Re: My new treatment protocal

[Guest guest]

Kay,

What is the name of this protazoan?

Thanks,

Ellen

I have learned so much lately from group emails and related websearches have

led to the following;

Due to your posts regarding biofilm and oxalates, I recently saw Fry

MD whose undergrad work was in microbiology and who owns his own lab in

sdale, Arizona. At our first appointment, Dr. Fry told me that 2 years

ago, he discovered a protazoan inside biofilm that's similar to the malaria

parasite in 100% of the CFS patients he tests. Dr. Fry has focused his work on

CFS for the last 19 years. Since this discovery, he treated all of his CFS

patients with antibiotics and anti-malaria drugs reversing CFS in 70%. His CFS

patients who had had it for the longest were the 30% whose symptoms were the

most difficult until he learned that the food for this protazoan was fat. That

was 6 months ago. Since putting all of his CFS patients on the

antibiotic/antimalaria drugs plus a fat free diet and enzymes to breakdown

biofilm, he has had 100% success in treating CFS.

He also told me he can only get us well when we stop magnesium supplements.

He said that we are not actually low in magnesium. Rather that because

magnesium is an essential component of biofilm, the biofilm robs magnesium from

our blood to increase its' population making us look magnesium deficient. So

when we take magnesium supplements we are actually feeding the biofilm and

making ourselves worse. This was quite a revelation to me. Dr. Fry does lab

smeers to test. Mine revealed well developed biofilm and the protazoan so I

have just started his treatment protacol. You can keyword Fry Laboraties if you

wish, for a list of the CFS and Lyme disease related tests his lab does. He

will work with your doctors if you wish.

Although I'm not crazy about drugs or more antibiotics, I feel them a

necessary step to kill the bugs. Since my urine acid test results indicated

high oxalates, I went on the low oxalate diet too. And since I've stopped

taking all magnesium, I'm using cal citrate with meals to bind with the oxalates

and carry them out. I'm also taking Lifestar Glutathene since low glutatheine

seems part of this circle of events too. Without magnesium my bowels don't move

so I'm drinking prune juice and senna tea and doing enemas for now.

Dr. Fry says I will probably feel sicker for the first 2 months due to Herx

and should start to feel better in about 3 months. From the day I woke up with

CFS 28 years ago, my body temp has been low. He said that when the protazoan is

under control my body temp will be normal again. It should take 3-5 months.

After that I plan on getting back my good gut bacteria with a stool infusion

treatment. Web searching this afternoon, I found Dr. Khoruts, University

of Minnesota Gastroenterologist, 763-898-1000 and Dr. Lawrence Brandt at

Montefiore Medical Center in New York who are doing fecal transplants in the US.

I'm sending a letter to Dr. Fry tomorrow to see if he knows of a

gastroenterologist here in Arizona who does or will do the procedure when my

antibiotic treatment is finished. I'm learning the importance of doing things

in the right order. Kill the bugs first then repopulate the gut with good

bacteria is what I'm thinking.

I of course, am no doctor. Just sharing what I'm in the beginning of trying.

It's similar to what has done to get her good results. If anyone reading

this has input that might help me, I would appreciate it and I will let you all

know in a few months what my results are.

Kay

[Guest guest]

Kay Siegrist wrote:

> I have learned so much lately from group emails and related websearches have

led to the following;

I have to express my extreme skepticism. Dr. Fry claims to be a Lyme

researcher for over 14 years, yet I cannot find any papers he's written

on the subject. He claims to have 100% success in treating CFS, yet no

one seems to know anything about his treatment. There have been no

press releases, news reports or scientific papers that I can find.

Where is his proof, other than his word?

Plenty of people have undergrad degrees in microbiology. That doesn't

make him an expert in the field. His M.S. is in molecular biology.

He's a GP, not an infectious disease specialist. In fact, I checked him

out and discovered he is not board certified in *ANY* medical specialty.

He is an FAA medical examiner, i.e. he does medical exams for pilots

.... to determine that they are medically fit to fly.

He claims he discovered a protozoa inside biofilm that's similar to the

malaria parasite. Why are there no scientific papers on this supposed

discovery?

Furthermore, he owns his own lab where *all* the testing is done, and he

does not accept any insurance. That is a *HUGE* conflict of interest.

It has been illegal in the states of Florida, Illinois and New York for

nearly two decades. He also does not accept samples drawn in New York

state. What's up with that? Probably due to the conflict of interest.

All of this is highly suspect and smacks of a major scam to me.

Jeri <teewinot13@...>

@>--->---->-------------------<----<---<@

Dr. Pall's NO/ONOO- Theory/Treatment Discussion Group:

TenthParadigmSociety

@>----------<---------->-----------------------<----------<----------<@

The Tenth Paradigm - Dr. Pall's Website for CFS/MCS/FM/ETC.:

http://www.thetenthparadigm.org

@>----------<---------->-----------------------<----------<----------<@

MCS-Florida - For All Chemically Sensitive Floridians

MCS-Florida

[Guest guest]

I recognize the possible conflict of interest and you're right I have no proof

that he has accomplished what he says.  I'm simply passing on to you what I'm

trying.  Kay

> I have learned so much lately from group emails and related websearches have

led to the following;

I have to express my extreme skepticism. Dr. Fry claims to be a Lyme

researcher for over 14 years, yet I cannot find any papers he's written

on the subject. He claims to have 100% success in treating CFS, yet no

one seems to know anything about his treatment. There have been no

press releases, news reports or scientific papers that I can find.

Where is his proof, other than his word?

Plenty of people have undergrad degrees in microbiology. That doesn't

make him an expert in the field. His M.S. is in molecular biology.

He's a GP, not an infectious disease specialist. In fact, I checked him

out and discovered he is not board certified in *ANY* medical specialty.

He is an FAA medical examiner, i.e. he does medical exams for pilots

.... to determine that they are medically fit to fly.

He claims he discovered a protozoa inside biofilm that's similar to the

malaria parasite. Why are there no scientific papers on this supposed

discovery?

Furthermore, he owns his own lab where *all* the testing is done, and he

does not accept any insurance. That is a *HUGE* conflict of interest.

It has been illegal in the states of Florida, Illinois and New York for

nearly two decades. He also does not accept samples drawn in New York

state. What's up with that? Probably due to the conflict of interest.

All of this is highly suspect and smacks of a major scam to me.

Jeri <teewinot13@...>

@>--->---->-------------------<----<---<@

Dr. Pall's NO/ONOO- Theory/Treatment Discussion Group:

TenthParadigmSociety

@>----------<---------->-----------------------<----------<----------<@

The Tenth Paradigm - Dr. Pall's Website for CFS/MCS/FM/ETC.:

http://www.thetenthparadigm.org

@>----------<---------->-----------------------<----------<----------<@

MCS-Florida - For All Chemically Sensitive Floridians

MCS-Florida

[Guest guest]

As far as I know, it doesn't have a name.  Just a number.  I'm too exhausted

to look it up for you right now and am going to rest.  Kay

From: ellen <variegatedfoliage@...>

Subject: Re: My new treatment protocal

Date: Friday, February 25, 2011, 12:38 PM

 

Kay,

What is the name of this protazoan?

