Re: Judy B. / Mort / perspective

[Guest guest]

Judy / Mort,

At 3:09 PM +0200 on 7/13/00 the esteemed judy wrote:

Re: making your own lightbox:

>Mort,

>Ignorant couch potatoes! your post made me think as I have CFS for a year

[snip]

>Maybe, just maybe, there is a good side to CFS, not for the victim but for

>the family?

>Sorry to philosophize...your words touched a chord with me, especially as it

>is my birthday today and I wish myself that on my 42nd birthday next year I

>will be a lot healthier than on my 41st, that my family will all be healthy,

>that everyone on the list will have better health and that we should have

>some peace in the world...

Judy B.

Your response to Mort was appropriate and you need not apologize for

philosophizing. Although certainly no one wants to get any type of illness

one thing that illness does is allows for an awareness of perspective and

compassion.

My main illness is Bipolar Disorder. I am fortunate that it is stabilized.

I have no regrets, and I don't wish to be different. I have lost marriages,

businesses, money, property etc. etc. due to the illness. Oh well, what really

happened is that I lived a life. Fortunately I am still alive to keep living.

I am lucky, that is all.

I was very fortunate to be with my late wife, , for seven years. She had

Budd-Chiari syndrome for seventeen years. She was never bitter, and always

appreciative of any type of medical support she received.

Even at the end when we figured out that she had been betrayed by the HMO

capitation incentive system and her liver disease protocols had been

denied her,

she was not bitter, she simply wanted to see if we could get her what we could

to keep her alive. That I did, as aggressively as I could.

knew she had a

fatal illness, that every day being alive was a blessing, and that

the battle to stay

alive was just that.

Her physical condition was so horrific and complicated that when people would

ask her to explain the illness they would disappear from our lives. It was too

intense. She looked pregnant. She had 48 endoscopies. She had 4

major esophageal

varices hemorrhages. She had intermittent bleeding from the portal

hypertension

caused by a 100 percent cirrhosed liver for the last five years of

her life. She

was, and I am not a score keeper, pretty much the sickest person in just about

any room she was in. But, she never talked about her illness unless

asked. Then

when asked, whoever asked would immediately become uncomfortable with

the details.

was also a brittle diabetic. This erratic form of diabetes was

complicated by

her liver intermittently releasing glucose. Even with her intensive

studies in patient

diabetic control and testing ten or more times a day with sometimes

that many insulin

injections her hypoglycemic reactions were brutal. She had the type

of body where she

could not recognize the symptoms. It was common for her to test in

the 30's, a more

than a couple times in the 20's, with the lowest a 24. I checked on

her a minimum of

every two hours wherever I was and whatever I was doing for seven years for her

to be in a possible diabetic reaction.

She was a singer, piano player. She continued her career singing at

the Catamaran

Hotel in Pacific Beach part of San Diego up until five months before

the doctors took

her down. When she would be working people would be talking about

their lives and

their illnesses. She would listen and offer words of encouragement.

She would never

mention her own illness. She would never compare and be condescending,

Mort,

She was a blast to be around. I still can't believe she is gone. I

can't believe

it was that the doctors decided to save money for their bonus

program on. She

had a wonderful attitude. It did not matter, when it came to money,

she was too expensive,

she was out! It didn't matter that she faithfully paid her insurance premiums.

If it wasn't for Dr. Eugene Schiff in Miami I would never have gotten

her transferred

out of Sharp Hospital to UCSD for her liver transplant.

The transplant was successful. She died when the transplanted liver

did not activate.

The autopsy did showed that it did not activate because at Sharp they

let her bleed out

11 pints of blood (while transfusing 11 in) instead of doing

continuous emergent endoscopies

(with either sclerotherapy or the balloon dilation) to stop the

bleeding. The doctors at

Sharp elected, over my vehement objections, to let her bleed while I

watched her blood pressure stay bottomed out. That is how I called

Dr. Schiff.

