Notes from an aging hippie

[Guest guest]

This isn't the least bit comforting....I'd rather die than " imagine " no

religion. What harm are the traditional,

mainstream religions causing? The problem always arises from the " fanatic " be

they Christian, Muslim, Catholic,

Protestant, what have you. How sad.

Karla in Texas-desperately glad she has " religion. "

Rob Breedeveld wrote:

Imagine there's no countries

> It isn't hard to do

> Nothing to kill or die for

> And no religion too

> Imagine all the people

> Living life in peace...

>

[Guest guest]

This isn't the least bit comforting....I'd rather die than " imagine " no

religion. What harm are the traditional,

mainstream religions causing? The problem always arises from the " fanatic " be

they Christian, Muslim, Catholic,

Protestant, what have you. How sad.

Karla in Texas-desperately glad she has " religion. "

Rob Breedeveld wrote:

Imagine there's no countries

> It isn't hard to do

> Nothing to kill or die for

> And no religion too

> Imagine all the people

> Living life in peace...

>

[Guest guest]

> Imagine there's no countries

>

> > It isn't hard to do

> > Nothing to kill or die for

> > And no religion too

> > Imagine all the people

> > Living life in peace...

> >

Sorry Karla, I mean no offence with these lyrics. I didnt write them

although I agree with the meaning they stand for.

And youre not completely right because if there are only fanatics

that carry the weapons and go into war, the world would be full of

fanatics. Fanatics throwing stones at children in Northern Ireland,

Fanatics killing eachother at the Westbank, Fanatics in Bosnia.

Kosovo, Eastern Timor. Thats only in the last six months.

I respect every one although I am not a religious person myself. I

hope that the religious people would at least try to do the same. I

agree with you that the majority does that and lives the way most

holy scriptures tell us, to respect and love your fellow human being

but just tonight I heard that a poll in the US resulted in 35% hating

Muslims. And thats where it all starts.

One thing is for sure. A fanatic non-believer hasn't been seen yet.

>Rob, Nope, I'm afraid the Oklahoma bombers didn't intend to die

for their

>incredibly ignorant beliefs. That are not quite as fanatical as the

>perpetrators of this heinous act. They lived to be executed. You

>must

>remember that Bonnie lives there and sees the devastation day after

>day.

>They flew planes into her home town!!! They killed friends and

>neighbors.

>How would you feel if it were Amsterdam? I think being careful

>about who we

>allow into our country would be a great short term solution.

>Elaine

>

Elaine, I wouldnt be so sure that the group to which the Oklahoma

Bomber belongs arent willing to die for their believes.

And I feel for Bonnie and understand her reaction. I probably would

say the same thing. But I hope, so many miles away, to give some

reflection on the hatred thats going on. If something scares me, then

its hatred.

Just reflecting how I see things.

Finally I want to make clear that when we saw the news about the

attack, I cried........as a human being for al those lives that ware

destroyed in a flash. The world will never be the same.

peace

Rob

[Guest guest]

> Imagine there's no countries

>

> > It isn't hard to do

> > Nothing to kill or die for

> > And no religion too

> > Imagine all the people

> > Living life in peace...

> >

Sorry Karla, I mean no offence with these lyrics. I didnt write them

although I agree with the meaning they stand for.

And youre not completely right because if there are only fanatics

that carry the weapons and go into war, the world would be full of

fanatics. Fanatics throwing stones at children in Northern Ireland,

Fanatics killing eachother at the Westbank, Fanatics in Bosnia.

Kosovo, Eastern Timor. Thats only in the last six months.

I respect every one although I am not a religious person myself. I

hope that the religious people would at least try to do the same. I

agree with you that the majority does that and lives the way most

holy scriptures tell us, to respect and love your fellow human being

but just tonight I heard that a poll in the US resulted in 35% hating

Muslims. And thats where it all starts.

One thing is for sure. A fanatic non-believer hasn't been seen yet.

