Re: Starch, Monounsaturated Fats and Prostate Cancer

[Guest guest]

PUFA inversely associated with prostate cancer? Isn't the evidence

being strongly established that exactly the opposite is the case when

it comes to consumption of omega-6 FA? More than enough to make anyone

suspicious?

Conclusions drawn by the authors of a famous study published a couple

of months ago:

Taken together, the data suggest that arachidonic acid via conversion

to PGE2 plays an important role in stimulation of growth-related genes

and proliferation via PI3K signaling and NF-{kappa}B translocation to

the nucleus. (Cancer Res 2006; 66(3): 1427-33)

http://cancerres.aacrjournals.org/cgi/content/abstract/66/3/1427

Introducing another abtract to the same research:

For the past 60 years, dietary intake of essential fatty acids has

increased. Moreover, the omega-6 fatty acids have recently been found

to play an important role in regulation of gene expression.

Proliferation of human prostate cells was significantly increased 48 h

after arachidonic acid (AA) addition.

http://carcin.oxfordjournals.org/cgi/content/abstract/26/9/1520

>

> Hi folks:

>

> Males should find this of interest:

>

> " CONCLUSIONS: Starch and monounsaturated fatty acids were directly

> associated with prostate cancer risk and polyunsaturated fatty acids

> were inversely associated. "

>

> PMID: 15598953

>

> Free full text is available.

>

> Rodney.

>

[Guest guest]

PUFA inversely associated with prostate cancer? Isn't the evidence

being strongly established that exactly the opposite is the case when

it comes to consumption of omega-6 FA? More than enough to make anyone

suspicious?

Conclusions drawn by the authors of a famous study published a couple

of months ago:

Taken together, the data suggest that arachidonic acid via conversion

to PGE2 plays an important role in stimulation of growth-related genes

and proliferation via PI3K signaling and NF-{kappa}B translocation to

the nucleus. (Cancer Res 2006; 66(3): 1427-33)

http://cancerres.aacrjournals.org/cgi/content/abstract/66/3/1427

Introducing another abtract to the same research:

For the past 60 years, dietary intake of essential fatty acids has

increased. Moreover, the omega-6 fatty acids have recently been found

to play an important role in regulation of gene expression.

Proliferation of human prostate cells was significantly increased 48 h

after arachidonic acid (AA) addition.

http://carcin.oxfordjournals.org/cgi/content/abstract/26/9/1520

>

> Hi folks:

>

> Males should find this of interest:

>

> " CONCLUSIONS: Starch and monounsaturated fatty acids were directly

> associated with prostate cancer risk and polyunsaturated fatty acids

> were inversely associated. "

>

> PMID: 15598953

>

> Free full text is available.

>

> Rodney.

>

[Guest guest]

Once again, we seem to be faced with making dietary decisions from

partial or contradictory information. The bulk of the information

seems to suggest that:

1) linoleic acid, a polyunsaturated omega-6 fatty acid, is an

essential fatty acid that reduces cholesterol, among other

things.(PMID: 8503356)

2) ratios of omega-6:omega-3 of 4:1 have been associated with reduced

mortality from cardiovascular disease, suppressed inflammation in

patients with rheumatoid arthritis, and decreased risk of breast

cancer.(PMID: 12442909)

One BIG variable is the amount of fat in the diet. Anybody who

consumes animal fats, which are high in saturated fats, should

probably balance their diet by adding sources of omega-6 like walnuts

or sunflower seeds to avoid high cholesterol levels. At the same

time, sources of omega-3 (flaxseed, fish oil) should be consumed in

enough quantity to achieve the 4:1 ratio. All this has to be done

while restricting calories to avoid becoming overweight or obese, of

course.

Optimum Nutrition = Perfect Balance.

Tony

> >

> > Hi folks:

> >

> > Males should find this of interest:

> >

> > " CONCLUSIONS: Starch and monounsaturated fatty acids were directly

> > associated with prostate cancer risk and polyunsaturated fatty acids

> > were inversely associated. "

> >

> > PMID: 15598953

> >

> > Free full text is available.

> >

> > Rodney.

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Once again, we seem to be faced with making dietary decisions from

partial or contradictory information. The bulk of the information

seems to suggest that:

1) linoleic acid, a polyunsaturated omega-6 fatty acid, is an

essential fatty acid that reduces cholesterol, among other

things.(PMID: 8503356)

2) ratios of omega-6:omega-3 of 4:1 have been associated with reduced

mortality from cardiovascular disease, suppressed inflammation in

patients with rheumatoid arthritis, and decreased risk of breast

cancer.(PMID: 12442909)

One BIG variable is the amount of fat in the diet. Anybody who

consumes animal fats, which are high in saturated fats, should

probably balance their diet by adding sources of omega-6 like walnuts

or sunflower seeds to avoid high cholesterol levels. At the same

time, sources of omega-3 (flaxseed, fish oil) should be consumed in

enough quantity to achieve the 4:1 ratio. All this has to be done

while restricting calories to avoid becoming overweight or obese, of

course.

