Fungdar

[Guest guest]

A quick addendum to the personal reaction testing business. I know a lot has

been said about the process of developing one's senses for use in staying safe.

I have recently been confronted with a very negative practical outcome to that

whole discussion and wanted to correct something:

When a person is still so very toxic that the reactivity is constant - there

simply IS no way to develop that sense ( " fungdar " ). Finding out what you react

to requires first getting clear of the exposure long enough to have a new

reaction. NOT everybody will feel better when away from the acute exposure for

just a couple of days. I was not able to begin distingushing hits until several

months after the acute exposure had ended. and Jonathon went even further

with establishing a baseline for themselves, but the same principle applies -

it's like a light switch - it only has two positions. If it's already turned on,

you can't turn it on some more. You have to turn it off first, if you want to

see the lights come on again. Otherwise, it's like hoping to see a black cat in

a dark room on a moonless night - and visual contrast sensitivity isn't the only

lack of contrast you get along with the toxicity. Job One has to be ending the

acute exposure. Developing fungdar is ONLY useful

as a means of avoiding new exposures once the acute exposure has ended and

sensing new reactions becomes possible again. You have to get safe first. You

can get smarter about staying safe later when you begin to feel a bit better!

Serena

www.freeboards.net/index.php?mforum=sickgovernmentb

---------------------------------

for Good

Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort.

[Guest guest]

Developing fungdar is ONLY useful

> as a means of avoiding new exposures once the acute exposure has ended and

> sensing new reactions becomes possible again. You have to get safe first.

> You can get smarter about staying safe later when you begin to feel a bit

> better!>

> Serena

Serena thank you for posting this. You are 100% correct. When I first

became ill due to the mold (whatever it was since we didn't test) I was so

reactive to any and everything including chemicals and fragrances I couldn't

figure out what I was reacting to and certainly couldn't use my own body as

a " mold detector " . As I'm becoming healthier it's easier to do.

I know many that are being constantly exposed, some are living in their

cars, having fled their unsafe homes, but due to their ill health they are

not capable of being able to detect nor protect themselves from exposures

since they have gone from mold illness to multiple chemical sensitivity

illness. Some I know will attempt to find safe shelter, they think the

dwelling is safe after an hour or two in the dwelling, sign a lease and only

to find out the first night in the new home they are reactive and have to

flee again.

Rosie

[Guest guest]

> Developing fungdar is ONLY useful as a means of avoiding new

exposures once the acute exposure has ended and sensing new

reactions becomes possible again. You have to get safe first.

You can get smarter about staying safe later when you begin to feel

a bit better!>

> > Serena

>

Yes. That's why I make it clear that going to a pristine place isn't

a cure, what you are looking for is " As good as it gets " .

This way you identify the DIRECTION you want to push.

Lowering toxic load is a journey, not an instant cure.

But, as always, I have to throw it another complication.

The upregulation of systemic Immune Complement Factors involves a

delayed response. When I did my " proximity testing " , the peak of my

response occured FOUR HOURS after the " hit " and then tapered off.

I had to keep track of my movements in order to make a correlation

with primary slammers that had happened hours ago instead of

automatically implicating the current location.

It's always got to be something 'eh?

But if this were easy, it would have been entirely figured out a

long time ago.

And Carl. Where the heck you been all these years?

I went through hundreds of doctors, many of them the most famous CFS

specialists and researchers in the world, and NOBODY knew what I was

talking about. Even Eckhard Johannings office said that they had

never seen anyone like me.

-

[Guest guest]

--- In , SERENA EDWARDS <pushcrash@y...>

wrote:

> A quick addendum to the personal reaction testing business. I know

a lot has been said about the process of developing one's senses for

use in staying safe. I have recently been confronted with a very

negative practical outcome to that whole discussion and wanted to

correct something:

>

> When a person is still so very toxic that the reactivity is

constant - there simply IS no way to develop that sense ( " fungdar " ).

Finding out what you react to requires first getting clear of the

exposure long enough to have a new reaction. NOT everybody will feel

better when away from the acute exposure for just a couple of days. I

was not able to begin distingushing hits until several months after

the acute exposure had ended.

I know when I first got ill I didn't notice the smell of the mold

when I left the house for a little while. But I remember I would go

to see my grandmother and I would stay for 5 or 6 hours and I would

get home and the smell would hit me in the face. That is when I was

getting very weak and could figure out why I was so weak and I was

usually very active.

[Guest guest]

And...could someone give me the steps for getting better.....Drs., medicines,

foods etc. I just recently found out I have been exposed to

stachy,aspergil,pencill for apx 1 yr at a very highlevel of spore

count...1,600,800. ANY advice would be greatly appreciated as my son and I are

both very ill.

