Carbs

[Guest guest]

Hi Mike,

What book said that meats putrefy in our long digestive track? When you cook a meat it can sit out for a rather long time and it does not putrefy so why would anyone think it will in your digestive track? The animals with the short digestive tracts eat meats along with organs that are raw. I don't think I buy into the putrefy thing for that reason.

Bill

carbs

If you examine your teeth, you will find that you have canines, incisors, for biting and tearing, ripping(Carnivore) also molars for grinding grains and legumes, chewing, etc(Herbivore). If you look at the digestive track of a human compared to that of a carnivore, you will find that we have considerably more intestine that they do, giving food/meat more travel time and more space for meat to putrefy.

R. Gow, CPSThe S2A Group, Michigan Div.(810) 599-9625

group email addresses:Post message:longevity Subscribe: longevity-subscribe Unsubscribe: longevity-unsubscribe Questions/Complaints:longevity-owner If you are interested in injectable growth hormone then we suggest you subscribe to Rejuvenation. Send a blank email to rejuvenation-subscribe Note: This forum is for discussion of health related subjects, but under no circumstances should any of the information published here be considered a substitute for personal medical advice from a qualified physician. The founder/moderator is not an MD, nor are many of the subscribers/participants. Also, advice and information presented here by MD'sand other health care professionals should not be considered a substitute for personal medical advice.

[Guest guest]

carbs

If you examine your teeth, you will find that you have canines, incisors, for biting and tearing, ripping(Carnivore) also molars for grinding grains and legumes, chewing, etc(Herbivore). If you look at the digestive track of a human compared to that of a carnivore, you will find that we have considerably more intestine that they do, giving food/meat more travel time and more space for meat to putrefy.

R. Gow, CPSThe S2A Group, Michigan Div.(810) 599-9625

++ So, evolution goofed. We're adapted for meat-eating at the fore end

of our digestive tracts but maladapted at the nether end.

Probably not.

Al

[Guest guest]

Will some of you list your favorite clean clean carbs. I am on W3/C2

and I need some fat to come off and I know its my carbs. I follow BFL

guidelines, but any other ideas besides sweet potatos and oatmeal?

[Guest guest]

Fat Free yogurt with your cottage cheese!! I heard dairy is a great

source to helping you burn that fat.. but who knows if thats true. I

would try ff yogurt though or maybe some fruit if your not too

worried about the sugar.. thats the problem with fruit for me. I

would stick to berries.. ohh and i eat whole wheat english muffins

and those are mmm mm good. haha Hope this helps!

> Will some of you list your favorite clean clean carbs. I am on

W3/C2

> and I need some fat to come off and I know its my carbs. I follow

BFL

> guidelines, but any other ideas besides sweet potatos and oatmeal?

>

>

[Guest guest]

> I just ate carbs!

> Last night I made chai and it was crappy.

Marta,

Oh no! Now you're going to hell...lol I've led a very sheltered

life when it comes to ethnic food. What is " chai " ?

Hugs,

Laurie in WI

DS Revision 8/12/04

Dr. Ara Keshishian

196 days to go!!!

[Guest guest]

> I just ate carbs!

> Last night I made chai and it was crappy.

Marta,

Oh no! Now you're going to hell...lol I've led a very sheltered

life when it comes to ethnic food. What is " chai " ?

Hugs,

Laurie in WI

DS Revision 8/12/04

Dr. Ara Keshishian

196 days to go!!!

[Guest guest]

> Oh no! Now you're going to hell...lol I've led a very sheltered

> life when it comes to ethnic food. What is " chai " ?

Chai is Indian tea: spices, lowfat milk and tea. Very yummy. I

copied my gf's recipe after drinking hers for years, but tea is full

of oxalates...

Marta

[Guest guest]

> Oh no! Now you're going to hell...lol I've led a very sheltered

> life when it comes to ethnic food. What is " chai " ?