Thanks,

Ellen

I have learned so much lately from group emails and related websearches have led

to the following;

Due to your posts regarding biofilm and oxalates, I recently saw Fry MD

whose undergrad work was in microbiology and who owns his own lab in sdale,

Arizona. At our first appointment, Dr. Fry told me that 2 years ago, he

discovered a protazoan inside biofilm that's similar to the malaria parasite in

100% of the CFS patients he tests. Dr. Fry has focused his work on CFS for the

last 19 years. Since this discovery, he treated all of his CFS patients with

antibiotics and anti-malaria drugs reversing CFS in 70%. His CFS patients who

had had it for the longest were the 30% whose symptoms were the most difficult

until he learned that the food for this protazoan was fat. That was 6 months

ago. Since putting all of his CFS patients on the antibiotic/antimalaria drugs

plus a fat free diet and enzymes to breakdown biofilm, he has had 100% success

in treating CFS.

He also told me he can only get us well when we stop magnesium supplements. He

said that we are not actually low in magnesium. Rather that because magnesium is

an essential component of biofilm, the biofilm robs magnesium from our blood to

increase its' population making us look magnesium deficient. So when we take

magnesium supplements we are actually feeding the biofilm and making ourselves

worse. This was quite a revelation to me. Dr. Fry does lab smeers to test. Mine

revealed well developed biofilm and the protazoan so I have just started his

treatment protacol. You can keyword Fry Laboraties if you wish, for a list of

the CFS and Lyme disease related tests his lab does. He will work with your

doctors if you wish.

Although I'm not crazy about drugs or more antibiotics, I feel them a necessary

step to kill the bugs. Since my urine acid test results indicated high oxalates,

I went on the low oxalate diet too. And since I've stopped taking all magnesium,

I'm using cal citrate with meals to bind with the oxalates and carry them out.

I'm also taking Lifestar Glutathene since low glutatheine seems part of this

circle of events too. Without magnesium my bowels don't move so I'm drinking

prune juice and senna tea and doing enemas for now.

Dr. Fry says I will probably feel sicker for the first 2 months due to Herx and

should start to feel better in about 3 months. From the day I woke up with CFS

28 years ago, my body temp has been low. He said that when the protazoan is

under control my body temp will be normal again. It should take 3-5 months.

After that I plan on getting back my good gut bacteria with a stool infusion

treatment. Web searching this afternoon, I found Dr. Khoruts, University of

Minnesota Gastroenterologist, 763-898-1000 and Dr. Lawrence Brandt at Montefiore

Medical Center in New York who are doing fecal transplants in the US. I'm

sending a letter to Dr. Fry tomorrow to see if he knows of a gastroenterologist

here in Arizona who does or will do the procedure when my antibiotic treatment

is finished. I'm learning the importance of doing things in the right order.

Kill the bugs first then repopulate the gut with good bacteria is what I'm

thinking.

I of course, am no doctor. Just sharing what I'm in the beginning of trying.

It's similar to what has done to get her good results. If anyone reading

this has input that might help me, I would appreciate it and I will let you all

know in a few months what my results are.

Kay

[Guest guest]

Kay Siegrist wrote:

> I recognize the possible conflict of interest and you're right I have no proof

that he has accomplished what he says. I'm simply passing on to you what I'm

trying. Kay

That may be, but you are putting this man forward to people as if he is

a miracle worker and stating this stuff as if it were fact. You also

implied he has advanced training and knowledge which he does not

possess. You didn't just simply say, " Here's what I'm trying. " That's

a grave disservice to the others on this list. Many of the people on

this list are too sick to spend all the time I did researching this guy.

And what I found was more than disturbing enough for me to let the

entire list know.

Treating people with anti-malarial drugs and antibiotics when they are

not indicated or needed can be extremely dangerous, even

life-threatening, and can cause even more problems than you already

have. These drugs are not benign like sugar pills.

Jeri <teewinot13@...>

@>--->---->-------------------<----<---<@

Dr. Pall's NO/ONOO- Theory/Treatment Discussion Group:

TenthParadigmSociety

@>----------<---------->-----------------------<----------<----------<@

The Tenth Paradigm - Dr. Pall's Website for CFS/MCS/FM/ETC.:

http://www.thetenthparadigm.org

@>----------<---------->-----------------------<----------<----------<@

MCS-Florida - For All Chemically Sensitive Floridians

MCS-Florida

[Guest guest]

According to Dr. Fry's test results, the antibiotic and antimalarial drugs he's

treating me with, are indicated and neither he nor I consider them sugar

pills.  As doctors do, he has chosen what in his experience he feels is best

suited to my test results and patient history and I'm hoping he's right.  He

has put me on his most aggressive combination because of how devdeloped my

bilfilm is and because I've had CFS for 28 years.  He did a liver enzymes test

first to make sure he could give me this particular malaria drug and will

monitor me monthly.  If a particular liver enzyme level gets too low, I will

need to stop this drug and go on one less aggressive.

 

As I mentioned in my initial email, he says he has only had success with more

advanced CFS patients in the last 6 months.  I don't know where you got the

miracle worker part.  I simply told the group what he told me and clearly

stated at the end that this is something I was trying and would let everyone

know the results.  

 

's succes has been an inspiration to me as I am not used to hearing from

or about people who have had CFS nearly as long as me let alone one who has

gotten their life back.  She refered to herself as a " guinea pig " who is still

walking a fine line.  I consider myself the same. How could we be anything

else at this point in time.  If there is a physician or patient who has this

whole CFS puzzle figured out, I haven't heard about them yet.  I know no CFS

experts yet.  So some of us just have to take chances so we all can learn.   

She has mentioned how helpful the fecal implants were for her but that they

were done in Australia.  In my initial email, I also wanted anyone else who

found that treatment resonated with them like it did with me, to know that there

are gastroenterologists here in the US who are doing fecal implants too.  I

didn't find any who had done them on CFS patients but know that as long as they

are being done on

someone, the possibility exists for me to get them too.

 

I have appreciated fellow CFS'ers sharing their questions, opinions, results,

experiences, and possibilities with me then I choose what clicks with me and it

sometimes helps me decide what to try next.  I was simply trying to do the

same.  While I think it important to stick to the subject, if we only posted

what was proven beyond doubt by physicians with printed papers, we wouldn't

have much.  Unfortunately with this disease, we seem to be left with charting

our own treatments and hoping for breakthroughs.  I do feel we're getting

closer and have more hope for us now than ever before.  And I of course hope

that what Dr. Fry has just told me and what we're trying will be a breakthrough

for me and help others.  Time will tell.

 

Kay   

> I recognize the possible conflict of interest and you're right I have no proof

that he has accomplished what he says. I'm simply passing on to you what I'm

trying. Kay

That may be, but you are putting this man forward to people as if he is

a miracle worker and stating this stuff as if it were fact. You also

implied he has advanced training and knowledge which he does not

possess. You didn't just simply say, " Here's what I'm trying. " That's

a grave disservice to the others on this list. Many of the people on

this list are too sick to spend all the time I did researching this guy.

And what I found was more than disturbing enough for me to let the

entire list know.

Treating people with anti-malarial drugs and antibiotics when they are

not indicated or needed can be extremely dangerous, even

life-threatening, and can cause even more problems than you already

have. These drugs are not benign like sugar pills.

