Re: HELP - I want to make thick yogurt!

[Guest guest]

Suze,

Thank you so much for replying. I would love to give this a try, unfortunately

though I have not found the time yet to make kefir. Many customers have asked

for it and I would love to give it a try. So........ for a complete idiot

concerning kefir - could you (or anyone else) suggest a good place to start? I

know this thread has been covered here in the past, but I didn't take the time

to pay attention

Janet

RE: HELP - I want to make thick yogurt!

>>>>I've been making and selling " raw " yogurt in our farm store - more than

10 gallons a week now. I use " warm from the cow " milk without heating it,

add the starter yogurt and let it set in a temperature controlled (87

degrees) overnight - or 12 hours. The flavor is outstanding, but the

consistency is like - excuse the term - snot! It's runny and slimy and

won't stay on a spoon. It's more like a drinkable, slimy yogurt.

-------->janet, i'm not sure if i can be very helpful, but i used to make

raw yogurt and it definitely had some serious polysaccharide " slimeyness "

going on. i refer to it as " gooey " and *i* just happen to love it that way

:-) in any case, i think (but am not certain) that it's one of the

fermenting bacteria, or combination of fermenting bacteria that make these

slimey strands. however, my *kefirized* raw milk doesn't have any of that

slimeyness at_all and it is thick like yogurt. kefir has a lot of the same

bacteria that yogurt does (and then some!) but i don't think it has

bulgaricus nor bifidus like yogurt (at least not according to the list of

kefir bacteria on dom's site).

so....maybe if you added a little homemade kefir to your yogurt when you

first culture it, perhaps some of the bacteria/yeasts in the kefir will

*process* the slimey polysaccharide strands in the yogurt that are produced

by the yogurt bacteria? i have no idea if this would work, but it would be

an interesting experiment! and you would be *improving* the health benefits

and the microbial profile of the product. of course, it would no longer be

purely " yogurt " but maybe your customers wouldn't mind if it came out thick,

yummy and had a few extra probiotics to boot?

well, it may not be the type of solution you're looking for, but i couldn't

pass up the suggestion of an amalgam of cultures - which always seems to

have interesting results, if nothing more :-)

Suze Fisher

Lapdog Design, Inc.

Web Design & Development

http://members.bellatlantic.net/~vze3shjg/

mailto:s.fisher22@...

[Guest guest]

>>>>I've been making and selling " raw " yogurt in our farm store - more than

10 gallons a week now. I use " warm from the cow " milk without heating it,

add the starter yogurt and let it set in a temperature controlled (87

degrees) overnight - or 12 hours. The flavor is outstanding, but the

consistency is like - excuse the term - snot! It's runny and slimy and

won't stay on a spoon. It's more like a drinkable, slimy yogurt.

-------->janet, i'm not sure if i can be very helpful, but i used to make

raw yogurt and it definitely had some serious polysaccharide " slimeyness "

going on. i refer to it as " gooey " and *i* just happen to love it that way

:-) in any case, i think (but am not certain) that it's one of the

fermenting bacteria, or combination of fermenting bacteria that make these

slimey strands. however, my *kefirized* raw milk doesn't have any of that

slimeyness at_all and it is thick like yogurt. kefir has a lot of the same

bacteria that yogurt does (and then some!) but i don't think it has

bulgaricus nor bifidus like yogurt (at least not according to the list of

kefir bacteria on dom's site).

so....maybe if you added a little homemade kefir to your yogurt when you

first culture it, perhaps some of the bacteria/yeasts in the kefir will

*process* the slimey polysaccharide strands in the yogurt that are produced

by the yogurt bacteria? i have no idea if this would work, but it would be

an interesting experiment! and you would be *improving* the health benefits

and the microbial profile of the product. of course, it would no longer be

purely " yogurt " but maybe your customers wouldn't mind if it came out thick,

yummy and had a few extra probiotics to boot?

well, it may not be the type of solution you're looking for, but i couldn't

pass up the suggestion of an amalgam of cultures - which always seems to

have interesting results, if nothing more :-)

Suze Fisher

Lapdog Design, Inc.

Web Design & Development

http://members.bellatlantic.net/~vze3shjg/

mailto:s.fisher22@...

[Guest guest]

>>>>Thank you so much for replying. I would love to give this a try,

unfortunately though I have not found the time yet to make kefir. Many

customers have asked for it and I would love to give it a try. So........

for a complete idiot concerning kefir - could you (or anyone else) suggest a

good place to start?