Chai is Indian tea: spices, lowfat milk and tea. Very yummy. I

copied my gf's recipe after drinking hers for years, but tea is full

of oxalates...

Marta

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 1/29/2004 9:11:54 PM Central Standard Time,

hevnbound1@... writes:

Marta,

Oh no! Now you're going to hell...lol I've led a very sheltered

life when it comes to ethnic food. What is " chai " ?

Hugs,

Laurie in WI

Oh,

Laurie, Marta is gonna have to introduce you to chai. I drank it post op

in Ca and liked it. I can't find the teatley brand here, and it just isn't the

same kind but it's good just not AS good.

in Bama

VBG 1982 (lost from 433lbs to 270's)

VBG to RNY1996 revision(Lost from 343 to 299)

RNY to DS revision Dec 2002 -down 118 lbs so far (377.7 to 259.4 and still

going

Homepage address- http://hometown.aol.com/mdl1031/myhomepage/profile.html

Many thanks to Dr. K willing to take on a 3rd timer....LOL

[Guest guest]

Hi Nick,

Great you can share your Kombucha tea with those who appreciate it:-))

The number of carbs would be different from batch to batch depending on how

much sugar was used to begin with and then how long the brew is fermented,

the temperature during fermentation, - the longer the fermentation the fewer

the carbs.

You can make it no carb by fermenting it 17 days or so until all the sugar

is used up. However it probably will taste more like vinegar than cider by

that time. It could be diluted with water at that point and Stevia added for

sweetening. However, most people like it best at 7-10 days.

Peace, Love and Harmony,

Bev

[Guest guest]

1. This may sound simple-minded, but I used the authorized foods list.

If it's in the vegetable category, it's a vegetable. If it's in the

carb category it's a carb. If it's not on either list and it has more

than 15g of cabs per serving, I call it a carb.

http://www.bodyforlife.com/nutrition/foodlist.asp

2. The closer it is to the way it came out of the ground, the better.

Other than that, it depends on your goals. To answer your specific

questions, yams are more fat-loss friendly than grains. Yams are also

more fat-loss friendly than white potatoes because they're lower

glycemic and more nutrient dense. But the glycemic index/load doesn't

tell the whole story. It depends on what you're trying to do. Plenty

of times I *want* the food that's higher glycemic or more calorie

dense. Pre and post workout I'm looking for things like cereal,

bagels, bananas, white potatoes, honey, and pasta. Before the workout

they give me quick energy, after the workout they replenish glycogen

stores quickly and they create an insulin spike that helps with

creatine uptake. Just because a food is high-glycemic or calorie-dense

doesn't necessarily mean that it's bad or should be totally avoided.

White potatoes are a fine example. They're spectacular for workout

recovery and loaded with potassium but people are scared to death of

them, either because they're high-glycemic or because they're white.

An important thing to remember on BFL is that the glycemic index and

glycemic load of various foods is almost irrelevant due to the fact

that we never ever eat carbs alone. You're always going to be having

them with protein, and usually some fat. That will keep your blood

sugar stable even if you ate something like cotton candy as your carb.

Really all you're looking for in a quality carb is something that's

close to its natural state, nutrient dense, and fairly high in fiber.

So, beans, yams, oats, corn, berries, and apples are awesome. White

bread, Fruit Loops and Pop Tarts, not so much.

If you want quick overview of what's low/high glycemic, here's a good chart:

http://www.mendosa.com/common_foods.htm

On 1/26/06, n <mtpaper@...> wrote:

> Two Carby/Vegetable questions:

>

> 1. What guidelines do folks use for determining whether a vegetable (such

> as spaghetti squash) is carb or vegetable? I restrict my carbs; I don't

> restrict my vegetables.

