Guest guest Posted July 17, 2000 Report Share Posted July 17, 2000 Hi All, We are still trying to develop a reward system for Cameron (6). I don't want to make it too hard (or complicated). Any suggestions would be welcome. I liked Roman's idea of using cognitive-type talk. >> " Wow..you're really getting good at noticing how much OCD makes you do that! " ? and of using a special high-five, (for days that Cameron tries but is unsuccessful). Kathy Hammes also said that her son, Steve was motivated by trips to fast food places, staying up later, extra time on the computer, etc. These are great ideas also. What do you think about making a " rewards " jar and letting Cameron pull a reward from the jar each day on the days that he is able to resist his Os and Cs? I'm not sure if Cameron can resist on his own just yet. Mostly these days he tells me that he told a friend to put something in their pants but if I ask him if he put something in his also, he changes the subject or clams up. I think what bothers him the most are his feelings of guilt. He feels guilty and ashamed for what he thinks of as " coercing " his friends to do this. He also feels guilt every time he remembers doing this. I think that's what the triggers do. They remind him about doing this and then he feels guilt, shame, anxiety, etc. I don't think he would be especially anxious if he couldn't actually act on his thoughts. However, I'm not usually around when he does anything so I'm not certain. He seems most anxious afterwards, when he remembers it. Also, does anyone have suggestions regarding how to explain OCD to their young children? Or how you explained it to your kids? Cameron met with Dr. March who briefly explained to him that it's like your brain has hiccups. We haven't talked specifically about OCD since then. We just refer to it as " those thoughts you have " . Thanks for all your help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 17, 2000 Report Share Posted July 17, 2000 We used a star chart for my son which seemed to work, every time he did not do a certain ritual or showered in a certain amount of time he was giving stars. Example, if he showered in 20 min. he would get 2 gold stars, if it was in 25 five min. he would get 3 blue stars etc. etc. Gold being the best. then we would give him rewards, if he earned 10 gold stars his reward would be better than 20 blue ones etc. We had bought a great big calander and each night he would put the stars he earned on the date, You could tell which days were bad and which were good, The out come is he now showers in 20min by himself , but we still have to bring him his towel when he his done. Pat ----- > From: lowek@... > egroups > Subject: Advice on rewards > Date: Monday, July 17, 2000 12:45 PM > > Hi All, > We are still trying to develop a reward system for Cameron (6). I > don't want to make it too hard (or complicated). Any suggestions > would be welcome. > > I liked Roman's idea of using cognitive-type talk. > >> " Wow..you're really getting good at noticing how much OCD makes you > do that! " ? and of using a special high-five, (for days that Cameron > tries but is unsuccessful). > Kathy Hammes also said that her son, Steve was motivated by trips to > fast food places, staying up later, extra time on the computer, etc. > These are great ideas also. What do you think about making a > " rewards " > jar and letting Cameron pull a reward from the jar each day on the > days that he is able to resist his Os and Cs? > > I'm not sure if Cameron can resist on his own just yet. Mostly these > days he tells me that he told a friend to put something in their > pants > but if I ask him if he put something in his also, he changes the > subject or clams up. I think what bothers him the most are his > feelings of guilt. He feels guilty and ashamed for what he thinks of > as " coercing " his friends to do this. He also feels guilt every time > he remembers doing this. I think that's what the triggers do. They > remind him about doing this and then he feels guilt, shame, anxiety, > etc. I don't think he would be especially anxious if he couldn't > actually act on his thoughts. However, I'm not usually around when he > does anything so I'm not certain. He seems most anxious afterwards, > when he remembers it. > > Also, does anyone have suggestions regarding how to explain OCD to > their young children? Or how you explained it to your kids? Cameron > met with Dr. March who briefly explained to him that it's like your > brain has hiccups. We haven't talked specifically about OCD since > then. We just refer to it as " those thoughts you have " . > Thanks for all your help. > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Visit www.ibelieve.com today and get a FREE book by Chuck Swindoll! > 1/6182/7/_/531051/_/963852334/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > You may subscribe to the OCD-L by emailing listserv@... . In the body of your message write: subscribe OCD-L your name. The Archives, Files, and Features List for the may be accessed by going