Re: Long-term study on myotomies in China

[Guest guest]

Hi, ,

actually there are a lot of studies indicating Achalasia patients

restoring their motility by herbel treatment and acupuncture.

however, they have to treat it at a early stage. otherwise, wait

until the E is stretched, none of the treatments will be affected,

not event myotomy. That is what said " permanent " .

Thank you very much for your info. I am really appreciated.

Quincia

>

> Ni hao Quincia,

>

> I was just reading a long-term study on myotomy for achalasia

> that was done by a dozen doctors at Hebei Medical University in

> Shijiazhuang. (I'm sure there are also surgeons who do this

> operation in Shanghai, where you are.) They followed up with 176

> patients for an average of 14 years and had quite good results.

> The most interesting thing in this article is that when they did

> manometries several years later, four of their patients had

> recovered some motility. In other words, the muscles of the

> esophagus started functioning more normally after surgery in 2%

> of their patients. These patients had surgery an average of just

> one year after they first noticed problems with swallowing, and

> they only had mild to moderate dilation of the esophagus.

> Because of this, the authors say that " myotomy should be

> performed as early as possible once achalasia is diagnosed. "

>

> The contact person is Dr. Jun-Feng Liu, Tel. 86-311-6033941,

> email liujf@... I'm sure he could give you names of

> doctors to contact in Shanghai also, in case you want to talk to

> them while you pursue alternative treatment. I'm glad to hear

> that you're having good results with acupuncture and herbal

> remedies.

>

> The article is here (in English):

> http://www.wjgnet.com/1007-9327/10/287.pdf

>

> in Lancaster, PA

>

[Guest guest]

hi, sorry for the typoes.

affected => effective.

event => even

> >

> > Ni hao Quincia,

> >

> > I was just reading a long-term study on myotomy for achalasia

> > that was done by a dozen doctors at Hebei Medical University in

> > Shijiazhuang. (I'm sure there are also surgeons who do this

> > operation in Shanghai, where you are.) They followed up with 176

> > patients for an average of 14 years and had quite good results.

> > The most interesting thing in this article is that when they did

> > manometries several years later, four of their patients had

> > recovered some motility. In other words, the muscles of the

> > esophagus started functioning more normally after surgery in 2%

> > of their patients. These patients had surgery an average of just

> > one year after they first noticed problems with swallowing, and

> > they only had mild to moderate dilation of the esophagus.

> > Because of this, the authors say that " myotomy should be

> > performed as early as possible once achalasia is diagnosed. "

> >

> > The contact person is Dr. Jun-Feng Liu, Tel. 86-311-6033941,

> > email liujf@ I'm sure he could give you names of

> > doctors to contact in Shanghai also, in case you want to talk to

> > them while you pursue alternative treatment. I'm glad to hear

> > that you're having good results with acupuncture and herbal

> > remedies.

> >

> > The article is here (in English):

> > http://www.wjgnet.com/1007-9327/10/287.pdf

> >

> > in Lancaster, PA

> >

>

[Guest guest]

hi, quoted from the report:

" Four patients were found to have varying extents of

resumption of esophageal peristalsis by esophageal manometry

at 20 months, 7, 15 and 20 years after esophageal myotomy,

respectively (Figure 3). "

Question: why was the esophageal peristalsis resumed or retored for

those patients? it seems a little bit contradictory to what we

believe that peristalsis will be lost for ever since Achalasia is not

revertable.

" Aperistaltic esophagus could not become peristaltic after Heller's

myotomy. However, we found that aperistaltic esophagus

resumed peristalsis in 4 patients at 20 months, 7, 15 and 20

years after surgery, respectively. In these patients, the mean time

of dysphagia was 1.1 years (range 2 months to 8 years) before

surgery, which was shorter than that in the entire group (4.8

years), and there were 2 patients with moderate dilation of the

esophagus and 2 with mild dilation. Although the reason is

unknown, this finding indicates that it is potential for a few

achalasia patients to resume their esophageal peristalsis after

Heller's myotomy. "

Question: could that be anything else trigger the resumption of the

peristalsis rather than myotomy?