>

> 2. I know that some carbs are.... more nutritional than others. For

> example, grains are better metabolically than ww bread or ww pasta. But

> what is the hierarchy? Are grains better than yams? Are yams better than

> white potatoes? And is this because of the fiber content of each carb or

> is it based on something else? Is this related to each item's glycemic

> index? Or Glycemic Load? I've tried surfing around about this, but I'm

> getting information overload. Years ago I was diagnosed as being

> hypoglemic. Can anyone lead me to a simple, direct website that shows

> which carbs are healthier for me to eat than other carbs????

>

> Thank you!

> n T.

>

>

> At 11:58 PM 1/25/2006, you wrote:

> >Spaghetti squash is the only winter squash that is more like zuchini

> >and the summer squashes. The winter squashes are low, but the spaghetti

> >squash is LOWER, and can be counted as a vegie, not a carb !!!

> >--->

> >

> >fitday.com 1 CUP serving

> >acorn (winter) squash: 15g CARB, 56cal, 1.1g protein, 0 fat

> >butternut: 16g CARB, 63cal; 1.4g protein, 0 fat

> >

> >Squash, summer yellow 5g CARB, 23 cal, 1g protein, 0 fat

> >spaghetti squash 7g CARB, 31 cal, .5g fat, .6gm protein

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

In other words - KISS - Keep It Simple Sister.

Thanks

n

At 06:28 PM 1/26/2006, you wrote:

>Really all you're looking for in a quality carb is something that's

>close to its natural state, nutrient dense, and fairly high in fiber.

>So, beans, yams, oats, corn, berries, and apples are awesome. White

>bread, Fruit Loops and Pop Tarts, not so much.

[Guest guest]

-

Having said that... what is your opinion on snacking on veggies

throughout the day if you have the munchies? I am not talking HUNGER

here... I am talking: Sitting at your desk, bored (well, bored with

the work your doing and really in a munchy mood? I know that we

should FIGHT the munchies and it should be a habit that is broken...

but, with that giant feat put aside, do you think it would be

detrimental to snack on baby carrots or celery or any other veggie?

I know this is a silly question, but it was one of my many ponders I

had yesterday while I was munching on said carrots

Was it bad not to throw in a protien, or am I jsut equally doing my

body good?

Thanx!!!! You da best!

> > >Spaghetti squash is the only winter squash that is more like

zuchini

> > >and the summer squashes. The winter squashes are low, but the

spaghetti

> > >squash is LOWER, and can be counted as a vegie, not a carb !!!

> > >--->

> > >

> > >fitday.com 1 CUP serving

> > >acorn (winter) squash: 15g CARB, 56cal, 1.1g protein, 0 fat

> > >butternut: 16g CARB, 63cal; 1.4g protein, 0

fat

> > >

> > >Squash, summer yellow 5g CARB, 23 cal, 1g protein, 0 fat

> > >spaghetti squash 7g CARB, 31 cal, .5g fat, .6gm

protein

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Yes, it would be bad. When you're eating six or more meals a day, you

shouldn't be snacking between them - whether you're eating veggies, or

rice cakes, or the carpeting. Allowing yourself to eat out of boredom

or to entertain yourself or kill time is a very bad habit. It's likely

that very urge that caused a weight problem in the first place.

Also, if you're eating veggies (carbs basically) with no protein,

you're jacking with your insulin levels. You're not having any protein

to keep your blood sugar stable and so you're likely to just make the

desire to eat worse, and as it gets worse you're more likely to do

stupid things with the vegetables, like dip them in ranch dressing or

cheez whiz, or chase them with a bunch of Hershey's Kisses off of a

co-workers desk.

If you want to eat a lot of raw veggies and linger over them and make

them last awhile, have them with a protein portion like seasoned

cottage cheese dip. Make it one of your meals though, not just part of

an eat-all-day plan.

That said, if you're going to have a munchie breakdown, it's

definitely better to binge on celery and broccoli than to hit the

vending machine. :-)

On 1/27/06, Carley Easton <carleyeaston@...> wrote:

> -

> Having said that... what is your opinion on snacking on veggies

> throughout the day if you have the munchies? I am not talking HUNGER

> here... I am talking: Sitting at your desk, bored (well, bored with

> the work your doing and really in a munchy mood? I know that we

> should FIGHT the munchies and it should be a habit that is broken...

