Guest guest Posted July 7, 2011 Report Share Posted July 7, 2011 I'm trying to decide whether to start with water grains or milk grains. I want to make kefir that I can use with my children. Of course, they like the kind I've bought at the store because it is flavored and has lots of sugar. Can anyone give me some direction? Thanks so much! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 8, 2011 Report Share Posted July 8, 2011 On Thu, Jul 7, 2011 at 7:37 AM, <lisa.littler@...> wrote: I'm trying to decide whether to start with water grains or milk grains. I want to make kefir that I can use with my children. Of course, they like the kind I've bought at the store because it is flavored and has lots of sugar. Can anyone give me some direction? I would go with milk grains if you can get raw milk. If you cannot get raw milk, I would go with water grains and use either water or coconut milk. I gave a glass of my kefir (raw milk and awesome grains) to a friend (adult), and she literally gagged on the taste: it was way too sour for her (funny, it doesn't seem sour to me). She suggested adding fruits, and there are a lot of suggestions out there on making milk kefir smoothies with fruit and berries and sweeten it, if necessary, with raw local honey. Good suggestion from someone who couldn't tolerate the taste in her mouth. I suspect it would work well with children. Joyce M. -- Support Airedale Rescue-Buy a pattern http://www.airedalerescue.net/alphabet/a_is_for_airedale/patterns/ www.dearjubilee.com www.dearjubilee-joyce.blogspot.com dearjubilee-inmyfatherswords.blogspot.com/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 8, 2011 Report Share Posted July 8, 2011 From just the perspective of the metabolic toxicity of sugar, I'd certainly not feed it to my children. America\n runs on rugar and our health care system is right there to treat the diseases it causes...excuse me, my biases are showing...but I've been researching and writing about this stuff going on two years and sugar is a poison to humans! Ellie's New Adventure: http://mindingthemiddleagedmiddle.com   How older, fatter folk can figure out what works for weight, health and aging!   E-books, articles, blog and much more... Rural adventure: http://beyondthesidewalk.com   Marketing Workshops, Books, blog/free newsletter, consulting for rural entrepreneurs From: <lisa.littler@...> Subject: still investigating Date: Thursday, July 7, 2011, 7:37 AM  I'm trying to decide whether to start with water grains or milk grains. I want to make kefir that I can use with my children. Of course, they like the kind I've bought at the store because it is flavored and has lots of sugar. Can anyone give me some direction? Thanks so much! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 8, 2011 Report Share Posted July 8, 2011 On Fri, Jul 8, 2011 at 8:23 AM, Ellie Winslow <winslowellie@...>wrote: From just the perspective of the metabolic toxicity of sugar, I'd certainly not feed it to my children. America\n runs on rugar and our health care system is right there to treat the diseases it causes...excuse me, my biases are showing...but I've been researching and writing about this stuff going on two years and sugar is a poison to humans! Ellie, Are you including raw local honey in this? From everything I have researched since first using raw local honey instead of sugar, it has many health benefits, and I would not include it in a discussio about the metabolic toxicity of sugar.. http://www.benefits-of-honey.com/raw-honey.html http://www.globalhealingcenter.com/natural-health/health-benefits-of-organic-loc\ ally-grown-raw-honey/ And although I am not a huge fan of Dr. Mercola because of his focus on his own products, I did find Mercola's comments on this page helpful: http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2007/08/13/honey-as-medicine-\ is-making-a-comeback.aspx Joyce M. -- Support Airedale Rescue-Buy a pattern http://www.airedalerescue.net/alphabet/a_is_for_airedale/patterns/ www.dearjubilee.com www.dearjubilee-joyce.blogspot.com dearjubilee-inmyfatherswords.blogspot.com/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 8, 2011 Report Share Posted July 8, 2011 As far as how honey is metabolized it is just like sugar--actually just like high fructose corn syrup. It may have a few vitamins and minerals but metabolically you're kidding yourself if you think it's not raising blood sugar and creating the metabolic havoc of frustose. Sorry, it's one of the myths. Ellie's New Adventure: http://mindingthemiddleagedmiddle.com   How older, fatter folk can figure out what works for weight, health and aging!   