Guest guest Posted July 7, 2006 Report Share Posted July 7, 2006 Well, well, well. There's a link between PFO's and hypercoagulation. I'm starting to think that it would be very worthwhile getting my PFO closed: Antiphospholipid antibodies are common in patients referred for percutaneous patent foramen ovale closure. Dodge SM, Hassell K, CA, Keller J, Groves B, Carroll JD. Division of Cardiology, Department of Medicine, University of Colorado Health Sciences Center, Denver, Colorado 80262, USA. Very little is known about any interaction between patent foramen ovale (PFO) and various hypercoagulable disorders that have been associated with cryptogenic stroke. Percutaneous PFO closure for secondary prevention of paradoxical thromboembolization is receiving increasing attention. Hypercoagulability may affect the potential risks and expected benefits of percutaneous PFO closure. Consecutive patients undergoing percutaneous PFO closure at a single center were screened for the presence of antiphospholipid antibodies, elevated lipoprotein(a), hyperhomocysteinemia, and dysfibrinogenemia. Sixteen of 34 patients (47%) with complete arterial hypercoagulability screening had laboratory evidence of arterial hypercoagulability. Thirteen of these patients (38%) had antiphospholipid antibodies. Antiphospholipid antibodies appear to be common in patients referred for percutaneous PFO closure for secondary prevention of systemic thromboembolic events. Thorough testing based on established recommendations is warranted. Further studies are needed regarding the interaction between PFO and various hypercoagulable disorders that have been associated with cryptogenic stroke. Copyright 2004 Wiley-Liss, Inc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 7, 2006 Report Share Posted July 7, 2006 Can the PFO be undiagnosed? Diane in MI PFO and Hypercoagulation Well, well, well. There's a link between PFO's and hypercoagulation. I'm starting to think that it would be very worthwhile getting my PFO closed: Antiphospholipid antibodies are common in patients referred for percutaneous patent foramen ovale closure. Dodge SM, Hassell K, CA, Keller J, Groves B, Carroll JD. Division of Cardiology, Department of Medicine, University of Colorado Health Sciences Center, Denver, Colorado 80262, USA. Very little is known about any interaction between patent foramen ovale (PFO) and various hypercoagulable disorders that have been associated with cryptogenic stroke. Percutaneous PFO closure for secondary prevention of paradoxical thromboembolization is receiving increasing attention. Hypercoagulability may affect the potential risks and expected benefits of percutaneous PFO closure. Consecutive patients undergoing percutaneous PFO closure at a single center were screened for the presence of antiphospholipid antibodies, elevated lipoprotein(a), hyperhomocysteinemia, and dysfibrinogenemia. Sixteen of 34 patients (47%) with complete arterial hypercoagulability screening had laboratory evidence of arterial hypercoagulability. Thirteen of these patients (38%) had antiphospholipid antibodies. Antiphospholipid antibodies appear to be common in patients referred for percutaneous PFO closure for secondary prevention of systemic thromboembolic events. Thorough testing based on established recommendations is warranted. Further studies are needed regarding the interaction between PFO and various hypercoagulable disorders that have been associated with cryptogenic stroke. Copyright 2004 Wiley-Liss, Inc. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.9/382 - Release Date: 7/4/2006 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 7, 2006 Report Share Posted July 7, 2006 There is a 1 in 4 chance that you have a PFO. It's very common. In general, the more tests you do, the more that you will find wrong with you. The only reason I found out that I had a PFO was because they mistook one of my CFS attacks for a possible stroke or TIA. So they sent me for all kinds of neurological and cardiological workup. I found out during that workup that one of my main arteries joins at the wrong place, I have a mild chiari malformation, and I have a PFO. Later on, during testing at the FFC, I found out that I have HHV6a, Lyme disease (by criteria), and I have hypercoagulation. CFS/ME/CFIDS/CFAC could just be a cumulation of many things. The PFO was diagnosed using ultrasound and " bubbles " of saline. You'll need to see a cardiologist to get tested, and he'll want a good reason to test you (suspected TIA, etc.). Katrina. > > Can the PFO be undiagnosed? > Diane in MI Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 7, 2006 Report Share Posted July 7, 2006 definitely. adrienne PFO and Hypercoagulation Well, well, well. There's a link between PFO's and hypercoagulation. I'm starting to think that it would be very worthwhile getting my PFO closed: Antiphospholipid antibodies are common in patients referred for percutaneous patent foramen ovale closure. Dodge SM, Hassell K, CA, Keller J, Groves B, Carroll JD. Division of Cardiology, Department of Medicine, University of Colorado Health Sciences Center, Denver, Colorado 80262, USA. Very little is known about any interaction between patent foramen ovale (PFO) and various hypercoagulable disorders that have been associated with cryptogenic stroke. Percutaneous PFO closure for secondary prevention of paradoxical thromboembolization is receiving increasing attention. Hypercoagulability may affect the potential risks and expected benefits of percutaneous PFO closure. Consecutive patients undergoing percutaneous PFO closure at a single center were screened for the presence of antiphospholipid antibodies, elevated lipoprotein(a), hyperhomocysteinemia, and dysfibrinogenemia. Sixteen of 34 patients (47%) with complete arterial hypercoagulability screening had laboratory evidence of arterial hypercoagulability. Thirteen of these patients (38%) had antiphospholipid antibodies. Antiphospholipid antibodies appear to be common in patients referred for percutaneous PFO closure for secondary prevention of systemic thromboembolic events. Thorough testing based on established recommendations is warranted. Further studies are needed regarding the interaction between PFO and various hypercoagulable disorders that have been associated with cryptogenic stroke. Copyright 2004 Wiley-Liss, Inc. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.9/382 - Release Date: 7/4/2006 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 7, 2006 Report Share Posted July 7, 2006 Maybe I really don't want to know...I have about all I want to think about right now with just hypothyroidism/cfids/fm/osa and coag. defect. I'm sure we'll find it if it's to be found at some point. Diane in MI Re: PFO and Hypercoagulation There is a 1 in 4 chance that you have a PFO. It's very common. In general, the more tests you do, the more that you will find wrong with you. The only reason I found out that I had a PFO was because they mistook one of my CFS attacks for a possible stroke or TIA. So they sent me for all kinds of neurological and cardiological workup. I found out during that workup that one of my main arteries joins at the wrong place, I have a mild chiari malformation, and I have a PFO. Later on, during testing at the FFC, I found out that I have HHV6a, Lyme disease (by criteria), and I have hypercoagulation. CFS/ME/CFIDS/CFAC could just be a cumulation of many things. The PFO was diagnosed using ultrasound and " bubbles " of saline. You'll need to see a cardiologist to get tested, and he'll want a good reason to test you (suspected TIA, etc.). Katrina. > > Can the PFO be undiagnosed? > Diane in MI ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.9/382 - Release Date: 7/4/2006 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 7, 2006 Report Share Posted July 7, 2006 Do they have to be specifically looking for a PFO to find it or would it have shown up on my general echocardiogram? Trina katrinanon <katnap@...> wrote: The PFO was diagnosed using ultrasound and " bubbles " of saline. You'll need to see a cardiologist to get tested, and he'll want a good reason to test you (suspected TIA, etc.). Katrina. . --------------------------------- Music Unlimited - Access over 1 million songs.Try it free. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 7, 2006 Report Share Posted July 7, 2006 They have to be looking for it and it isn't seen in an echocardiogram. They have to do some type of saline test... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 8, 2006 Report Share Posted July 8, 2006 is quite correct. They swoosh the saline back and forth between two syringes to make it full of tiny bubbles, then they inject that into the vein going back to your heart. Once the bubbles are in your heart, they have you make a " bearing down " motion, similar to the one made when going to the toilet. If the bubbles cross over into the other chamber, then you have a PFO which opens under pressure. They can tell how big the hole is by the number of bubbles that cross over. Kat. > > They have to be looking for it and it isn't seen in an echocardiogram. They > have to do some type of saline test... > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 2, 2006 Report Share Posted August 2, 2006 Does, anyone, know how it is diagnosed? I have read, recently, that High Heart Rate is one of the symptoms of PFO... Amelia Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 3, 2006 Report Share Posted August 3, 2006 Thanks, Annette, Is it a cardiologist that diagnoses? Do you know the precursory symptoms, that lead one to think it is a probability from the patient's point of view? And what symptoms would be relevant to the doc? Really appreciate that knowledgable answer... Amelia Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 3, 2006 Report Share Posted August 3, 2006 Hi Amelia, My Fiance has a PFO (but doesn't have CFS or ME). The diagnosis can be made by transthoracic echocardiography with injection of bubble contrast, combined with multiple sustained Valsalva manoeuvres. In his case he does not have a high heart rate. The reason he was tested for a PFO was blood clots. Kindest regards, Annette --------------------------------- Try the all-new . " The New Version is radically easier to use " – The Wall Street Journal Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 3, 2006 Report Share Posted August 3, 2006 Hi Kat, The procedure sounds invasive and a bit scary (especially for CFIDS/Distolic Dysfunction person). Did they tell you, or did you research any risks/side effects? What did it feel like? Do you have other cardiac diagnosis or symptoms? What had you been told to do or not do about it? This is an extremely valuable thread! Katrina > > > > They have to be looking for it and it isn't seen in an > echocardiogram. They > > have to do some type of saline test... > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 4, 2006 Report Share Posted August 4, 2006 On 7/7/06, katrinanon <katnap@...> wrote: > > Well, well, well. There's a link between PFO's and hypercoagulation. > I'm starting to think that it would be very worthwhile getting my PFO > closed: There was a recent posting here and elsewhere where Dr. Cheney documents a case where a CFS patient had PFO closure with BAD results. > > Sixteen > of 34 patients (47%) with complete arterial hypercoagulability > screening had laboratory evidence of arterial hypercoagulability. > Thirteen of these patients (38%) had antiphospholipid antibodies. > I don't think either of these numbers is high enough to show a causal relationship. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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