Re: Drastic Times, Drastic Measures

[Guest guest]

Pamela: You need to be really careful about your bp being so high. How do you get any energy from eating so little? Perhaps you can follow a vegan diet i.e. the rice diet. Their new book is now out and you can order it through their site or Amzon. Have you been tested for Pheochromocytoma? The spikes and such high numbers, sporatic attacks may actually be indicative of pheo. Please keep us updated about your health. You were one of the good people on this group who kept me encouraged when I was diagnosed and you are in my thoughts always. FarahPamela s <spirlhelix@...> wrote: Hi, AllI hope everyone has had a great holiday!I've been away for a while. According to all testresults, I don't have aldosteronism, so

when my bloodpressure went up again, I just got discouraged aboutthe prospect of finding medical answers. I stillthink I have some secondary form of hypertension,since my blood pressure is quite variable and canactually be pretty low from time to time.Then I get the spikes. Sometimes they do worse thanspike and go on for weeks or months. The premise is that there is sodium in my diet whichcauses fluid retention, etc.Therefore, I have been on a fast from both medicationsand food for the last few days, starting January 1. Iexpect to fast at least a week longer with the goal ofseeing if my blood pressure eventually goes down. Iam tapering off caffeine slowly (tea) because Iunderstand withdrawal can cause a rebound spike inblood pressure.Here are the results of my efforts so far:January 1: fresh fruit only BP: 234/140I think my blood pressure

may have been a little toohigh for the machine to register properly (it onlygoes up to 240).January 2: clear fruit juice, tea, and water onlyBP: 210/119January 3: same as aboveBP: 201/100Today I am starting on water only. I don't have ascale and don't weigh myself everyday. I did go tothe local pharmacy last night and found that I havelost 4 lbs. so far. I am looking for some sort of adrop indicating loss of retained water. So far, Ithink the 4 lbs. loss is probably just a lack of solidfood in my diet and (sorry to be so graphic) littleleft in my colon!Wishing you all well,Warmly,Pam "I'd rather learn from one bird how to sing, than to teach ten thousand stars how not to dance." __________________________________________

DSL – Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less. dsl.

[Guest guest]

What meds were you on and what was your BP before this. These BPs are risky but seem to be coming down-most likely due to the low sodium intake (indeed no sodium intake).

What are the test results that suggest you do not have primary aldo? As I recall the BP has fell markedly with spiro which is essentially diagnostic of a mineralocorticoid cause of HTN, but maybe I have you mixed up with another one on our site. Are you in Cinn?

May your pressure be low!

Clarence E. Grim, BS (Chem/Math), MS (Biochem), MD, FACP, FACC, FAHS

Clinical Professor of Medicine and Epidemiology

Director, Hypertension Diagnosis and Treatment Center

Board Certified in Internal Medicine, Geriatrics and Hypertension

Published over 220 scientific papers, book chapters and 220 abstracts in the area of high blood pressure epidemiology, physiology, endocrinology measurement, treatment and how to detect curable causes.

Listed in Best Doctors in America

Specializing in Difficult to Control High Blood Pressure and the History and Physiology of High Blood pressure in the African Diaspora

[Guest guest]

Hi, Dr. Grim

You have kindly responded to me twice in the past that

the test results I posted are negative for

aldosteronism.

I initially had good results with spironolactone, but

about over a year later the BP started climbing again.

Recently I was on Spironolactone 150 and Diovan HCT

80. There are few BP meds I can tolerate.

Yes, your memory is very good. I do live in

Cincinnati. My son has hypertension since age 12 and

LVH since age 15, but also no aldosteronism.

January 1: fresh fruit only

BP: 234/140

I think my blood pressure may have been a little too

high for the machine to register properly (it only

goes up to 240).

January 2: clear fruit juice, tea, and water only

BP: 210/119

January 3: same as above

BP: 201/100

January 4--no tea, only water

BP 237/116

Warmly,

Pam

--- lowerbp2@... wrote:

> What meds were you on and what was your BP before

> this. These BPs are risky

> but seem to be coming down-most likely due to the

> low sodium intake (indeed

> no sodium intake).

>

> What are the test results that suggest you do not

> have primary aldo? As I

> recall the BP has fell markedly with spiro which is

> essentially diagnostic of a

> mineralocorticoid cause of HTN, but maybe I have you

> mixed up with another one

> on our site. Are you in Cinn?

>

>

>

> May your pressure be low!

>

> Clarence E. Grim, BS (Chem/Math), MS (Biochem), MD,

> FACP, FACC, FAHS

> Clinical Professor of Medicine and Epidemiology

> Director, Hypertension Diagnosis and Treatment

> Center

> Board Certified in Internal Medicine, Geriatrics and

> Hypertension

>

> Published over 220 scientific papers, book chapters

> and 220 abstracts in the

> area of high blood pressure epidemiology,

> physiology, endocrinology

> measurement, treatment and how to detect curable

> causes.

> Listed in Best Doctors in America

> Specializing in Difficult to Control High Blood

> Pressure and the History and

> Physiology of High Blood pressure in the African

> Diaspora

>

>

" I'd rather learn from one bird how to sing, than to teach ten thousand stars

how not to dance. "

__________________________________________

DSL – Something to write home about.

Just $16.99/mo. or less.

dsl.

[Guest guest]

Hi, Farah

Thank you for your kind response! It's nice to hear

from you again.

My blood pressure is in this range a lot these days,

so the fact that I'm not taking my meds may be

affecting it slightly, but the preponderance of recent

high readings is the reason for the drastic measures.

.. .

I have some experience with fasting from years ago;

I'm quite comfortable with it and have more and better

energy while fasting than when eating a restricted

diet. It's got to do with the metabolism vs. ketosis

and so forth. The way I understand it, eating small

amounts of food will starve you of muscle and make you

tired, while eating nothing will take off fat and

leave your muscle mass pretty much intact. I could

stand to shed a few pounds anyway. If weight is a

factor in my blood pressure, losing weight will only

help. If my blood pressure comes down on a strict

fast, we know that my diet is causing the problem. If

it does not, there is clearly something else going on.

When I start eating again, I will add foods to my diet

slowly to see if there is an effect on my blood

pressure. I will start with fruit, then add rice,

then vegetables, then roasted meat etc., until I am on

the full DASH diet. When I see my blood pressure

start to rise, I intend to note what I have been

eating.

Thank you again for your caring concern.

Warmly,

Pam

--- Farah Rahbar <farahbar@...> wrote:

> Pamela:

> You need to be really careful about your bp being

> so high. How do you get any energy from eating so

> little? Perhaps you can follow a vegan diet i.e. the

> rice diet. Their new book is now out and you can

> order it through their site or Amzon.

> Have you been tested for Pheochromocytoma? The

> spikes and such high numbers, sporatic attacks may

> actually be indicative of pheo.

>

> Please keep us updated about your health. You were

> one of the good people on this group who kept me

> encouraged when I was diagnosed and you are in my

> thoughts always.