Thank so much for for providing us this study paper.

Quincia

>

> Ni hao Quincia,

>

> I was just reading a long-term study on myotomy for achalasia

> that was done by a dozen doctors at Hebei Medical University in

> Shijiazhuang. (I'm sure there are also surgeons who do this

> operation in Shanghai, where you are.) They followed up with 176

> patients for an average of 14 years and had quite good results.

> The most interesting thing in this article is that when they did

> manometries several years later, four of their patients had

> recovered some motility. In other words, the muscles of the

> esophagus started functioning more normally after surgery in 2%

> of their patients. These patients had surgery an average of just

> one year after they first noticed problems with swallowing, and

> they only had mild to moderate dilation of the esophagus.

> Because of this, the authors say that " myotomy should be

> performed as early as possible once achalasia is diagnosed. "

>

> The contact person is Dr. Jun-Feng Liu, Tel. 86-311-6033941,

> email liujf@... I'm sure he could give you names of

> doctors to contact in Shanghai also, in case you want to talk to

> them while you pursue alternative treatment. I'm glad to hear

> that you're having good results with acupuncture and herbal

> remedies.

>

> The article is here (in English):

> http://www.wjgnet.com/1007-9327/10/287.pdf

>

> in Lancaster, PA

>

[Guest guest]

They must not have had real achalasia if peristalsis resumed. the

key characteristics of achalasia are non-relaxation of the LES and

lack of peristalsis.

> >

> > Ni hao Quincia,

> >

> > I was just reading a long-term study on myotomy for achalasia

> > that was done by a dozen doctors at Hebei Medical University in

> > Shijiazhuang. (I'm sure there are also surgeons who do this

> > operation in Shanghai, where you are.) They followed up with

176

> > patients for an average of 14 years and had quite good results.

> > The most interesting thing in this article is that when they did

> > manometries several years later, four of their patients had

> > recovered some motility. In other words, the muscles of the

> > esophagus started functioning more normally after surgery in 2%

> > of their patients. These patients had surgery an average of

just

> > one year after they first noticed problems with swallowing, and

> > they only had mild to moderate dilation of the esophagus.

> > Because of this, the authors say that " myotomy should be

> > performed as early as possible once achalasia is diagnosed. "

> >

> > The contact person is Dr. Jun-Feng Liu, Tel. 86-311-6033941,

> > email liujf@ I'm sure he could give you names of

> > doctors to contact in Shanghai also, in case you want to talk to

> > them while you pursue alternative treatment. I'm glad to hear

> > that you're having good results with acupuncture and herbal

> > remedies.

> >

> > The article is here (in English):

> > http://www.wjgnet.com/1007-9327/10/287.pdf

> >

> > in Lancaster, PA

> >

>

[Guest guest]

hi, ,

I felt the herbel tea stuck in my E when I drunk the tea at the

very beginning of the treatment , however, I also felt the discomfort

feeling of water and food being stuck in my E gradually disappeared

and the tea could go down without any difficulty as well as meal.

Maybe the herbel tea help relaxing my muscle. and the time of the

discomfortable feeling become shorter and less frequent. however,

when I am emotional or nervous (my father want me to get around the

Shanghai city by myself.), my swallowing problem comes back. it will

disappear after I was relaxed. I rarely have spasm; if I do, it is

minor and it will go away by a cup of warm water. not like before, 4

to 5 hours non-stop, made me want to cry. I will be back 5/1. anyway,

I will bring back the prescription and continue using herbel tea

treatment combined with acupuncuture.

those four patients might not have acupuncture; however, something

must happen. Their health condition become better and they might

probably proactively monitor their health and alter their life style.