When was in Sharp the final time and at UCSD she was in an

encephalopic coma,

by a miracle she woke up as they were wheeling her out for the

transplant, to everyone's

amazement! She was on life support with the breathing tubes. We

explained she was off

for the transplant. She smiled and gave a thumbs up. Still not

complaining. Then she

did an amazing thing, but it wasn't surprising to me. She made a

motion of taking her

liver out and made a sending motion like a football pass. I knew

what she was doing,

I said OK, , we will send your live to Dr. Schiff! That is the

last thing she

consciously requested, that her liver go to research.

I think that is the way to be! That is what I try to emulate. I

loved her style.

That is why I enjoy helping others so much. I know of so many that

have 's

attitude. That is the way I am. I like this list so much because of

the intensity

of everyone's desire to get better. No one is condescending.

Until,

RE: making your own lightbox

> Cheryl,

[snip]

> I ain't got no little Seasonal Affective Disorder (SAD), longing for bright

> summer days - and I bet most PWC's feel best in the winter, despite the

> " research " stating we are sickest then - this is more " It's All In Your

> Head " crap. Let the depressives have their low winters and happy summers -

> PWCs feel best when SADs are at their worst.. Any comment from anyone?

[snip]

> Mort Caldwell

Mort,

Your condescending remarks regarding SAD patients is an insult. I could give

you lots of facts and figures but I don't know who you are and if you read

information like that or if you really care? Too make a non-compassionate

statement about someone else who is sick while you have an illness,

of any type,

amazes me. It disappoints me. It the group was made up of members with your

attitude I would have been gone the first hour.

Fortunately you appear to be an anomaly.

San Diego

At 3:09 PM +0200 on 7/13/00 the esteemed judy wrote:

Re: making your own lightbox:

>Mort,

>Ignorant couch potatoes! your post made me think as I have CFS for a year

[snip]

>Maybe, just maybe, there is a good side to CFS, not for the victim but for

>the family?

>Sorry to philosophize...your words touched a chord with me, especially as it

>is my birthday today and I wish myself that on my 42nd birthday next year I

>will be a lot healthier than on my 41st, that my family will all be healthy,

>that everyone on the list will have better health and that we should have

>some peace in the world...

>Judy B.

[Guest guest]

,

thanks a lot for sharing, so we can learn from your touching story.

Hugs

Stania

-----Pùvodní zpráva-----

Od: D. Cumming <pcumming1@...>

Komu: egroups <egroups>

Datum: 13. èervence 2000 18:12

Pøedmìt: Re: Judy B. / Mort / perspective

>Judy / Mort,

>

>At 3:09 PM +0200 on 7/13/00 the esteemed judy wrote:

>Re: making your own lightbox:

>>Mort,

>>Ignorant couch potatoes! your post made me think as I have CFS for a year

>

>[snip]

>

>>Maybe, just maybe, there is a good side to CFS, not for the victim but for

>>the family?

>>Sorry to philosophize...your words touched a chord with me, especially as

it

>>is my birthday today and I wish myself that on my 42nd birthday next year

I

>>will be a lot healthier than on my 41st, that my family will all be

healthy,

>>that everyone on the list will have better health and that we should have

>>some peace in the world...

>

>Judy B.

>

>Your response to Mort was appropriate and you need not apologize for

>philosophizing. Although certainly no one wants to get any type of illness

>one thing that illness does is allows for an awareness of perspective and

>compassion.

>

>My main illness is Bipolar Disorder. I am fortunate that it is stabilized.

>I have no regrets, and I don't wish to be different. I have lost

marriages,

>businesses, money, property etc. etc. due to the illness. Oh well, what

really

>happened is that I lived a life. Fortunately I am still alive to keep

living.

>I am lucky, that is all.

>

>I was very fortunate to be with my late wife, , for seven years. She

had

>Budd-Chiari syndrome for seventeen years. She was never bitter, and always

>appreciative of any type of medical support she received.

>

>Even at the end when we figured out that she had been betrayed by the HMO

>capitation incentive system and her liver disease protocols had been

>denied her,

>she was not bitter, she simply wanted to see if we could get her what we

could

>to keep her alive. That I did, as aggressively as I could.

