Guest guest Posted April 27, 2006 Report Share Posted April 27, 2006 Massey LK. Does excess dietary protein adversely affect bone? Symposium overview. J Nutr. 1998 Jun;128(6):1048-50. Review. No abstract available. PMID: 9614168 http://tinyurl.com/n4ube Lowe DT. Comment on recent symposium overview: does excess dietary protein adversely affect bone. J Nutr. 1998 Dec;128(12):2529. Review. No abstract available. PMID: 9868205 http://tinyurl.com/rrul9 -- Al Pater, PhD; email: old542000@... __________________________________________________ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 27, 2006 Report Share Posted April 27, 2006 Massey LK. Does excess dietary protein adversely affect bone? Symposium overview. J Nutr. 1998 Jun;128(6):1048-50. Review. No abstract available. PMID: 9614168 http://tinyurl.com/n4ube Lowe DT. Comment on recent symposium overview: does excess dietary protein adversely affect bone. J Nutr. 1998 Dec;128(12):2529. Review. No abstract available. PMID: 9868205 http://tinyurl.com/rrul9 -- Al Pater, PhD; email: old542000@... __________________________________________________ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 27, 2006 Report Share Posted April 27, 2006 " Does excess dietary protein adversely affect bone? " EXCESS of anything is bad or superfluous! That is the definition of " excess " . With regard to protein, bodybuilders are probably the most indulgent. They ingest in the range of at least 2 grams of protein per pound of weight. Do bodybuilders have weak bones? I don't think so. Otherwise, they would not be able to lift those 250 lb barbells without breaking something. The title was formulated as a teaser to grab attention. In reality, low protein intake *weakens* the bones. Here is a paragraph from the same article: " n Hannan and her colleagues of the Framingham Osteoporosis Study reported that men and women (ages 69-91 y) who consumed the lowest quartile of %protein intakes had increased rates of femoral bone loss compared with the three higher quartiles. Women with the highest %protein intake had no bone loss over the 3- to 4-y study period. Both of these studies reemphasized the need for adequate dietary protein for bone health. " The matrix of bone consists of collagen -- a protein. Tony > > > > Massey LK. > Does excess dietary protein adversely affect bone? Symposium overview. > J Nutr. 1998 Jun;128(6):1048-50. Review. No abstract available. > PMID: 9614168 http://tinyurl.com/n4ube > > Lowe DT. > Comment on recent symposium overview: does excess dietary protein adversely affect > bone. > J Nutr. 1998 Dec;128(12):2529. Review. No abstract available. > PMID: 9868205 http://tinyurl.com/rrul9 > > -- Al Pater, PhD; email: old542000@... > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 27, 2006 Report Share Posted April 27, 2006 " Does excess dietary protein adversely affect bone? " EXCESS of anything is bad or superfluous! That is the definition of " excess " . With regard to protein, bodybuilders are probably the most indulgent. They ingest in the range of at least 2 grams of protein per pound of weight. Do bodybuilders have weak bones? I don't think so. Otherwise, they would not be able to lift those 250 lb barbells without breaking something. The title was formulated as a teaser to grab attention. In reality, low protein intake *weakens* the bones. Here is a paragraph from the same article: " n Hannan and her colleagues of the Framingham Osteoporosis Study reported that men and women (ages 69-91 y) who consumed the lowest quartile of %protein intakes had increased rates of femoral bone loss compared with the three higher quartiles. Women with the highest %protein intake had no bone loss over the 3- to 4-y study period. Both of these studies reemphasized the need for adequate dietary protein for bone health. " The matrix of bone consists of collagen -- a protein. Tony > > > > Massey LK. > Does excess dietary protein adversely affect bone? Symposium overview. > J Nutr. 1998 Jun;128(6):1048-50. Review. No abstract available. > PMID: 9614168 http://tinyurl.com/n4ube > > Lowe DT. > Comment on recent symposium overview: does excess dietary protein adversely affect > bone. > J Nutr. 1998 Dec;128(12):2529. Review. No abstract available. > PMID: 9868205 http://tinyurl.com/rrul9 > > -- Al Pater, PhD; email: old542000@... > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 28, 2006 Report Share Posted April 28, 2006 At 03:07 PM 4/27/2006, you wrote: > " Does excess dietary protein adversely affect bone? " > >EXCESS of anything is bad or superfluous! That is the >definition of " excess " . With regard to protein, bodybuilders are >probably the most indulgent. They ingest in the range of at least 2 >grams of protein per pound of weight. Do bodybuilders have weak >bones? I don't think so. Otherwise, they would not be able to lift >those 250 lb barbells without breaking something. > >The title was formulated as a teaser to grab attention. In reality, >low protein intake *weakens* the bones. Here is a paragraph from the >same article: Competitive bodybuilders don't have weak bones before age 40. Osteoporosis is a condition that takes decades to develop, so a high protein diet may have negative effects that don't manifest until long after bodybuilders have hung up the weights. That said, weight training is believed to be very good for your bones... But the question isn't " are moderate amounts of weight training good for your health? " but more like " are the extreme lifestyle of bodybuilders healthy? " You can certainly get pretty buff as a " natural " bodybuilder who avoids steroids (but eat a lot of protein and things like creatine, probably eat 4000 calories a day on the " on " cycle, then 1200 a day and no-carbs well " cutting up " ) but you're not going to win competitions against builders who take steroids. In the 90's the size of these people exploded: it's been discovered that builders who use steroids can benefit from 10,000 calorie a day diets. Steroids themselves deplete HDL cholesterol (to the point where abnormally low HDL levels in a 20-something athelete is a cause of suspicion) It turns out the steroids which are best at bulking up muscle have estrogen activity in addition to androgenic activity, so builders often take estrogen-blocking drugs such as Tamoxifen. They'll take clenbuterol (a failed asthma drug that can screw up your heart) and shoot insulin... In recent years, T3 thyroid hormone has been a popular way to " cut up " (reduce bodyfat) in the weeks before competition. Word on the street is that Arnold Schwarzenegger was an early adopter of HGH for his 1980 comeback (photos of him around that time show a gap between his front teeth that's characteristic of the bone growth induced by HGH.) In the last few years we've seen a lot of NFL players and pro wrestlers fall over with heart problems in their 30's and 40's. Is it the drugs? The diet? Or the fact that these people carry too much mass? My dad played college ball in the 1960's and was lucky enough to play against Joe Naimath. At 6' 2'', and 220 pounds, he was typical for a defensive player of his day. He died at age 50 in a boat accident: the doctors said he was in excellent health for somebody his age. When my dad was playing ball, a football scholarship was good for four years -- he was sidelined by appendicitis in his sophmore year, but finished his degree. In the 1970's college ball got a lot more professional: they'd cancel your scholarship if you didn't perform on the field. Weight training and steroids became part of the regimen. Around '93 I went to a party (unknowingly) where much of a Division One football team showed up: these guys were beyond huge in everything. My dad looked like a pipsqueak in comparison. Bodybuilding is a technology of the body which can attain incredible results. I think a bit of weight training can benefit anybody. Yet, we're just at the point where we'll start seeing the effects of the drugs and steroids... Schwarzenegger, for instance, won the Mr. Olympia first in 1970, when he was 20 years old. Steroids were just becoming widespread then. Certainly some people in weightlifting are interested in prolonging function into late life, but extreme diets and drugs are for people who want to get results in the short term. Bodybuilders explore the outer limits of human metabolism, but they're not a model for people concerned with health and longevity to follow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 28, 2006 Report Share Posted April 28, 2006 At 03:07 PM 4/27/2006, you wrote: > " Does excess dietary protein adversely affect bone? " > >EXCESS of anything is bad or superfluous! That is the >definition of " excess " . With regard to protein, bodybuilders are >probably the most indulgent. They ingest in the range of at least 2 >grams of protein per pound of weight. Do bodybuilders have weak >bones? I don't think so. Otherwise, they would not be able to lift >those 250 lb barbells without breaking something. > >The title was formulated as a teaser to grab attention. In reality, >low protein intake *weakens* the bones. Here is a paragraph from the >same article: Competitive bodybuilders don't have weak bones before age 40. Osteoporosis is a condition that takes decades to develop, so a high protein diet may have negative effects that don't manifest until long after bodybuilders have hung up the weights. That said, weight training is believed to be very good for your bones... But the question isn't " are moderate amounts of weight training good for your health? " but more like " are the extreme lifestyle of bodybuilders healthy? " You can certainly get pretty buff as a " natural " bodybuilder who avoids steroids (but eat a lot of protein and things like creatine, probably eat 4000 calories a day on the " on " cycle, then 1200 a day and no-carbs well " cutting up " ) but you're not going to win competitions against builders who take steroids. In the 90's the size of these people exploded: it's been discovered that builders who use steroids can benefit from 10,000 calorie a day diets. Steroids themselves deplete HDL cholesterol (to the point where abnormally low HDL levels in a 20-something athelete is a cause of suspicion) It turns out the steroids which are best at bulking up muscle have estrogen activity in addition to androgenic activity, so builders often take estrogen-blocking drugs such as Tamoxifen. They'll take clenbuterol (a failed asthma drug that can screw up your heart) and shoot insulin... In recent years, T3 thyroid hormone has been a popular way to " cut up " (reduce bodyfat) in the weeks before competition. Word on the street is that Arnold Schwarzenegger was an early adopter of HGH for his 1980 comeback (photos of him around that time show a gap between his front teeth that's characteristic of the bone growth induced by HGH.) In the last few years we've seen a lot of NFL players and pro wrestlers fall over with heart problems in their 30's and 40's. Is it the drugs? The diet? Or the fact that these people carry too much mass? My dad played college ball in the 1960's and was lucky enough to play