Re: Re. toleration of multivitamins

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

For me, having had CFS for decades and therefore reaching a 'par' where

I know what foods will or will not have any effect, adding in a vitamin

or mineral product (be it a single or multi) means that any response is

likely to be attributed to that product. Having been ill for so long I

am also aware that coincidence may happen and it is therefore necessary

to repeat exposure using very careful diary entries to monitor cause and

effect. Having said this however, in most cases the resultant side

effects are so gross that there is little confusion. I have noticed

that as time goes by, and especially since mega relapsing recently

(probably due to chemical exposure), I am even more sensitive to the

tiniest amounts of supplements/vits etc.

Rosie

Hi Dawn, Kathy F, Rosie, Vickie, Dianne, Ellen, and everyone.

I've been thinking about your responses, and what I can't seem to

understand is how anyone really pinned down the offending physical

responses that you experienced to only and specifically the multivitamin

you had previously taken. You know what I mean? I can understand

taking

the thing and then burping up the taste of it and that being

distasteful. And I can understand actually seeing the undigested pill

after it's left your body. But I can't seem to understand much of the

rest

of it.

What I mean is...how can you decide that it was the multi that caused

the

distress unless you did not ingest anything else that particular

morning,

afternoon, or for that matter, the entire day? If I took a pill and

something upset me, I'd have a very hard time figuring out that it WAS

the

pill that did it. I'd wonder about stuff I ate, stuff I drank,

combinations of things eaten or drunk, times of the day, all of it. And

I'd further find it really hard to pin it down to some particular

element

of the pill, say the vitamins B or the C or the iron or zinc or

anything. I would not be able to say " I took the xyz pill and the

vitamin

C did me in " or " I took the ABC pill and the yada-yada caused me to be

constipated. "

See what I mean? I don't see how anyone can be so precise in this. Can

someone explain this to me better? I'm not trying to nit-pick. I'm

trying

to understand.

in Champaign IL

For me, I could not " tolerate " any over the counter multi-vitamin that I

have tried. What are those? Almost every brand out there. What do I

mean

by not tolerate? GI upset: anything from nausea to burping up the taste

of

the vitamin for the entire day, increase in acid reflux, constipation,

abdominal pain, dizziness, just feeling yucky! And for some vitamins,

and

pardon me if this is gross to anyone, but they were comming out whole-

which

means they sure weren't helping!

Dawn

I have many of the same reactions (except for excreting a

complete pill but I've heard of this before). Other

symptoms are increased fatigue. There are probably more

symptoms that aren't coming to mind right now. None of

these symptoms are minor - GI symptoms with accompanying

fatigue can last for days. It feels very systemic and I

find it very difficult to eat.

I suspect the 'B' vitamins but I don't think that I tolerate

some of the amino acids either.

There may be more, like the sulfur I already mentioned, but

so far I haven't been able to determine what they are.

Kathy F.

Hi ,

I'm very sensitive to almost anything including all vit/min supps other

than Concentrace (don't know why that should be any different)

Most reactions exacerbate my ME generally and this doesn't ease with

time and is also very immediate. There seems to be a specific affinity

with making my cns symptoms much worse, and some will also cause my

interstitial cystitis to flare up - vitamin C will do this within a

matter of hours whatever form I take it in. I've worked out that my

body seems only able to tolerate things in the natural food form - so

diet is paramount.

I'm also mega- sensitive to most prescription medicines.

Rosie

Hi , it took me at least 10 years to find a multi-vitamin that I

could tolerate part of the time. I have to hold my nose when I take

them, otherwise, I have to just forget about it. Recently, I have

been taking them with Betaine HCL, No-Fenol, and digestive enzyme

multi-cap. That seems to work, except on really bad days.

My nose sends me a message that I am not going to tolerate something.

For me, the worst culprit is thiamine. I learned that by accident

when I bought thiamine separately. If I don't pay attention to my

nose, my stomach makes me wish I had -- a sick, upset stomach

feeling. The symptoms are general as well as local.

