Guest guest Posted January 15, 2000 Report Share Posted January 15, 2000 You can find some good information at: www.smart-drugs.com/GHB-South.htm I have been using it for about a month - mostly for severe depression. It really helps. I would like to hear from others about your specific cycling. I did a lot of research before I began dosing but there is very little written about this. I'm actually a little hesitant about stopping it even for a day. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks, Rene >From: bren@... >Reply-longevityegroups >longevityegroups >Subject: GHB >Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2000 19:41:35 -0500 > > >What is GHB? > > >------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 15, 2000 Report Share Posted January 15, 2000 Hi Rene, It will normalize your brain chemistry! Read this: Bimodal Psychotropic Response to GHB Ever since the discovery of significant physiologic effects of GHB by Dr. Henri Laborit over thirty years ago, researchers have been confounded by government regulators and seemingly anomalous results. Faced with these two problems many researchers have abandoned GHB in spite of its obvious promise. Centurion Aging Research Lab (CARL) has managed to solve the first problem, (temporarily at least), and now believe we have an explanation for the latter. After years of research on GHB, the Staff at CARL began to perceive that what at first was considered an anomaly is in fact, a significant indicator of the potent beneficial effects of Gamma- Hydroxy Butyrate. We first became interested in GHB as an adjunct to our personal life extension program due to its recognized ability to stimulate growth hormone production and initiate restorative stage 4 sleep. Our personal experience and a review of the literature led to the realization that GHB may be one of the most significant life extension agents known, and we determined to make its benefits available to the life extension community at large. (See our page www.ghbinfo.com/getit) It was the universal experience of all our associates that two to three grams of GHB was sufficient to induce a deep restorative sleep, and lesser amounts had a pleasant relaxing effect. Shortly after the introduction of our G-WiZzZzZ! kit for the safe, at home, production of GHB, we became alarmed when several of our customers complained that the kit products did not have the intended effects. Instead of aiding in sleep the product kept them up all night! While it did not seem possible, we had to assume that there was a problem with our quality control, however when samples of the product were returned for analysis they proved to be fine. The conundrum deepened when a repeat customer called after the purchase of his third kit to inquire what we had changed. He insisted that something had been changed because the product was no longer working. When we inquired further he replied that GHB was starting to put him to sleep and that it was beginning to interfere with his functioning during the day. When informed that this was the expected effect he responded that he had been taking as much as four grams three times a day and that it used to make him feel " energized and almost euphoric " , but now even small amounts were putting him to sleep! Clearly something very interesting was going on here. We were very much aware of the significant biochemical individuality of response to GHB, and of its steep dose/response curve. however we did not believe the phenomena we were observing could be accounted for in this way. When we went back to the literature we found that as many as 17% of the individuals in some controlled studies could not achieve sleep with GHB, but this was mentioned as an aside because the studies were investigating growth hormone production and not sleep. A break came when we received an inquiry from the Netherlands stating that a doctor had suggested using GHB as an " AD " . We had no idea what was meant by AD and were informed that it meant anti-depressant. Shortly there-after we received a copy of Dr. Rifat's report and " the light began to dawn " . Subsequent investigation revealed that every single case of GHB's failure to induce sleep that we could account for was associated with a person who had either been diagnosed as clinically depressed, or who had strong reason to think they might be! It is interesting to note that Dr. Rifat admits to his own condition as being clinically depressed. Dr. Rifat's report contained a number of references to negative side-effects of GHB and how to avoid them, which puzzled us. He seemed to consider the sleep inducing effects of GHB to be negative, while we considered them positive. He recommends cycling the use of GHB in order to avoid the induction of sleep. He was also very concerned about the possibility of GHB inducing epileptic type seizures, and recommended the prophylactic administration of benzodiazepenes to protect against them. This was not only unnecessary, it actually reduced the effectiveness of GHB therapy, by producing competition for binding sites. The