>

> Farah

>

> Pamela s <spirlhelix@...> wrote:

> Hi, All

>

> I hope everyone has had a great holiday!

>

> I've been away for a while. According to all test

> results, I don't have aldosteronism, so when my

> blood

> pressure went up again, I just got discouraged about

> the prospect of finding medical answers. I still

> think I have some secondary form of hypertension,

> since my blood pressure is quite variable and can

> actually be pretty low from time to time.

>

> Then I get the spikes. Sometimes they do worse than

> spike and go on for weeks or months.

>

> The premise is that there is sodium in my diet which

> causes fluid retention, etc.

>

> Therefore, I have been on a fast from both

> medications

> and food for the last few days, starting January 1.

> I

> expect to fast at least a week longer with the goal

> of

> seeing if my blood pressure eventually goes down. I

> am tapering off caffeine slowly (tea) because I

> understand withdrawal can cause a rebound spike in

> blood pressure.

>

> Here are the results of my efforts so far:

>

> January 1: fresh fruit only

> BP: 234/140

>

> I think my blood pressure may have been a little too

> high for the machine to register properly (it only

> goes up to 240).

>

> January 2: clear fruit juice, tea, and water only

> BP: 210/119

>

> January 3: same as above

> BP: 201/100

>

> Today I am starting on water only. I don't have a

> scale and don't weigh myself everyday. I did go to

> the local pharmacy last night and found that I have

> lost 4 lbs. so far. I am looking for some sort of a

> drop indicating loss of retained water. So far, I

> think the 4 lbs. loss is probably just a lack of

> solid

> food in my diet and (sorry to be so graphic) little

> left in my colon!

>

> Wishing you all well,

>

> Warmly,

>

> Pam

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> " I'd rather learn from one bird how to sing, than to

> teach ten thousand stars how not to dance. "

>

>

>

> __________________________________________

> DSL – Something to write home about.

> Just $16.99/mo. or less.

> dsl.

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hi, Farah

Oh! PS: I forgot to answer your question! I have

been tested for pheo five or six times with negative

results.

Warmly,

Pam

--- Pamela s <spirlhelix@...> wrote:

> Hi, Farah

>

> Thank you for your kind response! It's nice to hear

> from you again.

>

> My blood pressure is in this range a lot these days,

> so the fact that I'm not taking my meds may be

> affecting it slightly, but the preponderance of

> recent

> high readings is the reason for the drastic

> measures.

> . .

>

> I have some experience with fasting from years ago;

> I'm quite comfortable with it and have more and

> better

> energy while fasting than when eating a restricted

> diet. It's got to do with the metabolism vs.

> ketosis

> and so forth. The way I understand it, eating small

> amounts of food will starve you of muscle and make

> you

> tired, while eating nothing will take off fat and

> leave your muscle mass pretty much intact. I could

> stand to shed a few pounds anyway. If weight is a

> factor in my blood pressure, losing weight will only

> help. If my blood pressure comes down on a strict

> fast, we know that my diet is causing the problem.

> If

> it does not, there is clearly something else going

> on.

>

> When I start eating again, I will add foods to my

> diet

> slowly to see if there is an effect on my blood

> pressure. I will start with fruit, then add rice,

> then vegetables, then roasted meat etc., until I am

> on

> the full DASH diet. When I see my blood pressure

> start to rise, I intend to note what I have been

> eating.

>

> Thank you again for your caring concern.

>

>

> Warmly,

>

> Pam

>

>

>

> --- Farah Rahbar <farahbar@...> wrote:

>

> > Pamela:

> > You need to be really careful about your bp

> being

> > so high. How do you get any energy from eating so

> > little? Perhaps you can follow a vegan diet i.e.

> the

> > rice diet. Their new book is now out and you can

> > order it through their site or Amzon.

> > Have you been tested for Pheochromocytoma? The

> > spikes and such high numbers, sporatic attacks

> may

> > actually be indicative of pheo.

> >

> > Please keep us updated about your health. You

> were

> > one of the good people on this group who kept me

> > encouraged when I was diagnosed and you are in my

> > thoughts always.

> >

> > Farah

> >

> > Pamela s <spirlhelix@...> wrote:

> > Hi, All

> >

> > I hope everyone has had a great holiday!

> >

> > I've been away for a while. According to all test

> > results, I don't have aldosteronism, so when my

> > blood

> > pressure went up again, I just got discouraged

> about

> > the prospect of finding medical answers. I still

> > think I have some secondary form of hypertension,

> > since my blood pressure is quite variable and can

> > actually be pretty low from time to time.

> >

> > Then I get the spikes. Sometimes they do worse

> than

> > spike and go on for weeks or months.

> >

> > The premise is that there is sodium in my diet

> which

> > causes fluid retention, etc.

> >

> > Therefore, I have been on a fast from both

> > medications

> > and food for the last few days, starting January

> 1.

> > I

> > expect to fast at least a week longer with the

> goal

> > of

> > seeing if my blood pressure eventually goes down.

> I

> > am tapering off caffeine slowly (tea) because I

> > understand withdrawal can cause a rebound spike in

> > blood pressure.

> >

> > Here are the results of my efforts so far:

> >

> > January 1: fresh fruit only

> > BP: 234/140

> >

> > I think my blood pressure may have been a little

> too

> > high for the machine to register properly (it only

> > goes up to 240).

> >

> > January 2: clear fruit juice, tea, and water only

> > BP: 210/119

> >

> > January 3: same as above

> > BP: 201/100

> >

> > Today I am starting on water only. I don't have a

> > scale and don't weigh myself everyday. I did go

> to

> > the local pharmacy last night and found that I

> have

> > lost 4 lbs. so far. I am looking for some sort of

> a

> > drop indicating loss of retained water. So far, I

> > think the 4 lbs. loss is probably just a lack of

> > solid

> > food in my diet and (sorry to be so graphic)

> little

> > left in my colon!

> >

> > Wishing you all well,

> >

> > Warmly,

> >

> > Pam

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > " I'd rather learn from one bird how to sing, than

> to

> > teach ten thousand stars how not to dance. "

> >

> >

> >

> > __________________________________________

> > DSL – Something to write home about.

> > Just $16.99/mo. or less.

> > dsl.

> >

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 1/5/06 4:40:49 AM, spirlhelix@... writes:

My blood pressure is in this range a lot these days,

so the fact that I'm not taking my meds may be

affecting it slightly, but the preponderance of recent

high readings is the reason for the drastic measures.

Have you ever been on the Grim Combination of Combinations. You can take my file on difficult HTN to your Doc and I would be happy to talk to he or she.

May your pressure be low!

Clarence E. Grim, BS (Chem/Math), MS (Biochem), MD, FACP, FACC, FAHS

Clinical Professor of Medicine and Epidemiology

Director, Hypertension Diagnosis and Treatment Center

Board Certified in Internal Medicine, Geriatrics and Hypertension

Published over 220 scientific papers, book chapters and 220 abstracts in the area of high blood pressure epidemiology, physiology, endocrinology measurement, treatment and how to detect curable causes.