-------->kefir is even easier and quicker to make than yogurt. I just made

two batches in about 2 minutes. all i did was scoop the kefir grains out of

two quart ball jars, plunk them in two empty ball jars, poured a little of

the cultured kefir in each jar, then filled to the top with raw milk. voila!

done. i'll harvest those new batches tomorrow morning.

i got my grains from GEM cultures in CA. they are super grains! i've gotten

grains from dom too, but they never took off. so, my personal preference is

for GEM grains (which were originally from dom a long time ago), or to get

them from someone who got them from dom or gem. i've got people here locally

waiting for my grains so i don't have any to share online at the moment, but

maybe someone else does?

for all that you ever wanted to know about kefir, visit dom's site:

http://users.chariot.net.au/~dna/kefirpage.html

Suze Fisher

Lapdog Design, Inc.

Web Design & Development

http://members.bellatlantic.net/~vze3shjg/

mailto:s.fisher22@...

[Guest guest]

Janet-

>Do any of you have suggestions or ideas? Has anyone experimented with

>this? I'm becoming very frustrated but will continue to search until I

>find a solution. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

How about trying a higher culturing temperature, 100-105 degrees. That's

more the optimum range for yoghurt.

-

[Guest guest]

Janet,

> I've considered trying pectin, but have not been able to find a

reliable source or find any information on using it in Yogurt.

Redwood Hill (goat milk yogurt) uses pectin in their yogurt, so maybe

they could provide you info. Last I checked (a year ago?) they

weren't yet organic, but were intending to become so.

Their website: www.redwoodhill.com and their phone #: 707-823-8250

[Guest guest]

Janet,

>I've considered trying pectin, but have not been able to find a reliable

source or find any information on using it in Yogurt.  I >would like to

keep my

yogurt completely raw and organic and still be able to thicken it somewhat.

Here <http://www.permaculture.net/Pomona>http://www.permaculture.net/Pomona/

you can order Pomona's pectin from a county business. Its the purest and

safest

I know of.

Wanita

[Guest guest]

>It's runny and slimy and won't stay on a spoon. It's more like a drinkable,

slimy yogurt.

Well, you see, that is viili! So you just tell your customers that it is Finnish

yogurt!

Seriously though, I don't know what you'd do either. The amount of

polysaccharide

depends on the kind of bacteria, and you seem to have one high in

polysaccharide. You can try " innoculating " the milk with a different bacteria,

but then that defeats the purpose. Or changing the temp slightly. The slimy

bacteria seem to like it colder.

Using pectin as someone suggested

sounds good too, but if your slime is like mine, it doesn't go away easily.

My kefiili we just run through the blender, then it is like milk again, but

actually

folks have gotten to liking the texture.

-- Heidi

[Guest guest]

Thanks Suze - I might just take up Kefir making and give this a try. I'm

willing to try about anything at this point

Janet

RE: HELP - I want to make thick yogurt!

>>>>I've been making and selling " raw " yogurt in our farm store - more than

10 gallons a week now. I use " warm from the cow " milk without heating it,

add the starter yogurt and let it set in a temperature controlled (87

degrees) overnight - or 12 hours. The flavor is outstanding, but the

consistency is like - excuse the term - snot! It's runny and slimy and

won't stay on a spoon. It's more like a drinkable, slimy yogurt.

-------->janet, i'm not sure if i can be very helpful, but i used to make

raw yogurt and it definitely had some serious polysaccharide " slimeyness "

going on. i refer to it as " gooey " and *i* just happen to love it that way

:-) in any case, i think (but am not certain) that it's one of the

fermenting bacteria, or combination of fermenting bacteria that make these

slimey strands. however, my *kefirized* raw milk doesn't have any of that

slimeyness at_all and it is thick like yogurt. kefir has a lot of the same

bacteria that yogurt does (and then some!) but i don't think it has

bulgaricus nor bifidus like yogurt (at least not according to the list of

kefir bacteria on dom's site).

so....maybe if you added a little homemade kefir to your yogurt when you

first culture it, perhaps some of the bacteria/yeasts in the kefir will

*process* the slimey polysaccharide strands in the yogurt that are produced

by the yogurt bacteria? i have no idea if this would work, but it would be

an interesting experiment! and you would be *improving* the health benefits

and the microbial profile of the product. of course, it would no longer be

purely " yogurt " but maybe your customers wouldn't mind if it came out thick,

yummy and had a few extra probiotics to boot?

well, it may not be the type of solution you're looking for, but i couldn't

pass up the suggestion of an amalgam of cultures - which always seems to

have interesting results, if nothing more :-)

Suze Fisher

Lapdog Design, Inc.

Web Design & Development

http://members.bellatlantic.net/~vze3shjg/

mailto:s.fisher22@...

[Guest guest]

- I would love to try raising the temp, but don't know if my waterbed

heater will go that high. We have quite the contraption set up for making

yogurt (and Kombucha) using the heater works great. I'll try to turn the temp

up and see what happens.

Janet

Re: HELP - I want to make thick yogurt!

Janet-

>Do any of you have suggestions or ideas? Has anyone experimented with

>this? I'm becoming very frustrated but will continue to search until I

>find a solution. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

How about trying a higher culturing temperature, 100-105 degrees. That's

more the optimum range for yoghurt.

