Guest guest Posted January 28, 2006 Report Share Posted January 28, 2006 >> Almost no study of diet, including giving high sodium diet to raise blood pressure, high potassium to lower bp, or high calcium diet to lower bp, finds a change of more than 4-6 mm Hg in systolic blood pressure. Actually we have published it on several occasions as have others.. (absracts below) McDougall reported average BP reductions of 17/13 mm Hg for hypertensive patients in a 12-day inpatient program with a vegan-vegetarian diet and MacGregor found an average BP reductions of 16/9 mm Hg for hypertensive patients on a very low-sodium diet The Pritikin Center showed average reductions in systolic (19 mm Hg) and diastolic (8 mm Hg) BP in 3 weeks. Goldhammer showed an overall mean drop of 37.1/13.3 mm Hg during a water only fasting program followed by a low fat, low sodium vegan diet. The rice diet at duke has shown reductions on average of 17/8 and more J Am Coll Nutr. <javascript:AL_get(this, 'jour', 'J Am Coll Nutr.');> 1995 Oct;14(5):491-6. Related Articles, <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Display & dopt=pubmed\ _pubmed & from_uid=8522729> Links <javascript:PopUpMenu2_Set(Menu8522729);> Rapid reduction of serum cholesterol and blood pressure by a twelve-day, very low fat, strictly vegetarian diet. McDougall J <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Search & itool=pubmed\ _Abstract & term=%22McDougall+J%22%5BAuthor%5D> , Litzau K <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Search & itool=pubmed\ _Abstract & term=%22Litzau+K%22%5BAuthor%5D> , Haver E <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Search & itool=pubmed\ _Abstract & term=%22Haver+E%22%5BAuthor%5D> , Saunders V <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Search & itool=pubmed\ _Abstract & term=%22Saunders+V%22%5BAuthor%5D> , Spiller GA <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Search & itool=pubmed\ _Abstract & term=%22Spiller+GA%22%5BAuthor%5D> . St. Helena Hospital, Deer Park, California 94576, USA. OBJECTIVE: This study was conducted to demonstrate the effectiveness of a strictly vegetarian, very low-fat diet on cardiac risk factor modification. METHODS: Five hundred men and women, participants in an intensive 12-day live-in program, were studied. The program focused on dietary modification, moderate exercise, and stress management at a hospital-based health-center. RESULTS: During this short time period, cardiac risk factors improved: there was an average reduction of total serum cholesterol of 11% (p < 0.001), of blood pressure of 6% (p < 0.001) and a weight loss of 2.5 kg for men and 1 kg for women. Serum triglycerides did not increase except for two subgroups: females age > or = 65 years with serum cholesterol < 6.5 mmol/L and for females 50 to 64 years with baseline serum cholesterol between 5.2-6.5 mmol/L. High-density lipoprotein cholesterol measured on 66 subjects decreased by 19%. CONCLUSION: A strict, very low-fat vegetarian diet free from all animal products combined with lifestyle changes that include exercise and weight loss is an effective way to lower serum cholesterol and blood pressure. Lancet. <javascript:AL_get(this, 'jour', 'Lancet.');> 1989 Nov 25;2(8674):1244-7. Related Articles, <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Display & dopt=pubmed\ _pubmed & from_uid=2573761> Links <javascript:PopUpMenu2_Set(Menu2573761);> Double-blind study of three sodium intakes and long-term effects of sodium restriction in essential hypertension. MacGregor GA <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Search & itool=pubmed\ _Abstract & term=%22MacGregor+GA%22%5BAuthor%5D> , Markandu ND <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Search & itool=pubmed\ _Abstract & term=%22Markandu+ND%22%5BAuthor%5D> , Sagnella GA <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Search & itool=pubmed\ _Abstract & term=%22Sagnella+GA%22%5BAuthor%5D> , Singer DR <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Search & itool=pubmed\ _Abstract & term=%22Singer+DR%22%5BAuthor%5D> , Cappuccio FP <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Search & itool=pubmed\ _Abstract & term=%22Cappuccio+FP%22%5BAuthor%5D> . Department of Medicine, St 's Hospital Medical School, London. 20 patients with mild hypertension (average supine blood pressure without treatment, 164/101 mm Hg) reduced their salt intake to 50 mmol (3 g) per day for a month. They then entered a 3 month double-blind randomised crossover study of three levels of sodium intake: 200, 100, and 50 mmol per day. Blood pressure was significantly reduced on the middle and lowest sodium intakes. The average fall in blood pressure from the highest to the lowest sodium intake was 16/9 mm Hg. Patients continued to restrict their sodium intake for a further year. In 16 of the 20 patients blood pressure remained well controlled with salt restriction alone. Supine blood pressure at 1 year was 142/87 (SE 3/2) mm Hg with a 24 h urinary sodium excretion of 54 (7) mmol. These results show a progressive blood pressure fall as salt intake is reduced and that, in many patients with mild essential hypertension, blood pressure can be controlled without the need for drug therapy. Effect of Diet and Exercise Intervention on Blood Pressure, Insulin, Oxidative Stress, and Nitric Oxide Availability Christian K. , PhD; Nosratola D. Vaziri, MD; R. Barnard, PhD From the Department of Physiological Science, University of California, Los Angeles (C.K.R., R.J.B.), and the Division of Nephrology and Hypertension, Department of Medicine, University of California, Irvine (C.K.R., N.D.V.). Correspondence to R. Barnard, Department of Physiological Science, UCLA, P.O. 951527, Los Angeles, CA 90095-1527. E-mail jbarnard@... Background- Diet and exercise can affect blood pressure and atherosclerotic risk. Methods and Results- The present study was designed to examine the effects of a short-term, rigorous diet and exercise intervention on blood pressure, hyperinsulinemia, and nitric oxide (NO) availability. Men (n=11) were placed on a low-fat, high-fiber diet combined with daily exercise for 45 to 60 minutes for 3 weeks. Pre- and post fasting blood was drawn for serum lipid, insulin, 8-isoprostaglandin F2 (8-iso-PGF2), and glucose measurements. Anthropometric parameters, blood pressure (BP), and 24-hour urinary NO metabolite excretion (NOX), a marker of NO bioavailability, were measured. Systolic (P<0.01) and diastolic BP (P<0.01) and 8-iso-PGF2 decreased (P<0.05), whereas urinary NOX increased (P<0.05). There was a significant reduction in fasting insulin (P<0.01) and a significant correlation between the decrease in serum insulin and the increase in urinary NOX (r2=0.68, P<0.05). All fasting lipids decreased significantly, and the total cholesterol to high-density lipoprotein cholesterol ratio improved. Although body weight and body mass index (P<0.01) decreased, obesity was still present and there were no correlations between the change in body mass index and the change in insulin, BP, or urinary NOX. Conclusions- This intervention resulted in dramatic improvements in BP, oxidative stress, NO availability, and the metabolic profile within 3 weeks, mitigating the risk for atherosclerosis progression and its clinical sequelae. Medically Supervised Water-only Fasting in the Treatment of Hypertension Alan Goldhamer, DC,a Lisle, PhD,b Banoo Parpia, PhD,c V. , MD,dand T. Colin , PhDe ABSTRACT Background: Hypertension-related diseases are the leading cause of morbidity and mortality in industrially developed societies. Although antihypertensive drugs are extensively used, dietary and lifestyle modifications also are effective in the treatment of patients with hypertension. One such lifestyle intervention is the use of medically supervised, water-only fasting as a safe and effective means of normalizing blood pressure and initiating health-promoting behavioral changes. Methods: One hundred seventy-four consecutive hypertensive patients with blood pressure in excess of 140 mm Hg systolic, 90 mm Hg diastolic (140/90 mm Hg), or both were treated in an inpatient setting under medical supervision. The treatment program consisted of a short prefasting period (approximately 2 to 3 days on average) during which food consumption was limited to fruits and vegetables, followed by medically supervised water-only fasting (approximately 10 to 11 days on average) and a refeeding period (approximately 6 to 7 days on average) introducing