Optimum Nutrition = Perfect Balance.

Tony

> >

> > Hi folks:

> >

> > Males should find this of interest:

> >

> > " CONCLUSIONS: Starch and monounsaturated fatty acids were directly

> > associated with prostate cancer risk and polyunsaturated fatty acids

> > were inversely associated. "

> >

> > PMID: 15598953

> >

> > Free full text is available.

> >

> > Rodney.

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Yes, it's hard to get around the fact that despite the disadvantanges

brought about by PUFA consumption, there is long standing scientific

evidence regarding benefits when it comes to cadio-vascular health.

PUFAs lower plasma cholesterol. But -curiously- (according to the

following reviewer) it does seem to increase cholesterol biosynthesis.

Why???

Regulation of cholesterol biosynthesis by diet in humans

PJ

School of Dietetics and Human Nutrition, Faculty of Agricultural and

Environmental Sciences, McGill University, Ste-Anne-de-Bellevue,

Quebec, Canada. jonesp@...

Biosynthesis of cholesterol represents a major input into whole-body

pools; however, its regulation has been difficult to study in humans

because of limitations in methodologies. The present objectives are to

compare available techniques for measuring this process and examine

how dietary factors alter human cholesterol biosynthesis. Review of

existing techniques suggests that mass isotopomer distribution

analysis and deuterium incorporation approaches offer advantages over

other methods. Dietary factors influencing human cholesterol synthesis

include energy restriction, meal frequency, dietary fat type, and

cholesterol and phytosterol content. Food deprivation for as short as

24 h results in almost complete cessation of cholesterol biosynthesis.

Similarly, increased meal frequency patterns are associated with a

substantial depression in synthesis. In contrast, consumption of oils

rich in polyunsaturated fatty acids, despite reducing circulating

concentrations, increases the cholesterol synthesis rate compared with

other fats. Stepwise addition of dietary cholesterol is associated

with only a modest decline in cholesterogenesis while raising plasma

concentrations slightly. It can be concluded that synthesis, as a

contributor to circulating cholesterol concentrations, is sensitive to

many dietary factors. Energy deprivation results in the greatest

decline in synthesis, likely accounting for the beneficial decline in

circulating cholesterol concentrations observed with weight loss.

Does anyone have any input? Studies on cholesterol biosynthesis are

hard to come across but would seem more promising in furnishing

essential clues to bring us out of these apparent contradictions. If

the body makes more cholesterol following consumption of PUFA, but

presents lower plasma levels of the stuff, doesn't that mean that it

is somehow using it up because a need for it has been created? Is that

good? A protective reaction offsetting the effects of some deleterious

factor???

http://www.ajcn.org/cgi/content/abstract/66/2/438

Way out at sea on this one...

> > >

> > > Hi folks:

> > >

> > > Males should find this of interest:

> > >

> > > " CONCLUSIONS: Starch and monounsaturated fatty acids were directly

> > > associated with prostate cancer risk and polyunsaturated fatty

acids

> > > were inversely associated. "

> > >

> > > PMID: 15598953

> > >

> > > Free full text is available.

> > >

> > > Rodney.

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Yes, it's hard to get around the fact that despite the disadvantanges

brought about by PUFA consumption, there is long standing scientific

evidence regarding benefits when it comes to cadio-vascular health.

PUFAs lower plasma cholesterol. But -curiously- (according to the

following reviewer) it does seem to increase cholesterol biosynthesis.

Why???

Regulation of cholesterol biosynthesis by diet in humans

PJ

School of Dietetics and Human Nutrition, Faculty of Agricultural and

Environmental Sciences, McGill University, Ste-Anne-de-Bellevue,

Quebec, Canada. jonesp@...

Biosynthesis of cholesterol represents a major input into whole-body

pools; however, its regulation has been difficult to study in humans

because of limitations in methodologies. The present objectives are to

compare available techniques for measuring this process and examine

how dietary factors alter human cholesterol biosynthesis. Review of

existing techniques suggests that mass isotopomer distribution

analysis and deuterium incorporation approaches offer advantages over

other methods. Dietary factors influencing human cholesterol synthesis

include energy restriction, meal frequency, dietary fat type, and

cholesterol and phytosterol content. Food deprivation for as short as

24 h results in almost complete cessation of cholesterol biosynthesis.