fear of epileptic type seizures is based on animal studies and has since been shown to not apply to humans. It is now clear that there is a bimodal psychotropic response to GHB. Most people experience relaxation and deep sleep within 45 minutes in response to 3.5g or less of GHB, we refer to this as the Somnolent GHB Response (SGR). A smaller population composed of clinically depressed individuals experience euphoria and complete alleviation of depression at the same dose and in the same period of time. We call this the Euphoric GHB Response (EGR). This bimodal response to GHB means that for the first time there may be a definitive, objective test for clinical depression. Observations indicate that most depressed individuals undergo a change in their response to GHB that corresponds with a long-term and possibly permanent lifting of their depression. This shift in response usually occurs in 30 to 90 days with a few individuals reporting the change within a week and one who has still not experienced it after five months. There is some evidence that caffeine may slow or inhibit the transition. It is tempting to think of such long term change in terms of a " cure! " Unfortunately, Rifat and others have apparently misinterpreted the change in response to GHB in a negative light and have instituted protocols to prevent it from occurring, rather than encouraging it. For those health professionals who are working with GHB or would like to, we suggest the following protocol. If an individual is experiencing symptoms of depression administer two grams of GHB on an empty stomach. It is strongly advised that this be done at a time when either potential response (SGR or EGR) will not present a problem. If no subjective effects are experienced within an hour, administer another 1.5 grams. If the subject feels anything other than very tired or " drunk " they are not experiencing the expected Somnolent GHB Response (SGR), and have EGR, or are experiencing Transitional GHB Response (TGR). We suggest that individuals in EGR work with their health care professional to determine optimal dosing which will vary with the severity of the symptoms and which will decline over time. One psychiatrist reported doses as high as 12 grams a day being required to eliminate all undesirable symptoms, and that this dose declined to 6/g/day within two weeks. Once the transition from EGR to SGR begins to occur it is important individuals stop taking GHB at times when drowsiness or sleep are unwanted. A person experiencing EGR will exhibit heightened alertness and powers of concentration which are advantages in many situations, and it is not surprising that a person would view the loss of these effects as negative. It is important that they realize that increased or repeated dosing will not effect the return of such subjective effects and will in fact produce the opposite result. As the EGR declines individuals should decrease and eventually eliminate their daytime dosing and switch to a " maintenance regime " of two to three grams at bed time. These observations, interpretations, hypothesis, and recommendations are presented as a public service by Centurion Aging Research Laboratory, in the hope that they will spur further research, alleviate human suffering and enrich the experience of life. They are based on our personal experience and the experience of those who have been kind enough to report to us. This report should not be construed as containing medical advice and has most certainly NOT been approved by the FDA. We strongly discourage anyone from beginning ANY program of personal experimentation without the consent and advice of their health care professional. We would like to encourage anyone who has had positive or negative experiences with GHB to share them with us. reprint from: http://lab.eccentrica.org/ghb/bimodal.html Regards, Tom > Re: GHB > > You can find some good information at: > www.smart-drugs.com/GHB-South.htm > > I have been using it for about a month - mostly for severe depression. It > > really helps. > > I would like to hear from others about your specific cycling. I did a lot > > of research before I began dosing but there is very little written about > this. I'm actually a little hesitant about stopping it even for a day. > Any > help would be appreciated. > > Thanks, > Rene > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 15, 2000 Report Share Posted January 15, 2000 Try this . . http://www.pondman.nu/clpage.htm also http://lab.eccentrica.org/ghb/ I would recommend sticking with GHB there is still time to buy GBL and NaOH before HR 2130 goes into effect. Making GHB is easy I have all the info you need to make it on (her) website (http://lab.eccentrica.org/ghb/), as well as the links to suppliers. I recommend stocking up on GBL from AE Tech and NaOH from Vegan Soapworks, they have the purest most trustworthy stuff out there. Don't use 1,4 BDO or take GBL straight. The release of hGH, with is not as strong with GBL or 1,4 BDO as with GHB. I still consider GHB the safest from a medical standpoint. GBL and 1,4 