> but, with that giant feat put aside, do you think it would be

> detrimental to snack on baby carrots or celery or any other veggie?

> I know this is a silly question, but it was one of my many ponders I

> had yesterday while I was munching on said carrots

> Was it bad not to throw in a protien, or am I jsut equally doing my

> body good?

>

> Thanx!!!! You da best!

>

>

> > > >Spaghetti squash is the only winter squash that is more like

> zuchini

> > > >and the summer squashes. The winter squashes are low, but the

> spaghetti

> > > >squash is LOWER, and can be counted as a vegie, not a carb !!!

> > > >--->

> > > >

> > > >fitday.com 1 CUP serving

> > > >acorn (winter) squash: 15g CARB, 56cal, 1.1g protein, 0 fat

> > > >butternut: 16g CARB, 63cal; 1.4g protein, 0

> fat

> > > >

> > > >Squash, summer yellow 5g CARB, 23 cal, 1g protein, 0 fat

> > > >spaghetti squash 7g CARB, 31 cal, .5g fat, .6gm

> protein

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

[Guest guest]

Ahhh, say it ain't so.

That's what I figured... I totally eat out of boredom, or anger.

Thanks for putting what I didn't want to hear in black and white!

Oh, and thankfully, I can't tell you the last time I put $ in a

vending machine... other than to get a water or the occasional diet

soda... PHEW!

Hey, have you heard much about Ostrich sticks? I purchased some to

taste last night...

http://www.netrition.com/ostrim_page.html

> > > > >Spaghetti squash is the only winter squash that is more like

> > zuchini

> > > > >and the summer squashes. The winter squashes are low, but

the

> > spaghetti

> > > > >squash is LOWER, and can be counted as a vegie, not a

carb !!!

> > > > >--->

> > > > >

> > > > >fitday.com 1 CUP serving

> > > > >acorn (winter) squash: 15g CARB, 56cal, 1.1g protein, 0 fat

> > > > >butternut: 16g CARB, 63cal; 1.4g

protein, 0

> > fat

> > > > >

> > > > >Squash, summer yellow 5g CARB, 23 cal, 1g protein, 0 fat

> > > > >spaghetti squash 7g CARB, 31 cal, .5g fat, .6gm

> > protein

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

[Guest guest]

I love Ostrim. Teriyaki and Barbecue are my favorites. I sometimes

take ostrich jerky and dried apricots with me in place of a bar.

On 1/27/06, Carley Easton <carleyeaston@...> wrote:

>

> Hey, have you heard much about Ostrich sticks? I purchased some to

> taste last night...

> http://www.netrition.com/ostrim_page.html

[Guest guest]

Cool, I bought Natural and peppered! I like that it's a lower sodium-

though I don't like the nitrates... but could be worse...

> >

> > Hey, have you heard much about Ostrich sticks? I purchased some to

> > taste last night...

> > http://www.netrition.com/ostrim_page.html

>

[Guest guest]

> Two Carby/Vegetable questions:

> 1. What guidelines do folks use for determining whether

> a vegetable (such as spaghetti squash) is carb or vegetable?

> I restrict my carbs; I don't restrict my vegetables.

Oh but you should ..

This has always been a sticky picky point of mine ;-)

There are only three food groups: protein/carbs/fats.

Vegetables *are* carbs. They dont make up a fourth food group.

They are carbs, just much better for you than say a piece of white

bread. So its all about choices within a carb parameter.

You have your carb portion (like chicken) now I want a carb, but oh

I want some brown rice AND brocolli so I have 1/4 to 1/2 of each to

make a whole carb portion on my plate. BALANCE! OR I eat a much

larger portion of broccoli and call that my counter balance to my

protein. A much slimmer choice IMHO.

