Re: Is my soap batch ruined? Help

[Guest guest]

hi ellen,

well this happened to me the first time i tried making soap.

All I did was to microwave it....that accelerates the process....my

soap got so hard I could not even get it out of the bucket...had to

let it harden there and later remelted it and put it in molds.

So i thk u shud try microwaving. hoever u will have to re add the fo

or eo later as that may evaporate.

natasha

> This is only my second time at making real soap with lye. I

measured

> out all the ingredients went to work, got into the stirring stage

> waiting for a trace. Problem is, it never happened. waiting after

> stirring for 5 hours with a blender it only got to a heavy

> pudding.Never had a trace. I couldnt wait any longer so I went

ahead

> and put my essential oil's in and put it in molds. After 24hours in

> the molds it is only a little harder than it was which was the

> pudding stage. Is this batch ruined? Do I wait another 24 hours?

Will

> it get harder? If it is ruined as soap can I use it for something

> else? I hope that this will still be soap and eventually I can take

> it out of the molds to cure. Does anyone have any hope for me?

>

> Ellen

[Guest guest]

did you run all your ingredients through a lye calculator?

Joyce Siegert

Ladybug Creations

Candles & Soaps

----- Original Message -----

From: " Ellen Scusa " <eascusa@...>

> This is only my second time at making real soap with lye. I measured

> out all the ingredients went to work, got into the stirring stage

> waiting for a trace. Problem is, it never happened. waiting after

> stirring for 5 hours with a blender it only got to a heavy

> pudding.Never had a trace. I couldnt wait any longer so I went ahead

> and put my essential oil's in and put it in molds. After 24hours in

> the molds it is only a little harder than it was which was the

> pudding stage. Is this batch ruined? Do I wait another 24 hours? Will

> it get harder? If it is ruined as soap can I use it for something

> else? I hope that this will still be soap and eventually I can take

> it out of the molds to cure. Does anyone have any hope for me?

>

> Ellen

[Guest guest]

Ellen

I am wondering if your oils cooled down...and that you might have done the

No Gel process with the batch, I am just learning the No Gel CP method and

the Lye water and oils are mixed at 80-85 degrees and there is no insulating

and placed in a cool room. The soap does not ever heat up and never goes

through the heat of the gel stage and it does take longer to process before

the bars can be cut or come out of the mold. It really does become soap

though! ... one of the benifits is that you keep more of your scent. The

bars tend look is more uniform also...

I guess I would wait...another day and if still not looking right, try to

cut into it. One of my first batches had a 1/4 inch slimmy top...with a

solid bottom....I may have poured that one too soon, there was this oily

unsafronated top layer that I had to cut off. Regardless...it is never a

real waist...it is all needed to learn..

Laurie H. from MN

----- Original Message ----- "

> > This is only my second time at making real soap with lye.....

trace never happened after....stirring for 5 hours ....After 24hours in

the molds it is only a little harder than it was which was the

pudding stage. Is this batch ruined?

Ellen

------ http://USFamily.Net/info - Unlimited Internet - From $8.99/mo! ------

[Guest guest]

Ellen,

Just give it some more time in the mold. Keep an eye on it. As long as

you followed the instructions it should be okay. What was the recipe

and how did you make the soap? Hot Process, Cold Process? Sometimes my

cold processed soaps take a tad longer to harden. But it all works out.

Randy

> This is only my second time at making real soap with lye. I

measured

> out all the ingredients went to work, got into the stirring stage

> waiting for a trace. Problem is, it never happened. waiting after

> stirring for 5 hours with a blender it only got to a heavy

> pudding.Never had a trace. I couldnt wait any longer so I went

ahead

> and put my essential oil's in and put it in molds. After 24hours in

> the molds it is only a little harder than it was which was the

> pudding stage. Is this batch ruined? Do I wait another 24 hours?

Will

> it get harder? If it is ruined as soap can I use it for something

> else? I hope that this will still be soap and eventually I can take

> it out of the molds to cure. Does anyone have any hope for me?

>

> Ellen

Just in! Germall Plus Liquid, E Wax NF, Stearic Acid, Evening Primrose

oil,Wheat Germ oil!We have many hard to find items like citric

acid,empty capsules,red clay,best priced essential oils and more!

http://glenbrookfarm.com/store/specialsseeds_1.html

To unsub send an e-mail to :

-unsubscribe

_____

[Guest guest]

Sounds like you didn't use enough lye. The other question might be, what

kind of lye did you use? My veggie soaps are superfatted at 6-7% and I keep

the coconut down to 15%, so I give them about 48 hours from pour to cut. I

made shaving soap yesterday and 5 hours later it was rock hard, so a whole

lot depends on what sort of oils you're using, and the wrong combination of

oils might never get hard. If it's not enough lye, you can try making

another batch, maybe half the size of the too-soft one and use a 0%

superfat, grate up the soft batch and put them in the crock pot for an hour

or two. If it's because you've only got very soft oils in your soap, maybe

try the same thing, but instead of no superfat, make sure you get some oils

that harden soap like coconut or palm kernel or cocoa butter in there.

