Re: - Iodine/Lyme Disease

[Guest guest]

,

How do you know so many people with Lyme disease? Is there any documentation about Iodine and Lyme Disease I can forward to someone I know about it? I just don't want to tell her about it since I think it would be more beneficial for her to read for herself.

Thanks,

Kathy T.

From: texlyme_mom <texlyme_mom@...>Subject: Re: Lori - newbie updating and Vit C - blood sugar and Lymeiodine Date: Thursday, September 1, 2011, 8:37 AM

,You asked if anyone knows whether iodine has been used for treating Lyme disease. To the best of my knowledge, none of the ILADS doctors knows anything (yet) about iodine therapy, but it's probably only a matter of time before they learn about iodine and consider trying it. (ILADS = International Lyme and Associated Diseases Society) I have read somewhere recently (forgot where, because I read so much) that Lugol's solution was used for treating syphilis back in the old days before antibiotics became available. Lyme disease is caused by a spirochete bacterium very similar to the spirochete that causes syphilis. The only problem would be to figure out what dosage of Lugol's or Iodoral to take in order to treat Lyme disease effectively since Lyme spirochetes can hide out in almost every tissue and organ in the body. Therefore, my guess is that it would probably require working up to a rather high dosage of iodine, but how

high and for how long to treat is anybody's guess.Personally, knowing as much as I know about the various antibiotic therapy protocols for Lyme and also knowning what little bit I know so far about the Iodine Protocol, I'd opt to start first with iodine and I'd treat aggressively with iodine for at least 6-12 months (or longer) before resorting to antibiotics for Lyme disease. I say this because I've met numerous Lyme patients who claim to be "cured" from Lyme disease but who are still taking "maintenance" doses of antibiotics after more than a decade of having taken high doses of multiple antibiotic combos, including IV antibiotics. If you suspect that it might be Lyme disease, then you need to learn what a "Herxheimer Reaction" is and how to manage it. A Herx reaction is caused by the immune system's over-reaction to toxins produced by dead and dying spiorochetes. In the old days of syphilis, patients often died from the

severity of Herxheimer reactions, especially after penicillin first came on the scene. Therefore, learning what to expect and how to manage a Herxheimer reaction could be critical to your success if Lyme disease is indeed part of your diagnostic picture. The best lab for diagnosing Lyme disease is Igenex. We can continue this discussion privately (or in the Off Topic forum) if you suspect that you might be having Herxheimer "die-off" symptoms from taking iodine, but I would be remiss not to add one important note of caution about the danger of a rare, but severe life-threatening Herxheimer reaction, as follows: If you experience a sudden on-set of fever of 100.5 F or above (which usually occurs around the 3rd - 4th week of treatment, due to the slow replication life-cycle of spirochetes) then STOP all antibiotics or iodine immediately and get a white blood cell count ASAP. If the WBCs have dropped below 3, you are in the danger zone for

a life-threatening crisis. Therefore, do NOT continue taking iodine (or any antibiotics) until your WBCs have come back up above 4 -- which could take about 7-10 days to occur. It is safe to continue treatment again after the WBCs come back up above 4. I have known of hundreds of Lyme patients, but I've only known of a couple of rare but severe, life-threatening Herxheimer reactions. (One such patient was a family member, which is why I take this matter so seriously.) Remember, the immune system is the Big Gun and that antibiotics or iodine merely weaken/s the Lyme bacteria so that the immune system can do its job of eradicating the infection. That's why it's safe to continue treatment after the Herxheimer crisis is past. To be quite honest, I would be quite surprised (shocked, really) if iodine would provoke such a life-threatening Herxheimer crisis, especially if the patient builds up gradually enough on Iodine Therapy -- but since no

one else has attempted to treat late-stage, chronic Lyme disease before with Iodine Therapy, it would be foolish for any of us to assume that such an event couldn't happen. PS to Moderators: Please indulge this important "OT" message because many CFS (and other chronically ill) patients can be unsuspected and therefore undiagnosed late-stage Lyme patients in disguise. Please remain vigilant for the possibility of this kind of serious but rare Herxheimer event. Such patients require prompt medical supervision. Please feel free to contact me privately if you are worried about any iodine forum member who spikes a fever of 100.5 F or higher, especially at the 3rd-4th week after first starting Iodine Therapy. I occasionally fall behind in reading the Daily Digests; thus, I might fail to notice their message otherwise. Most ordinary doctors won't recognize the significance of this kind of rare Herxheimer event associated with

spirochetal infections unless they are experienced ILADS Lyme specialists. >I'd also love to hear from anyone who knows about Lyme disease - can iodine or anything else you know of help with that? That is starting to look like the culprit in the rest of my issues.> > Thanks, >

[Guest guest]

Kathy,

No, I am not aware of any precedent for treating Lyme disease with the Iodine

Therapy Protocol by any of the ILADS doctors, so there is not any documentation

that you can forward to your friend on this subject.