Similarly, increased meal frequency patterns are associated with a

substantial depression in synthesis. In contrast, consumption of oils

rich in polyunsaturated fatty acids, despite reducing circulating

concentrations, increases the cholesterol synthesis rate compared with

other fats. Stepwise addition of dietary cholesterol is associated

with only a modest decline in cholesterogenesis while raising plasma

concentrations slightly. It can be concluded that synthesis, as a

contributor to circulating cholesterol concentrations, is sensitive to

many dietary factors. Energy deprivation results in the greatest

decline in synthesis, likely accounting for the beneficial decline in

circulating cholesterol concentrations observed with weight loss.

Does anyone have any input? Studies on cholesterol biosynthesis are

hard to come across but would seem more promising in furnishing

essential clues to bring us out of these apparent contradictions. If

the body makes more cholesterol following consumption of PUFA, but

presents lower plasma levels of the stuff, doesn't that mean that it

is somehow using it up because a need for it has been created? Is that

good? A protective reaction offsetting the effects of some deleterious

factor???

http://www.ajcn.org/cgi/content/abstract/66/2/438

Way out at sea on this one...

> > >

> > > Hi folks:

> > >

> > > Males should find this of interest:

> > >

> > > " CONCLUSIONS: Starch and monounsaturated fatty acids were directly

> > > associated with prostate cancer risk and polyunsaturated fatty

acids

> > > were inversely associated. "

> > >

> > > PMID: 15598953

> > >

> > > Free full text is available.

> > >

> > > Rodney.

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

> Perhaps the important point:

> " Energy deprivation results in the greatest decline in synthesis,

likely accounting for the beneficial decline in circulating

cholesterol concentrations observed with weight loss. "

An important point to be sure. But what this effect brought about in

such a short time can mean on overall health status I am not qualified

to guess as long as high cholesterol is in itself considered (by

association) a risk factor and not just a marker for artherosclerosis

or for anything else for that matter. If considered a marker such a

decrease would mean nothing as we know for sure that sclerotic

artheries are not made well in 24 hours. All that would be proven is

that plama cholesterol levels are sensitive to dietary factors. How

far does this get us?

> What causes the liver to make more that we would think necessary? dunno.

Neither do I. But I am mightily tempted to be consequential. There are

numerous studies out there which establish the peroxidative effects of

PUFAs on different tissues. Here's one:

The effect of increased intakes of polyunsaturated fatty acids and

vitamin E on DNA damage in human lymphocytes

A. McE. JENKINSON1, A. R. COLLINS, S. J. DUTHIE, K. W. J. WAHLE and G.

G. DUTHIE

Rowett Research Institute, Bucksburn, Aberdeen, Scotland, U.K. AB21 9SB

1Correspondence: Rowett Research Institute, Greenburn Rd., Bucksburn,

Aberdeen, Scotland, U.K. AB21 9SB. E-mail: aj@...

ABSTRACT

The effect of increasing dietary intakes of polyunsaturated fatty

acids (PUFAs) and vitamin E on indices of oxidative DNA damage was

investigated. Twenty-one healthy male, nonsmokers aged 28.9 ± 1.3

years participated in a free-living, split plot/change over trial in

which half the volunteers consumed diets containing 5% PUFA as food

energy for 4 wk and, after a 10 wk washout period, consumed a 15% PUFA

diet for another 4 wk. The other volunteers followed an identical

protocol, except that they consumed the 15% PUFA diet first. The diets

were provided to volunteers either with or without an additional 80 mg

d{alpha}-tocopherol acetate/day; otherwise total fat, carbohydrates,

protein, and basal vitamin E contents remained unchanged. DNA damage

induced by 200 µM H2O2 in lymphocytes from volunteers as well as

endogenous DNA damage in the form of oxidized pyrimidines, measured by

alkaline single-cell gel electrophoresis (the comet assay),

significantly decreased after consumption of the 5% PUFA diet (P<0.001

and P=0.01, respectively), but significantly increased after

consumption of the 15% PUFA diet when {alpha}-tocopherol levels were

in the range of 5–7 mg/day (P=0.008 and P=0.03, respectively). These

changes were abolished by an additional 80 mg d{alpha}-tocopherol/day.

This study indicates that increasing dietary levels of PUFA to 15% may

adversely affect some indices of DNA stability. However, increasing

the dietary intake of vitamin E by 80 mg/day ameliorates the damaging

effects of PUFA.—on, A. McE., , A. R., Duthie, S. J.,

Wahle, K. W. J., Duthie, G. G. The effect of increased intakes of

polyunsaturated fatty acids and vitamin E on DNA damage in human

lymphocytes.

Here's another:

Polyunsaturated fatty acids partially reproduce the role of

melanocytes in the epidermal melanin unit.

Cario-Andre M, Briganti S, Picardo M, Nikaido O, de Verneuil H, Taieb A.