to , enter your email address and password, then point and click. Subscription issues, problems, or suggestions may be addressed to Louis Harkins, list owner, at harkins@... . > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 17, 2000 Report Share Posted July 17, 2000 Hi , my daughter is six too. Some thoughts: > We are still trying to develop a reward system for Cameron (6). I > don't want to make it too hard (or complicated). Any suggestions > would be welcome. > I liked Roman's idea of using cognitive-type talk. > >> " Wow..you're really getting good at noticing how much OCD makes you > do that! " ? and of using a special high-five, (for days that Cameron > tries but is unsuccessful). > Kathy Hammes also said that her son, Steve was motivated by trips to > fast food places, staying up later, extra time on the computer, etc. > These are great ideas also. What do you think about making a > " rewards " > jar and letting Cameron pull a reward from the jar each day on the > days that he is able to resist his Os and Cs? We recognize daily efforts (whether successful, partly successful or just a good try) with star stickers which Kel puts on pages in a diary with the target compulsion written at the top. The stars add up as the compulsion diminishes, and when OCD finally " forgets about " a compulsion (Kel's words) we celebrate with a special treat--trip to Chuck E. Cheese's or whatever. We don't require a certain number of stars to earn the special treat, as we are celebrating Kellen successfully bossing a compulsion and rewarding her efforts to go against what OCD is telling her to do. The star stickers are intended more as a visual reminder of all her successes and the diary itself is helpful, since Kel has a tendency to forget about compulsions as soon as they are no longer a problem. Because of this she has a hard time feeling a sense of progress, and the record of her successful bossing reminds her how far she's come. BTW I was surprised how much Kel got into earning the stars to put into her boss-back book. I'm not sure about using a special high-five or anything else to denote an unsuccessful " good try " . We relentlessly accent the positive and if she's not able to do an E & RP exercise I think of ways to break it down to reduce the anxiety level it produces and help her succeed. OCD can be pretty demoralizing to her and I don't want to add to that. I think my daughter would quickly come to think of the high-five as a sign of failure rather than the " good try, you'll get it next time " supportive gesture as intended. Just my 2 cents based on my child. > I'm not sure if Cameron can resist on his own just yet. Mostly these > days he tells me that he told a friend to put something in their > pants > but if I ask him if he put something in his also, he changes the > subject or clams up. Kel is extremely reluctant to discuss OCD thoughts with me or OCD things she has done. I don't have any great input here, just that I think this is common and fueled by shame and embarassment. > Also, does anyone have suggestions regarding how to explain OCD to > their young children? Or how you explained it to your kids? Cameron > met with Dr. March who briefly explained to him that it's like your > brain has hiccups. We haven't talked specifically about OCD since > then. We just refer to it as " those thoughts you have " . Hiccuping brain didn't go very far with Kellen. Her own idea is that she has bugs in her brain which make the bad thoughts. " Blink Blink Clop Clop, Why Do We Do Things We Can't Stop " is a book that features OCD as a flea which makes farm animals worry and do repetitive things, and it was helpful in explaining OCD to Kel--though also the basis of her own " bugs in the brain " theory. Hope this helps, Kathy R. in Indiana Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 18, 2000 Report Share Posted July 18, 2000 Hi Kathy R., Thanks for your reply. What a terrific idea! So the special treat is given to celebrate when OCD forgets about a compulsion? Has Kellen (I love her name) ever said that a compulsion was gone so that she could get the special reward? I'm just anticipating what Cameron may do. I think that he might say that the thoughts are gone when they really aren't, just to get to do whatever the special thing is. Do you give one star a day - not differentiating between success and a good try? My questions must sound like I'm taking this to the -Nth degree of specificity but we've used reward charts before for non- OCD, like for brushing teeth, etc. and they seem to fizzle out pretty quickly. That's why I want to do this one so that it keeps Cam motivated. Thanks again! > Hi , my daughter is six too. Some thoughts: > > > We are still trying to develop a reward system for Cameron (6). I > > don't want to make it too hard (or complicated). Any suggestions > > would be welcome. > > I liked Roman's idea of using cognitive-type talk. > > >> " Wow..you're really getting good at noticing how much OCD makes you > > do that! " ? and of using a special high-five, (for