Guest guest Posted April 3, 2004 Report Share Posted April 3, 2004 Hi All, I need to know if anyone can give me 1st person info on a successful treatment of Hypertension. A lady up here has been on several meds in an effort to control it but has been unsuccessful so far. I have no more details as to meds, other stressors, etc. but she is apparently quite interested in NF. If there are specific successes, perhaps we can share them with practioners up here...! Lori/Brainworks/Alaska May training Hi I'm Pete's administrative person. One thing I'd like to start doing is contacting everyone who's coming to a workshop to check what equipment and software they are bringing and get them as prepared as possible. Hopefully this will free up more workshop time for everyone. Could you send me the participants names, emails, phone numbers if available, and any other info you have that might be useful and not too much hassle for you? Thank you! Foxx -----Original Message-----From: St. Clair, MSW [mailto:mstclair@...] Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2004 6:01 PM Subject: Re: More training available in April Pete will be in the Detroit area May 20-25th. 20th: BioExplorer 21st: 1-day Level 2 22-25: 4-day Trainer's practicum. I have room for one more guest, if needed. mstclair@... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 6, 2004 Report Share Posted April 6, 2004 Lori, In the Atlanta days, I worked with a lot of adults who had hypertension issues among their symptoms. That tended to be a fairly quick and easy thing to change (unless there were severe hydraulic considerations related to plaque in the blood vessels), since most anything you do to truly relax (not an easy thing for some of these folks to do) will have an effect. GSR training, which works directly on the autonomic nervous system, can be an easy and often effective way to demonstrate changes. Also, teaching simple breathing techniques can be of benefit (I always do a certain type of breathing once I sit in the chair by the blood pressure cuff). Pete Van DeusenBrainTrainer ()16246 SW 92nd Ave, Miami, FL 33157305/321-1595 Re: Hypertension Hi All, I need to know if anyone can give me 1st person info on a successful treatment of Hypertension. A lady up here has been on several meds in an effort to control it but has been unsuccessful so far. I have no more details as to meds, other stressors, etc. but she is apparently quite interested in NF. If there are specific successes, perhaps we can share them with practioners up here...! Lori/Brainworks/Alaska Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 18, 2004 Report Share Posted December 18, 2004 On Sunday, Dec 19, 2004, at 07:41 Asia/Tokyo, Ken Woody wrote: > However, I > was surprised that my blood pressure was elevated - 145 over 92. > That's a > first for me. > > I am not wild about starting on any meds. Any thoughts, suggestions or > supplement ideas from anyone? Get it tested again, a few times before you accept it. BP can vary greatly for small reasons. Especially if yours has always been low, to suddenly get one big jump may just mean you didn't get enough sleep last night, or that the nurse was unusually cute, or whatever. I assume you are getting regular exercise? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 18, 2004 Report Share Posted December 18, 2004 Yep, I lift weights several times a week and run 2-3 times a week. 5foot 8inches tall and 163 pounds. Fairly good diet but have to eat out for business which makes it tough. Thanks, Ken Re: Hypertension > > > On Sunday, Dec 19, 2004, at 07:41 Asia/Tokyo, Ken Woody wrote: > >> However, I >> was surprised that my blood pressure was elevated - 145 over 92. >> That's a >> first for me. >> >> I am not wild about starting on any meds. Any thoughts, suggestions or >> supplement ideas from anyone? > > Get it tested again, a few times before you accept it. BP can vary > greatly for small reasons. Especially if yours has always been low, to > suddenly get one big jump may just mean you didn't get enough sleep > last night, or that the nurse was unusually cute, or whatever. > > I assume you are getting regular exercise? > > > > > Note: This forum is for discussion of health related subjects but under no > circumstances should any information published here be considered a > substitute for personal medical advice from a qualified physician. -the > owner > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 18, 2004 Report Share Posted December 18, 2004 Hey Ken, I lifted weights fairly consistently (took off a month or so each year) for 20+ years. I assumed everything I had heard about the necessity of pumping Iron to get real gains in strength was true. About a year ago I started getting pain in my left wrist during bench presses, just a twinge at first. I thought back and related it to an old sports injury I never got looked at (just taped it up and kept going - dumb). It