Re: Re: Genetic drift in kefir grains, genetic exchange between different lineages of grains

[Guest guest]

, How long have you had the 2 groups together? I am wondering if

they will revert to an " average " size or some such later on? The reason

I wonder is because I recall reading from DOM's materials that he

experimented with a combination, (I believe it was a Kombucha scoby and

kefir grains both in milk .. or was it in tea?) but the point is that

although the kefir grains turned out odd shaped, like " non-propagables "

he'd had before, (after he had them juicing for awhile and knowing they

would not again 'grow " in milk but would make milk kefir), and they had

the flat, curled edge shape of his previous non-propagables (i.e., no

" growth " and little ones). I am just realizing that is possibly clear

as mud, but hoping you-all know what I mean. We need another language

to really speak kefereeze! Here's a link to his picture of the

experiment. *http://users.chariot.net.au/~dna/KG-KS-42.jpg* *. *I also

have the following from some of his writings about that:

There is *no evidence that

Kefiran, which is the essential component of propagable kefir grains, is

produced by

the microflora colonized within the KKH *(or within the fake-leather

parts of my shoes for that matter).*The nature of wild microbes is that

they have the

ability to colonies with the structure of " porous materials " *(such as

non-propagable kefir grains, Kombucha SCOBY, terra cotta pots, wooden

barrels,

and yes, including leather hide).*If Kefiran is not produced due to a

damaged component, in this case, the absence of e.g., Lb.

kefiranofaciens by non propagable kefir grains_, then Kefiran is also

absent in the final kefir._*

This form of culture-beverage *could not be classified as true authentic

kefir; but

more in-line with commercially-prepared pseudo-kefir,* cultured with

lab-prepared " pure mixed starter cultures " (i.e. to say the milk is not

cultured with propagable kefir grains). "

That may tell us something of what happens with all mixed cultures where

the kefir is used but does not reproduce true to kefiran/kefir grains.

The scientists still miss the " soul " of kefir!! Joyce Simmerman

**

On 6/23/2011 10:38 PM, ROSA wrote:

>

> That, actually happened to me, my first milk kefir grains I got, were

> this big clusters, they were growing at a normal rate, then a friend

> gave up on her kefir grains, and gave them to me, they were little

> grains, like a dime size and a whole bunch of them, I, without

> thinking, dumped them right into my big cluster grains.

>

> Now, Ijust have a bunch of little cluster, and they are growing like

> crazy, and my big grains are gone

>

> They still make great thick kefir thou About the fungi/bacteria, I

> have no idea.

>

>

>

>

> >

> > Wonder what would happen if you put kefir grains from different

> sources into

> > the same containers for a few batches. Each could pick up strains of

> > bacteria/fungi it didn't have before from the other, and where they

> both had

> > a bacterial species the two populations could exchange genetic

> material. I

> > think sometimes fungi do that too. On the same note, do different

> lines of

> > kefir grains look different in shape, color and size attained? Do they

> > produce a different-tasting product? What do you think? in

> > Kentucky

> >

>

>