Vickie

I do not seem to have this problem now with supplements and take

many that I hope are doing me good, they certainly seem to be I know

when I had H.pyhlori last year I was so so thin with no appetite and

really was undernourished even though I was eating bascially a

normal diet. When I started on the mastika my stomach was very

uncomfortable for a few days but I felt if I do not try this a

little while longer I will never know...which is they way I have

proceded with everything I try and the way I see it is time to

adjust to what you body can benefit from...I know it can be a

roulette wheel but I have felt I had nothing to loose and maybe a

lot to gain...I must be one of the lucky ones that have made vast

improvements. I can only say how I am now which is far different to

a year back. I know from Thyroid tests done recently on that score I

am not improving by far but I am hopeful still. I could not climb

stairs a year back and did not have the strength to cut a piece of

cheese as an example only. BW Dianne

Reading your post reminds me, sometimes I get thins weird, floaty

feeling.

I don't know if anyone else has expereinced that.

Dawn

,

For me, one problem is that they tend to use ascorbic acid for the

source of

vitamin C, and magnesium oxide or other forms of magnesium that are not

the

most absorbable, both of which give me diarrhea. Also, the " more

complete "

ones throw in antioxidants like alpha lipoic acid and NAC, which are bad

for

people like me with high toxicity loads because they can cause

redistribution.

Ellen

This list is intended for patients to share personal experiences with

each other, not to give medical advice. If you are interested in any

treatment discussed here, please consult your doctor.

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 3/11/2006 2:51:00 PM Eastern Standard Time,

BernieAnne@... writes:

I also see some people getting instant results from taking a

supplement which somehow doesn't seem right.

Bernie

If you are REALLY deficient, you can indeed feel an 'instant' results. That

was my experience with SAM-e and my first 200 mg dose of it and again when I

did my first dose of liquid Magnesium.... after years of taking various

kinds of tabs and caps.

But, I am experienced in living in this body. The above were/are no placebo

effect.

And more recently, l-Carnitine tartrate gives me a response within about a

half an hour.

It's good to know of the placebo effect as that shows the mind/body

connection and opens the doors to other modes of healing and physical health

restoration.

mjh

" The Basil Book "

http://foxhillfarm.us/FireBasil/

[Guest guest]

Okay...thanks, Rosie. Does " are so gross " mean throwing up,

diarrhea, or...what? What all is included in this " gross " category?

Just checking...maybe my gross is different than other peoples's

grosses.

>

>

> Hi ,

>

> For me, having had CFS for decades and therefore reaching a 'par'

where

> I know what foods will or will not have any effect, adding in a

vitamin

> or mineral product (be it a single or multi) means that any

response is

> likely to be attributed to that product. Having been ill for so

long I

> am also aware that coincidence may happen and it is therefore

necessary

> to repeat exposure using very careful diary entries to monitor

cause and

> effect. Having said this however, in most cases the resultant side

> effects are so gross that there is little confusion. I have noticed

> that as time goes by, and especially since mega relapsing recently

> (probably due to chemical exposure), I am even more sensitive to the

> tiniest amounts of supplements/vits etc.

>

> Rosie

>

[Guest guest]

,

I know because I have tried these things separately, and find in avoiding

them I avoid the problems.

Ellen

> Hi Dawn, Kathy F, Rosie, Vickie, Dianne, Ellen, and everyone.

>

> I've been thinking about your responses, and what I can't seem to

> understand is how anyone really pinned down the offending physical

> responses that you experienced to only and specifically the multivitamin

> you had previously taken. You know what I mean? I can understand taking

> the thing and then burping up the taste of it and that being

> distasteful. And I can understand actually seeing the undigested pill

> after it's left your body. But I can't seem to understand much of the

> rest

> of it.

