Re: Help! With Hypertension Strategies

[Guest guest]

Pam, I've had it take about a week to recover from a few days of indulgence, although I'm usually pretty consistent with my meds. Other things I've found to help lower my blood pressure in the interim include getting enough sleep at night, taking a warm bath, deep breathing exercises, avoiding caffeine, and do anything else that helps you to relax.

I've heard there are certain things you can eat to naturally lower bp (garlic, ginger, apples) but I have not personally tried anything like this.

Take care,

Help! With Hypertension Strategies

Hi, AllWell, I've been forgetting my medication from time totime. And I did have a bad weekend, dietetically speaking,eating BBQ ribs my son cooked for his birthdaycelebration (we had extra left--had to eat them,right?).And I was on my period, which is the absolute worsttime for my blood pressure.And this was a visit to my cardiologist, who drives menuts.So my blood pressure was 220/120.And this was the second visit in three months where itregistered at stroke level.Over the last several days, I have been taking my 100mg spironolactone more religiously (I thought I couldget by without using my seven-day pillbox, but Iproved myself mistaken).I ate very little sodium. . . one night I just aterice and only rice, to try to get the blood pressureto come down. I've been eating lots of vegetables andhomecooked foods with no or little sodium. And my period is over.But my blood pressure is still pretty high (187/116).Is there any chance the Spironolactone needs to beincreased? How long should I experiment with dietbefore I ask my doctor about upping theSpironolactone?I could also try going back on Lisinopril, which Istopped taking to save money.Dr. Grim, what do I need to do next? I really want toavoid experimenting with more hypertensionmedications.Warmly,Pam "I'd rather learn from one bird how to sing, than to teach ten thousand stars how not to dance."__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

Hi Pam:

Hope you are feeling better. Like mentioned, a warm bath really helps. On the days(before spiro) that my bp was over 180+, I fill the bath tub with the warmest water and just soak in there for 5-10 minutes, my bp drops 60 points (on both syst. and diast) immediately after I come out of the bath tub and lie down for a few minutes. I notice my bp stays low for at least an hour or more before it starts going up again.

Here is another Yoga suggestion I use for myself and teach, take one long deep breath(inhale) thru your nose, and and 3 quick exhalations thru the mouth(make sure your belly is totally out of air, so press your tummy in as you exhale, and repeat this a few times. Of course these are all temporary solutions.(make sure you are lying down or sitting when you try the breathing), this gives your body extra quick oxygen so you may feel dizzy.(kind of hyper ventilating)

I've tried garlic, ginger, lots of vit C, co-Q 10, etc, and all of them resulted in bringing my bp up reather than lower. Perhaps this works for those who have essential hypertention. It appears that they work as extra salt in our bodies.

Wishing you a much lower bp,

Farah Malotky <leslie@...> wrote:

Pam, I've had it take about a week to recover from a few days of indulgence, although I'm usually pretty consistent with my meds. Other things I've found to help lower my blood pressure in the interim include getting enough sleep at night, taking a warm bath, deep breathing exercises, avoiding caffeine, and do anything else that helps you to relax.

I've heard there are certain things you can eat to naturally lower bp (garlic, ginger, apples) but I have not personally tried anything like this.

Take care,

Help! With Hypertension Strategies

Hi, AllWell, I've been forgetting my medication from time totime. And I did have a bad weekend, dietetically speaking,eating BBQ ribs my son cooked for his birthdaycelebration (we had extra left--had to eat them,right?).And I was on my period, which is the absolute worsttime for my blood pressure.And this was a visit to my cardiologist, who drives menuts.So my blood pressure was 220/120.And this was the second visit in three months where itregistered at stroke level.Over the last several days, I have been taking my 100mg spironolactone more religiously (I thought I couldget by without using my seven-day pillbox, but Iproved myself mistaken).I ate very little sodium. . . one night I just aterice and only rice, to try to get the blood pressureto come down. I've been eating lots of vegetables andhomecooked foods with no or little

sodium. And my period is over.But my blood pressure is still pretty high (187/116).Is there any chance the Spironolactone needs to beincreased? How long should I experiment with dietbefore I ask my doctor about upping theSpironolactone?I could also try going back on Lisinopril, which Istopped taking to save money.Dr. Grim, what do I need to do next? I really want toavoid experimenting with more hypertensionmedications.Warmly,Pam "I'd rather learn from one bird how to sing, than to teach ten thousand stars how not to dance."__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

Hi, All!

Thanks, everyone for sharing your ideas!

I must have a highly aldosterone-driven blood pressure

at the moment, because taking the warm bath only

lowered my blood pressure by 4 points, systolic.

Started at 197/118, ended up at 193/114.

Worth a try, anyway.

Based on that, I don't think the stress-relief

techniques are going to help me much at this

particular moment.

My nephrologist has increased my spironolactone to 200

mg per day. Hope it kicks in soon!

Here's a funny story:

I had to go to the ER the other night to have some

injuries checked for infection. The staff was rather

in an uproar when I told them I had been attacked by a

wild turkey.

It was not easy to keep a straight face while telling

them this.

Wild turkeys are making a comeback, folks. If you

love to walk nature trails like I do, and you happen

to see a male (Tom) come up to you and display his fan

of tailfeathers, take my advice and run, don't walk,

right down that trail away from that turkey.

This was a big turkey. As a conservative estimate,

I'd put it at 40 lbs. There is no way that enormous

bird would go in any oven of mine.

I was so awe-struck at this huge bird so close to me,

that when he came up to me I froze on the spot. Very

quickly, I found out what those wings are for.

Turkeys can fly for short distances (at up to 55

mph!). They beat you with their wings (those wing

bones are at least the size of a man's wrist in

diameter, and quite hard in the uncooked state) and,

still flying, rise to gouge you with their spurs.

When I saw the bird rise and lift his claws to strike

me, I instinctively (thanks to my former study of Jeet

Kune Do, and thank you Bruce Lee!) grabbed a hold of

that huge drumstick and threw the turkey.

I let the turkey know what I thought. I wonder if

anyone else on the trail heard me yell, " No! Turkey!

Stop! "

I lost both my shoes in the scuffle (actually, I

stupidly threw them at the turkey and had to retrieve

them) so, still yelling, I held one shoe in each hand

and backed quite rapidly about a hundred yards down

the trail as the turkey pursued me. I managed to get

a good knock on each wing with the shoes, but I'm sure

it just made him madder.

So here I was in the emergency room a couple of nights

later with several lacerations and puncture wounds, as

well as a slew of bruises from my encounter with the

turkey.

Some staff members were absolutely agog with my story.

The triage nurse was apparently more concerned (as

you may imagine) with my blood pressure, which

registered at 234/133.

It turns out that my tetanus shots were up to date and

my punctures were clean with no sign of infection

(hard for me to tell; several were on my back).

If nothing else, it gave me a good story.

Warmly,

Pam

--- Pamela s <spirlhelix@...> wrote:

>

> Hi, All

>

> Well, I've been forgetting my medication from time

> to

> time.