>Rob, Nope, I'm afraid the Oklahoma bombers didn't intend to die

for their

>incredibly ignorant beliefs. That are not quite as fanatical as the

>perpetrators of this heinous act. They lived to be executed. You

>must

>remember that Bonnie lives there and sees the devastation day after

>day.

>They flew planes into her home town!!! They killed friends and

>neighbors.

>How would you feel if it were Amsterdam? I think being careful

>about who we

>allow into our country would be a great short term solution.

>Elaine

>

Elaine, I wouldnt be so sure that the group to which the Oklahoma

Bomber belongs arent willing to die for their believes.

And I feel for Bonnie and understand her reaction. I probably would

say the same thing. But I hope, so many miles away, to give some

reflection on the hatred thats going on. If something scares me, then

its hatred.

Just reflecting how I see things.

Finally I want to make clear that when we saw the news about the

attack, I cried........as a human being for al those lives that ware

destroyed in a flash. The world will never be the same.

peace

Rob

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 9/19/01 11:56:04 AM Central Daylight Time,

wildwards@... writes:

> . One author being interviewed was asked

> what Americans could to to make Bin Laden happy and he said, " move to

> another

> planet. "

> Cheryl in VA

>

Then he'd probably declare war on that planet. Jessie

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 9/19/01 11:56:04 AM Central Daylight Time,

wildwards@... writes:

> . One author being interviewed was asked

> what Americans could to to make Bin Laden happy and he said, " move to

> another

> planet. "

> Cheryl in VA

>

Then he'd probably declare war on that planet. Jessie

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 9/19/2001 12:04:28 PM Central Daylight Time,

breedeveld@... writes:

> Arent we forgetting something? Are we a bit short of memory?

> As far as I know the Oklahoma Bomber wasn't an immigrant. Terrorism

>

Well the only one seen dancing in the streets following the OKC bombing

was.....um that's right no one was caught dancing in the streets here when

the building was bombed. That seems to be the difference between then and

now.

And Rob I work with many muslims. Most of us know that not all Arabs are

responsible anymore then all Americans were responsible for the bombin of the

Fed. building.

Joy

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 9/19/2001 12:04:28 PM Central Daylight Time,

breedeveld@... writes:

> Arent we forgetting something? Are we a bit short of memory?

> As far as I know the Oklahoma Bomber wasn't an immigrant. Terrorism

>

Well the only one seen dancing in the streets following the OKC bombing

was.....um that's right no one was caught dancing in the streets here when

the building was bombed. That seems to be the difference between then and

now.

And Rob I work with many muslims. Most of us know that not all Arabs are

responsible anymore then all Americans were responsible for the bombin of the

Fed. building.

Joy

[Guest guest]

Bonnie,

I know exactly how you are feeling, because I too am feeling the same way.

Most people are very, very supportive of our situation, but really cant

imagine what it is like to be here every day. The news is jaded and there is

so much the rest of the world doesnt even know about what is really going on.

Like the funerals, the memorials, the interruption to our daily lives. To

the tears we have to explain to our kids. The jumping every time we hear a

phone ring for fear of bad or sad news. To the now motherless, fatherless

children and the widows at 30 years old. To the teenagers so full of anger

that they talk of bombs blowing up their houses, their schools. To the 4

year olds who really dont understand. To the 7 year olds who only wants his

life and cartoons back and cant understand, why all the flags all of a

sudden? To the 11 year old with Down Syndrome who knows something is wrong,

changed and very sad in her life, without really understanding.

Oh, about that 11 year old, who all of a sudden, needs her mother to sing her

lullabyes before going to bed and needs 100 more hugs than before. Do you

think she knows?

~ trying to live 'normally' in NY and mom to that 11 year old, DS

and that 7 year old jesse

[Guest guest]

Bonnie,

I know exactly how you are feeling, because I too am feeling the same way.

Most people are very, very supportive of our situation, but really cant

imagine what it is like to be here every day. The news is jaded and there is

so much the rest of the world doesnt even know about what is really going on.

