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Fombonne

http://www.whale.to/vaccines/fombonne_h.html

Links within all of the below on the webpage

Fombonne

[2006 July 1 Pediatrics.] " Pervasive Developmental Disorders in Montreal,

Quebec: Prevalence and Links With Immunizations " --- Dr. Fombonne's

[2004 Nov] Smeeth, Fombonne, Hall et al. Rate of First Recorded Diagnosis

of Autism and Other Pervasive Developmental Disorders in United Kingdom

General Practice, 1988 to 2001

[2004 Lancet] " MMR Vaccination And Pervasive Developmental Disorders: A

Case Control Study. " By Liam Smeeth, Cook, Fombonne...

[2003 Jan] Fombonne, editorial, Journal of the American Medical

Association, January 1st 2003 Vol 289, No.1 49

[2001 Oct Pediatrics] Fombonne & Chakrabarti, No Evidence for a New Variant

of Measles-Mumps-Rubella-Induced Autism, Pediatrics

[2000-2002 Unpublished Study by Fombonne et al, A Case-Control Study of

Autism In General Practice, UK, Study Period September 2000-August 2002

[1998] Letter by Dr. Fombonne, Inflammatory Bowel Disease and Autism,

Pediatrics, March 28th 1998

http://www.mrw.interscience.wiley.com/cochrane/clsysrev/articles/CD004407/pd

f_fs.html

Fombonne is a psychiatrist. Here is what the Cochrane Collaboration said

about Fombonne's last paper regarding a review of the safety of the mmr:

" The number and possible impact of biases in this study is so high that

interpretation of the results is impossible " . (page 21)

“E. Fombonne has provided advice on the epidemiology and clinical aspects

of autism to scientists advising parents, to vaccine manufacturers (for a

fee), and to several Government committees.” In plainer language, Fombonne

had been a paid adviser to the manufacturers of MMR in the then-impending

1,500-strong class action High Court case in the UK that alleged that MMR

had precipitated children’s degeneration into autism. The wisdom of using a

paid witness to the manufacturers, as defendants, in a central authorship

role in a supposedly independent research paper, might be questioned by

many. -- Thrower

I was the first to announce the " autism epidemic " , in 1995, and I pointed

out in that article that excessive vaccines were a plausible cause of the

epidemic. As you know, an enormous amount of clinical laboratory research

(as opposed to epidemiological research), has been accumulated since that

time, supporting my position. (I did not know then that the vaccines

contained mercury, although I had been collecting data since 1967 from the

mothers of autistic children, on any dental work they may have had during

their pregnancy.) The evidence is now overwhelming, despite the

misinformation from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, the

American Academy of Pediatrics and the Institute of Medicine.------- The

(Pretending to) Combat Autism Act By Bernard Rimland

See: Studies (government) Studies on vaccine autism link

[2006 July 1] Pediatrics. " Pervasive Developmental Disorders in Montreal,

Quebec: Prevalence and Links With Immunizations " --- Dr. Fombonne

It is not entirely true that Quebec children have been receiving

thimerosal-free vaccines since 1996. All 3 of the influenza vaccines

licensed in Canada contain thimerosal. Currently, close to a third of

Quebec youngsters are receiving these, as are a number of pregnant women.

For details on this, please visit the links below. Also, it may not be on

the immunization scdedule, but Quebec infants who come from countries (or

whose mothers were born in countries) where hepatitis B is endemic, are

recommended hepatitis B shots as infants. In the U.S.,

non-thimerosal-containing hepatitis B vaccine became licensed in 1999. At

that time, Canada was still using the thimerosal-containing hep B vaccine

for infants. That is stated in a Health Canada Bulletin. I doubt Quebec

somehow managed to get a non-thimerosal-containing hep B vaccine before the

rest of the country and the States (for that matter). Aasa

http://www.vran.org//vaccines/flu/flu_ingredients.htm

[July 9, 2006 press release] FOMBONNE AUTISM STUDY RIDDLED WITH

INACCURACIES, RADICAL CONCLUSIONS, SAYS NATIONAL AUTISM ASSOCIATION

Recently, FAIR Autism Media was contacted by Bloomberg Press to comment on

the Fombonne study & article in the Journal of Pediatrics. Dr. Ayoub

offered his comments to the reporter. This is just another heavily biased

study by an author with a long track record of financial ties to the drug

industry, and whose previous views on the epidemiology of autism have been

discredited,'' wrote Ayoub

SafeMinds Aids to Correct Misinformation

[July 2006] letter to the Guardian (London) which shows this latest study

is junk--Clifford

[2004 Sept Lancet] " MMR Vaccination And Pervasive Developmental Disorders:

A Case Control Study. " By Liam Smeeth, Cook, Fombonne,

Heavey, C Rodriques, G , J Hall. Lancet 2004;

364:963-969.