>

> And I did have a bad weekend, dietetically speaking,

> eating BBQ ribs my son cooked for his birthday

> celebration (we had extra left--had to eat them,

> right?).

>

> And I was on my period, which is the absolute worst

> time for my blood pressure.

>

> And this was a visit to my cardiologist, who drives

> me

> nuts.

>

> So my blood pressure was 220/120.

>

> And this was the second visit in three months where

> it

> registered at stroke level.

>

> Over the last several days, I have been taking my

> 100

> mg spironolactone more religiously (I thought I

> could

> get by without using my seven-day pillbox, but I

> proved myself mistaken).

>

> I ate very little sodium. . . one night I just ate

> rice and only rice, to try to get the blood pressure

> to come down. I've been eating lots of vegetables

> and

> homecooked foods with no or little sodium.

>

> And my period is over.

>

> But my blood pressure is still pretty high

> (187/116).

>

> Is there any chance the Spironolactone needs to be

> increased? How long should I experiment with diet

> before I ask my doctor about upping the

> Spironolactone?

>

> I could also try going back on Lisinopril, which I

> stopped taking to save money.

>

> Dr. Grim, what do I need to do next? I really want

> to

> avoid experimenting with more hypertension

> medications.

>

> Warmly,

>

> Pam

>

>

>

>

>

> " I'd rather learn from one bird how to sing, than to

> teach ten thousand stars how not to dance. "

>

> __________________________________________________

>

[Guest guest]

Pam, this is too high! Is is always that high? What are you doing?

Spiro or inspra? Dr Grim, I believe, mentioned upping the spiro, by

amounts, and to do it w/your doc.

Dave

On Apr 23, 2005, at 8:31 PM, Pamela s wrote:

>

> Hi, All!

>

> Thanks, everyone for sharing your ideas!

>

> I must have a highly aldosterone-driven blood pressure

> at the moment, because taking the warm bath only

> lowered my blood pressure by 4 points, systolic.

>

> Started at 197/118, ended up at 193/114.

>

> Worth a try, anyway.

>

> Based on that, I don't think the stress-relief

> techniques are going to help me much at this

> particular moment.

>

> My nephrologist has increased my spironolactone to 200

> mg per day. Hope it kicks in soon!

>

> Here's a funny story:

>

> I had to go to the ER the other night to have some

> injuries checked for infection. The staff was rather

> in an uproar when I told them I had been attacked by a

> wild turkey.

>

> It was not easy to keep a straight face while telling

> them this.

>

> Wild turkeys are making a comeback, folks. If you

> love to walk nature trails like I do, and you happen

> to see a male (Tom) come up to you and display his fan

> of tailfeathers, take my advice and run, don't walk,

> right down that trail away from that turkey.

>

> This was a big turkey. As a conservative estimate,

> I'd put it at 40 lbs. There is no way that enormous

> bird would go in any oven of mine.

>

> I was so awe-struck at this huge bird so close to me,

> that when he came up to me I froze on the spot. Very

> quickly, I found out what those wings are for.

> Turkeys can fly for short distances (at up to 55

> mph!). They beat you with their wings (those wing

> bones are at least the size of a man's wrist in

> diameter, and quite hard in the uncooked state) and,

> still flying, rise to gouge you with their spurs.

>

> When I saw the bird rise and lift his claws to strike

> me, I instinctively (thanks to my former study of Jeet

> Kune Do, and thank you Bruce Lee!) grabbed a hold of

> that huge drumstick and threw the turkey.

>

> I let the turkey know what I thought. I wonder if

> anyone else on the trail heard me yell, " No! Turkey!

> Stop! "

>

> I lost both my shoes in the scuffle (actually, I

> stupidly threw them at the turkey and had to retrieve

> them) so, still yelling, I held one shoe in each hand

> and backed quite rapidly about a hundred yards down

> the trail as the turkey pursued me. I managed to get

> a good knock on each wing with the shoes, but I'm sure

> it just made him madder.

>

> So here I was in the emergency room a couple of nights

> later with several lacerations and puncture wounds, as

> well as a slew of bruises from my encounter with the

> turkey.

>

> Some staff members were absolutely agog with my story.

> The triage nurse was apparently more concerned (as

> you may imagine) with my blood pressure, which

> registered at 234/133.

>

> It turns out that my tetanus shots were up to date and

> my punctures were clean with no sign of infection

> (hard for me to tell; several were on my back).

>

> If nothing else, it gave me a good story.

>

> Warmly,

>

> Pam

>

>

>

>

> --- Pamela s <spirlhelix@...> wrote:

>>

>> Hi, All

>>

>> Well, I've been forgetting my medication from time

>> to

>> time.

>>

>> And I did have a bad weekend, dietetically speaking,

>> eating BBQ ribs my son cooked for his birthday

>> celebration (we had extra left--had to eat them,

>> right?).

>>

>> And I was on my period, which is the absolute worst

>> time for my blood pressure.

>>

>> And this was a visit to my cardiologist, who drives

>> me

>> nuts.

>>

>> So my blood pressure was 220/120.

>>

>> And this was the second visit in three months where

>> it

>> registered at stroke level.

>>

>> Over the last several days, I have been taking my

>> 100

>> mg spironolactone more religiously (I thought I

>> could

>> get by without using my seven-day pillbox, but I

>> proved myself mistaken).

>>

>> I ate very little sodium. . . one night I just ate

>> rice and only rice, to try to get the blood pressure

>> to come down. I've been eating lots of vegetables

>> and

>> homecooked foods with no or little sodium.

>>

>> And my period is over.

>>

>> But my blood pressure is still pretty high

>> (187/116).

>>

>> Is there any chance the Spironolactone needs to be

>> increased? How long should I experiment with diet

>> before I ask my doctor about upping the

>> Spironolactone?

>>

>> I could also try going back on Lisinopril, which I

>> stopped taking to save money.

>>

>> Dr. Grim, what do I need to do next? I really want

>> to

>> avoid experimenting with more hypertension

>> medications.

>>

>> Warmly,

>>

>> Pam

>

[Guest guest]

Wow, Thank God you are ok. What a story. My bp would be that high too if I had to encounter a large turkey like that.