I said that I know " of " hundreds of Lyme patients through participating in

internet Lyme forums and also from attending several ILADS medical conferences

where I have had the opportunity to interact personally with numerous other Lyme

support leaders from around the country.

I want to correct something that I stated earlier about the risk of a

life-threatening Herxheimer reaction from iodine because I have had more time to

reflect upon the possibility of such an occurrence. Based on what I know about

the pathophysiology of chronic, late-stage Lyme disease, I do not believe that

such a severe life-threatening Herx reaction is at all likely with Iodine

Therapy because iodine would be weakening the spirochetes more gradually,

allowing the white blood cells to kill them more slowly.

The life-threatening kind of " classical " Herxheimer reaction, first documented

during the days of syphilis, can occur when a severely chronically ill Lyme

patient who carries an extremely high spirochetal load is treated with

intravenous cell wall inhibiting (CWI) antibiotics, thereby causing a sudden

" die-off " reaction of pathogens. This sudden " die off " occurs when these

slow-growing spirochetes reach a certain critical stage of their life-cycle

which CWI antibiotics are designed to take advantage of, such that the CWI

antibiotics kill off a very large number of these pathogens all at one time.

This kind of sudden, heavy die-off of pathogens releases toxins which overwhelm

the immune system, causing it to over-react because of the cytokine storm that

ensues, thereby resulting in a precipitous drop in white blood cells down into

the critical danger zone. Without enough WBCs, the patient can easily succumb to

an overwhelming secondary opportunistic super-infection. However, the longer

I've had to consider it, I cannot imagine that this same kind of acute reaction

would ever occur with Iodine Therapy.

The only reason I mentioned this idea earlier at all was from an over-abundance

of caution out of fear that not to point out such a rare and unlikely

possibility would be irresponsible of me because I am aware that many patients

in this Iodine forum are not under medical supervision. In retrospect, I

regret that I might have created an unnecessary alarmist reaction.

Personally, I would not hesitate to try the Iodine Protocol for Lyme with

someone in my own family, first, before resorting to antibiotics. I only wish

that iodine therapy had been available 10+ years ago. I say this because iodine

would at least lower the patient's spirochetal load, making a subsequent

life-threatening Herx reaction from IV antibiotics unlikely if IVs were given

later, subsequent to iodine therapy.

Then, if there are still any lingering neurological symptoms after iodine

therapy, that's when IV antibiotics might be required in order to penetrate the

blood brain barrier and to kill spirochetes that are hiding out inside the

cerebral spinal fluid. I don't know if iodine therapy can penetrate those body

compartments or not because I'm not well enough versed in the science behind

iodine therapy yet to know what iodine is capable of accomplishing.

I'm still trying to plough through Dr. Abraham's research papers on the Optimox

website. I do recall reading that WBCs are capable of " stealing " iodine from

thyroid and of using the stolen iodine to manufacture myeloperoxidase in order

to kill intracellular pathogens. That's why I think that iodine therapy might

work nicely to treat late-stage chronic Lyme disease because new research on

Lyme indicates that spirochetes can hide out inside the lymph nodes where they

" paralyze " the WBCs. With enough iodine on board, I would expect that these

" sleeping zombie-like " WBCs might be able to eliminate these intracellular

spirochetes.

These ideas are all pure hypothetical speculation on my part. None of these

ideas are to be found in the current medical literature on Lyme disease. They

are all my own original ideas, based on what I've been reading in Dr. Abraham's

research papers thus far and on how I'm interpreting this new-to-me knowledge

about iodine in light of what I already know about the pathophysiology of Lyme

disease.