Listed in Best Doctors in America

Specializing in Difficult to Control High Blood Pressure and the History and Physiology of High Blood pressure in the African Diaspora

[Guest guest]

Did I suggest you go see Dr. Weinberger or Pratt in Indianapolis?

May your pressure be low!

Clarence E. Grim, BS (Chem/Math), MS (Biochem), MD, FACP, FACC, FAHS

Clinical Professor of Medicine and Epidemiology

Director, Hypertension Diagnosis and Treatment Center

Board Certified in Internal Medicine, Geriatrics and Hypertension

Published over 220 scientific papers, book chapters and 220 abstracts in the area of high blood pressure epidemiology, physiology, endocrinology measurement, treatment and how to detect curable causes.

Listed in Best Doctors in America

Specializing in Difficult to Control High Blood Pressure and the History and Physiology of High Blood pressure in the African Diaspora

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 1/5/06 8:08:15 PM, spirlhelix@... writes:

Hi, Dr Grim

I'm not sure if I have been on the Combination you

mention.  What does it consist of? I am not able to

take beta blockers or many of the popular hypertension

meds I have been exposed to.

Warmly,

Pam

again my experience is that using a little of several diff meds may improve BPcontrol They are in the tfile called difficult hypertension at the bloodpressureline site. Maybe we should put it on our site or link our site to it.

The combo is Lotrel and Ziac the BB in it has fewer side effects. Give more details on what side effects you had with each drug.

May your pressure be low!

Clarence E. Grim, BS (Chem/Math), MS (Biochem), MD, FACP, FACC, FAHS

Clinical Professor of Medicine and Epidemiology

Director, Hypertension Diagnosis and Treatment Center

Board Certified in Internal Medicine, Geriatrics and Hypertension

Published over 220 scientific papers, book chapters and 220 abstracts in the area of high blood pressure epidemiology, physiology, endocrinology measurement, treatment and how to detect curable causes.

Listed in Best Doctors in America

Specializing in Difficult to Control High Blood Pressure and the History and Physiology of High Blood pressure in the African Diaspora

[Guest guest]

Hi, Dr Grim

I'm not sure if I have been on the Combination you

mention. What does it consist of? I am not able to

take beta blockers or many of the popular hypertension

meds I have been exposed to.

Warmly,

Pam

--- lowerbp2@... wrote:

>

> In a message dated 1/5/06 4:40:49 AM,

> spirlhelix@... writes:

>

>

> > My blood pressure is in this range a lot these

> days,

> > so the fact that I'm not taking my meds may be

> > affecting it slightly, but the preponderance of

> recent

> > high readings is the reason for the drastic

> measures.

> >

>

> Have you ever been on the Grim Combination of

> Combinations. You can take my

> file on difficult HTN to your Doc and I would be

> happy to talk to he or she.

>

>

>

> May your pressure be low!

>

> Clarence E. Grim, BS (Chem/Math), MS (Biochem), MD,

> FACP, FACC, FAHS

> Clinical Professor of Medicine and Epidemiology

> Director, Hypertension Diagnosis and Treatment

> Center

> Board Certified in Internal Medicine, Geriatrics and

> Hypertension

>

> Published over 220 scientific papers, book chapters

> and 220 abstracts in the

> area of high blood pressure epidemiology,

> physiology, endocrinology

> measurement, treatment and how to detect curable

> causes.

> Listed in Best Doctors in America

> Specializing in Difficult to Control High Blood

> Pressure and the History and

> Physiology of High Blood pressure in the African

> Diaspora

>

>

" I'd rather learn from one bird how to sing, than to teach ten thousand stars

how not to dance. "

__________________________________________

DSL – Something to write home about.

Just $16.99/mo. or less.

dsl.

[Guest guest]

Hi, Dr. Grim

I tried to get the article you named last night, but I

was not able to access it since I'm not a member.

Perhaps I will join just so I can see it.

I have a history of glomerulonephritis diagnosed by

kidney bx and polyarteritis nodosa diagnosed by liver

bx secondary to Hep B. Both conditions are thought to

be controlled since my recovery from Hep B.

This is only a partial list of medications I have

used.

I know I had more failed " experiments " with

frequently-used medications when I was first diagnosed

with high blood pressure. They were given to me as

samples from the doctor's office, so I don't have good

records. When my blood pressure was more controlled,

I was on Interferon, Nifedepine (calcium channel

blocker) and Beta blockers. . .these led to other

adverse effects that I was unable to tolerate. Diovan

helps to some extent,

but my blood pressure is typically over 150/90 in the

doctor's office, even when it is well-controlled

(120/80) at home, so doctors tend to keep increasing

medication and adding new medications even when I'm

doing well (for me).

I have another list of some of the many combinations

I have been on, I think. I will see if I can

find it for you.

Nexium--stomach pain, ulcer. Got a Vitamin B 12

deficency.

Pletal--pain when walking, ?? blood pressure. Stopped

taking it at some point. I don't have pain when

walking any longer. If it had helped with blood

pressure, the doctor would never have switched it to

something else.

Avapro--high blood pressure. Did not help, I guess.

Doctor changed to a different medication.

Promethazine--don't know why I would have been given

this. I don't remember taking it, but it was in my

medicine chest.

Nadolol--It brought my heart rate down to under 50

beats per minute within two hours of first taking it.

The doctor kept me on 10 mg in combination with other

drugs for over a year, but my blood pressure was still

not controlled. I was also depressed during this time

and I discovered that BBs cause me to be depressed.

I'm

not interested in any BBs at this point.

Labetalol--made me suicidal within two hours of taking

it. It brings down the blood pressure, but it's not

worth it. It won't extend my life.

Atenolol--This one made me sleep sixteen hours a day

and I soon became suicidally depressed from taking it.

I was started at 100 mg qd and had to taper off it

slowly. I felt like I was in a coma until it was out

of my system. I will never take it or other Beta

blockers again.

Nifedepine--I took this for two years and my gums

became badly swollen and sore. I could not care for

my teeth properly; my gums were so sore I could only

eat liquids and was unable to sleep through the night.

I lost a tooth due to an infection and told my doctor

to take me off it. When I finally went off it, my

heart rate went back to normal after being in the

120-150 range for a year.

Verapamil--blood pressure. Did not help.

Verapamil SR--blood pressure. Did not help.

Hydrocortothyazide--edema. Which turned out to be

caused mostly by Nifedpine. Since going off

Nifedepine, I hardly ever have any edema.

HCT lost its effectiveness after a while.

Atacand--blood pressure. I guess it didn't work. The

doctor put me on something else.

Maxzide--edema. Apparently the edema was caused by

Nifedepine, but anyway it's better now that I'm off

Nifedepine.

But the Maxzide lost its effectiveness after a while.