Take good care of yourself,

FarahPamela s <spirlhelix@...> wrote:

Hi, All!Thanks, everyone for sharing your ideas!I must have a highly aldosterone-driven blood pressureat the moment, because taking the warm bath onlylowered my blood pressure by 4 points, systolic.Started at 197/118, ended up at 193/114.Worth a try, anyway. Based on that, I don't think the stress-relieftechniques are going to help me much at thisparticular moment.My nephrologist has increased my spironolactone to 200mg per day. Hope it kicks in soon!Here's a funny story:I had to go to the ER the other night to have someinjuries checked for infection. The staff was ratherin an uproar when I told them I had been attacked by awild turkey.It was not easy to keep a straight face while tellingthem this.Wild turkeys are making a comeback, folks. If

youlove to walk nature trails like I do, and you happento see a male (Tom) come up to you and display his fanof tailfeathers, take my advice and run, don't walk,right down that trail away from that turkey.This was a big turkey. As a conservative estimate,I'd put it at 40 lbs. There is no way that enormousbird would go in any oven of mine.I was so awe-struck at this huge bird so close to me,that when he came up to me I froze on the spot. Veryquickly, I found out what those wings are for. Turkeys can fly for short distances (at up to 55mph!). They beat you with their wings (those wingbones are at least the size of a man's wrist indiameter, and quite hard in the uncooked state) and,still flying, rise to gouge you with their spurs. When I saw the bird rise and lift his claws to strikeme, I instinctively (thanks to my former study of JeetKune Do, and thank you Bruce Lee!)

grabbed a hold ofthat huge drumstick and threw the turkey.I let the turkey know what I thought. I wonder ifanyone else on the trail heard me yell, "No! Turkey! Stop!"I lost both my shoes in the scuffle (actually, Istupidly threw them at the turkey and had to retrievethem) so, still yelling, I held one shoe in each handand backed quite rapidly about a hundred yards downthe trail as the turkey pursued me. I managed to geta good knock on each wing with the shoes, but I'm sureit just made him madder.So here I was in the emergency room a couple of nightslater with several lacerations and puncture wounds, aswell as a slew of bruises from my encounter with theturkey.Some staff members were absolutely agog with my story.The triage nurse was apparently more concerned (asyou may imagine) with my blood pressure, whichregistered at 234/133.It turns out that my tetanus shots were

up to date andmy punctures were clean with no sign of infection(hard for me to tell; several were on my back).If nothing else, it gave me a good story.Warmly,Pam --- Pamela s <spirlhelix@...> wrote:> > Hi, All> > Well, I've been forgetting my medication from time> to> time. > > And I did have a bad weekend, dietetically speaking,> eating BBQ ribs my son cooked for his birthday> celebration (we had extra left--had to eat them,> right?).> > And I was on my period, which is the absolute worst> time for my blood pressure.> > And this was a visit to my cardiologist, who drives> me> nuts.> > So my blood pressure was 220/120.> > And this was the second visit in three months where> it> registered at stroke level.> > Over the last

several days, I have been taking my> 100> mg spironolactone more religiously (I thought I> could> get by without using my seven-day pillbox, but I> proved myself mistaken).> > I ate very little sodium. . . one night I just ate> rice and only rice, to try to get the blood pressure> to come down. I've been eating lots of vegetables> and> homecooked foods with no or little sodium. > > And my period is over.> > But my blood pressure is still pretty high> (187/116).> > Is there any chance the Spironolactone needs to be> increased? How long should I experiment with diet> before I ask my doctor about upping the> Spironolactone?> > I could also try going back on Lisinopril, which I> stopped taking to save money.> > Dr. Grim, what do I need to do next? I really want> to>

avoid experimenting with more hypertension> medications.> > Warmly,> > Pam > > > > > > "I'd rather learn from one bird how to sing, than to> teach ten thousand stars how not to dance."> > __________________________________________________>

[Guest guest]

When my bp was this high, I had to take a sublingual nitroglycerine and bring it down quickly. I take one every 10 to 15 minutes until it comes down and stay in bed without moving. At the ER, they once gave me at least 15 to bring it down. Hope your meds is going to work for you very soon.

FarahDave <dave@...> wrote:

Pam, this is too high! Is is always that high? What are you doing? Spiro or inspra? Dr Grim, I believe, mentioned upping the spiro, by amounts, and to do it w/your doc.DaveOn Apr 23, 2005, at 8:31 PM, Pamela s wrote:>> Hi, All!>> Thanks, everyone for sharing your ideas!>> I must have a highly aldosterone-driven blood pressure> at the moment, because taking the warm bath only> lowered my blood pressure by 4 points, systolic.>> Started at 197/118, ended up at 193/114.>> Worth a try, anyway.>> Based on that, I don't think the stress-relief> techniques are going to help me much at this> particular moment.>> My nephrologist has increased my spironolactone to 200> mg per day. Hope it kicks in

soon!>> Here's a funny story:>> I had to go to the ER the other night to have some> injuries checked for infection. The staff was rather> in an uproar when I told them I had been attacked by a> wild turkey.>> It was not easy to keep a straight face while telling> them this.>> Wild turkeys are making a comeback, folks. If you> love to walk nature trails like I do, and you happen> to see a male (Tom) come up to you and display his fan> of tailfeathers, take my advice and run, don't walk,> right down that trail away from that turkey.>> This was a big turkey. As a conservative estimate,> I'd put it at 40 lbs. There is no way that enormous> bird would go in any oven of mine.>> I was so awe-struck at this huge bird so close to me,> that when he came up to me I froze on the spot. Very> quickly,

I found out what those wings are for.> Turkeys can fly for short distances (at up to 55> mph!). They beat you with their wings (those wing> bones are at least the size of a man's wrist in> diameter, and quite hard in the uncooked state) and,> still flying, rise to gouge you with their spurs.>> When I saw the bird rise and lift his claws to strike> me, I instinctively (thanks to my former study of Jeet> Kune Do, and thank you Bruce Lee!) grabbed a hold of> that huge drumstick and threw the turkey.>> I let the turkey know what I thought. I wonder if> anyone else on the trail heard me yell, "No! Turkey!> Stop!">> I lost both my shoes in the scuffle (actually, I> stupidly threw them at the turkey and had to retrieve> them) so, still yelling, I held one shoe in each hand> and backed quite rapidly about a hundred yards down> the

trail as the turkey pursued me. I managed to get> a good knock on each wing with the shoes, but I'm sure> it just made him madder.>> So here I was in the emergency room a couple of nights> later with several lacerations and puncture wounds, as> well as a slew of bruises from my encounter with the> turkey.>> Some staff members were absolutely agog with my story.> The triage nurse was apparently more concerned (as> you may imagine) with my blood pressure, which> registered at 234/133.>> It turns out that my tetanus shots were up to date and> my punctures were clean with no sign of infection> (hard for me to tell; several were on my back).>> If nothing else, it gave me a good story.>> Warmly,>> Pam>>>>> --- Pamela s <spirlhelix@...> wrote:>>>> Hi,

All>>>> Well, I've been forgetting my medication from time>> to>> time.>>>> And I did have a bad weekend, dietetically speaking,>> eating BBQ ribs my son cooked for his birthday>> celebration (we had extra left--had to eat them,>> right?).>>>> And I was on my period, which is the absolute worst>> time for my blood pressure.>>>> And this was a visit to my cardiologist, who drives>> me>> nuts.>>>> So my blood pressure was 220/120.>>>> And this was the second visit in three months where>> it>> registered at stroke level.>>>> Over the last several days, I have been taking my>> 100>> mg spironolactone more religiously (I thought I>> could>> get by without using my seven-day pillbox, but I>> proved

myself mistaken).>>>> I ate very little sodium. . . one night I just ate>> rice and only rice, to try to get the blood pressure>> to come down. I've been eating lots of vegetables>> and>> homecooked foods with no or little sodium.>>>> And my period is over.>>>> But my blood pressure is still pretty high>> (187/116).>>>> Is there any chance the Spironolactone needs to be>> increased? How long should I experiment with diet>> before I ask my doctor about upping the>> Spironolactone?>>>> I could also try going back on Lisinopril, which I>> stopped taking to save money.>>>> Dr. Grim, what do I need to do next? I really want>> to>> avoid experimenting with more hypertension>> medications.>>>>