a low-fat, low-sodium, vegan diet. Results: Almost 90% of the subjects achieved blood pressure less than 140/90 mm Hg by the end of the treatment program. The average reduction in blood pressure was 37/13 mm Hg, with the greatest decrease being observed for subjects with the most severe hypertension. Patients with stage 3 hypertension (those with systolic blood pressure greater than 180 mg Hg, diastolic blood pressure greater than 110 mg Hg, or both) had an average reduction of 60/17 mm Hg at the conclusion of treatment. All of the subjects who were taking antihypertensive medication at entry (6.3% of the total sample) successfully discontinued the use of medication. Conclusion: Medically supervised water-only fasting appears to be a safe and effective means of normalizing blood pressure and may assist in motivating health-promoting diet and lifestyle changes. (J Manipulative Physiol Ther 2001;24:335-9) Arch Intern Med. <javascript:AL_get(this, 'jour', 'Arch Intern Med.');> 1974 May;133(5):758-90. Related Articles, <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Display & dopt=pubmed\ _pubmed & from_uid=4595399> Links <javascript:PopUpMenu2_Set(Menu4595399);> Treatment of hypertensive vascular disease with rice diet. Kempner W <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Search & itool=pubmed\ _Abstract & term=%22Kempner+W%22%5BAuthor%5D> . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 28, 2006 Report Share Posted January 28, 2006 >> Almost no study of diet, including giving high sodium diet to raise blood pressure, high potassium to lower bp, or high calcium diet to lower bp, finds a change of more than 4-6 mm Hg in systolic blood pressure. Actually we have published it on several occasions as have others.. (absracts below) McDougall reported average BP reductions of 17/13 mm Hg for hypertensive patients in a 12-day inpatient program with a vegan-vegetarian diet and MacGregor found an average BP reductions of 16/9 mm Hg for hypertensive patients on a very low-sodium diet The Pritikin Center showed average reductions in systolic (19 mm Hg) and diastolic (8 mm Hg) BP in 3 weeks. Goldhammer showed an overall mean drop of 37.1/13.3 mm Hg during a water only fasting program followed by a low fat, low sodium vegan diet. The rice diet at duke has shown reductions on average of 17/8 and more J Am Coll Nutr. <javascript:AL_get(this, 'jour', 'J Am Coll Nutr.');> 1995 Oct;14(5):491-6. Related Articles, <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Display & dopt=pubmed\ _pubmed & from_uid=8522729> Links <javascript:PopUpMenu2_Set(Menu8522729);> Rapid reduction of serum cholesterol and blood pressure by a twelve-day, very low fat, strictly vegetarian diet. McDougall J <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Search & itool=pubmed\ _Abstract & term=%22McDougall+J%22%5BAuthor%5D> , Litzau K <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Search & itool=pubmed\ _Abstract & term=%22Litzau+K%22%5BAuthor%5D> , Haver E <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Search & itool=pubmed\ _Abstract & term=%22Haver+E%22%5BAuthor%5D> , Saunders V <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Search & itool=pubmed\ _Abstract & term=%22Saunders+V%22%5BAuthor%5D> , Spiller GA <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Search & itool=pubmed\ _Abstract & term=%22Spiller+GA%22%5BAuthor%5D> . St. Helena Hospital, Deer Park, California 94576, USA. OBJECTIVE: This study was conducted to demonstrate the effectiveness of a strictly vegetarian, very low-fat diet on cardiac risk factor modification. METHODS: Five hundred men and women, participants in an intensive 12-day live-in program, were studied. The program focused on dietary modification, moderate exercise, and stress management at a hospital-based health-center. RESULTS: During this short time period, cardiac risk factors improved: there was an average reduction of total serum cholesterol of 11% (p < 0.001), of blood pressure of 6% (p < 0.001) and a weight loss of 2.5 kg for men and 1 kg for women. Serum triglycerides did not increase except for two subgroups: females age > or = 65 years with serum cholesterol < 6.5 mmol/L and for females 50 to 64 years with baseline serum cholesterol between 5.2-6.5 mmol/L. High-density lipoprotein cholesterol measured on 66 subjects decreased by 19%. CONCLUSION: A strict, very low-fat vegetarian diet free from all animal products combined with lifestyle changes that include exercise and weight loss is an effective way to lower serum cholesterol and blood pressure. Lancet. <javascript:AL_get(this, 'jour', 'Lancet.');> 1989 Nov 25;2(8674):1244-7. Related Articles, <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Display & dopt=pubmed\ _pubmed & from_uid=2573761> Links <javascript:PopUpMenu2_Set(Menu2573761);> Double-blind study of three sodium intakes and long-term effects of sodium restriction in essential hypertension. MacGregor GA <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Search & itool=pubmed\ _Abstract & term=%22MacGregor+GA%22%5BAuthor%5D> , Markandu ND <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Search & itool=pubmed\ _Abstract & term=%22Markandu+ND%22%5BAuthor%5D> , Sagnella GA <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Search & itool=pubmed\ _Abstract & term=%22Sagnella+GA%22%5BAuthor%5D> , Singer DR <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Search & itool=pubmed\ _Abstract & term=%22Singer+DR%22%5BAuthor%5D> , Cappuccio FP <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Search & itool=pubmed\ _Abstract & term=%22Cappuccio+FP%22%5BAuthor%5D> . Department of Medicine, St 's Hospital Medical School, London. 20 patients with mild hypertension (average supine blood pressure without treatment, 164/101 mm Hg) reduced their salt intake to 50 mmol (3 g) per day for a month. They then entered a 3 month double-blind randomised crossover study of three levels of sodium intake: 200, 100, and 50 mmol per day. Blood pressure was significantly reduced on the middle and lowest sodium intakes. The average fall in blood pressure from the highest to the lowest sodium intake was 16/9 mm Hg. Patients continued to restrict their sodium intake for a further year. In 16 of the 20 patients blood pressure remained well controlled with salt restriction alone. Supine blood pressure at 1 year was 142/87 (SE 3/2) mm Hg with a 24 h urinary sodium excretion of 54 (7) mmol. These results show a progressive blood pressure fall as salt intake is reduced and that, in many patients with mild essential hypertension, blood pressure can be controlled without the need for drug therapy. Effect of Diet and Exercise Intervention on Blood Pressure, Insulin, Oxidative Stress, and Nitric Oxide Availability Christian K. , PhD; Nosratola D. Vaziri, MD; R. Barnard, PhD From the Department of Physiological Science, University of California, Los Angeles (C.K.R., R.J.B.), and the Division of Nephrology and Hypertension, Department of Medicine, University of California, Irvine (C.K.R., N.D.V.). Correspondence to R. Barnard, Department of Physiological Science, UCLA, P.O. 951527, Los Angeles, CA 90095-1527. E-mail jbarnard@... Background- Diet and exercise can affect blood pressure and atherosclerotic risk. Methods and Results- The present study was designed to examine the effects of a short-term, rigorous diet and exercise intervention on blood pressure, hyperinsulinemia, and nitric oxide (NO) availability. Men (n=11) were placed on a low-fat, high-fiber diet combined with daily exercise for 45 to 60 minutes for 3 weeks. Pre- and post fasting blood was drawn for serum lipid, insulin, 8-isoprostaglandin F2 (8-iso-PGF2), and glucose measurements. Anthropometric parameters, blood pressure (BP), and 24-hour urinary NO metabolite excretion (NOX), a marker of NO bioavailability, were measured. Systolic (P<0.01) and diastolic BP (P<0.01) and 8-iso-PGF2 decreased (P<0.05), whereas urinary NOX increased (P<0.05). There was a significant reduction in fasting insulin (P<0.01) and a significant correlation between the decrease in serum insulin and the increase in urinary NOX (r2=0.68, P<0.05). All fasting lipids decreased significantly, and the total cholesterol to high-density lipoprotein cholesterol ratio improved. Although body weight and body mass index (P<0.01) decreased, obesity was still present and there were no correlations between the change in body mass index and the change in insulin, BP, or urinary NOX. Conclusions- This