SERENA EDWARDS <pushcrash@...> wrote:A quick addendum to the personal

reaction testing business. I know a lot has been said about the process of

developing one's senses for use in staying safe. I have recently been confronted

with a very negative practical outcome to that whole discussion and wanted to

correct something:

When a person is still so very toxic that the reactivity is constant - there

simply IS no way to develop that sense ( " fungdar " ). Finding out what you react

to requires first getting clear of the exposure long enough to have a new

reaction. NOT everybody will feel better when away from the acute exposure for

just a couple of days. I was not able to begin distingushing hits until several

months after the acute exposure had ended. and Jonathon went even further

with establishing a baseline for themselves, but the same principle applies -

it's like a light switch - it only has two positions. If it's already turned on,

you can't turn it on some more. You have to turn it off first, if you want to

see the lights come on again. Otherwise, it's like hoping to see a black cat in

a dark room on a moonless night - and visual contrast sensitivity isn't the only

lack of contrast you get along with the toxicity. Job One has to be ending the

acute exposure. Developing fungdar is ONLY useful

as a means of avoiding new exposures once the acute exposure has ended and

sensing new reactions becomes possible again. You have to get safe first. You

can get smarter about staying safe later when you begin to feel a bit better!

Serena

www.freeboards.net/index.php?mforum=sickgovernmentb

---------------------------------

for Good

Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort.

[Guest guest]

As stated, Faith, Job One is to get into a safe environment. There isn't any

magic bullet that will overcome acute ongoing exposure. I think you said the

exposure was in your home. If I'm recalling that correctly, then you need to get

into another living situation without taking your current belongings with you,

as they would be contaminated. Some people opt to move and put their stuff into

storage for later disposition. Some people just trash or sell off everything and

make a break for it. Most end up switching vehicles, as those become

cross-contaminated as well. Some people move entirely outdoors - not too

practical when you have children, but some of the single guys have pulled it off

very well (I jokingly call them " The Boy Scouts " ). I can only relay to you what

I've heard from others, since I was exposed in the workplace rather than at

home. But the first step is always the same: end the exposure, first and

foremost. I wish it was easier, but there you have it. I've yet to hear

of anyone who thought they could delay this inevitable step without paying the

price in worsening health - and that only makes it harder or eventually

downright impossible to pull off the move and eventual recovery. So first, get

safe.

After you do that, you need to get with one of the docs KC posted this week for

treatment. How you proceed from there is going to depend entirely on the kind of

doctor you see, what the diagnosis is, and how they treat. They aren't all the

same, and not all of us have the same problems. Some are allergic, some toxic,

some have fungal infections, and all kinds of combinations of those and other

physical conditions. Therefore, there is no generic fix you can just download

from the internet. The main trick is to get with a doc who can correctly

diagnose and treat any or all of those. Ending the present exposure and avoiding

future exposures is essential, but it doesn't fix whatever damage has already

been done. If you're sick, you need good medical care, period.

As you get better, you'll start to develop your own techniques for avoiding

further exposures. It kind of has to go that way, because everyone reacts

differently, as described above. If you have the genetic predisposition for not

being able to unload the toxins, you won't ever be able to tolerate exposures

like this again - unless medical science figures out a way to turn off the genes

that cause it. And that is probably a long way off, if it's going to happen at

all. There's a backlog of discussion on the whole avoidance topic, and you

probably can find most of it by searching the postings here for the words

" avoidance " or more recently, " fungdar " and reading those threads. That'll give

you a pretty good general rundown of various member's input on the subject.

And whatever else you do, read " Mold Warriors " ! You may want to read other stuff

later, but that one book will give you more education and tools than anything I

could possible say here. You can get a copy at www.moldwarriors.com. Amongst

many other things, the book discusses the differences in the way this affects

children as opposed to adults. You'll be wanting that information, for sure.

Do let us know how it's going for you!

Serena

www.freeboards.net/index.php?mforum=sickgovernmentb

---------------------------------

for Good

Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort.

[Guest guest]

This " boy scout " went to the desert and when I started to " clear "

and gained the ability to perceive specific contaminated zones, my

damn jacket alone was enough to keep me upregulated.

Once I was going nuts trying to figure out why I couldn't " break the

response " and it was my hat!

This is a horrible thing, and I never proposed MADNESS as a viable

therapy. I told doctors " This is one HELL OF A CLUE' as to the

nature of CFS.

I just wanted it RESEARCHED rather than instantly denied.

When Dr Cheney asked me to volunteer to be in the CDC study group to

define " CFS " , it was thought that this was PURELY a viral illness.

I actually tried to refuse, since I had already told him that mold

was making me ill, and according to his model of viral illness, I

figured that this would be an obfusticating factor. But he didn't

seem to care about the mold connection, so I went ahead and

participated thinking that when CFS is researched, as a prototypical

case, it would FORCE them to clarify the role of mold in CFS.

Amazingly enough, I could never get ANY of the CFS doctors or

researchers to pay the slightest attention - even when I shouted it

at them and pounded my fist on their desks.

I've done a lot of writing about my dismay at this failure of

doctors, but it was even more amazing to go to CFS groups and talk

to people giving me " mold hits " and show them pictures of me

mountain climbing and have them show even less interest than the

doctors.

I thought that when people started to gain awareness of mold that it

might become easier to present this concept, but as you can see,

I've been saying in this very group for five years now and

was the only person to take an interest.

Some Moldies are pretty desperate, so I find it surprising that they

would rather carry on as they have than make the slightest effort to

do the Boy Scout thing.

If you check my old messages, you can see my story where I met a

girl-doctor as a result of feeling " hits " from her clothing and we

wound up having a Jamboree out in the woods.

-