Warmly,>>>> Pam>

[Guest guest]

Oh my gosh, Pam! I read your story with great interest consider as just earlier this week I had a fanned out Tom wandering my back yard most of the day... I even took a picture of him (from indoors, luckily - http://pg.photos./ph/lmalotky/detail?.dir=/f2ee & .dnm=28e3.jpg & .src=ph). Anyway, my kids also like to play in the yard (my youngest is 4). I read your story to my husband and he wanted me to ask what you were wearing. He suggested the turkeys will attack something they think is another Tom (i.e. their reflection in a window), but that they tend to react to people wearing red, white, & blue (or sometimes just bright blue). He said he's talked to hunters who had experiences just by carrying a red, white and blue candy bar wrapper.

Well, I hope that Spiro kicks in for you quickly and that your BP goes down for you real soon.

Best wishes,

Re: Help! With Hypertension Strategies

Hi, All!Thanks, everyone for sharing your ideas!I must have a highly aldosterone-driven blood pressureat the moment, because taking the warm bath onlylowered my blood pressure by 4 points, systolic.Started at 197/118, ended up at 193/114.Worth a try, anyway. Based on that, I don't think the stress-relieftechniques are going to help me much at thisparticular moment.My nephrologist has increased my spironolactone to 200mg per day. Hope it kicks in soon!Here's a funny story:I had to go to the ER the other night to have someinjuries checked for infection. The staff was ratherin an uproar when I told them I had been attacked by awild turkey.It was not easy to keep a straight face while tellingthem this.Wild turkeys are making a comeback, folks. If youlove to walk nature trails like I do, and you happento see a male (Tom) come up to you and display his fanof tailfeathers, take my advice and run, don't walk,right down that trail away from that turkey.This was a big turkey. As a conservative estimate,I'd put it at 40 lbs. There is no way that enormousbird would go in any oven of mine.I was so awe-struck at this huge bird so close to me,that when he came up to me I froze on the spot. Veryquickly, I found out what those wings are for. Turkeys can fly for short distances (at up to 55mph!). They beat you with their wings (those wingbones are at least the size of a man's wrist indiameter, and quite hard in the uncooked state) and,still flying, rise to gouge you with their spurs. When I saw the bird rise and lift his claws to strikeme, I instinctively (thanks to my former study of JeetKune Do, and thank you Bruce Lee!) grabbed a hold ofthat huge drumstick and threw the turkey.I let the turkey know what I thought. I wonder ifanyone else on the trail heard me yell, "No! Turkey! Stop!"I lost both my shoes in the scuffle (actually, Istupidly threw them at the turkey and had to retrievethem) so, still yelling, I held one shoe in each handand backed quite rapidly about a hundred yards downthe trail as the turkey pursued me. I managed to geta good knock on each wing with the shoes, but I'm sureit just made him madder.So here I was in the emergency room a couple of nightslater with several lacerations and puncture wounds, aswell as a slew of bruises from my encounter with theturkey.Some staff members were absolutely agog with my story.The triage nurse was apparently more concerned (asyou may imagine) with my blood pressure, whichregistered at 234/133.It turns out that my tetanus shots were up to date andmy punctures were clean with no sign of infection(hard for me to tell; several were on my back).If nothing else, it gave me a good story.Warmly,Pam --- Pamela s <spirlhelix@...> wrote:> > Hi, All> > Well, I've been forgetting my medication from time> to> time. > > And I did have a bad weekend, dietetically speaking,> eating BBQ ribs my son cooked for his birthday> celebration (we had extra left--had to eat them,> right?).> > And I was on my period, which is the absolute worst> time for my blood pressure.> > And this was a visit to my cardiologist, who drives> me> nuts.> > So my blood pressure was 220/120.> > And this was the second visit in three months where> it> registered at stroke level.> > Over the last several days, I have been taking my> 100> mg spironolactone more religiously (I thought I> could> get by without using my seven-day pillbox, but I> proved myself mistaken).> > I ate very little sodium. . . one night I just ate> rice and only rice, to try to get the blood pressure> to come down. I've been eating lots of vegetables> and> homecooked foods with no or little sodium. > > And my period is over.> > But my blood pressure is still pretty high> (187/116).> > Is there any chance the Spironolactone needs to be> increased? How long should I experiment with diet> before I ask my doctor about upping the> Spironolactone?> > I could also try going back on Lisinopril, which I> stopped taking to save money.> > Dr. Grim, what do I need to do next? I really want> to> avoid experimenting with more hypertension> medications.> > Warmly,> > Pam > > > > > > "I'd rather learn from one bird how to sing, than to> teach ten thousand stars how not to dance."> > __________________________________________________>

[Guest guest]

Hi,

I was wearing a black long-sleeved T shirt (solid

color, nothing printed on it) and blue jeans.

I came to the part of the trail where the turkey was

just after a man had come jogging the other way. So I

may have gotten the brunt of the turkey's ire, raised

by the other person's initial intrusion in his space.

I reported the incident to the man in charge of the

city's parks, who told me that they had never had

another incident like it, etc.

He also speculated that this particular turkey may

have been imprinted by a human at some point, so was

triggered by my presence.

I spoke to a new-age type who told me that this

incident had been a shamanic initiation into turkey

medicine. Evidently the turkey symbolizes prosperity,

so if I start getting hit with large sums of money,

I'll take everyone out for a turkey dinner.

Warmly,

Pam

--- Malotky <leslie@...> wrote:

> Oh my gosh, Pam! I read your story with great

> interest consider as just earlier this week I had a

> fanned out Tom wandering my back yard most of the

> day... I even took a picture of him (from indoors,

> luckily -

>

http://pg.photos./ph/lmalotky/detail?.dir=/f2ee & .dnm=28e3.jpg & .src=ph).

> Anyway, my kids also like to play in the yard (my

> youngest is 4). I read your story to my husband and

> he wanted me to ask what you were wearing. He

> suggested the turkeys will attack something they

> think is another Tom (i.e. their reflection in a

> window), but that they tend to react to people

> wearing red, white, & blue (or sometimes just bright

> blue). He said he's talked to hunters who had

> experiences just by carrying a red, white and blue

> candy bar wrapper.

>

> Well, I hope that Spiro kicks in for you quickly and

> that your BP goes down for you real soon.

>

> Best wishes,

>

> Re: Help! With

> Hypertension Strategies

>

>

> Hi, All!

>

> Thanks, everyone for sharing your ideas!