INSERM E0217, Universite Victor Segalen Bordeaux II, 146 rue Leo

Saignat, 33076 Bordeaux cedex, France.

The incidence rate of melanoma is higher in fair-skinned than in

dark-skinned individuals. In negroid skin there is more eumelanin

which is present in all skin layers and fewer polyunsaturated fatty

acids (PUFA) than in caucasoid skin. The western diet, which is rich

in omega-6 polyunsaturated fatty acids, is associated with more

proneness to cancer including cutaneous melanoma. To study the

respective influence of omega-6 PUFA and low phototype melanocytes on

redox status -basal and following UV irradiation-, we used epidermal

reconstructs. The addition of polyunsaturated fatty acids as well as

the presence of low phototype melanocytes affected basal status

similarly except for catalase activity, which decreased significantly

in polyunsaturated fatty acid-supplemented reconstructs. Following UV,

polyunsaturated fatty acids and low phototype melanocytes increased

lipid and protein oxidative damage without affecting direct DNA

damage. However, polyunsaturated fatty acids increased epidermal

apoptosis whereas low phototype melanocytes decreased it. Since our

data suggest that an omega-6 PUFA rich-diet may increase oxidative

damage in melanocytes without inducing apoptosis, the long-term net

outcome could be cumulated mutations and an increased risk of skin

cancer, especially melanoma.

PMID: 15740592 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

So that if PUFA intake increases cholesterol production while

decreasing plasma levels, could we not venture to guess that the need

for increased cholelesterol migh not be, as a reaction to rapid

peroxidation (since PUFAs are so damaging), antioxidative? How else do

we explain it?

>

>

> [ ] Re: Starch, Monounsaturated Fats and

Prostate Cancer

>

>

> Yes, it's hard to get around the fact that despite the disadvantanges

> brought about by PUFA consumption, there is long standing scientific

> evidence regarding benefits when it comes to cadio-vascular health.

> PUFAs lower plasma cholesterol. But -curiously- (according to the

> following reviewer) it does seem to increase cholesterol biosynthesis.

> Why???

>

> Regulation of cholesterol biosynthesis by diet in humans

>

> PJ

> School of Dietetics and Human Nutrition, Faculty of Agricultural and

> Environmental Sciences, McGill University, Ste-Anne-de-Bellevue,

> Quebec, Canada. jonesp@...

>

> Biosynthesis of cholesterol represents a major input into whole-body

> pools; however, its regulation has been difficult to study in humans

> because of limitations in methodologies. The present objectives are to

> compare available techniques for measuring this process and examine

> how dietary factors alter human cholesterol biosynthesis. Review of

> existing techniques suggests that mass isotopomer distribution

> analysis and deuterium incorporation approaches offer advantages over

> other methods. Dietary factors influencing human cholesterol synthesis

> include energy restriction, meal frequency, dietary fat type, and

> cholesterol and phytosterol content. Food deprivation for as short as

> 24 h results in almost complete cessation of cholesterol biosynthesis.

> Similarly, increased meal frequency patterns are associated with a

> substantial depression in synthesis. In contrast, consumption of oils

> rich in polyunsaturated fatty acids, despite reducing circulating

> concentrations, increases the cholesterol synthesis rate compared with

> other fats. Stepwise addition of dietary cholesterol is associated

> with only a modest decline in cholesterogenesis while raising plasma

> concentrations slightly. It can be concluded that synthesis, as a

> contributor to circulating cholesterol concentrations, is sensitive to

> many dietary factors. Energy deprivation results in the greatest

> decline in synthesis, likely accounting for the beneficial decline in

> circulating cholesterol concentrations observed with weight loss.

>

> Does anyone have any input? Studies on cholesterol biosynthesis are

> hard to come across but would seem more promising in furnishing

> essential clues to bring us out of these apparent contradictions. If

> the body makes more cholesterol following consumption of PUFA, but

> presents lower plasma levels of the stuff, doesn't that mean that it

> is somehow using it up because a need for it has been created? Is that

> good? A protective reaction offsetting the effects of some deleterious

> factor???

>

> http://www.ajcn.org/cgi/content/abstract/66/2/438

>

> Way out at sea on this one...

>

[Guest guest]

> Perhaps the important point:

> " Energy deprivation results in the greatest decline in synthesis,

likely accounting for the beneficial decline in circulating

cholesterol concentrations observed with weight loss. "

An important point to be sure. But what this effect brought about in

such a short time can mean on overall health status I am not qualified

to guess as long as high cholesterol is in itself considered (by

association) a risk factor and not just a marker for artherosclerosis

or for anything else for that matter. If considered a marker such a

decrease would mean nothing as we know for sure that sclerotic

artheries are not made well in 24 hours. All that would be proven is

that plama cholesterol levels are sensitive to dietary factors. How

far does this get us?