Like the funerals, the memorials, the interruption to our daily lives. To

the tears we have to explain to our kids. The jumping every time we hear a

phone ring for fear of bad or sad news. To the now motherless, fatherless

children and the widows at 30 years old. To the teenagers so full of anger

that they talk of bombs blowing up their houses, their schools. To the 4

year olds who really dont understand. To the 7 year olds who only wants his

life and cartoons back and cant understand, why all the flags all of a

sudden? To the 11 year old with Down Syndrome who knows something is wrong,

changed and very sad in her life, without really understanding.

Oh, about that 11 year old, who all of a sudden, needs her mother to sing her

lullabyes before going to bed and needs 100 more hugs than before. Do you

think she knows?

~ trying to live 'normally' in NY and mom to that 11 year old, DS

and that 7 year old jesse

[Guest guest]

I stopped watching channel 3 (Phila. CBS I think) because they showed a person

jumping from the building which in my opinion was in poor taste.

Di, mom to Jake(18,nda) and 4 (DS)

Pennsylvania

Re: Notes from an aging hippie

In a message dated 9/19/01 10:17:37 AM Central Daylight Time,

lowenthalrj@... writes:

> A family on one of the planes included the 2 and 4 year old daughters

> and 3 elementary students were on another plane.

>

> I wouldn't agree that there should be any indiscriminate or reckless use

> of power, but the group responsible will do it again if nothing is done

> to stop them. The Pentagon daycare isn't in the building, but it's

> nearby--what if that had been hit?

>

> We got babies too.

>

> Judi

HI Judi

Exactly!!!!!!!!!!! if scenes of the dead is what you want to see, stick

around...I'm sure there will be tons of web sites to show " our " dead soon.

Kathy mom to Sara 9

[Guest guest]

I stopped watching channel 3 (Phila. CBS I think) because they showed a person

jumping from the building which in my opinion was in poor taste.

Di, mom to Jake(18,nda) and 4 (DS)

Pennsylvania

Re: Notes from an aging hippie

In a message dated 9/19/01 10:17:37 AM Central Daylight Time,

lowenthalrj@... writes:

> A family on one of the planes included the 2 and 4 year old daughters

> and 3 elementary students were on another plane.

>

> I wouldn't agree that there should be any indiscriminate or reckless use

> of power, but the group responsible will do it again if nothing is done

> to stop them. The Pentagon daycare isn't in the building, but it's

> nearby--what if that had been hit?

>

> We got babies too.

>

> Judi

HI Judi

Exactly!!!!!!!!!!! if scenes of the dead is what you want to see, stick

around...I'm sure there will be tons of web sites to show " our " dead soon.

Kathy mom to Sara 9

[Guest guest]

It takes my husband 45 minutes to get to work because the gates on Fort

are closed with those orange things. They check your entrance

(registration) sticker on your car AND your personal military ID. The

commissary and PX have armed guards (those at the gate are armed as well)

and have those concreted pillars to keep anyone who might harm people in a

truck or car away from the building. They have closed all extra doors and

ID checks are constant. The cute little MPs are working in full gear and it

is so hot here. They are so polite and caring but I feel stifled with all

the extra " protection. " I heard on CNN that they will probably be deployed.

The service members are always the last to know:)) I can't imagine what

it's like for those in NY or DC. I wish I could hug all of you and do

something to make things better. I will be extra lonely if they deploy my

best friend in the whole world (dh), so I'm depending on Y'all (or the

plural being all Y'all) ))

Elaine

RE: Re: Notes from an aging hippie

> <<The news is jaded and there is

> so much the rest of the world doesnt even know about what is really

> going on.

>

> Like the funerals, the memorials, the interruption to our daily lives.