>

> I must have a highly aldosterone-driven blood

> pressure

> at the moment, because taking the warm bath only

> lowered my blood pressure by 4 points, systolic.

>

> Started at 197/118, ended up at 193/114.

>

> Worth a try, anyway.

>

> Based on that, I don't think the stress-relief

> techniques are going to help me much at this

> particular moment.

>

> My nephrologist has increased my spironolactone to

> 200

> mg per day. Hope it kicks in soon!

>

> Here's a funny story:

>

> I had to go to the ER the other night to have some

> injuries checked for infection. The staff was

> rather

> in an uproar when I told them I had been attacked

> by a

> wild turkey.

>

> It was not easy to keep a straight face while

> telling

> them this.

>

> Wild turkeys are making a comeback, folks. If you

> love to walk nature trails like I do, and you

> happen

> to see a male (Tom) come up to you and display his

> fan

> of tailfeathers, take my advice and run, don't

> walk,

> right down that trail away from that turkey.

>

> This was a big turkey. As a conservative

> estimate,

> I'd put it at 40 lbs. There is no way that

> enormous

> bird would go in any oven of mine.

>

> I was so awe-struck at this huge bird so close to

> me,

> that when he came up to me I froze on the spot.

> Very

> quickly, I found out what those wings are for.

> Turkeys can fly for short distances (at up to 55

> mph!). They beat you with their wings (those wing

> bones are at least the size of a man's wrist in

> diameter, and quite hard in the uncooked state)

> and,

> still flying, rise to gouge you with their spurs.

>

>

> When I saw the bird rise and lift his claws to

> strike

> me, I instinctively (thanks to my former study of

> Jeet

> Kune Do, and thank you Bruce Lee!) grabbed a hold

> of

> that huge drumstick and threw the turkey.

>

> I let the turkey know what I thought. I wonder if

> anyone else on the trail heard me yell, " No!

> Turkey!

> Stop! "

>

> I lost both my shoes in the scuffle (actually, I

> stupidly threw them at the turkey and had to

> retrieve

> them) so, still yelling, I held one shoe in each

> hand

> and backed quite rapidly about a hundred yards

> down

> the trail as the turkey pursued me. I managed to

> get

> a good knock on each wing with the shoes, but I'm

> sure

> it just made him madder.

>

> So here I was in the emergency room a couple of

> nights

> later with several lacerations and puncture

> wounds, as

> well as a slew of bruises from my encounter with

> the

> turkey.

>

> Some staff members were absolutely agog with my

> story.

> The triage nurse was apparently more concerned (as

> you may imagine) with my blood pressure, which

> registered at 234/133.

>

> It turns out that my tetanus shots were up to date

> and

> my punctures were clean with no sign of infection

> (hard for me to tell; several were on my back).

>

> If nothing else, it gave me a good story.

>

> Warmly,

>

> Pam

>

>

>

>

> --- Pamela s <spirlhelix@...> wrote:

> >

> > Hi, All

> >

> > Well, I've been forgetting my medication from

> time

> > to

> > time.

> >

> > And I did have a bad weekend, dietetically

> speaking,

> > eating BBQ ribs my son cooked for his birthday

> > celebration (we had extra left--had to eat them,

> > right?).

> >

> > And I was on my period, which is the absolute

> worst

> > time for my blood pressure.

> >

> > And this was a visit to my cardiologist, who

> drives

> > me

> > nuts.

> >

> > So my blood pressure was 220/120.

> >

> > And this was the second visit in three months

> where

> > it

> > registered at stroke level.

> >

> > Over the last several days, I have been taking

> my

> > 100

> > mg spironolactone more religiously (I thought I

> > could

> > get by without using my seven-day pillbox, but I

> > proved myself mistaken).

> >

> > I ate very little sodium. . . one night I just

> ate

> > rice and only rice, to try to get the blood

> pressure

> > to come down. I've been eating lots of

> vegetables

> > and

> > homecooked foods with no or little sodium.

> >

> > And my period is over.

> >

> > But my blood pressure is still pretty high

> > (187/116).

> >

> > Is there any chance the Spironolactone needs to

> be

>

=== message truncated ===

" I'd rather learn from one bird how to sing, than to teach ten thousand stars

how not to dance. "

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

Hi, Dave

Um yeah, it is rather high. I have secondary

hypertension, remember? Grin.

It is not that high unless it is, and then it is.

It's been consistently high for a couple of weeks now.

At first I thought it was mistakes of diet or perhaps

missed doses of Spironolactone, but it has persisted

despite my efforts to correct it.

I have doubled the Spironolactone per my nephrologist

as of yesterday, but as we know it takes a little

while to see a difference in the BP.

Thanks for your concern!

Warmly,

Pam

--- Dave <dave@...> wrote:

>

> Pam, this is too high! Is is always that high?

> What are you doing?

> Spiro or inspra? Dr Grim, I believe, mentioned

> upping the spiro, by

> amounts, and to do it w/your doc.

>

> Dave

>

> On Apr 23, 2005, at 8:31 PM, Pamela s wrote:

>

> >

> > Hi, All!

> >

> > Thanks, everyone for sharing your ideas!

> >

> > I must have a highly aldosterone-driven blood

> pressure

> > at the moment, because taking the warm bath only

> > lowered my blood pressure by 4 points, systolic.

> >

> > Started at 197/118, ended up at 193/114.

> >

> > Worth a try, anyway.

> >

> > Based on that, I don't think the stress-relief

> > techniques are going to help me much at this

> > particular moment.

> >

> > My nephrologist has increased my spironolactone to

> 200

> > mg per day. Hope it kicks in soon!

> >

> > Here's a funny story:

> >

> > I had to go to the ER the other night to have some

> > injuries checked for infection. The staff was

> rather

> > in an uproar when I told them I had been attacked

> by a

> > wild turkey.

> >

> > It was not easy to keep a straight face while

> telling

> > them this.

> >

> > Wild turkeys are making a comeback, folks. If you

> > love to walk nature trails like I do, and you

> happen

> > to see a male (Tom) come up to you and display his

> fan

> > of tailfeathers, take my advice and run, don't

> walk,

> > right down that trail away from that turkey.

> >

> > This was a big turkey. As a conservative

> estimate,

> > I'd put it at 40 lbs. There is no way that

> enormous

> > bird would go in any oven of mine.

> >

> > I was so awe-struck at this huge bird so close to

> me,

> > that when he came up to me I froze on the spot.

> Very

> > quickly, I found out what those wings are for.

> > Turkeys can fly for short distances (at up to 55

> > mph!). They beat you with their wings (those wing

> > bones are at least the size of a man's wrist in

> > diameter, and quite hard in the uncooked state)

> and,

> > still flying, rise to gouge you with their spurs.

> >

> > When I saw the bird rise and lift his claws to

> strike

> > me, I instinctively (thanks to my former study of

> Jeet

> > Kune Do, and thank you Bruce Lee!) grabbed a hold

> of

> > that huge drumstick and threw the turkey.