> What causes the liver to make more that we would think necessary? dunno.

Neither do I. But I am mightily tempted to be consequential. There are

numerous studies out there which establish the peroxidative effects of

PUFAs on different tissues. Here's one:

The effect of increased intakes of polyunsaturated fatty acids and

vitamin E on DNA damage in human lymphocytes

A. McE. JENKINSON1, A. R. COLLINS, S. J. DUTHIE, K. W. J. WAHLE and G.

G. DUTHIE

Rowett Research Institute, Bucksburn, Aberdeen, Scotland, U.K. AB21 9SB

1Correspondence: Rowett Research Institute, Greenburn Rd., Bucksburn,

Aberdeen, Scotland, U.K. AB21 9SB. E-mail: aj@...

ABSTRACT

The effect of increasing dietary intakes of polyunsaturated fatty

acids (PUFAs) and vitamin E on indices of oxidative DNA damage was

investigated. Twenty-one healthy male, nonsmokers aged 28.9 ± 1.3

years participated in a free-living, split plot/change over trial in

which half the volunteers consumed diets containing 5% PUFA as food

energy for 4 wk and, after a 10 wk washout period, consumed a 15% PUFA

diet for another 4 wk. The other volunteers followed an identical

protocol, except that they consumed the 15% PUFA diet first. The diets

were provided to volunteers either with or without an additional 80 mg

d{alpha}-tocopherol acetate/day; otherwise total fat, carbohydrates,

protein, and basal vitamin E contents remained unchanged. DNA damage

induced by 200 µM H2O2 in lymphocytes from volunteers as well as

endogenous DNA damage in the form of oxidized pyrimidines, measured by

alkaline single-cell gel electrophoresis (the comet assay),

significantly decreased after consumption of the 5% PUFA diet (P<0.001

and P=0.01, respectively), but significantly increased after

consumption of the 15% PUFA diet when {alpha}-tocopherol levels were

in the range of 5–7 mg/day (P=0.008 and P=0.03, respectively). These

changes were abolished by an additional 80 mg d{alpha}-tocopherol/day.

This study indicates that increasing dietary levels of PUFA to 15% may

adversely affect some indices of DNA stability. However, increasing

the dietary intake of vitamin E by 80 mg/day ameliorates the damaging

effects of PUFA.—on, A. McE., , A. R., Duthie, S. J.,

Wahle, K. W. J., Duthie, G. G. The effect of increased intakes of

polyunsaturated fatty acids and vitamin E on DNA damage in human

lymphocytes.

Here's another:

Polyunsaturated fatty acids partially reproduce the role of

melanocytes in the epidermal melanin unit.

Cario-Andre M, Briganti S, Picardo M, Nikaido O, de Verneuil H, Taieb A.

INSERM E0217, Universite Victor Segalen Bordeaux II, 146 rue Leo

Saignat, 33076 Bordeaux cedex, France.

The incidence rate of melanoma is higher in fair-skinned than in

dark-skinned individuals. In negroid skin there is more eumelanin

which is present in all skin layers and fewer polyunsaturated fatty

acids (PUFA) than in caucasoid skin. The western diet, which is rich

in omega-6 polyunsaturated fatty acids, is associated with more

proneness to cancer including cutaneous melanoma. To study the

respective influence of omega-6 PUFA and low phototype melanocytes on

redox status -basal and following UV irradiation-, we used epidermal

reconstructs. The addition of polyunsaturated fatty acids as well as

the presence of low phototype melanocytes affected basal status

similarly except for catalase activity, which decreased significantly

in polyunsaturated fatty acid-supplemented reconstructs. Following UV,

polyunsaturated fatty acids and low phototype melanocytes increased

lipid and protein oxidative damage without affecting direct DNA

damage. However, polyunsaturated fatty acids increased epidermal

apoptosis whereas low phototype melanocytes decreased it. Since our

data suggest that an omega-6 PUFA rich-diet may increase oxidative

damage in melanocytes without inducing apoptosis, the long-term net

outcome could be cumulated mutations and an increased risk of skin

cancer, especially melanoma.

PMID: 15740592 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

So that if PUFA intake increases cholesterol production while

decreasing plasma levels, could we not venture to guess that the need

for increased cholelesterol migh not be, as a reaction to rapid

peroxidation (since PUFAs are so damaging), antioxidative? How else do

we explain it?

>

>

> [ ] Re: Starch, Monounsaturated Fats and

Prostate Cancer

>

>

> Yes, it's hard to get around the fact that despite the disadvantanges

> brought about by PUFA consumption, there is long standing scientific

> evidence regarding benefits when it comes to cadio-vascular health.

> PUFAs lower plasma cholesterol. But -curiously- (according to the

> following reviewer) it does seem to increase cholesterol biosynthesis.

