Re: Notes from an aging hippie

September 20, 2001

Where is Lennon now that we need him?

granny

---

" O mankind! We created you from a single (pair) of a male and a

female, and made you into nations and tribes, that ye may know each

other ... " al-Qur'an 49:13

http://www.bspyle.com/granny.html

RE: Notes from an aging hippie

> I came across this letter on the internet. Maybe interesting for

those

> who want to 'nuke' everyone. Sometimes things are not so simple and

revenge

> is an understandable emotion but not the 'right' one.

>

> I know its easy for me to talk about this so many miles away but it

> also helps to keep perspective.

> And lets get one thing straight...this is not only an attack on the

US

> but on every righteous human being.

>

> Imagine all the people living live in peace.

>

> Rob

> A dreamer

>

> Written by an Afghani in the U.S.

>

> I've been hearing a lot of talk about " bombing Afghanistan back to

the

> Stone Age. " Ron Owens, on KGO Talk Radio today, allowed that this would

mean

> killing innocent people, people who had nothing to do with this atrocity,

> but " we're at war, we have to accept collateral damage. What else can we

> do? " Minutes later I heard some TV pundit discussing whether we " have the

> belly to do what must be done. " And I thought about the issues being

raised

> especially hard because I am from Afghanistan, and even though I've lived

> here for 35 years I've never lost track of what's going on there. So I

want

> to tell anyone who will listen how it all looks from where I'm standing.

>

> I speak as one who deeply hates the Taliban and Osama Bin Laden. My

> hatred comes from first hand experience. There is no doubt in my mind that

> these people were responsible for the atrocity in New York. I agree that

> something must be done about those monsters. But the Taliban and Ben Laden

> are not Afghanistan. They're not even the government of Afghanistan. The

> Taliban are a cult of ignorant psychotics who took over Afghanistan in

1997.

> Bin Laden is a political criminal with a plan. When you think Taliban,

think

> Nazis. When you think Bin Laden,think Hitler. And when you think " the

people

> of Afghanistan " think " the Jews in the concentration camps. "

>

> It's not only that the Afghan people had nothing to do with this

> atrocity. They were the first victims of the perpetrators. They would

exult

> if someone would come in there, take out the Taliban and clear out the

rats

> nest of international thugs holed up in their country.

>

> Some say, why don't the Afghans rise up and overthrow the Taliban?

The

> answer is, they're starved, exhausted, hurt, incapacitated, suffering. A

few

> years ago, the United Nations estimated that there are 500,000 disabled

> orphans in Afghanistan--a country with no economy, no food. There are

> millions of widows. And the Taliban has been burying these widows alive in

> mass graves. The soil is littered with land mines, the farms were all

> destroyed by the Soviets. These are a few of the reasons why the

> Afghan people have not overthrown the Taliban.

>

> We come now to the question of " bombing Afghanistan back to the

Stone

> Age " . Trouble is, that's been done. The Soviets took care of it already.

> Make the Afghans suffer? They're already suffering. Level their houses?

> Done. Turn their schools into piles of rubble? Done. Eradicate their

> hospitals? Done. Destroy their infrastructure? Cut them off from medicine

> and health care? Too late. Someone already did all that. New bombs would

> only stir the rubble of earlier bombs. Would they at least get the

Taliban?

> Not likely. In today's Afghanistan, only the Taliban eat, only they have

the

> means to move around. They'd slip away and hide.

>

> Maybe the bombs would get some of those disabled orphans, they don't

> move too fast, they don't even have wheelchairs. But flying over Kabul and

> dropping bombs would not really be a strike against the criminals who did

> this horrific thing. Actually it would only be making common cause with

the

> Taliban--by raping once again the people they've been raping all this

time.

