Glutamate/GABA balancing and BH4 for CFS

[Guest guest]

Hi, all.

I'm not doing the Yasko treatment model, but did do some research at the

autismanswer.com site regarding her suggested treatments for the common CFS

issues of

glutamate/GABA balancing and deficiency in tetrahydrobiopterin(BH4), an

important

percursor to making dopamine, serotonin, norepinephrine as well as healthy

levels of

nitric oxide(NO) and antioxidative detox. My findings in this search were

compelling

enough to have me go for her suggested treatments for these specific issues and

the

results in three weeks have been positive.

The glutamate/GABA balancing treatments have reduced some of the brain pain I

have

that I attribute to glutamate excitotoxicity and BH4 has definitely been a note

worthy

treatment, with clear benefits happening for me in the form of taking some of

the edge off

the chronic irritability and intensity I way too often feel with CFS, without

the bad side

effects I've experienced with taking SAMe and some of the popular

pharmaceuticals

commonly prescribed for these symptoms. My previous neurotransmitter levels

tested

showed I had abnormally low GABA, abnormally low dopamine and low normal

serotonin.

CFS associated symptoms I have yet to dissapate: brain clog/stiffness and

related pain/

inflammation, neural network dissyncronization/strained concentration, brain

microvascular hypoperfusion, cervical dystonia(right side head/neck) and

nonrefreshing

sleep.

[Guest guest]

Dr. Bart Braverman M.D. reports that taurine and also manganese (not magnesium)

and

b-6 can help convert glutamate into it's calming cousin GABA.

d.

p.s. His book is great " The Healing Power Within " . All about amino acid

interactions...

>

> Hi, all.

>

>

>

> I'm not doing the Yasko treatment model, but did do some research at the

> autismanswer.com site regarding her suggested treatments for the common CFS

issues

of

> glutamate/GABA balancing and deficiency in tetrahydrobiopterin(BH4), an

important

> percursor to making dopamine, serotonin, norepinephrine as well as healthy

levels of

> nitric oxide(NO) and antioxidative detox. My findings in this search were

compelling

> enough to have me go for her suggested treatments for these specific issues

and the

> results in three weeks have been positive.

>

>

>

> The glutamate/GABA balancing treatments have reduced some of the brain pain I

have

> that I attribute to glutamate excitotoxicity and BH4 has definitely been a

note worthy

> treatment, with clear benefits happening for me in the form of taking some of

the edge

off

> the chronic irritability and intensity I way too often feel with CFS, without

the bad side

> effects I've experienced with taking SAMe and some of the popular

pharmaceuticals

> commonly prescribed for these symptoms. My previous neurotransmitter levels

tested

> showed I had abnormally low GABA, abnormally low dopamine and low normal

serotonin.

>

>

>

> CFS associated symptoms I have yet to dissapate: brain clog/stiffness and

related pain/

> inflammation, neural network dissyncronization/strained concentration, brain

> microvascular hypoperfusion, cervical dystonia(right side head/neck) and

nonrefreshing

> sleep.

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hi, Dan.

" kdrbrill " <kdrbrill@...> wrote:

>

> Dr. Bart Braverman M.D. reports that taurine and also manganese (not

magnesium) and

> b-6 can help convert glutamate into it's calming cousin GABA.

***What does he say about chronically abnormal upregulation of glutamate in

conditions

like autism, Huntington's and CFS? Given the way I've been effectively

attacking this

pathway borrowing from only one part of one step in the entire Yasko

armamentarium of

treatment tools for this and not doing the actual protocol, I would say his

thinking taurine,

manganese and b-6 as the treatment for this is tremendously naive, light-weight

and

ridiculous, if that is what he is suggesting for PWCs.

***Unfortunately still in 2006, too many of even the most well intended docs for

PWCs still

go with the errant flight of fancy of applying normal biochemistry and nutrition

to a quite

abnormal situation, which is tragic for the unsuspecting patients of these docs

needing

more responsible researchers. FWIW and to be clear, the improvement I report

here in my

CFS related glutamate/GABA imbalance had nothing to do with supplemental

taurine,

maganese and b-6(been there done that, no improvement observed), the

autismanswer.com web board info on this topic was essential.

***

" davidhall2020 " <david-hall@> wrote:

> >

> > Hi, all.

> >

> > I'm not doing the Yasko treatment model, but did do some research at the

> > autismanswer.com site regarding her suggested treatments for the common CFS

issues

> of

> > glutamate/GABA balancing and deficiency in tetrahydrobiopterin(BH4), an

important

> > percursor to making dopamine, serotonin, norepinephrine as well as healthy

levels of

> > nitric oxide(NO) and antioxidative detox. My findings in this search were

compelling

> > enough to have me go for her suggested treatments for these specific issues

and the

> > results in three weeks have been positive.