days that Cameron > > tries but is unsuccessful). > > Kathy Hammes also said that her son, Steve was motivated by trips to > > fast food places, staying up later, extra time on the computer, etc. > > These are great ideas also. What do you think about making a > > " rewards " > > jar and letting Cameron pull a reward from the jar each day on the > > days that he is able to resist his Os and Cs? > > We recognize daily efforts (whether successful, partly successful or just a > good try) with star stickers which Kel puts on pages in a diary with the > target compulsion written at the top. The stars add up as the compulsion > diminishes, and when OCD finally " forgets about " a compulsion (Kel's words) > we celebrate with a special treat--trip to Chuck E. Cheese's or whatever. > We don't require a certain number of stars to earn the special treat, as we > are celebrating Kellen successfully bossing a compulsion and rewarding her > efforts to go against what OCD is telling her to do. The star stickers are > intended more as a visual reminder of all her successes and the diary itself > is helpful, since Kel has a tendency to forget about compulsions as soon as > they are no longer a problem. Because of this she has a hard time feeling a > sense of progress, and the record of her successful bossing reminds her how > far she's come. > > BTW I was surprised how much Kel got into earning the stars to put into her > boss-back book. > > I'm not sure about using a special high-five or anything else to denote an > unsuccessful " good try " . We relentlessly accent the positive and if she's > not able to do an E & RP exercise I think of ways to break it down to reduce > the anxiety level it produces and help her succeed. OCD can be pretty > demoralizing to her and I don't want to add to that. I think my daughter > would quickly come to think of the high-five as a sign of failure rather > than the " good try, you'll get it next time " supportive gesture as intended. > Just my 2 cents based on my child. > > > I'm not sure if Cameron can resist on his own just yet. Mostly these > > days he tells me that he told a friend to put something in their > > pants > > but if I ask him if he put something in his also, he changes the > > subject or clams up. > > Kel is extremely reluctant to discuss OCD thoughts with me or OCD things she > has done. I don't have any great input here, just that I think this is > common and fueled by shame and embarassment. > > > Also, does anyone have suggestions regarding how to explain OCD to > > their young children? Or how you explained it to your kids? Cameron > > met with Dr. March who briefly explained to him that it's like your > > brain has hiccups. We haven't talked specifically about OCD since > > then. We just refer to it as " those thoughts you have " . > > Hiccuping brain didn't go very far with Kellen. Her own idea is that she > has bugs in her brain which make the bad thoughts. " Blink Blink Clop > Clop, Why Do We Do Things We Can't Stop " is a book that features OCD as a > flea which makes farm animals worry and do repetitive things, and it was > helpful in explaining OCD to Kel--though also the basis of her own " bugs in > the brain " theory. > > Hope this helps, > > Kathy R. in Indiana Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 18, 2000 Report Share Posted July 18, 2000 Hi Pat! Thanks for sharing what has worked for your son. Your response has helped me not only to figure out a reward system but it has also given me encouragement. The reward system has shown measurable results which must motivate your entire family - right? When I read that it really works, I get " psyched " ! Psyched in a good way - of course :-) Thanks for the support! > We used a star chart for my son which seemed to work, every time he did not > do a certain ritual or showered in a certain amount of time he was giving > stars. Example, if he showered in 20 min. he would get 2 gold stars, if it > was in 25 five min. he would get 3 blue stars etc. etc. Gold being the > best. then we would give him rewards, if he earned 10 gold stars his reward > would be better than 20 blue ones etc. > We had bought a great big calander and each night he would put the stars he > earned on the date, You could tell which days were bad and which were good, > The out come is he now showers in 20min by himself , but we still have to > bring him his towel when he his done. > > Pat > > ----- > > From: lowek@l... > > egroups > > Subject: Advice on rewards > > Date: Monday, July 17, 2000 12:45 PM > > > > Hi All, > > We are still trying to develop a reward system for Cameron (6). I > > don't want to make it too hard (or complicated). Any suggestions > > would be welcome. > > > > I liked Roman's idea of using cognitive-type talk. > > >> " Wow..you're really getting good at noticing how much OCD makes you > > do that! " ? and of using a special high-five, (for days that Cameron > > tries but is unsuccessful). > > Kathy Hammes also said that her son, Steve was motivated by trips to > > fast food