Re: Crash on Glutathione then increased energy

July 26, 2006

In teeny tiny doses, yes. You can't really know unless you try again. It

certainly could've kicked your immune system into action against some infection

and made you feel so bad. But no reason to do it so drastically. But really,

Rich is the glutathione expert.

Adrienne

Crash on Glutathione then increased energy

I wrote earlier about my attempt to take liposomal glutathione. I

crashed harder than I have in a long time. For a couple of weeks I

thought I had taken a major step backward.

Here's the weird part: Now that I've recovered for a few days, I feel

more energy than usual. I've been a lurker on this list for 7-8 years

with few posts of my own because I usually don't have the energy to

join in on the conversation. I have so much energ that this is

probably my 5th post in two days. I'm typing like a mad woman.

Does anybody think that it could be a longer term effect of the

glutathione? I'm wondering if I should start taking it again?

Lynn

This list is intended for patients to share personal experiences with each

other, not to give medical advice. If you are interested in any treatment

discussed here, please consult your doctor.

July 26, 2006

Question: Is trying new therapies and/or processes comparable to

macrobiotics in that when switching over to a " good " , supportive behavior

that it's possible you'll get sick in the short-term as you are either

detoxing and/or the toxins are being pushed out of your body? Would that

be a possible scenario of the below?

I've been wondering this as I start to integrate some suggestion in to my

life. And wondering if I need to prepare for some added " down time " ?

Thanks,

Laurel

Re: Crash on Glutathione then increased energy

In teeny tiny doses, yes. You can't really know unless you try again. It

certainly could've kicked your immune system into action against some

infection and made you feel so bad. But no reason to do it so drastically.

But really, Rich is the glutathione expert.

Adrienne

Crash on Glutathione then increased energy

I wrote earlier about my attempt to take liposomal glutathione. I

crashed harder than I have in a long time. For a couple of weeks I

thought I had taken a major step backward.

Here's the weird part: Now that I've recovered for a few days, I feel

more energy than usual. I've been a lurker on this list for 7-8 years

with few posts of my own because I usually don't have the energy to

join in on the conversation. I have so much energ that this is

probably my 5th post in two days. I'm typing like a mad woman.

Does anybody think that it could be a longer term effect of the

glutathione? I'm wondering if I should start taking it again?

Lynn

This list is intended for patients to share personal experiences with each

other, not to give medical advice. If you are interested in any treatment

discussed here, please consult your doctor.

July 26, 2006

On Jul 26, 2006, at 8:30 PM, tloyd61275 wrote:

> I wrote earlier about my attempt to take liposomal glutathione. I

> crashed harder than I have in a long time. For a couple of weeks I

> thought I had taken a major step backward.

>

> Here's the weird part: Now that I've recovered for a few days, I feel

> more energy than usual. I've been a lurker on this list for 7-8 years

> with few posts of my own because I usually don't have the energy to

> join in on the conversation. I have so much energ that this is

> probably my 5th post in two days. I'm typing like a mad woman.

>

> Does anybody think that it could be a longer term effect of the

> glutathione? I'm wondering if I should start taking it again?

I had similar experiences when I went on lipo. You probably just took

more than your body could handle. If you've been sick a long time,

and have a high tox load to clear, it can be really awful when it all

starts to come down.

The fact that you feel significantly better now suggests that it was

probably doing a good job of it, though. But you need to start a lot

smaller, and work into it.

Sara

July 26, 2006

On Jul 26, 2006, at 9:35 PM, Laurel Ley wrote:

> Question: Is trying new therapies and/or processes comparable to

> macrobiotics in that when switching over to a " good " , supportive

> behavior

> that it's possible you'll get sick in the short-term as you are either

> detoxing and/or the toxins are being pushed out of your body?

> Would that

> be a possible scenario of the below?

My experience is that yes, with some things, this does happen.

Glutathione, being the body's number one detoxer, is particularly

likely to create this in people with high tox loads. Likewise, I have

medical proof that I carry a large heavy metal burden, so a recent

FIR sauna (which is known to move metal) also wiped me out for

several days. (GSH actually helped speed healing in that case.) But

in both those cases, it was pretty clear on reflection that my

symptoms were because these treatments were creating known reactions

against known toxins. Importantly: when I stopped, the symptoms ended

in a few days.