> Why???

>

> Regulation of cholesterol biosynthesis by diet in humans

>

> PJ

> School of Dietetics and Human Nutrition, Faculty of Agricultural and

> Environmental Sciences, McGill University, Ste-Anne-de-Bellevue,

> Quebec, Canada. jonesp@...

>

> Biosynthesis of cholesterol represents a major input into whole-body

> pools; however, its regulation has been difficult to study in humans

> because of limitations in methodologies. The present objectives are to

> compare available techniques for measuring this process and examine

> how dietary factors alter human cholesterol biosynthesis. Review of

> existing techniques suggests that mass isotopomer distribution

> analysis and deuterium incorporation approaches offer advantages over

> other methods. Dietary factors influencing human cholesterol synthesis

> include energy restriction, meal frequency, dietary fat type, and

> cholesterol and phytosterol content. Food deprivation for as short as

> 24 h results in almost complete cessation of cholesterol biosynthesis.

> Similarly, increased meal frequency patterns are associated with a

> substantial depression in synthesis. In contrast, consumption of oils

> rich in polyunsaturated fatty acids, despite reducing circulating

> concentrations, increases the cholesterol synthesis rate compared with

> other fats. Stepwise addition of dietary cholesterol is associated

> with only a modest decline in cholesterogenesis while raising plasma

> concentrations slightly. It can be concluded that synthesis, as a

> contributor to circulating cholesterol concentrations, is sensitive to

> many dietary factors. Energy deprivation results in the greatest

> decline in synthesis, likely accounting for the beneficial decline in

> circulating cholesterol concentrations observed with weight loss.

>

> Does anyone have any input? Studies on cholesterol biosynthesis are

> hard to come across but would seem more promising in furnishing

> essential clues to bring us out of these apparent contradictions. If

> the body makes more cholesterol following consumption of PUFA, but

> presents lower plasma levels of the stuff, doesn't that mean that it

> is somehow using it up because a need for it has been created? Is that

> good? A protective reaction offsetting the effects of some deleterious

> factor???

>

> http://www.ajcn.org/cgi/content/abstract/66/2/438

>

> Way out at sea on this one...

>

[Guest guest]

Hi JW:

Interesting that they induce hypertriglyceridemia by feeding a 10%

solution of fructose to the rats. Do we know if it has the same

effect on humans? If so then it does cast doubt on the health

properties of some fruits.

Rodney.

--- In , " jwwright " <jwwright@...>

wrote:

>

> Here's an interesting treatise on cholesterol tests.

> http://library.usask.ca/theses/available/etd-01232006-

123919/unrestricted/g_woo.pdf

>

>

> Regards.

> [ ] Re: Starch, Monounsaturated Fats and

Prostate Cancer

>

>

> --- In , " jwwright " <jwwright@>

wrote:

>

> > Perhaps the important point:

> > " Energy deprivation results in the greatest decline in

synthesis,

> likely accounting for the beneficial decline in circulating

> cholesterol concentrations observed with weight loss. "

>

> An important point to be sure. But what this effect brought about

in

> such a short time can mean on overall health status I am not

qualified

> to guess as long as high cholesterol is in itself considered (by

> association) a risk factor and not just a marker for

artherosclerosis

> or for anything else for that matter. If considered a marker such

a

> decrease would mean nothing as we know for sure that sclerotic

> artheries are not made well in 24 hours. All that would be proven

is

> that plama cholesterol levels are sensitive to dietary factors.

How

> far does this get us?

>

>

> > What causes the liver to make more that we would think

necessary? dunno.

> Neither do I. But I am mightily tempted to be consequential.

There are

> numerous studies out there which establish the peroxidative

effects of

> PUFAs on different tissues. Here's one:

>

[Guest guest]

Hi JW:

Interesting that they induce hypertriglyceridemia by feeding a 10%

solution of fructose to the rats. Do we know if it has the same

effect on humans? If so then it does cast doubt on the health

properties of some fruits.

Rodney.

--- In , " jwwright " <jwwright@...>

wrote:

>

> Here's an interesting treatise on cholesterol tests.

> http://library.usask.ca/theses/available/etd-01232006-

123919/unrestricted/g_woo.pdf

>

>

> Regards.

> [ ] Re: Starch, Monounsaturated Fats and

Prostate Cancer

>

>

> --- In , " jwwright " <jwwright@>

wrote:

>

> > Perhaps the important point:

> > " Energy deprivation results in the greatest decline in

synthesis,

> likely accounting for the beneficial decline in circulating

> cholesterol concentrations observed with weight loss. "

>

> An important point to be sure. But what this effect brought about

in

> such a short time can mean on overall health status I am not

qualified

> to guess as long as high cholesterol is in itself considered (by

> association) a risk factor and not just a marker for

artherosclerosis

> or for anything else for that matter. If considered a marker such

a

> decrease would mean nothing as we know for sure that sclerotic

> artheries are not made well in 24 hours. All that would be proven

is

> that plama cholesterol levels are sensitive to dietary factors.