Diovan--Blood pressure. It seems to help to some

extent.

My blood pressure is still high on Diovan,

particularly in the doctor's office.

Hydralazine--aching joints and muscles, headache,

fever,

dark urine. I am told this is considered a true

allergic

reaction.

Lisinopril--feelings of fullness, bloating stomach,

shock-like BP drop, difficulty swallowing, dizziness

and blacking out after standing. It also evidently

lowers my allergy threshold to a dangerous level

(tendency to generalized hives when I'm taking it).

Again, I have been told I have a true allergic

reaction

to this drug.

Warmly,

Pam

--- lowerbp2@... wrote:

>

> In a message dated 1/5/06 8:08:15 PM,

> spirlhelix@... writes:

>

>

> > Hi, Dr Grim

> >

> > I'm not sure if I have been on the Combination you

> > mention. What does it consist of? I am not able

> to

> > take beta blockers or many of the popular

> hypertension

> > meds I have been exposed to.

> >

> > Warmly,

> >

> > Pam

> >

>

> again my experience is that using a little of

> several diff meds may improve

> BPcontrol They are in the tfile called difficult

> hypertension at the

> bloodpressureline site. Maybe we should put it on

> our site or link our site to it.

>

> The combo is Lotrel and Ziac the BB in it has

> fewer side effects. Give

> more details on what side effects you had with each

> drug.

>

>

>

> May your pressure be low!

>

> Clarence E. Grim, BS (Chem/Math), MS (Biochem), MD,

> FACP, FACC, FAHS

> Clinical Professor of Medicine and Epidemiology

> Director, Hypertension Diagnosis and Treatment

> Center

> Board Certified in Internal Medicine, Geriatrics and

> Hypertension

>

> Published over 220 scientific papers, book chapters

> and 220 abstracts in the

> area of high blood pressure epidemiology,

> physiology, endocrinology

> measurement, treatment and how to detect curable

> causes.

> Listed in Best Doctors in America

> Specializing in Difficult to Control High Blood

> Pressure and the History and

> Physiology of High Blood pressure in the African

> Diaspora

>

>

" I'd rather learn from one bird how to sing, than to teach ten thousand stars

how not to dance. "

__________________________________________

DSL – Something to write home about.

Just $16.99/mo. or less.

dsl.

[Guest guest]

You have been through the gamut.

There are still some drugs you have not been tried on:

Reserpine a good old timer

Spironolactone or Inspra

nitroglycerine.

Aldomet

Ismelin

Catapres

But here is what I would do if you came to me:

Diovan HCTZ lowest dose bid.

Norvasc 2.5 bid

Reserpine 1.25 per day

Adding each slowly and treating your home BP not your office BP.

In a message dated 1/6/06 3:43:13 AM, spirlhelix@... writes:

Hi, Dr. Grim

I tried to get the article you named last night, but I

was not able to access it since I'm not a member.

Perhaps I will join just so I can see it.

Good group to join for you I think if you have not. It is free of course.

I have a history of glomerulonephritis diagnosed by

kidney bx and polyarteritis nodosa diagnosed by liver

bx secondary to Hep B.   Both conditions are thought to

be controlled since my recovery from Hep B.

I have reported a case of PAN that seemed to be due to renal artery stenosis.

GN makes you Salt Sensitive. Have you done the DASH 14 day challenge?

Did diuretics lower the BP at all?

 

This is only a partial list of medications I have

used.  

I know I had more failed "experiments" with

frequently-used medications when I was first diagnosed

with high blood pressure.  They were given to me as

samples from the doctor's office, so I don't have good

records.  When my blood pressure was more controlled,

I was on Interferon, Nifedepine (calcium channel

blocker) and Beta blockers. . .these led to other

adverse effects that I was unable to tolerate.  Diovan

helps to some extent,

but my blood pressure is typically over 150/90 in the

doctor's office, even when it is well-controlled

(120/80) at home, so doctors tend to keep increasing

medication and adding new medications even when I'm

doing well (for me).

Have you ever had a 24 hr BP reading done. This might convince them that your BP is OK out of the office.

I have another list of some of the many combinations

I have been on, I think.  I will see if I can

find it for you.

Nexium--stomach pain, ulcer.  Got a Vitamin B 12

deficency.

How was this documented (B12) rare in someone your age

Pletal--pain when walking, ?? blood pressure.  Stopped

taking it at some point.  I don't have pain when

walking any longer.  If it had helped with blood

pressure, the doctor would never have switched it to

something else. not for BP. 

Avapro--high blood pressure.  Did not help, I guess.

Doctor changed to a different medication.

Promethazine--don't know why I would have been given

this.  I don't remember taking it, but it was in my

medicine chest.

Nadolol--It brought my heart rate down to under 50

beats per minute within two hours of first taking it.

The doctor kept me on 10 mg in combination with other

drugs for over a year, but my blood pressure was still

not controlled.  I was also depressed during this time

and I discovered that BBs cause me to be depressed.

I'm

not interested in any BBs at this point.

Labetalol--made me suicidal within two hours of taking

it.  It brings down the blood pressure, but it's not

worth it.  It won't extend my life.

Atenolol--This one made me sleep sixteen hours a day

and I soon became suicidally depressed from taking it.

I was started at 100 mg qd and had to taper off it

slowly.  I felt like I was in a coma until it was out

of my system.  I will never take it or other Beta

blockers again.

Nifedepine--I took this for two years and my gums

became badly swollen and sore.  I could not care for

my teeth properly; my gums were so sore I could only

eat liquids and was unable to sleep through the night.

I lost a tooth due to an infection and told my doctor

to take me off it.  When I finally went off it, my

heart rate went back to normal after being in the

120-150 range for a year.

Newer CCBs not as likely to have this problem.

Verapamil--blood pressure.  Did not help.

Verapamil SR--blood pressure.  Did not help.

Hydrocortothyazide--edema.  Which turned out to be

caused mostly by Nifedpine.  Since going off

Nifedepine, I hardly ever have any edema. 

HCT lost its effectiveness after a while.

HCTZ does not cause edema but Nif does.

How much HCTZ were you on. Some need more than others.

Atacand--blood pressure.  I guess it didn't work.  The

doctor put me on something else.

Maxzide--edema.  Apparently the edema was caused by

Nifedepine, but anyway it's better now that I'm off

Nifedepine.

But the Maxzide lost its effectiveness after a while.

See above

 

Diovan--Blood pressure.  It seems to help to some

extent. 

My blood pressure is still high on Diovan,

particularly in the doctor's office.

Hydralazine--aching joints and muscles, headache,

fever,

dark urine. I am told this is considered a true

allergic

reaction.

Indeed this can cause lupus like syndrome but in the old days when it was the only one around those who got the syndrome actually lived longer.

Lisinopril--feelings of fullness, bloating stomach,

shock-like BP drop, difficulty swallowing, dizziness

and blacking out after standing.  It also evidently

lowers my allergy threshold to a dangerous level

(tendency to generalized hives when I'm taking it). 