>

>

> in Champaign IL

[Guest guest]

Takes time to understand.Many times it takes a lot of time if you have brain

problems and you get worse until you detect the problem.

best wishes.

Nil

Re. toleration of multivitamins

> Hi Dawn, Kathy F, Rosie, Vickie, Dianne, Ellen, and everyone.

>

> I've been thinking about your responses, and what I can't seem to

> understand is how anyone really pinned down the offending physical

> responses that you experienced to only and specifically the multivitamin

> you had previously taken. You know what I mean? I can understand taking

>

[Guest guest]

Okay...that makes sense. Thank you, Ellen.

>

> ,

>

> I know because I have tried these things separately, and find in

avoiding

> them I avoid the problems.

>

> Ellen

>

>

[Guest guest]

Yes, that's true. And also true and applies to the big things in life

too. Especially, if all along, you thought your brain was

functioning " normally " and " it " must be coming from another source.

Thanks, Nil.

>

> Takes time to understand.Many times it takes a lot of time if you

have brain

> problems and you get worse until you detect the problem.

> best wishes.

>

> Nil

[Guest guest]

Hi , sometimes it is difficult to pin down what caused the bad

reaction and sometimes it takes a while to figure it out. I think

one's sense of smell and taste has something to do with it.

Everything has its own unique odor and taste. If I eat a hamburger

with onions and I react to the onions, I belch up something that

smells like onions, not something that smells like hamburger or meat,

etc. I don't know how your stomach can be selective in what it

belches up, but it can. Or maybe when something is offensive, you

become so sensitive to the smell that you can't smell anything else

that you belch up. Or if you don't belch it up, you have a strong

onion taste in your mouth and the taste is VERY offensive.

If I throw up something, it is a long time before I am able to eat it

again. I'm sure we are all born with instincts that help us avoid

toxic substances. Anything we are allergic to or sensitive to is

toxic to us.

Hope that helps,

Vickie

>

>

> Hi Dawn, Kathy F, Rosie, Vickie, Dianne, Ellen, and everyone.

>

> I've been thinking about your responses, and what I can't seem to

> understand is how anyone really pinned down the offending physical

> responses that you experienced to only and specifically the

>multivitamin

> you had previously taken. You know what I mean? I can understand

>taking

> the thing and then burping up the taste of it and that being

> distasteful. And I can understand actually seeing the undigested

>pill

> after it's left your body. But I can't seem to understand much of

>the rest

> of it.

>

> What I mean is...how can you decide that it was the multi that

>caused the

> distress unless you did not ingest anything else that particular

>morning,

> afternoon, or for that matter, the entire day? If I took a pill

>and

> something upset me, I'd have a very hard time figuring out that it

>WAS the

> pill that did it. I'd wonder about stuff I ate, stuff I drank,

> combinations of things eaten or drunk, times of the day, all of

>it. And

> I'd further find it really hard to pin it down to some particular

>element

> of the pill, say the vitamins B or the C or the iron or zinc or

> anything. I would not be able to say " I took the xyz pill and the

>vitamin

> C did me in " or " I took the ABC pill and the yada-yada caused me to

>be

> constipated. "

>

> See what I mean? I don't see how anyone can be so precise in

>this. Can

> someone explain this to me better? I'm not trying to nit-pick.

>I'm trying

> to understand.

>

>

> in Champaign IL

>

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

Sorry, I meant 'gross' in terms of size or magnitude; ie; there isn't

much doubt that there is exists cause and effect.

Rosie

Subject: Re: Re. toleration of multivitamins

Okay...thanks, Rosie. Does " are so gross " mean throwing up,

diarrhea, or...what? What all is included in this " gross " category?

Just checking...maybe my gross is different than other peoples's

grosses.