intervention resulted in dramatic improvements in BP, oxidative stress, NO availability, and the metabolic profile within 3 weeks, mitigating the risk for atherosclerosis progression and its clinical sequelae. Medically Supervised Water-only Fasting in the Treatment of Hypertension Alan Goldhamer, DC,a Lisle, PhD,b Banoo Parpia, PhD,c V. , MD,dand T. Colin , PhDe ABSTRACT Background: Hypertension-related diseases are the leading cause of morbidity and mortality in industrially developed societies. Although antihypertensive drugs are extensively used, dietary and lifestyle modifications also are effective in the treatment of patients with hypertension. One such lifestyle intervention is the use of medically supervised, water-only fasting as a safe and effective means of normalizing blood pressure and initiating health-promoting behavioral changes. Methods: One hundred seventy-four consecutive hypertensive patients with blood pressure in excess of 140 mm Hg systolic, 90 mm Hg diastolic (140/90 mm Hg), or both were treated in an inpatient setting under medical supervision. The treatment program consisted of a short prefasting period (approximately 2 to 3 days on average) during which food consumption was limited to fruits and vegetables, followed by medically supervised water-only fasting (approximately 10 to 11 days on average) and a refeeding period (approximately 6 to 7 days on average) introducing a low-fat, low-sodium, vegan diet. Results: Almost 90% of the subjects achieved blood pressure less than 140/90 mm Hg by the end of the treatment program. The average reduction in blood pressure was 37/13 mm Hg, with the greatest decrease being observed for subjects with the most severe hypertension. Patients with stage 3 hypertension (those with systolic blood pressure greater than 180 mg Hg, diastolic blood pressure greater than 110 mg Hg, or both) had an average reduction of 60/17 mm Hg at the conclusion of treatment. All of the subjects who were taking antihypertensive medication at entry (6.3% of the total sample) successfully discontinued the use of medication. Conclusion: Medically supervised water-only fasting appears to be a safe and effective means of normalizing blood pressure and may assist in motivating health-promoting diet and lifestyle changes. (J Manipulative Physiol Ther 2001;24:335-9) Arch Intern Med. <javascript:AL_get(this, 'jour', 'Arch Intern Med.');> 1974 May;133(5):758-90. Related Articles, <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Display & dopt=pubmed\ _pubmed & from_uid=4595399> Links <javascript:PopUpMenu2_Set(Menu4595399);> Treatment of hypertensive vascular disease with rice diet. Kempner W <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Search & itool=pubmed\ _Abstract & term=%22Kempner+W%22%5BAuthor%5D> . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 28, 2006 Report Share Posted January 28, 2006 PS You also have to consider that with the studies we do, and the one McDougall did and the ones the Rice Diet did, that not only were those drops in SBP seen, there was also the reduction in or elimination of, HTN medicine during the study. So, the original numbers were while on HTN meds and the final numbers were without them. So the actual drops were much more. We get around 80% of our patients off their HTN meds in 14-21 days. The rice diet has similar stats. Jeff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 28, 2006 Report Share Posted January 28, 2006 PS You also have to consider that with the studies we do, and the one McDougall did and the ones the Rice Diet did, that not only were those drops in SBP seen, there was also the reduction in or elimination of, HTN medicine during the study. So, the original numbers were while on HTN meds and the final numbers were without them. So the actual drops were much more. We get around 80% of our patients off their HTN meds in 14-21 days. The rice diet has similar stats. Jeff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 28, 2006 Report Share Posted January 28, 2006 But there is confusion about the word hypertension. Those who have it know what it is. It's not just elevated BP. Rodney's effect is the same as mine - elevated BP. I used 800 IU bid - NFG. Studies deal with averages and as Jay Gould once said, I'm not average. Odd that Rodney is in a far higher latitude than I, with the same results. I believe it's the insult of the pill on the intestinal tract. BTW, RAS has very little to do with my HTN, and I suspect others as well. Most do not use a RAS type control for BP, rather diuretic, CCB, BB. The info on RAS controllers sounds good too - just doesn't work. Regards. [ ] Re: Systolic BP and Vitamin D - Episode 5 Rodney,Your experience is the REVERSE of what has been reported in theliterature. Usually, low vitamin D is associated with hypertension.Tony==Here is a list of links to PubMed abstracts:http://www.cholecalciferol-council.com/hypertension.htm==J Cell Biochem. 2003 Feb 1;88(2):327-31. Vitamin D regulation of the renin-angiotensin system.Li YC. Department of Medicine, The University of Chicago, Chicago,Illinois 60637, USA. cyan@... The renin-angiotensin system (RAS) plays a central role in theregulation of blood pressure, electrolyte, and volume homeostasis.Epidemiological and clinical studies have long suggested anassociation of inadequate sunlight exposure or low serum1,25-dihydroxyvitamin D(3) [1,25(OH)(2)D(3)] levels with high bloodpressure and/or high plasma renin activity, but the mechanism is notunderstood. Our recent discovery that 1,25(OH)(2)D(3) functions as apotent negative endocrine regulator of renin gene expression providessome insights into the mechanism. The concept of vitamin D regulationof blood pressure through the RAS opens a new avenue to ourunderstanding of the physiological functions of the vitamin Dendocrine system, and provides a basis for exploring the potential useof vitamin D analogues in prevention and treatment of hypertension. PMID: 12520534 >> Hi folks:> > Am I boring you yet? (I certainly hope not.)> > I have just completed another two weeks taking zero vitamin D > supplements. This time I even omitted the calcium with a small > amount of D. Yet again, my SBP has returned to 110! I am now > getting pretty close to persuading myself that, at least for me, > vitamin D supplements appreciably raise my SBP. I will check again > tomorrow morning to verify the 110. Then do another two weeks taking > 1125 IU of supplements daily and recheck one more time whether it, > yet again, raises my SBP.> > The amount by which my SBP is raised while taking the supplement > varies appreciably. The lowest I have seen it after two weeks on the > supplements is 116, the highest 137. Off supplements it is pretty > consistently 110.> > Anyway the possible relevance for people here is that if you have a > SBP above what you think it ought to be (want it to be) and are > taking supplemental D you might want to try the following. Measure > your BP a few times to get a benchmark number. Then stop taking the > D supplements, and after a few weeks without them recheck your SBP a > few times. You just may find that your BP is higher than it needs to > be. It certainly seems to be the case with me. And in my case two > weeks off the supplements is long enough to wash out the effect. > fwiw.> > Obviously this is a one-mouse experiment and we all know, from > reading Dr. Walford if not before, the extent to which we should pay > attention to one-mouse experiments.> > Rodney.> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 28, 2006 Report Share Posted January 28, 2006 But there is confusion about the word hypertension. Those who have it know what it is. It's not just elevated BP. Rodney's effect is the same as mine - elevated BP. I used 800 IU bid - NFG. Studies deal with averages and as Jay Gould once said, I'm not average. Odd that Rodney is in a far higher latitude than I, with the same results. I believe it's the insult of the pill on the intestinal tract. BTW, RAS has very little to do with my HTN, and I suspect others as well. Most do not use a RAS type control for BP, rather diuretic, CCB, BB. The info on RAS controllers sounds good too - just doesn't work. Regards. [ ] Re: Systolic BP and Vitamin D - Episode 5 Rodney,Your experience is the REVERSE of what has been reported in theliterature. Usually, low vitamin D is associated with hypertension.Tony==Here is a list of links to PubMed abstracts:http://www.cholecalciferol-council.com/hypertension.htm==J Cell Biochem. 