ONE spear of broccoli contains 9grams carbs/5 grams protein (only 50

calories) while brown rice for a 1/2cup contains 25 grams

carbs/2grams protein (115 calories) - see the difference? Many

people eat the larger portion of rice AND a humongous portion of

broccoli (or other veggies) thinking the veg carb doesnt count

somehow like its made of air! Sometimes you may want a portion of a

denser carb or sometimes you wont and go for just the veggies - its

this choice of carbs that I think makes a better transformation for

alot of people! Again its ALL about choices, but they are all in the

same 'carb food group' just as a poptart is! (poptart=33grams

carbs/2grams protein/210 calories!) Would I have some string cheese

and a poptart? Hey its a carb! Ehhhhh!(buzzer noise)! wrong choice!

(ok can eat a Cadbury egg with a protein shake but thats not

the norm ok! LoL!) Bottom line - KNOW thy carbs - dont make them a

fourth food group!

joni

-----------------------------------------------

*carb count in vegetables list:

http://weightloss.about.com/cs/vegetables/index.htm

[Guest guest]

OMG, this was the BEST POST I ever read. I felt as if you were

talking to me. I'm always eating 1/2 cup of rice (or sweet potato)

and about 2 cups of steamed cabbage.... I tend to overdose on the

veggies because they are so low in cal. I never thought about the

carbs.

I too have been having slow progress (C1W3D7) and have not lost a

pound. I'm going to pay better attention to my portions from now on.

I think I've been focusing too much on the calories.

> > Two Carby/Vegetable questions:

> > 1. What guidelines do folks use for determining whether

> > a vegetable (such as spaghetti squash) is carb or vegetable?

> > I restrict my carbs; I don't restrict my vegetables.

>

> Oh but you should ..

> This has always been a sticky picky point of mine ;-)

> There are only three food groups: protein/carbs/fats.

> Vegetables *are* carbs. They dont make up a fourth food group.

> They are carbs, just much better for you than say a piece of white

> bread. So its all about choices within a carb parameter.

> You have your carb portion (like chicken) now I want a carb, but

oh

> I want some brown rice AND brocolli so I have 1/4 to 1/2 of each

to

> make a whole carb portion on my plate. BALANCE! OR I eat a much

> larger portion of broccoli and call that my counter balance to my

> protein. A much slimmer choice IMHO.

> ONE spear of broccoli contains 9grams carbs/5 grams protein (only

50

> calories) while brown rice for a 1/2cup contains 25 grams

> carbs/2grams protein (115 calories) - see the difference? Many

> people eat the larger portion of rice AND a humongous portion of

> broccoli (or other veggies) thinking the veg carb doesnt count

> somehow like its made of air! Sometimes you may want a portion of

a

> denser carb or sometimes you wont and go for just the veggies -

its

> this choice of carbs that I think makes a better transformation

for

> alot of people! Again its ALL about choices, but they are all in

the

> same 'carb food group' just as a poptart is! (poptart=33grams

> carbs/2grams protein/210 calories!) Would I have some string

cheese

> and a poptart? Hey its a carb! Ehhhhh!(buzzer noise)! wrong

choice!

> (ok can eat a Cadbury egg with a protein shake but thats not

> the norm ok! LoL!) Bottom line - KNOW thy carbs - dont make them a

> fourth food group!

>

>

> joni

> -----------------------------------------------

> *carb count in vegetables list:

> http://weightloss.about.com/cs/vegetables/index.htm

>

[Guest guest]

Orrrr, I can continue to choose not to restrict my vegetables, and be

content that my transformation may not be as rapid or dramatic! I refuse

to measure my lettuce or broccoli. I may change that next month, or next

year. But, for the time being, this is the way it is.

I have been finding that my lunch and dinner portions - because of the

volume of green stuff - are too big, and I'm often not ready for Meal 4 or

6. But I need to get to that place when I'm ready. For the time being, I

like seeing my chicken and rice on a big bed of lettuce. It makes me

happy. It makes me content. It makes this a way of eating I can do

forever. I need to modify the volume of the green stuff, but it's more

because of portion size, not carb content.