>

>

> Hi ,

>

> For me, having had CFS for decades and therefore reaching a 'par'

where

> I know what foods will or will not have any effect, adding in a

vitamin

> or mineral product (be it a single or multi) means that any

response is

> likely to be attributed to that product. Having been ill for so

long I

> am also aware that coincidence may happen and it is therefore

necessary

> to repeat exposure using very careful diary entries to monitor

cause and

> effect. Having said this however, in most cases the resultant side

> effects are so gross that there is little confusion. I have noticed

> that as time goes by, and especially since mega relapsing recently

> (probably due to chemical exposure), I am even more sensitive to the

> tiniest amounts of supplements/vits etc.

>

> Rosie

>

This list is intended for patients to share personal experiences with

each other, not to give medical advice. If you are interested in any

treatment discussed here, please consult your doctor.

[Guest guest]

> I've been thinking about your responses, and what I can't seem to

> understand is how anyone really pinned down the offending physical

> responses that you experienced to only and specifically the

multivitamin

> you had previously taken. You know what I mean? I can understand

taking

> the thing and then burping up the taste of it and that being

> distasteful. And I can understand actually seeing the undigested

pill

> after it's left your body. But I can't seem to understand much of

the rest

> of it.

>

> What I mean is...how can you decide that it was the multi that

caused the

> distress unless you did not ingest anything else that particular

morning,

> afternoon, or for that matter, the entire day? If I took a pill

and

> something upset me, I'd have a very hard time figuring out that it

WAS the

> pill that did it. I'd wonder about stuff I ate, stuff I drank,

> combinations of things eaten or drunk, times of the day, all of

it. And

> I'd further find it really hard to pin it down to some particular

element

> of the pill, say the vitamins B or the C or the iron or zinc or

> anything. I would not be able to say " I took the xyz pill and the

vitamin

> C did me in " or " I took the ABC pill and the yada-yada caused me to

be

> constipated. "

>

> See what I mean? I don't see how anyone can be so precise in

this. Can

> someone explain this to me better? I'm not trying to nit-pick.

I'm trying

> to understand.

Hi - You aren't the only person here trying to figure out the

same thing. I too don't know how anyone can pin point it down to one

product. I also see some people getting instant results from taking a

supplement which somehow doesn't seem right. That to me would be the

placebo effect. A person doesn't become deficient overnight, so it

would seem unlikely that there would be an instant result, or that by

missing a day that there would be noticeable difference. As the body

stores most nutrients there would have to be at least a week or two

go by before there should be any noticeable effect, if any.

Hey, what can I say; I'm a born skeptic and I question everything :-)

Like you, I am also trying to understand this. The more I can learn

the better.

Take care.

Bernie

[Guest guest]

Hi Vickie. I agree with your general principle. But it does remind

me of something sort of parallel that I think is now faulty logic but

that I myself believed for a long time.

When I had my first acute gallbladder attack, I was so terrified

along with the pain and feeling sick, that stuck with me forever and

combined with my there-to-fore belief that diet affected my

gallbladder. Once I saw my doctor, who was a gastro internal med

guy, he told me that the cause was solely genetics (and based on my

family, that's borne out). However, even though I believed my

doctor, my previous beliefs stuck with me and were a stronger

influence, because the impact of the experience with the pain and

terror caused me to swear off chocolate, which I did successfully for

one year. Chocolate had no influence on my diet. It was only a

previous association I'd made with " fatty diet " and " fatty diets

cause gallbladder attacks, " both of which were not ultimately

sensible for me because gallbladder disease is in my family and is

genetic.

I certainly see your sense as it relates to hamburgers with onions!

That's how I stopped eating beef, many years ago. My mother made

hamburgers with raw onions, which did make me ill. I stopped eating

her hamburgers, which saved my stomach upset, and in addition drew my

attention to " beef. " (If I *never* contract new variant CJD, I will

chalk it up to stopping beef consumption by virtue of my mother's

burgers with onions. If I do, however, I will presumably be too far

gone at the time it's discovered to make the connection. This may be

called bohemian logic, but it makes sense to me. )

>

> Hi , sometimes it is difficult to pin down what caused the bad

> reaction and sometimes it takes a while to figure it out. I think

> one's sense of smell and taste has something to do with it.