2003 Feb 1;88(2):327-31. Vitamin D regulation of the renin-angiotensin system.Li YC. Department of Medicine, The University of Chicago, Chicago,Illinois 60637, USA. cyan@... The renin-angiotensin system (RAS) plays a central role in theregulation of blood pressure, electrolyte, and volume homeostasis.Epidemiological and clinical studies have long suggested anassociation of inadequate sunlight exposure or low serum1,25-dihydroxyvitamin D(3) [1,25(OH)(2)D(3)] levels with high bloodpressure and/or high plasma renin activity, but the mechanism is notunderstood. Our recent discovery that 1,25(OH)(2)D(3) functions as apotent negative endocrine regulator of renin gene expression providessome insights into the mechanism. The concept of vitamin D regulationof blood pressure through the RAS opens a new avenue to ourunderstanding of the physiological functions of the vitamin Dendocrine system, and provides a basis for exploring the potential useof vitamin D analogues in prevention and treatment of hypertension. PMID: 12520534 >> Hi folks:> > Am I boring you yet? (I certainly hope not.)> > I have just completed another two weeks taking zero vitamin D > supplements. This time I even omitted the calcium with a small > amount of D. Yet again, my SBP has returned to 110! I am now > getting pretty close to persuading myself that, at least for me, > vitamin D supplements appreciably raise my SBP. I will check again > tomorrow morning to verify the 110. Then do another two weeks taking > 1125 IU of supplements daily and recheck one more time whether it, > yet again, raises my SBP.> > The amount by which my SBP is raised while taking the supplement > varies appreciably. The lowest I have seen it after two weeks on the > supplements is 116, the highest 137. Off supplements it is pretty > consistently 110.> > Anyway the possible relevance for people here is that if you have a > SBP above what you think it ought to be (want it to be) and are > taking supplemental D you might want to try the following. Measure > your BP a few times to get a benchmark number. Then stop taking the > D supplements, and after a few weeks without them recheck your SBP a > few times. You just may find that your BP is higher than it needs to > be. It certainly seems to be the case with me. And in my case two > weeks off the supplements is long enough to wash out the effect. > fwiw.> > Obviously this is a one-mouse experiment and we all know, from > reading Dr. Walford if not before, the extent to which we should pay > attention to one-mouse experiments.> > Rodney.> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 28, 2006 Report Share Posted January 28, 2006 Yes it will lower BP, but it won't cure essential HTN. Many things will cycle BP up. These articles are meaningless when compared with actuals, especially in HTN. Recall there are MANY HTN drugs. I react badly to a diuretic, eg., which is first line defense. After 5 days in the hospital, my doc wouldn't prescribe anything. BTW, I did my own rice diet and it worked - in the sense I could drop one medication. Weight loss also dropped, also no commercial wheat products. But it doesn't cure HTN. Rodney doesn't have HTN, just a higher BP - he reacts to vit D as I do. So the question is do you want to rec a thing that might raise BP? I don't. I have friends who have been in wheel chairs. Regards. RE: [ ] Re: Systolic BP and Vitamin D - Episode 5 >> Almost no study of diet, including giving high sodium diet to raise blood pressure, high potassium tolower bp, or high calcium diet to lower bp, finds a change of more than 4-6 mm Hg in systolic blood pressure. Actually we have published it on several occasions as have others.. (absracts below)McDougall reported average BP reductions of 17/13 mm Hg for hypertensive patients in a 12-day inpatient program with a vegan-vegetarian diet and MacGregor found an average BP reductions of 16/9 mm Hg for hypertensive patients on a very low-sodium diet The Pritikin Center showed average reductions in systolic (19 mm Hg) and diastolic (8 mm Hg) BP in 3 weeks.Goldhammer showed an overall mean drop of 37.1/13.3 mm Hg during a water only fasting program followed by a low fat, low sodium vegan diet.The rice diet at duke has shown reductions on average of 17/8 and moreJ Am Coll Nutr. <javascript:AL_get(this, 'jour', 'J Am Coll Nutr.');> 1995 Oct;14(5):491-6. Related Articles, <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Display & dopt=pubmed_pubmed & from_uid=8522729> Links <javascript:PopUpMenu2_Set(Menu8522729);> Rapid reduction of serum cholesterol and blood pressure by a twelve-day, very low fat, strictly vegetarian diet.McDougall J <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Search & itool=pubmed_Abstract & term=%22McDougall+J%22%5BAuthor%5D> , Litzau K <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Search & itool=pubmed_Abstract & term=%22Litzau+K%22%5BAuthor%5D> , Haver E <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Search & itool=pubmed_Abstract & term=%22Haver+E%22%5BAuthor%5D> , Saunders V <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Search & itool=pubmed_Abstract & term=%22Saunders+V%22%5BAuthor%5D> , Spiller GA <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Search & itool=pubmed_Abstract & term=%22Spiller+GA%22%5BAuthor%5D> .St. Helena Hospital, Deer Park, California 94576, USA.OBJECTIVE: This study was conducted to demonstrate the effectiveness of a strictly vegetarian, very low-fat diet on cardiac risk factor modification. METHODS: Five hundred men and women, participants in an intensive 12-day live-in program, were studied. The program focused on dietary modification, moderate exercise, and stress management at a hospital-based health-center. RESULTS: During this short time period, cardiac risk factors improved: there was an average reduction of total serum cholesterol of 11% (p < 0.001), of blood pressure of 6% (p < 0.001) and a weight loss of 2.5 kg for men and 1 kg for women. Serum triglycerides did not increase except for two subgroups: females age > or = 65 years with serum cholesterol < 6.5 mmol/L and for females 50 to 64 years with baseline serum cholesterol between 5.2-6.5 mmol/L. High-density lipoprotein cholesterol measured on 66 subjects decreased by 19%. CONCLUSION: A strict, very low-fat vegetarian diet free from all animal products combined with lifestyle changes that include exercise and weight loss is an effective way to lower serum cholesterol and blood pressure.Lancet. <javascript:AL_get(this, 'jour', 'Lancet.');> 1989 Nov 25;2(8674):1244-7. Related Articles, <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Display & dopt=pubmed_pubmed & from_uid=2573761> Links <javascript:PopUpMenu2_Set(Menu2573761);> Double-blind study of three sodium intakes and long-term effects of sodium restriction in essential hypertension.MacGregor GA <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Search & itool=pubmed_Abstract & term=%22MacGregor+GA%22%5BAuthor%5D> , Markandu ND <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Search & itool=pubmed_Abstract & term=%22Markandu+ND%22%5BAuthor%5D> , Sagnella GA <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Search & itool=pubmed_Abstract & term=%22Sagnella+GA%22%5BAuthor%5D> , Singer DR <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Search & itool=pubmed_Abstract & term=%22Singer+DR%22%5BAuthor%5D> , Cappuccio FP <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Search & itool=pubmed_Abstract & term=%22Cappuccio+FP%22%5BAuthor%5D> .Department of Medicine, St 's Hospital Medical School, London.20 patients with mild hypertension (average supine blood pressure without treatment, 164/101 mm Hg) reduced their salt intake to 50 mmol (3 g) per day for a month. They then entered a 3 month double-blind randomised crossover study of three levels of sodium intake: 200, 100, and 50 mmol per day. Blood pressure was significantly reduced on the middle and lowest sodium intakes. The average fall in blood pressure from the highest to the lowest sodium intake was 16/9 mm Hg. Patients continued to restrict their sodium intake for a further year. In 16 of the 20 patients blood pressure remained well controlled with salt restriction alone. Supine blood pressure at 1 year was 142/87 (SE 3/2) mm Hg with a 24 h urinary sodium excretion of 54 (7) mmol. These results show a progressive blood pressure fall as salt intake is reduced and that, in many patients with mild essential hypertension, blood pressure can be controlled