I SHOULD do what I can live with, on an extended basis. I've decided, for

myself, that winter squashes (including spaghetti squash) are carbs, not

vegetables.

n

PS - I am aware that vegs are carbs, having low-carbed for 9-12 months;

however, their benefit for me outweighs my including them in my daily carb

allottment

At 11:00 AM 1/29/2006, you wrote:

><SNIP> I don't restrict my vegetables.

>

>Oh but you should ..

>This has always been a sticky picky point of mine ;-)

<SNIP>

[Guest guest]

I'm still pondering your " sticky picky point " of including green vegetables

in your daily carb allowance. Are you trying to follow the ratio of 40%

carb, 40% protein & 20% fat? I don't think there's any place where BFL

uses the 40/40/20 ratio - I'm not sure of its source. Simple BFL method is

a palm-sized portion of protein, a fist-sized portion of carb, and a smidge

of healthy fat, and " a portion of vegetables to at least two meals each

day. " If we apply the 40/40/20 ratio to that, then clearly the 40/40/20

excludes the vegetables.

Tom Venuto, from Burn the Fat, Feed the Muscle uses the ratio of 50% carb,

30% protein and 20% fat - and includes vegetables in the carb count. He

says:

The 3-2-1 method for calculating nutrient ratios

A very simple way to estimate your nutrient ratios is to follow the 3-2-1

rule. Here's how it works: Imagine your plate divided into six sections

like slices of a pie. Fill

up three slices (3/6 or 50%) with natural carbohydrates like potatoes,

yams, oatmeal, whole grains, fruits and vegetables. Fill up two sections

(2/6 or 33%) with lean proteins like egg whites, chicken or fish. Finish

with one section of fat (1/6 or 17%). This simple method puts you very

close to the optimal ratios for a baseline diet and you don't need to be a

math whiz to figure it out.

Therefore, I honestly think it's all the same thing. I think the ratio of

40/40/20 excluding vegetables is very likely comparable to 50/30/20

including vegetables.

Bottom line - I'm eating great healthy food, lean protein, smidge of

healthy fat. I'm clear of processed foods, white flour, sugar, junk. I

will continue the KISS theory (Keep it simple sister) on the basis of

continuing this in a long term lifestyle that I can maintain.

Have a great healthy week -

n

At 02:01 PM 1/29/2006, you wrote:

><SNIP>

> >

> > Oh but you should ..

> > This has always been a sticky picky point of mine ;-)

> > There are only three food groups: protein/carbs/fats.

> >

[Guest guest]

Okay, I just went through fitday and I checked to see what the carb

portions was for a lot of veggies:

ex.

1 cup of broccoli: carbs: 8 g (44 cal)

1 cup of lettuce: 1g (7 cal)

1 cup of cabbage: 5 g (22 cal)

1 cup of apple: 17 g (65 cal)

1 cup of grapes: 28 g (114 cal)

1 cup of banana: 35g (138 cal)

Okay, so it seems as if we would have to eat a WHOLE bunch of

veggies to significantly alter the carb (and cal)content. Hence, I

guess it's okay not to count it. However, fruits are a different

story.....I think I will continue to splurge on the veggies, but be

mindful of the fruits.

> ><SNIP>

> > >

> > > Oh but you should ..

> > > This has always been a sticky picky point of mine ;-)

> > > There are only three food groups: protein/carbs/fats.

> > >

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Fruits are clearly counted as carbs in BFL's program.... that was never an

issue for me. I only exclude the lettuce, cabbage, kale, broccoli, cukes

from my carb count. Carrots are borderline for me. They're carby, but 99%

of the time I am using part of a grated carrot in my

salad. Negligible. About once a month, when we bring home fresh baby

carrots, I am drawn to eat a bunch of them. And you know what? So be it.