Jeri <teewinot13@...>

@>--->---->-------------------<----<---<@

Dr. Pall's NO/ONOO- Theory/Treatment Discussion Group:

TenthParadigmSociety

@>----------<---------->-----------------------<----------<----------<@

The Tenth Paradigm - Dr. Pall's Website for CFS/MCS/FM/ETC.:

http://www.thetenthparadigm.org

@>----------<---------->-----------------------<----------<----------<@

MCS-Florida - For All Chemically Sensitive Floridians

MCS-Florida

[Guest guest]

Kay, I for one appreciate your postings. I also see the point, that " wild

claims " can be harmful to the desperate. We all need to filter, and wait on

each persons results, before jumping into different protocols. If I remember

correctly, you tried the stem cell treatment a year or so back, and was very

gracious in sharing that experiment. Am I to assume, you have given up on the

stem cells??

God Bless,

Sara

>

> > I recognize the possible conflict of interest and you're right I have no

proof that he has accomplished what he says. I'm simply passing on to you what

I'm trying. Kay

>

> That may be, but you are putting this man forward to people as if he is

> a miracle worker and stating this stuff as if it were fact. You also

> implied he has advanced training and knowledge which he does not

> possess. You didn't just simply say, " Here's what I'm trying. " That's

> a grave disservice to the others on this list. Many of the people on

> this list are too sick to spend all the time I did researching this guy.

> And what I found was more than disturbing enough for me to let the

> entire list know.

>

> Treating people with anti-malarial drugs and antibiotics when they are

> not indicated or needed can be extremely dangerous, even

> life-threatening, and can cause even more problems than you already

> have. These drugs are not benign like sugar pills.

>

> Jeri <teewinot13@...>

> @>--->---->-------------------<----<---<@

> Dr. Pall's NO/ONOO- Theory/Treatment Discussion Group:

> TenthParadigmSociety

> @>----------<---------->-----------------------<----------<----------<@

> The Tenth Paradigm - Dr. Pall's Website for CFS/MCS/FM/ETC.:

> http://www.thetenthparadigm.org

> @>----------<---------->-----------------------<----------<----------<@

> MCS-Florida - For All Chemically Sensitive Floridians

> MCS-Florida

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Thanks for posting this idea Kay. I wonder how this relates to symptoms that

indicate lack of magnesium, like muscle twitching. My daughter struggles

with this all the time. Do you suppose the biofilm is taking the majority of

the Magnesium she supplements with and so she is not getting enough herself?

But if she stops the Mg supplements, her twitching gets worse. And she take

Boluoke. Maybe not enough? Her LLMD is afraid to go after the biofilm too

aggressively because he thinks she wouldn't be able to handle the die-off but

maybe it is time. She is also on IV Rocephin and several oral abx for the lyme.

I will propose this scenario to him and see if he has anything relevant to add.

> He also told me he can only get us well when we stop magnesium supplements. 

He said that we are not actually low in magnesium.  Rather that because

magnesium is an essential component of biofilm, the biofilm robs magnesium from

our blood to increase its' population making us look magnesium deficient.  So

when we take magnesium supplements we are actually feeding the biofilm and

making ourselves worse. 

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

 

Yes I am the one who did 4 stem cell treatments, had my last almost a year ago,

and don't have plans to do more.  I was ISCI's first CFS patient so no one knew

from the onset how much or how little those treatments would help me and I told

the group that in my posts.

 

I did the stem cell treatments because the study that connected cardiomyopathy

with CFS said that the most promising future treatment here in the US for

cardiomyopathy was stem cells.  I didn't feel I had time to wait.  For about 4

months prior to my first stem cell treatment my heart had gotten so bad it felt

like it was bubbling at times.  I was very weak and for the first time since

having CFS, felt myself slipping away.  Numbness, tingling, and coldness of

extremeties and general weakness had become extremely disabling and scarey. 

From the first treatment, my heart never has had that bubbling sensation

again.  The stem cells also meant the end of bladder frequency problems for me,

took away my hiatal hernia, and as I was told they would to, may have modulated

my immune system because severe allergies that I've had since CFS onset almost

disappeared by the 4th treatment.  I'm not sorry I had the stem cell treatments

at all.   Even

though they are not a cure for CFS and no one told me they would be, they did

handle physical repairs that I feel had become urgent for me.  They also

reduced the severity of many symptoms which although not a cure, improved my

quality of life. 

 

Since doing the stem cell treatments, we've shared info about biofilms,

oxalates, XMRV, fecal transplants, and other things. Had I known about these

sooner, I may not have needed the stem cell treatments.  But I didn't, was in

an urgent situation, and the stem cell treatments got me through.  Stem cell

treatments don't kill pathogens, don't dissolve biofilm, and don't repopulate

the gut with healthy bacteria and I didn't expect them too.  Now I will try to

address those issues in an effort to get myself the rest of the way well.

 

Blessings to you too,

Kay

From: grammie2304 <sarawilliams.williams@...>

Subject: Re: My new treatment protocal

Date: Saturday, February 26, 2011, 5:07 AM

 

Kay, I for one appreciate your postings. I also see the point, that " wild

claims " can be harmful to the desperate. We all need to filter, and wait on each

persons results, before jumping into different protocols. If I remember

correctly, you tried the stem cell treatment a year or so back, and was very

gracious in sharing that experiment. Am I to assume, you have given up on the

stem cells??

God Bless,

Sara

>

> > I recognize the possible conflict of interest and you're right I have no

proof that he has accomplished what he says. I'm simply passing on to you what

I'm trying. Kay

>

> That may be, but you are putting this man forward to people as if he is

> a miracle worker and stating this stuff as if it were fact. You also

> implied he has advanced training and knowledge which he does not

> possess. You didn't just simply say, " Here's what I'm trying. " That's

> a grave disservice to the others on this list. Many of the people on

> this list are too sick to spend all the time I did researching this guy.

> And what I found was more than disturbing enough for me to let the

> entire list know.

>

> Treating people with anti-malarial drugs and antibiotics when they are

> not indicated or needed can be extremely dangerous, even

> life-threatening, and can cause even more problems than you already

> have. These drugs are not benign like sugar pills.

>

> Jeri <teewinot13@...>

> @>--->---->-------------------<----<---<@

> Dr. Pall's NO/ONOO- Theory/Treatment Discussion Group:

> TenthParadigmSociety

> @>----------<---------->-----------------------<----------<----------<@

> The Tenth Paradigm - Dr. Pall's Website for CFS/MCS/FM/ETC.:

> http://www.thetenthparadigm.org

> @>----------<---------->-----------------------<----------<----------<@

> MCS-Florida - For All Chemically Sensitive Floridians

> MCS-Florida

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

I have asked myself some of these same questions and don't yet know the

answers.  I don't know that anyone knows for sure yet.  It's all too new.  In

the 90s, well intentioned doctors in  CFS and Autoimmune disease clinics were

giving patients including me Vitamin C IVs and supplements including

magnesium.  Now we've learned that vitamin C turns into oxalates so if we had

high oxalates, made us worse and that magnesium, calcium, and iron are biofilm

components and it's possible that magnesium supplements in particular may help

biofilm build.  Dr. Fry told me that the reason we appear low in magnesium is

because biofilm takes it from our blood.  I'm wondering if the reason why I

have osteoporosis is because biofilm is taking it from my bones.  Don't know

the answer but believe it a logical question.