without the need for drug therapy.Effect of Diet and Exercise Intervention on Blood Pressure, Insulin, Oxidative Stress, and Nitric Oxide Availability Christian K. , PhD; Nosratola D. Vaziri, MD; R. Barnard, PhD From the Department of Physiological Science, University of California, Los Angeles (C.K.R., R.J.B.), and the Division of Nephrology and Hypertension, Department of Medicine, University of California, Irvine (C.K.R., N.D.V.). Correspondence to R. Barnard, Department of Physiological Science, UCLA, P.O. 951527, Los Angeles, CA 90095-1527. E-mail jbarnard@... Background- Diet and exercise can affect blood pressure and atherosclerotic risk. Methods and Results- The present study was designed to examine the effects of a short-term, rigorous diet and exercise intervention on blood pressure, hyperinsulinemia, and nitric oxide (NO) availability. Men (n=11) were placed on a low-fat, high-fiber diet combined with daily exercise for 45 to 60 minutes for 3 weeks. Pre- and post fasting blood was drawn for serum lipid, insulin, 8-isoprostaglandin F2 (8-iso-PGF2), and glucose measurements. Anthropometric parameters, blood pressure (BP), and 24-hour urinary NO metabolite excretion (NOX), a marker of NO bioavailability, were measured. Systolic (P<0.01) and diastolic BP (P<0.01) and 8-iso-PGF2 decreased (P<0.05), whereas urinary NOX increased (P<0.05). There was a significant reduction in fasting insulin (P<0.01) and a significant correlation between the decrease in serum insulin and the increase in urinary NOX (r2=0.68, P<0.05). All fasting lipids decreased significantly, and the total cholesterol to high-density lipoprotein cholesterol ratio improved. Although body weight and body mass index (P<0.01) decreased, obesity was still present and there were no correlations between the change in body mass index and the change in insulin, BP, or urinary NOX. Conclusions- This intervention resulted in dramatic improvements in BP, oxidative stress, NO availability, and the metabolic profile within 3 weeks, mitigating the risk for atherosclerosis progression and its clinical sequelae. Medically Supervised Water-only Fasting in the Treatment of HypertensionAlan Goldhamer, DC,a Lisle, PhD,b Banoo Parpia, PhD,c V. , MD,dand T. Colin , PhDeABSTRACTBackground: Hypertension-related diseases are the leading cause of morbidity and mortality in industrially developed societies. Although antihypertensive drugs are extensively used, dietary and lifestyle modifications also are effective in the treatment of patients with hypertension. One such lifestyle intervention is the use of medically supervised, water-only fasting as a safe and effective means of normalizing blood pressure and initiating health-promoting behavioral changes. Methods: One hundred seventy-four consecutive hypertensive patients with blood pressure in excess of 140 mm Hg systolic, 90 mm Hg diastolic (140/90 mm Hg), or both were treated in an inpatient setting under medical supervision. The treatment program consisted of a short prefasting period (approximately 2 to 3 days on average) during which food consumption was limited to fruits and vegetables, followed by medically supervised water-only fasting (approximately 10 to 11 days on average) and a refeeding period (approximately 6 to 7 days on average) introducing a low-fat, low-sodium, vegan diet. Results: Almost 90% of the subjects achieved blood pressure less than 140/90 mm Hg by the end of the treatment program. The average reduction in blood pressure was 37/13 mm Hg, with the greatest decrease being observed for subjects with the most severe hypertension. Patients with stage 3 hypertension (those with systolic blood pressure greater than 180 mg Hg, diastolic blood pressure greater than 110 mg Hg, or both) had an average reduction of 60/17 mm Hg at the conclusion of treatment. All of the subjects who were taking antihypertensive medication at entry (6.3% of the total sample) successfully discontinued the use of medication. Conclusion: Medically supervised water-only fasting appears to be a safe and effective means of normalizing blood pressure and may assist in motivating health-promoting diet and lifestyle changes. (J Manipulative Physiol Ther 2001;24:335-9)Arch Intern Med. <javascript:AL_get(this, 'jour', 'Arch Intern Med.');> 1974 May;133(5):758-90. Related Articles, <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Display & dopt=pubmed_pubmed & from_uid=4595399> Links <javascript:PopUpMenu2_Set(Menu4595399);> Treatment of hypertensive vascular disease with rice diet.Kempner W <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Search & itool=pubmed_Abstract & term=%22Kempner+W%22%5BAuthor%5D> . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 28, 2006 Report Share Posted January 28, 2006 Yes it will lower BP, but it won't cure essential HTN. Many things will cycle BP up. These articles are meaningless when compared with actuals, especially in HTN. Recall there are MANY HTN drugs. I react badly to a diuretic, eg., which is first line defense. After 5 days in the hospital, my doc wouldn't prescribe anything. BTW, I did my own rice diet and it worked - in the sense I could drop one medication. Weight loss also dropped, also no commercial wheat products. But it doesn't cure HTN. Rodney doesn't have HTN, just a higher BP - he reacts to vit D as I do. So the question is do you want to rec a thing that might raise BP? I don't. I have friends who have been in wheel chairs. Regards. RE: [ ] Re: Systolic BP and Vitamin D - Episode 5 >> Almost no study of diet, including giving high sodium diet to raise blood pressure, high potassium tolower bp, or high calcium diet to lower bp, finds a change of more than 4-6 mm Hg in systolic blood pressure. Actually we have published it on several occasions as have others.. (absracts below)McDougall reported average BP reductions of 17/13 mm Hg for hypertensive patients in a 12-day inpatient program with a vegan-vegetarian diet and MacGregor found an average BP reductions of 16/9 mm Hg for hypertensive patients on a very low-sodium diet The Pritikin Center showed average reductions in systolic (19 mm Hg) and diastolic (8 mm Hg) BP in 3 weeks.Goldhammer showed an overall mean drop of 37.1/13.3 mm Hg during a water only fasting program followed by a low fat, low sodium vegan diet.The rice diet at duke has shown reductions on average of 17/8 and moreJ Am Coll Nutr. <javascript:AL_get(this, 'jour', 'J Am Coll Nutr.');> 1995 Oct;14(5):491-6. Related Articles, <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Display & dopt=pubmed_pubmed & from_uid=8522729> Links <javascript:PopUpMenu2_Set(Menu8522729);> Rapid reduction of serum cholesterol and blood pressure by a twelve-day, very low fat, strictly vegetarian diet.McDougall J <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Search & itool=pubmed_Abstract & term=%22McDougall+J%22%5BAuthor%5D> , Litzau K <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Search & itool=pubmed_Abstract & term=%22Litzau+K%22%5BAuthor%5D> , Haver E <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Search & itool=pubmed_Abstract & term=%22Haver+E%22%5BAuthor%5D> , Saunders V <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Search & itool=pubmed_Abstract & term=%22Saunders+V%22%5BAuthor%5D> , Spiller GA <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Search & itool=pubmed_Abstract & term=%22Spiller+GA%22%5BAuthor%5D> .St. Helena Hospital, Deer Park, California 94576, USA.OBJECTIVE: This study was conducted to demonstrate the effectiveness of a strictly vegetarian, very low-fat diet on cardiac risk factor modification. METHODS: Five hundred men and women, participants in an intensive 12-day live-in program, were studied. The program focused on dietary modification, moderate exercise, and stress management at a hospital-based health-center. RESULTS: During this short time period, cardiac risk factors improved: there was an average reduction of total serum cholesterol of 11% (p < 0.001), of blood pressure of 6% (p < 0.001) and a weight loss of 2.5 kg for men and 1 kg for women. Serum triglycerides did not increase except for two subgroups: females age > or = 65 years with serum cholesterol < 6.5 mmol/L and for females 50 to 64 years with baseline serum cholesterol between 5.2-6.5 mmol/L. High-density lipoprotein cholesterol measured on 66 subjects decreased by 19%. CONCLUSION: A strict, very low-fat vegetarian diet free from all animal products combined with lifestyle changes that include exercise