[Guest guest]

Also see Braverman, MD's, book, THe Edge Effect. Lots more on amino

acids. I saw him last year and benefitted. _www.pathmed.com_

(http://www.pathmed.com)

mjh

" The Basil Book "

_http://foxhillfarm.us/FireBasil/_ (http://foxhillfarm.us/FireBasil/)

Posted by: " kdrbrill " _kdrbrill@... _

(mailto:kdrbrill@...?Subject=

Re:%20Glutamate/GABA%20balancing%20and%20BH4%20for%20CFS) _kdrbrill _

(kdrbrill)

Tue Dec 12, 2006 2:46 pm (PST)

Dr. Bart Braverman M.D. reports that taurine and also manganese (not

magnesium) and

b-6 can help convert glutamate into it's calming cousin GABA.

d.

p.s. His book is great " The Healing Power Within " . All about amino acid

interactions.p.

[Guest guest]

>

> Hi, all.

>

>

>

> I'm not doing the Yasko treatment model, but did do some research

at the

> autismanswer.com site regarding her suggested treatments for the

common CFS issues of

> glutamate/GABA balancing and deficiency in tetrahydrobiopterin

(BH4), an important

> percursor to making dopamine, serotonin, norepinephrine as well as

healthy levels of

> nitric oxide(NO) and antioxidative detox. My findings in this

search were compelling

> enough to have me go for her suggested treatments for these

specific issues and the

> results in three weeks have been positive.

>

>

>

> The glutamate/GABA balancing treatments have reduced some of the

brain pain I have

> that I attribute to glutamate excitotoxicity and BH4 has definitely

been a note worthy

> treatment, with clear benefits happening for me in the form of

taking some of the edge off

> the chronic irritability and intensity I way too often feel with

CFS, without the bad side

> effects I've experienced with taking SAMe and some of the popular

pharmaceuticals

> commonly prescribed for these symptoms. My previous

neurotransmitter levels tested

> showed I had abnormally low GABA, abnormally low dopamine and low

normal serotonin.

>

>

>

> CFS associated symptoms I have yet to dissapate: brain

clog/stiffness and related pain/

> inflammation, neural network dissyncronization/strained

concentration, brain

> microvascular hypoperfusion, cervical dystonia(right side

head/neck) and nonrefreshing

> sleep.

>

>

>

>

Hi

I wanted to let you know that I feel many of the symptoms of

glutamine/GABA inbalance when my hormones aren't balanced. I could

relate to all what Yasko wrote about this problem and this has

happened very recently to me when I had to come off my adrenal meds

cos my doctor put me on thyroxine which caused me massive problems.

I really thought I was going to actively have to deal with it but to

my surprise once I got back on the correct thyroid/adrenal combo for

me then these symptoms just go away within a very short space of

time, as does the muscle problems, migraines, inflammation,

allergies, exhaustion, and inability to walk anywhere.

Hormones are massively imbalanced in CFS but very few people seem to

get this problem addressed probably because the problem lies in the

HPA axis and not the target organs themselves. Although having said

that if one is mercury poisoned as is likely with so many of us then

that would also be another reason for the problem with under-

functioning hormones plus a major problem with detoxification.

Pam

[Guest guest]

> Hi

>

> I wanted to let you know that I feel many of the symptoms of

> glutamine/GABA inbalance when my hormones aren't balanced.

\

***How can you tell? I don't have femal hormone imbalances of course yet I

feel the sting

in my right brain from too much glutamate excitoxicity.

I could

> relate to all what Yasko wrote about this problem and this has

> happened very recently to me when I had to come off my adrenal meds

> cos my doctor put me on thyroxine which caused me massive problems.

> I really thought I was going to actively have to deal with it but to

> my surprise once I got back on the correct thyroid/adrenal combo for

> me then these symptoms just go away within a very short space of

> time, as does the muscle problems, migraines, inflammation,

> allergies, exhaustion, and inability to walk anywhere.

***Well thyroid issues could involve the C cells of the thyroid which produce

calcitonin,

which may lower blood calcium levels, but these symptoms you list don't appear

to be

from excessive glutamate that could increase toxic levels of calcium influx into

the cell,

focused in the brain in CFS. Are you sure you're not thinking of excessive

lactate build-

up, which does definitely happen in PWC's muscles and brain because of poor

mitochondrial Kreb's cycle function and reliance on glycolysis for

ATP?

>

> Hormones are massively imbalanced in CFS but very few people seem to

> get this problem addressed probably because the problem lies in the

> HPA axis and not the target organs themselves.

***Hormones production issues are difficult to address directly in CFS, until

the underlying

cellular metabolic issues like glutathione depletion-methylation block issues

are dealt with

effectively. I've found repleting glutathione has eliminated my hypothalamic

poor

antidiuretic hormone output which causes low blood volume in PWCs and the

glutathione

repletion has eliminated my hypothyroidism(thyroid meds no longer needed as the

glutathione has stopped excessive hydrogen peroxide production causing the

hypofunctioning).