>knew she had a

>fatal illness, that every day being alive was a blessing, and that

>the battle to stay

>alive was just that.

>

>Her physical condition was so horrific and complicated that when people

would

>ask her to explain the illness they would disappear from our lives. It was

too

>intense. She looked pregnant. She had 48 endoscopies. She had 4

>major esophageal

>varices hemorrhages. She had intermittent bleeding from the portal

>hypertension

>caused by a 100 percent cirrhosed liver for the last five years of

>her life. She

>was, and I am not a score keeper, pretty much the sickest person in just

about

>any room she was in. But, she never talked about her illness unless

>asked. Then

>when asked, whoever asked would immediately become uncomfortable with

>the details.

>

> was also a brittle diabetic. This erratic form of diabetes was

>complicated by

>her liver intermittently releasing glucose. Even with her intensive

>studies in patient

>diabetic control and testing ten or more times a day with sometimes

>that many insulin

>injections her hypoglycemic reactions were brutal. She had the type

>of body where she

>could not recognize the symptoms. It was common for her to test in

>the 30's, a more

>than a couple times in the 20's, with the lowest a 24. I checked on

>her a minimum of

>every two hours wherever I was and whatever I was doing for seven years for

her

>to be in a possible diabetic reaction.

>

>She was a singer, piano player. She continued her career singing at

>the Catamaran

>Hotel in Pacific Beach part of San Diego up until five months before

>the doctors took

>her down. When she would be working people would be talking about

>their lives and

>their illnesses. She would listen and offer words of encouragement.

>She would never

>mention her own illness. She would never compare and be condescending,

>

>Mort,

>

>She was a blast to be around. I still can't believe she is gone. I

>can't believe

>it was that the doctors decided to save money for their bonus

>program on. She

>had a wonderful attitude. It did not matter, when it came to money,

>she was too expensive,

>she was out! It didn't matter that she faithfully paid her insurance

premiums.

>

>If it wasn't for Dr. Eugene Schiff in Miami I would never have gotten

>her transferred

>out of Sharp Hospital to UCSD for her liver transplant.

>

>The transplant was successful. She died when the transplanted liver

>did not activate.

>The autopsy did showed that it did not activate because at Sharp they

>let her bleed out

>11 pints of blood (while transfusing 11 in) instead of doing

>continuous emergent endoscopies

>(with either sclerotherapy or the balloon dilation) to stop the

>bleeding. The doctors at

>Sharp elected, over my vehement objections, to let her bleed while I

>watched her blood pressure stay bottomed out. That is how I called

>Dr. Schiff.

>

>When was in Sharp the final time and at UCSD she was in an

>encephalopic coma,

>by a miracle she woke up as they were wheeling her out for the

>transplant, to everyone's

>amazement! She was on life support with the breathing tubes. We

>explained she was off

>for the transplant. She smiled and gave a thumbs up. Still not

>complaining. Then she

>did an amazing thing, but it wasn't surprising to me. She made a

>motion of taking her

>liver out and made a sending motion like a football pass. I knew

>what she was doing,

>I said OK, , we will send your live to Dr. Schiff! That is the

>last thing she

>consciously requested, that her liver go to research.

>

>I think that is the way to be! That is what I try to emulate. I

>loved her style.

>That is why I enjoy helping others so much. I know of so many that

>have 's

>attitude. That is the way I am. I like this list so much because of

>the intensity

>of everyone's desire to get better. No one is condescending.

>

>Until,

>

> RE: making your own lightbox

>

>> Cheryl,

>

>[snip]

>

>> I ain't got no little Seasonal Affective Disorder (SAD), longing for

bright

>> summer days - and I bet most PWC's feel best in the winter, despite the

>> " research " stating we are sickest then - this is more " It's All In Your

>> Head " crap. Let the depressives have their low winters and happy

summers -

>> PWCs feel best when SADs are at their worst.. Any comment from anyone?

