Guest guest Posted May 14, 2003 Report Share Posted May 14, 2003 Hi Ian, we use the good old Neil on for the purposes you describe, recently we have completed casualty extraction exercises from the top of tanks/inside vessels on the platform and have found these to be better than the paraguard. regards Neil Poole " Sharpe, Ian R. " <iars@...> 14/05/2003 07:02 Please respond to cc: Subject: Rescue From Height Hi All, I'm looking for some information or rather picking the collective brains of everyone. As most of you know I've just started a new project and currently we have no means of rescue from height, scaffold, oil and gas production modules etc. I'm trying to get a head start and help procurement with some advice. We immediately identified the paraguard but as we will have to buy 3 this is going to eat into a significant part of the budget (not good) Does anyone know or have experience of any cheaper alternatives that can provide the same level of imobilisation and similar capabilities. I thought about the MIBS from R & M but I'm not sure it would give us the level we need and I'm not convinced of its ability to work well with Ropes etc. Neil on was again a choice but I'm not a great fan of these either. For those of you thinking of MRT type things please remember that the people using these are going to be largely untrained aside from the training that we can give them. All information / ideas gratefully received, if you have websites all the better. Many Thanks Ian ---------------------------------------- Ian Sharpe (ISOS) Project Medical Services Manager PFD Tengiz Project. Tel +7 (8) 300 7187 212 Mail - iars@... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 14, 2003 Report Share Posted May 14, 2003 What about a combination of Stokes basket stretcher and scoop - works well when scoop is secured into the basket stretcher. Ferno model 71 or 71S works extremely well. Or for confined space then a SKED with a spine board. Struan Rescue From Height > Hi All, > > I'm looking for some information or rather picking the collective brains > of everyone. > > As most of you know I've just started a new project and currently we > have no means of rescue from height, scaffold, oil and gas production > modules etc. I'm trying to get a head start and help procurement with > some advice. We immediately identified the paraguard but as we will have > to buy 3 this is going to eat into a significant part of the budget (not > good) > > Does anyone know or have experience of any cheaper alternatives that can > provide the same level of imobilisation and similar capabilities. I > thought about the MIBS from R & M but I'm not sure it would give us the > level we need and I'm not convinced of its ability to work well with > Ropes etc. Neil on was again a choice but I'm not a great fan of > these either. For those of you thinking of MRT type things please > remember that the people using these are going to be largely untrained > aside from the training that we can give them. > > All information / ideas gratefully received, if you have websites all > the better. > > Many Thanks > > Ian > > ---------------------------------------- > Ian Sharpe (ISOS) > Project Medical Services Manager > PFD Tengiz Project. > > Tel +7 (8) 300 7187 212 > Mail - iars@... > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 14, 2003 Report Share Posted May 14, 2003 Hi Ian, Have to go with what Struan said. We make use of that technique quite often here in South Africa and it proves to be a safe and cost effective way of getting people down. Ben Rescue From Height Hi All, I'm looking for some information or rather picking the collective brains of everyone. As most of you know I've just started a new project and currently we have no means of rescue from height, scaffold, oil and gas production modules etc. I'm trying to get a head start and help procurement with some advice. We immediately identified the paraguard but as we will have to buy 3 this is going to eat into a significant part of the budget (not good) Does anyone know or have experience of any cheaper alternatives that can provide the same level of imobilisation and similar capabilities. I thought about the MIBS from R & M but I'm not sure it would give us the level we need and I'm not convinced of its ability to work well with Ropes etc. Neil on was again a choice but I'm not a great fan of these either. For those of you thinking of MRT type things please remember that the people using these are going to be largely untrained aside from the training that we can give them. All information / ideas gratefully received, if you have websites all the better. Many Thanks Ian ---------------------------------------- Ian Sharpe (ISOS) Project Medical Services Manager PFD Tengiz Project. Tel +7 (8) 300 7187 212 Mail - iars@... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 14, 2003 Report Share Posted May 14, 2003 Can Stokes basket be used in a vertical lift? Or must they remain horizontal? If so that's going to cause us a problem - Thanks Ian Re: Rescue From Height Importance: High What about a combination of Stokes basket stretcher and scoop - works well when scoop is secured into the basket stretcher. Ferno model 71 or 71S works extremely well. Or for confined space then a SKED with a spine board. Struan Rescue From Height > Hi All, > > I'm looking for some information or rather picking the collective > brains of everyone. > > As most of you know I've just started a new project and currently we > have no means of rescue from height, scaffold, oil and gas production > modules etc. I'm trying to get a head start and help procurement with > some advice. We immediately identified the paraguard but as we will > have to buy 3 this is going to eat into a significant part of the > budget (not > good) > > Does anyone know or have experience of any cheaper alternatives that > can provide the same level of imobilisation and similar capabilities. > I thought about the MIBS from R & M but I'm not sure it would give us > the level we need and I'm not convinced of its ability to work well > with Ropes etc. Neil on was again a choice but I'm not a great > fan of these either. For those of you thinking of MRT type things > please remember that the people using these are going to be largely > untrained aside from the training that we can give them. > > All information / ideas gratefully received, if you have websites all > the better. > > Many Thanks > > Ian > > ---------------------------------------- > Ian Sharpe (ISOS) > Project Medical Services Manager > PFD Tengiz Project. > > Tel +7 (8) 300 7187 212 > Mail - iars@... > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 14, 2003 Report Share Posted May 14, 2003 Something else I've thought of, the stokes seems to be pretty much the same as a Ferno basket but lighter? Rescue From Height Hi All, I'm looking for some information or rather picking the collective brains of everyone. As most of you know I've just started a new project and currently we have no means of rescue from height, scaffold, oil and gas production modules etc. I'm trying to get a head start and help procurement with some advice. We immediately identified the paraguard but as we will have to buy 3 this is going to eat into a significant part of the budget (not good) Does anyone know or have experience of any cheaper alternatives that can provide the same level of imobilisation and similar capabilities. I thought about the MIBS from R & M but I'm not sure it would give us the level we need and I'm not convinced of its ability to work well with Ropes etc. Neil on was again a choice but I'm not a great fan of these either. For those of you thinking of MRT type things please remember that the people using these are going to be largely untrained aside from the training that we can give them. All information / ideas gratefully received, if you have websites all the better. Many Thanks Ian ---------------------------------------- Ian Sharpe (ISOS) Project Medical Services Manager PFD Tengiz Project. Tel +7 (8) 300 7187 212 Mail - iars@... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 14, 2003 Report Share Posted May 14, 2003 I havent had the opportunity of working with the Ferno basket, but the stokes seems pretty light to me. Very easy to manoevre in elevated areas Rescue From Height Hi All, I'm looking for some information or rather picking the collective brains of everyone. As most of you know I've just started a new project and currently we have no means of rescue from height, scaffold, oil and gas production modules etc. I'm trying to get a head start and help procurement with some advice. We immediately identified the paraguard but as we will have to buy 3 this is going to eat into a significant part of the budget (not good) Does anyone know or have experience of any cheaper alternatives that can provide the same level of imobilisation and similar capabilities. I thought about the MIBS from R & M but I'm not sure it would give us the level we need and I'm not convinced of its ability to work well with Ropes etc. Neil on was again a choice but I'm not a great fan of these either. For those of you thinking of MRT type things please remember that the people using these are going to be largely untrained aside from the training that we can give them. All information / ideas gratefully received, if you have websites all the better. Many Thanks Ian ---------------------------------------- Ian Sharpe (ISOS) Project Medical Services Manager PFD Tengiz Project. Tel +7 (8) 300 7187 212 Mail - iars@... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 14, 2003 Report Share Posted May 14, 2003 Hi Ian, I know cost is important but if you are training locals, the best stretcher would indeed be the Paraguard. With the colour coded slings it offers a fool proof barrier. We also also have Trelleborg Paramedic stretchers onboard here, I can imagine those being more expensive than the Paraguards though. I hope you have some success in your search, but I would plumb for the Paraguard personally. ATB Geoff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 14, 2003 Report Share Posted May 14, 2003 Thats exactly the two reasons we had to go for them in the end. Regards Neil " Ian Sharpe " <Ian@...> 14/05/2003 10:07 Please respond to cc: Subject: Re: Rescue From Height Neil, I think thats the way we are going to end up going. I'm not happy about it but at least you can vertical lift safely and it is cheap..... Cheers Ian > Hi Ian, we use the good old Neil on for the purposes you describe, > recently we have completed casualty extraction exercises from the top of > tanks/inside vessels on the platform and have found these to be better > than the paraguard. > > regards > > > Neil Poole > > > > > " Sharpe, Ian R. " <iars@t...