BD are safer from the legal standpoint (thanks to our idiot lawmakers). As long as you give your body 2-3 days off weekly, drink adequate water, don't mix them (GHB, GBL, or 1,4 BD) with alcohol or sedatives, and be careful of the dose, there is little chance of long-term damage. Sleep is one of natures best medicines. By improving sleep alone, you are enhancing your longevity. GBL needs to be converted to GHB by your liver enzymes. The effects of exposure to free GBL in the blood are not fully explored. Extensive research has been done on GHB however. My fear is that it could stress the liver some as its ability to raise IGF-1 levels is less pronounced than with GHB. regards, Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 15, 2000 Report Share Posted January 15, 2000 I found the link page on pond-... but couldnt find the other on how to make the ghb for research purposes of course.I would really appreciatte some feedback on this.Thanks in advance to any and all respondents. Re: GHB Try this . . http://www.pondman.nu/clpage.htm alsohttp://lab.eccentrica.org/ghb/I would recommend sticking with GHB there is still time to buy GBL and NaOHbefore HR 2130 goes into effect. Making GHB is easy I have all the info youneed to make it on (her) website (http://lab.eccentrica.org/ghb/), as wellasthe links to suppliers.I recommend stocking up on GBL from AE Tech and NaOH from Vegan Soapworks,they have the purest most trustworthy stuff out there.Don't use 1,4 BDO or take GBL straight. The release of hGH,with is not as strong with GBL or 1,4 BDO as with GHB.I still consider GHB the safest from a medical standpoint. GBL and 1,4 BD are safer from the legal standpoint (thanks to our idiot lawmakers). Aslong as you give your body 2-3 days off weekly, drink adequate water, don't mix them (GHB, GBL, or 1,4 BD) with alcohol or sedatives, and be careful of the dose, there is little chance of long-term damage. Sleep is one of natures best medicines. By improving sleep alone, you are enhancing your longevity.GBL needs to be converted to GHB by your liver enzymes. The effects of exposure to free GBL in the blood are not fully explored. Extensiveresearch has been done on GHB however. My fear is that it could stress the liversome as its ability to raise IGF-1 levels is less pronounced than with GHB.regards,Tom------------------------------------------------------------------------ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 3, 2000 Report Share Posted February 3, 2000 Dale, > In your professional opinion would products using furanone (renewtrient) > have the same effects and work through the same mechanism as GHB. It's not a professional opinion but from what I hear the furanone stuff is potentially bad for the kidneys or liver. -gts Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 3, 2000 Report Share Posted February 3, 2000 I have used both ghb and furanol,specificly rest-eze and in my non professional opinion,since I'm not a doctor,but more importantly in several ways a user of both,there is no comparision,I have yet to find anything that came close to the effects of ghb.Ghb is by far superior to any of the newer products out now claiming to give the same results.I have now decided to stop wasting money and stick only to what I know works. Rick- Re: GHB Dale,> In your professional opinion would products using furanone (renewtrient)> have the same effects and work through the same mechanism as GHB.It's not a professional opinion but from what I hear the furanone stuff ispotentially bad for the kidneys or liver.-gts------------------------------------------------------------------------ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 4, 2000 Report Share Posted February 4, 2000 Dale I just noticed that you asked me a question below but my answer was not really an answer to your question. As far as I know, only GHB works through the same mechanism as GHB. The precursors like Renewtrient work only because they get converted to GHB in the body or brain. From what I understand there may be some problems with toxicity associated with that conversion process, so GHB is probably safer than its precursors. But that really wasn't your question. -gta Re: GHB > Dale, > > > In your professional opinion would products using furanone (renewtrient) > > have the same effects and work through the same mechanism as GHB. > > It's not a professional opinion but from what I hear the furanone stuff is > potentially bad for the kidneys or liver. > > -gts > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 4, 2000 Report Share Posted February 4, 2000 Gordo, Thanks, I think remeber on of the docs favoring furanone over tetramethlyene glycol. Dale gts wrote: Dale I just noticed that you asked me a question below but my answer was not really an answer to your question. As far as I know, only GHB works through the same mechanism as GHB. The precursors like Renewtrient work only because they get converted to GHB in the body or brain. >From what I understand there may be some problems with toxicity associated with that conversion