Again, I have been told I have a true allergic

reaction

to this drug.

This is a fairly common problem with ACEs Be sure no one puts you on this again.

Warmly,

Pam

--- lowerbp2@... wrote:

>

> In a message dated 1/5/06 8:08:15 PM,

> spirlhelix@... writes:

>

>

> > Hi, Dr Grim

> >

> > I'm not sure if I have been on the Combination you

> > mention.  What does it consist of? I am not able

> to

> > take beta blockers or many of the popular

> hypertension

> > meds I have been exposed to.

> >

> > Warmly,

> >

> > Pam

> >

>

> again my experience is that using a little of

> several diff meds may improve

> BPcontrol   They are in the   tfile called difficult

> hypertension at the

> bloodpressureline site.   Maybe we should put it on

> our site or link our site to it.

>

> The combo is Lotrel and Ziac   the BB in it has

> fewer side effects.   Give

> more details on what side effects you had with each

> drug.  

>

>

>

> May your pressure be low!

>

> Clarence E. Grim, BS (Chem/Math), MS (Biochem), MD,

> FACP, FACC, FAHS

> Clinical Professor of Medicine and Epidemiology

> Director, Hypertension Diagnosis and Treatment

> Center

> Board Certified in Internal Medicine, Geriatrics and

> Hypertension

>

> Published over 220 scientific papers, book chapters

> and 220 abstracts in the

> area of high blood pressure epidemiology,

> physiology, endocrinology

> measurement, treatment and how to detect curable

> causes.

> Listed in Best Doctors in America

> Specializing in Difficult to Control High Blood

> Pressure and the History and

> Physiology of High Blood pressure in the African

> Diaspora

>

>

"I'd rather learn from one bird how to sing, than to teach ten thousand stars how not to dance."

       

__________________________________________

DSL – Something to write home about.

Just $16.99/mo. or less.

dsl.

[Guest guest]

HI, Dr. Grim

Thanks for reminding me!

I have been on spironolactone, which does not bother

me, but eventually my blood pressure rose again.

I have also been on nitroglycerine, but I was taken

off it again so I'm guessing the effects were not as

desired.

I have also been on Catapres, but it makes me very

sleepy and disoriented (no shock there) and I can't

stay on it, so there is risk of rebound when I stop

taking it.

I have also been on Norvasc; I don't recall the side

effects if any, but I know I was taken off it, so it

seems it either was not effective or not tolerable or

both.

Diuretics seem to lower the blood pressure only for a

short time.

I haven't done the DASH 14 day challenge, but I intend

to use DASH after the fast--so I will let you know how

it goes.

I had a 14 hour BP reading and my nephrologist and my

cardiologist disagreed on how to interpret the

results. My cardiologist said my BP was " too

variable " , while my nephrologist said the variations

were normal.

The B12 was low (not an official deficiency, but

enough to cause symptoms--I think around 419, if

memory serves). It caused memory loss, dizziness, and

tingling arms and hands. It was diagnosed by a

neruologist.

I don't recall how much HCTZ I was on, but I think it

was a high dose by the time they titrated it up three

or four times.

Thanks for your remarks!

Warmly,

Pam

--- lowerbp2@... wrote:

> You have been through the gamut.

>

> There are still some drugs you have not been tried

> on:

>

> Reserpine a good old timer

> Spironolactone or Inspra

> nitroglycerine.

> Aldomet

> Ismelin

> Catapres

>

>

> But here is what I would do if you came to me:

>

> Diovan HCTZ lowest dose bid.

> Norvasc 2.5 bid

> Reserpine 1.25 per day

>

> Adding each slowly and treating your home BP not

> your office BP.

>

>

> In a message dated 1/6/06 3:43:13 AM,

> spirlhelix@... writes:

>

>

> > Hi, Dr. Grim

> >

> > I tried to get the article you named last night,

> but I

> > was not able to access it since I'm not a member.

> > Perhaps I will join just so I can see it.

> >

> Good group to join for you I think if you have not.

> It is free of course.

> >

> > I have a history of glomerulonephritis diagnosed

> by

> > kidney bx and polyarteritis nodosa diagnosed by

> liver

> > bx secondary to Hep B. Â Both conditions are

> thought to

> > be controlled since my recovery from Hep B.

> >

> I have reported a case of PAN that seemed to be due

> to renal artery stenosis.

>

> GN makes you Salt Sensitive. Have you done the DASH

> 14 day challenge?

> Did diuretics lower the BP at all?

> > Â

> >

> > This is only a partial list of medications I have

> > used. Â

> > I know I had more failed " experiments " with

> > frequently-used medications when I was first

> diagnosed

> > with high blood pressure. They were given to me

> as

> > samples from the doctor's office, so I don't have

> good

> > records. When my blood pressure was more

> controlled,

> > I was on Interferon, Nifedepine (calcium channel

> > blocker) and Beta blockers. . .these led to other

> > adverse effects that I was unable to tolerate.Â

> Diovan

> > helps to some extent,

> > but my blood pressure is typically over 150/90 in

> the

> > doctor's office, even when it is well-controlled

> > (120/80) at home, so doctors tend to keep

> increasing

> > medication and adding new medications even when

> I'm

> > doing well (for me).

> >

> Have you ever had a 24 hr BP reading done. This

> might convince them that your

> BP is OK out of the office.

> >

> > I have another list of some of the many

> combinations

> > I have been on, I think. I will see if I can

> > find it for you.

> >

> > Nexium--stomach pain, ulcer. Got a Vitamin B 12

> > deficency.

> >

> How was this documented (B12) rare in someone your

> age

> >

> > Pletal--pain when walking, ?? blood pressure.Â

> Stopped

> > taking it at some point. I don't have pain when

> > walking any longer. If it had helped with blood

> > pressure, the doctor would never have switched it

> to

> > something else. not for BP.Â

> >

> > Avapro--high blood pressure. Did not help, I

> guess.

> > Doctor changed to a different medication.

> >

> > Promethazine--don't know why I would have been

> given

> > this. I don't remember taking it, but it was in

> my

> > medicine chest.

> >

> > Nadolol--It brought my heart rate down to under 50

> > beats per minute within two hours of first taking

> it.

> >

> > The doctor kept me on 10 mg in combination with

> other

> > drugs for over a year, but my blood pressure was

> still

> >

> > not controlled. I was also depressed during this

> time

> >

> > and I discovered that BBs cause me to be

> depressed.

> > I'm

> > not interested in any BBs at this point.

> >

> > Labetalol--made me suicidal within two hours of

> taking

> > it. It brings down the blood pressure, but it's

> not

> > worth it. It won't extend my life.

> >

> > Atenolol--This one made me sleep sixteen hours a

> day

> > and I soon became suicidally depressed from taking

> it.

> > I was started at 100 mg qd and had to taper off it

> > slowly. I felt like I was in a coma until it was

> out

> > of my system. I will never take it or other Beta

> > blockers again.