places, staying up later, extra time on the computer, etc. > > These are great ideas also. What do you think about making a > > " rewards " > > jar and letting Cameron pull a reward from the jar each day on the > > days that he is able to resist his Os and Cs? > > > > I'm not sure if Cameron can resist on his own just yet. Mostly these > > days he tells me that he told a friend to put something in their > > pants > > but if I ask him if he put something in his also, he changes the > > subject or clams up. I think what bothers him the most are his > > feelings of guilt. He feels guilty and ashamed for what he thinks of > > as " coercing " his friends to do this. He also feels guilt every time > > he remembers doing this. I think that's what the triggers do. They > > remind him about doing this and then he feels guilt, shame, anxiety, > > etc. I don't think he would be especially anxious if he couldn't > > actually act on his thoughts. However, I'm not usually around when he > > does anything so I'm not certain. He seems most anxious afterwards, > > when he remembers it. > > > > Also, does anyone have suggestions regarding how to explain OCD to > > their young children? Or how you explained it to your kids? Cameron > > met with Dr. March who briefly explained to him that it's like your > > brain has hiccups. We haven't talked specifically about OCD since > > then. We just refer to it as " those thoughts you have " . > > Thanks for all your help. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------ ------ > > Visit www.ibelieve.com today and get a FREE book by Chuck Swindoll! > > 1/6182/7/_/531051/_/963852334/ > > ------------------------------------------------------------------ ------ > > > > You may subscribe to the OCD-L by emailing listserv@v... . In > the body of your message write: subscribe OCD-L your name. The Archives, > Files, and Features List for the may be accessed by > going to , enter your email address and password, > then point and click. Subscription issues, problems, or suggestions may > be addressed to Louis Harkins, list owner, at harkins@w... . > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 19, 2000 Report Share Posted July 19, 2000 HI : We have used the jar method for both rewards and consequences. Also we asked our boys to come up with ideas for rewards or consequences which of course might be subject to veto or modification by their parents. They enjoyed participating in deciding the plan and this enhanced their cooperation. We actually found the predictability of the reward or negative consequence to be more valuable than the randomness of a surprise. Perhaps this is connected to the chronic inflexibility which is often the scourge of kids with NBDs. Another thing we learned about these reward systems is that consistency is very important. Also we found that simple praise and positive reinforcement are very powerful rewards themselves. I am sure other parents with young OCDers will have some good suggestions about how to talk about OCD with a six-year old. Steve was 10 when we figured out he had OCD and he always has related best to the materials about OCD that aimed at an adult audience. Videotapes, especially the OCF one with a panel of children with OCD, can be very helpful getting information across to our kids and other family members. What helped Steve is for us to tell him about the famous people who have or had OCD. That seemed to make his brain difficulties slightly more acceptable to him. Good luck, take care, aloha, Kathy (H) kathyh@... >X-Sender: kathyh@... (Unverified) >X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.0.1 >Date: Tue, 18 Jul 2000 17:33:29 -1000 >kathyh@... >From: Kathy Hammes <kathyh@...> >Subject: Fwd: Advice on rewards > >>X-Sender: kathyh@... >>X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.0.1 >>Date: Mon, 17 Jul 2000 17:31:17 -1000 >>kathyh@... >>From: Kathy Hammes <kathyh@...> >>Subject: Fwd: Advice on rewards >> >>>X-eGroups-Return: >>sentto-90485-7293-963852336-kathyh=interpac.netreturns (DOT) onelist.com >>>X-eGroups-Return: lowek@... >>>egroups >>>User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 >>>X-Mailer: eGroups Message Poster >>>From: lowek@... >>>Mailing-List: list egroups; contact >>-owneregroups >>>Delivered-mailing list egroups >>>List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:-unsubscribeegroups> >>>Date: Mon, 17 Jul 2000 16:45:28 -0000 >>>Reply-egroups >>>Subject: Advice on rewards >>> >>>Hi All, >>>We are still trying to develop a reward system for Cameron (6). I >>>don't want to make it too hard (or complicated). Any suggestions >>>would be welcome. >>> >>>I liked Roman's idea of using cognitive-type talk. >>>>> " Wow..you're really getting good at noticing how much OCD makes you >>>do that! " ? and of using a special high-five, (for days that Cameron >>>tries but is unsuccessful). >>>Kathy Hammes also said that her son, Steve was motivated by trips to >>>fast food places, staying up later, extra time on the computer, etc. >>>These are great ideas