* This was an important paper in that it claimed to have looked at a

very large number of child health records, giving it considerable claimed

authority. The study had been set up in the UK in the light of strong

public concern (and probably a degree of internal UK Government unease)

over the safety of MMR vaccination.

Data were abstracted from the UK General Practitioer Research Database.

The study found that:

* MMR vaccination was not associated with an increased risk of

subsequent PDD diagnosis. The study found “no convincing evidence” that MMR

vaccination increased the risk of autism or other pervasive developmental

disorders

* The “odds ratio” associated with MMR vaccination varied according to

the age at which a person joined the GPRD. In particular, the odds ratio

associated with MMR vaccination was higher among children who joined the

GPRD at birth or before their first birthday. This was dismissed as

possible selection bias or a “chance result”

* ·Research into the cause(s) of autism was urgently needed The study

included over 1,000 cases with a diagnosis of PDD. Despite its size, the

study had a number of drawbacks, some of which the study authors admitted:

* some recording of previous vaccination history, where children came

onto a GPRD after date of vaccination, was acknowledged to be possibly

incomplete

* the study admitted that it was not able to separately identify the

subgroup of cases with regressive symptoms, so as to be able to investigate

the hypothesis that only some children were vulnerable to MMR-induced

disease and that this was always regressive. This was a crucial failing, as

this hypothesis lies at the very heart of the allegations of parents and

the views of researchers such as Dr. Wakefield. On page 967, the

authors stated that “we were not able to separately identify the sub-group

of cases with regressive symptoms (so as) to investigate the hypothesis

that only some children are vulnerable to MMR-induced disease and that this

is always (in those cases) regressive”. The authors thereby are admitting

that they have not, in fact, conducted an investigation of “the Wakefield

hypothesis”

* The study claimed that its results were similar to a Danish cohort

study (the Madsen et al study). However, the use of thimerosalcontaining

vaccines in Denmark has not matched that in the UK, and so comparing the

two countries’ experiences may be inappropriate

The study also had to declare one serious conflict of interest,

specifically that “E. Fombonne has provided advice on the epidemiology and

clinical aspects of autism to scientists advising parents, to vaccine

manufacturers (for a fee), and to several Government committees.”

In plainer language, Fombonne had been a paid adviser to the manufacturers

of MMR in the then-impending 1,500-strong class action High Court case in

the UK that alleged that MMR had precipitated children’s degeneration into

autism. The wisdom of using a paid witness to the manufacturers, as

defendants, in a central authorship role in a supposedly independent

research paper, might be questioned by many.

This study was heavily criticised:

* the study is only epidemiological, not clinical. No children were

examined

* the UK GP Research Database, the basis for this study, was not

designed to be used for a study such as this

* there may have been some misclassification of cases (the authors

admitted this flaw). In fact, it is understood that no fewer than 73

“controls” were discovered during the course of the study to be “cases”,

illustrating the difficulty of relying on the GPRD database

* insufficient controls were used. Although the study, which used 1,294

cases and 4,469 controls, had initially indicated that there would be ten

controls per autism case, 594 cases had fewer than three controls, 72 cases

had only one control and 25 had none at all. It was not explained why the

study’s original protocols had been apparently disregarded

* only 62% of the children had received MMR before 18 months. Yet the

focus of concern needed to be on infants younger than this, 15 months or

less. This makes the study less relevant to the core area of concern

* methodological flaws in the study were pointed out to the study team

at early stages of the study, but do not seem to have been taken into account

* the study deliberately excluded children who did not have a record of

seeing their GP in the 12 months prior to the “index date”, which was the

date at which the children received a diagnosis of PDD. This could have

increased the risk of excluding children who had undergone definite

regression after MMR

Comment: this study cannot be taken as offering reliable evidence to deny

an MMR/autism link, despite the claims made at the time. It is worth

reminding readers as to the original “Wakefield hypothesis”, as published

in the Israeli Medical Association Journal, 1999, Volume I, pp1-5: “There

exists a subset of children who are vulnerable to developing a particular

form of regressive autism following previously normal development, in

combination with a novel form of inflammatory bowel disease. Onset may

occur over weeks or sometimes months, and is triggered by exposure to a

measles-containing vaccine, predominantly the measles mumps rubella vaccine

(MMR) that is in use in much of the world today. This exposure leads to

long term infection with measles virus within key sites, including the

intestine where it causes inflammation.”