 

I have no idea of course, what is relevant for your daughter.  I used to have

muscle twitches.  They left while I was getting the stem cell treatments.  I

agree with you that it would be good to talk with her doctor about this new

information and certainly wish you the best of luck in helping her.  Dr. Fry's

office treats people with chronic lyme disease as well as lupus and CFS.  Your

doctor could contact him to see if he has treated anyone whose history is

similar to your daughters and if so, what his results were.  That might help in

some way. 

 

Kay  

From: susan jasper <susan@...>

Subject: Re: My new treatment protocal

Date: Saturday, February 26, 2011, 9:20 AM

 

Thanks for posting this idea Kay. I wonder how this relates to symptoms that

indicate lack of magnesium, like muscle twitching. My daughter struggles

with this all the time. Do you suppose the biofilm is taking the majority of the

Magnesium she supplements with and so she is not getting enough herself? But if

she stops the Mg supplements, her twitching gets worse. And she take Boluoke.

Maybe not enough? Her LLMD is afraid to go after the biofilm too aggressively

because he thinks she wouldn't be able to handle the die-off but maybe it is

time. She is also on IV Rocephin and several oral abx for the lyme.

I will propose this scenario to him and see if he has anything relevant to add.

> He also told me he can only get us well when we stop magnesium supplements. 

He said that we are not actually low in magnesium.  Rather that because

magnesium is an essential component of biofilm, the biofilm robs magnesium from

our blood to increase its' population making us look magnesium deficient.  So

when we take magnesium supplements we are actually feeding the biofilm and

making ourselves worse. 

[Guest guest]

Kay,

What kind of stem cells did they use?

Thanks,

Ellen

Yes I am the one who did 4 stem cell treatments, had my last almost a year ago,

and don't have plans to do more. I was ISCI's first CFS patient so no one knew

from the onset how much or how little those treatments would help me and I told

the group that in my posts.

I did the stem cell treatments because the study that connected cardiomyopathy

with CFS said that the most promising future treatment here in the US for

cardiomyopathy was stem cells. I didn't feel I had time to wait. For about 4

months prior to my first stem cell treatment my heart had gotten so bad it felt

like it was bubbling at times. I was very weak and for the first time since

having CFS, felt myself slipping away. Numbness, tingling, and coldness of

extremeties and general weakness had become extremely disabling and scarey.

From the first treatment, my heart never has had that bubbling sensation again.

The stem cells also meant the end of bladder frequency problems for me, took

away my hiatal hernia, and as I was told they would to, may have modulated my

immune system because severe allergies that I've had since CFS onset almost

disappeared by the 4th treatment. I'm not sorry I had the stem cell treatments

at all. Even

though they are not a cure for CFS and no one told me they would be, they did

handle physical repairs that I feel had become urgent for me. They also reduced

the severity of many symptoms which although not a cure, improved my quality of

life.

Since doing the stem cell treatments, we've shared info about biofilms,

oxalates, XMRV, fecal transplants, and other things. Had I known about these

sooner, I may not have needed the stem cell treatments. But I didn't, was in an

urgent situation, and the stem cell treatments got me through. Stem cell

treatments don't kill pathogens, don't dissolve biofilm, and don't repopulate

the gut with healthy bacteria and I didn't expect them too. Now I will try to

address those issues in an effort to get myself the rest of the way well.

Blessings to you too,

Kay

From: grammie2304 <sarawilliams.williams@...>

Subject: Re: My new treatment protocal

Date: Saturday, February 26, 2011, 5:07 AM

Kay, I for one appreciate your postings. I also see the point, that " wild

claims " can be harmful to the desperate. We all need to filter, and wait on each

persons results, before jumping into different protocols. If I remember

correctly, you tried the stem cell treatment a year or so back, and was very

gracious in sharing that experiment. Am I to assume, you have given up on the

stem cells??

God Bless,

Sara

>

> > I recognize the possible conflict of interest and you're right I have no

proof that he has accomplished what he says. I'm simply passing on to you what

I'm trying. Kay

>

> That may be, but you are putting this man forward to people as if he is

> a miracle worker and stating this stuff as if it were fact. You also

> implied he has advanced training and knowledge which he does not

> possess. You didn't just simply say, " Here's what I'm trying. " That's

> a grave disservice to the others on this list. Many of the people on

> this list are too sick to spend all the time I did researching this guy.

> And what I found was more than disturbing enough for me to let the

> entire list know.

>

> Treating people with anti-malarial drugs and antibiotics when they are

> not indicated or needed can be extremely dangerous, even

> life-threatening, and can cause even more problems than you already

> have. These drugs are not benign like sugar pills.

>

> Jeri <teewinot13@...>

> @>--->---->-------------------<----<---<@

> Dr. Pall's NO/ONOO- Theory/Treatment Discussion Group:

> TenthParadigmSociety

> @>----------<---------->-----------------------<----------<----------<@

> The Tenth Paradigm - Dr. Pall's Website for CFS/MCS/FM/ETC.:

> http://www.thetenthparadigm.org

> @>----------<---------->-----------------------<----------<----------<@

> MCS-Florida - For All Chemically Sensitive Floridians

> MCS-Florida

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hi, Jeri.

There are other specialty labs that don't accept samples from New York state.

The reason is that New York state requires that labs be inspected and certified

by the state if samples are to be accepted from their state, even though the

labs have federal CLIA certification, which is required for all commercial labs

that run human samples. The managements of specialty labs decide whether the

additional business they would get from people in New York state would be worth

the cost and additional hassle of undergoing more inspections, and some decide

that it isn't worth it. I have heard that New York state did this in order to

generate revenue from fees, in order to provide the financial support for

state-operated laboratories. The practical consequence of it for the citizens

of New York state, however, is that there are a lot of lab tests that they are

not able to get. Some go to New Jersey or Connecticut and have doctors there

order the tests for them

Best regards,

Rich

He also does not accept samples drawn in New York

> state. What's up with that?

[Guest guest]

placenta

From: grammie2304 <sarawilliams.williams@...>

Subject: Re: My new treatment protocal

Date: Saturday, February 26, 2011, 5:07 AM

Kay, I for one appreciate your postings. I also see the point, that " wild

claims " can be harmful to the desperate. We all need to filter, and wait on each

persons results, before jumping into different protocols. If I remember

correctly, you tried the stem cell treatment a year or so back, and was very

gracious in sharing that experiment. Am I to assume, you have given up on the

stem cells??

God Bless,

Sara

>

> > I recognize the possible conflict of interest and you're right I have no

proof that he has accomplished what he says. I'm simply passing on to you what

I'm trying. Kay

>

> That may be, but you are putting this man forward to people as if he is

> a miracle worker and stating this stuff as if it were fact. You also

> implied he has advanced training and knowledge which he does not

> possess. You didn't just simply say, " Here's what I'm trying. " That's

> a grave disservice to the others on this list. Many of the people on

> this list are too sick to spend all the time I did researching this guy.

> And what I found was more than disturbing enough for me to let the

> entire list know.