A lot of things could happen. I have read some articles in Chinese

though about a lady who refused to have myotomy seek herbel

treatment. Her condition kept getting improved. Surprisingly, she got

her peristaltic back after two months treatment. One lady who had

myotomy however symptoms come back and she also seek herbel

treatment. 10 weeks later, symptoms started improving and 2 monthes

later, all symptoms were gone. the TCM kept monitoring her and use

different herbel prescription.

Another article is about 32 patients, different age, gender,

occupation and history they were all achalasia patients. They were

treated by acupuncture only. and effective rate is 90% after 6

treatments. 70% symptoms are totally gone. 15% symptoms come back

when emotional. 5% improved. 10% less improvement.

anyway, just my feeling and finding. keep you updated. Thank you

for discussing with me.

Quincia

>

> > They must not have had real achalasia if peristalsis resumed.

>

> The paper includes manometry readings before surgery, showing

> simultaneous contractions that are not peristaltic, and then

> years after surgery, showing sequenced peristaltic contractions

> in that same person.

>

> This is a mysterious disease, and the cause or causes are not

> even known. There are few very long-term studies. I don't think

> we can state categorically that peristalsis will never, ever

> resume in anyone who has achalasia.

>

> (On this list, in Pittsburgh posted a month ago that his

> motility returned after a myotomy and after treating his

> dermatitis herpetiformis, which may have been the underlying

> cause of achalasia in his case.)

>

> Quincia, I wonder too if something else was going on in those

> four patients. Maybe they all had acupuncture after surgery!

>

> By the way, it would be lovely if you could post a photo of

> yourself getting acupuncture treatment, or a photo of the herbal

> medicine shop, etc. Seeing your photos would be like a brief

> trip to China for the rest of us.

>

> in Lancaster, PA

>

> >>

> >> hi, quoted from the report:

> >>

> >> " Four patients were found to have varying extents of

> >> resumption of esophageal peristalsis by esophageal manometry

> >> at 20 months, 7, 15 and 20 years after esophageal myotomy,

> >> respectively (Figure 3). "

>

> >> >

> >> > The article is here (in English):

> >> > http://www.wjgnet.com/1007-9327/10/287.pdf

> >> >

>

[Guest guest]

hi, Mauro,

I don't know the name of those herbs. I did acupuncture on my back,

knee, sometime feet, forearm, back, ear. tell me a little bit about

your story, like why you choose TCM and how it goes. Thank you.

Quincia

> >

> > > They must not have had real achalasia if peristalsis resumed.

> >

> > The paper includes manometry readings before surgery, showing

> > simultaneous contractions that are not peristaltic, and then

> > years after surgery, showing sequenced peristaltic contractions

> > in that same person.

> >

> > This is a mysterious disease, and the cause or causes are not

> > even known. There are few very long-term studies. I don't think

> > we can state categorically that peristalsis will never, ever

> > resume in anyone who has achalasia.

> >

> > (On this list, in Pittsburgh posted a month ago that his

> > motility returned after a myotomy and after treating his

> > dermatitis herpetiformis, which may have been the underlying

> > cause of achalasia in his case.)

> >

> > Quincia, I wonder too if something else was going on in those

> > four patients. Maybe they all had acupuncture after surgery!

> >

> > By the way, it would be lovely if you could post a photo of

> > yourself getting acupuncture treatment, or a photo of the herbal

> > medicine shop, etc. Seeing your photos would be like a brief

> > trip to China for the rest of us.

> >

> > in Lancaster, PA

> >

> > >>

> > >> hi, quoted from the report:

> > >>

> > >> " Four patients were found to have varying extents of

> > >> resumption of esophageal peristalsis by esophageal manometry

> > >> at 20 months, 7, 15 and 20 years after esophageal myotomy,

> > >> respectively (Figure 3). "

> >

> > >> >

> > >> > The article is here (in English):

> > >> > http://www.wjgnet.com/1007-9327/10/287.pdf

> > >> >

> >

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Mauro and Quinicia:

I hope you will continue to post your experiences and successes with TCM -- I

for one am

interested in your efforts and see the information as valuable. Please don't go

away!

Peggy from Lompoc, who has had a myotomy but uses and believes in TCM!