> >

> > I let the turkey know what I thought. I wonder if

> > anyone else on the trail heard me yell, " No!

> Turkey!

> > Stop! "

> >

> > I lost both my shoes in the scuffle (actually, I

> > stupidly threw them at the turkey and had to

> retrieve

> > them) so, still yelling, I held one shoe in each

> hand

> > and backed quite rapidly about a hundred yards

> down

> > the trail as the turkey pursued me. I managed to

> get

> > a good knock on each wing with the shoes, but I'm

> sure

> > it just made him madder.

> >

> > So here I was in the emergency room a couple of

> nights

> > later with several lacerations and puncture

> wounds, as

> > well as a slew of bruises from my encounter with

> the

> > turkey.

> >

> > Some staff members were absolutely agog with my

> story.

> > The triage nurse was apparently more concerned

> (as

> > you may imagine) with my blood pressure, which

> > registered at 234/133.

> >

> > It turns out that my tetanus shots were up to date

> and

> > my punctures were clean with no sign of infection

> > (hard for me to tell; several were on my back).

> >

> > If nothing else, it gave me a good story.

> >

> > Warmly,

> >

> > Pam

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > --- Pamela s <spirlhelix@...> wrote:

> >>

> >> Hi, All

> >>

> >> Well, I've been forgetting my medication from

> time

> >> to

> >> time.

> >>

> >> And I did have a bad weekend, dietetically

> speaking,

> >> eating BBQ ribs my son cooked for his birthday

> >> celebration (we had extra left--had to eat them,

> >> right?).

> >>

> >> And I was on my period, which is the absolute

> worst

> >> time for my blood pressure.

> >>

> >> And this was a visit to my cardiologist, who

> drives

> >> me

> >> nuts.

> >>

> >> So my blood pressure was 220/120.

> >>

> >> And this was the second visit in three months

> where

> >> it

> >> registered at stroke level.

> >>

> >> Over the last several days, I have been taking my

> >> 100

> >> mg spironolactone more religiously (I thought I

> >> could

> >> get by without using my seven-day pillbox, but I

> >> proved myself mistaken).

> >>

> >> I ate very little sodium. . . one night I just

> ate

> >> rice and only rice, to try to get the blood

> pressure

> >> to come down. I've been eating lots of

> vegetables

> >> and

> >> homecooked foods with no or little sodium.

> >>

> >> And my period is over.

> >>

> >> But my blood pressure is still pretty high

> >> (187/116).

> >>

> >> Is there any chance the Spironolactone needs to

> be

> >> increased? How long should I experiment with

> diet

> >> before I ask my doctor about upping the

> >> Spironolactone?

> >>

> >> I could also try going back on Lisinopril, which

> I

> >> stopped taking to save money.

> >>

> >> Dr. Grim, what do I need to do next? I really

> want

> >> to

> >> avoid experimenting with more hypertension

> >> medications.

> >>

> >> Warmly,

> >>

> >> Pam

> >

>

=== message truncated ===

" I'd rather learn from one bird how to sing, than to teach ten thousand stars

how not to dance. "

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

Gee whillikers, if I may be allowed the Twainism. Maybe the catapres

patch for a little while? I know you've had reactions, but stroke is

worse. . .

Dave

On Apr 23, 2005, at 10:36 PM, Pamela s wrote:

>

> Hi, Dave

>

> Um yeah, it is rather high. I have secondary

> hypertension, remember? Grin.

>

> It is not that high unless it is, and then it is.

> It's been consistently high for a couple of weeks now.

> At first I thought it was mistakes of diet or perhaps

> missed doses of Spironolactone, but it has persisted

> despite my efforts to correct it.

>

> I have doubled the Spironolactone per my nephrologist

> as of yesterday, but as we know it takes a little

> while to see a difference in the BP.

>

> Thanks for your concern!

>

> Warmly,

>

> Pam

[Guest guest]

Land a mercy, Dave

Is that there Catapres patch anything like the cabbage

patch?

Actually, I have some clonidine on hand but I was told

it can cause a nasty rebound effect once you stop

taking it. And I don't intend to go on taking it

because it makes me comatose at the rate of about a

day per dose.

The beta blockers go to work fast, but leave me with

an obsession: " How can I kill myself? Let me count

the ways. . . " Even assuming I would not be

successful in carrying out one of my many creative

beta-blocker induced plans for departure, they make me

feel so dreadful, depressed and rotten (which is why I

want to kill myself when on them in the first place)

that it would affect my what-do-you-call-it--quality

of life. Betas have been reported to have rebound

effects, too.

If there is something that would not cause a rebound

and allow me to remain functional and still bring down

my blood pressure rapidly, I would consider it.

But I can't really say that I think a stroke would

leave me worse off than the other options I am aware

of at present. At least with a stroke I have a chance

of maintaining a productive attitude.

Of course, the big one might be waiting for me. But

I've always wanted to go out fast when I go.

Warmly,

Pam

--- Dave <dave@...> wrote:

>

> Gee whillikers, if I may be allowed the Twainism.

> Maybe the catapres

> patch for a little while? I know you've had

> reactions, but stroke is

> worse. . .

>

> Dave

>

> On Apr 23, 2005, at 10:36 PM, Pamela s wrote:

>

> >

> > Hi, Dave

> >

> > Um yeah, it is rather high. I have secondary

> > hypertension, remember? Grin.

> >

> > It is not that high unless it is, and then it is.

> > It's been consistently high for a couple of weeks

> now.

> > At first I thought it was mistakes of diet or

> perhaps

> > missed doses of Spironolactone, but it has

> persisted

> > despite my efforts to correct it.

> >

> > I have doubled the Spironolactone per my

> nephrologist

> > as of yesterday, but as we know it takes a little

> > while to see a difference in the BP.

> >

> > Thanks for your concern!

> >

> > Warmly,

> >

> > Pam

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Pam

mine took 2 weeks to come down and i think at that time i also was only eating 500 mlg of salt aday.

is he watching the K cuz mine went up to 5.5 and scared him half to death he took me off spero for a day and re run the test at the haspital it was only 4.5. lol

it will come down soon for you i hope thats what mine was in that area.

Take Care

Mark

P.S should go back and kill the turkey and eat him LOL

Where do u live LOL?