Many of the ILADS doctors are very open-minded to new ideas, especially when the

science behind those ideas is as solid and sound as the science behind

Iodiotherapy. I predict that it's only a matter of time before some of the ILADS

doctors start to explore iodine therapy for their Lyme patients. I only wish

that iodine therapy had been available in the late 1990s when our family was so

desperate for answers because we would have been the first ones in line to

vounteer as human guinea pigs to try it out before resorting to antibiotics.

> >

> I'd also love to hear from anyone who knows about Lyme disease - can iodine or

anything else you know of help with that? That is starting to look like the

culprit in the rest of my issues.

> >

> > Thanks,

> >

>

[Guest guest]

So what is the most successful treatment for Lyme Disease? Is Iodine therapy the best approach in your mind?

Thanks a bunch

Kathy T.

From: texlyme_mom <texlyme_mom@...>Subject: Re: - Iodine/Lyme Diseaseiodine Date: Thursday, September 1, 2011, 1:21 PM

Kathy,No, I am not aware of any precedent for treating Lyme disease with the Iodine Therapy Protocol by any of the ILADS doctors, so there is not any documentation that you can forward to your friend on this subject. I said that I know "of" hundreds of Lyme patients through participating in internet Lyme forums and also from attending several ILADS medical conferences where I have had the opportunity to interact personally with numerous other Lyme support leaders from around the country.I want to correct something that I stated earlier about the risk of a life-threatening Herxheimer reaction from iodine because I have had more time to reflect upon the possibility of such an occurrence. Based on what I know about the pathophysiology of chronic, late-stage Lyme disease, I do not believe that such a severe life-threatening Herx reaction is at all likely with Iodine Therapy because iodine would be weakening the spirochetes more

gradually, allowing the white blood cells to kill them more slowly. The life-threatening kind of "classical" Herxheimer reaction, first documented during the days of syphilis, can occur when a severely chronically ill Lyme patient who carries an extremely high spirochetal load is treated with intravenous cell wall inhibiting (CWI) antibiotics, thereby causing a sudden "die-off" reaction of pathogens. This sudden "die off" occurs when these slow-growing spirochetes reach a certain critical stage of their life-cycle which CWI antibiotics are designed to take advantage of, such that the CWI antibiotics kill off a very large number of these pathogens all at one time. This kind of sudden, heavy die-off of pathogens releases toxins which overwhelm the immune system, causing it to over-react because of the cytokine storm that ensues, thereby resulting in a precipitous drop in white blood cells down into the critical danger zone. Without enough

WBCs, the patient can easily succumb to an overwhelming secondary opportunistic super-infection. However, the longer I've had to consider it, I cannot imagine that this same kind of acute reaction would ever occur with Iodine Therapy.The only reason I mentioned this idea earlier at all was from an over-abundance of caution out of fear that not to point out such a rare and unlikely possibility would be irresponsible of me because I am aware that many patients in this Iodine forum are not under medical supervision. In retrospect, I regret that I might have created an unnecessary alarmist reaction. Personally, I would not hesitate to try the Iodine Protocol for Lyme with someone in my own family, first, before resorting to antibiotics. I only wish that iodine therapy had been available 10+ years ago. I say this because iodine would at least lower the patient's spirochetal load, making a subsequent life-threatening Herx reaction from

IV antibiotics unlikely if IVs were given later, subsequent to iodine therapy. Then, if there are still any lingering neurological symptoms after iodine therapy, that's when IV antibiotics might be required in order to penetrate the blood brain barrier and to kill spirochetes that are hiding out inside the cerebral spinal fluid. I don't know if iodine therapy can penetrate those body compartments or not because I'm not well enough versed in the science behind iodine therapy yet to know what iodine is capable of accomplishing. I'm still trying to plough through Dr. Abraham's research papers on the Optimox website. I do recall reading that WBCs are capable of "stealing" iodine from thyroid and of using the stolen iodine to manufacture myeloperoxidase in order to kill intracellular pathogens. That's why I think that iodine therapy might work nicely to treat late-stage chronic Lyme disease because new research on Lyme indicates that