and weight loss is an effective way to lower serum cholesterol and blood pressure.Lancet. <javascript:AL_get(this, 'jour', 'Lancet.');> 1989 Nov 25;2(8674):1244-7. Related Articles, <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Display & dopt=pubmed_pubmed & from_uid=2573761> Links <javascript:PopUpMenu2_Set(Menu2573761);> Double-blind study of three sodium intakes and long-term effects of sodium restriction in essential hypertension.MacGregor GA <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Search & itool=pubmed_Abstract & term=%22MacGregor+GA%22%5BAuthor%5D> , Markandu ND <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Search & itool=pubmed_Abstract & term=%22Markandu+ND%22%5BAuthor%5D> , Sagnella GA <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Search & itool=pubmed_Abstract & term=%22Sagnella+GA%22%5BAuthor%5D> , Singer DR <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Search & itool=pubmed_Abstract & term=%22Singer+DR%22%5BAuthor%5D> , Cappuccio FP <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Search & itool=pubmed_Abstract & term=%22Cappuccio+FP%22%5BAuthor%5D> .Department of Medicine, St 's Hospital Medical School, London.20 patients with mild hypertension (average supine blood pressure without treatment, 164/101 mm Hg) reduced their salt intake to 50 mmol (3 g) per day for a month. They then entered a 3 month double-blind randomised crossover study of three levels of sodium intake: 200, 100, and 50 mmol per day. Blood pressure was significantly reduced on the middle and lowest sodium intakes. The average fall in blood pressure from the highest to the lowest sodium intake was 16/9 mm Hg. Patients continued to restrict their sodium intake for a further year. In 16 of the 20 patients blood pressure remained well controlled with salt restriction alone. Supine blood pressure at 1 year was 142/87 (SE 3/2) mm Hg with a 24 h urinary sodium excretion of 54 (7) mmol. These results show a progressive blood pressure fall as salt intake is reduced and that, in many patients with mild essential hypertension, blood pressure can be controlled without the need for drug therapy.Effect of Diet and Exercise Intervention on Blood Pressure, Insulin, Oxidative Stress, and Nitric Oxide Availability Christian K. , PhD; Nosratola D. Vaziri, MD; R. Barnard, PhD From the Department of Physiological Science, University of California, Los Angeles (C.K.R., R.J.B.), and the Division of Nephrology and Hypertension, Department of Medicine, University of California, Irvine (C.K.R., N.D.V.). Correspondence to R. Barnard, Department of Physiological Science, UCLA, P.O. 951527, Los Angeles, CA 90095-1527. E-mail jbarnard@... Background- Diet and exercise can affect blood pressure and atherosclerotic risk. Methods and Results- The present study was designed to examine the effects of a short-term, rigorous diet and exercise intervention on blood pressure, hyperinsulinemia, and nitric oxide (NO) availability. Men (n=11) were placed on a low-fat, high-fiber diet combined with daily exercise for 45 to 60 minutes for 3 weeks. Pre- and post fasting blood was drawn for serum lipid, insulin, 8-isoprostaglandin F2 (8-iso-PGF2), and glucose measurements. Anthropometric parameters, blood pressure (BP), and 24-hour urinary NO metabolite excretion (NOX), a marker of NO bioavailability, were measured. Systolic (P<0.01) and diastolic BP (P<0.01) and 8-iso-PGF2 decreased (P<0.05), whereas urinary NOX increased (P<0.05). There was a significant reduction in fasting insulin (P<0.01) and a significant correlation between the decrease in serum insulin and the increase in urinary NOX (r2=0.68, P<0.05). All fasting lipids decreased significantly, and the total cholesterol to high-density lipoprotein cholesterol ratio improved. Although body weight and body mass index (P<0.01) decreased, obesity was still present and there were no correlations between the change in body mass index and the change in insulin, BP, or urinary NOX. Conclusions- This intervention resulted in dramatic improvements in BP, oxidative stress, NO availability, and the metabolic profile within 3 weeks, mitigating the risk for atherosclerosis progression and its clinical sequelae. Medically Supervised Water-only Fasting in the Treatment of HypertensionAlan Goldhamer, DC,a Lisle, PhD,b Banoo Parpia, PhD,c V. , MD,dand T. Colin , PhDeABSTRACTBackground: Hypertension-related diseases are the leading cause of morbidity and mortality in industrially developed societies. Although antihypertensive drugs are extensively used, dietary and lifestyle modifications also are effective in the treatment of patients with hypertension. One such lifestyle intervention is the use of medically supervised, water-only fasting as a safe and effective means of normalizing blood pressure and initiating health-promoting behavioral changes. Methods: One hundred seventy-four consecutive hypertensive patients with blood pressure in excess of 140 mm Hg systolic, 90 mm Hg diastolic (140/90 mm Hg), or both were treated in an inpatient setting under medical supervision. The treatment program consisted of a short prefasting period (approximately 2 to 3 days on average) during which food consumption was limited to fruits and vegetables, followed by medically supervised water-only fasting (approximately 10 to 11 days on average) and a refeeding period (approximately 6 to 7 days on average) introducing a low-fat, low-sodium, vegan diet. Results: Almost 90% of the subjects achieved blood pressure less than 140/90 mm Hg by the end of the treatment program. The average reduction in blood pressure was 37/13 mm Hg, with the greatest decrease being observed for subjects with the most severe hypertension. Patients with stage 3 hypertension (those with systolic blood pressure greater than 180 mg Hg, diastolic blood pressure greater than 110 mg Hg, or both) had an average reduction of 60/17 mm Hg at the conclusion of treatment. All of the subjects who were taking antihypertensive medication at entry (6.3% of the total sample) successfully discontinued the use of medication. Conclusion: Medically supervised water-only fasting appears to be a safe and effective means of normalizing blood pressure and may assist in motivating health-promoting diet and lifestyle changes. (J Manipulative Physiol Ther 2001;24:335-9)Arch Intern Med. <javascript:AL_get(this, 'jour', 'Arch Intern Med.');> 1974 May;133(5):758-90. Related Articles, <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Display & dopt=pubmed_pubmed & from_uid=4595399> Links <javascript:PopUpMenu2_Set(Menu4595399);> Treatment of hypertensive vascular disease with rice diet.Kempner W <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed & cmd=Search & itool=pubmed_Abstract & term=%22Kempner+W%22%5BAuthor%5D> . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 29, 2006 Report Share Posted January 29, 2006 I use a Lumiscope self inflating device for 16 yrs. Not the same device (a second) but it measures the same. I calibrate it against a Mercury Sphygmo, connected to the same tube so I can listen and read the Hg tube while the Lumiscope inflates and measures the same pressure. The electronic device is convenient, can be used as many times as desired, in a variety of settings. Also the manual cuff requires a certain amount of exertion, fussing with the measurement. Measurements must be taken when absolutely still. I tracked BP for 16 yrs closely, and kept notebook records of what I ate, what I did to correlate with BP. Including during treadmill exercise. Actually I stop to measure it seated, then get back on. I do that at 10 min intervals, 0.5 miles. I've done that before eating, after eating, after eating a high fat meal, you name it. I wore out one treadmill in 2 yrs. The exercise rise is far more important to me than seated, rested. I also have an Omron which is also accurate, and have discarded a Sunbeam, Walgreens, and a wrist monitor. I used a finger monitor for a while only for heart rate on the treadmill. I've also tried several more brands and refused to buy them or took them back. I have 4 Lumiscopes now (which you don't see much in the stores now), the 2 newer ones read slightly diff from the older models. They tend to read per the newer instructions for taking BP which is to record korotkoff 5 sound (the last sound you hear) instead of 4 (the point where the sound changes from a bump to a muffled bump). With mine that's about 5 mm Hg difference. The machines in the store now seem to be quite