>

>[snip]

>

>> Mort Caldwell

>

>Mort,

>

>Your condescending remarks regarding SAD patients is an insult. I could

give

>you lots of facts and figures but I don't know who you are and if you read

>information like that or if you really care? Too make a non-compassionate

>statement about someone else who is sick while you have an illness,

>of any type,

>amazes me. It disappoints me. It the group was made up of members with

your

>attitude I would have been gone the first hour.

>

>Fortunately you appear to be an anomaly.

>

>

>San Diego

>

>

>

>

>

>

>At 3:09 PM +0200 on 7/13/00 the esteemed judy wrote:

>Re: making your own lightbox:

>>Mort,

>>Ignorant couch potatoes! your post made me think as I have CFS for a year

>

>[snip]

>

>>Maybe, just maybe, there is a good side to CFS, not for the victim but for

>>the family?

>>Sorry to philosophize...your words touched a chord with me, especially as

it

>>is my birthday today and I wish myself that on my 42nd birthday next year

I

>>will be a lot healthier than on my 41st, that my family will all be

healthy,

>>that everyone on the list will have better health and that we should have

>>some peace in the world...

>>Judy B.

>

>------------------------------------------------------------------------

>Get a NextCard Visa, in 30 seconds!

>1. Fill in the brief application

>2. Receive approval decision within 30 seconds

>3. Get rates as low as 2.9% Intro or 9.9% Fixed APR

>1/6628/5/_/531724/_/963504451/

>------------------------------------------------------------------------

>

>This list is intended for patients to share personal experiences with each

other, not to give medical advice. If you are interested in any treatment

discussed here, please consult your doctor.

>

[Guest guest]

Wow , I have no words when I hear what you and your wife went through.

Where does one get the strength to go on....

thanks you for sharing with us.

Judy B.

RE: making your own lightbox

>

> > Cheryl,

>

> [snip]

>

> > I ain't got no little Seasonal Affective Disorder (SAD), longing for

bright

> > summer days - and I bet most PWC's feel best in the winter, despite the

> > " research " stating we are sickest then - this is more " It's All In Your

> > Head " crap. Let the depressives have their low winters and happy

summers -

> > PWCs feel best when SADs are at their worst.. Any comment from anyone?

>

> [snip]

>

> > Mort Caldwell

>

> Mort,

>

> Your condescending remarks regarding SAD patients is an insult. I could

give

> you lots of facts and figures but I don't know who you are and if you read

> information like that or if you really care? Too make a non-compassionate

> statement about someone else who is sick while you have an illness,

> of any type,

> amazes me. It disappoints me. It the group was made up of members with

your

> attitude I would have been gone the first hour.

>

> Fortunately you appear to be an anomaly.

>

>

> San Diego

>

>

>

>

>

>

> At 3:09 PM +0200 on 7/13/00 the esteemed judy wrote:

> Re: making your own lightbox:

> >Mort,

> >Ignorant couch potatoes! your post made me think as I have CFS for a year

>

> [snip]

>

> >Maybe, just maybe, there is a good side to CFS, not for the victim but

for

> >the family?

> >Sorry to philosophize...your words touched a chord with me, especially as

it

> >is my birthday today and I wish myself that on my 42nd birthday next year

I

> >will be a lot healthier than on my 41st, that my family will all be

healthy,

> >that everyone on the list will have better health and that we should have

> >some peace in the world...

> >Judy B.

>

> ------------------------------------------------------------------------

> Get a NextCard Visa, in 30 seconds!

> 1. Fill in the brief application

> 2. Receive approval decision within 30 seconds

> 3. Get rates as low as 2.9% Intro or 9.9% Fixed APR

> 1/6628/5/_/531724/_/963504451/

> ------------------------------------------------------------------------

>

> This list is intended for patients to share personal experiences with each

other, not to give medical advice. If you are interested in any treatment

discussed here, please consult your doctor.

>

>

[Guest guest]

Judy,

Thank you, I wish it were not true ...

If ever died she wanted her body returned to science

to learn what they could from her. To make sure Dr. Schiff

dictated what to do with her body, how he wanted the autopsy

performed etc.