But, also in my experience, I don't think this " herx " happens nearly

as often as other people seem to think it does. I've seen it used to

justify treatments that later turned out to be genuinely harmful, or

at least highly inappropriate. Apart from the two examples above,

when something new makes me feel wretched, it's almost always because

it's a Bad Thing and I need to not do it. Recent abortive experiments

along this line include Cortef (which I learned the hard way that I

don't have the enzymes to clear), testosterone (ditto), and SAMe

(ditto ditto). Fortunately, I learned something important from these

events, though. Rich was able to piece it together that these three,

along with several other problematic drugs, are all cleared by the

same enzyme. Obviously, I'm not making that enzyme. Which means that

from now on, I'll know to avoid the whole damn family and spare

myself future grief. So even wrong turns can be educational, if

you're paying attention for the lesson.

Then there was salt/c, for which my bad reaction prompted quite a

debate here about whether I was in a natural cleansing cycle or

unnatural congestive heart failure. (It is a difference worth noting,

yes.) I'm still not sure, but you bet I'm gonna be damn careful with

this stuff in the future.

Moral of the long story: Yes, herxing happens. But I'd tend to assume

that most bad reactions are NOT herxes, unless 1) you know for sure

that you've got the relevant toxins on board and 2) you know for sure

that the new treatment does tend to move those exact toxins. Mostly,

pain is still the body's way of saying, " Don't DO that! " Ignoring or

enduring it, in the absence of a sound medical reason to do so, has

on occasion created massive setbacks that took me weeks or months to

heal my way back out of.

Sara

July 26, 2006

I personally don't think a whole lot has to be that way. Perhaps with the

exception of just the situation you may be in w. the lipo glut.

An awful lot seems to be dose-related. For example, the physical therapy I have

recently begun. At first it wiped me out profoundly. The wipe out only lasted a

few hrs., so I risked going forward. It has been a process of learning not to

reach for more than a tiny bit of accomplishment, while at the same time

increasing, in tiny increments my ability to accomplish. Voila; after a month,

one day I was already in a low place when my p.t. arrived, but I made a tiny

effort to do it anyhow- and to my surprise, the d*** exercise energized me. I

didn't accomplish much, but I didn't crash big-time either, just a droop about

1/2 hr later.

The neat thing is that the prescription my doc wrote is for a whole year, so I

don't have to hurry!

(I observe a great deal of inclination to hurry and get well on this forum, and

I don't think that works with this disease. But I am older than most of the

people here, I believe. I still really want a life, but so much has already been

consumed by this disease it is not as urgent and I have less time ahead to have

great hopes for, so I can afford to be laid back.)

At this point I take a whole slew of things for energy, strength and cognition.

When I recently added some new things, my response to all the old things started

changing. and not in simple ways, because the effects of some of the stuff is

cumulative, so that I may find myself in trouble a few days after I quit

something altogether and then have to figure out how often to take that thing,

not just how much.

Right now I am trying to figure out how to get through the evening without

either crashing into withdrawals of some sort or another, nor being too

energized to sleep.

This does not answer your question so directly, I guess, but unless I think the

risk is manageable, as with the p.t. or unless I have a good idea of what I am

doing, I don't keep up with treatments or processes that make me feel worse.

Adrienne

Crash on Glutathione then increased energy

I wrote earlier about my attempt to take liposomal glutathione. I

crashed harder than I have in a long time. For a couple of weeks I

thought I had taken a major step backward.

Here's the weird part: Now that I've recovered for a few days, I feel

more energy than usual. I've been a lurker on this list for 7-8 years

with few posts of my own because I usually don't have the energy to

join in on the conversation. I have so much energ that this is

probably my 5th post in two days. I'm typing like a mad woman.

Does anybody think that it could be a longer term effect of the

glutathione? I'm wondering if I should start taking it again?

Lynn

This list is intended for patients to share personal experiences with each

other, not to give medical advice. If you are interested in any treatment

discussed here, please consult your doctor.

July 27, 2006

Thank you Mercuria. for the answer below

TO THOSE IN THE KNOW: Okay, I am struggling over putting what glutathione

is, in " english " . I start reading the links and Wikipedia and my eyes glaze

over.

So here's my shot at " english " -- glutathione is a naturally occurring

antioxidant. As an antioxidant, the purpose of glutathione is to help

protect and/or rid the body of toxins, such as free radicals. For example,

glutathione is needed for the detoxification of

<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Methylglyoxal> methylglyoxal, a toxin produced

as a by-product of metabolism. When the body has low levels of

glutathione, it means that your body's ability to fend off toxins is

decreased and as a result, your body's various systems may become overly

toxic, thus reducing your natural healing process. Also, when you begin

to increase your body's glutathione levels, it may result in a high level of

detoxification quickly and you may find your energy and immune system

lowered in teh short-term.

???? Am I remotely in the ballpark at a layman's definition?

THANK YOU,