E-books, articles, blog and much more... Rural adventure: http://beyondthesidewalk.com   Marketing Workshops, Books, blog/free newsletter, consulting for rural entrepreneurs From just the perspective of the metabolic toxicity of sugar, I'd certainly not feed it to my children. America\n runs on rugar and our health care system is right there to treat the diseases it causes...excuse me, my biases are showing...but I've been researching and writing about this stuff going on two years and sugar is a poison to humans! Ellie, Are you including raw local honey in this? From everything I have researched since first using raw local honey instead of sugar, it has many health benefits, and I would not include it in a discussio about the metabolic toxicity of sugar.. http://www.benefits-of-honey.com/raw-honey.html http://www.globalhealingcenter.com/natural-health/health-benefits-of-organic-loc\ ally-grown-raw-honey/ And although I am not a huge fan of Dr. Mercola because of his focus on his own products, I did find Mercola's comments on this page helpful: http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2007/08/13/honey-as-medicine-\ is-making-a-comeback.aspx Joyce M. -- Support Airedale Rescue-Buy a pattern http://www.airedalerescue.net/alphabet/a_is_for_airedale/patterns/ www.dearjubilee.com www.dearjubilee-joyce.blogspot.com dearjubilee-inmyfatherswords.blogspot.com/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 8, 2011 Report Share Posted July 8, 2011 On Fri, Jul 8, 2011 at 8:47 AM, Ellie Winslow <winslowellie@...>wrote: > As far as how honey is metabolized it is just like sugar--actually just > like high fructose corn syrup. It may have a few vitamins and minerals but > metabolically you're kidding yourself if you think it's not raising blood > sugar and creating the metabolic havoc of frustose. Sorry, it's one of the > myths. > No, it is not like high fructose corn syrup, and scientific evidence is not saying so either. http://jn.nutrition.org/content/132/11/3379.full This study suggests that honey does not have the harmful effects of REFINED fructose. Honey's redemption probably lies in its minor protective constituents as well as in the fact that it does not contain manmade, chemically isolated fructose produced by isomerization from glucose. High fructose corn syrup is NOT the same as the fructose in fruit, nor is it the same as raw honey. High fructose corn syrup causes the body to lose minerals and causes nutritional deficiencies and causes health problems. Honey, especially raw honey, contains vitamins, minerals, antioxidants, and antimicrobial properties. Since honey is sweeter than sugar, we use honey than we would sugar. So where did the idea that honey is the same as high fructose corn syrup come from? From the Corn Refiners Association! Its website, HFCSfacts.com, states: " Research confirms that high fructose corn syrup is safe and no different from other common sweeteners like table sugar and honey. All three sweeteners are nutritionally the same " That is simply NOT true, but it is what the high fructose corn syrup people would like us to believe. (see http://www.healthyeatingadvisor.com/hfcs.html for one site that challenges the idea that high fructose corn syrup is the same as all other sweeteners). I do use raw honey as a sweetener instead of refined sweeteners. That said, do I use a lot? Absolutely not: a small bottle of locally produced raw honey lasts a long long time in my house. If what you are trying to do is to ensure that your children have no taste for sweet, you probably should eliminate honey as well as the dangerous sweets, but my problem with doing this is that at some point, your children are going to taste sweets, and they won't know the difference between the sweets that are truly dangerous and those that will do no harm in moderation,. Now can we get back to kefir? Joyce M. -- Support Airedale Rescue-Buy a pattern http://www.airedalerescue.net/alphabet/a_is_for_airedale/patterns/ www.dearjubilee.com www.dearjubilee-joyce.blogspot.com dearjubilee-inmyfatherswords.blogspot.com/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 8, 2011 Report Share Posted July 8, 2011 Amen! I'm looking forward to a land that flows with milk and honey. I'm just sure it must be kefired milk ;-) Texas > > Now can we get back to kefir? > > > Joyce M. > > -- > Support Airedale Rescue-Buy a pattern > http://www.airedalerescue.net/alphabet/a_is_for_airedale/patterns/ > > www.dearjubilee.com www.dearjubilee-joyce.blogspot.com > dearjubilee-inmyfatherswords.blogspot.com/ > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 8, 2011 Report Share Posted July 8, 2011 Ellie, Yes, even raw honey is metabolized just like sugar or corn syrup and even like grains. I am not saying honey is like corn syrup as it at least does not contain all the chemicals but it is metabolized just like sugar. Grains can have more natural sugar makeup than some actual sugars. Ask someone who has sugar restrictions and see how they have to limit grains, sugars of all kinds including honey, and many fruits and even some veggies. So the key here is MODERATION and monderation for some means much less to none while it can mean small amounts for others. For me, it means none, not even grains unless they are gluten free and even than, I make tham into a sourdough