consistent, and I notice my docs here are using the hospital type automated system. So I think a lot of progress has been made regardless what people think about automated devices. Obviously there are challenges in the way people hear the sounds, their "ear", their eye hand ear coordination, etc. My wife and I both go for checkups the same day, and on one occasion 2 nurses measure ours separately, both at 160/90. I have HTN, she does not. In the car afterward I checked mine at 135/85 hers at her usual 112/67. Since then I believe no one's data about BP. And I'm not taking any more vit D other than that in my MV. The type you get in a pill is not the same as the sun's. And the liver is not required to make the conversion. The gut can do it. Regards. [ ] Re: Systolic BP and Vitamin D - Episode 5 JW,I haven't tried the in-store blood pressure machines.I was asking about at home monitors. It doesn't soundlike Rodney measures at home. What brand/type do youuse for your regular tracking? I used to trust thesethings, but with such a discrepancy between the manualand automatic pump models, I no longer know which tobelieve.Thanks,-> >> > Hi :> > > > I use the machine that is in the local drug store. It does not > > appear to have a manufacturer's name on it. It has a 1 800 number, > > but that is not very useful on a Saturday.> > > > I do not know which is the most accurate as I have no way to > > calibrate it. It does not have a memory feature. It seems like a > > good idea to avoid the machines with a lower arm cuff.> > > > This morning, on the same machine in the same store as yesterday, > the > > numbers came out at 105/64. This is even lower than previous > > readings, even when averaged with the 110 of yesterday. The reason > > possibly may be that this time not only did I stop the 1000 IU > > supplement but also the '500 mg Ca + 125 IU of D', which I had > > continued to take when I previously experimentally stopped the 1000 > > IU.> > > > This singular mouse is now becoming even more convinced that, for > it > > at least, there is a 'D >>> SBP' connection.> > > > I will try one more cycle of 1125 IU of D supplementation. If the > > results are similar I will then shift to a 'fish+shiitake' > experiment > > to add 1125 IU to my previous intake, but in food instead of by > > supplement. And in May a sunlight experiment. I need to find a > way > > to get plenty of D while maintaining a CRON-like SBP. Stay tuned.> > > > [Remember that, of people who have normal blood pressure at age 60, > > 95% of them eventually get hypertension if they live long enough. > So > > this is an important issue, even for those who think their BP is > OK. > > Perhaps the 5% "is us"?]> > > > Rodney.> > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 29, 2006 Report Share Posted January 29, 2006 I use a Lumiscope self inflating device for 16 yrs. Not the same device (a second) but it measures the same. I calibrate it against a Mercury Sphygmo, connected to the same tube so I can listen and read the Hg tube while the Lumiscope inflates and measures the same pressure. The electronic device is convenient, can be used as many times as desired, in a variety of settings. Also the manual cuff requires a certain amount of exertion, fussing with the measurement. Measurements must be taken when absolutely still. I tracked BP for 16 yrs closely, and kept notebook records of what I ate, what I did to correlate with BP. Including during treadmill exercise. Actually I stop to measure it seated, then get back on. I do that at 10 min intervals, 0.5 miles. I've done that before eating, after eating, after eating a high fat meal, you name it. I wore out one treadmill in 2 yrs. The exercise rise is far more important to me than seated, rested. I also have an Omron which is also accurate, and have discarded a Sunbeam, Walgreens, and a wrist monitor. I used a finger monitor for a while only for heart rate on the treadmill. I've also tried several more brands and refused to buy them or took them back. I have 4 Lumiscopes now (which you don't see much in the stores now), the 2 newer ones read slightly diff from the older models. They tend to read per the newer instructions for taking BP which is to record korotkoff 5 sound (the last sound you hear) instead of 4 (the point where the sound changes from a bump to a muffled bump). With mine that's about 5 mm Hg difference. The machines in the store now seem to be quite consistent, and I notice my docs here are using the hospital type automated system. So I think a lot of progress has been made regardless what people think about automated devices. Obviously there are challenges in the way people hear the sounds, their "ear", their eye hand ear coordination, etc. My wife and I both go for checkups the same day, and on one occasion 2 nurses measure ours separately, both at 160/90. I have HTN, she does not. In the car afterward I checked mine at 135/85 hers at her usual 112/67. Since then I believe no one's data about BP. And I'm not taking any more vit D other than that in my MV. The type you get in a pill is not the same as the sun's. And the liver is not required to make the conversion. The gut can do it. Regards. [ ] Re: Systolic BP and Vitamin D - Episode 5 JW,I haven't tried the in-store blood pressure machines.I was asking about at home monitors. It doesn't soundlike Rodney measures at home. What brand/type do youuse for your regular tracking? I used to trust thesethings, but with such a discrepancy between the manualand automatic pump models, I no longer know which tobelieve.Thanks,-> >> > Hi :> > > > I use the machine that is in the local drug store. It does not > > appear to have a manufacturer's name on it. It has a 1 800 number, > > but that is not very useful on a Saturday.> > > > I do not know which is the most accurate as I have no way to > > calibrate it. It does not have a memory feature. It seems like a > > good idea to avoid the machines with a lower arm cuff.> > > > This morning, on the same machine in the same store as yesterday, > the > > numbers came out at 105/64. This is even lower than previous > > readings, even when averaged with the 110 of yesterday. The reason > > possibly may be that this time not only did I stop the 1000 IU > > supplement but also the '500 mg Ca + 125 IU of D', which I had > > continued to take when I previously experimentally stopped the 1000 > > IU.> > > > This singular mouse is now becoming even more convinced that, for > it > > at least, there is a 'D >>> SBP' connection.> > > > I will try one more cycle of 1125 IU of D supplementation. If the > > results are similar I will then shift to a 'fish+shiitake' > experiment > > to add 1125 IU to my previous intake, but in food instead of by > > supplement. And in May a sunlight experiment. I need to find a > way > > to get plenty of D while maintaining a CRON-like SBP. Stay tuned.> > > > [Remember that, of people who have normal blood pressure at age 60, > > 95% of them eventually get hypertension if they live long enough. > So > > this is an important issue, even for those who think their BP is > OK. > > Perhaps the 5% "is us"?]> > > > Rodney.> > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 29, 2006 Report Share Posted January 29, 2006 JW You are right, we are not those people or live in their environments and so cant neccessarily extrapolate those numbers to everyone in the US. And, while I know you are meticulous about your diet/health/BP, we also have to agree that your experience is " your " experience and again, we cant neccessarily say your experience is indicative of everyone in the US with " essential " HTN. Regards Jeff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 29, 2006 Report Share Posted January 29, 2006 JW You are right, we are not those people or live in their environments and so cant neccessarily extrapolate those numbers to everyone in the US. And, while I know you are meticulous about your diet/health/BP, we also have to agree that your experience is " your " experience and again, we cant neccessarily say your experience is indicative of everyone in the US with " essential " HTN. Regards Jeff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 30, 2006 Report Share Posted January 30, 2006 The problem with taking too much vit D is too much calcium and possibly stones. I didn't hear or see that mentioned in the refs recommending higher D intake. I didn't hear or see in the refs the feature of exogenous vit d to raise serum Ca+. The article you presented