against Joe Naimath. At 6' 2'', and 220 pounds, he was typical for a defensive player of his day. He died at age 50 in a boat accident: the doctors said he was in excellent health for somebody his age. When my dad was playing ball, a football scholarship was good for four years -- he was sidelined by appendicitis in his sophmore year, but finished his degree. In the 1970's college ball got a lot more professional: they'd cancel your scholarship if you didn't perform on the field. Weight training and steroids became part of the regimen. Around '93 I went to a party (unknowingly) where much of a Division One football team showed up: these guys were beyond huge in everything. My dad looked like a pipsqueak in comparison. Bodybuilding is a technology of the body which can attain incredible results. I think a bit of weight training can benefit anybody. Yet, we're just at the point where we'll start seeing the effects of the drugs and steroids... Schwarzenegger, for instance, won the Mr. Olympia first in 1970, when he was 20 years old. Steroids were just becoming widespread then. Certainly some people in weightlifting are interested in prolonging function into late life, but extreme diets and drugs are for people who want to get results in the short term. Bodybuilders explore the outer limits of human metabolism, but they're not a model for people concerned with health and longevity to follow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 28, 2006 Report Share Posted April 28, 2006 Hi folks: It might be a good idea to have a discussion here about the types of protein one might consider taking if one felt some supplemental protein might be desirable for longevity. CASEIN seems to be a very big no-no. Which rules out milk and milk products, but not whey. In addition to whey, gelatin, soy protein and egg white are possibly good candidates - the latter two of which I consume occasionally, not because I know of serious evidence of benefit, but 'just because' (as would say!) it seemed to be a good idea at the time. Any thoughts would be appreciated by me. Thanks in advance. Rodney. > > " Does excess dietary protein adversely affect bone? " > > > >EXCESS of anything is bad or superfluous! That is the > >definition of " excess " . With regard to protein, bodybuilders are > >probably the most indulgent. They ingest in the range of at least 2 > >grams of protein per pound of weight. Do bodybuilders have weak > >bones? I don't think so. Otherwise, they would not be able to lift > >those 250 lb barbells without breaking something. > > > >The title was formulated as a teaser to grab attention. In reality, > >low protein intake *weakens* the bones. Here is a paragraph from the > >same article: > > Competitive bodybuilders don't have weak bones before age > 40. Osteoporosis is a condition that takes decades to develop, so a high > protein diet may have negative effects that don't manifest until long after > bodybuilders have hung up the weights. That said, weight training is > believed to be very good for your bones... But the question isn't " are > moderate amounts of weight training good for your health? " but more like > " are the extreme lifestyle of bodybuilders healthy? " > > You can certainly get pretty buff as a " natural " bodybuilder who > avoids steroids (but eat a lot of protein and things like > creatine, probably eat 4000 calories a day on the " on " cycle, then 1200 a > day and no-carbs well " cutting up " ) but you're not going to win > competitions against builders who take steroids. In the 90's the size of > these people exploded: it's been discovered that builders who use steroids > can benefit from 10,000 calorie a day diets. Steroids themselves deplete > HDL cholesterol (to the point where abnormally low HDL levels in a > 20-something athelete is a cause of suspicion) It turns out the steroids > which are best at bulking up muscle have estrogen activity in addition to > androgenic activity, so builders often take estrogen-blocking drugs such > as Tamoxifen. They'll take clenbuterol (a failed asthma drug that can > screw up your heart) and shoot insulin... In recent years, T3 thyroid > hormone has been a popular way to " cut up " (reduce bodyfat) in the weeks > before competition. Word on the street is that Arnold Schwarzenegger was > an early adopter of HGH for his 1980 comeback (photos of him around that > time show a gap between his front teeth that's characteristic of the bone > growth induced by HGH.) > > In the last few years we've seen a lot of NFL players and pro > wrestlers fall over with heart problems in their 30's and 40's. Is it the > drugs? The diet? Or the fact that these people carry too much mass? > > My dad played college ball in the 1960's and was lucky enough to > play against Joe Naimath. At 6' 2'', and 220 pounds, he was typical for a > defensive player of his day. He died at age 50 in a boat accident: the > doctors said he was in excellent health for somebody his age. When my dad > was playing ball, a football scholarship was good for four years -- he was > sidelined by appendicitis in his sophmore year, but finished his > degree. In the 1970's college ball got a lot more professional: they'd > cancel your scholarship if you didn't perform on the field. Weight > training and steroids became part of the regimen. Around '93 I went to a > party (unknowingly) where much of a Division One football team showed > up: these guys were beyond huge in everything. My dad looked like a > pipsqueak in comparison. > > Bodybuilding is a technology of the body which can