>

> Treating people with anti-malarial drugs and antibiotics when they are

> not indicated or needed can be extremely dangerous, even

> life-threatening, and can cause even more problems than you already

> have. These drugs are not benign like sugar pills.

>

> Jeri <teewinot13@...>

> @>--->---->-------------------<----<---<@

> Dr. Pall's NO/ONOO- Theory/Treatment Discussion Group:

> TenthParadigmSociety

> @>----------<---------->-----------------------<----------<----------<@

> The Tenth Paradigm - Dr. Pall's Website for CFS/MCS/FM/ETC.:

> http://www.thetenthparadigm.org

> @>----------<---------->-----------------------<----------<----------<@

> MCS-Florida - For All Chemically Sensitive Floridians

> MCS-Florida

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Interesting about the magnesium thing.

I have heard the same about copper in CFS. Shows up low on tests, but is

actually sequestered.

Peta Cohen MD has found that when she uses the biofilm protocol on autistic

kids, they " blow out copper. "

I *think* this happened to me. I had a massive copper pull on an FTM. I believe

it was after doing the biofilm protocol but I'm not sure.

I had such a horrid reaction to the protocol (probably being too aggressive)

that I haven't repeated it.

It's on the list!

>

>

> From: ellen <variegatedfoliage@...>

> Subject: Re: My new treatment protocal

>

> Date: Friday, February 25, 2011, 12:38 PM

>

>

>  

>

>

>

> Kay,

>

> What is the name of this protazoan?

>

> Thanks,

> Ellen

> I have learned so much lately from group emails and related websearches have

led to the following;

>

> Due to your posts regarding biofilm and oxalates, I recently saw Fry

MD whose undergrad work was in microbiology and who owns his own lab in

sdale, Arizona. At our first appointment, Dr. Fry told me that 2 years ago,

he discovered a protazoan inside biofilm that's similar to the malaria parasite

in 100% of the CFS patients he tests. Dr. Fry has focused his work on CFS for

the last 19 years. Since this discovery, he treated all of his CFS patients with

antibiotics and anti-malaria drugs reversing CFS in 70%. His CFS patients who

had had it for the longest were the 30% whose symptoms were the most difficult

until he learned that the food for this protazoan was fat. That was 6 months

ago. Since putting all of his CFS patients on the antibiotic/antimalaria drugs

plus a fat free diet and enzymes to breakdown biofilm, he has had 100% success

in treating CFS.

>

> He also told me he can only get us well when we stop magnesium supplements. He

said that we are not actually low in magnesium. Rather that because magnesium is

an essential component of biofilm, the biofilm robs magnesium from our blood to

increase its' population making us look magnesium deficient. So when we take

magnesium supplements we are actually feeding the biofilm and making ourselves

worse. This was quite a revelation to me. Dr. Fry does lab smeers to test. Mine

revealed well developed biofilm and the protazoan so I have just started his

treatment protacol. You can keyword Fry Laboraties if you wish, for a list of

the CFS and Lyme disease related tests his lab does. He will work with your

doctors if you wish.

>

> Although I'm not crazy about drugs or more antibiotics, I feel them a

necessary step to kill the bugs. Since my urine acid test results indicated high

oxalates, I went on the low oxalate diet too. And since I've stopped taking all

magnesium, I'm using cal citrate with meals to bind with the oxalates and carry

them out. I'm also taking Lifestar Glutathene since low glutatheine seems part

of this circle of events too. Without magnesium my bowels don't move so I'm

drinking prune juice and senna tea and doing enemas for now.

>

> Dr. Fry says I will probably feel sicker for the first 2 months due to Herx

and should start to feel better in about 3 months. From the day I woke up with

CFS 28 years ago, my body temp has been low. He said that when the protazoan is

under control my body temp will be normal again. It should take 3-5 months.

>

> After that I plan on getting back my good gut bacteria with a stool infusion

treatment. Web searching this afternoon, I found Dr. Khoruts, University of

Minnesota Gastroenterologist, 763-898-1000 and Dr. Lawrence Brandt at Montefiore

Medical Center in New York who are doing fecal transplants in the US. I'm

sending a letter to Dr. Fry tomorrow to see if he knows of a gastroenterologist

here in Arizona who does or will do the procedure when my antibiotic treatment

is finished. I'm learning the importance of doing things in the right order.

Kill the bugs first then repopulate the gut with good bacteria is what I'm

thinking.

>

> I of course, am no doctor. Just sharing what I'm in the beginning of trying.

It's similar to what has done to get her good results. If anyone reading

this has input that might help me, I would appreciate it and I will let you all

know in a few months what my results are.

>

> Kay

>

>

[Guest guest]

Where would be the best place to study biofilm protocol???

God Bless,

Sara

>

>

> From: susan jasper <susan@...>

> Subject: Re: My new treatment protocal

>

> Date: Saturday, February 26, 2011, 9:20 AM

>

>

>  

>

>

>

>

>

> Thanks for posting this idea Kay. I wonder how this relates to symptoms that

indicate lack of magnesium, like muscle twitching. My daughter struggles

with this all the time. Do you suppose the biofilm is taking the majority of the

Magnesium she supplements with and so she is not getting enough herself? But if

she stops the Mg supplements, her twitching gets worse. And she take Boluoke.

Maybe not enough? Her LLMD is afraid to go after the biofilm too aggressively

because he thinks she wouldn't be able to handle the die-off but maybe it is

time. She is also on IV Rocephin and several oral abx for the lyme.

> I will propose this scenario to him and see if he has anything relevant to

add.

>

>

>

> > He also told me he can only get us well when we stop magnesium

supplements.  He said that we are not actually low in magnesium.  Rather that

because magnesium is an essential component of biofilm, the biofilm robs

magnesium from our blood to increase its' population making us look magnesium

deficient.  So when we take magnesium supplements we are actually feeding the

biofilm and making ourselves worse. 

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Kay

It is suspected that oxalates could also be another reason for osteoporosis as

they have found that oxalates are chelating calcium and magnesium and other

minerals. I understand that if we take these supplements with our meals and we

also take fat based supplements they all end up in a soupy mess and we don't

absorb any of it. If oxalates are an issue then it is recommended to take

calcium and magnesium citrate with meals to bind the oxalates in the meal, then

between meals take any fat soluble sups and mag and cal. It is also recommended

to take taurine to help the liver make bile to utilize the fats.

All this is soooo new and complex ie. biofilm and oxalates, etc. and great care

should be taken, but at the same time it is exciting because the depth of

knowledge relating to these chronic illness I think is really gathering

momentum, a lot of the research is due to the horrific autism epidemic. Look how

allopathic medicine has turned its back on them. But it will take many years to

filter outside the autism arena into mainstream. As you say, vit c intravenous

used to be considered/and still is a very beneficial treatment for many

illnesses but can be detrimental to others. I don't think a lot of this will

filter into allopathic medicine for a long time because individuality/genetics

aren't taken into account, one size fits all, take or leave it, it takes far to

long to piece the whole picture together for one person, the economic model the

system is based on does not allow for the time needed. It is people like me

that the system can't help, issues are too complex so in an attempt to improve

my quality of life I choose to take reasonably researched new approaches, I will

be dead by the time allopathic medicine has the answers. I choose to take

responsibility for my life and not wait for a doctor who doesn't really care

about me anyway. Most wouldn't even blink an eye lid if I died.