Re: Help! With Hypertension Strategies

Hi, DaveUm yeah, it is rather high. I have secondaryhypertension, remember? Grin.It is not that high unless it is, and then it is. It's been consistently high for a couple of weeks now.At first I thought it was mistakes of diet or perhapsmissed doses of Spironolactone, but it has persisteddespite my efforts to correct it.I have doubled the Spironolactone per my nephrologistas of yesterday, but as we know it takes a littlewhile to see a difference in the BP.Thanks for your concern!Warmly,Pam--- Dave <dave@...> wrote:> > Pam, this is too high! Is is always that high? > What are you doing? > Spiro or inspra? Dr Grim, I believe, mentioned> upping the spiro, by > amounts, and to do it w/your doc.> > Dave> > On Apr 23, 2005, at 8:31 PM, Pamela s wrote:> > >> > Hi, All!> >> > Thanks, everyone for sharing your ideas!> >> > I must have a highly aldosterone-driven blood> pressure> > at the moment, because taking the warm bath only> > lowered my blood pressure by 4 points, systolic.> >> > Started at 197/118, ended up at 193/114.> >> > Worth a try, anyway.> >> > Based on that, I don't think the stress-relief> > techniques are going to help me much at this> > particular moment.> >> > My nephrologist has increased my spironolactone to> 200> > mg per day. Hope it kicks in soon!> >> > Here's a funny story:> >> > I had to go to the ER the other night to have some> > injuries checked for infection. The staff was> rather> > in an uproar when I told them I had been attacked> by a> > wild turkey.> >> > It was not easy to keep a straight face while> telling> > them this.> >> > Wild turkeys are making a comeback, folks. If you> > love to walk nature trails like I do, and you> happen> > to see a male (Tom) come up to you and display his> fan> > of tailfeathers, take my advice and run, don't> walk,> > right down that trail away from that turkey.> >> > This was a big turkey. As a conservative> estimate,> > I'd put it at 40 lbs. There is no way that> enormous> > bird would go in any oven of mine.> >> > I was so awe-struck at this huge bird so close to> me,> > that when he came up to me I froze on the spot. > Very> > quickly, I found out what those wings are for.> > Turkeys can fly for short distances (at up to 55> > mph!). They beat you with their wings (those wing> > bones are at least the size of a man's wrist in> > diameter, and quite hard in the uncooked state)> and,> > still flying, rise to gouge you with their spurs.> >> > When I saw the bird rise and lift his claws to> strike> > me, I instinctively (thanks to my former study of> Jeet> > Kune Do, and thank you Bruce Lee!) grabbed a hold> of> > that huge drumstick and threw the turkey.> >> > I let the turkey know what I thought. I wonder if> > anyone else on the trail heard me yell, "No! > Turkey!> > Stop!"> >> > I lost both my shoes in the scuffle (actually, I> > stupidly threw them at the turkey and had to> retrieve> > them) so, still yelling, I held one shoe in each> hand> > and backed quite rapidly about a hundred yards> down> > the trail as the turkey pursued me. I managed to> get> > a good knock on each wing with the shoes, but I'm> sure> > it just made him madder.> >> > So here I was in the emergency room a couple of> nights> > later with several lacerations and puncture> wounds, as> > well as a slew of bruises from my encounter with> the> > turkey.> >> > Some staff members were absolutely agog with my> story.> > The triage nurse was apparently more concerned> (as> > you may imagine) with my blood pressure, which> > registered at 234/133.> >> > It turns out that my tetanus shots were up to date> and> > my punctures were clean with no sign of infection> > (hard for me to tell; several were on my back).> >> > If nothing else, it gave me a good story.> >> > Warmly,> >> > Pam> >> >> >> >> > --- Pamela s <spirlhelix@...> wrote:> >>> >> Hi, All> >>> >> Well, I've been forgetting my medication from> time> >> to> >> time.> >>> >> And I did have a bad weekend, dietetically> speaking,> >> eating BBQ ribs my son cooked for his birthday> >> celebration (we had extra left--had to eat them,> >> right?).> >>> >> And I was on my period, which is the absolute> worst> >> time for my blood pressure.> >>> >> And this was a visit to my cardiologist, who> drives> >> me> >> nuts.> >>> >> So my blood pressure was 220/120.> >>> >> And this was the second visit in three months> where> >> it> >> registered at stroke level.> >>> >> Over the last several days, I have been taking my> >> 100> >> mg spironolactone more religiously (I thought I> >> could> >> get by without using my seven-day pillbox, but I> >> proved myself mistaken).> >>> >> I ate very little sodium. . . one night I just> ate> >> rice and only rice, to try to get the blood> pressure> >> to come down. I've been eating lots of> vegetables> >> and> >> homecooked foods with no or little sodium.> >>> >> And my period is over.> >>> >> But my blood pressure is still pretty high> >> (187/116).> >>> >> Is there any chance the Spironolactone needs to> be> >> increased? How long should I experiment with> diet> >> before I ask my doctor about upping the> >> Spironolactone?> >>> >> I could also try going back on Lisinopril, which> I> >> stopped taking to save money.> >>> >> Dr. Grim, what do I need to do next? I really> want> >> to> >> avoid experimenting with more hypertension> >> medications.> >>> >> Warmly,> >>> >> Pam> >> === message truncated ==="I'd rather learn from one bird how to sing, than to teach ten thousand stars how not to dance."__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

Hi, Mike

Thanks for the reassurances! I just hope the

condition is still something that can be managed by

medication. I was doing real well for a year there.

One of my sons is real thrilled with the idea of

hunting down that turkey, too. But it was in a nature

preserve, and I think they frown on that sort of thing

there.

I live in Cincinnati, Ohio. The woods where I met the

turkey are right along the Ohio river.

http://www.cincinnatinature.org/

It's very beautiful and relaxing there. I found the

turkey (or he found me) on the Trillium Trail.

But I'm not going to stop going there just because of

one mean turkey. And if the new-ager who told me I

was about to be attacked by prosperity was correct,

the first thing I will do is buy myself the biggest

turkey that will fit in the oven just to celebrate.

Are you in Michigan, Mike?

I'll let you know so you can come down here for some

turkey when and if the money hits me!

Warmly,

Pam

--- THE HOUSE <thewhiningpplz@...> wrote:

> Hi Pam

> mine took 2 weeks to come down and i think at that

> time i also was only eating 500 mlg of salt aday.

> is he watching the K cuz mine went up to 5.5 and

> scared him half to death he took me off spero for a

> day and re run the test at the haspital it was only

> 4.5. lol

> it will come down soon for you i hope thats what

> mine was in that area.

> Take Care

> Mark

> P.S should go back and kill the turkey and eat him

> LOL

> Where do u live LOL?

> Re: Help! With

> Hypertension Strategies

>

>

> Hi, Dave

>

> Um yeah, it is rather high. I have secondary

> hypertension, remember? Grin.

>

> It is not that high unless it is, and then it is.

> It's been consistently high for a couple of weeks

> now.

> At first I thought it was mistakes of diet or

> perhaps

> missed doses of Spironolactone, but it has

> persisted

> despite my efforts to correct it.

>

> I have doubled the Spironolactone per my

> nephrologist

> as of yesterday, but as we know it takes a little

> while to see a difference in the BP.

>

> Thanks for your concern!

>

> Warmly,

>

> Pam

>

> --- Dave <dave@...> wrote:

>

> >

> > Pam, this is too high! Is is always that high?

> > What are you doing?

> > Spiro or inspra? Dr Grim, I believe, mentioned

> > upping the spiro, by

> > amounts, and to do it w/your doc.

> >

> > Dave

> >

> > On Apr 23, 2005, at 8:31 PM, Pamela s

> wrote:

> >

> > >

> > > Hi, All!

