Re: Limited editions -- asking the perfumers here for feedback

[Guest guest]

At 05:57 PM 10/5/2005, you wrote:

>I just had an eye-opener on Perfume of Life forum. Two, actually.

Forgot to include the URL of the discussion:

http://p075.ezboard.com/fperfumeoflifefrm66.showMessage?topicID=595.topic

>1. I'm considering releasing some of my perfumes as Limited Editions, not

>for exclusivity, but more as a test to see how to gear production. The

>perfumistas there are solidly opposed to limited editions. Guess they feel

>burned, manipulated, etc. Do you produce limited editions, and what has

>been the feedback?

>

>2. Yosh, who uses fragrance oils, just released a limited edition (only 50

>bottles) of an 8ml oil that is $175 retail. Her marketing is usually

>aggressive and solid, since her fumes are so popular, but oy vay, what a

>price for some blend of mostly synthetics FOs and a bit of EO (if there is

>EO in there, I've never detected any in the few I've sniffed.) Would you

>pay that, if you absolutely ADORED the scent, but knew they were FOs? Who

>do you think would?

Anya

http://.com

The premier site on the Web to discover the beauty of Natural Perfume

" The Age of the Foodie is passé. It is now the Age of the Scentie. "

[Guest guest]

<<Yosh, who uses fragrance oils, just released a limited edition (only 50

bottles) of an 8ml oil that is $175 retail. Her marketing is usually

aggressive and solid, since her fumes are so popular, but oy vay, what a

price for some blend of mostly synthetics FOs and a bit of EO (if there is

EO in there, I've never detected any in the few I've sniffed.) Would you

pay that, if you absolutely ADORED the scent, but knew they were FOs? Who

do you think would?>>

Hi Anya,

I've purchased Yosh fragrances from Luckyscent.com. The ones I've sampled

have been so lovely and very unique. Also they did smell very lush and

natural to me. I could really smell the basil, ginger and ylang ylang

clearly in Ginger Ciao.

The bottles are like little treasures.

~Pixie

[Guest guest]

At 06:45 PM 10/5/2005, you wrote:

><<Yosh, who uses fragrance oils, just released a limited edition (only 50

>bottles) of an 8ml oil that is $175 retail. Her marketing is usually

>aggressive and solid, since her fumes are so popular, but oy vay, what a

>price for some blend of mostly synthetics FOs and a bit of EO (if there is

>EO in there, I've never detected any in the few I've sniffed.) Would you

>pay that, if you absolutely ADORED the scent, but knew they were FOs? Who

>do you think would?>>

>

>

>Hi Anya,

>

>I've purchased Yosh fragrances from Luckyscent.com. The ones I've sampled

>have been so lovely and very unique. Also they did smell very lush and

>natural to me. I could really smell the basil, ginger and ylang ylang

>clearly in Ginger Ciao.

>The bottles are like little treasures.

>

>~Pixie

Hi Pixie:

I'm not saying she doesn't use some EOs. She joined this group briefly last

year and asked for EO sources, how to blend them, etc. She had used them a

bit in the past. She often wrote me privately on where to source them, how

to blend them, etc. If people want to use FOs, that's their business ;-)

Tell me the truth -- does Ginger Ciao evolve at all on your skin? Or does

it just stay the same from application to wash off? It's a nice FO, and I

can get it from the supplier, if I so wished, but of course, I won't use

it. Ditto her Stargazer. Very artificial and with no true perfume

evolution, since it is 100% FO, according to her description of the notes

(and my nose.) As far as price point, that's her business, as it is every

perfumers. Marketing rules, and lots love little treasure bottles, too.

Anya

http://.com

The premier site on the Web to discover the beauty of Natural Perfume

" The Age of the Foodie is passé. It is now the Age of the Scentie. "

[Guest guest]

I have never done a limited edition........If an oil become unavailable I

would discontinue the fragrance.

I would think of doing a limited edition for a special " rose oil " or a rare

find oil that I would only make so many bottles.

Le Bijou, a natural perfumery http://www.JoAnneBassett.com

Exquisite natural fragrances http://www.JoAnneBassettInc.com

[Guest guest]

> Would you

>> pay that, if you absolutely ADORED the scent, but knew they were FOs? Who

>> do you think would?>>

>>

There are people who would pay that, particularly if it were a well known

name and it was used to enhance self esteem and they loved the aroma. I

would not pay that.

In fact I got into pefumery, not only because of my grandmother but also

because the candles I loved cost a great deal and I was only able to afford

them occasionally. So I went on a quest to learn how to create my own and to

work with oils of all kinds.