When I told the Chief of Staff (at UCSD where the heroic efforts

occurred) that, right after he told me that had died, and we

filled out the paperwork for the autopsy, I turned at looked at .

I paused.

Then I turned back to the Chief of Staff and said to him there

is more to 's wish that I just became aware of, that occurred

during the disaster at Sharp Memorial Hospital.

It is that medical advocates whether it be the patients themselves

or their families and friends need assistance to know the proper protocols.

So that they know that they are getting the appropriate medical care at all

times. That they won't be fooled by capitation incentives and leading

questions by doctors that can easily trick the unknowing patient.

He agreed. I told him I would work on it! He said if I could accomplish

what I am stating it would be an enormous task, but it would be a relief

to him all the other good medical professionals.

My quest has evolved, in a short time I will be introducing a web site,

initially for liver patients that will allow them to read this site and feel

as if they are going through their own illness the second time around, with

experience. Not the first time around, as we all do now, where we

can all get tricked by our inexperience.

PS - That is why lists like this are so imperative, that is why you will see

me occasionally posting a comment like " awesome list " !

At 9:42 PM +0200 on 7/13/00 the esteemed judy wrote:

Re: Judy B. / Mort / perspective:

>Wow , I have no words when I hear what you and your wife went through.

>Where does one get the strength to go on....

>thanks you for sharing with us.

>Judy B.

[Guest guest]

, that is an absolutely marvelous thing that you are doing, a legacy

from for people everywhere who are in trouble. I wish that someone

would have done it for CFS patients with a list of all the different

possibilities, what to do, where to buy things, pros and cons etc. Maybe if

I get better I will be able to do something similar, it's just the kind of

thing I think is important. I have been extremely grateful for all your

information and assistance until now and I agree, one needs not only a list

but also a website where you get it all in a glance.

Best wishes,

Judy

Re: Judy B. / Mort / perspective

> Judy,

>

> Thank you, I wish it were not true ...

>

> If ever died she wanted her body returned to science

> to learn what they could from her. To make sure Dr. Schiff

> dictated what to do with her body, how he wanted the autopsy

> performed etc.

>

> When I told the Chief of Staff (at UCSD where the heroic efforts

> occurred) that, right after he told me that had died, and we

> filled out the paperwork for the autopsy, I turned at looked at .

> I paused.

>

> Then I turned back to the Chief of Staff and said to him there

> is more to 's wish that I just became aware of, that occurred

> during the disaster at Sharp Memorial Hospital.

>

> It is that medical advocates whether it be the patients themselves

> or their families and friends need assistance to know the proper

protocols.

> So that they know that they are getting the appropriate medical care at

all

> times. That they won't be fooled by capitation incentives and leading

> questions by doctors that can easily trick the unknowing patient.

>

> He agreed. I told him I would work on it! He said if I could accomplish

> what I am stating it would be an enormous task, but it would be a relief

> to him all the other good medical professionals.

>

> My quest has evolved, in a short time I will be introducing a web site,

> initially for liver patients that will allow them to read this site and

feel

> as if they are going through their own illness the second time around,

with

> experience. Not the first time around, as we all do now, where we

> can all get tricked by our inexperience.

>

>

>

> PS - That is why lists like this are so imperative, that is why you will

see

> me occasionally posting a comment like " awesome list " !

>

>

> At 9:42 PM +0200 on 7/13/00 the esteemed judy wrote:

> Re: Judy B. / Mort / perspective:

> >Wow , I have no words when I hear what you and your wife went

through.

> >Where does one get the strength to go on....

> >thanks you for sharing with us.

> >Judy B.

>

> ------------------------------------------------------------------------

> Get a NextCard Visa, in 30 seconds!

> 1. Fill in the brief application

> 2. Receive approval decision within 30 seconds

> 3. Get rates as low as 2.9% Intro or 9.9% Fixed APR

> 1/6628/5/_/531724/_/963523125/

> ------------------------------------------------------------------------

>

> This list is intended for patients to share personal experiences with each

other, not to give medical advice. If you are interested in any treatment

discussed here, please consult your doctor.