> >

> > Nifedepine--I took this for two years and my gums

> > became badly swollen and sore. I could not care

> for

> > my teeth properly; my gums were so sore I could

> only

> > eat liquids and was unable to sleep through the

> night.

> > I lost a tooth due to an infection and told my

> doctor

> > to take me off it. When I finally went off it,

> my

> > heart rate went back to normal after being in the

> > 120-150 range for a year.

> >

> Newer CCBs not as likely to have this problem.

> >

> > Verapamil--blood pressure. Did not help.

> >

> > Verapamil SR--blood pressure. Did not help.

> >

> > Hydrocortothyazide--edema. Which turned out to

> be

> > caused mostly by Nifedpine. Since going off

> > Nifedepine, I hardly ever have any edema.Â

> > HCT lost its effectiveness after a while.

> >

> HCTZ does not cause edema but Nif does.

>

> How much HCTZ were you on. Some need more than

> others.

> >

> > Atacand--blood pressure. I guess it didn't

> work. The

> > doctor put me on something else.

> >

> >

> > Maxzide--edema. Apparently the edema was caused

> by

> > Nifedepine, but anyway it's better now that I'm

> off

> > Nifedepine.

> > But the Maxzide lost its effectiveness after a

> while.

> >

> See above

> > Â

> > Diovan--Blood pressure. It seems to help to some

> > extent.Â

> > My blood pressure is still high on Diovan,

> > particularly in the doctor's office.

> >

> > Hydralazine--aching joints and muscles, headache,

> > fever,

> > dark urine. I am told this is considered a true

> > allergic

> > reaction.

> >

>

=== message truncated ===

" I'd rather learn from one bird how to sing, than to teach ten thousand stars

how not to dance. "

__________________________________________

DSL – Something to write home about.

Just $16.99/mo. or less.

dsl.

[Guest guest]

Hi, All!

For those who care, here is an update on my water fast to control

blood pressure and help establish its cause. Anyway, it helps me to

keep records; and I don't mind sharing my results with all of you.

January 1: fresh fruit only

BP: 234/140

I think my blood pressure may have been a little too

high for the machine to register properly (it only

goes up to 240).

January 2: clear fruit juice, tea, and water only

BP: 210/119

January 3: same as above

BP: 201/100

January 4: no tea, only water

BP 237/116

Weight loss of 7 lbs at this point

January 5: water only

BP 234/120

January 6: water only

BP 236/136

Weight loss of 13 lbs. total

Looks like I dropped some water weight here.

January 7:

BP 195/126

Finally! I think I was in caffiene withdrawal for a while there. It

always shoots my blood pressure up. I need to decide whether I intend

to forgo caffiene in the future, or make extensive efforts to imbibe

on a strict schedule so I won't go into withdrawal (it only takes a

day as you can see).

January 9:

BP 191/116

Things are looking a little better. I intend to go on for another

week to see if my BP will continue to go down. If it is still pretty

high, perhaps I need to look for factors other than diet such as sleep

apnea. Does high blood pressure ever result from allergies?

Remebering that I have a history of vasculitis, which I believe is a

similar to allergy.

I also have very sensitive skin which is inclined to hives and " atopic

dermatitis " . I have been told by a dermatologist that I am " allergic

to myself " . . . lovely. But when I was being treated for a severe

allergic reaction this summer, my blood pressure was 105/65. Hmmm.

Warmly,

Pam

[Guest guest]

Might want to try the rice-fruit diet at ricediet.com

May your pressure be low!

Clarence E. Grim, BS (Chem/Math), MS (Biochem), MD, FACP, FACC, FAHS

Clinical Professor of Medicine and Epidemiology

Director, Hypertension Diagnosis and Treatment Center

Board Certified in Internal Medicine, Geriatrics and Hypertension

Published over 220 scientific papers, book chapters and 220 abstracts in the area of high blood pressure epidemiology, physiology, endocrinology measurement, treatment and how to detect curable causes.

Listed in Best Doctors in America

Specializing in Difficult to Control High Blood Pressure and the History and Physiology of High Blood pressure in the African Diaspora

[Guest guest]

Hi, Dr. Grim

I wonder if you would look over these numbers and see what you think:

January 1: fresh fruit only

BP: 234/140

I think my blood pressure may have been a little too

high for the machine to register properly (it only

goes up to 240).

January 2: clear fruit juice, tea, and water only

BP: 210/119

January 3: same as above

BP: 201/100

January 4: no tea, only water

BP 237/116

Weight loss of 7 lbs at this point

January 5: water only

BP 234/120

January 6: water only

BP 236/136

Weight loss of 13 lbs. total

Looks like I dropped some water weight here.

January 7:

BP 195/126

Finally! I think I was in caffiene withdrawal for a while there. It

always shoots my blood pressure up. I need to decide whether I intend

to forgo caffiene in the future, or make extensive efforts to imbibe

on a strict schedule so I won't go into withdrawal (it only takes a

day as you can see).

January 9:

BP 191/116

January 10:

BP 203/120

January 11:

BP 223/114

January 12:

BP 236/116

January 13:

BP 219/119

January 14:

BP 209/118

January 15:

BP: 232/126

January 15: Began drinking apple and grape juice in addition to water.

BP: 191/118

Spent the night previous to this BP reading at my daughter's (she has

no cats; I have ten and I'm allergic to cats)

January 16: Rice and fruit.

BP: 166/125

January 17: Rice and fruit.

BP 144/106

These diastolic readings seem awfully high. Does that mean anything

to you, Dr. Grim?

January 18: Rice, fruit, vegetables, meat. No wheat or dairy

products. I had been feeling worn-out so I broke down and started

eating a more varied diet for energy.

BP 164/115

I noticed I was able to rest well when I was fasting; slept all night

without rising; did not have my mouth open as I slept. When I started

a more varied diet, the same symptoms (sleep disturbances, snoring,

waking up at night) came back. I no doubt have some food allergies,

but I think my overall allergy load is just way too high as the owner

of ten cats who has severe allergies to cats. Funny thing is, I never

think about cat allergies since I don't get rhinitis anymore as I used

to. I don't even try to treat my allergies for this reason, and

because I find allergy medications just as hard to tolerate as blood

pressure meds. If this theory is true, then any additional allergy

load (certain foods, in addition to constant exposure to cats) may be

adding to swelling in the throat and soft palate, leading to a mild

case of sleep apnea (I have been diagnosed with borderline sleep

apnea), leading to blood pressure which is more difficult to control.

Warmly,

Pam

[Guest guest]

Hi, Dr. Grim

I forgot to note one more variable: My weight has

dropped 19 lbs. since the beginning of January.

Warmly,

Pam

" I'd rather learn from one bird how to sing, than to teach ten thousand stars

how not to dance. "

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 1/18/06 7:27:35 AM, spirlhelix@... writes:

Hi, Dr. Grim

I forgot to note one more variable:  My weight has

dropped 19 lbs. since the beginning of January.