As a perfumer who is also a mental health provider I am concerned that my

products are affordable. I wish to be inclusive rather than exclusive.

There are so many people who are in need of relief of stress and to

rebalance their energies and aroma is one of the quickest ways I know of to

get relief. If I am out of the cost range of most peoples budgets, I cannot

reach people who are in need. And there are many.

I research the price points of fragrances and mine are in line with what is

sold in the marketplace in the mid-range. My prices go up of course with

the more expensive absolutes and otto's.

I got feedback that a woman who needs to spend a lot of money on jewelry,

and designer items thought my price on a particular fragrance was not high

enough. It was $45.00 for 2oz. of a special " Fresh Vanilla " EDP combination

of Natural and synthetic. I am on my second batch because I sold out of the

first batch.

Anyway, I told my customer(who comes in every week to buy from me and was

giving me the feedback) that particular individual is not my customer.

People come to me to feel better, to smell good, to create a particular

aromatic environment in their home. I try to work with their budgets as

much as possible. Even so my products are still out of the price range of

some potential customers. I do have a bottom line.

I think a perfumer needs to ask what is the mission of their art and work

within that.

I do not criticize anyone " s mission, purpose or business practices.

This is what I need to do re: my pricing and mission.

Best to all,

Dorothy

Dorothy McCall, Cert. Aroma.

Kingsbury Fragrances

The Royal York

3955 Bigelow Blvd. Ste. 907

Pittsburgh, PA. 15213

(412) 687-2720

www.kingsburyfragrances.com

" Vibrating aromatic threads speak of the Divine through tapestries of scent "

Dorothy McCall Cert. Aroma.

[Guest guest]

> I just had an eye-opener on Perfume of Life forum. Two, actually.

>

> 1. I'm considering releasing some of my perfumes as Limited

Editions, not

> for exclusivity, but more as a test to see how to gear production. The

> perfumistas there are solidly opposed to limited editions. Guess

they feel

> burned, manipulated, etc. Do you produce limited editions, and what has

> been the feedback?

Speaking as a perfumista here, I object to the *marketing* of limited

editions by huge houses like Chanel etc because it is an attempt to

manipulate the consumer into buying more product (even stockpiling

it), out of fear of missing out. However, I don't object to limited

editions themselves, particularly in the context you describe. I

believe that as a natural perfumer you will have more leeway to

experiment and consumers may not expect you to keep up your

" catalogue " of perfumes forever, the way we (rather unrealistically)

expect it of the large perfume houses. Some smaller perfumers whose

client base happily accepts limited editions (or who regularly phase

things off of their list) are Black Phoenix Alchemy Lab and Dawn

Spencer Hurwitz, and even Madini.

>

> 2. Yosh, who uses fragrance oils, just released a limited edition

(only 50

> bottles) of an 8ml oil that is $175 retail. Her marketing is usually

> aggressive and solid, since her fumes are so popular, but oy vay,

what a

> price for some blend of mostly synthetics FOs and a bit of EO (if

there is

> EO in there, I've never detected any in the few I've sniffed.) Would

you

> pay that, if you absolutely ADORED the scent, but knew they were

FOs? Who

> do you think would?

>

I would not spend this much on 8 ml of oil containing FO, but there

are collectors and status seekers who would.

[Guest guest]

> Would you

>> pay that, if you absolutely ADORED the scent, but knew they were FOs? Who

>> do you think would?>>

>>

There are people who would pay that, particularly if it were a well known

name and it was used to enhance self esteem and they loved the aroma. I

would not pay that.

In fact I got into pefumery, not only because of my grandmother but also

because the candles I loved cost a great deal and I was only able to afford

them occasionally. So I went on a quest to learn how to create my own and to

work with oils of all kinds.

As a perfumer who is also a mental health provider I am concerned that my

products are affordable. I wish to be inclusive rather than exclusive.

There are so many people who are in need of relief of stress and to

rebalance their energies and aroma is one of the quickest ways I know of to

get relief. If I am out of the cost range of most peoples budgets, I cannot

reach people who are in need. And there are many.

I research the price points of fragrances and mine are in line with what is

sold in the marketplace in the mid-range. My prices go up of course with

the more expensive absolutes and otto's.

I got feedback that a woman who needs to spend a lot of money on jewelry,

and designer items thought my price on a particular fragrance was not high

enough. It was $45.00 for 2oz. of a special " Fresh Vanilla " EDP combination

of Natural and synthetic. I am on my second batch because I sold out of the

first batch.

Anyway, I told my customer(who comes in every week to buy from me and was

giving me the feedback) that particular individual is not my customer.