form to eliminate natural sugar in them. I was stricken with a severe case of IBD from strong antibotics that were needed for surgery for a broken wrist. A little bit of honey, a small piece of organic apple, even those small amounts of sugar didn't work for me. I am now mended beyond what I was before the antibotics but it sure taught how sugar can feed the wrong bacteria and make one miserable quickly. The reason kefir is so good for us is because the sugar in milk and sugar in water kefir is used by the kefir grains. So adding honey may defeat this good thing. Some people feel, like I used to, that honey is good and natural and needs little limiting. Alice ----- Original Message ----- From: Ellie Winslow As far as how honey is metabolized it is just like sugar--actually just like high fructose corn syrup. It may have a few vitamins and minerals but metabolically you're kidding yourself if you think it's not raising blood sugar and creating the metabolic havoc of frustose. Sorry, it's one of the myths. Ellie's New Adventure: http://mindingthemiddleagedmiddle.com How older, fatter folk can figure out what works for weight, health and aging! E-books, articles, blog and much more... Rural adventure: http://beyondthesidewalk.com Marketing Workshops, Books, blog/free newsletter, consulting for rural entrepreneurs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 8, 2011 Report Share Posted July 8, 2011 I certainly agree that anything, including honey, that is metabolized like sugar needs to be restricted and used lightly. Joyce On Fri, Jul 8, 2011 at 1:00 PM, Alice Connell <abconn@...> wrote: > ** > > > Ellie, > > Yes, even raw honey is metabolized just like sugar or corn syrup and even > like grains. I am not saying honey is like corn syrup as it at least does > not contain all the chemicals but it is metabolized just like sugar. Grains > can have more natural sugar makeup than some actual sugars. Ask someone who > has sugar restrictions and see how they have to limit grains, sugars of all > kinds including honey, and many fruits and even some veggies. So the key > here is MODERATION and monderation for some means much less to none while it > can mean small amounts for others. For me, it means none, not even grains > unless they are gluten free and even than, I make tham into a sourdough form > to eliminate natural sugar in them. I was stricken with a severe case of IBD > from strong antibotics that were needed for surgery for a broken wrist. A > little bit of honey, a small piece of organic apple, even those small > amounts of sugar didn't work for me. I am now mended beyond what I was > before the antibotics but it sure taught how sugar can feed the wrong > bacteria and make one miserable quickly. > > The reason kefir is so good for us is because the sugar in milk and sugar > in water kefir is used by the kefir grains. So adding honey may defeat this > good thing. Some people feel, like I used to, that honey is good and natural > and needs little limiting. > > Alice > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Ellie Winslow > > As far as how honey is metabolized it is just like sugar--actually just > like high fructose corn syrup. It may have a few vitamins and minerals but > metabolically you're kidding yourself if you think it's not raising blood > sugar and creating the metabolic havoc of frustose. Sorry, it's one of the > myths. > > Ellie's New Adventure: http://mindingthemiddleagedmiddle.com > How older, fatter folk can figure out what works for weight, health and > aging! > E-books, articles, blog and much more... > Rural adventure: http://beyondthesidewalk.com > Marketing Workshops, Books, blog/free newsletter, consulting for rural > entrepreneurs > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 8, 2011 Report Share Posted July 8, 2011 Dear Joyce, That is all that we need: more restrictions. It is bigger government that got us into this mess in the first place. If we had followed the Constitution, then we would not have so many restrictions and regulations. I have a heck of a time getting raw milk in my state. And the Preamble to the Constitution does not carry the weight of law. Liberals ask if something is good. Conservatives ask if something is right. Libertarians ask if something is free. Constitutionalists ask if something is constitutional. I thought that we were all Constitutionalists. After all, don't all office holders have to swear to defend and uphold the Constitution. Then they start off their work day ignoring the Constitution. and Katrina Bird's Incredibly Lucky Daddy > > From: jmillerwolfe@... > Date: Fri, 8 Jul 2011 13:20:59 -0500 > Subject: Re: still investigating > > I certainly agree that anything, including honey, that is metabolized like > sugar needs to be restricted and used lightly. > > Joyce Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 8, 2011 Report Share Posted July 8, 2011 Right on, Right on Right on, . It is so easy to take away freedom and