attain > incredible results. I think a bit of weight training can benefit > anybody. Yet, we're just at the point where we'll start seeing the > effects of the drugs and steroids... Schwarzenegger, for instance, won > the Mr. Olympia first in 1970, when he was 20 years old. Steroids were > just becoming widespread then. Certainly some people in weightlifting are > interested in prolonging function into late life, but extreme diets and > drugs are for people who want to get results in the short > term. Bodybuilders explore the outer limits of human metabolism, but > they're not a model for people concerned with health and longevity to follow. > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 28, 2006 Report Share Posted April 28, 2006 Hi folks: It might be a good idea to have a discussion here about the types of protein one might consider taking if one felt some supplemental protein might be desirable for longevity. CASEIN seems to be a very big no-no. Which rules out milk and milk products, but not whey. In addition to whey, gelatin, soy protein and egg white are possibly good candidates - the latter two of which I consume occasionally, not because I know of serious evidence of benefit, but 'just because' (as would say!) it seemed to be a good idea at the time. Any thoughts would be appreciated by me. Thanks in advance. Rodney. > > " Does excess dietary protein adversely affect bone? " > > > >EXCESS of anything is bad or superfluous! That is the > >definition of " excess " . With regard to protein, bodybuilders are > >probably the most indulgent. They ingest in the range of at least 2 > >grams of protein per pound of weight. Do bodybuilders have weak > >bones? I don't think so. Otherwise, they would not be able to lift > >those 250 lb barbells without breaking something. > > > >The title was formulated as a teaser to grab attention. In reality, > >low protein intake *weakens* the bones. Here is a paragraph from the > >same article: > > Competitive bodybuilders don't have weak bones before age > 40. Osteoporosis is a condition that takes decades to develop, so a high > protein diet may have negative effects that don't manifest until long after > bodybuilders have hung up the weights. That said, weight training is > believed to be very good for your bones... But the question isn't " are > moderate amounts of weight training good for your health? " but more like > " are the extreme lifestyle of bodybuilders healthy? " > > You can certainly get pretty buff as a " natural " bodybuilder who > avoids steroids (but eat a lot of protein and things like > creatine, probably eat 4000 calories a day on the " on " cycle, then 1200 a > day and no-carbs well " cutting up " ) but you're not going to win > competitions against builders who take steroids. In the 90's the size of > these people exploded: it's been discovered that builders who use steroids > can benefit from 10,000 calorie a day diets. Steroids themselves deplete > HDL cholesterol (to the point where abnormally low HDL levels in a > 20-something athelete is a cause of suspicion) It turns out the steroids > which are best at bulking up muscle have estrogen activity in addition to > androgenic activity, so builders often take estrogen-blocking drugs such > as Tamoxifen. They'll take clenbuterol (a failed asthma drug that can > screw up your heart) and shoot insulin... In recent years, T3 thyroid > hormone has been a popular way to " cut up " (reduce bodyfat) in the weeks > before competition. Word on the street is that Arnold Schwarzenegger was > an early adopter of HGH for his 1980 comeback (photos of him around that > time show a gap between his front teeth that's characteristic of the bone > growth induced by HGH.) > > In the last few years we've seen a lot of NFL players and pro > wrestlers fall over with heart problems in their 30's and 40's. Is it the > drugs? The diet? Or the fact that these people carry too much mass? > > My dad played college ball in the 1960's and was lucky enough to > play against Joe Naimath. At 6' 2'', and 220 pounds, he was typical for a > defensive player of his day. He died at age 50 in a boat accident: the > doctors said he was in excellent health for somebody his age. When my dad > was playing ball, a football scholarship was good for four years -- he was > sidelined by appendicitis in his sophmore year, but finished his > degree. In the 1970's college ball got a lot more professional: they'd > cancel your scholarship if you didn't perform on the field. Weight > training and steroids became part of the regimen. Around '93 I went to a > party (unknowingly) where much of a Division One football team showed > up: these guys were beyond huge in everything. My dad looked like a > pipsqueak in comparison. > > Bodybuilding is a technology of the body which can attain > incredible results. I think a bit of weight training can benefit > anybody. Yet, we're just at the point where we'll start seeing the > effects of the drugs and steroids... Schwarzenegger, for instance, won > the Mr. Olympia first in 1970, when he was 20 years old. Steroids were > just becoming widespread then. Certainly some people in weightlifting are > interested in prolonging function into late life, but extreme diets and > drugs are for people who want to get results in the short > term. Bodybuilders explore the outer limits of human metabolism, but > they're not a model for people concerned with health and longevity to follow. > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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