spirochetes can hide out inside the lymph nodes where they "paralyze" the WBCs. With enough iodine on board, I would expect that these "sleeping zombie-like" WBCs might be able to eliminate these intracellular spirochetes. These ideas are all pure hypothetical speculation on my part. None of these ideas are to be found in the current medical literature on Lyme disease. They are all my own original ideas, based on what I've been reading in Dr. Abraham's research papers thus far and on how I'm interpreting this new-to-me knowledge about iodine in light of what I already know about the pathophysiology of Lyme disease.Many of the ILADS doctors are very open-minded to new ideas, especially when the science behind those ideas is as solid and sound as the science behind Iodiotherapy. I predict that it's only a matter of time before some of the ILADS doctors start to explore iodine therapy for their Lyme patients. I only wish that iodine therapy

had been available in the late 1990s when our family was so desperate for answers because we would have been the first ones in line to vounteer as human guinea pigs to try it out before resorting to antibiotics. > >> I'd also love to hear from anyone who knows about Lyme disease - can iodine or

anything else you know of help with that? That is starting to look like the culprit in the rest of my issues.> > > > Thanks, > >>

[Guest guest]

Hi ,I am using iodine, and am also using the Cowden protocol for treating Lyme now. I don't know if it's appropriate to give details on this forum since it is off topic, so, if you want you can contact me directly if you wish more detailed information.

[Guest guest]

I have Lyme disease...misdiagnosed for 35 years.....did Ritchie Shoemaker's

protocol for 9 months which helped somewhat. Now I have been diagnosed with

chronic autoimmune arthritic Lyme disease due to being undiagnosed for so long.

This disease really effected my joints. I have been taking iodine for 4 years

with 50mg for the last year, with no problems. I am sure I will be taking this

dosage of iodine for the rest of my life. I am 71 years old. V

> > >

> > I'd also love to hear from anyone who knows about Lyme disease - can iodine

or anything else you know of help with that? That is starting to look like the

culprit in the rest of my issues.

> > >

> > > Thanks,

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Kathy,

As I indicated before, based on our family's extensive experience with cases of

both acute Lyme and chronic Lyme, I would not hesitate to use the Iodine

Protocol for chronic Lyme FIRST -- before resorting to long-term, heavy-duty

antibiotics or to other so-called alternative " natural " remedies, such as

herbals, homeopathy, etc.

Iodine is cheap, and the science behind it is solid. I'm not convinced that the

herbals are any more effective than any of the antibiotics are and they add up

in expense quickly also.

However, homeopathic remedies probably do help the body to get rid of the Lyme

toxins which are responsible for most of the symptoms of late-stage chronic

Lyme. -- aka: Herxheimer reaction (HR) or " immuno-pathology " (IP) = " die-off "

symptoms from Lyme toxins.

Lyme toxins are low molecular weight, fat-soluble neuro-toxins (similar to

Clostridia toxin, according to S.T. Donta's research) which circulate via the

enterohepatic circulatory loop and which the body has great difficulty in

eliminating. That's why I'd bet on homeopathic remedies for the purpose of

eliminating these toxins which are responsible for the symptoms of late-stage,

chronic Lyme disease.

As for acute (early-stage) Lyme with a bull's-eye rash, I'd paint the rash with

iodine -- but not until AFTER the rash had first been seen by an urgent care

doctor for official diagnosis and also photographed (preferably by the doctor)

for documentation in the medical records. Then, I'd go ahead with antibiotics in

order to increase the odds that the early-stage (acute) Lyme would not advance

to late-stage, chronic Lyme. I'd probably take iodine orally also as extra

insurance. Maybe I might be gutsy enough just to take iodine alone, without the

extra insurance of antibiotics, but I rather doubt it 'cause I know first-hand

how bad late-stage, chronic Lyme can be.

Dr. Derry, MD who is another (retired) iodine advocate is the one who

suggested painting the tick bite and the rash with iodine, and that makes

perfectly good sense to me. Be sure to paint all the way out to and a little bit

past the edges of the bull's-eye rash because that's where the spirochetes

migrate and where the spirochetes can best be found if the rash is biopsied in

order to prove the diagnosis -- which isn't really necessary for diagnosis

nowadays. (Biopsies were more of a research tool during the very earliest days

of dawning awareness of Lyme disease within the medical community a couple of

decades ago.)

Otherwise, roll the dice or consult a fortune teller with a crystal ball because

NO ONE really knows the best way to treat late-stage, chronic Lyme disease. I'm

just telling you what I would do for my family if faced with the same dilemma

again today, in light of what I'm starting to learn and understand about the

solid science behind iodine therapy.

