Cholestyramine tx and Herxing

[Guest guest]

My voiced concern over the herxing issue with this treatment was because

my doc said there was no herxing, yet people on the list, including

reports via Carol S. from Cheney, said yes there was.

So last night I read the chapter in Shoemaker's book on Herxing. I

actually think that chapter contains the heart of his model (and how he

discovered it) relating neurotoxins to symptoms to the treatment.

Because much of the explanation takes place at (I think) the level of

molecular biology and that's not something I've had an iota of study in,

in order to reproduce his argument I'd have to do lots more work than I'm

willing to do, and even then I don't know how close I'd get.

HOWEVER, I think I'm correct in the following representation of what he's

saying:

1. That there is a worsening of symptoms with treatment just as with

Herxing, though he calls it " intensification. " The experience is

indistinguishable (you get sicker) but Herxing involves killing bugs that

release toxins and intensification involves removing toxins from tissue I

think into the bloodstream before they're

eliminated from the body.

2. That the above worsening from the treatment varies depending on the

cause of the/ source of the toxins, e.g., whether from Lyme or from

physical trauma or from environmental toxin exposure AND the length of

time you've been ill (an old and familiar phenomenon).

3. He does use that drug (I didn't write down the name but it's already

been mentioned) to absorb those toxins in order to reduce the awfulness

of the toxin release, and in fact starts patients on it before starting

the cholestryramine (sp?). While apparently Cheney reduces the amount of

the cholestryramine (csm) though I don't know if he (Cheney) also gives

that absorbing drug.

I was very disappointed given what my doc had told me to learn of this

intensification reaction.

What I really think we need is reports of experience accompanied with

what was identified as the primary sources of the toxin and lenght of

illness so that we are in a better position to predict for each of us who

might try this treatment what to expect.

There are several people who've already said they're on it. It seems

that the above and the intensificiation reaction would help others of us.

Shoemaker describes a few patients and I haven't read the entire book so

I've probably not read about all of them; but some did get quite sick

though it seems not for a long time.

I do wish Shoemaker or someone would collect and organize the data on

those using it to help guide the rest of us considering it, especially

those who are quite ill and have been so quite long.

Of course I might be wrong about the above since I didn't discuss it with

anyone and since there was lots of scientific material that I really had

to let be without getting under my belt, but I was most interested in the

issue of whether or not you risked getting sicker in the process of

getting better, and apparently you do.

Judith Wisdom

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[Guest guest]

> Judith, I too took the test and came back positive and as I was

taking the drug I got really sick. My doctor did not alert me to a

possibility of hexing. I went off the drug and never started back on

it since I didnt know at the time what was wrong. Ive since

understand about the hexing but have not tried it again. mary

>

>

>

>

> My voiced concern over the herxing issue with this treatment was

because

> my doc said there was no herxing, yet people on the list, including

> reports via Carol S. from Cheney, said yes there was.

>

> So last night I read the chapter in Shoemaker's book on Herxing. I

> actually think that chapter contains the heart of his model (and

how he

> discovered it) relating neurotoxins to symptoms to the treatment.

>

> Because much of the explanation takes place at (I think) the level

of

> molecular biology and that's not something I've had an iota of

study in,

> in order to reproduce his argument I'd have to do lots more work

than I'm

> willing to do, and even then I don't know how close I'd get.

>

> HOWEVER, I think I'm correct in the following representation of

what he's

> saying:

>

> 1. That there is a worsening of symptoms with treatment just as

with

> Herxing, though he calls it " intensification. " The experience is

> indistinguishable (you get sicker) but Herxing involves killing

bugs that

> release toxins and intensification involves removing toxins from

tissue I

> think into the bloodstream before they're

> eliminated from the body.

>

> 2. That the above worsening from the treatment varies depending on

the

> cause of the/ source of the toxins, e.g., whether from Lyme or from

> physical trauma or from environmental toxin exposure AND the length

of

> time you've been ill (an old and familiar phenomenon).

>

> 3. He does use that drug (I didn't write down the name but it's

already

> been mentioned) to absorb those toxins in order to reduce the

awfulness

> of the toxin release, and in fact starts patients on it before

starting

> the cholestryramine (sp?). While apparently Cheney reduces the

amount of

> the cholestryramine (csm) though I don't know if he (Cheney) also

gives

> that absorbing drug.

>

> I was very disappointed given what my doc had told me to learn of

this

> intensification reaction.

>

> What I really think we need is reports of experience accompanied

with

> what was identified as the primary sources of the toxin and lenght

of

> illness so that we are in a better position to predict for each of

us who

> might try this treatment what to expect.

>

> There are several people who've already said they're on it. It

seems

> that the above and the intensificiation reaction would help others

of us.

>

> Shoemaker describes a few patients and I haven't read the entire

book so

> I've probably not read about all of them; but some did get quite

sick

> though it seems not for a long time.

>

> I do wish Shoemaker or someone would collect and organize the data

on

> those using it to help guide the rest of us considering it,

especially

> those who are quite ill and have been so quite long.

>

> Of course I might be wrong about the above since I didn't discuss

it with

> anyone and since there was lots of scientific material that I

really had

> to let be without getting under my belt, but I was most interested

in the

> issue of whether or not you risked getting sicker in the process of

> getting better, and apparently you do.

>

> Judith Wisdom

> ________________________________________________________________

> GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO!

> Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less!

> Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit:

> http://dl.www.juno.com/get/web/.