> Everything has its own unique odor and taste. If I eat a hamburger

> with onions and I react to the onions, I belch up something that

> smells like onions, not something that smells like hamburger or

meat,

> etc. I don't know how your stomach can be selective in what it

> belches up, but it can. Or maybe when something is offensive, you

> become so sensitive to the smell that you can't smell anything

else

> that you belch up. Or if you don't belch it up, you have a strong

> onion taste in your mouth and the taste is VERY offensive.

>

> If I throw up something, it is a long time before I am able to eat

it

> again. I'm sure we are all born with instincts that help us avoid

> toxic substances. Anything we are allergic to or sensitive to is

> toxic to us.

>

> Hope that helps,

>

> Vickie

[Guest guest]

Oh, okay. Thanks, Rosie. Big difference between what we were

thinking.

>

>

> Hi ,

>

> Sorry, I meant 'gross' in terms of size or magnitude; ie; there isn't

> much doubt that there is exists cause and effect.

>

> Rosie

>

[Guest guest]

Well, , for me, I can say that I did lots of trial and error. I would

take the vitamin and experience symptoms. I wouldn't take the vitamin, I

wouldn't experience the symptoms. As to what in the vitamin I specifically

did not tolerate, I am not sure. I know that before I found my current

brand, I had the most success with Geratol because it didn't contain Ca, but

my current one does contain Ca and I have no trouble with it. I am not sure

how well that answered your question, let me know if you need more

clarification.

Dawn

>From: Capel <kcapel@...>

>Reply-

>

>Subject: Re. toleration of multivitamins

>Date: Sat, 11 Mar 2006 02:37:06 -0600

>

>Hi Dawn, Kathy F, Rosie, Vickie, Dianne, Ellen, and everyone.

>

>I've been thinking about your responses, and what I can't seem to

>understand is how anyone really pinned down the offending physical

>responses that you experienced to only and specifically the multivitamin

>you had previously taken. You know what I mean? I can understand taking

>the thing and then burping up the taste of it and that being

>distasteful. And I can understand actually seeing the undigested pill

>after it's left your body. But I can't seem to understand much of the rest

>of it.

>

>What I mean is...how can you decide that it was the multi that caused the

>distress unless you did not ingest anything else that particular morning,

>afternoon, or for that matter, the entire day? If I took a pill and

>something upset me, I'd have a very hard time figuring out that it WAS the

>pill that did it. I'd wonder about stuff I ate, stuff I drank,

>combinations of things eaten or drunk, times of the day, all of it. And

>I'd further find it really hard to pin it down to some particular element

>of the pill, say the vitamins B or the C or the iron or zinc or

>anything. I would not be able to say " I took the xyz pill and the vitamin

>C did me in " or " I took the ABC pill and the yada-yada caused me to be

>constipated. "

>

>See what I mean? I don't see how anyone can be so precise in this. Can

>someone explain this to me better? I'm not trying to nit-pick. I'm trying

>to understand.

>

>

>in Champaign IL

>

>

>For me, I could not " tolerate " any over the counter multi-vitamin that I

>have tried. What are those? Almost every brand out there. What do I mean

>by not tolerate? GI upset: anything from nausea to burping up the taste of

>the vitamin for the entire day, increase in acid reflux, constipation,

>abdominal pain, dizziness, just feeling yucky! And for some vitamins, and

>pardon me if this is gross to anyone, but they were comming out whole-

>which

>means they sure weren't helping!

>Dawn

>

>

>I have many of the same reactions (except for excreting a

>complete pill but I've heard of this before). Other

>symptoms are increased fatigue. There are probably more

>symptoms that aren't coming to mind right now. None of

>these symptoms are minor - GI symptoms with accompanying

>fatigue can last for days. It feels very systemic and I

>find it very difficult to eat.