process, so GHB is probably safer than its precursors. But that really wasn't your question. -gta Re: GHB > Dale, > > > In your professional opinion would products using furanone (renewtrient) > > have the same effects and work through the same mechanism as GHB. > > It's not a professional opinion but from what I hear the furanone stuff is > potentially bad for the kidneys or liver. > > -gts > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 4, 2000 Report Share Posted February 4, 2000 Stealth, When you say grams, what form are you taking it in, i.e. liquid or capsules. stealth@... wrote: Rick...or anyone else for that mater, Has anyone noticed a tolerance build to GHB? I have noticed it it take 4.5 grams to feel any effects when 3.0 grams used to be sufficient. I usually take a dose just to the limit of fellling a bit "woozy" ; even though I feel this way, I notice an increase iin my increase compassion to work out ..better endurance....quicker recovery between sets,,,..well just about anything physical or cognitive. I cycle the use of GHB every other day and then 1 week off at the end of the month. Highlander wrote: I have used both ghb and furanol,specificly rest-eze and in my non professional opinion,since I'm not a doctor,but more importantly in several ways a user of both,there is no comparision,I have yet to find anything that came close to the effects of ghb.Ghb is by far superior to any of the newer products out now claiming to give the same results.I have now decided to stop wasting money and stick only to what I know works. Rick- Re: GHB Dale, > In your professional opinion would products using furanone (renewtrient) > have the same effects and work through the same mechanism as GHB. It's not a professional opinion but from what I hear the furanone stuff is potentially bad for the kidneys or liver. -gts ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 4, 2000 Report Share Posted February 4, 2000 Hi , No drop off for me; whenever I do notice a tolerance buildup I cut back until I get the original effect. Have you seen this article: Bimodal Psychotropic Response to GHB Ever since the discovery of significant physiologic effects of GHB by Dr. Henri Laborit over thirty years ago, researchers have been confounded by government regulators and seemingly anomalous results. Faced with these two problems many researchers have abandoned GHB in spite of its obvious promise. Centurion Aging Research Lab (CARL) has managed to solve the first problem, (temporarily at least), and now believe we have an explanation for the latter. After years of research on GHB, the Staff at CARL began to perceive that what at first was considered an anomaly is in fact, a significant indicator of the potent beneficial effects of Gamma- Hydroxy Butyrate. We first became interested in GHB as an adjunct to our personal life extension program due to its recognized ability to stimulate growth hormone production and initiate restorative stage 4 sleep. Our personal experience and a review of the literature led to the realization that GHB may be one of the most significant life extension agents known, and we determined to make its benefits available to the life extension community at large. (See our page www.ghbinfo.com/getit) It was the universal experience of all our associates that two to three grams of GHB was sufficient to induce a deep restorative sleep, and lesser amounts had a pleasant relaxing effect. Shortly after the introduction of our G-WiZzZzZ! kit for the safe, at home, production of GHB, we became alarmed when several of our customers complained that the kit products did not have the intended effects. Instead of aiding in sleep the product kept them up all night! While it did not seem possible, we had to assume that there was a problem with our quality control, however when samples of the product were returned for analysis they proved to be fine. The conundrum deepened when a repeat customer called after the purchase of his third kit to inquire what we had changed. He insisted that something had been changed because the product was no longer working. When we inquired further he replied that GHB was starting to put him to sleep and that it was beginning to interfere with his functioning during the day. When informed that this was the expected effect he responded that he had been taking as much as four grams three times a day and that it used to make him feel " energized and almost euphoric " , but now even small amounts were putting him to sleep! Clearly something very interesting was going on here. We were very much aware of the significant biochemical individuality of response to GHB, and of its steep dose/response curve. however we did not believe the phenomena we were observing could be accounted for in this way. When we went back to the literature we found that as many as 17% of the individuals in some controlled studies could not achieve sleep with GHB, but this was mentioned as an aside because the studies were investigating growth hormone production and not sleep. A break came when we received an inquiry from