also. What do you think about making a >>> " rewards " >>>jar and letting Cameron pull a reward from the jar each day on the >>>days that he is able to resist his Os and Cs? >>> >>>I'm not sure if Cameron can resist on his own just yet. Mostly these >>>days he tells me that he told a friend to put something in their >>>pants >>>but if I ask him if he put something in his also, he changes the >>>subject or clams up. I think what bothers him the most are his >>>feelings of guilt. He feels guilty and ashamed for what he thinks of >>>as " coercing " his friends to do this. He also feels guilt every time >>>he remembers doing this. I think that's what the triggers do. They >>>remind him about doing this and then he feels guilt, shame, anxiety, >>>etc. I don't think he would be especially anxious if he couldn't >>>actually act on his thoughts. However, I'm not usually around when he >>>does anything so I'm not certain. He seems most anxious afterwards, >>>when he remembers it. >>> >>>Also, does anyone have suggestions regarding how to explain OCD to >>>their young children? Or how you explained it to your kids? Cameron >>>met with Dr. March who briefly explained to him that it's like your >>>brain has hiccups. We haven't talked specifically about OCD since >>>then. We just refer to it as " those thoughts you have " . >>>Thanks for all your help. >>> >>> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 19, 2000 Report Share Posted July 19, 2000 Hi , > Thanks for your reply. What a terrific idea! So the special treat is > given to celebrate when OCD forgets about a compulsion? Has Kellen > (I love her name) ever said that a compulsion was gone so that she > could get the special reward? I'm just anticipating what Cameron may > do. I think that he might say that the thoughts are gone when they > really aren't, just to get to do whatever the special thing is. We've been using the star-in-the-diary approach for about six months and so far Kel hasn't faked the diminishment of a compulsion. It's usually obvious how difficult an exposure is for her (she's anxious, irritable for ex.), when one is gone or nearly so she is bored and loses interest in doing the exposure--plus I don't notice her doing the compulsion off and on throughout the day. We don't necessarily announce " we will go to Chuck E. Cheese's " when a certain compulsion is gone. There is just the understanding we will do something special that she chooses, to celebrate Kel's hard work and success diminishing a compulsion. When and what are usually decided on the spur of the moment. Maybe it is Kel's age that allows us to be this casual, maybe an older child would want/need a more rigid plan (nod to Kathy H's post): a specific number of stars needed to earn an agreed-upon prize. We set this whole process up very loosely and low-pressure on purpose to avoid pitting OCD against Kellen where sometimes Kel would win and sometimes OCD would. Of course that happens, and that is why we reward her effort to boss a compulsion whether it is entirely successful or not. We were afraid of a situation where her diary would show no stars for several days in a row and this would underscore how strong (and maybe undefeatable after all) OCD is. FWIW Kel is the sort of kid who's upset when she loses a game of Candyland, so we wanted to avoid this scenario around E & RP. > Do > you give one star a day - not differentiating between success and a > good try? My questions must sound like I'm taking this to the -Nth > degree of specificity but we've used reward charts before for non- > OCD, like for brushing teeth, etc. and they seem to fizzle out pretty > quickly. That's why I want to do this one so that it keeps Cam > motivated. Some days Kel racks up several stars, some days none, we try to have at least one E & RP session a day but admit we slip sometimes especially now that it's summer. Trying to walk the line between making progress and turning the whole business into a huge chore for Kellen. Of course being free of a compulsion is the true reward :-) but I think most younger children would need motivation of some sort to do the hard work of bossing back. I never used star charts or any other motivation technique for non-OCD so this is " new " for Kel and maybe explains why it hasn't fizzled yet. She's proud of the diary, likes to look at it and all the stars, shows it to others and even laughs about some of the long-bossed compulsions there. The sense of having come a long way in this struggle is very helpful IMO. Kathy R. in Indiana (I just glanced over this post--boy I do go on . . . :-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 19, 2000 Report Share Posted July 19, 2000 Hi , Try reading the book, Polly's magic games to your son, also theres a book calledblink,blink,clap,clap, why do I do the things I cant stop. I cant remember the author, but you can order online through borders,just look under ocd and kids. Good luck! Ilene Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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