>I suspect the 'B' vitamins but I don't think that I tolerate

>some of the amino acids either.

>There may be more, like the sulfur I already mentioned, but

>so far I haven't been able to determine what they are.

>Kathy F.

>

>

>Hi ,

>I'm very sensitive to almost anything including all vit/min supps other

>than Concentrace (don't know why that should be any different)

>Most reactions exacerbate my ME generally and this doesn't ease with

>time and is also very immediate. There seems to be a specific affinity

>with making my cns symptoms much worse, and some will also cause my

>interstitial cystitis to flare up - vitamin C will do this within a

>matter of hours whatever form I take it in. I've worked out that my

>body seems only able to tolerate things in the natural food form - so

>diet is paramount.

>I'm also mega- sensitive to most prescription medicines.

>Rosie

>

>

>

>Hi , it took me at least 10 years to find a multi-vitamin that I

>could tolerate part of the time. I have to hold my nose when I take

>them, otherwise, I have to just forget about it. Recently, I have

>been taking them with Betaine HCL, No-Fenol, and digestive enzyme

>multi-cap. That seems to work, except on really bad days.

>My nose sends me a message that I am not going to tolerate something.

>For me, the worst culprit is thiamine. I learned that by accident

>when I bought thiamine separately. If I don't pay attention to my

>nose, my stomach makes me wish I had -- a sick, upset stomach

>feeling. The symptoms are general as well as local.

>Vickie

>

>

>

>I do not seem to have this problem now with supplements and take

>many that I hope are doing me good, they certainly seem to be I know

>when I had H.pyhlori last year I was so so thin with no appetite and

>really was undernourished even though I was eating bascially a

>normal diet. When I started on the mastika my stomach was very

>uncomfortable for a few days but I felt if I do not try this a

>little while longer I will never know...which is they way I have

>proceded with everything I try and the way I see it is time to

>adjust to what you body can benefit from...I know it can be a

>roulette wheel but I have felt I had nothing to loose and maybe a

>lot to gain...I must be one of the lucky ones that have made vast

>improvements. I can only say how I am now which is far different to

>a year back. I know from Thyroid tests done recently on that score I

>am not improving by far but I am hopeful still. I could not climb

>stairs a year back and did not have the strength to cut a piece of

>cheese as an example only. BW Dianne

>

>

>

>Reading your post reminds me, sometimes I get thins weird, floaty feeling.

>I don't know if anyone else has expereinced that.

>Dawn

>

>

>

>,

>For me, one problem is that they tend to use ascorbic acid for the source

>of

>vitamin C, and magnesium oxide or other forms of magnesium that are not the

>most absorbable, both of which give me diarrhea. Also, the " more complete "

>ones throw in antioxidants like alpha lipoic acid and NAC, which are bad

>for

>people like me with high toxicity loads because they can cause

>redistribution.

>Ellen

>

>

>

>

>

>

>This list is intended for patients to share personal experiences with each

>other, not to give medical advice. If you are interested in any treatment

>discussed here, please consult your doctor.

>

[Guest guest]

>

> > I've been thinking about your responses, and what I can't seem

to

> > understand is how anyone really pinned down the offending

physical

> > responses that you experienced to only and specifically the

> multivitamin

> > you had previously taken. You know what I mean? I can

understand

> taking

> > the thing and then burping up the taste of it and that being

> > distasteful. And I can understand actually seeing the

undigested

> pill

> > after it's left your body. But I can't seem to understand much

of

> the rest

> > of it.