It's all a crap shoot. Choose your poison wisely. That's why I'd opt for iodine

FIRST for late-stage, chronic Lyme disease -- because iodine is not really a

poison afterall, as we've all been misled into believing for the last sixty

years. It's Mother Nature's own natural antibiotic.

PS - One of the semi-popular " fad " treatments for Lyme disease is the Vit C plus

Salt Cure. (Google it, if you're curious.) Now I realize why this popular remedy

seems to be somewhat effective -- because it's helping the body to get rid of

whatever toxic metals have been accumulated as a result of the long-standing

Lyme infection. I'm not convinced that Vit C + Salt actually " cures " the

underlying Lyme spirochetal infection any better than any of the other so-called

" natural " remedies. However, at least we now have a reasonable explanation for

why it does seem to be somewhat effective in reduction of Lyme symptomology. Go

figure....

>

> So what is the most successful treatment for Lyme Disease?  Is Iodine therapy

the best approach in your mind?

>  

> Thanks a bunch

> Kathy T.

>

[Guest guest]

, I am so grateful for your extensive experience with lyme and iodine. Sorry that you have had this hit your family so hard. Perhaps I missed it in the previous posts but just what is the "iodine protocol" you mention for treating lyme?I think using iodine on the rash is brilliant,,,,why not?! Regular drug store iodine solution? Or something stronger? Paint it until the bullseye goes away? I wonder if other bites could also benefit, even mosquitos that now supposedly are carrying all kinds of stuff!I am the one who was treated with homeopathics and so far, so good. Janet iodine From: texlyme_mom@...Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2011 14:37:36 +0000Subject: Re: - Iodine/Lyme Disease

Kathy,

As I indicated before, based on our family's extensive experience with cases of both acute Lyme and chronic Lyme, I would not hesitate to use the Iodine Protocol for chronic Lyme FIRST -- before resorting to long-term, heavy-duty antibiotics or to other so-called alternative "natural" remedies, such as herbals, homeopathy, etc.

Iodine is cheap, and the science behind it is solid. I'm not convinced that the herbals are any more effective than any of the antibiotics are and they add up in expense quickly also.

However, homeopathic remedies probably do help the body to get rid of the Lyme toxins which are responsible for most of the symptoms of late-stage chronic Lyme. -- aka: Herxheimer reaction (HR) or "immuno-pathology" (IP) = "die-off" symptoms from Lyme toxins.

Lyme toxins are low molecular weight, fat-soluble neuro-toxins (similar to Clostridia toxin, according to S.T. Donta's research) which circulate via the enterohepatic circulatory loop and which the body has great difficulty in eliminating. That's why I'd bet on homeopathic remedies for the purpose of eliminating these toxins which are responsible for the symptoms of late-stage, chronic Lyme disease.

As for acute (early-stage) Lyme with a bull's-eye rash, I'd paint the rash with iodine -- but not until AFTER the rash had first been seen by an urgent care doctor for official diagnosis and also photographed (preferably by the doctor) for documentation in the medical records. Then, I'd go ahead with antibiotics in order to increase the odds that the early-stage (acute) Lyme would not advance to late-stage, chronic Lyme. I'd probably take iodine orally also as extra insurance. Maybe I might be gutsy enough just to take iodine alone, without the extra insurance of antibiotics, but I rather doubt it 'cause I know first-hand how bad late-stage, chronic Lyme can be.

Dr. Derry, MD who is another (retired) iodine advocate is the one who suggested painting the tick bite and the rash with iodine, and that makes perfectly good sense to me. Be sure to paint all the way out to and a little bit past the edges of the bull's-eye rash because that's where the spirochetes migrate and where the spirochetes can best be found if the rash is biopsied in order to prove the diagnosis -- which isn't really necessary for diagnosis nowadays. (Biopsies were more of a research tool during the very earliest days of dawning awareness of Lyme disease within the medical community a couple of decades ago.)

Otherwise, roll the dice or consult a fortune teller with a crystal ball because NO ONE really knows the best way to treat late-stage, chronic Lyme disease. I'm just telling you what I would do for my family if faced with the same dilemma again today, in light of what I'm starting to learn and understand about the solid science behind iodine therapy.

It's all a crap shoot. Choose your poison wisely. That's why I'd opt for iodine FIRST for late-stage, chronic Lyme disease -- because iodine is not really a poison afterall, as we've all been misled into believing for the last sixty years. It's Mother Nature's own natural antibiotic.