> To

> the tears we have to explain to our kids. The jumping every time we

> hear a

> phone ring for fear of bad or sad news. To the now motherless,

> fatherless

> children and the widows at 30 years old. To the teenagers so full of

> anger

> that they talk of bombs blowing up their houses, their schools. To the

> 4

> year olds who really dont understand. To the 7 year olds who only wants

> his

> life and cartoons back and cant understand, why all the flags all of a

> sudden?>>

>

> I hear you. The magnitude is less in Washington, but this is all in

> evidence, especially the disruptive quality--just commuting in (which

> was already a great BIG pain) has gotten to be an even bigger hassle

> with all the ID checks and extra security and people are leaving very

> early in the morning just to get to work anywhere near on time. Parking

> is more restricted too.

>

> What bugs me is that at the same time there is a litany about getting

> back to regular business and normalcy--uh, hello? How are we supposed

> to do that exactly?

>

> Judi

>

>

> Click reply to all for messages to go to the list. Just hit reply for

messages to go to the sender of the message.

>

>

[Guest guest]

It takes my husband 45 minutes to get to work because the gates on Fort

are closed with those orange things. They check your entrance

(registration) sticker on your car AND your personal military ID. The

commissary and PX have armed guards (those at the gate are armed as well)

and have those concreted pillars to keep anyone who might harm people in a

truck or car away from the building. They have closed all extra doors and

ID checks are constant. The cute little MPs are working in full gear and it

is so hot here. They are so polite and caring but I feel stifled with all

the extra " protection. " I heard on CNN that they will probably be deployed.

The service members are always the last to know:)) I can't imagine what

it's like for those in NY or DC. I wish I could hug all of you and do

something to make things better. I will be extra lonely if they deploy my

best friend in the whole world (dh), so I'm depending on Y'all (or the

plural being all Y'all) ))

Elaine

RE: Re: Notes from an aging hippie

> <<The news is jaded and there is

> so much the rest of the world doesnt even know about what is really

> going on.

>

> Like the funerals, the memorials, the interruption to our daily lives.

> To

> the tears we have to explain to our kids. The jumping every time we

> hear a

> phone ring for fear of bad or sad news. To the now motherless,

> fatherless

> children and the widows at 30 years old. To the teenagers so full of

> anger

> that they talk of bombs blowing up their houses, their schools. To the

> 4

> year olds who really dont understand. To the 7 year olds who only wants

> his

> life and cartoons back and cant understand, why all the flags all of a

> sudden?>>

>

> I hear you. The magnitude is less in Washington, but this is all in

> evidence, especially the disruptive quality--just commuting in (which

> was already a great BIG pain) has gotten to be an even bigger hassle

> with all the ID checks and extra security and people are leaving very

> early in the morning just to get to work anywhere near on time. Parking

> is more restricted too.

>

> What bugs me is that at the same time there is a litany about getting

> back to regular business and normalcy--uh, hello? How are we supposed

> to do that exactly?

>

> Judi

>

>

> Click reply to all for messages to go to the list. Just hit reply for

messages to go to the sender of the message.

>

>

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 9/20/2001 4:14:36 PM Central Daylight Time,

linman42@... writes:

<< Both of my children will be starting soccer on Saturday. I

have/want to go to memorial service for our friend who was on the 95th

floor. What do I say to my children that will explain to them why I wont be

at their first game of soccer season. Normal??????

~ mom to amanda 11 DS and jesse 7 >>

Just tell them that you need to go and pray for your friend who died. If

necessary you should say where/when, I'd only tell them the answer to that if

they really wanted to know. Kids do understand alot more then we think and

, I'm sure that they'll understand going to say goodby to a friend.

Sure you'll miss a game, but that isn't the end of the world, there are other

games, but only one memorial servive for your friend.

Take care

And God Bless

Joy

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 9/20/2001 4:14:36 PM Central Daylight Time,

linman42@... writes:

<< Both of my children will be starting soccer on Saturday. I

have/want to go to memorial service for our friend who was on the 95th

floor. What do I say to my children that will explain to them why I wont be

at their first game of soccer season. Normal??????

~ mom to amanda 11 DS and jesse 7 >>

Just tell them that you need to go and pray for your friend who died. If

necessary you should say where/when, I'd only tell them the answer to that if

they really wanted to know. Kids do understand alot more then we think and

, I'm sure that they'll understand going to say goodby to a friend.