HTH,

Traci

Is my soap batch ruined? Help

> This is only my second time at making real soap with lye. I measured

> out all the ingredients went to work, got into the stirring stage

> waiting for a trace. Problem is, it never happened. waiting after

> stirring for 5 hours with a blender it only got to a heavy

> pudding.Never had a trace. I couldnt wait any longer so I went ahead

> and put my essential oil's in and put it in molds. After 24hours in

> the molds it is only a little harder than it was which was the

> pudding stage. Is this batch ruined? Do I wait another 24 hours? Will

> it get harder? If it is ruined as soap can I use it for something

> else? I hope that this will still be soap and eventually I can take

> it out of the molds to cure. Does anyone have any hope for me?

>

> Ellen

>

>

>

>

>

> Just in! Germall Plus Liquid, E Wax NF, Stearic Acid, Evening Primrose

oil,Wheat Germ oil!We have many hard to find items like citric acid,empty

capsules,red clay,best priced essential oils and more!

> http://glenbrookfarm.com/store/specialsseeds_1.html

> To unsub send an e-mail to :

> -unsubscribe

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

There's a special method ?????!!!!!!

In the summer, they gel. In the winter, they don't gel. The only time I

really care is if it's goatmilk. If the flashpoint of your scent is less

than the temperature of you gelling soap, you will lose scent. If not, it

really makes no difference. If you think about it, the more heat, the faster

it saponifies, so by insulating and gelling you're speeding up the process.

Cooking it in the oven, forcing a complete and total gel and having it

useable tomorrow makes the role of heat really obvious. Not gelling will

help keep discoloration to a minimum, it will cut down on ammonia smell in

gm soap, but the oils you're soaping with have a much bigger effect than gel

or not gel. I suspect the non-gelled soap may take a bit longer to fully

cure. I get angry at the people who made me think I had ruined my soap the

first time it didn't gel.

Traci

Mad Scientist Wanna-Be

Re: Is my soap batch ruined? Help

> Ellen

> I am wondering if your oils cooled down...and that you might have done the

> No Gel process with the batch, I am just learning the No Gel CP method and

> the Lye water and oils are mixed at 80-85 degrees and there is no

insulating

> and placed in a cool room. The soap does not ever heat up and never goes

> through the heat of the gel stage and it does take longer to process

before

> the bars can be cut or come out of the mold. It really does become soap

> though! ... one of the benifits is that you keep more of your scent. The

> bars tend look is more uniform also...

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Ellen,

If you know that you weighed out everything right, then it is

probably that it cooled down to quick and did not go through the gel

stage. I don't prefer to make soap when it is done without the gel

stage, but it does make soap and just takes a bit longer to be ready

to cut. Give it a day or so honey and then it should be ready to

come out of the mold. HTH God Bless TTYS :-)

Rita...Homeschooling Mom in Georgia

May the ~A~ngels up ~A~bove Guide

you with Love ~A~

[Guest guest]

Ellen

You should post your recipe so people can help.

First, you need about 1/2 hard oils such as coconut oil, palm oil,

etc and about 1/2 soft oils in your formula.

Second you need to run any recipe through a lye calculator, if you do

not have one, you can download a FREE LYE calculator from my website

and use it with your spreadsheet program on your computer.

Third, if your soap batch had the consistency of pudding then you DID

reach a trace. Trace is when the batch turns creamy color and is the

consistency of thin to thick pudding.

Fourth, you should keep the temperature of lye water and oils to at

least 100-140 degrees when blending and using a Stick blender will

help a lot to get the batch to trace much faster.

People new to soapmaking should not use lower temps for un-gel

soaps.

Fifth, careful measurements using WEIGHT and not volume is

essential. Weigh each ingredient on a DIGITAL scale only. A few

ounces of extra water will make for a very soft batch and takes

forever to dry.

Sixth, if your soap does not firm up in a few days, scoop it back

into a tall stock pot and melt it down again, then using a double

boiler, cook it for about 1 hour OR until it is TRANSLUCENT, then

scoop into molds, it will be quite thick now, and not pourable. Let

it set in the mold for a day then unmold and cut into bars, it will

be ready to use in a few days since saponization is complete.

If you want to learn more about soaping you can check out my website

and E-books about Soap making, see url below.