How

> far does this get us?

>

>

> > What causes the liver to make more that we would think

necessary? dunno.

> Neither do I. But I am mightily tempted to be consequential.

There are

> numerous studies out there which establish the peroxidative

effects of

> PUFAs on different tissues. Here's one:

>

[Guest guest]

Hi JW:

From a very long time back (1960s) I have been under the (mistaken I

wonder?) impression that signifcant exercise quite quickly depletes

cholesterol. Until the next high fat meal.

But it doesn't really matter much if one is not eating a

cholesterolemic diet in the first place.

Rodney.

> >

> > Here's an interesting treatise on cholesterol tests.

> > http://library.usask.ca/theses/available/etd-01232006-

> 123919/unrestricted/g_woo.pdf

> >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Hi JW:

From a very long time back (1960s) I have been under the (mistaken I

wonder?) impression that signifcant exercise quite quickly depletes

cholesterol. Until the next high fat meal.

But it doesn't really matter much if one is not eating a

cholesterolemic diet in the first place.

Rodney.

> >

> > Here's an interesting treatise on cholesterol tests.

> > http://library.usask.ca/theses/available/etd-01232006-

> 123919/unrestricted/g_woo.pdf

> >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

> > >

> > > Here's an interesting treatise on cholesterol tests.

> > > http://library.usask.ca/theses/available/etd-01232006-

> > 123919/unrestricted/g_woo.pdf

> > >

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

> > >

> > > Here's an interesting treatise on cholesterol tests.

> > > http://library.usask.ca/theses/available/etd-01232006-

> > 123919/unrestricted/g_woo.pdf

> > >

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Christian:

Just to be clear about what you are saying here: Is it your belief

that there are different TYPES of fructose? ...... " and type of

fructose in fruit are very different. " ....... i.e. that there are

fructoses with different chemical formulae some of which are more

harmful than others? And are you saying that the type of fructose in

fruit is different from the type of fructose in HFCS?

If you are, then some details about the differences would be helpful

and what the evidence is about their relevant harmfulness.

Rodney.

> > >

> > > Here's an interesting treatise on cholesterol

> > tests.

> > >

> >

> http://library.usask.ca/theses/available/etd-01232006-

> > 123919/unrestricted/g_woo.pdf

> > >

> > >

> >

>

>

> ------------------------------------------------

> c_bonanno@...

> http://calorierestrictionexperiment.blogspot.com/

>

> __________________________________________________

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Christian:

Just to be clear about what you are saying here: Is it your belief

that there are different TYPES of fructose? ...... " and type of

fructose in fruit are very different. " ....... i.e. that there are

fructoses with different chemical formulae some of which are more

harmful than others? And are you saying that the type of fructose in

fruit is different from the type of fructose in HFCS?

If you are, then some details about the differences would be helpful

and what the evidence is about their relevant harmfulness.

Rodney.

> > >

> > > Here's an interesting treatise on cholesterol

> > tests.

> > >

> >

> http://library.usask.ca/theses/available/etd-01232006-

> > 123919/unrestricted/g_woo.pdf

> > >

> > >

> >

>

>

> ------------------------------------------------

> c_bonanno@...

> http://calorierestrictionexperiment.blogspot.com/

>

> __________________________________________________

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Christian:

Also worth noting that fructose has a **low** glycemic index -

between 11 and 25 - according to this site which appears

authoritative:

http://www.glycemicindex.com/

Rodney.

> > >

> > > Here's an interesting treatise on cholesterol

> > tests.

> > >

> >

> http://library.usask.ca/theses/available/etd-01232006-

> > 123919/unrestricted/g_woo.pdf

> > >

> > >

> >

>

>

> ------------------------------------------------

> c_bonanno@...

> http://calorierestrictionexperiment.blogspot.com/

>

> __________________________________________________

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Christian:

Also worth noting that fructose has a **low** glycemic index -

between 11 and 25 - according to this site which appears

authoritative:

http://www.glycemicindex.com/

Rodney.

> > >

> > > Here's an interesting treatise on cholesterol

> > tests.

> > >

> >

> http://library.usask.ca/theses/available/etd-01232006-

> > 123919/unrestricted/g_woo.pdf

> > >

> > >

> >

>

>

> ------------------------------------------------

> c_bonanno@...