[pdf March 2006] MMR Vaccine, Thimerosal and Regressive or Late Onset

Autism A Review of the Evidence for a Link Between Vaccination and

Regressive Autism-- Thrower

[sept 2004] Dr. Wakefield Responds To British Study Clearing MMR Vaccines

[2004 Nov] Study by Smeeth, Fombonne, Hall et al. Rate of First Recorded

Diagnosis of Autism and Other Pervasive Developmental Disorders in United

Kingdom General Practice, 1988 to 2001 published in BMC Medicine, 2: 39,

November 2004.

This study analysed the rates of first diagnosis of pervasive developmental

disorders amongst people registered with GP practices that were part of the

UK GP Database during 1988-2001. It included 1,410 cases drawn from over 14

million person-years of observation. The main outcome measures were the

rates of diagnosis of PDD, by the year of diagnosis, the year of birth, by

gender and by geographical region.

The study found that:

· the rate increased progressively from 0.40/10,000 person years in 1991 to

2.98 per 10,000 person years in 2001

· there was a similar increase in standardized incidence ratios, from 35 in

1991 to 365 in 2001

· the temporal increase was not limited to children born during specific

years, nor to children diagnosed in a specific time period

· the rate of diagnosis of PDDs other than autism rose from zero for

1988-92 to 1.06 per 10,000 person-years in 2001

· the rate of diagnosis of autism also increased, but to a lesser extent

· there was marked geographical variation in rates, with standardized

incidence ratios varying from 66 in Wales to 141 for SE England

The study concluded that better ascertainment of diagnosis was likely to

have contributed to the observed temporal increase in rates of diagnosis of

PDD, but the authors could not rule out a real increase. The study claimed

to be on of the largest undertaken of trends in the incidence of autism

The study authors had to admit to a considerable number of uncertainties,

and make a number of suppositions. Uncertainties included:

· it was “likely” that a proportion of cases in the “autism” diagnostic

category had a form of PDD other than autism

· the inaccuracy of diagnosis within the GP research database was “likely”

to reflect changes in the definition of PDD

· inflation in the number of cases in later years “could have” occurred as

other PDD diagnoses came into widespread use and some

previously-undiagnosed children were diagnosed

· greater ascertainment of high functioning autism “may partly explain” the

increased incidence of autism

· better detection of less severe cases alone cannot explain all the increases

· geographical variation “may” reflect differences in service provision and

parental awareness in different regions

· the accuracy of the data “may” have changed during the study period

· these factors “could explain only a very small part” of the increased

rates observed

· the nature of the study precluded the authors from assessing how often

children with PDDs were not diagnosed

The study team concluded that the extent to which the increase in incidence

that were documented was uncertain.

Comment - there are many criticisms that can be made of this study, many of

which are identified by the study team themselves as potential confounding

factors.

The study clearly found large increases, and attempted to shrug these off

by linking them to factors such as better diagnosis and greater awareness.

However, it was unable to accurately weigh these factors and quantify their

individual influence. It is therefore the case that the study has very

limited value. It is again interesting that the study authors seem anxious

to avoid reaching the conclusion that there has been a large real increase

in autism. [pdf March 2006] MMR Vaccine, Thimerosal and Regressive or Late

Onset Autism A Review of the Evidence for a Link Between Vaccination and

Regressive Autism-- Thrower

[2003 Jan] Fombonne, editorial, Journal of the American Medical

Association, January 1st 2003 Vol 289, No.1 49

At the start of 2003, Dr. Fombonne wrote an editorial in the Journal

of the American Medical association that appeared to acknowledge that there

had been some real increase in autism, but which also attempted to explain

this away to as great a degree as possible through the usual recourse to

references to better awareness, less restrictive criteria and a greater

willingness to diagnose.