Just my thoughts,

> >

> >

> > From: susan jasper <susan@>

> > Subject: Re: My new treatment protocal

> >

> > Date: Saturday, February 26, 2011, 9:20 AM

> >

> >

> >  

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > Thanks for posting this idea Kay. I wonder how this relates to symptoms that

indicate lack of magnesium, like muscle twitching. My daughter struggles

with this all the time. Do you suppose the biofilm is taking the majority of the

Magnesium she supplements with and so she is not getting enough herself? But if

she stops the Mg supplements, her twitching gets worse. And she take Boluoke.

Maybe not enough? Her LLMD is afraid to go after the biofilm too aggressively

because he thinks she wouldn't be able to handle the die-off but maybe it is

time. She is also on IV Rocephin and several oral abx for the lyme.

> > I will propose this scenario to him and see if he has anything relevant to

add.

> >

> >

> >

> > > He also told me he can only get us well when we stop magnesium

supplements.  He said that we are not actually low in magnesium.  Rather that

because magnesium is an essential component of biofilm, the biofilm robs

magnesium from our blood to increase its' population making us look magnesium

deficient.  So when we take magnesium supplements we are actually feeding the

biofilm and making ourselves worse. 

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

That's a good question.  I followed the advice of other group members and

checked out Dr. Usman's info at www.autismpedia.org.  Her protocol is for

autistic children.  I haven't found much about breaking down biofilm in adults

or CFS patients.  I also keyworded things like " breaking down biofilm " ,

" biofilm protocols " , etc.  went to links and read.  From this information and

Dr. Fry's suggestions, I have put together my own protocal of numerous

supplements and 2 prescriptions that make sense to me for me.  That's the best

I know how to do at this time.  I also paid attention to 's warning that

the herx reaction can be substantial and not to be taken lightly.  So I'm

listening to my body and if it gets to be too much will energy test myself and

back off on whatever I need to.  I'm following the basic suggestions of Dr.

Usman;

 

     1.  enzymes and EDTA on an empty stomach to break up biofilm

     2.  antibiotics and in my case the anti malarial prescribed by Dr. Fry

with a meal

     3.  an hour after meals, binders, I'm using bentonite clay in water,

to mop up the toxins

 

On an empty stomach when I get up in the morning, I'm taking Lifestar

Glutathene, NAC, Serrapeptase, and vitamin D.  1/2 hour before breakfast,

Boluoke/Lumbrokinase per Dr. Fry.  With breakfast, Curcumin and Sutherlandia

OPC per Dr. Swanepoel from South Africa, kelp for iron, and calcium citrate to

bind with oxalates to carry them out.  1 hour later, bentonite clay and

acidophelis with pectin per Dr. Usman.  1/2 hour before lunch, Boluoke and

Serrapeptase again.  With lunch Sutherlandia and calcium citrate.  1 hour

later Bentonite clay and acidophelis with pectin again.  With dinner

Nattokinase, curcumin, and the antibiotic and anti malarial.  I intersperse

senna and prune juice between meals and at bedtime to keep my bowels moving in

the absence of magnesium.  It's a lot in an effort to breakdown the biofilm,

kill bugs, and move both out.  Oh, I'm also taking the anti

parasites, wormwood and black walnut tincture, as the protzoan Dr. Fry

discovered is a parasite.  And I'm on a fat free diet to starve the parasite

and the low oxalate diet since my urine tests indicated high oxalates.

 

The Sutherlandia OPC from South Africa is so strong I have had to start and stop

it 4 times each time, tolerating it better.  I started it last August and

believe it is gradually making me stronger.  Dr. Swanepoel suggests

liver/gallbladder flushes as he says it is very difficult for chronically ill

people to get well if the gall bladder and liver are not clear.  I passed

hundreds of gallstones, gall sand, and 2 stone clusters held together with

something jellylike after my first 2 flushes.  The first 2 flushes made me

really sick but I believe cleared a path for better detox.  Just my

postulation.

 

I'm not suggesting that anyone else do any part of my chosen protocol.  If

however, any of what I've shared here resonates with any of you and helps you,

I'm happy.  I'm taking what I've read plus test results plus the advice of 2

doctors and the rest is me flying by the seat of my pants and hoping it

prepares me for what I consider my next step of fecal transplants to repopulate

the get. 

 

Kay       

From: grammie2304 <sarawilliams.williams@...>

Subject: Re: My new treatment protocal

Date: Sunday, February 27, 2011, 4:34 AM

 

Where would be the best place to study biofilm protocol???

God Bless,

Sara

>

>

> From: susan jasper <susan@...>

> Subject: Re: My new treatment protocal

>

> Date: Saturday, February 26, 2011, 9:20 AM

>

>

>  

>

>

>

>

>

> Thanks for posting this idea Kay. I wonder how this relates to symptoms that

indicate lack of magnesium, like muscle twitching. My daughter struggles

with this all the time. Do you suppose the biofilm is taking the majority of the

Magnesium she supplements with and so she is not getting enough herself? But if

she stops the Mg supplements, her twitching gets worse. And she take Boluoke.

Maybe not enough? Her LLMD is afraid to go after the biofilm too aggressively

because he thinks she wouldn't be able to handle the die-off but maybe it is

time. She is also on IV Rocephin and several oral abx for the lyme.

> I will propose this scenario to him and see if he has anything relevant to

add.

>

>

>

> > He also told me he can only get us well when we stop magnesium

supplements.  He said that we are not actually low in

magnesium.  Rather that because magnesium is an essential component of

biofilm, the biofilm robs magnesium from our blood to increase its' population

making us look magnesium deficient.  So when we take magnesium supplements we

are actually feeding the biofilm and making ourselves worse. 

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hi ,  Yes, I agree with you whoeheartedly.

 

I have read your posts carefully before putting together my current protoco and

have appreciated them so much.  For the reasons you noted, I'm taking vitamin D

and other fat soluble supplements away from meals.  I'm skipping the mag

citrate per Dr. Fry but am taking calcium citrate as you and Dr. Usman suggest

to bind with the oxalates and carry them out.  And I believe we must be

consumate label readers.  I chose an EDTA that doesn't contain Vitamin C which

turns into oxalates.  It takes a lot of self involvement to make sure we're not

taking ourselves backwards while we're trying to do the opposite.

 

Kay

 

From: crusaderD <dennybrand@...>

Subject: Re: My new treatment protocal

Date: Monday, February 28, 2011, 6:24 AM

 

Hi Kay

It is suspected that oxalates could also be another reason for osteoporosis as

they have found that oxalates are chelating calcium and magnesium and other

minerals. I understand that if we take these supplements with our meals and we

also take fat based supplements they all end up in a soupy mess and we don't

absorb any of it. If oxalates are an issue then it is recommended to take

calcium and magnesium citrate with meals to bind the oxalates in the meal, then

between meals take any fat soluble sups and mag and cal. It is also recommended

to take taurine to help the liver make bile to utilize the fats.