I assure you - I didn't get fat by overeating carrots - baby carrots or

mature carrots!

n

At 03:38 PM 1/29/2006, you wrote:

><SNIP>

>Okay, so it seems as if we would have to eat a WHOLE bunch of

>veggies to significantly alter the carb (and cal)content. Hence, I

>guess it's okay not to count it. However, fruits are a different

>story.....I think I will continue to splurge on the veggies, but be

>mindful of the fruits.<SNIP>

>

>----------

[Guest guest]

I'm a long-term BFLer at almost 6 years total, but the last 4 years

steady. I was super morbidly obese (a real medical term), now I'm

just overweight! I've gone from 340-185 and I've made some

adjustments that I could live with for a lifetime. For me, what

works is lots of veggies. After a free day I usually eat an entire

bunch of celery throughout the day on top of my usual meals. I need

filler to keep me satiated. I also don't scrimp on the romaine

lettuce. I will put 5oz of salmon on my biggest dinner plate filled

with romaine. I also eat a lot of ginger, tomatoes, and peppercinis

with my salads. The only time I use big dinner plates is for my

salads, otherwise the small plates are for non-lettuce meals. I do

understand balance, but my body works so much better when I don't

eat carbs in the evening. If I stop my carbs at 3pm (meal 3 or 4)

then I don't experience night-snacking (a huge problem for me).

If BFL is treated as the title suggests people do find their own

little workable niches. The foundation of BFL is phenomenal and

saved my life. I can live with this and that's the point.

dj

> ><SNIP> I don't restrict my vegetables.

> >

> >Oh but you should ..

> >This has always been a sticky picky point of mine ;-)

> <SNIP>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hi n,

As long as you get a wide variety of fruits, vegetables, protein, and

healthy fats, I doubt that a week or two without grains would be

terrible.

However, your question got me wondering and digging.

I remember hearing about whole grains and brown rice being a good

sources of vitamin B-1, Thiamine,. That's worth looking into...

Whole grains and brown rice are great sources of silicon.

This is from the Balch book;

" Silicon is the second most abundant element on the planet (oxygen is

the first). It is necessary for the formation of collegen for bones

and connective tissue; for healthy nails, skin, and hair; and for

calcium absorption in the early stages of bone formation. It is

needed to maintain flexible arteries, and plays a major role in

preventing cardiovascular disease. Silicon counteracts the eggects of

aluminum on the body and is important in the prevention of Alzheimer's

disease and osteoporosis. It stimulates the immune system and

inhibits the aging process in tissues. Silicon levels decrease with

aging, so elderly people need larger amounts. "

" Foods that contain silicon include;

alfalfa, beetss, brown rice, the herb horsetail, bell peppers,

soybeans, leafy green vegetables, and whole grains. "

Zinc is another important element that is not available from fruits.

Good news; parsley,poultry, and mushrooms are common sources.

We lose zinc through perspiration. (I didn't know that.)

Consumption of hard water and also fiber causes zinc to be excreted

through the intestinal tract.

She mentions grains as a source for zinc, but later states;

" Compounds called phytates that are found in grains and legumes bind

with zinc so that it cannot be absorbed. " (Go figure

Deficiency of zinc may result in the loss of the senses of taste and

smell. It can also couse fingernails to become thin, pel, and develop

white spots. Other possible signs of deficiency include; acne,

fatigue, hair loss, high cholesterol levels, impaired night vision,

impotence, increased suseptibility to infection, infertility, memory

impairment, a propensity to diabetes, prostate trouble, recurrent

colds and flu, and slow wound healing.

Don't take zinc and iron together, they interfere with each other's

activity.

This is probably more than you wanted to hear, but I learned alot

sharing it anyway

Excuse me while I take my white flecked fingernails over to get a zinc

lozenge to suck on

> Can someone remind me of why I should (or if I should) deliberately

> add back starchy carbs?