Fombonne’s key points were that:

* That the prevalence rate of 34 per 10,000 (1 in 294) was likely to

actually be an underestimate, because high-functioning autism cases were

likely to have been missed.

* The lower reported prevalence in 3- and 4-year olds might reflect

lower sensitivity of case identification for disorders, which were often

diagnosed later

* There was an unexpected decrease in prevalence amongst 9- and 10-year

olds. Fombonne dismisses the idea that this might imply that the younger

the birth cohort, the greater the level of autism as being “biologically

implausible”. Yet this is open to obvious question - what if an external

factor had altered during this time? Fombonne does not address this

possibility.

Fombonne concluded that a rate of 41-45 per 10,000 (1 in 222) might

be a more accurate rate of prevalence. He noted in his editorial that other

studies suggested rates of 60 per 10,000 when pervasive developmental

disorder-not otherwise specified (PDD-NOS) and Aspergers syndrome were

taken account of.

He then addressed the issue as to whether the prevalence of autistic

spectrum disorder (ASD) had increased over time. His benchmark was the

1970s Wing and Gould study in Camberwell, London, which pointed to a rate

of 20 per 10,000 for severe-impairment cases. Other earlier studies had

point to rates of 4 or 5 per 10,000, and more recent studies cited by

Fombonne pointed to rates of more than 10 per 10,000. Fombonne’s conclusion

was that the most recent rates of prevalence were three or four times

higher than 30 years ago.

Fombonne, seemingly searching for an uncontroversial explanation for any

increase, then examined whether this increase implied a broadening of

criteria and improved methods of case-finding during studies. He pointed to

what he described as the “major” changes in criteria:

* Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders, Third Edition

(DSM-III), 1980

* DSM Revised Third Edition (DSM IIIR), 1987

* DSM Fourth Edition (DSM IV), 1994.

He argued that there was strong evidence that differences in methods for

case finding could account for a “huge” proportion of the variability of

prevalence estimates between surveys. Referral rates were also unreliable,

due to confounding factors. This, and other factors, he concluded, combined

to offer “good” evidence to support the contention that higher rates of

prevalence reflected changes in diagnostic practice, improved

identification and availability of services. The hypothesis of an

increasing trend in the incidence of autism could not, in his view, be

fully tested because of the inadequacy of studies to date. Fombonne

dismissed any association with MMR (citing his own study work and studies

by Madsen and by and as proof), and dismissed evidence of any

connection with thiomersal as being “weak”.

Fombonne was also quoted in the New York Times of 31st December 2002 as

stating: “No strong candidate environmental exposures have been

identified.....Claims of an association with MMR have not been borne out by

recent studies, and evidence for causal association with other exposures

such as mercury-containing vaccines is weak”.

The study being commented on by Fombonne was that by Dr. Marshalyn

Yeargin-Allsop et al, detailed earlier. Comment: the editorial by Fombonne

offers no hard evidence against a vaccine/autism link, and, whilst offering

some arguments in favour of questioning the precise scale of the apparent

major rise in autism prevalence, fails to demolish the central assertion of

many parents, that autism has grown immensely in a couple of decades. No

alternative explanations for the rise are offered by the Fombonne

editorial. [pdf March 2006] MMR Vaccine, Thimerosal and Regressive or Late

Onset Autism A Review of the Evidence for a Link Between Vaccination and

Regressive Autism-- Thrower

[2001 Oct] Fombonne & Chakrabarti, No Evidence for a New Variant of

Measles-Mumps-Rubella-Induced Autism, Pediatrics, Vol. 108 No. 4 October 2001

This paper examined whether there is a new phenotype of autism involving

regression and gastrointestinal symptoms.

It is suggested that where this paper is flawed is in the assumptions

underpinning the hypotheses that are tested. All else stems from that.

Fombonne & Chakrabarti assume that if autistic enterocolitis existed, then

one or more of the following six predictions should be supported by

empirical data:

* Prediction (1) - “childhood disintegrative disorder has become more

frequent”. (The study found the prevalence of childhood disintegrative

disorder to be 0.6/10,000, or 1 in 16,666. But this seems far too low in

comparison with other recent studies).

Comment - historic data is not available to prove this either way.

The claim that the present rate of 1 in 16,666 represents no increase is

further undermined by its non-credible low level. Other studies have found

rates very many times higher. This strongly suggests that the study is flawed.

* Prediction (2) - “the mean age of first parental concern for autistic

children who are exposed to MMR is closer to the mean immunisation age than

in children who are not exposed to MMR.”

Comment - the study found that there was no difference in the mean

age at first parental concern between the two samples exposed to MMR (19.3

months and 19.2 months) and the pre-MMR sample (19.5 months). But no

argument has been presented as to why there should be a difference. A

difference might be expected, but its absence in itself does not prove

anything. It is perfectly possible that childhood disintegrative disorder

has several causes, and that the arresting of development could be noticed

at around the same time. Pre-MMR children who became autistic may well have

become so due to an adverse outcome from monovalent measles vaccine. This

possibility does not seem to have occurred to Fombonne. There is also a

simplistic focus upon MMR alone as a sole factor, working in isolation,

rather than as part of a complex process.

* Prediction (3) - “regression in the development of children with

autism has become more common in MMR-vaccinated children.” The study found

that the rate of developmental regression reported in the post-MMR sample

(15.6%) was not different from that in the pre-MMR sample (18.4%) and

therefore there was no suggestion that regression in the development course

of autism had increased in frequency since MMR was introduced. The study

also found that in the epidemiologic sample, the subset of autistic

children with regression had no other developmental or clinical

characteristics, which would have argued for a specific etiologically

distinct phenotype.

Comment - the samples were small. The study used three samples, a

post-MMR sample of 96 children with PDD, a pre-MMR sample of 98 autistic

patients, and a post-MMR sample of 68 autistic patients. These are very

small numbers to use in a statistically-based study. Fombonne and

Chakrabarti’s results should thus be treated with caution, as a few cases

either way would impact upon their conclusions.

* Prediction (4) - “the age of onset for autistic children with

regression clusters around the MMR immunisation date and is different from

that of autistic children”. The study found that parents of autistic

children with developmental regression detected the first symptoms at a

very similar age (19.8 months) to those of autistic children without

regression (19.3 months). The study also found that the mean intervals from

MMR immunisation to parental recognition of autistic symptoms were

comparable in autistic children with or without regression (248 days vs 272

days, not significant).

Comment - but regression might not necessarily be expected to

“cluster round”, but may follow MMR at a delay of weeks, months or years.

There is no scientific justification for assuming that children with

regression after MMR should have their condition recognised at a different

time to those who did not regress after MMR. In any event, it is stated

that the difference between 248 days and 272 days is not significant, but

it is almost 10% different, and this difference has not been explained.

* Prediction (5) - “children with regressive autism have distinct

symptoms and severity profiles.”

Comment - little scientific justification for testing this assumption

is given in the study, which also refers to external features such as

behaviour, when the real focus of interest should be on gut biopsies and

ileocolonoscopies of the actual children, which of course were not done in

this study. Not enough is known about autistic enterocolitis to make such

an assumption about external characteristics into a key test.

* Prediction (6) - “regressive autism is associated with

gastrointestinal symptoms and/or inflammatory bowel disorder”.

Comment - but the children in this study did not undergo

ileocolonoscopy.

Their condition was medically unresearched.

Other comments:

* this is a statistical analysis of random groups of children, not of

the children whose cases are going to the High Court. The numbers are

extremely small, too small for a reliable interpretation to be made

* The assumption seems to have been made that children could not have

been damaged by vaccines other than MMR. The Lassiter court case outcome

(US) means that there is evidence, that has been accepted in a Court that

other multiple vaccines also trigger autism.

* What this study set out to do was not to investigate the cause(s) of

damage to specific children, but to clear MMR of any complicity. At first

sight, it succeeds in the latter, but at closer analysis, it makes numerous

unfounded assumptions that considerably weaken the strength of its

conclusions. At worst, it demonstrates the central flaw of designing a

study hoping to achieve a desired outcome, rather than to investigate a

problem.

Overall verdict: this study fails to provide any convincing evidence

against an MMR/autism link.

(Note: this study has been claimed by the UK Medical Research Council

to represent “strong positive evidence” of there being no MMR/autism link)

[pdf March 2006] MMR Vaccine, Thimerosal and Regressive or Late Onset

Autism A Review of the Evidence for a Link Between Vaccination and

Regressive Autism-- Thrower

[2001 Jan] Paper by Fombonne, Medical Research Council Child Psychiatry

Unit and Institute of Psychiatry, Is There An Epidemic of Autism?,

Pediatrics, January 2001

At the end of January 2001, a paper, “Is There An Epidemic of Autism?” was

published by Dr. Fombonne. The paper sought to deny that autism had

really increased, and criticised the “poor research methodology” of Dr.