> > 14/05/2003 07:02 > Please respond to > > > > cc: > Subject: Rescue From Height > > > Hi All, > > I'm looking for some information or rather picking the collective brains > of everyone. > > As most of you know I've just started a new project and currently we > have no means of rescue from height, scaffold, oil and gas production > modules etc. I'm trying to get a head start and help procurement with > some advice. We immediately identified the paraguard but as we will have > to buy 3 this is going to eat into a significant part of the budget (not > good) > > Does anyone know or have experience of any cheaper alternatives that can > provide the same level of imobilisation and similar capabilities. I > thought about the MIBS from R & M but I'm not sure it would give us the > level we need and I'm not convinced of its ability to work well with > Ropes etc. Neil on was again a choice but I'm not a great fan of > these either. For those of you thinking of MRT type things please > remember that the people using these are going to be largely untrained > aside from the training that we can give them. > > All information / ideas gratefully received, if you have websites all > the better. > > Many Thanks > > Ian > > ---------------------------------------- > Ian Sharpe (ISOS) > Project Medical Services Manager > PFD Tengiz Project. > > Tel +7 (8) 300 7187 212 > Mail - iars@t... > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 14, 2003 Report Share Posted May 14, 2003 Thanks Geoff, But cost is an issue, thats why I'm looking for alternatives. If I could have the PG I would but I can't...... > Hi Ian, > > I know cost is important but if you are training locals, the best stretcher would indeed be the Paraguard. With the colour coded slings it offers a fool proof barrier. We also also have Trelleborg Paramedic stretchers onboard here, I can imagine those being more expensive than the Paraguards though. > > I hope you have some success in your search, but I would plumb for the Paraguard personally. > > ATB > Geoff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 14, 2003 Report Share Posted May 14, 2003 I still don't see how you can do a vertical lift with a Stokes. surely there is a risk of sliding out of the end? > Hi Ian, > > Have to go with what Struan said. We make use of that technique quite often > here in South Africa and it proves to be a safe and cost effective way of > getting people down. > > Ben > > Rescue From Height > > > Hi All, > > I'm looking for some information or rather picking the collective brains > of everyone. > > As most of you know I've just started a new project and currently we > have no means of rescue from height, scaffold, oil and gas production > modules etc. I'm trying to get a head start and help procurement with > some advice. We immediately identified the paraguard but as we will have > to buy 3 this is going to eat into a significant part of the budget (not > good) > > Does anyone know or have experience of any cheaper alternatives that can > provide the same level of imobilisation and similar capabilities. I > thought about the MIBS from R & M but I'm not sure it would give us the > level we need and I'm not convinced of its ability to work well with > Ropes etc. Neil on was again a choice but I'm not a great fan of > these either. For those of you thinking of MRT type things please > remember that the people using these are going to be largely untrained > aside from the training that we can give them. > > All information / ideas gratefully received, if you have websites all > the better. > > Many Thanks > > Ian > > ---------------------------------------- > Ian Sharpe (ISOS) > Project Medical Services Manager > PFD Tengiz Project. > > Tel +7 (8) 300 7187 212 > Mail - iars@t... > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 14, 2003 Report Share Posted May 14, 2003 Neil, I think thats the way we are going to end up going. I'm not happy about it but at least you can vertical lift safely and it is cheap..... Cheers Ian > Hi Ian, we use the good old Neil on for the purposes you describe, > recently we have completed casualty extraction exercises from the top of > tanks/inside vessels on the platform and have found these to be better > than the paraguard. > > regards > > > Neil Poole > > > > > " Sharpe, Ian R. " <iars@t...> > 14/05/2003 07:02 > Please respond to > > > > cc: > Subject: Rescue From Height > > > Hi All, > > I'm looking for some information or rather picking the collective brains > of everyone. > > As most of you know I've just started a new project and currently we > have no means of rescue from height, scaffold, oil and gas production > modules etc. I'm trying to get a head start and help procurement with > some advice. We immediately identified the paraguard but as we will have > to buy 3 this is going to eat into a significant part of the budget (not > good) > > Does anyone know or have experience of any cheaper alternatives that can > provide the same level of imobilisation and similar capabilities. I > thought about the MIBS from R & M but I'm not sure it would give us the > level we need and I'm not convinced of its ability to work well with > Ropes etc. Neil on was again a choice but I'm not a great fan of > these either. For those of you thinking of MRT type things please > remember that the people using these are going to be largely untrained > aside from the training that we can give them. > > All information / ideas gratefully received, if you have websites all > the better. > > Many Thanks > > Ian > > ---------------------------------------- > Ian Sharpe (ISOS) > Project Medical Services Manager > PFD Tengiz Project. > > Tel +7 (8) 300 7187 212 > Mail - iars@t... > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 14, 2003 Report Share Posted May 14, 2003 We normally secure the patient onto the trauma board with a spider harness then secure the trauma board into the stokes with ropes. 5 or 6 straps are put across the patient so that he is secured to the stokes aswell and unable to move or slide around.(creates a similar effect to the paraguard and Neil on). The foot plate attachment is hooked up and provides a stable base for the feet. If all the ropes and straps are tied properly, there will be no chance of the guy falling out. The paraguard is obviously best option with the Neil on next, but this has proven to be an effective alternative Rescue From Height > > > Hi All, > > I'm looking for some information or rather picking the collective brains > of everyone. > > As most of you know I've just started a new project and currently we > have no means of rescue from height, scaffold, oil and gas production > modules etc. I'm trying to get a head start and help procurement with > some advice. We immediately identified the paraguard but as we will have > to buy 3 this is going to eat into a significant part of the budget (not > good) > > Does anyone know or have experience of any cheaper alternatives that can > provide the same level of imobilisation and similar capabilities. I > thought about the MIBS from R & M but I'm not sure it would give us the > level we need and I'm not convinced of its ability to work well with > Ropes etc. Neil on was again a choice but I'm not a great fan of > these either. For those of you thinking of MRT type things please > remember that the people using these are going to be largely untrained > aside from the training that we can give them. > > All information / ideas gratefully received, if you have websites all > the better. > > Many Thanks > > Ian > > ---------------------------------------- > Ian Sharpe (ISOS) > Project Medical Services Manager > PFD Tengiz Project. > > Tel +7 (8) 300 7187 212 > Mail - iars@t... > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 14, 2003 Report Share Posted May 14, 2003 They can be used both ways, just depends how you set up the system. We used both during high angle rescue training Re: Rescue From Height Importance: High What about a combination of Stokes basket stretcher and scoop - works well when scoop is secured into the basket stretcher. Ferno model 71 or 71S works extremely well. Or for confined space then a SKED with a spine board. Struan Rescue From Height > Hi All, > > I'm looking for some information or rather picking the collective > brains of everyone. > > As most of you know I've just started a new project and currently we > have no means of rescue from height, scaffold, oil and gas production > modules etc. I'm trying to get a head start and help procurement with > some advice. We immediately identified the paraguard but as we will > have to buy 3 this is going to eat into a significant part of the > budget (not > good) > > Does anyone know or have experience of any cheaper alternatives that > can provide the same level of imobilisation and similar capabilities. > I thought about the MIBS from R & M but I'm not sure it would give us > the level we need and I'm not convinced of its ability to work well > with Ropes etc. Neil on was again a choice but I'm not a great > fan of these either. For those of you thinking of MRT type things > please remember that the people using these are going to be largely > untrained aside from the training that we can give them. > > All information / ideas gratefully received, if you have websites all > the better. > > Many Thanks > > Ian > > ---------------------------------------- > Ian Sharpe (ISOS) > Project Medical Services Manager > PFD Tengiz Project. > > Tel +7 (8) 300 7187 212 > Mail - iars@... > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 14, 2003 Report Share Posted May 14, 2003 Hi Ian, I a have used it in the same manner as well. Only because had nothing else fancier. It worked like well. Rudy --- " Bayside ISOS (BBA) " <isos@...> wrote: --------------------------------- We normally secure the patient onto the trauma board with a spider harness then secure the trauma board into the stokes with ropes. 5 or 6 straps are put across the patient so that he is secured to the stokes aswell and unable to move or slide around.