got steadily worse despite taking 4gms of Glucosamine daily. I started wrapping it with a boxing wrap and resigned myself to eventual decline and decrepitude of my wrist and pretty much all of my joints. By chance I came across this guy's site www.mattfurey.com , saw what an animal this guy is, read his testimonials and decided to try bodyweight exercises for awhile instead (I have a fairly extensive background in these as well from wrestling and Judo, so I didn't order any of his DVDs. I would recommend them though if you have the dough and need instruction, I'm sure they're great). Amazingly, after about 4 months of bodyweight exercises (and running) only, my wrist is almost completely healed to the point where it hardly makes any noise when I rotate it. I put my weights in storage (in case I ever need them for construction purposes, never know when you might need a few hundred pounds of Iron), and probably won't ever lift again. I'm totally sold on the strength building and recuperative powers of bodyweight exercises. Fury says you don't have to give up your weights totally if you don't want to, supplementing your bodyweight exercises with weights is OK - they help make up for the stress weights put on your body. But I don't see a reason to even bother with them at this point. JMHOP naturally... Your mileage may vary. Best regards, Dave Narby Re: Hypertension > > > On Sunday, Dec 19, 2004, at 07:41 Asia/Tokyo, Ken Woody wrote: > >> However, I >> was surprised that my blood pressure was elevated - 145 over 92. >> That's a >> first for me. >> >> I am not wild about starting on any meds. Any thoughts, suggestions or >> supplement ideas from anyone? > > Get it tested again, a few times before you accept it. BP can vary > greatly for small reasons. Especially if yours has always been low, to > suddenly get one big jump may just mean you didn't get enough sleep > last night, or that the nurse was unusually cute, or whatever. > > I assume you are getting regular exercise? > > > > > Note: This forum is for discussion of health related subjects but under no > circumstances should any information published here be considered a > substitute for personal medical advice from a qualified physician. -the > owner > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 18, 2004 Report Share Posted December 18, 2004 There is a new FDA-approved device which can be used a few times a week to lower blood pressure without the use of drugs: http://www.resperate.com/resperate/product_demo.aspx Hypertension Last week, I had my 45 year physical. No problems with the spirometer, or my VO2subMax, Stress Test or Ekg. Still waiting on the blood work. However, I was surprised that my blood pressure was elevated - 145 over 92. That's a first for me. I am not wild about starting on any meds. Any thoughts, suggestions or supplement ideas from anyone? Ken Note: This forum is for discussion of health related subjects but under no circumstances should any information published here be considered a substitute for personal medical advice from a qualified physician. -the owner Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 18, 2004 Report Share Posted December 18, 2004 About a year ago I bought all of Matt's tapes and read his book on body weight conditioning. While okay, most of it didn't impress me. I'd pass on it. Matt is much better at marketing than communicating good information. BTW, most people who lift weights, especially in positions like the bench press, angle their wrist incorrectly which can definitely lead to problems. For all presses versus gravity, the wrist should be kept in line (unbroken) with the arm as much as possible, with the knuckles facing the ceiling. MOST people allow their wrists to flex backwards, placing way too much stress on them. Push up, too, stress the wrist incorrectly if done flat handed on the ground, which is why you should buy those handles for doing push ups. They key is to always key the wrist straight in line with the arm, with the one and only exception of doing forearm curls. > > > >> However, I > >> was surprised that my blood pressure was elevated - 145 over 92. > >> That's a > >> first for me. > >> > >> I am not wild about starting on any meds. Any thoughts, suggestions or > >> supplement ideas from anyone? > > > > Get it tested again, a few times before you accept it. BP can vary > > greatly for small reasons. Especially if yours has always been low, to > > suddenly get one big jump may just mean you didn't get enough sleep > > last night, or that the nurse was unusually cute, or whatever. > > > > I assume you are getting regular exercise? > > > > > > > > > > Note: This forum is for discussion of health related subjects but under no > > circumstances should any information published here be considered a > > substitute for personal medical advice from a qualified physician. -the > > owner > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 