PS - One of the semi-popular "fad" treatments for Lyme disease is the Vit C plus Salt Cure. (Google it, if you're curious.) Now I realize why this popular remedy seems to be somewhat effective -- because it's helping the body to get rid of whatever toxic metals have been accumulated as a result of the long-standing Lyme infection. I'm not convinced that Vit C + Salt actually "cures" the underlying Lyme spirochetal infection any better than any of the other so-called "natural" remedies. However, at least we now have a reasonable explanation for why it does seem to be somewhat effective in reduction of Lyme symptomology. Go figure....

>

> So what is the most successful treatment for Lyme Disease? Is Iodine therapy the best approach in your mind?

> Â

> Thanks a bunch

> Kathy T.

>

[Guest guest]

Janet,

I apologize for the confusion. " Iodine Protocol " (or " Iodine Therapy " ) means to

me exactly what we are doing here in this forum -- ie, according to the " New

Member Protocol " file. I chose that terminology because I've been in so many

different internet forums over the years, and this descriptive terminology

translates easily to these other groups.

The idea for painting the tick bite and the rash came from something I found by

Dr. Derry, probably on Shomon's About-dot-com-Thyroid website. Dr.

Derry also stated that painting with iodine would work equally well for other

tick-borne infections (Rocky Mountain Spotted Fever, Babesia, Bartonella, etc.)

or also for West Nile Virus transmitted by mosquitoes.

I'm pretty sure that Dr. Derry was talking about Lugol's solution, but I'd use

whatever I had on hand -- Provodine or Betadine or tincture of iodine, whatever

is available since you might be away from home in a rural area without

convenient access to Lugol's. Yes, I would continue to paint it until the rash

has disappeared completely, which can take a week or two. That might be

overkill, but so what? Overkill is certainly better than undertreatment when

dealing with something as bad as these insect- and arthropod-vectored diseases.

This idea about topical use of iodine reminds me that , MD has

suggested using iodine vaginally for treating uterine cysts -- and maybe uterine

fibroids, too, but I don't recall for certain about that. I'm pretty sure that

Dr. had Betadine (or Provodine) iodine in mind because those forms of

iodine would be much less irritating to sensitive vaginal tissues. Sorry, but I

don't recall the link to that article. This idea is posted in an article

somewhere on his Tahoma Clinic website, I think, but that website is somewhat

difficult to navigate, and I don't have time right now to search for it.

Dr. also has another website called Nutrition & Healing. Maybe someone

else will be curious enough to try to find his article on iodine.

>

>

> , I am so grateful for your extensive experience with lyme and

iodine. Sorry that you have had this hit your family so hard. Perhaps I missed

it in the previous posts but just what is the " iodine protocol " you mention for

treating lyme?I think using iodine on the rash is brilliant,,,,why not?!

Regular drug store iodine solution? Or something stronger? Paint it until the

bullseye goes away? I wonder if other bites could also benefit, even mosquitos

that now supposedly are carrying all kinds of stuff!I am the one who was treated

with homeopathics and so far, so good. Janet

>

[Guest guest]

Thanks for clearing this up for me . I think I'll start keeping iodine tincture in my car. I have only taken Iodoral so far. Is Lugols stronger than Provodine or Betadine?janet iodine From: texlyme_mom@...Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2011 21:53:54 +0000Subject: Re: - Iodine/Lyme Disease

Janet,

I apologize for the confusion. "Iodine Protocol" (or "Iodine Therapy") means to me exactly what we are doing here in this forum -- ie, according to the "New Member Protocol" file. I chose that terminology because I've been in so many different internet forums over the years, and this descriptive terminology translates easily to these other groups.

The idea for painting the tick bite and the rash came from something I found by Dr. Derry, probably on Shomon's About-dot-com-Thyroid website. Dr. Derry also stated that painting with iodine would work equally well for other tick-borne infections (Rocky Mountain Spotted Fever, Babesia, Bartonella, etc.) or also for West Nile Virus transmitted by mosquitoes.