>

>

[Guest guest]

Judy,

Thanks. Actually you got me as I was composing an off list note

to Mort apologizing for going off on him so badly this morning.

I just came back from the mountains where I put 's ashes and

we had her ceremony. I traumatized myself today ... so I went up

to our favorite hike to her favorite tree!

Sometimes I can write about it and it is ok, other times I go right back

into intensive care with ...

When I came back I finally got from Mort's post, then I went

back and read his other ones and realized how much I liked Mort!

What happened this morning is that I felt he was being condescending to

SAD patients and/or mental illness patient, and well, I don't like that.

When I got home a few minutes ago, with a little clearer head I reread

Mort's post and I think he was just venting. So, sorry Mort! I guess your

private email from me is now public

As for the website Judy, what it will do is to direct people to listserv's

such as this one, if appropriate, for instance if the website was

CFSFMS related.

As well as the buying, research, encyclopedic, protocols type info etc.

I hope once I put the formula up, that it can be duplicated for all illnesses.

BTW - initially I tried to work all these ideas through the American

Liver Foundation.

They were not interested. I offered to be on their board of

directors, they were not

interested. Then I started to monitor there activities more closely.

Wow, what a money driven organization that is. I can see why they

didn't want me.

I offered no grant money, no research money, no sponsorship money.

All I had was

experience and common sense ideas! I have the emails saved between

the ALF President

and I, what a waste of time.

I should have known better. This is the same organization that I

relied on for information that was so unclear that I got duped during

's course of treatment.

That is why I am going to do it through the web site. Thankfully the web is so

powerful that we can communicate just as effectively as these mega

social organizations.

Ooops, I am going off track, must be past my bedtime! Back to the

topic, so I can wrap

up this post ...

Especially what needs to be explained, on the web site(s) the how the

capitation

HMO systems work! As well as how the Social Security health care

system actually

works in this country.

The insurance companies have the US citizens duped that we can't even

mention socialized

medicine without being slammed. Meanwhile, if a fully insured anyone

gets a catastrophic

injury and becomes, say quadriplegic, what happens?

Their insurance cap is met, patient is kicked out! Social Security

comes to the rescue ...

What is that in reality? Socialized medicine! Provider of last

resort - US Government =

micro socialized medicine. What percentage of US health care is truly

delivered by the US government? 40%. That is a pretty big micro!

What percentage of health care profits are taken by insurance companies? 30%.

Hmmm, that is a big chunk of money that could be reinvested into

health care that

is being awarded to the deliverers of 60% of the health care. The

same folks that

are denying % of the health care. Essentially they are now being

rewarded by creating

barriers to health care.

That by the way is a number that I have not figured out yet. Does

anyone know that.

What percentage of potential health care does insurance companies deny?

The one driving motivator in making the website work for editing

purposes is that I

will keep reminding myself what and I went through and I will

be imagining as

the first time reader - the goal will be to have them not spin their

wheels, not once,

it is unnecessary. I mention the first time reader, but it will be

designed for anyone

to check back for information, but why not write it so clear that a newbie can

understand it?

Especially when the website will list related listserv's. My what

great resources

these types of forums are!

Some of the existing web sites related to CFSFMS might have all the components

to accomplish the " second time around " effect. A section perhaps just needs

to be broken out and a flow of information added that would walk the newbie

who is stressed out with the agony of the impact of the illness, the newness

of the terminology, then the reassurance needed about the mental block that

initially occurs when one encounters all this type of stuff and is turmoil.

Well, maybe it is not so easy But worth a try!

Ken and others, are your web site possible to convert into this format?

I will help! A lot!!!

I will certainly show you all what I come up with. or have come up with so far.

Thanks everyone, I will try not to let my situation get the best of me again,

PS - Thank you for all the public and private posts of kind words and

support today.

They were very, very kind and you all had no idea that I had done

myself in - emotionally.