All this is soooo new and complex ie. biofilm and oxalates, etc. and great care

should be taken, but at the same time it is exciting because the depth of

knowledge relating to these chronic illness I think is really gathering

momentum, a lot of the research is due to the horrific autism epidemic. Look how

allopathic medicine has turned its back on them. But it will take many years to

filter outside the autism arena into mainstream. As you say, vit c intravenous

used to be considered/and still is a very beneficial treatment for many

illnesses but can be detrimental to others. I don't think a lot of this will

filter into allopathic medicine for a long time because individuality/genetics

aren't taken into account, one size fits all, take or leave it, it takes far to

long to piece the whole picture together for one person, the economic model the

system is based on does not allow for the time needed. It is people like me that

the system can't help, issues are

too complex so in an attempt to improve my quality of life I choose to take

reasonably researched new approaches, I will be dead by the time allopathic

medicine has the answers. I choose to take responsibility for my life and not

wait for a doctor who doesn't really care about me anyway. Most wouldn't even

blink an eye lid if I died.

Just my thoughts,

> >

> >

> > From: susan jasper <susan@>

> > Subject: Re: My new treatment protocal

> >

> > Date: Saturday, February 26, 2011, 9:20 AM

> >

> >

> >  

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > Thanks for posting this idea Kay. I wonder how this relates to symptoms that

indicate lack of magnesium, like muscle twitching. My daughter struggles

with this all the time. Do you suppose the biofilm is taking the majority of the

Magnesium she supplements with and so she is not getting enough herself? But if

she stops the Mg supplements, her twitching gets worse. And she take Boluoke.

Maybe not enough? Her LLMD is afraid to go after the biofilm too aggressively

because he thinks she wouldn't be able to handle the die-off but maybe it is

time. She is also on IV Rocephin and several oral abx for the lyme.

> > I will propose this scenario to him and see if he has anything relevant to

add.

> >

> >

> >

> > > He also told me he can only get us well when we stop magnesium

supplements.  He said that we are not actually low in

magnesium.  Rather that because magnesium is an essential component of

biofilm, the biofilm robs magnesium from our blood to increase its' population

making us look magnesium deficient.  So when we take magnesium supplements we

are actually feeding the biofilm and making ourselves worse. 

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Dr.Klinghardt is quite involved with biofilms:

http://www.klinghardtacademy.com/images/stories/powerpoints/treatinglyme%202010.\

pdf

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_7396/is_312/ai_n32103066/

http://www.klinghardtacademy.com/images/stories/powerpoints/autism%20protocol%20\

09.pdf?chakra_shop=023d7c2702bac65ad79a74828b1d3f5e

________________________________

From: Kay Siegrist <ksiegr@...>

Sent: Mon, February 28, 2011 11:54:31 AM

Subject: Re: Re: My new treatment protocal

That's a good question. I followed the advice of other group members and

checked out Dr. Usman's info at www.autismpedia.org. Her protocol is for

autistic children. I haven't found much about breaking down biofilm in adults

or CFS patients. I also keyworded things like " breaking down biofilm " , " biofilm

protocols " , etc. went to links and read. From this information and Dr. Fry's

suggestions, I have put together my own protocal of numerous supplements and 2

prescriptions that make sense to me for me. That's the best I know how to do at

this time. I also paid attention to 's warning that the herx reaction can

be substantial and not to be taken lightly. So I'm listening to my body and if

it gets to be too much will energy test myself and back off on whatever I need

to. I'm following the basic suggestions of Dr. Usman;

1. enzymes and EDTA on an empty stomach to break up biofilm

2. antibiotics and in my case the anti malarial prescribed by Dr. Fry with

a meal

3. an hour after meals, binders, I'm using bentonite clay in water, to mop

up the toxins

On an empty stomach when I get up in the morning, I'm taking Lifestar

Glutathene, NAC, Serrapeptase, and vitamin D. 1/2 hour before breakfast,

Boluoke/Lumbrokinase per Dr. Fry. With breakfast, Curcumin and Sutherlandia OPC

per Dr. Swanepoel from South Africa, kelp for iron, and calcium citrate to bind

with oxalates to carry them out. 1 hour later, bentonite clay and acidophelis

with pectin per Dr. Usman. 1/2 hour before lunch, Boluoke and Serrapeptase

again. With lunch Sutherlandia and calcium citrate. 1 hour later Bentonite

clay and acidophelis with pectin again. With dinner Nattokinase, curcumin, and

the antibiotic and anti malarial. I intersperse senna and prune juice between

meals and at bedtime to keep my bowels moving in the absence of magnesium. It's

a lot in an effort to breakdown the biofilm, kill bugs, and move both out. Oh,

I'm also taking the anti parasites, wormwood and black walnut tincture, as the

protzoan Dr. Fry

discovered is a parasite. And I'm on a fat free diet to starve the parasite and

the low oxalate diet since my urine tests indicated high oxalates.

The Sutherlandia OPC from South Africa is so strong I have had to start and stop

it 4 times each time, tolerating it better. I started it last August and

believe it is gradually making me stronger. Dr. Swanepoel suggests

liver/gallbladder flushes as he says it is very difficult for chronically ill

people to get well if the gall bladder and liver are not clear. I passed

hundreds of gallstones, gall sand, and 2 stone clusters held together with

something jellylike after my first 2 flushes. The first 2 flushes made me

really sick but I believe cleared a path for better detox. Just my postulation.

I'm not suggesting that anyone else do any part of my chosen protocol. If

however, any of what I've shared here resonates with any of you and helps you,

I'm happy. I'm taking what I've read plus test results plus the advice of 2

doctors and the rest is me flying by the seat of my pants and hoping it prepares

me for what I consider my next step of fecal transplants to repopulate the get.

Kay

From: grammie2304 <sarawilliams.williams@...>

Subject: Re: My new treatment protocal

Date: Sunday, February 27, 2011, 4:34 AM

Where would be the best place to study biofilm protocol???

God Bless,

Sara

>

>

> From: susan jasper <susan@...>

> Subject: Re: My new treatment protocal

>

> Date: Saturday, February 26, 2011, 9:20 AM

>

>

> Â

>

>

>

>

>

> Thanks for posting this idea Kay. I wonder how this relates to symptoms that

>indicate lack of magnesium, like muscle twitching. My daughter struggles

>with this all the time. Do you suppose the biofilm is taking the majority of

the

>Magnesium she supplements with and so she is not getting enough herself? But if

>she stops the Mg supplements, her twitching gets worse. And she take Boluoke.

>Maybe not enough? Her LLMD is afraid to go after the biofilm too aggressively

>because he thinks she wouldn't be able to handle the die-off but maybe it is

>time. She is also on IV Rocephin and several oral abx for the lyme.

> I will propose this scenario to him and see if he has anything relevant to

add.

>

>

>

> > He also told me he can only get us well when we stop magnesium

supplements.Â

>He said that we are not actually low in magnesium.  Rather that because

>magnesium is an essential component of biofilm, the biofilm robs magnesium from

>our blood to increase its' population making us look magnesium deficient. So

>when we take magnesium supplements we are actually feeding the biofilm and

>making ourselves worse.Â

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Can those of you who are eliminating the oxalates share what your symptoms are

in relation to eating oxalates?? I ate a 90% oxalate meal last night, and

became comatose immediately???