Warmly,

Pam

If you have been trying to lose that is good. If not has your

Rx changed since then.

No chance that you got a new scale or the old one was knocked out of whack?

May your pressure be low!

Clarence E. Grim, BS (Chem/Math), MS (Biochem), MD, FACP, FACC, FAHS

Clinical Professor of Medicine and Epidemiology

Director, Hypertension Diagnosis and Treatment Center

Board Certified in Internal Medicine, Geriatrics and Hypertension

Published over 220 scientific papers, book chapters and 220 abstracts in the area of high blood pressure epidemiology, physiology, endocrinology measurement, treatment and how to detect curable causes.

Listed in Best Doctors in America

Specializing in Difficult to Control High Blood Pressure and the History and Physiology of High Blood pressure in the African Diaspora

[Guest guest]

Read your other letter first.

Looks like rice and fruit are doing their job. You should also be on a one a day vitamin.

Keep up the good work!

Many will drop their BP over 100 points on this eating plan. Trust you have one of the books on the diet. If not recommend ricediet.com

Be certain you tell your Dr what you are doing.

May your pressure be low!

Clarence E. Grim, BS (Chem/Math), MS (Biochem), MD, FACP, FACC, FAHS

Clinical Professor of Medicine and Epidemiology

Director, Hypertension Diagnosis and Treatment Center

Board Certified in Internal Medicine, Geriatrics and Hypertension

Published over 220 scientific papers, book chapters and 220 abstracts in the area of high blood pressure epidemiology, physiology, endocrinology measurement, treatment and how to detect curable causes.

Listed in Best Doctors in America

Specializing in Difficult to Control High Blood Pressure and the History and Physiology of High Blood pressure in the African Diaspora

[Guest guest]

Hi, Dr. Grim

I really _cannot_ do the rice diet, if all it consists

of is rice and fruit. I need more energy. I am not a

vegetarian.

I don't have a book, and I don't mean to get one.

Thanks for your kind wishes,

Warmly,

Pam

--- lowerbp2@... wrote:

> Read your other letter first.

>

> Looks like rice and fruit are doing their job. You

> should also be on a one

> a day vitamin.

>

> Keep up the good work!

>

> Many will drop their BP over 100 points on this

> eating plan. Trust you have

> one of the books on the diet. If not recommend

> ricediet.com

>

> Be certain you tell your Dr what you are doing.

>

>

>

> May your pressure be low!

>

> Clarence E. Grim, BS (Chem/Math), MS (Biochem), MD,

> FACP, FACC, FAHS

> Clinical Professor of Medicine and Epidemiology

> Director, Hypertension Diagnosis and Treatment

> Center

> Board Certified in Internal Medicine, Geriatrics and

> Hypertension

>

> Published over 220 scientific papers, book chapters

> and 220 abstracts in the

> area of high blood pressure epidemiology,

> physiology, endocrinology

> measurement, treatment and how to detect curable

> causes.

> Listed in Best Doctors in America

> Specializing in Difficult to Control High Blood

> Pressure and the History and

> Physiology of High Blood pressure in the African

> Diaspora

>

>

" I'd rather learn from one bird how to sing, than to teach ten thousand stars

how not to dance. "

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

Hi, Dr. Grim

Those diastolic pressures have come down very little

or none at all. They are pretty high. What could

that mean?

Warmly,

Pam

--- lowerbp2@... wrote:

> Read your other letter first.

>

> Looks like rice and fruit are doing their job. You

> should also be on a one

> a day vitamin.

>

> Keep up the good work!

>

> Many will drop their BP over 100 points on this

> eating plan. Trust you have

> one of the books on the diet. If not recommend

> ricediet.com

>

> Be certain you tell your Dr what you are doing.

>

>

>

> May your pressure be low!

>

> Clarence E. Grim, BS (Chem/Math), MS (Biochem), MD,

> FACP, FACC, FAHS

> Clinical Professor of Medicine and Epidemiology

> Director, Hypertension Diagnosis and Treatment

> Center

> Board Certified in Internal Medicine, Geriatrics and

> Hypertension

>

> Published over 220 scientific papers, book chapters

> and 220 abstracts in the

> area of high blood pressure epidemiology,

> physiology, endocrinology

> measurement, treatment and how to detect curable

> causes.

> Listed in Best Doctors in America

> Specializing in Difficult to Control High Blood

> Pressure and the History and

> Physiology of High Blood pressure in the African

> Diaspora

>

>

" I'd rather learn from one bird how to sing, than to teach ten thousand stars

how not to dance. "

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 1/18/06 1:50:10 PM, spirlhelix@... writes:

Those diastolic pressures have come down very little

or none at all.  They are pretty high.  What could

that mean?

If you are using an automatic device they are prob wrong. Do you listen or use an automatic device?

Listening is much more accurate in many folks.

May your pressure be low!

Clarence E. Grim, BS (Chem/Math), MS (Biochem), MD, FACP, FACC, FAHS

Clinical Professor of Medicine and Epidemiology

Director, Hypertension Diagnosis and Treatment Center

Board Certified in Internal Medicine, Geriatrics and Hypertension

Published over 220 scientific papers, book chapters and 220 abstracts in the area of high blood pressure epidemiology, physiology, endocrinology measurement, treatment and how to detect curable causes.

Listed in Best Doctors in America

Specializing in Difficult to Control High Blood Pressure and the History and Physiology of High Blood pressure in the African Diaspora

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 1/18/06 1:38:58 PM, spirlhelix@... writes:

Hi, Dr. Grim

I really _cannot_ do the rice diet, if all it consists

of is rice and fruit.  I need more energy.  I am not a

vegetarian.

I don't have a book, and I don't mean to get one. 

Thanks for your kind wishes,

Warmly,

Pam

If you read about the diet you will see that meat is added back once you get to goal

Recommend you read

"Fat Like Us" for more infor.

It is always your choice.

As Dr K always said: in one had I offer you your life and the other the salt shaker. The choice is yours.

Of course this was when there were no drugs to treat HTN and most with you kind of pressures were dead in a year.

May your pressure be low!

Clarence E. Grim, BS (Chem/Math), MS (Biochem), MD, FACP, FACC, FAHS

Clinical Professor of Medicine and Epidemiology

Director, Hypertension Diagnosis and Treatment Center

Board Certified in Internal Medicine, Geriatrics and Hypertension

Published over 220 scientific papers, book chapters and 220 abstracts in the area of high blood pressure epidemiology, physiology, endocrinology measurement, treatment and how to detect curable causes.

Listed in Best Doctors in America

Specializing in Difficult to Control High Blood Pressure and the History and Physiology of High Blood pressure in the African Diaspora

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 1/19/06 6:38:09 AM, spirlhelix@... writes:

Hi, Dr. Grim

Thanks for the book title.  My current BMI says I'm

just nine pounds above overweight in the obese

category.  Gastric bypass has never been proposed for

me (seems rather drastic at this point).  Besides,

with my history of low Vitamin B12 (one reason I want

more variety in my diet and not a strictly vegetarian

regieme), I have an idea what health risks are

involved with that sort of surgery.  I don't think

surgery is the answer.