> >

> > What I mean is...how can you decide that it was the multi that

> caused the

> > distress unless you did not ingest anything else that particular

> morning,

> > afternoon, or for that matter, the entire day? If I took a pill

> and

> > something upset me, I'd have a very hard time figuring out that

it

> WAS the

> > pill that did it. I'd wonder about stuff I ate, stuff I drank,

> > combinations of things eaten or drunk, times of the day, all of

> it. And

> > I'd further find it really hard to pin it down to some

particular

> element

> > of the pill, say the vitamins B or the C or the iron or zinc or

> > anything. I would not be able to say " I took the xyz pill and

the

> vitamin

> > C did me in " or " I took the ABC pill and the yada-yada caused me

to

> be

> > constipated. "

> >

> > See what I mean? I don't see how anyone can be so precise in

> this. Can

> > someone explain this to me better? I'm not trying to nit-pick.

> I'm trying

> > to understand.

>

>

> Hi - You aren't the only person here trying to figure out

the

> same thing. I too don't know how anyone can pin point it down to

one

> product. I also see some people getting instant results from

taking a

> supplement which somehow doesn't seem right. That to me would be

the

> placebo effect. A person doesn't become deficient overnight, so it

> would seem unlikely that there would be an instant result, or that

by

> missing a day that there would be noticeable difference. As the

body

> stores most nutrients there would have to be at least a week or

two

> go by before there should be any noticeable effect, if any.

>

> Hey, what can I say; I'm a born skeptic and I question

everything :-)

> Like you, I am also trying to understand this. The more I can

learn

> the better.

>

> Take care.

>

> Bernie

This is a hard one I can only say what I feel.. in my case I was

battlerling to keep weight on and so much more of course...strength

was gone I had the shakes something awlful I could not concentrate

for any reasonable length on time walking was an effort and I swayed

easily...I had ringing in my ears and could hear suddenly sounds

that where magnified..I could not bear to be touched...I hurt so

much I just cried and cried..I could not sleep...I hate to say this

now but I tried to take my life on 5 ocassions because I could

really and truly bear no more...I fought back and as slow as it was

just making some recovery was everything and I stick with my regime

that I feel has made the difference but also know I have some to go

yet. I cannot answer what works best as we all have different makeup

and therefore individual needs. The body is so so complicated. BW

Dianne

>

[Guest guest]

So, does this ruin / change your previous conviction that calcium

affected you badly? Or does it make you question the current multi's

delivery of calcium to your system? I'm not sure where this leaves

me, either, Dawn!

>

> Well, , for me, I can say that I did lots of trial and error.

I would

> take the vitamin and experience symptoms. I wouldn't take the

vitamin, I

> wouldn't experience the symptoms. As to what in the vitamin I

specifically

> did not tolerate, I am not sure. I know that before I found my

current

> brand, I had the most success with Geratol because it didn't

contain Ca, but

> my current one does contain Ca and I have no trouble with it. I am

not sure

> how well that answered your question, let me know if you need more

> clarification.

> Dawn

>

[Guest guest]

Yes, very individual and so complicated, Dianne, and I truly

appreciate you sharing your strife here. What a torture this all is,

even on lesser levels than what you have courageously withstood. I

can relate to the tears at a touch on the skin and magnified sounds,

tinnitus, and other stuff. Just lately I've noticed an increased

sensitivity to even subdued light on days with overcast weather, no

sun in the sky. Even with clouds overhead, I squint my eyes and

it " hurts " to try to see.

> This is a hard one I can only say what I feel.. in my case I was

> battlerling to keep weight on and so much more of course...strength

> was gone I had the shakes something awlful I could not concentrate

> for any reasonable length on time walking was an effort and I

swayed

> easily...I had ringing in my ears and could hear suddenly sounds

> that where magnified..I could not bear to be touched...I hurt so

> much I just cried and cried..I could not sleep...I hate to say this

> now but I tried to take my life on 5 ocassions because I could

> really and truly bear no more...I fought back and as slow as it was

> just making some recovery was everything and I stick with my regime

> that I feel has made the difference but also know I have some to go

> yet. I cannot answer what works best as we all have different

makeup

> and therefore individual needs. The body is so so complicated. BW

> Dianne

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Dawn

Both the migraine and the constipation suggest very strongly that you are

not getting enough Magnesium and so the Calcium is out of balance, causing your

issues.

mjh

In a message dated 3/11/2006 11:38:18 PM Eastern Standard Time,

dawnmunn@... writes:

I had a full blown migraine... I really should stay away from

my computer when I have a migraine. The peoblem I had was not with Ca, it

was with iron. Again, I am really sorry. I am not sure why I wrote that.