-

[Guest guest]

Thank you Wanita, this is very interesting! I've never heard of the Pomona

brand before.

Janet

Re: HELP - I want to make thick yogurt!

Janet,

>I've considered trying pectin, but have not been able to find a reliable

source or find any information on using it in Yogurt. I >would like to

keep my

yogurt completely raw and organic and still be able to thicken it somewhat.

Here <http://www.permaculture.net/Pomona>http://www.permaculture.net/Pomona/

you can order Pomona's pectin from a county business. Its the purest and

safest

I know of.

Wanita

[Guest guest]

Heidi,

I have tried blending the yogurt when it's finished, and it turns to a

" thickened milk " consistency. I myself don't mind it that way, in fact we do

sell it as a " drinkable yogurt " that the customers love. But, for those that

want the good old fashioned yogurt, I'm going to keep trying to make it thicker.

I guess I should study more on the polysaccharide and bacteria of yogurt, I

might be able to understand this a little better.

Thanks so much,

Janet

Re: HELP - I want to make thick yogurt!

>It's runny and slimy and won't stay on a spoon. It's more like a drinkable,

slimy yogurt.

Well, you see, that is viili! So you just tell your customers that it is Finnish

yogurt!

Seriously though, I don't know what you'd do either. The amount of

polysaccharide

depends on the kind of bacteria, and you seem to have one high in

polysaccharide. You can try " innoculating " the milk with a different bacteria,

but then that defeats the purpose. Or changing the temp slightly. The slimy

bacteria seem to like it colder.

Using pectin as someone suggested

sounds good too, but if your slime is like mine, it doesn't go away easily.

My kefiili we just run through the blender, then it is like milk again, but

actually

folks have gotten to liking the texture.

-- Heidi

[Guest guest]

On Sunday, July 6, 2003, at 03:52 PM, Wayne and Janet Brunner wrote:

> Thank you Wanita, this is very interesting! I've never heard of the

> Pomona brand before.

Pomona's is great, when I made jam it's all I ever used if I added

pectin at all.

Lynn S.

-----

Lynn Siprelle * Writer, Mother, Programmer, Fiber Artisan

The New Homemaker: http://www.newhomemaker.com/

Siprelle & Associates: http://www.siprelle.com/

[Guest guest]

Hi Janet

I have been making raw yoghurt every week for the past 8 months now

so maybe I can offer some thoughts. We are able to buy organic raw

milk from jersey cows in Australia so the ingredients should be

similar to yours. I heat the milk to 38 degress C, add the starter

and keep it at this temp for 8 hours. The flavour is excellent.

Before I store the yoghurt in the fridge I strain it through a hand

held kitchen strainer ie I pour the yoghurt mixture into the

strainer, give it a gentle shake from side to side and seperate some

of the whey from the yoghurt (I keep the whey for soaking and

drinking), then pour the strained (thicker) mixture into a seperate

container. This can also be done by letting the yoghurt mixture sit

in a fridge overnight and some whey will seperate from the yoghurt,

then just pour it off. Once we have the strained thick mixture ready,

we blend it with a hand mixer and viola, thick raw yoghurt, YUM.

Regards

M

[Guest guest]

Janet

The top few inches are very yellow when I make it also.

I find by leaving it overnight in the fridge it seperates well enough

to pour off the excess whey.

Good luck.

M

PS I use 38 degress C because I thought this was the body temp of a

cow. Is this right?

[Guest guest]

---Janet, How's the yogurt doing by now? I'd first, decide if it's

worth the trouble to make a " different " yogurt. Adding thickeners is

what they do in the factories to prevent syneresis (the whey from

separating from the curd). I think you'll have to go to 102F+/-

processing to get non- " snot " like yogurt and, probably, use a

commercial starter culture on each batch rather than using a mother

culture (innoculating from the previous " snot like " batch) so to

speak. To get the same nearly identical product each batch you'll

have to pocess nearly the same way each batch (eliminate as many

variables as you can between batches). As someone indicated you can

strain or pour off the whey but that's a lot of extra processing and

you'll probably still have " snot-like " yogurt. Texture is most

likely a function of processing temp. and bacteria/microorganisms

present in each batch. I think if I were selling yogurt I'd warm

milk to 100F to 103F and maintain that temp till done. And possibly

even pasteurize before adding culture to eliminate variables. Dennis

In , " Janet Brunner " <wajabrun@n...>

wrote:

> Hello Folks,

> I've been making and selling " raw " yogurt in our farm store - more

than 10 gallons a week now. I use " warm from the cow " milk without

heating it, add the starter yogurt and let it set in a temperature

controlled (87 degrees) overnight - or 12 hours. The flavor is

outstanding, but the consistency is like - excuse the term - snot!

It's runny and slimy and won't stay on a spoon. It's more like a

drinkable, slimy yogurt.

>

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