the Netherlands stating that a doctor had suggested using GHB as an " AD " . We had no idea what was meant by AD and were informed that it meant anti-depressant. Shortly there-after we received a copy of Dr. Rifat's report and " the light began to dawn " . Subsequent investigation revealed that every single case of GHB's failure to induce sleep that we could account for was associated with a person who had either been diagnosed as clinically depressed, or who had strong reason to think they might be! It is interesting to note that Dr. Rifat admits to his own condition as being clinically depressed. Dr. Rifat's report contained a number of references to negative side-effects of GHB and how to avoid them, which puzzled us. He seemed to consider the sleep inducing effects of GHB to be negative, while we considered them positive. He recommends cycling the use of GHB in order to avoid the induction of sleep. He was also very concerned about the possibility of GHB inducing epileptic type seizures, and recommended the prophylactic administration of benzodiazepenes to protect against them. This was not only unnecessary, it actually reduced the effectiveness of GHB therapy, by producing competition for binding sites. The fear of epileptic type seizures is based on animal studies and has since been shown to not apply to humans. It is now clear that there is a bimodal psychotropic response to GHB. Most people experience relaxation and deep sleep within 45 minutes in response to 3.5g or less of GHB, we refer to this as the Somnolent GHB Response (SGR). A smaller population composed of clinically depressed individuals experience euphoria and complete alleviation of depression at the same dose and in the same period of time. We call this the Euphoric GHB Response (EGR). This bimodal response to GHB means that for the first time there may be a definitive, objective test for clinical depression. Observations indicate that most depressed individuals undergo a change in their response to GHB that corresponds with a long-term and possibly permanent lifting of their depression. This shift in response usually occurs in 30 to 90 days with a few individuals reporting the change within a week and one who has still not experienced it after five months. There is some evidence that caffeine may slow or inhibit the transition. It is tempting to think of such long term change in terms of a " cure! " Unfortunately, Rifat and others have apparently misinterpreted the change in response to GHB in a negative light and have instituted protocols to prevent it from occurring, rather than encouraging it. For those health professionals who are working with GHB or would like to, we suggest the following protocol. If an individual is experiencing symptoms of depression administer two grams of GHB on an empty stomach. It is strongly advised that this be done at a time when either potential response (SGR or EGR) will not present a problem. If no subjective effects are experienced within an hour, administer another 1.5 grams. If the subject feels anything other than very tired or " drunk " they are not experiencing the expected Somnolent GHB Response (SGR), and have EGR, or are experiencing Transitional GHB Response (TGR). We suggest that individuals in EGR work with their health care professional to determine optimal dosing which will vary with the severity of the symptoms and which will decline over time. One psychiatrist reported doses as high as 12 grams a day being required to eliminate all undesirable symptoms, and that this dose declined to 6/g/day within two weeks. Once the transition from EGR to SGR begins to occur it is important individuals stop taking GHB at times when drowsiness or sleep are unwanted. A person experiencing EGR will exhibit heightened alertness and powers of concentration which are advantages in many situations, and it is not surprising that a person would view the loss of these effects as negative. It is important that they realize that increased or repeated dosing will not effect the return of such subjective effects and will in fact produce the opposite result. As the EGR declines individuals should decrease and eventually eliminate their daytime dosing and switch to a " maintenance regime " of two to three grams at bed time. These observations, interpretations, hypothesis, and recommendations are presented as a public service by Centurion Aging Research Laboratory, in the hope that they will spur further research, alleviate human suffering and enrich the experience of life. They are based on our personal experience and the experience of those who have been kind enough to report to us. This report should not be construed as containing medical advice and has most certainly NOT been approved by the FDA. We strongly discourage anyone from beginning ANY program of personal experimentation without the consent and advice of their health care professional. We would like to encourage anyone who has had positive or negative experiences with GHB to share them with us. reprint from: http://lab.eccentrica.org/ghb/bimodal.html > Re: GHB > > Rick...or anyone else for that mater, > Has anyone noticed a tolerance build to GHB? I have noticed it it take > 4.5 grams to feel any effects when 3.0 grams used to be sufficient. I > usually take a dose just to the limit of fellling a bit " woozy " ; even > though I feel this way, I notice an increase iin my increase compassion > to work out ..better endurance....quicker recovery between sets,,,..well > just about anything physical or cognitive. I cycle the use of GHB every > other day and then 1 week off at the end of the month. > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 4, 2000 Report Share Posted February 4, 2000 Red Devil Lye is meant for cleaning drains so I don't know if you can depend on its purity. It might contain lead or other impurities. Sodium Hydroxide (NaOH) is not a controlled substance, so it might be worth the trouble to open up the yellow pages and find a chemical supply company that sells it. I've heard that stores that sell wine and beer making equipment for home brewers also carry pure NaOH for use in brewing. It's also available on the net. I know there is a soap company that sells soap making supplies including pure NaOH on the net at a good price... but I don't remember the URL. -gts GHB > For those looking for sodium hydroxide, it has just come to my attention > that since it is really lye, Red Devil lye is the exact same thing. > There are two types, but get the one that is 100% sodium hydroxide. > > Dale > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 4, 2000 Report Share Posted February 4, 2000 I can't give yo a good answer because when I took it was years ago,and at that time I didn't cycle it,I took it every day for several months,and it's affects increased after about a month or so which I am sure had to do with a build up of it in my system,since I didn't increase the dosage to any noticable degree.I guess that does answer your question after all.but the problem is that I took it more or less as needed,if I felt on a particular day that I wasn't feeling the way I wanted I would take a little more,and visa versa. Re: GHB Dale, > In your professional opinion would products using furanone (renewtrient) > have the same effects and work through the same mechanism as GHB. It's not a professional opinion but from what I hear the furanone stuff is potentially bad for the kidneys or liver. -gts ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 5, 2000 Report Share Posted February 5, 2000 Rick...or anyone else for that mater, Has anyone noticed a tolerance build to GHB? I have noticed it it take 4.5 grams to feel any effects when 3.0 grams used to be sufficient. I usually take a dose just to the limit of fellling a bit "woozy" ; even though I feel this way, I notice an increase iin my increase compassion to work out ..better endurance....quicker recovery between sets,,,..well just about anything physical or cognitive. I cycle the use of GHB every other day and then 1 week off at the end of the month. Highlander wrote: I have used both ghb and furanol,specificly rest-eze and in my non professional opinion,since I'm not a doctor,but more importantly in several ways a user of both,there is no comparision,I have yet to find anything that came close to the effects of ghb.Ghb is by far superior to any of the newer products out now claiming to give the same results.I have now decided to stop wasting money and stick only to what I know works. Rick- Re: GHB Dale, > In your professional opinion would products using furanone (renewtrient) > have the same effects and work through the same mechanism as GHB. It's not a professional opinion but from what I hear the furanone stuff is potentially bad for the kidneys or liver. -gts ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 5, 2000 Report Share Posted February 5, 2000 About my reply to GHB.....I wrote " I notice an increase iin my increase compassion " .....I have just awakened....no, I'm not high on GHB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 5, 2000 Report Share Posted February 5, 2000 Hi Jodi. I think this is the best place to start learning about Gamma-Hydroxybutyrate (GBH): http://www.ceri.com/ghbpage.shtml It's a very controversial substance. -gts GHB I am new to your discussion group. What does GHB stand for. Does this group have an active Chat room or just e-mail correspndence? Thank you , Jodi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 5, 2000 Report Share Posted February 5, 2000 Hi, Grams as in a liquid GHB / Distilled water base - when you mix a 190gram kit --> gbl / NaOH and with distilled H2O into a 32 oz bottle, it yields approximately 1 gram per teaspoonfull of GHB. (0.98 grams per teaspoon actually). "Dale R. Hersh" wrote: Stealth, When you say grams, what form are you taking it in, i.e. liquid or capsules. stealth@... wrote: Rick...or anyone else for that mater, Has anyone noticed a tolerance build to GHB? I have noticed it it take 4.5 grams to feel any effects when 3.0 grams used to be sufficient. I usually take a dose just to the limit of fellling a bit "woozy" ; even