People come to me to feel better, to smell good, to create a particular

aromatic environment in their home. I try to work with their budgets as

much as possible. Even so my products are still out of the price range of

some potential customers. I do have a bottom line.

I think a perfumer needs to ask what is the mission of their art and work

within that.

I do not criticize anyone " s mission, purpose or business practices.

This is what I need to do re: my pricing and mission.

Best to all,

Dorothy

Dorothy McCall, Cert. Aroma.

Kingsbury Fragrances

The Royal York

3955 Bigelow Blvd. Ste. 907

Pittsburgh, PA. 15213

(412) 687-2720

www.kingsburyfragrances.com

" Vibrating aromatic threads speak of the Divine through tapestries of scent "

Dorothy McCall Cert. Aroma.

[Guest guest]

At 06:45 PM 10/5/2005, you wrote:

><<Yosh, who uses fragrance oils, just released a limited edition (only 50

>bottles) of an 8ml oil that is $175 retail. Her marketing is usually

>aggressive and solid, since her fumes are so popular, but oy vay, what a

>price for some blend of mostly synthetics FOs and a bit of EO (if there is

>EO in there, I've never detected any in the few I've sniffed.) Would you

>pay that, if you absolutely ADORED the scent, but knew they were FOs? Who

>do you think would?>>

>

>

>Hi Anya,

>

>I've purchased Yosh fragrances from Luckyscent.com. The ones I've sampled

>have been so lovely and very unique. Also they did smell very lush and

>natural to me. I could really smell the basil, ginger and ylang ylang

>clearly in Ginger Ciao.

>The bottles are like little treasures.

Hi Serena:

Yes, her perfume oils are very popular. Glad you like them, and I'm sure

many do. To me, however, I just smell the FO. I have smelled some wonderful

FO/EO blends, but I don't detect that in her perfume oils. Oh, to have a

tabletop GC like Luca Turin ;-)

Anya

http://.com

The premier site on the Web to discover the beauty of Natural Perfume

" The Age of the Foodie is passé. It is now the Age of the Scentie. "

[Guest guest]

At 08:09 PM 10/5/2005, you wrote:

> > Would you

> >> pay that, if you absolutely ADORED the scent, but knew they were FOs? Who

> >> do you think would?>>

> >>

>

>There are people who would pay that, particularly if it were a well known

>name and it was used to enhance self esteem and they loved the aroma. I

>would not pay that.

I agree! When something is 80-90-100% FOs I just shake my head.

>As a perfumer who is also a mental health provider I am concerned that my

>products are affordable. I wish to be inclusive rather than exclusive.

>There are so many people who are in need of relief of stress and to

>rebalance their energies and aroma is one of the quickest ways I know of to

>get relief. If I am out of the cost range of most peoples budgets, I cannot

>reach people who are in need. And there are many.

You sound very wise and grounded, Dorothy. We had a member, who has since

left the group, object when I posted that I would like for natural perfumes

to be available everywhere, at the local drugstores, for everyone. She

wanted to keep them exclusive, and, I suppose have people " pass her

coolness test " before they could buy them! Yow! I see her on another forum,

now, jumping in how she needs to learn marketing. You seem to have the

marketing and soul part down very well, congratulations.

>I research the price points of fragrances and mine are in line with what is

>sold in the marketplace in the mid-range. My prices go up of course with

>the more expensive absolutes and otto's.

I see that happening with my line. Whe I sold my oils on South Beach, they

were simple soliflors, or simple blends, and the only expensive ones were

frankincense and sandalwood, and I was able to sell them very reasonably.

When I was asked to do private line, we kept the prices down (corporate

mentality, but that's OK, it exposed their customers to some nice

naturals.) When I started blending bespoke, I had a hard time with all the

high prices I had to charge, but it was so much more -- time, reworkings,

absolutes, ottos, etc.

>People come to me to feel better, to smell good, to create a particular

>aromatic environment in their home. I try to work with their budgets as

>much as possible. Even so my products are still out of the price range of

>some potential customers. I do have a bottom line.

So true. We have to be business people, or we go out of business!

>I do not criticize anyone " s mission, purpose or business practices.

I have decades of paid experience as a critic, so it is hard for me not to

jump in with a critique. I started out in the music business, and had no

problem writing a review of an album or concert, and panning it, if it

deserved to be panned. I try to tone that inherent urge to criticize down

because of my position with this group, but it is hard. I just hate seeing

people getting ripped off or dissed, whether its in music, or perfume ;-)

and I can't hold my tongue or fingers back, lol. Other than that, I'm a

pussycat, yes?

Anya

http://.com

The premier site on the Web to discover the beauty of Natural Perfume

" The Age of the Foodie is passé. It is now the Age of the Scentie. "