18, 2004 Report Share Posted December 18, 2004 Take more vitamin C! http://www.lewrockwell.com/sardi/sardi29.html http://www.lewrockwell.com/sardi/sardi33.html http://www.lewrockwell.com/orig/sardi9.html I take 10 grams a day on average, mostly via an acid free vitamin C powder that I add to all of my drinking water and green tea. My blood pressure is 70/112. > Last week, I had my 45 year physical. No problems with the spirometer, or my > VO2subMax, Stress Test or Ekg. Still waiting on the blood work. However, I > was surprised that my blood pressure was elevated - 145 over 92. That's a > first for me. > > I am not wild about starting on any meds. Any thoughts, suggestions or > supplement ideas from anyone? > > Ken Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 18, 2004 Report Share Posted December 18, 2004 Thanks, I actually just started his stuff. Looks pretty good. Re: Hypertension > > > > > > > > On Sunday, Dec 19, 2004, at 07:41 Asia/Tokyo, Ken Woody wrote: > > > >> However, I > >> was surprised that my blood pressure was elevated - 145 over 92. > >> That's a > >> first for me. > >> > >> I am not wild about starting on any meds. Any thoughts, suggestions or > >> supplement ideas from anyone? > > > > Get it tested again, a few times before you accept it. BP can vary > > greatly for small reasons. Especially if yours has always been low, to > > suddenly get one big jump may just mean you didn't get enough sleep > > last night, or that the nurse was unusually cute, or whatever. > > > > I assume you are getting regular exercise? > > > > > > > > > > Note: This forum is for discussion of health related subjects but under > no > > circumstances should any information published here be considered a > > substitute for personal medical advice from a qualified physician. -the > > owner > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 18, 2004 Report Share Posted December 18, 2004 , If what your doing works for you, that's great. I didn't need his books, I knew plenty of bodyweight exercises already; but I had just given them up in because I had bought into the hype on weight training. As a result, my wrist started to hurt from a prior injury, now it's fine. Plus I'm more flexible, work the muscle groups through the full range of motion and have better " functional " strength. Plus I freed up some floor space by getting rid of my bench (and I can do my bodyweight routine anywhere). Personally, I think Matt is spot on, and he's got the body and credentials to prove it. Most people will eventually experience some injury from weight lifting. I'd rather avoid that, and wanted to provide people with an alternative if they were interested. JMHOP. Regards, Dave Narby Re: Hypertension About a year ago I bought all of Matt's tapes and read his book on body weight conditioning. While okay, most of it didn't impress me. I'd pass on it. Matt is much better at marketing than communicating good information. BTW, most people who lift weights, especially in positions like the bench press, angle their wrist incorrectly which can definitely lead to problems. For all presses versus gravity, the wrist should be kept in line (unbroken) with the arm as much as possible, with the knuckles facing the ceiling. MOST people allow their wrists to flex backwards, placing way too much stress on them. Push up, too, stress the wrist incorrectly if done flat handed on the ground, which is why you should buy those handles for doing push ups. They key is to always key the wrist straight in line with the arm, with the one and only exception of doing forearm curls. > > > >> However, I > >> was surprised that my blood pressure was elevated - 145 over 92. > >> That's a > >> first for me. > >> > >> I am not wild about starting on any meds. Any thoughts, suggestions or > >> supplement ideas from anyone? > > > > Get it tested again, a few times before you accept it. BP can vary > > greatly for small reasons. Especially if yours has always been low, to > > suddenly get one big jump may just mean you didn't get enough sleep > > last night, or that the nurse was unusually cute, or whatever. > > > > I assume you are getting regular exercise? > > > > > > > > > > Note: This forum is for discussion of health related subjects but under no > > circumstances should any information published here be considered a > > substitute for personal medical advice from a qualified physician. -the > > owner > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 18, 2004 Report Share Posted December 18, 2004 Hi Loren, Practicing circular breathing (AKA Yoga breathing, meditative breathing, etc.) will do the same thing, no gadgets required. CV (especially running hills, hill sprints are even better) combined with circular breathing should bring your BP way down. Best, Dave Hypertension Last week, I had my 45 year physical. No problems with the spirometer, or my VO2subMax, Stress Test or Ekg. Still waiting on the blood work. However, I was surprised that my blood pressure was elevated - 145 over 92. That's a first for me. I am not wild about starting on any meds. Any thoughts, suggestions or supplement ideas from anyone? Ken Note: This forum is for discussion of health related subjects but under no circumstances should any information published here be considered a substitute for personal medical advice from a qualified physician. -the owner Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 18, 2004 Report Share Posted December 18, 2004 Hi Loren, Practicing circular breathing (AKA Yoga breathing, meditative breathing, etc.) will do the same thing, no gadgets required. CV (especially running hills, hill sprints are even better) combined with circular breathing should bring your BP way down. Best, Dave Hypertension Last week, I had my 45 year physical. No problems with the spirometer, or my VO2subMax, Stress Test or Ekg. Still waiting on the blood work. However, I was surprised that my blood pressure was elevated - 145 over 92. That's a first for me. I am not wild about starting on any meds. Any thoughts, suggestions or supplement ideas from anyone? Ken Note: This forum is for discussion of health related subjects but under no circumstances should any information published here be considered a substitute for personal medical advice from a qualified physician. -the owner Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 19, 2004 Report Share Posted December 19, 2004 Dave, the problem with body weight exercises is that you will stop improving because you reach a point where you cannot trigger new muscle growth due to the adaptive response of your body. In other words, you need to constantly challenge your body in order to stimulate a level of stress that causes muscles growth. This is called the progressive theory of muscle growth and is the most respected theory of body & strength building. Take squats for an example: I've seen Matt's tapes and his book, and his squats are fine for newbies, but I can do literally hundreds of his body weight squats because they do not tax my muscles (at 5'7 " I weigh 170, 8% bodyfat, extremely fit). At the gym, I can squat 340 for 8 reps, twice my body weight. A year ago I was squatting 280. I could not have had this improvement through Matt's system. Instead, doing Matt's squats (a sort of sumo-style, btw) are some aerobic in nature because you do so many -- he recommends getting up to 100 per day! This becomes catabolic (degrading) to the muscles! Basically, Matt's system works fine for beginners and non-athletes who have a LOT of room for improvement. But you'll never see pro sports athletes taking up his system because it's ineffective at getting a person to their true potential. > > > > > >> However, I > > >> was surprised that my blood pressure was elevated - 145 over > 92. > > >> That's a > > >> first for me. > > >> > > >> I am not wild about starting on any meds. Any thoughts, > suggestions or > > >> supplement ideas from anyone? > > > > > > Get it tested again, a few times before you accept it. BP can > vary > > > greatly for small reasons. Especially if yours has always been > low, to > > > suddenly get one big jump may just mean you didn't get enough > sleep > > > last night, or that the nurse was unusually cute, or whatever. > > > > > > I assume you are getting regular exercise? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Note: This forum is for discussion of health related subjects > but under no > > > circumstances should any information published here be > considered a > > > substitute for personal medical advice from a qualified > physician. -the > > > owner > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 19, 2004 Report Share Posted December 19, 2004 Dave, the problem with body weight exercises is that you will stop improving because you reach a point where you cannot trigger new muscle growth due to the adaptive response of your body. In other words, you need to constantly challenge your body in order to stimulate a level of stress that causes muscles growth. This is called the progressive theory of muscle growth and is the most respected theory of body & strength building. Take squats for an example: I've seen Matt's tapes and his book, and his squats are fine for newbies, but I can do literally hundreds of his body weight squats because they do not tax my muscles (at 5'7 " I weigh 170, 8% bodyfat, extremely fit). At the gym, I can squat 340 for 8 reps, twice my body weight. A year ago I was squatting 280. I could not have had this improvement through Matt's system. Instead, doing Matt's squats (a sort of sumo-style, btw) are some aerobic in nature because you do so many -- he recommends getting up to 100 per day! This becomes catabolic (degrading) to the muscles! Basically, Matt's system works fine for beginners and non-athletes who have a LOT of room for improvement. But you'll never see pro sports athletes taking up his system because it's ineffective at getting a person to their true potential. > > > > > >> However, I > > >> was surprised that my blood pressure was elevated - 145 over > 92. > > >> That's a > > >> first for me. > > >> > > >> I am not wild about starting on any meds. Any thoughts, > suggestions or > > >> supplement ideas from anyone? > > > > > > Get it tested again, a few times before you accept it. BP can > vary > > > greatly for small reasons. Especially if yours has always been > low, to > > > suddenly get one big jump may just mean you didn't get enough > sleep > > > last night, or that the nurse was unusually cute, or whatever. > > > > > > I assume you are getting regular exercise? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Note: This forum is for discussion of health related subjects > but under no > > > circumstances should any information published here be > considered a > > > substitute for personal medical advice from a qualified > physician. -the > > > owner > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 19, 2004 Report Share Posted December 19, 2004 Hi , Very impressive. However, I'm curious: Since you were so kind as to share your weight lifting squat prowess and the improvements you've seen from pumping iron - At this particular moment in time... How many one legged squats can you do? I'm talking full-extension, ankle-to-ass to up-on-your- toes, no-help-with-balancing squats. Just curious. Because It sounds to me (considering what you've shared with us) that a robust guy like you (able to squat 2x his bodyweight 8 times and do " hundreds " of 2 legged bodyweight squats without it " taxing " him much) ought to be able to do at least, well.. 100 such squats! Each leg! And while we're examining your physical prowess, just how many full extension overhand pull-ups, handstand push-ups, one armed Hindu push-ups, and 100 yard hill sprints can you do? I humbly suggest that you try those, I am sure you will find they " tax your muscles " sufficiently. When you get so you can consecutively perform 100 one-legged squats (free standing, to the ankle), 25 full-extension over hand pull-ups, 30 hand stand push-ups to your forehead (I'll allow a wall to help balance on this one. Alternately if you can do 15 without the wall, that's fine too), 25 one-arm Hindu push-ups (with good form) and thirty 100 yard hill sprints (no walking in between - jog back to the start point), please get back to me... Because I'll really want to see what someone who can execute those with proper form looks like. I guarantee anyone who can do the above will be an astonishingly impressive physical specimen. I doubt there are hardly any " professional athletes " who lift weights for strength training that can pull this off. But I'll bet there's a martial artists or gymnasts who can. Myself, I'd rather look like a martial artist or a gymnast than an Iron pumping football player, and I'd SURE AS HELL rather be flexible like a martial artist or a gymnast. As I recall, the champion boxer Ken Norton never lifted a weight. If I ever manage to look like that at my age, I'll be happy as hell. And BTW, Matt is certainly a " pro " athlete. I certainly wouldn't want to wrestle him in a competition, and I know a thing or two about legit wrestling. That guy is an animal. One look at his body should tell anyone with half a brain that you certainly don't need weights to get strong. I personally have absolutely no interest whatsoever in bragging about my squat or bench (not that I ever did. I was more interested in winning wrestling tournaments). Today at 37 years old I'm more interested in keeping up with the 16-19 year old crowd in the wrestling room. So far so good - and my wrist doesn't hurt like it did when I pumped iron. In fact, it doesn't even snap, crackle and pop anymore. Regards, Dave Narby PS You must have skipped over the part in his books/tapes about one-legged squats because they certainly are not " Sumo-style " . Re: Hypertension Dave, the problem with body weight exercises is that you will stop improving because you reach a point where you cannot trigger new muscle growth due to the adaptive response of your body. In other words, you need to constantly challenge your body in order to stimulate a level of stress that causes muscles growth. This is called the progressive theory of muscle growth and is the most respected theory of body & strength building. Take squats for an example: I've seen Matt's tapes and his book, and his squats are fine for newbies, but I can do literally hundreds of his body weight squats because they do not tax my muscles (at 5'7 " I weigh 170, 8% bodyfat, extremely fit). At the gym, I can squat 340 for 8 reps, twice my body weight. A year ago I was squatting 280. I could not have had this improvement through Matt's system. Instead, doing Matt's squats (a sort of sumo-style, btw) are some aerobic in nature because you do so many -- he recommends getting up to 100 per day! This becomes catabolic (degrading) to the muscles! Basically, Matt's system works fine for beginners and non-athletes who have a LOT of room for improvement. But you'll never see pro sports athletes taking up his system because it's ineffective at getting a person to their true potential. > > > > > >> However, I > > >> was surprised that my blood pressure was elevated - 145 over > 92. > > >> That's a > > >> first for me. > > >> > > >> I am not wild about starting on any meds. Any thoughts, > suggestions or > > >> supplement ideas from anyone? > > > > > > Get it tested again, a few times before you accept it. BP can > vary > > > greatly for small reasons. Especially if yours has always been > low, to > > > suddenly get one big jump may just mean you didn't get enough > sleep > > > last night, or that the nurse was unusually cute, or whatever. > > > > > > I assume you are getting regular exercise? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Note: This forum is for discussion of health related subjects > but under no > > > circumstances should any information published here be > considered a > > > substitute for personal medical advice from a qualified > physician. -the > > > owner > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 19, 2004 Report Share Posted December 19, 2004 Dave, don't get me wrong, you can see plenty of results from body weight exercises, but at a point you'll see diminishing returns and you'll need to use extra weight. In effect, lifting free weights (not machines, though), is very similar to bodyweight movements like Matt teaches, but using extra weight for extra resistance beyond what body weight alone can provide. BTW, I'm a STRONG proponent of resistance movements in which the torso moves through space, as research has shown that these trigger the greatest neurological response because your body needs to stabilize itself (a reason machines produce lesser results). In effect, the more fear you have of doing a movement, the better the result, and full body movements are the scariest, such as weighted push-ups (rather than bench presses), chin-ups (various wide, narrow, palm up, palm down grips), dead-lifts, squats, standing calf raises, dips, and so on. These are the movements the best replicate real life evolutionary reasons for having muscles, and produce a body wide, systemic growth effect. (In other words, dead lifts will increase biceps, even though the biceps are not involved in the movement.) I've done one arm push-ups, and can get around 20. I haven't done one legged squats though I imagine they'd work very well as they'd involve core muscles and your body weight would be sufficient to induce growth. They key is to have enough resistance such that you reach fatigue before 15 reps. If your body weight alone cannot do this for a movement, then you need to add weight -- it's as simple as that. FYI, I'm a still practicing martial artists with black belts in two separate styles. I got into martial arts in the early 70's (after seeing Enter the Dragon), and have practiced over 7-8 styles. I, too, much prefer to have a lean, muscular, Bruce Lee-like physique. Bruce Lee's muscle mass versus his body weight was perhaps the best the world has ever seen, and he could to one finger push-ups. But this was mostly because he only weighed 135-ish. Being *that* lean has its advantages, as his bodyfat was probably close to 3%. > > > > > > > >> However, I > > > >> was surprised that my blood pressure was elevated - 145 > over > > 92. > > > >> That's a > > > >> first for me. > > > >> > > > >> I am not wild about starting on any meds. Any thoughts, > > suggestions or > > > >> supplement ideas from anyone? > > > > > > > > Get it tested again, a few times before you accept it. BP > can > > vary > > > > greatly for small reasons. Especially if yours has always > been > > low, to > > > > suddenly get one big jump may just mean you didn't get > enough > > sleep > > > > last night, or that the nurse was unusually cute, or > whatever. > > > > > > > > I assume you are getting regular exercise? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Note: This forum is for discussion of health related > subjects > > but under no > > > > circumstances should any information published here be > > considered a > > > > substitute for personal medical advice from a qualified > > physician. -the > > > > owner > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 19, 2004 Report Share Posted December 19, 2004 Dave, don't get me wrong, you can see plenty of results from body weight exercises, but at a point you'll see diminishing returns and you'll need to use extra weight. In effect, lifting free weights (not machines, though), is very similar to bodyweight movements like Matt teaches, but using extra weight for extra resistance beyond what body weight