though I feel this way, I notice an increase iin my increase compassion to work out ..better endurance....quicker recovery between sets,,,..well just about anything physical or cognitive. I cycle the use of GHB every other day and then 1 week off at the end of the month. Highlander wrote: I have used both ghb and furanol,specificly rest-eze and in my non professional opinion,since I'm not a doctor,but more importantly in several ways a user of both,there is no comparision,I have yet to find anything that came close to the effects of ghb.Ghb is by far superior to any of the newer products out now claiming to give the same results.I have now decided to stop wasting money and stick only to what I know works. Rick- Re: GHB Dale, > In your professional opinion would products using furanone (renewtrient) > have the same effects and work through the same mechanism as GHB. It's not a professional opinion but from what I hear the furanone stuff is potentially bad for the kidneys or liver. -gts ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 5, 2000 Report Share Posted February 5, 2000 Sorry, someone asked me about the process & how I came up with the 1G/teaspoon concentration...deleted your e-mail message - so here it is... You take 135grams GBL and 60 grams Sodium Hydroxide (NaOH) and combine (this is actually 195grams). You use about 135 grams (4.8ounces) distilled water to produce the exothermic/solvent action by pouring this into the 195gram GBL/NaOH solution- then wait until it cools - poor this contents into the quart bottle then top the bottle off with distilled water - it yields approximately a 1 gram concentration of GHB per teaspoonfull. (approximately 28g = 1ounce). stealth@... wrote: > Hi, > Grams as in a liquid GHB / Distilled water base - when you mix a > 190gram kit --> gbl / NaOH and with distilled H2O into a 32 oz > bottle, it yields approximately 1 gram per teaspoonfull of GHB. (0.98 > grams per teaspoon actually). > > > " Dale R. Hersh " wrote: > >> Stealth, >> >> When you say grams, what form are you taking it in, i.e. liquid or >> capsules. >> >> stealth@... wrote: >> >> > Rick...or anyone else for that mater, >> > Has anyone noticed a tolerance build to GHB? I have noticed it it >> > take 4.5 grams to feel any effects when 3.0 grams used to be >> > sufficient. I usually take a dose just to the limit of fellling a >> > bit " woozy " ; even though I feel this way, I notice an increase iin >> > my increase compassion to work out ..better endurance....quicker >> > recovery between sets,,,..well just about anything physical or >> > cognitive. I cycle the use of GHB every other day and then 1 week >> > off at the end of the month. >> > >> > >> > >> > Highlander wrote: >> > >> >> I have used both ghb and furanol,specificly rest-eze and in my >> >> non professional opinion,since I'm not a doctor,but more >> >> importantly in several ways a user of both,there is no >> >> comparision,I have yet to find anything that came close to the >> >> effects of ghb.Ghb is by far superior to any of the newer >> >> products out now claiming to give the same results.I have now >> >> decided to stop wasting money and stick only to what I know >> >> works. >> >> Rick- >> >> >> >> Re: GHB >> >> Dale, >> >> >> >> > In your professional opinion would products using >> >> furanone (renewtrient) >> >> > have the same effects and work through the same >> >> mechanism as GHB. >> >> >> >> It's not a professional opinion but from what I hear >> >> the furanone stuff is >> >> potentially bad for the kidneys or liver. >> >> >> >> -gts >> >> >> >> >> >> - >> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> >> >> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 21, 2000 Report Share Posted April 21, 2000 Hi, >Thought it was a no no to use in most states now >HGH Drs liked it, patients were able to feel restorative sleep from it >GBH produces it? or enchanes its mechanism ? I think you are thinking of GHB = gamma-hydroxy-butyrate. That is the illegal knock-out drug. It is chemically closely related to butyrate, but not converted that way in the body. I don't know what effects GHB would have on sleep quality. Butyrate is used by the body as a signalling mechanism. I was in a lab that was working on its mechanism - (rather non-specific activator of many genes, acting directly in the nucleus). It takes pretty high levels to get these effects unless the generation is targetted, rather like a neurotransmitter. I suspect that blood butyrate levels are actually reading what has 'leaked' into the blood rather than what is being actively used - but those would be correlated, at least in a healthy person. Jerry ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 30, 2000 Report Share Posted June 30, 2000 In a message dated 06.29.2000 09:31:00 W. Europe Daylight Time, longevityegroups writes: << Unfortunately, GHB is illegal in the US even though there are much more dangerous drugs (which GHB is not) in public distribution. It is used extensively in Europe. >> Greetings from Paris - I live in Europe, do you by chance