Although having said

> that if one is mercury poisoned as is likely with so many of us then

> that would also be another reason for the problem with under-

> functioning hormones plus a major problem with detoxification.

***Chronic heavy metal toxification and stealth infections. Chronic stealth

Infections and

heavy metal toxification. Put these together with glutathione

depleted-methylation block

terrains(bodies) and thy name is ME/CFS!...(at least a major subset of us).

***

[Guest guest]

Hi I have typed my response after your question -

> >

> > I wanted to let you know that I feel many of the symptoms of

> > glutamine/GABA inbalance when my hormones aren't balanced.

> \

>

>

> ***How can you tell? I don't have femal hormone imbalances of

course yet I feel the sting

> in my right brain from too much glutamate excitoxicity.

The main symptoms I experienced were excessive adrenaline with

nothing to balance it despite taking quite a lot of valerian and

other herbs meant to help with GABA. I would feel a real stress

response when my blood sugar would fall. This happened consistently

after eating and happened even though my blood sugar monitor would

give a level that any doctor would say was fine, ie 4.9 or even 5.2

sometimes. I didn't feel like I could handle any stress whatsoever

and I had 3 days of solid migraines that were agony and didn't really

respond to painkillers. Since being back on just 2.5mg Pred with the

occasional extra 2.5 h/c I haven't had one headache and don't feel

like I am going to get one either even when I have had to undergo

some extremely stressful situations.

>

>

>

> I could

> > relate to all what Yasko wrote about this problem and this has

> > happened very recently to me when I had to come off my adrenal

meds

> > cos my doctor put me on thyroxine which caused me massive

problems.

> > I really thought I was going to actively have to deal with it but

to

> > my surprise once I got back on the correct thyroid/adrenal combo

for

> > me then these symptoms just go away within a very short space of

> > time, as does the muscle problems, migraines, inflammation,

> > allergies, exhaustion, and inability to walk anywhere.

>

>

>

> ***Well thyroid issues could involve the C cells of the thyroid

which produce calcitonin,

> which may lower blood calcium levels, but these symptoms you list

don't appear to be

> from excessive glutamate that could increase toxic levels of

calcium influx into the cell,

> focused in the brain in CFS. Are you sure you're not thinking of

excessive lactate build-

> up, which does definitely happen in PWC's muscles and brain because

of poor

> mitochondrial Kreb's cycle function and reliance on glycolysis for

> ATP?

>

Hi

No I definitely have high levels of calcium at the outer membrane of

the mito as per my Translactor Study done this year by Biolab, it

would appear to be a permanent problem for me.

One interesting thing I was reading today from Kane's Detoxx book was

that calcium channel blockers and beta blockers will both block the

effects of high calcium going into the cell where it causes havoc. I

am speaking with Dr Myhill next week and I will ask her about this.

I know that I have always felt better when I have taken a low dose

beta blocker. Kane also mentions using Phosphotidyl Choline and

Butyrate plus a higher level of Omega 6 fats to help this problem.

BioLab didn't find any evidence of high lactic acid in the mito but I

hadn't done any real walking before the test so that might not be too

accurate because I am sure this is what happens when I walk but again

it is very much mediated by my thyroid/adrenal meds. What I mean by

this is that I get a bad effect in my muscles but recovery happens

within hours if I rest. When not on thyroid or adrenal meds there is

just no recovery even over a matter of days. I spend the vast

majority of my time on the sofa and unable to do anything apart from

read and get the occasional meal.

Pam

>

>

> >

> > Hormones are massively imbalanced in CFS but very few people seem

to

> > get this problem addressed probably because the problem lies in

the

> > HPA axis and not the target organs themselves.

>

>

>

> ***Hormones production issues are difficult to address directly in

CFS, until the underlying

> cellular metabolic issues like glutathione depletion-methylation

block issues are dealt with

> effectively. I've found repleting glutathione has eliminated my

hypothalamic poor

> antidiuretic hormone output which causes low blood volume in PWCs

and the glutathione

> repletion has eliminated my hypothyroidism(thyroid meds no longer

needed as the

> glutathione has stopped excessive hydrogen peroxide production

causing the

> hypofunctioning).

>

>

>

> Although having said

> > that if one is mercury poisoned as is likely with so many of us

then

> > that would also be another reason for the problem with under-

> > functioning hormones plus a major problem with detoxification.

>

>

>

> ***Chronic heavy metal toxification and stealth infections.

Chronic stealth Infections and

> heavy metal toxification. Put these together with glutathione

depleted-methylation block

> terrains(bodies) and thy name is ME/CFS!...(at least a major subset

of us).

>

>

>

> ***

>