so hard for people to keep it. Many people do just fine on sugar and honey-if they can regulate those they will continue to crack down on raw milk (like they have on raw honey) and other things we consider healthy but the mainstream does not. Lee Anne, Pennyslvania > > > Dear Joyce, > > That is all that we need: more restrictions. It is bigger government that got us into this mess in the first place. If we had followed the Constitution, then we would not have so many restrictions and regulations. I have a heck of a time getting raw milk in my state. > > And the Preamble to the Constitution does not carry the weight of law. > > Liberals ask if something is good. Conservatives ask if something is right. Libertarians ask if something is free. Constitutionalists ask if something is constitutional. I thought that we were all Constitutionalists. After all, don't all office holders have to swear to defend and uphold the Constitution. Then they start off their work day ignoring the Constitution. > > > > and Katrina Bird's Incredibly Lucky Daddy > > > > > > From: jmillerwolfe@... > > Date: Fri, 8 Jul 2011 13:20:59 -0500 > > Subject: Re: still investigating > > > > I certainly agree that anything, including honey, that is metabolized like > > sugar needs to be restricted and used lightly. > > > > Joyce > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 8, 2011 Report Share Posted July 8, 2011 Wait, we do need another law, one that requires everyone to make kefir and drink it daily. Then wouldn't we all smell good? Hydie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 8, 2011 Report Share Posted July 8, 2011 LOL. It would be good, wouldn't it. And good is all that some politically retarded people think of. and Katrina Bird's Incredibly Lucky Daddy From: moonlithorses@... Date: Fri, 8 Jul 2011 20:49:50 +0000 Subject: Re: still investigating Wait, we do need another law, one that requires everyone to make kefir and drink it daily. Then wouldn't we all smell good? Hydie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 8, 2011 Report Share Posted July 8, 2011 Oh, *drink* the kefir? Not put it under my arms to make me smell good? hmm... As far as law's: todays news in Colorado, some " rules " for day care centers are being finalized, and among the 95 pages, was a regulation only allowing day care's to give kids 1% milk. Talk about a Nanny State (pun intended). And complete lack of real nutrition knowledge. Note on honey vs sugar, etc: I have a 2 year old qt jar of raw honey, it's over 9/10's full. I use it when something i'm making is expecting/requires some sweetness (rare). As far as white sugar, only used in my house when making traditional sweet breads for holidays, or when making kombucha. So not much sugar used here. kefir ice cream recipe will be delayed a week or so, a circuit blew and my garage fridge/freezer was out for a week before I noticed. Three gallons of frozen goat milk had to be dumped along with several hundreds of dollars of formerly frozen meats & fish. When I get it cleaned up good, I'll be able to freeze my ice cream bowl again, and give everyone a proper recipe and update. Leo On Fri, Jul 8, 2011 at 2:49 PM, moonlithorses <moonlithorses@...>wrote: > ** > > > > Wait, we do need another law, one that requires everyone to make kefir and > drink it daily. Then wouldn't we all smell good? > Hydie > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 8, 2011 Report Share Posted July 8, 2011 Leo, Sorry for you loss but I can't help thinking of how my dogs would have feasted on that stuff, especially the milk. Alice >> > kefir ice cream recipe will be delayed a week or so, a circuit blew and my > garage fridge/freezer was out for a week before I noticed. Three gallons > of > frozen goat milk had to be dumped along with several hundreds of dollars > of > formerly frozen meats & fish. When I get it cleaned up good, I'll be able > to freeze my ice cream bowl again, and give everyone a proper recipe and > update. > > Leo > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 8, 2011 Report Share Posted July 8, 2011 Leo, That's cuz the one's who made these laws are stupid. That's what happens to brains who are deprived of some good full fat kefir and other good fats. Alice > Oh, *drink* the kefir? Not put it under my arms to make me smell good? > hmm... > > As far as law's: todays news in Colorado, some " rules " for day care > centers > are being finalized, and among the 95 pages, was a regulation only > allowing > day care's to give kids 1% milk. Talk about a Nanny State (pun intended). > And complete lack of real nutrition knowledge. > >> > Leo > > > On Fri, Jul 8, 2011 at 2:49 PM, moonlithorses > <moonlithorses@...>wrote: > >> ** >> >> >> >> Wait, we do need another law, one that requires everyone to make kefir >> and >> drink it daily. Then wouldn't we all smell good? >> Hydie >> >> >> > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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