>

> So what else is there? What can be done, then? Let me now speak with

> true fear and trembling. The only way to get Bin Laden is to go in there

> with ground troops. When people speak of " having the belly to do what

needs

> to be done " they're thinking in terms of having the belly to kill as many

as

> needed. Having the belly to overcome any moral qualms about killing

innocent

> people. Let's pull our heads out of the sand. What's actually on the table

> is Americans dying. And not just because some Americans would die fighting

> their way through Afghanistan to Bin Laden's hideout. It's much bigger

than

> that folks. Because to get any troops to Afghanistan, we'd have to go

> through Pakistan. Would they let us? Not likely. The conquest of Pakistan

> would have to be first. Will other Muslim nations just stand by? You see

> where I'm going. We're flirting with a world war between Islam and the

West.

>

> And guess what: that's Bin Laden's program. That's exactly what he

> wants. That's why he did this. Read his speeches and statements. It's all

> right there. He really believes Islam would beat the west. It might seem

> ridiculous, but he figures if he can polarize the world into Islam and the

> West, he's got a billion soldiers. If the west wreaks a holocaust in those

> lands, that's a billion people with nothing left to lose, that's

even

> better from Bin Laden's point of view. He's probably wrong, in the end the

> West would win, whatever that would mean, but the war would last for years

> and millions would die, not just theirs but ours. Who has the belly for

> that?

>

> Unfortunately, Bin Laden does. Anyone else?

>

> In Peace,

> Tamim Ansary

>

September 20, 2001

Right on, Rob! I might add that when we are dropping bombs on whoever our

demon du jour is, you can bet your sweet bippy that the people, men, women

and children, below feel terror.

granny

---

" O mankind! We created you from a single (pair) of a male and a

female, and made you into nations and tribes, that ye may know each

other ... " al-Qur'an 49:13

http://www.bspyle.com/granny.html

Re: Notes from an aging hippie

>

> > I agree with you Bonnie about restricting immigrants. times have

> changed, we can no longer allow every single person into the country.

> >

> > I am also sickened by the fact that they used our schools,

> airplanes and any other American means in their act of terrorism.

> That is just a slap in the face to all Americans.

> >

>

> Arent we forgetting something? Are we a bit short of memory?

> As far as I know the Oklahoma Bomber wasn't an immigrant. Terrorism

> and fanatic people arent disguised as arabs or any other race. The

> only resemblance they have is willing to die for their believes.

> And they will use anything and anyone they can to get there moment of

> glory. There only goal is destroying the symbols of freedom.

>

> Rob

>

> Imagine there's no countries

> It isn't hard to do

> Nothing to kill or die for

> And no religion too

> Imagine all the people

> Living life in peace...

>

September 20, 2001

Right on, Rob! I might add that when we are dropping bombs on whoever our

demon du jour is, you can bet your sweet bippy that the people, men, women

and children, below feel terror.

granny

---

" O mankind! We created you from a single (pair) of a male and a

female, and made you into nations and tribes, that ye may know each

other ... " al-Qur'an 49:13

http://www.bspyle.com/granny.html

Re: Notes from an aging hippie

>

> > I agree with you Bonnie about restricting immigrants. times have

> changed, we can no longer allow every single person into the country.

> >

> > I am also sickened by the fact that they used our schools,

> airplanes and any other American means in their act of terrorism.

> That is just a slap in the face to all Americans.

> >

>

> Arent we forgetting something? Are we a bit short of memory?

> As far as I know the Oklahoma Bomber wasn't an immigrant. Terrorism

> and fanatic people arent disguised as arabs or any other race. The

> only resemblance they have is willing to die for their believes.

> And they will use anything and anyone they can to get there moment of

> glory. There only goal is destroying the symbols of freedom.

>

> Rob

>

> Imagine there's no countries

> It isn't hard to do

> Nothing to kill or die for

> And no religion too

> Imagine all the people

> Living life in peace...