So you all helped me out a lot, seriously - thank you!

[Guest guest]

Dear ,

Dont worry, we are all in somewhat of the same boat. Good days when we can

deal with people and things and our traumas, and I am sure that in one way

or another we all have them, and bad days when we can't and good hours and

bad hours, not even days. How wonderful that you have a place to go to with

your memories.I think that the idea of a CFS website is terrific, and it

should include all the things that Ken and everyone else has put together.

the problem? For the new patient it is really really scary to face so much

info at once. About four months ago my mother came back from a trip to the

USA and brought me a book called Chronic Fatigue and Fibronyalgia from the

alternative medicine guide, and I read it through in once sitting and it

scared the you know what out of me. I coulnd't digest it, I couldnt

understand the difference between the various things suggested there and all

I saw was the pros of everything and didnt know where to start...olive leaf

extract? blood coagulation, dental amalgams? Kineseology? Gut flora? Urine

analysis? Post polio syndrome? should I go on? It turns out that even here

in Israel lots of alternative stuff is going on, although we dont have

access to things like ampligen trials. and all the conventional doctors, or

at least almost all of them, knock down the ideas of alternative...only when

desperate, like my GP, do they say, " well, I have heard of

acupuncture...maybe try that... " but nothing more. Who do you go to? One of

the best doctors I found was the one who was the only one listed in Israel

on the co-cure good doctors list and I thank whoever it was who put her on

the list, she is marvelous, and it is worth the hour and a half trip to

Jerusalem to see her and be able to consult with her. Another excellent

doctor was referred to me by the representatives of an American medical

laboratory which opened up a branch in Israel, but again, we do have

socialized medicine here in Israel and it can be good and again it can be

terrible. We just ended a 120 day hospital strike here, with tens of

thousands of patients and thousands of operations being postponed and who

knows what the results will be...so there are other sides to socialized

medicine...whenever you need something important here, you pay privately and

heaven help you if you can't afford it. As of now everyone who can afford to

do so takes out private medical insurance to cover the extra consultations,

medications which your HMO won't pay for, etc. so we end up with the same

nonsense as in the USA...I hear the English system is good, but then again,

there are also difficulties there...

In any case, take care , and know that we are all here for you as you

are for us.

Best,

Judy

[Guest guest]

,

Your story about & you is so sweet. I'm crying. I hope she knows she

left a mark. I never met her, but she will now be a role-model for me.

Ellen

RE: making your own lightbox

>

> > Cheryl,

>

> [snip]

>

> > I ain't got no little Seasonal Affective Disorder (SAD), longing for

bright

> > summer days - and I bet most PWC's feel best in the winter, despite the

> > " research " stating we are sickest then - this is more " It's All In Your

> > Head " crap. Let the depressives have their low winters and happy

summers -

> > PWCs feel best when SADs are at their worst.. Any comment from anyone?

>

> [snip]

>

> > Mort Caldwell

>

> Mort,

>

> Your condescending remarks regarding SAD patients is an insult. I could

give

> you lots of facts and figures but I don't know who you are and if you read

> information like that or if you really care? Too make a non-compassionate

> statement about someone else who is sick while you have an illness,

> of any type,

> amazes me. It disappoints me. It the group was made up of members with

your

> attitude I would have been gone the first hour.

>

> Fortunately you appear to be an anomaly.

>

>

> San Diego

>

>

>

>

>

>

> At 3:09 PM +0200 on 7/13/00 the esteemed judy wrote:

> Re: making your own lightbox:

> >Mort,

> >Ignorant couch potatoes! your post made me think as I have CFS for a year

>

> [snip]

>

> >Maybe, just maybe, there is a good side to CFS, not for the victim but

for

> >the family?

> >Sorry to philosophize...your words touched a chord with me, especially as

it

> >is my birthday today and I wish myself that on my 42nd birthday next year

I

> >will be a lot healthier than on my 41st, that my family will all be

healthy,

> >that everyone on the list will have better health and that we should have

> >some peace in the world...

> >Judy B.

>

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>