I do know that if I take a seperate Ca pill (not in a multivit,) that always

caused constipation.

mjh

" The Basil Book "

http://foxhillfarm.us/FireBasil/

[Guest guest]

I think it has to do with the current pills delivery. My current multi is 2

separate pills, one taken in the AM, one in the PM. I think that somehow

the way they separate the vitamins between the pills is what makes the

difference. And, , I really need to apologize. I wrote that email

earlier when I had a full blown migraine... I really should stay away from

my computer when I have a migraine. The peoblem I had was not with Ca, it

was with iron. Again, I am really sorry. I am not sure why I wrote that.

I do know that if I take a seperate Ca pill (not in a multivit,) that always

caused constipation. The only Ca I found that I could take alone was

Viactiv chews. So, for me, I don't think my problem has anything to do with

the amount of vitamins, but rather the delivery. Probably has something to

do with all of my allergies. Maybe some of the multivits had fillers that

would react with my body, I am not sure why I had so many bad reactions,

that is purely a guess. But like I said, I am so greatful to have found one

that works well for me now. If you are interested, I can give you the

breakdown of the two seperate pills, maybe there is something there.

-Dawn

>From: " netsukeme " <kcapel@...>

>Reply-

>

>Subject: Re: Re. toleration of multivitamins

>Date: Sat, 11 Mar 2006 20:31:05 -0000

>

>So, does this ruin / change your previous conviction that calcium

>affected you badly? Or does it make you question the current multi's

>delivery of calcium to your system? I'm not sure where this leaves

>me, either, Dawn!

>

>

>

_________________________________________________________________

Don’t just search. Find. Check out the new MSN Search!

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[Guest guest]

mjh,

migraines and constipation are related to mag deficiency??? Tell me more

please!!! While mine are bothersome (I get migraines almost weakly now), my

mom has debilitating migraines and had to have her colon removed 3 years ago

for severe constipation. Now, her small intestine is making hard stool and

she is still constipated!! I would love to be able to help her out. BTW,

she has fibro too.

Dawn

>From: foxhillers@...

>Reply-

>

>Subject: Re: Re: Re. toleration of multivitamins

>Date: Sat, 11 Mar 2006 23:45:57 EST

>

>

>

>Dawn

>

>Both the migraine and the constipation suggest very strongly that you are

>not getting enough Magnesium and so the Calcium is out of balance, causing

>your

>issues.

>

>mjh

>

>

>In a message dated 3/11/2006 11:38:18 PM Eastern Standard Time,

>dawnmunn@... writes:

>

>I had a full blown migraine... I really should stay away from

>my computer when I have a migraine. The peoblem I had was not with Ca, it

>was with iron. Again, I am really sorry. I am not sure why I wrote

>that.

>I do know that if I take a seperate Ca pill (not in a multivit,) that

>always

>caused constipation.

>

>

>

>

>mjh

> " The Basil Book "

>http://foxhillfarm.us/FireBasil/

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

>

> mjh,

> migraines and constipation are related to mag deficiency??? Tell

me more

> please!!!

Hi Dawn

There is a neurologist in the US who treats people with severe

migraines and he has discovered that taking magnesium, B2

(Riboflavin) and B-com helps a lot of the time. It can take three to

four months before you notice any improvement, however, according to

his patients once it starts to work, their migraines, if they get

them, are much less severe and they are able to function normally.

Magnesium taken in larger doses will help with constipation (think

Milk of Magnesia).

Take care.

Bernie