>

September 20, 2001

Those of G*d's creatures who never fail to do her will have no religion,

Karla. They have no need for one. Just a bit of food for thought.

granny

---

" O mankind! We created you from a single (pair) of a male and a

female, and made you into nations and tribes, that ye may know each

other ... " al-Qur'an 49:13

http://www.bspyle.com/granny.html

Re: Re: Notes from an aging hippie

>

> This isn't the least bit comforting....I'd rather die than " imagine " no

religion. What harm are the traditional,

> mainstream religions causing? The problem always arises from the

" fanatic " be they Christian, Muslim, Catholic,

> Protestant, what have you. How sad.

>

> Karla in Texas-desperately glad she has " religion. "

>

> Rob Breedeveld wrote:

> Imagine there's no countries

>

> > It isn't hard to do

> > Nothing to kill or die for

> > And no religion too

> > Imagine all the people

> > Living life in peace...

> >

>

> Click reply to all for messages to go to the list. Just hit reply for

messages to go to the sender of the message.

>

September 20, 2001

Those of G*d's creatures who never fail to do her will have no religion,

Karla. They have no need for one. Just a bit of food for thought.

granny

---

" O mankind! We created you from a single (pair) of a male and a

female, and made you into nations and tribes, that ye may know each

other ... " al-Qur'an 49:13

http://www.bspyle.com/granny.html

Re: Re: Notes from an aging hippie

>

> This isn't the least bit comforting....I'd rather die than " imagine " no

religion. What harm are the traditional,

> mainstream religions causing? The problem always arises from the

" fanatic " be they Christian, Muslim, Catholic,

> Protestant, what have you. How sad.

>

> Karla in Texas-desperately glad she has " religion. "

>

> Rob Breedeveld wrote:

> Imagine there's no countries

>

> > It isn't hard to do

> > Nothing to kill or die for

> > And no religion too

> > Imagine all the people

> > Living life in peace...

> >

>

> Click reply to all for messages to go to the list. Just hit reply for

messages to go to the sender of the message.

>

September 20, 2001

Judi,

That's the part that is so hard for me to understand... how do we go back to

being 'normal'? I feel like I am in a different world and I dont know how to

be normal. As a teacher, I cant teach well. I feel like nothing much is

mattering now. I have no desire to go anywhere. The heaviness i feel

everyday is making it difficult to even get out of my house in the AM. I

try, I really do.

And the weather is so nice lately, but I feel guilty to enjoy it. And I know

I should because soon it will be cold and miserable and then I will really

be depressed.

Oh, one of the things I forgot to mention last night, about trying to be

normal.....Both of my children will be starting soccer on Saturday. I

have/want to go to memorial service for our friend who was on the 95th

floor. What do I say to my children that will explain to them why I wont be

at their first game of soccer season. Normal??????

~ mom to amanda 11 DS and jesse 7

September 20, 2001

Judi,

That's the part that is so hard for me to understand... how do we go back to

being 'normal'? I feel like I am in a different world and I dont know how to

be normal. As a teacher, I cant teach well. I feel like nothing much is

mattering now. I have no desire to go anywhere. The heaviness i feel

everyday is making it difficult to even get out of my house in the AM. I

try, I really do.

And the weather is so nice lately, but I feel guilty to enjoy it. And I know

I should because soon it will be cold and miserable and then I will really

be depressed.

Oh, one of the things I forgot to mention last night, about trying to be

normal.....Both of my children will be starting soccer on Saturday. I

have/want to go to memorial service for our friend who was on the 95th

floor. What do I say to my children that will explain to them why I wont be

at their first game of soccer season. Normal??????

~ mom to amanda 11 DS and jesse 7

September 21, 2001

,

I haven't had much time to respond to e-mails lately. It's all I can do

to read all of them it seems. Since that awful Tuesday, I've seen you

post everyday and you seem so strong. Of course, your depressed. You

have every right to be. Your whole life has been changed. I can't even

imagine being where you're at. As far as your children's soccer game, I

think if you explain to them that you have to say goodbye to a friend

and miss this one game, they will understand. I really hope things

start getting better for you soon. I am continuing to pray for you.

Best wishes and may God Bless You!

Warmly,

September 21, 2001