Sure you'll miss a game, but that isn't the end of the world, there are other

games, but only one memorial servive for your friend.

Take care

And God Bless

Joy

[Guest guest]

That's a sophomoric argument, gem. Bin Laden has killed and has

expressed the intent to kill any American (he doesn't appear to

discriminate further, including children. He and his followers have

made refugees of many of the people of Afganistan, and I'm sure children

have suffered and probably died because of it. More probably will there

too.

The dilemma isn't becoming what we denounce--not " you're a bigger one. "

It's the two children are about to drown; which do you save dilemma.

The answer is to save the one you can save, do what's possible to save

the other, and live with it because that's what people have to do.

Better that than to stay on the bank and agonize about the the fact that

you may not save one while both die.

Judi

Re: Notes from an aging hippie

Let's be careful that we do not become baby killers, too, Judi. We do

not want to become that which we denounce.

granny

---

" O mankind! We created you from a single (pair) of a male and a

female, and made you into nations and tribes, that ye may know each

other ... " al-Qur'an 49:13 http://www.bspyle.com/granny.html

Re: Notes from an aging hippie

>

>

> > I'm not being argumentative and I respect everyone's opinions...I

> > myself

> am torn between revenge, justice, peace and war but what about the

> innocent children WE will be killing?

> > My husband also served in Desert Storm. He lived right out there in

> > the

> desert too, so don't think I'm not patriotic but isn't it time to stop

> the killing.

> > How about the times the US " butted " into other countries affairs in

> > the

> name of " peace " ? That's one of the reasons this bin Laden is so pissed

> at us. If a country asks us to come help them, that's one thing but

> for us to just decide to go and " invade " a country because WE thought

> we should, well that's another....

> > Di, mom to Jake(18,nda) and 4 (DS)

> > Pennsylvania

> > ----- Original Message -----

> > From: djackht@...

> >

> >

> > I fear death in combat, but not near as much as I fear something

> happening to my children, who have nothing to do with this. Much like

> the children on the

> > planes that crashed, or the innocents in the buildings.

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

That's a sophomoric argument, gem. Bin Laden has killed and has

expressed the intent to kill any American (he doesn't appear to

discriminate further, including children. He and his followers have

made refugees of many of the people of Afganistan, and I'm sure children

have suffered and probably died because of it. More probably will there

too.

The dilemma isn't becoming what we denounce--not " you're a bigger one. "

It's the two children are about to drown; which do you save dilemma.

The answer is to save the one you can save, do what's possible to save

the other, and live with it because that's what people have to do.

Better that than to stay on the bank and agonize about the the fact that

you may not save one while both die.

Judi

Re: Notes from an aging hippie

Let's be careful that we do not become baby killers, too, Judi. We do

not want to become that which we denounce.

granny

---

" O mankind! We created you from a single (pair) of a male and a

female, and made you into nations and tribes, that ye may know each

other ... " al-Qur'an 49:13 http://www.bspyle.com/granny.html

Re: Notes from an aging hippie

>

>

> > I'm not being argumentative and I respect everyone's opinions...I

> > myself

> am torn between revenge, justice, peace and war but what about the

> innocent children WE will be killing?

> > My husband also served in Desert Storm. He lived right out there in

> > the

> desert too, so don't think I'm not patriotic but isn't it time to stop

> the killing.

> > How about the times the US " butted " into other countries affairs in

> > the

> name of " peace " ? That's one of the reasons this bin Laden is so pissed

> at us. If a country asks us to come help them, that's one thing but

> for us to just decide to go and " invade " a country because WE thought

> we should, well that's another....

> > Di, mom to Jake(18,nda) and 4 (DS)

> > Pennsylvania

> > ----- Original Message -----

> > From: djackht@...

> >

> >

> > I fear death in combat, but not near as much as I fear something

> happening to my children, who have nothing to do with this. Much like

> the children on the

> > planes that crashed, or the innocents in the buildings.

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >