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Re: Log reduction

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Hi Sheila,

It sounds like you need a new doctor. Your doctor should have told

you that there is a margin of error with the FISH test. Depending

on which type of probe they used, it could be as high as 7% or even

10% (with a single fusion probe). The newer double fusion probes

have a smaller false positive rate (like 2%-5%) so your 3% is very

likely a complete zero which means you are very likely in a

cytogenetic remission (they don't really use the word remission,

it's been replaced with " response " ).

The log reduction you ask about can only be determined with a PCR

test. This test will look at many, many more cells than the 20 you

would see from a bone marrow biopsy exam or the 200 you would see in

a FISH test. PCR's aren't standardized so depending on the lab, you

could be looking at 10,000 to 1 million cells. The lab will have a

formula to determine if you've had the famous 3 log reduction which

is the goal in Gleevec therapy. If you've recently been diagnosed

(within the last year or two) you should have had a PCR at diagnosis

but if not, the lab should have what they would consider the average

number on diagnosis then the reduction is calculated from there.

Basically though, each log is a 10 fold reduction in numbers (the

decimal moves one spot to the right with each log reduction.....so

if you start at 10, a one log reduction would be 1.0 then a two log

reduction would be 0.10 and the three log reduction would be 0.01).

You say your WBC and ANC are very low. How low are they? It's

perfectly normal for them to be low to a certain extent. If your

ANC is below 1 then the protocol is to stop Gleevec treatment until

the ANC bounces back up to 1. Many inexperienced doctors will panic

when the ANC drops a bit and make their patients stop Gleevec when

there really isn't any need to. If you continue to have chronically

low counts, there are options you can consider. One is to take

Neupogen which is a medication that helps boost your neutrophils so

you can stay on the Gleevec without interruption.

There is a difference between being resistant and being sensitive.

If you're resistant, it means that the Gleevec isn't working. If

you're sensitive, it means it's working fine. If your FISH was just

3%, I'd say Gleevec is working fine for you. You should have

another BMB to confirm that you're in CCR (complete cytogenetic

response) and from there, you need to have regular PCR's every 3

months.

I hope I haven't confused you. There's an FAQ and a glossary in the

files section (at the left of the homepage) that you may want to

check out. If you have any more questions, please let us know.

Take care,

Tracey

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Hi Sheila,

i too get confused with all this log reduction so im sure if you see

some of the older ones online then im sure they will explane to you

about log reduction (zavie, john, tracey or lynn.) Sounds to me

Gleevec is doing the job for you which is great but about being round

for decades. I saw Tim thursday and he mentioned to me that the

good news about gleevec that they think it will help people to be

around for 20 years...so dont stress yourself out...if you cope with

gleevec and your counts keep reducing then thats great...

Susie Leech

Dx Nov 2002

Currently off Gleevec

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