> http://calorierestrictionexperiment.blogspot.com/

>

> __________________________________________________

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Christian:

Thanks for those links. The reason for my interest in this topic is

that I would like to get a much better idea about the health

attributes of fructose specifically. I had found it interesting that

feeding a solution of fructose to mice was done for the purpose of

causing hypertriglyceridemia, and I was not aware that fructose would

have a similar effect in humans.

It seems to me that there are some advantages and some disadvantages

of fructose for humans. The biggest disadvantage for the people at

this support group is, of course, that it is fairly calorically

dense. Are there others?

It has some advantages: it is a significant component of many fruits,

which most people believe to be healthy .... I am less enthusiastic

about many fruits than some others, but is that lack of enthusiasm

justified? Also fructose supplies appreciably greater sweetening

capacity for the same number of calories than either sucrose or

glucose, so less can be used; It has a very low GI and GL compared

with most other foods - but I am unsure if this really matters; there

is at least one study which showed a sizeable, 49%, reduction in

incidence of prostate cancer among people who consumed more fructose

(PMID: 9458087); and there have been several empirical studies posted

here in the past couple of years that suggest starch is not entirely

hazard-free. So if some of one's energy intake is going to be in the

form of carbohydrates perhaps some of it should be empty-calorie

fructose in preference to empty-calorie starch unless, naturally,

there are powerful reasons to avoid the fructose.

So the question I have at the back of my mind is: " What serious

evidence is there that fructose consumption truly is associated with

adverse health outcomes in humans? " If there is such evidence we

should presumably be making a point not only of avoiding HFCS (of

which the glucose content is bad enough) but also of avoiding the

fruits that have a significant fructose content. But if there is no

such evidence then perhaps frucose is preferable to starch.

Not many people here recommend avoiding fruits generally. Nor have I

seen any data relating to the fructose content of various fruits as a

way of deciding which fruits are preferable. Although I have come to

the conclusion that berries are probably far preferable to the fruits

one comes across most frequently in grocery stores.

Do you see where I am coming from?

Rodney.

> > > > >

> > > > > Here's an interesting treatise on

> > cholesterol

> > > > tests.

> > > > >

> > > >

> > >

> >

> http://library.usask.ca/theses/available/etd-01232006-

> > > > 123919/unrestricted/g_woo.pdf

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > >

> > >

> > >

> > > ------------------------------------------------

> > > c_bonanno@

> > > http://calorierestrictionexperiment.blogspot.com/

> > >

> > > __________________________________________________

> > >

[Guest guest]

Hi Christian:

Thanks for those links. The reason for my interest in this topic is

that I would like to get a much better idea about the health

attributes of fructose specifically. I had found it interesting that

feeding a solution of fructose to mice was done for the purpose of

causing hypertriglyceridemia, and I was not aware that fructose would

have a similar effect in humans.

It seems to me that there are some advantages and some disadvantages

of fructose for humans. The biggest disadvantage for the people at

this support group is, of course, that it is fairly calorically

dense. Are there others?

It has some advantages: it is a significant component of many fruits,

which most people believe to be healthy .... I am less enthusiastic

about many fruits than some others, but is that lack of enthusiasm

justified? Also fructose supplies appreciably greater sweetening

capacity for the same number of calories than either sucrose or

glucose, so less can be used; It has a very low GI and GL compared

with most other foods - but I am unsure if this really matters; there

is at least one study which showed a sizeable, 49%, reduction in

incidence of prostate cancer among people who consumed more fructose

(PMID: 9458087); and there have been several empirical studies posted

here in the past couple of years that suggest starch is not entirely

hazard-free. So if some of one's energy intake is going to be in the

form of carbohydrates perhaps some of it should be empty-calorie

fructose in preference to empty-calorie starch unless, naturally,

there are powerful reasons to avoid the fructose.

So the question I have at the back of my mind is: " What serious

evidence is there that fructose consumption truly is associated with

adverse health outcomes in humans? " If there is such evidence we

should presumably be making a point not only of avoiding HFCS (of

which the glucose content is bad enough) but also of avoiding the

fruits that have a significant fructose content. But if there is no

such evidence then perhaps frucose is preferable to starch.

Not many people here recommend avoiding fruits generally. Nor have I

seen any data relating to the fructose content of various fruits as a

way of deciding which fruits are preferable. Although I have come to

the conclusion that berries are probably far preferable to the fruits

one comes across most frequently in grocery stores.

Do you see where I am coming from?

Rodney.

> > > > >

> > > > > Here's an interesting treatise on

> > cholesterol

> > > > tests.

> > > > >

> > > >

> > >

> >

> http://library.usask.ca/theses/available/etd-01232006-

> > > > 123919/unrestricted/g_woo.pdf

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > >

> > >

> > >

> > > ------------------------------------------------

> > > c_bonanno@

> > > http://calorierestrictionexperiment.blogspot.com/

> > >

> > > __________________________________________________

> > >