last month was very good but it left out the other than liver conversions of vit d. The following is not the only ref about these but the one I have handy.Journal of Clinical Endocrinology and MetabolismVolume 82 • Number 12 • December 1, 1997Calcium Absorptive Effects of Vitamin D and Its Major Metabolites*DiscussionWe show here that both Vitamin D3 and 25(OH)D produce dose-dependent increases in calcium absorption efficiency in healthy adult men, and that they do so without evoking a detectable rise in circulating total 1,25(OH)2 D. The effect of vitamin D3 appears to be explainable largely, if not entirely, by conversion to 25(OH)D, there being no correlation between circulating vitamin D3 levels and absorption after adjusting for serum 25(OH)D. Thus, these findings confirm previous reports [4] [5] [6] [7] ,[9] that exogenous 25(OH)D exerts absorptive activity in humans in its own right. As shown in Figure 4 (Figure Not Available) , our dose-response data for 25(OH)D are remarkably similar to those reported earlier by Colodro et al [9] . Further, as reported above and shown in Fig. 1 (Figure Not Available) , the dose-response data indicate that the absorption-promoting activity.Correct me if I'm reading that wrong, but it sounds like absorption is not controlled by the liver. Higher BP may be the key to identifying too much Vit D intake for the individual. At least we should say if they intend to take 800 IU bid, they should measure their BP, just as a safety, and get serum Ca checked often (my guess - that's what I'd do).Last I looked more than 400 IU is not the RDA yet.http://darwin.nap.edu/books/0309085373/html/1320.html 600 for > 70yo.Regards. RE: [ ] Re: Systolic BP and Vitamin D - Episode 5JWYou are right, we are not those people or live in their environments and so cant neccessarily extrapolate those numbers to everyone in the US. And, while I know you are meticulous about your diet/health/BP, we also have to agree that your experience is "your" experience and again, we cant neccessarily say your experience is indicative of everyone in the US with "essential" HTN.RegardsJeff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 30, 2006 Report Share Posted January 30, 2006 The problem with taking too much vit D is too much calcium and possibly stones. I didn't hear or see that mentioned in the refs recommending higher D intake. I didn't hear or see in the refs the feature of exogenous vit d to raise serum Ca+. The article you presented last month was very good but it left out the other than liver conversions of vit d. The following is not the only ref about these but the one I have handy.Journal of Clinical Endocrinology and MetabolismVolume 82 • Number 12 • December 1, 1997Calcium Absorptive Effects of Vitamin D and Its Major Metabolites*DiscussionWe show here that both Vitamin D3 and 25(OH)D produce dose-dependent increases in calcium absorption efficiency in healthy adult men, and that they do so without evoking a detectable rise in circulating total 1,25(OH)2 D. The effect of vitamin D3 appears to be explainable largely, if not entirely, by conversion to 25(OH)D, there being no correlation between circulating vitamin D3 levels and absorption after adjusting for serum 25(OH)D. Thus, these findings confirm previous reports [4] [5] [6] [7] ,[9] that exogenous 25(OH)D exerts absorptive activity in humans in its own right. As shown in Figure 4 (Figure Not Available) , our dose-response data for 25(OH)D are remarkably similar to those reported earlier by Colodro et al [9] . Further, as reported above and shown in Fig. 1 (Figure Not Available) , the dose-response data indicate that the absorption-promoting activity.Correct me if I'm reading that wrong, but it sounds like absorption is not controlled by the liver. Higher BP may be the key to identifying too much Vit D intake for the individual. At least we should say if they intend to take 800 IU bid, they should measure their BP, just as a safety, and get serum Ca checked often (my guess - that's what I'd do).Last I looked more than 400 IU is not the RDA yet.http://darwin.nap.edu/books/0309085373/html/1320.html 600 for > 70yo.Regards. RE: [ ] Re: Systolic BP and Vitamin D - Episode 5JWYou are right, we are not those people or live in their environments and so cant neccessarily extrapolate those numbers to everyone in the US. And, while I know you are meticulous about your diet/health/BP, we also have to agree that your experience is "your" experience and again, we cant neccessarily say your experience is indicative of everyone in the US with "essential" HTN.RegardsJeff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 4, 2006 Report Share Posted February 4, 2006 Datapoint for ya, Rodney: I take 1000mg/day of vit D (ergocalciferol) & 80g salmon or mackeral/day. SBP = 118. I'll take the 118 w/vit D rather than 105-110 w/o (haven't done the experiment, so I don't know if, in fact, no vit D would translate to the lower SBP range). Al > Hi folks: > > Interim SBP result: In my 'two weeks on/two weeks washout' vitamin D > experiment, in the past four days I have consumed a lot of vitamin D > from food, but none from supplements. > > Last weekend after two weeks of negligible D intake my two SBP > readings were 110 and 105. This weekend after just four days of D > from food (fish and shiitake) my SBP was 118. Then I took it again a > second time about one minute after the first and got 119 (i.e. > encouraging as to machine consistency). > > The real test will be the data from next weekend. But this interim > result seems to confirm the data I got from the high D intake mostly > from supplements - that appreciable amounts of this vitamin appear to > considerable raise my SBP. Perhaps I will stretch this half cycle > out to three weeks, to see if I get an even higher number after three > weeks than after just two. > > jfi > > Rodney. > > >> > >> > I tracked BP for 16 yrs closely, and kept notebook records of > what >> I ate, what I did to correlate with BP. Including during treadmill >> exercise. Actually I stop to measure it seated, then get back on. I >> do that at 10 min intervals, 0.5 miles. I've done that before > eating, >> after eating, after eating a high fat meal, you name it. I wore out >> one treadmill in 2 yrs. >> > The exercise rise is far more important to me than seated, > rested. >> > >> > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 4, 2006 Report Share Posted February 4, 2006 Datapoint for ya, Rodney: I take 1000mg/day of vit D (ergocalciferol) & 80g salmon or mackeral/day. SBP = 118. I'll take the 118 w/vit D rather than 105-110 w/o (haven't done the experiment, so I don't know if, in fact, no vit D would translate to the lower SBP range). Al > Hi folks: > > Interim SBP result: In my 'two weeks on/two weeks washout' vitamin D > experiment, in the past four days I have consumed a lot of vitamin D > from food, but none from supplements. > > Last weekend after two weeks of negligible D intake my two SBP > readings were 110 and 105. This weekend after just four days of D > from food (fish and shiitake) my SBP was 118. Then I took it again a > second time about one minute after the first and got 119 (i.e. > encouraging as to machine consistency). > > The real test will be the data from next weekend. But this interim > result seems to confirm the data I got from the high D intake mostly > from supplements - that appreciable amounts of this vitamin appear to > considerable raise my SBP. Perhaps I will stretch this half cycle > out to three weeks, to see if I get an even higher number after three > weeks than after just two. > > jfi > > Rodney. > > >> > >> > I tracked BP for 16 yrs closely, and kept notebook records of > what >> I ate, what I did to correlate with BP. Including during treadmill >> exercise. Actually I stop to measure it seated, then get back on. I >> do that at 10 min intervals, 0.5 miles. I've done that before > eating, >> after eating, after eating a high fat meal, you name it. I wore out >> one treadmill in 2 yrs. >> > The exercise rise is far more important to me than seated, > rested. >> > >> > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 4, 2006 Report Share Posted February 4, 2006 Oops, that's IU not mg for the vit D units. Al Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 4, 2006 Report Share Posted February 4, 2006 Oops, that's IU not mg for the vit D units. Al Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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