(creates a similar effect to the paraguard and Neil on). The foot plate attachment is hooked up and provides a stable base for the feet. If all the ropes and straps are tied properly, there will be no chance of the guy falling out. The paraguard is obviously best option with the Neil on next, but this has proven to be an effective alternative Rescue From Height > > > Hi All, > > I'm looking for some information or rather picking the collective brains > of everyone. > > As most of you know I've just started a new project and currently we > have no means of rescue from height, scaffold, oil and gas production > modules etc. I'm trying to get a head start and help procurement with > some advice. We immediately identified the paraguard but as we will have > to buy 3 this is going to eat into a significant part of the budget (not > good) > > Does anyone know or have experience of any cheaper alternatives that can > provide the same level of imobilisation and similar capabilities. I > thought about the MIBS from R & M but I'm not sure it would give us the > level we need and I'm not convinced of its ability to work well with > Ropes etc. Neil on was again a choice but I'm not a great fan of > these either. For those of you thinking of MRT type things please > remember that the people using these are going to be largely untrained > aside from the training that we can give them. > > All information / ideas gratefully received, if you have websites all > the better. > > Many Thanks > > Ian > > ---------------------------------------- > Ian Sharpe (ISOS) > Project Medical Services Manager > PFD Tengiz Project. > > Tel +7 (8) 300 7187 212 > Mail - iars@t... > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 14, 2003 Report Share Posted May 14, 2003 Used the stokes / scoop combo many times both for vertical and horizontal lifts and lowers. Works well as Ben has described it and having been the tail end Charlie on some vertical hoists, there is no patient movement at all. The foot plate and the secure attachment of the scoop to the stokes prevents the patient from sliding out. The problem with the paraguard is that there is no structure to protect the patient from getting smacked against external structures. I have been hoisted in a Paraguard and I did not feel at safe. My 2 cents. Struan Rescue From Height > > > > > > Hi All, > > > > I'm looking for some information or rather picking the collective > brains > > of everyone. > > > > As most of you know I've just started a new project and currently we > > have no means of rescue from height, scaffold, oil and gas > production > > modules etc. I'm trying to get a head start and help procurement > with > > some advice. We immediately identified the paraguard but as we will > have > > to buy 3 this is going to eat into a significant part of the budget > (not > > good) > > > > Does anyone know or have experience of any cheaper alternatives > that can > > provide the same level of imobilisation and similar capabilities. I > > thought about the MIBS from R & M but I'm not sure it would give us > the > > level we need and I'm not convinced of its ability to work well with > > Ropes etc. Neil on was again a choice but I'm not a great > fan of > > these either. For those of you thinking of MRT type things please > > remember that the people using these are going to be largely > untrained > > aside from the training that we can give them. > > > > All information / ideas gratefully received, if you have websites > all > > the better. > > > > Many Thanks > > > > Ian > > > > ---------------------------------------- > > Ian Sharpe (ISOS) > > Project Medical Services Manager > > PFD Tengiz Project. > > > > Tel +7 (8) 300 7187 212 > > Mail - iars@t... > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 14, 2003 Report Share Posted May 14, 2003 Thanks, see what you mean now, but I'm not sure I'm happy to rely on untrained people tying ropes off, even my training in this area is limited I dread to think what the rest of the workforce will be like...... Thanks though Ian Rescue From Height > > > Hi All, > > I'm looking for some information or rather picking the collective brains > of everyone. > > As most of you know I've just started a new project and currently we > have no means of rescue from height, scaffold, oil and gas production > modules etc. I'm trying to get a head start and help procurement with > some advice. We immediately identified the paraguard but as we will have > to buy 3 this is going to eat into a significant part of the budget (not > good) > > Does anyone know or have experience of any cheaper alternatives that can > provide the same level of imobilisation and similar capabilities. I > thought about the MIBS from R & M but I'm not sure it would give us the > level we need and I'm not convinced of its ability to work well with > Ropes etc. Neil on was again a choice but I'm not a great fan of > these either. For those of you thinking of MRT type things please > remember that the people using these are going to be largely untrained > aside from the training that we can give them. > > All information / ideas gratefully received, if you have websites all > the better. > > Many Thanks > > Ian > > ---------------------------------------- > Ian Sharpe (ISOS) > Project Medical Services Manager > PFD Tengiz Project. > > Tel +7 (8) 300 7187 212 > Mail - iars@t... > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 14, 2003 Report Share Posted May 14, 2003 For what little help it might offer, have you considered any intracompany or extracompany discussions. We have given away a few paraguards over the years cos we have a lot, as I am sure a bunch of organisations will have. If you have an infrastucture - see what you can tap. Risk Management Advisor * DBNapier@... ' 01244 803802 Re: Rescue From Height Thanks Geoff, But cost is an issue, thats why I'm looking for alternatives. If I could have the PG I would but I can't...... > Hi Ian, > > I know cost is important but if you are training locals, the best stretcher would indeed be the