I don't have insurance, or the money to go to the Rice

House; it's hard enough to get money together to pay

ordinary doctor bills. 

Remember, I have just come off a two-week water fast,

which is the opposite extreme beginning point of most

people starting a restricted diet.  I can tell my body

misses certain minerals and nutrients.  In my current

physical and economic condition, I think I'd be much

more suited to the DASH diet.  

Warmly,

Pam

Agree DASH is best if it works. I would do the 14 day challange in the book and if your bp does not get better you are not DASH sensitive and the next step would be to do the rice diet at home for 2 weeks-tell you Dr what you are doing.

Or look at the Ornish diet.

Losing weight will almost certainly help things some as well.

May your pressure be low!

Clarence E. Grim, BS (Chem/Math), MS (Biochem), MD, FACP, FACC, FAHS

Clinical Professor of Medicine and Epidemiology

Director, Hypertension Diagnosis and Treatment Center

Board Certified in Internal Medicine, Geriatrics and Hypertension

Published over 220 scientific papers, book chapters and 220 abstracts in the area of high blood pressure epidemiology, physiology, endocrinology measurement, treatment and how to detect curable causes.

Listed in Best Doctors in America

Specializing in Difficult to Control High Blood Pressure and the History and Physiology of High Blood pressure in the African Diaspora

[Guest guest]

Hi, Dr. Grim

Thanks for the book title. My current BMI says I'm

just nine pounds above overweight in the obese

category. Gastric bypass has never been proposed for

me (seems rather drastic at this point). Besides,

with my history of low Vitamin B12 (one reason I want

more variety in my diet and not a strictly vegetarian

regieme), I have an idea what health risks are

involved with that sort of surgery. I don't think

surgery is the answer.

I don't have insurance, or the money to go to the Rice

House; it's hard enough to get money together to pay

ordinary doctor bills.

Remember, I have just come off a two-week water fast,

which is the opposite extreme beginning point of most

people starting a restricted diet. I can tell my body

misses certain minerals and nutrients. In my current

physical and economic condition, I think I'd be much

more suited to the DASH diet.

Warmly,

Pam

--- lowerbp2@... wrote:

>

> In a message dated 1/18/06 1:38:58 PM,

> spirlhelix@... writes:

>

>

> > Hi, Dr. Grim

> >

> > I really _cannot_ do the rice diet, if all it

> consists

> > of is rice and fruit. I need more energy. I am

> not a

> > vegetarian.

> >

> > I don't have a book, and I don't mean to get one.

> >

> > Thanks for your kind wishes,

> >

> > Warmly,

> >

> > Pam

> >

> If you read about the diet you will see that meat is

> added back once you get

> to goal

>

> Recommend you read

> " Fat Like Us " for more infor.

>

>

> It is always your choice.

>

> As Dr K always said: in one had I offer you your

> life and the other the

> salt shaker. The choice is yours.

>

> Of course this was when there were no drugs to treat

> HTN and most with you

> kind of pressures were dead in a year.

>

>

>

> May your pressure be low!

>

> Clarence E. Grim, BS (Chem/Math), MS (Biochem), MD,

> FACP, FACC, FAHS

> Clinical Professor of Medicine and Epidemiology

> Director, Hypertension Diagnosis and Treatment

> Center

> Board Certified in Internal Medicine, Geriatrics and

> Hypertension

>

> Published over 220 scientific papers, book chapters

> and 220 abstracts in the

> area of high blood pressure epidemiology,

> physiology, endocrinology

> measurement, treatment and how to detect curable

> causes.

> Listed in Best Doctors in America

> Specializing in Difficult to Control High Blood

> Pressure and the History and

> Physiology of High Blood pressure in the African

> Diaspora

>

>

" I'd rather learn from one bird how to sing, than to teach ten thousand stars

how not to dance. "

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

Best is BMI <25 to live long and prosper!

On Jan 19, 2006, at 6:30 AM, Pamela s wrote:

> Hi, Dr. Grim

>

> Thanks for the book title. My current BMI says I'm

> just nine pounds above overweight in the obese

> category. Gastric bypass has never been proposed for

> me (seems rather drastic at this point). Besides,

> with my history of low Vitamin B12 (one reason I want

> more variety in my diet and not a strictly vegetarian

> regieme), I have an idea what health risks are

> involved with that sort of surgery. I don't think

> surgery is the answer.

>

> I don't have insurance, or the money to go to the Rice

> House; it's hard enough to get money together to pay

> ordinary doctor bills.

>

> Remember, I have just come off a two-week water fast,

> which is the opposite extreme beginning point of most

> people starting a restricted diet. I can tell my body

> misses certain minerals and nutrients. In my current

> physical and economic condition, I think I'd be much

> more suited to the DASH diet.

>

> Warmly,

>

> Pam

>

> --- lowerbp2@... wrote:

>

>>

>> In a message dated 1/18/06 1:38:58 PM,

>> spirlhelix@... writes:

>>

>>

>>> Hi, Dr. Grim

>>>

>>> I really _cannot_ do the rice diet, if all it

>> consists

>>> of is rice and fruit. I need more energy. I am

>> not a

>>> vegetarian.

>>>

>>> I don't have a book, and I don't mean to get one.

>>>

>>> Thanks for your kind wishes,

>>>

>>> Warmly,

>>>

>>> Pam

>>>

>> If you read about the diet you will see that meat is

>> added back once you get

>> to goal

>>

>> Recommend you read

>> " Fat Like Us " for more infor.

>>

>>

>> It is always your choice.

>>

>> As Dr K always said: in one had I offer you your

>> life and the other the

>> salt shaker. The choice is yours.

>>

>> Of course this was when there were no drugs to treat

>> HTN and most with you

>> kind of pressures were dead in a year.

>>

>>

>>

>> May your pressure be low!

>>

>> Clarence E. Grim, BS (Chem/Math), MS (Biochem), MD,

>> FACP, FACC, FAHS

>> Clinical Professor of Medicine and Epidemiology

>> Director, Hypertension Diagnosis and Treatment

>> Center

>> Board Certified in Internal Medicine, Geriatrics and

>> Hypertension

>>

>> Published over 220 scientific papers, book chapters

>> and 220 abstracts in the

>> area of high blood pressure epidemiology,

>> physiology, endocrinology

>> measurement, treatment and how to detect curable

>> causes.

>> Listed in Best Doctors in America

>> Specializing in Difficult to Control High Blood

>> Pressure and the History and

>> Physiology of High Blood pressure in the African

>> Diaspora

>>

>>

>

>

> " I'd rather learn from one bird how to sing, than to teach ten

> thousand stars how not to dance. "

>

> __________________________________________________

>