happen to know a source for GHB in Europe? Is it available only through prescriptions? Thank you! MJ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 20, 2002 Report Share Posted June 20, 2002 As with all other deaths associated with performance enhancers or supplements I am not interested so much in information that they found " x drug " in the system of the deceased but was " x drug " the cause of the death? What other drugs were present? Was there a pre-existing condition? Deaths with " x drug " in the system, especially only 68 of them are VERY suspicious to me. There are so many other factors. These deaths are not catagorized for example. Maybe some of them were caused by being hit by a bus etc. Until a comprehensive stusy is done on " drugs " such as GHB and Ephedra it is basically anecdotal evidence at best. Liedel Ann Arbor, MI Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 21, 2002 Report Share Posted June 21, 2002 bigbud3@... wrote: << ** From a VERY comprehensive review: " Fatalities have been associated with GHB use. [157, 222, 245-247] The DEA has collected inves-tigative, toxicology, and autopsy reports from cases in which GHB was found in biological samples of the deceased. Since 1990, the DEA reports that they are aware of 68 deaths associated with the use of GHB, most of which have occurred in the last 4 years " >> Seeing as GHB is a naturally occuring substance (within all living things), it's like saying " blood was found in biological samples of the deceased " . You could change blood for " water " , " bone " , " liver " , " kidney " etc, etc. Now i'm no doctor, but I'd have thought anyone would have seen the flaws in that study!!! Simon Pitt B'Ham England Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 21, 2002 Report Share Posted June 21, 2002 bigbud3@... wrote: << ** From a VERY comprehensive review: " Fatalities have been associated with GHB use. [157, 222, 245-247] The DEA has collected inves-tigative, toxicology, and autopsy reports from cases in which GHB was found in biological samples of the deceased. Since 1990, the DEA reports that they are aware of 68 deaths associated with the use of GHB, most of which have occurred in the last 4 years " >> Seeing as GHB is a naturally occuring substance (within all living things), it's like saying " blood was found in biological samples of the deceased " . You could change blood for " water " , " bone " , " liver " , " kidney " etc, etc. Now i'm no doctor, but I'd have thought anyone would have seen the flaws in that study!!! Simon Pitt B'Ham England Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 21, 2002 Report Share Posted June 21, 2002 > > Seeing as GHB is a naturally occuring substance (within all living things), > it's like saying " blood was found in biological samples of the deceased " . > You could change blood for " water " , " bone " , " liver " , " kidney " etc, etc. Now > i'm no doctor, but I'd have thought anyone would have seen the flaws in that > study!!! If you would have followed the link that was provided and read the entire study you would have seen that this was discussed in great detail. Unfortunately many people find it easier to remain uneducated. Partial information is very often misleading. That is why it is worth the effort to read a complete study not just a synopsis. Harvey Maron, M.D. Steamboat Springs, CO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 21, 2002 Report Share Posted June 21, 2002 > > Seeing as GHB is a naturally occuring substance (within all living things), > it's like saying " blood was found in biological samples of the deceased " . > You could change blood for " water " , " bone " , " liver " , " kidney " etc, etc. Now > i'm no doctor, but I'd have thought anyone would have seen the flaws in that > study!!! If you would have followed the link that was provided and read the entire study you would have seen that this was discussed in great detail. Unfortunately many people find it easier to remain uneducated. Partial information is very often misleading. That is why it is worth the effort to read a complete study not just a synopsis. Harvey Maron, M.D. Steamboat Springs, CO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 21, 2002 Report Share Posted June 21, 2002 > > Seeing as GHB is a naturally occuring substance (within all living things), > it's like saying " blood was found in biological samples of the deceased " . > You could change blood for " water " , " bone " , " liver " , " kidney " etc, etc. Now > i'm no doctor, but I'd have thought anyone would have seen the flaws in that > study!!! If you would have followed the link that was provided and read the entire study you would have seen that this was discussed in great detail. Unfortunately many people find it easier to remain uneducated. Partial information is very often misleading. That is why it is worth the effort to read a complete study not just a synopsis. Harvey Maron, M.D. Steamboat Springs, CO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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