Wakefield, and said “There is no need to raise false alarms on

putative epidemics nor to practice poor science.....”

? Fombonne criticises the California increase on the basis of

in-migration, possible changes within the population make-up, the change

from DSM-III to DSM-IIIR in 1987, the introduction of diagnostic categories

for Asperger, Rett and childhood disintegrative disorder in DSM-IV in 1994,

the effects of earlier diagnosis adding to the totals, and other factors.

? His most useful conclusion is that “we simply lack good data”.

He raises doubts about the apparent epidemic, but is then unable to refute

it either.

In an excellent FEAT (parents’ group) critique (8th Feb 2001), Mark

Blaxill goes carefully through Fombonne’s previous work and argues that

Fombonne has become inconsistent. He points out key flaws in Fombonne’s

previous work, and criticises his criticisms of the California data and his

scientifically-unsupported assertions [July 2004] MMR and Acquired Autism

(Autistic Enterocolitis) - A Briefing Note by Thrower

[2000-2002 Unpublished Study by Fombonne et al, A Case-Control Study of

Autism In General Practice, UK, Study Period September 2000-August 2002

This study, based at the Maudsley Hospital, Denmark Hill, London, is to

assess if exposure to MMR immunisation is a risk factor for autism, and to

assess the exposure to viral infections, both prenatally and postnatally.

Despite the dates, as far as is known the study has yet to report.

The study will use UK GP data, hospital reports and a parents’

questionnaire. It will use over 400 cases of autism and four times as many

controls, selected from a GP database. It is funded by the Medical Research

Council (£351,000). No date has been given for publication of the findings.

(Note: since this study commenced, Professor Fombonne has also agreed to

appear at the forthcoming UK High Court cases as an expert witness on

behalf of the manufacturers of MMR, against the children. His current role

within the study is not known. It is also not known whether the control

group will be “unvaccinated with MMR”, “unvaccinated with MR”,

“unvaccinated with any measles-containing vaccine”, “unvaccinated with

thiomersal-containing vaccines” or “totally unvaccinated”, or what the

vaccination status of the control group children’s mothers will be. These

may affect any study findings). [July 2004] MMR and Acquired Autism

(Autistic Enterocolitis) - A Briefing Note by Thrower

[1998] Letter by Dr. Fombonne, Inflammatory Bowel Disease and Autism,

Pediatrics, March 28th 1998

This letter set out two studies that attempted to prove that there was no

connection between inflammatory bowel disease/Crohn’s disease and autism.

The first study looked at UK clinical data collected by the Child &

Adolescent Psychiatric Services of the Maudslay Hospital, London.

? For ASD, three diagnostic groups were examined, autism, atypical

autism including disintegrative disorder, and pervasive developmental disorder

? Medical disorders were coded for a 25-year period, including

Crohn’s and ulcerative colitis, for 8889 patients.

? Of the 8889 patients, 987 were born in 1987 or later, and were

therefore most likely to have been exposed to MMR. Of these, 201 had ASD.

? Of the 8889 children, only two had Crohn’s, and both were

non-autistic. None had ulcerative colitis.

For the second study, a similar approach was undertaken. Fombonne surveyed

medical, behavioural and intellectual disabilities amongst 6100 French

children.

? He found 174 cases with autism.

? One child of the 6100 had Crohn’s, and one had ulcerative

colitis. Neither were autistic

? The conclusion that Fombonne drew was that these data provide no

support for the hypothesis of an association between IBD and autism.

Overall verdict: neither of these studies offer any evidence to disprove

an MMR/autism link. [July 2004] MMR and Acquired Autism (Autistic

Enterocolitis) - A Briefing Note by Thrower

--------------------------------------------------------

Sheri Nakken, R.N., MA, Hahnemannian Homeopath

Vaccination Information & Choice Network, Nevada City CA & Wales UK

$$ Donations to help in the work - accepted by Paypal account

earthmysteriestours@... voicemail US 530-740-0561

(go to http://www.paypal.com) or by mail

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