God Bless,

Sara

> > >

> > >

> > > From: susan jasper <susan@>

> > > Subject: Re: My new treatment protocal

> > >

> > > Date: Saturday, February 26, 2011, 9:20 AM

> > >

> > >

> > >  

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Thanks for posting this idea Kay. I wonder how this relates to symptoms

that indicate lack of magnesium, like muscle twitching. My daughter

struggles with this all the time. Do you suppose the biofilm is taking the

majority of the Magnesium she supplements with and so she is not getting enough

herself? But if she stops the Mg supplements, her twitching gets worse. And she

take Boluoke. Maybe not enough? Her LLMD is afraid to go after the biofilm too

aggressively because he thinks she wouldn't be able to handle the die-off but

maybe it is time. She is also on IV Rocephin and several oral abx for the lyme.

> > > I will propose this scenario to him and see if he has anything relevant to

add.

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > > He also told me he can only get us well when we stop magnesium

supplements.  He said that we are not actually low in

magnesium.  Rather that because magnesium is an essential component of

biofilm, the biofilm robs magnesium from our blood to increase its' population

making us look magnesium deficient.  So when we take magnesium supplements we

are actually feeding the biofilm and making ourselves worse. 

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

[Guest guest]

HI Kay

Wow you really are working hard at this. From my understanding you still need

magnesium, the way Dr Usman explained it is a process of breaking the biofilm

down then building it up, breaking it down building it up etc. So you need to

have magnesium away from when you do the biofilm enzymes. If you are taking

calcium you should also take magnesium. I understand magnesium is involved in

over 300 enzyme reactions, you can create more problems by not having magnesium.

Have you checked that the EDTA is not the calcium form, the disodium form is

recommended. Also Cucumin may be really good for the liver and inflammation but

it is very high in oxalates.

Have you watched her recordings? She explains a lot of things.

I'm glad you have a doctor helping you with this. My doctor over saw what I did.

> > >

> > >

> > > From: susan jasper <susan@>

> > > Subject: Re: My new treatment protocal

> > >

> > > Date: Saturday, February 26, 2011, 9:20 AM

> > >

> > >

> > >  

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Thanks for posting this idea Kay. I wonder how this relates to symptoms

that indicate lack of magnesium, like muscle twitching. My daughter

struggles with this all the time. Do you suppose the biofilm is taking the

majority of the Magnesium she supplements with and so she is not getting enough

herself? But if she stops the Mg supplements, her twitching gets worse. And she

take Boluoke. Maybe not enough? Her LLMD is afraid to go after the biofilm too

aggressively because he thinks she wouldn't be able to handle the die-off but

maybe it is time. She is also on IV Rocephin and several oral abx for the lyme.

> > > I will propose this scenario to him and see if he has anything relevant to

add.

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > > He also told me he can only get us well when we stop magnesium

supplements.  He said that we are not actually low in

magnesium.  Rather that because magnesium is an essential component of

biofilm, the biofilm robs magnesium from our blood to increase its' population

making us look magnesium deficient.  So when we take magnesium supplements we

are actually feeding the biofilm and making ourselves worse. 

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

[Guest guest]

Hi ,  I just watched Dr. Usman's video which I hadn't done before and

heard her talk about breaking down the bad biofilm then building up the good gut

biofilm.  She doesn't elaborate.  Dr. Fry was very clear saying to me,  " I

cannot get you well unless you stop taking magnesium. "   Maybe he means to stop

taking it for now.  It's an important question so I'll ask him at my next

appointment.  In Dr. Usman's 2009 update at the autism conference, she

mentioned using Dr. Fry's lab for her testing.  That's an affirmation for me. 

Thanks for telling me about the EDTA form.  I have the wrong one and will

change.  Will also drop the curcumin.  This is so complicated!  But I want to

know the details and am hopeful that the results will be worth it.  Thanks, Kay

From: crusaderD <dennybrand@...>

Subject: Re: My new treatment protocal

Date: Tuesday, March 1, 2011, 6:19 AM

 

HI Kay

Wow you really are working hard at this. From my understanding you still need

magnesium, the way Dr Usman explained it is a process of breaking the biofilm

down then building it up, breaking it down building it up etc. So you need to

have magnesium away from when you do the biofilm enzymes. If you are taking

calcium you should also take magnesium. I understand magnesium is involved in

over 300 enzyme reactions, you can create more problems by not having magnesium.

Have you checked that the EDTA is not the calcium form, the disodium form is

recommended. Also Cucumin may be really good for the liver and inflammation but

it is very high in oxalates.

Have you watched her recordings? She explains a lot of things.

I'm glad you have a doctor helping you with this. My doctor over saw what I did.

> > >

> > >

> > > From: susan jasper <susan@>

> > > Subject: Re: My new treatment protocal

> > >

> > > Date: Saturday, February 26, 2011, 9:20 AM

> > >

> > >

> > >  

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Thanks for posting this idea Kay. I wonder how this relates to symptoms

that indicate lack of magnesium, like muscle twitching. My daughter

struggles with this all the time. Do you suppose the biofilm is taking the

majority of the Magnesium she supplements with and so she is not getting enough

herself? But if she stops the Mg supplements, her twitching gets worse. And she

take Boluoke. Maybe not enough? Her LLMD is afraid to go after the biofilm too

aggressively because he thinks she wouldn't be able to handle the die-off but

maybe it is time. She is also on IV Rocephin and several oral abx for the lyme.

> > > I will propose this scenario to him and see if he has anything relevant to

add.

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > > He also told me he can only get us well when we stop magnesium

supplements.  He said that we are not actually low in

magnesium.  Rather that because magnesium is an essential

component of biofilm, the biofilm robs magnesium from our blood to increase its'

population making us look magnesium deficient.  So when we take

magnesium supplements we are actually feeding the biofilm and making ourselves

worse. 

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

[Guest guest]

This is so facinating---------I am sensing this is an important key.

Thank you ladys for the information.

Still waiting to hear of personal stories as to oxalates.

Kay, if you think this is restrictive----try incorporating it in a weight loss

diet, which I am

God Bless,

Sara

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > From: susan jasper <susan@>

> > > > Subject: Re: My new treatment protocal

> > > >

> > > > Date: Saturday, February 26, 2011, 9:20 AM

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >  

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Thanks for posting this idea Kay. I wonder how this relates to symptoms

that indicate lack of magnesium, like muscle twitching. My daughter

struggles with this all the time. Do you suppose the biofilm is taking the

majority of the Magnesium she supplements with and so she is not getting enough

herself? But if she stops the Mg supplements, her twitching gets worse. And she

take Boluoke. Maybe not enough? Her LLMD is afraid to go after the biofilm too

aggressively because he thinks she wouldn't be able to handle the die-off but

maybe it is time. She is also on IV Rocephin and several oral abx for the lyme.

> > > > I will propose this scenario to him and see if he has anything relevant

to add.

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > > He also told me he can only get us well when we stop magnesium

supplements.  He said that we are not actually low in

magnesium.  Rather that because magnesium is an essential

component of biofilm, the biofilm robs magnesium from our blood to increase its'

population making us look magnesium deficient.  So when we take

magnesium supplements we are actually feeding the biofilm and making ourselves

worse. 

> > > >

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> > > >

> > > >

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