Paraguard. With the colour coded slings it offers a fool proof barrier. We also also have Trelleborg Paramedic stretchers onboard here, I can imagine those being more expensive than the Paraguards though. > > I hope you have some success in your search, but I would plumb for the Paraguard personally. > > ATB > Geoff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 14, 2003 Report Share Posted May 14, 2003 Definately agree with you.....not really a technique to use without adequate high angle training. Good luck! Rescue From Height > > > Hi All, > > I'm looking for some information or rather picking the collective brains > of everyone. > > As most of you know I've just started a new project and currently we > have no means of rescue from height, scaffold, oil and gas production > modules etc. I'm trying to get a head start and help procurement with > some advice. We immediately identified the paraguard but as we will have > to buy 3 this is going to eat into a significant part of the budget (not > good) > > Does anyone know or have experience of any cheaper alternatives that can > provide the same level of imobilisation and similar capabilities. I > thought about the MIBS from R & M but I'm not sure it would give us the > level we need and I'm not convinced of its ability to work well with > Ropes etc. Neil on was again a choice but I'm not a great fan of > these either. For those of you thinking of MRT type things please > remember that the people using these are going to be largely untrained > aside from the training that we can give them. > > All information / ideas gratefully received, if you have websites all > the better. > > Many Thanks > > Ian > > ---------------------------------------- > Ian Sharpe (ISOS) > Project Medical Services Manager > PFD Tengiz Project. > > Tel +7 (8) 300 7187 212 > Mail - iars@t... > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 14, 2003 Report Share Posted May 14, 2003 Guys, Thanks for all the very useful advice. We do however have to live in the real world, where we suffer from the effect of budgets, time constraints on staff and locality. What would be considered the norm in the western world, i.e. professional rope rescue training or SAR organisations just do not exist in this environment. Basically any training is down to what we organise and facilitate ourselves and even then you have to pull the guys off the job, and at the end of the day, management don't see that as productive. The reality is as it is in many industries around the world pushing for as much as you can without alienating the management. Obviously we will conduct regular drills and practice buts it doubtful due to the turnover of contractors and laborers that we will even have a dedicated rescue team, hence I'm trying to keep the actual stretcher element of the rescue method as simple as possible and not involve complicated rope securing of the patient (why I wanted the Para Guard) We'll get there in the end, and I'm lucky that I do work for a company that places a value on safety, but there is only so far they can go........ Best Wishes Ian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 14, 2003 Report Share Posted May 14, 2003 Ian I have the same problem as you do but as I am high angle rescue trained, I just trained up 3 key people to a standard that I can trust and only use those guys. The rope haulers and stretcher carriers don't have to be trained, they just have to have ears and understand English - which is difficult at times!! Its not impossible, what I would do if I was you would be to get your company to send you for some high angle training and then you can come back and teach a small number of people the tricks - this stuff is not rocket science. Struan RE: Rescue from height > Guys, > > Thanks for all the very useful advice. We do however have to live in the > real world, where we suffer from the effect of budgets, time constraints > on staff and locality. What would be considered the norm in the western > world, i.e. professional rope rescue training or SAR organisations just > do not exist in this environment. Basically any training is down to what > we organise and facilitate ourselves and even then you have to pull the > guys off the job, and at the end of the day, management don't see that > as productive. > > The reality is as it is in many industries around the world pushing for > as much as you can without alienating the management. Obviously we will > conduct regular drills and practice buts it doubtful due to the turnover > of contractors and laborers that we will even have a dedicated rescue > team, hence I'm trying to keep the actual stretcher element of the > rescue method as simple as possible and not involve complicated rope > securing of the patient (why I wanted the Para Guard) > > We'll get there in the end, and I'm lucky that I do work for a company > that places a value on safety, but there is only so far they can > go........ > > Best Wishes > > Ian > > > > > Member Information: > > List owner: Ian Sharpe Owner@... > Editor: Ross Boardman Editor@... > > ALL list admin messages (subscriptions & unsubscriptions) should be sent to the list owner. > > Post message: egroups > > Please visit our website http://www.remotemedics.co.uk > > Regards > > The Remote Medics Team > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 15, 2003 Report Share Posted May 15, 2003 Morning all, Reading with interest the high angle rescue bit. Can I recommend you maybe talking to one of your abseiling / inspection contract companies ie. OTS or Can. One of the problems we had onboard our installation was people requiring access to things like crane pedistals and vents stacks. Your problem is not only lowering them down from a height but also lifting as well. We ended up getting together with some of the rope access guys and had a pre - made up pulley, lift / lower system made up which is quite easy to use, and consists of only a couple of pulleys, some strops and a few jammers. As it's already made up it just comes out of the bag, is secured to your anchor points and off you go. We paid for the rope gear and the platform abseilers gave local tuition to the emergency response team guys. Took about 2 hours including a couple of practice scenarios. No real need to go on extensive rope access training. I can probably dig up a schematic from somewhere and post it if you like ? For any kind of lifting lowering up and down enclosed ladders, inside cranes, plant etc where there is limited access then IMHO you need a paraguard. The basket is okay but only if you intend on horizontal lifts ie. from deck to the helideck etc. I agree that this 'level' of training may not suit all needs but certainly covers ours locally. For further info try also Firenet.com and the Technical Rescue link. Was reading an interesting article yesterday (past article) from the Tech Rescue Magazine which is an excellent source of info. Hope this helps .... TC+ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 15, 2003 Report Share Posted May 15, 2003 They have to be properly fitted into a harness and secured into the stretcher. Webbibg sit-harness at least. Test your methods with a dummy first.... Fly Safe. Ken L-W CCEMT-P/RN etc --- " Ian Sharpe " <Ian@...> wrote: >I still don't see how you can do a vertical lift with a Stokes. >surely there is a risk of sliding out of the end? > > >> Hi Ian, >> >> Have to go with what Struan said. We make use of that technique >quite often >> here in South Africa and it proves to be a safe and cost effective >way of >> getting people down. >> >> Ben >> >> Rescue From Height >> >> >> Hi All, >> >> I'm looking for some information or rather picking the collective >brains >> of everyone. >> >> As most of you know I've just started a new project and currently we >> have no means of rescue from height, scaffold, oil and gas >production >> modules etc. I'm trying to get a head start and help procurement >with >> some advice. We immediately identified the paraguard but as we will >have >> to buy 3 this is going to eat into a significant part of the budget >(not >> good) >> >> Does anyone know or have experience of any cheaper alternatives >that can >> provide the same level of imobilisation and similar capabilities. I >> thought about the MIBS from R & M but I'm not sure it would give us >the >> level we need and I'm not convinced of its ability to work well with >> Ropes etc. Neil on was again a choice but I'm not a great >fan of >> these either. For those of you thinking of MRT type things please >> remember that the people using these are going to be largely >untrained >> aside from the training that we can give them. >> >> All information / ideas gratefully received, if you have websites >all >> the better. >> >> Many Thanks >> >> Ian >> >> ---------------------------------------- >> Ian Sharpe (ISOS) >> Project Medical Services Manager >> PFD Tengiz Project. >> >> Tel +7 (8) 300 7187 212 >> Mail - iars@t... >> >> >> >> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 15, 2003 Report Share Posted May 15, 2003 Mountain Rescue Council of the US will have approved method. Also a great book out detailing exact methods.. " Technical Rescue " . Mountain Rescue Council web site can direct you to the best standards. < Rescue From Height >> >> >> Hi All, >> >> I'm looking for some information or rather picking the collective >brains >> of everyone. >> >> As most of you know I've just started a new project and currently we >> have no means of rescue from height, scaffold, oil and gas >production >> modules etc. I'm trying to get a head start and help procurement >with >> some advice. We immediately identified the paraguard but as we will >have >> to buy 3 this is going to eat into a significant part of the budget >(not >> good) >> >> Does anyone know or have experience of any cheaper alternatives >that can >> provide the same level of imobilisation and similar capabilities. I >> thought about the MIBS from R & M but I'm not sure it would give us >the >> level we need and I'm not convinced of its ability to work well with >> Ropes etc. Neil on was again a choice but I'm not a great >fan of >> these either. For those of you thinking of MRT type things please >> remember that the people using these are going to be largely >untrained >> aside from the training that we can give them. >> >> All information / ideas gratefully received, if you have websites >all >> the better. >> >> Many Thanks >> >> Ian >> >> ---------------------------------------- >> Ian Sharpe (ISOS) >> Project Medical Services Manager >> PFD Tengiz Project. >> >> Tel +7 (8) 300 7187 212 >> Mail - iars@t... >> >> >> >> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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