Hope this helps

Sherry

Sherry's Creations

www.herbalsoap-healingcreams.com

Natural Care Books, booklets, spreadsheets

[Guest guest]

I have a couple of questions:

Re: Is my soap batch ruined? Help

> You should post your recipe so people can help.

> First, you need about 1/2 hard oils such as coconut oil, palm oil,

> etc and about 1/2 soft oils in your formula.

Why? I like castille. Oh, I love cocoa butter and shea butter...

> Fourth, you should keep the temperature of lye water and oils to at

> least 100-140 degrees when blending and using a Stick blender will

> help a lot to get the batch to trace much faster.

> People new to soapmaking should not use lower temps for un-gel

> soaps.

What's the advantage of soaping at higher temps? I thought higher temps led

to soap oozing from molds, fragrances seizing, things like that? What is

supposedly wrong with soap that doesn't gel? You've done both and compared?

I have never personally known anyone who suggested soaping above 120, so

that's a new idea for me. What does 140 do for soap?

I also noticed you said lye water loses its effectiveness overnight. Is it

because it sits or is it because of reheating? I know a lot of people who

mix their lye the day before, and they make nice soap. Some of them even use

a little vegetable shortening. I've never used vegetable shortening and I've

never mixed my lye the day before, so I can't comment from experience there.

If I've got lye between 80 and 100, I'm making soap. I can make soap out of

butter and Crisco and bacon grease if that's all I've got, too. It might not

be my best soap, but it'll still be soap.

Traci

[Guest guest]

Traci

Just an observation I have..

If I have a low flash point fragrance oil I will mix at 90-98 degrees.

It just seems to work out better

I have mixed at 140 when I was in a hurry but 100-110 degrees is my

usual mixing temp.

If you have a high balance of saturated fats in your soaps that require

higher temps to melt then mixing at higher temps can be of benefit...

But with my recipe I always use 100-110 which works best for my formula.

Lucinda

http://www.glenbrookfarm.com/herbs

>What's the advantage of soaping at higher temps? I thought higher temps

led to soap oozing >from molds, fragrances seizing, things like that?

What is supposedly wrong with soap that doesn't gel? You've done both

and compared? I have never personally known anyone who suggested soaping

above 120, so that's a new idea for me. What does 140 do for soap?

[Guest guest]

> I have a couple of questions:

> Why? I like castille. Oh, I love cocoa butter and shea butter...

Traci

If you use all soft oil in your soap batch, just be prepared for a

very long trace, and for a very long drying time, with a lot of

shrinkage to your bar. Using 1/2 soft and 1/2 hard oil makes for a

faster trace and shorter drying time.

BTW....hard oils means any butters or waxes too, and oils that are

solid at room temperature.

Soft oils are those oils/butters/waxes that are liquid at room

temperature.

> What's the advantage of soaping at higher temps? I thought higher

temps led > to soap oozing from molds, fragrances seizing, things

like that? What is

> supposedly wrong with soap that doesn't gel? You've done both and

compared?

> I have never personally known anyone who suggested soaping above

120, so > that's a new idea for me. What does 140 do for soap?

Traci

Higher temperatures CAN interfer with some fragrance oil, SO...you

need to KNOW the flash point of any FO your going to use and use a

batch temperature below that flash point, generally it is 100-140

degrees.

As I stated in my post already...higher temperatures helps

accellerate trace time, and gelling time.

There are many experienced soapers who do un-gelled soap but it is

not for the newbie to try.

> I also noticed you said lye water loses its effectiveness

overnight. Is it > because it sits or is it because of reheating? I

know a lot of people who > mix their lye the day before, and they

make nice soap. Some of them even use > a little vegetable

shortening. I've never used vegetable shortening and I've

> never mixed my lye the day before, so I can't comment from

experience there.

Traci....I have made soap for over 40 years....So I can tell you that

lye DOES lose potency and lye will degrade, if left overnight expose

to air. It is just NOT a good way to make soap and CAN lead to

disaster with NO saponization and your left with a curdled mass of

oils and a ruined batch of soap and a lot of money down the drain.

I know of no experieced soaper who ever mixes lye and lets it set

overnight.

In fact one must be very careful in storing lye after it is opened to

prevent moisture from getting into the flakes because it will render

the lye ineffective or degraded.

> If I've got lye between 80 and 100, I'm making soap. I can make

soap out of > butter and Crisco and bacon grease if that's all I've

got, too. It might not > be my best soap, but it'll still be soap.

Traci

Sure you can, but why bother, it is no better for your skin than

going to Walmart and getting commercial synthetic soap! Why would you

want to put bacon grease or Crisco on your skin??

And if people try to sell this type of soap as " hand-made natural

soap " then they do ALL home-crafters a HUGE Dis-Service because most

of them make their soaps with QUALITY ingredients.

Hope this helps Traci and best to you soaping.