Epstein--Barr antibodies

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 12/29/02 8:46:13 AM Eastern Standard Time,

writes:

> The onset of CFS involves suppression of the Th1 immune

> response (I suspect by glutathione and cysteine depletion), which is

> the one used to control viral infections. This allows the latent

> Epstein--Barr viral infection to be reactivated. Because the Th1

> immune response continues to be suppressed, the Epstein--Barr viral

> infection continues to be activated, and this can be shown by

> measuring the amounts of the various antibodies that are present.

> The Epstein--Barr nuclear antigen antibody is one of those that is

> often highly elevated in persistent reactivated infections. Another

> is the so-called early antigen antibody.

>

> Rich

>

Rich, this discussion of gluathione made me wonder about something. You know

how many CFSers don't get sick with cold/flu? You have also probably noticed

at least a couple on here who got much better (Steve B is one and the other

is a female whose name I cannot recall but very recent in the last month when

she posted on here) got colds for the first time since their illness. Do you

think they got sick with colds b/c of their glutathione being restored? I

brought up DMPS chelation for 8 months and cutting my mercury in half and my

small improvement since doing it as an example of how I thought maybe there

is something to your glutathione connection, although only time will tell if

further chelation brings about better results b/c working out 1-2 times a

week with the wimpy workouts I have is still not good enough for me and

represents only a stepping stone of progress in my opinion. I guess you may

suggest that glutathione improvement is an indirect reason CFSers who have

gotten well get sick with colds and that the direct resason is Th1/Th2 shift

but that this shift occurs due to glutathione improvement? I got sick with a

terrible cold/flu for first time in almost 3 years and a week later my head

hurts if I walk hard on the floor and I feel the pain manifested into my

teeth/jaw region and I have had this in the past and was wondering if this is

what is viral encephalopathy (sp?). I am better as of yesterday after being

sick for a week but this pain in the skull and upper teeth/jaw region is new

symptom left over from the sickness. Thanks for the explanation of the EBV

antibodies.

[Guest guest]

,

I know of three hypotheses to explain why many PWCs don't experience

the symptoms of colds or flus.

The first is that they have elevated RNase-L, and this chops up the

messenger RNA needed to replicate the viruses, so it stops their

proliferation. I first heard this one from Dr. Rosenbaum,

but I don't think it was original with him.

The second is that their immune response is shifted to Th2, and the

resulting elevated antibodies are able to kill the viruses during

the time they are outside the cells, travelling from one cell to

another. I suggested this one.

The third is that these PWCs really are infected with colds and

flus, but they don't experience the symptoms because the symptoms

result from the normal immune response to these infections, and

their immune responses are suppressed. This one is due to Rob

Napier.

I don't know which of these is the true explanation for this often-

reported phenomenon. I do think that rebuilding glutathione could

explain the return of cold and flu symptoms in PWCs, whichever of

the above hypotheses is the true one, because I think that the

depletion of glutathione and cysteine is what gives rise to the Th1

to Th2 shift, the rise in RNase-L, and the suppression of the immune

system. Getting rid of mercury is also important in restoring the

glutathione level, so that may explain your own observation of

getting a cold or flu after three years of not getting them.

I don't know what to make of your head and jaw pain, but perhaps

your immune system is coming alive and is fighting some things that

have been there for a while. This would be in keeping with Rob's

hypothesis above.

Rich

> Rich, this discussion of gluathione made me wonder about

something. You know

> how many CFSers don't get sick with cold/flu? You have also

probably noticed

> at least a couple on here who got much better (Steve B is one and

the other

> is a female whose name I cannot recall but very recent in the last

month when

> she posted on here) got colds for the first time since their

illness. Do you

> think they got sick with colds b/c of their glutathione being

restored? I

> brought up DMPS chelation for 8 months and cutting my mercury in

half and my

> small improvement since doing it as an example of how I thought

maybe there

> is something to your glutathione connection, although only time

will tell if

> further chelation brings about better results b/c working out 1-2

times a

> week with the wimpy workouts I have is still not good enough for

me and

> represents only a stepping stone of progress in my opinion. I

guess you may

> suggest that glutathione improvement is an indirect reason CFSers

who have

> gotten well get sick with colds and that the direct resason is

Th1/Th2 shift

> but that this shift occurs due to glutathione improvement? I got

sick with a

> terrible cold/flu for first time in almost 3 years and a week

later my head

> hurts if I walk hard on the floor and I feel the pain manifested

into my

> teeth/jaw region and I have had this in the past and was wondering

if this is

> what is viral encephalopathy (sp?). I am better as of yesterday

after being

> sick for a week but this pain in the skull and upper teeth/jaw

region is new

> symptom left over from the sickness. Thanks for the explanation

of the EBV

> antibodies.

>

>

>

>