> > >

> > > Thanks, everyone for sharing your ideas!

> > >

> > > I must have a highly aldosterone-driven blood

> > pressure

> > > at the moment, because taking the warm bath

> only

> > > lowered my blood pressure by 4 points,

> systolic.

> > >

> > > Started at 197/118, ended up at 193/114.

> > >

> > > Worth a try, anyway.

> > >

> > > Based on that, I don't think the stress-relief

> > > techniques are going to help me much at this

> > > particular moment.

> > >

> > > My nephrologist has increased my

> spironolactone to

> > 200

> > > mg per day. Hope it kicks in soon!

> > >

> > > Here's a funny story:

> > >

> > > I had to go to the ER the other night to have

> some

> > > injuries checked for infection. The staff was

> > rather

> > > in an uproar when I told them I had been

> attacked

> > by a

> > > wild turkey.

> > >

> > > It was not easy to keep a straight face while

> > telling

> > > them this.

> > >

> > > Wild turkeys are making a comeback, folks. If

> you

> > > love to walk nature trails like I do, and you

> > happen

> > > to see a male (Tom) come up to you and display

> his

> > fan

> > > of tailfeathers, take my advice and run, don't

> > walk,

> > > right down that trail away from that turkey.

> > >

> > > This was a big turkey. As a conservative

> > estimate,

> > > I'd put it at 40 lbs. There is no way that

> > enormous

> > > bird would go in any oven of mine.

> > >

> > > I was so awe-struck at this huge bird so close

> to

> > me,

> > > that when he came up to me I froze on the

> spot.

> > Very

> > > quickly, I found out what those wings are for.

> > > Turkeys can fly for short distances (at up to

> 55

> > > mph!). They beat you with their wings (those

> wing

> > > bones are at least the size of a man's wrist

> in

> > > diameter, and quite hard in the uncooked

> state)

> > and,

> > > still flying, rise to gouge you with their

> spurs.

> > >

> > > When I saw the bird rise and lift his claws to

> > strike

> > > me, I instinctively (thanks to my former study

> of

> > Jeet

> > > Kune Do, and thank you Bruce Lee!) grabbed a

> hold

> > of

> > > that huge drumstick and threw the turkey.

> > >

> > > I let the turkey know what I thought. I

> wonder if

> > > anyone else on the trail heard me yell, " No!

> > Turkey!

> > > Stop! "

> > >

> > > I lost both my shoes in the scuffle (actually,

> I

> > > stupidly threw them at the turkey and had to

> > retrieve

> > > them) so, still yelling, I held one shoe in

> each

> > hand

> > > and backed quite rapidly about a hundred yards

> > down

> > > the trail as the turkey pursued me. I managed

> to

> > get

> > > a good knock on each wing with the shoes, but

> I'm

> > sure

> > > it just made him madder.

> > >

> > > So here I was in the emergency room a couple

> of

> > nights

> > > later with several lacerations and puncture

> > wounds, as

> > > well as a slew of bruises from my encounter

> with

> > the

> > > turkey.

> > >

> > > Some staff members were absolutely agog with

> my

> > story.

> > > The triage nurse was apparently more

> concerned

> > (as

> > > you may imagine) with my blood pressure, which

> > > registered at 234/133.

> > >

> > > It turns out that my tetanus shots were up to

> date

> > and

> > > my punctures were clean with no sign of

> infection

> > > (hard for me to tell; several were on my

> back).

> > >

> > > If nothing else, it gave me a good story.

> > >

> > > Warmly,

> > >

>

=== message truncated ===

" I'd rather learn from one bird how to sing, than to teach ten thousand stars

how not to dance. "

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

Maybe some grapefruit juice with nifedipine sublingual. . .

;^0

Dave

p.s. my most experienced docs say the rebound is around 20%, and not

that common--only a day or two if at all, with the patch used for one

week. Then, you get a catapres patch doll. I also react like a PA pt

to Bp meds and BB's, but have used the patch a couple times when BP was

too up there, no problems withdrawing.

I do empathize with the speed of departure idea. WE haven't been

raised on Bardo Thødol.

On Apr 24, 2005, at 7:37 AM, Pamela s wrote:

>

> Land a mercy, Dave

>

> Is that there Catapres patch anything like the cabbage

> patch?

>

> Actually, I have some clonidine on hand but I was told

> it can cause a nasty rebound effect once you stop

> taking it. And I don't intend to go on taking it

> because it makes me comatose at the rate of about a

> day per dose.

>

> The beta blockers go to work fast, but leave me with

> an obsession: " How can I kill myself? Let me count

> the ways. . . " Even assuming I would not be

> successful in carrying out one of my many creative

> beta-blocker induced plans for departure, they make me

> feel so dreadful, depressed and rotten (which is why I

> want to kill myself when on them in the first place)

> that it would affect my what-do-you-call-it--quality

> of life. Betas have been reported to have rebound

> effects, too.

>

> If there is something that would not cause a rebound

> and allow me to remain functional and still bring down

> my blood pressure rapidly, I would consider it.

>

> But I can't really say that I think a stroke would

> leave me worse off than the other options I am aware

> of at present. At least with a stroke I have a chance

> of maintaining a productive attitude.

>

> Of course, the big one might be waiting for me. But

> I've always wanted to go out fast when I go.

>

> Warmly,

>

> Pam

>

>

>

> --- Dave <dave@...> wrote:

>>

>> Gee whillikers, if I may be allowed the Twainism.

>> Maybe the catapres

>> patch for a little while? I know you've had

>> reactions, but stroke is

>> worse. . .

>>

>> Dave

>>

>> On Apr 23, 2005, at 10:36 PM, Pamela s wrote:

>>

>>>

>>> Hi, Dave

>>>

>>> Um yeah, it is rather high. I have secondary

>>> hypertension, remember? Grin.

>>>

>>> It is not that high unless it is, and then it is.

>>> It's been consistently high for a couple of weeks

>> now.

>>> At first I thought it was mistakes of diet or

>> perhaps

>>> missed doses of Spironolactone, but it has

>> persisted

>>> despite my efforts to correct it.

>>>

>>> I have doubled the Spironolactone per my

>> nephrologist

>>> as of yesterday, but as we know it takes a little

>>> while to see a difference in the BP.

>>>

>>> Thanks for your concern!

>>>

>>> Warmly,

>>>

>>> Pam

>>

>>

>>

>>

[Guest guest]

Hi, Dave

Sigh. Nifedepine does just about nothing for me.

I like grapefruit juice, though.

> I do empathize with the speed of departure idea.

> WE haven't been

> raised on Bardo Thødol.

I'm afraid the Bardo Thødol is a little too esoteric

for me. I'm on the rather coarse pragmatic level of

" I'd rather be hit by a bus and not even know it than

die a lingering death beset by sickness and pain. "

But either way my body goes, my spirit will simply

have to learn to cope.

Warmly,

Pam

" I'd rather learn from one bird how to sing, than to teach ten thousand stars

how not to dance. "

__________________________________________________