I'm pretty sure that Dr. Derry was talking about Lugol's solution, but I'd use whatever I had on hand -- Provodine or Betadine or tincture of iodine, whatever is available since you might be away from home in a rural area without convenient access to Lugol's. Yes, I would continue to paint it until the rash has disappeared completely, which can take a week or two. That might be overkill, but so what? Overkill is certainly better than undertreatment when dealing with something as bad as these insect- and arthropod-vectored diseases.

This idea about topical use of iodine reminds me that , MD has suggested using iodine vaginally for treating uterine cysts -- and maybe uterine fibroids, too, but I don't recall for certain about that. I'm pretty sure that Dr. had Betadine (or Provodine) iodine in mind because those forms of iodine would be much less irritating to sensitive vaginal tissues. Sorry, but I don't recall the link to that article. This idea is posted in an article somewhere on his Tahoma Clinic website, I think, but that website is somewhat difficult to navigate, and I don't have time right now to search for it.

Dr. also has another website called Nutrition & Healing. Maybe someone else will be curious enough to try to find his article on iodine.

>

>

> , I am so grateful for your extensive experience with lyme and iodine. Sorry that you have had this hit your family so hard. Perhaps I missed it in the previous posts but just what is the "iodine protocol" you mention for treating lyme?I think using iodine on the rash is brilliant,,,,why not?! Regular drug store iodine solution? Or something stronger? Paint it until the bullseye goes away? I wonder if other bites could also benefit, even mosquitos that now supposedly are carrying all kinds of stuff!I am the one who was treated with homeopathics and so far, so good. Janet

>

[Guest guest]

Janet: in light of your questions, and just for clarification, a tincture is an

alcohol-based solution: there are iodine tinctures available, usually containing

only iodine, alcohol and a minor amount of water, and they are strong and very

drying, and NOT for internal use or application to mucus membranes. The

solution (referred to as Lugol's, for convenience) generally used internally is

a water solution of iodine and potassium iodide. You can apply it topically but

it does have a slight drying effect, and if you're applying it to mucus

membranes I strongly recommend using an oil carrier. Saturated potassium iodide

solutions (also water-based, usually with no free iodine) are suggested for

topical and internal use; I can't speak to their drying effect since I don't use

them, but I note that also suggests an oil carrier for their use on mucus

membranes. Also note that any iodine compound degrades rapidly in heat, so be

cautious about any iodine kept in a car for any length of time.

Regards, Megaera

>

> >

>

> >

>

> > , I am so grateful for your extensive experience with lyme and

iodine. Sorry that you have had this hit your family so hard. Perhaps I missed

it in the previous posts but just what is the " iodine protocol " you mention for

treating lyme?I think using iodine on the rash is brilliant,,,,why not?!

Regular drug store iodine solution? Or something stronger? Paint it until the

bullseye goes away? I wonder if other bites could also benefit, even mosquitos

that now supposedly are carrying all kinds of stuff!I am the one who was treated

with homeopathics and so far, so good. Janet

>

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Lugol's or an iodine liquid applied to any skin, not just mucous membranes, will

oxidize and

can cause irritation and a type of dermatitis/rash. As I explained yesterday,

regular topical

use should be used with an oil carrier on any skin. Occasional painting without

oil is fine.

And, how quickly someone's skin may react to the oxidation is an individual

thing-- different

people will vary in their reaction times.

--

On 3 Sep 2011 at 0:55, Megaera3 wrote:

> Janet: in light of your questions, and just for clarification, a

> tincture is an alcohol-based solution: there are iodine tinctures

> available, usually containing only iodine, alcohol and a minor amount

> of water, and they are strong and very drying, and NOT for internal

> use or application to mucus membranes. The solution (referred to as

> Lugol's, for convenience) generally used internally is a water

> solution of iodine and potassium iodide. You can apply it topically

> but it does have a slight drying effect, and if you're applying it to

> mucus membranes I strongly recommend using an oil carrier. Saturated

> potassium iodide solutions (also water-based, usually with no free

> iodine) are suggested for topical and internal use; I can't speak to

> their drying effect since I don't use them, but I note that

> also suggests an oil carrier for their use on mucus membranes. Also

> note that any iodine compound degrades rapidly in heat, so be cautious

> about any iodine kept in a car for any length of time.

>

> Regards, Megaera

>

>

> >

> >

> > Thanks for clearing this up for me . I think I'll start

> > keeping iodine tincture in my car. I have only taken Iodoral so

> > far. Is Lugols stronger than Provodine or Betadine?janet