> > >

> > > > They must not have had real achalasia if peristalsis resumed.

> > >

> > > The paper includes manometry readings before surgery, showing

> > > simultaneous contractions that are not peristaltic, and then

> > > years after surgery, showing sequenced peristaltic contractions

> > > in that same person.

> > >

> > > This is a mysterious disease, and the cause or causes are not

> > > even known. There are few very long-term studies. I don't think

> > > we can state categorically that peristalsis will never, ever

> > > resume in anyone who has achalasia.

> > >

> > > (On this list, in Pittsburgh posted a month ago that his

> > > motility returned after a myotomy and after treating his

> > > dermatitis herpetiformis, which may have been the underlying

> > > cause of achalasia in his case.)

> > >

> > > Quincia, I wonder too if something else was going on in those

> > > four patients. Maybe they all had acupuncture after surgery!

> > >

> > > By the way, it would be lovely if you could post a photo of

> > > yourself getting acupuncture treatment, or a photo of the herbal

> > > medicine shop, etc. Seeing your photos would be like a brief

> > > trip to China for the rest of us.

> > >

> > > in Lancaster, PA

> > >

> > > >>

> > > >> hi, quoted from the report:

> > > >>

> > > >> " Four patients were found to have varying extents of

> > > >> resumption of esophageal peristalsis by esophageal manometry

> > > >> at 20 months, 7, 15 and 20 years after esophageal myotomy,

> > > >> respectively (Figure 3). "

> > >

> > > >> >

> > > >> > The article is here (in English):

> > > >> > http://www.wjgnet.com/1007-9327/10/287.pdf

> > > >> >

> > >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Mauro,

I hope you all continue to post something of your successes,

alternative or otherwise, to the whole group. Others, like myself,

will search these postings for information.

I have a friend who has achalasia. I have used TCM extensively for my

own health issues - so am trying to research what TCM might be able

to do for him. I am trying to find out which acupucture points have

the best results for treating the symptoms. It sounds like they are

using Stomach 36 on you? The other points I can not tell from your

brief description. Has your acupcunturist told you the names for the

points?

Also, have you had any success using acupressure on yourself when

you are having active symptoms? If so, which points?

Thanks much,

Teala

>

> Hi Quincia,

>

[.....]

> Acupunture points: ankles(1ea), legs on the outher side just

below the knee (2ea), wrist (1ea), stomach (2ea)

> In addition to acupunture i have reflexology sessions every three

weeks.

> Still cannot eat many things but i manage to have a reasonably

good life.

>

> Since its just few of us using alternative medicine perhaps we

should use our personal email?

>

> Mauro

>

>

[Guest guest]

hi, Tealas,

Mauro and I are member of TCM_treatment_for_Achalasia group. you

can join our group and we can discuss this within the group. Mauro

are managing the disorder pretty well. he is under TCM treatment. I

am too. I went back to china for TCM treatment and sometimes I was

symptoms free. Stress and emotion play major role in the disorder.

you are welcomed to the group.

Quincia

> >

> > Hi Quincia,

> >

> [.....]

> > Acupunture points: ankles(1ea), legs on the outher side just

> below the knee (2ea), wrist (1ea), stomach (2ea)

> > In addition to acupunture i have reflexology sessions every

three

> weeks.

> > Still cannot eat many things but i manage to have a reasonably

> good life.

> >

> > Since its just few of us using alternative medicine perhaps we

> should use our personal email?

> >

> > Mauro

> >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Sorry for the long pause, and thanks for the invite! I will join this

group.

Cheers,

Teala

>

> hi, Tealas,

> Mauro and I are member of TCM_treatment_for_Achalasia group. you

> can join our group and we can discuss this within the group. Mauro

> are managing the disorder pretty well. he is under TCM treatment. I

> am too. I went back to china for TCM treatment and sometimes I was

> symptoms free. Stress and emotion play major role in the disorder.

> you are welcomed to the group.

> Quincia

>

>