alone can provide. BTW, I'm a STRONG proponent of resistance movements in which the torso moves through space, as research has shown that these trigger the greatest neurological response because your body needs to stabilize itself (a reason machines produce lesser results). In effect, the more fear you have of doing a movement, the better the result, and full body movements are the scariest, such as weighted push-ups (rather than bench presses), chin-ups (various wide, narrow, palm up, palm down grips), dead-lifts, squats, standing calf raises, dips, and so on. These are the movements the best replicate real life evolutionary reasons for having muscles, and produce a body wide, systemic growth effect. (In other words, dead lifts will increase biceps, even though the biceps are not involved in the movement.) I've done one arm push-ups, and can get around 20. I haven't done one legged squats though I imagine they'd work very well as they'd involve core muscles and your body weight would be sufficient to induce growth. They key is to have enough resistance such that you reach fatigue before 15 reps. If your body weight alone cannot do this for a movement, then you need to add weight -- it's as simple as that. FYI, I'm a still practicing martial artists with black belts in two separate styles. I got into martial arts in the early 70's (after seeing Enter the Dragon), and have practiced over 7-8 styles. I, too, much prefer to have a lean, muscular, Bruce Lee-like physique. Bruce Lee's muscle mass versus his body weight was perhaps the best the world has ever seen, and he could to one finger push-ups. But this was mostly because he only weighed 135-ish. Being *that* lean has its advantages, as his bodyfat was probably close to 3%. > > > > > > > >> However, I > > > >> was surprised that my blood pressure was elevated - 145 > over > > 92. > > > >> That's a > > > >> first for me. > > > >> > > > >> I am not wild about starting on any meds. Any thoughts, > > suggestions or > > > >> supplement ideas from anyone? > > > > > > > > Get it tested again, a few times before you accept it. BP > can > > vary > > > > greatly for small reasons. Especially if yours has always > been > > low, to > > > > suddenly get one big jump may just mean you didn't get > enough > > sleep > > > > last night, or that the nurse was unusually cute, or > whatever. > > > > > > > > I assume you are getting regular exercise? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Note: This forum is for discussion of health related > subjects > > but under no > > > > circumstances should any information published here be > > considered a > > > > substitute for personal medical advice from a qualified > > physician. -the > > > > owner > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 19, 2004 Report Share Posted December 19, 2004 , OK, I have a better idea where you're coming from. My only issue is that you (and perhaps I) are in the top 3% or so of people with regards to conditioning, and because of that we need to be careful when offering any advice on exercise. I'm not worried about you hurting yourself lifting weights, I'm worried about people who may be starting an exercise program, or those considering adding weight training. It's kind of a sensitive issue with me because a close friend of mine ruptured a disk in his neck doing an incline bench with poor form, damn near paralyzed him. My brothers were attending a weight lifting demonstration and got to see a steroid monster break his wrist attempting to go for his " personal best " on the bench (almost broke his damn neck, fortunately for him the spotters got it off of him). As I mentioned already, I myself had a 20 year old injury resurface. This was after changing my weight program (I started doing more weight with less reps with more sets vs. less weights, more reps). IMHOP, weight training done improperly is dangerous. For the purposes of competitive athletes, weights are fine. Chances are you have a coach who can watch your form, you'll have a spotter who can get you out of a jam, and you've studied and continue to read up on proper technique. The vast majority of competitive athletes also do bodyweight exercises, which decrease your chances of injury by increasing core strength, ancillary muscle groups and flexibility. Matt Furey also doesn't say " don't lift weights " - but he recommends bodyweight exercises in addition to them, if you're already weight training. In fact, for the average citizen, dumbbell exercises are probably fine (shoulder flys, pec flys, curls etc.) as you're much less likely to injure yourself (with the caveat of no triceps extensions - at least with any serious weight, it's too easy to injure an elbow). I throw in a set of shoulder flys occasionally as I find it's hard to really hit the deltoids just doing back bridge push-ups and handstand push-ups. However IMHOP, benches and squats shouldn't be done with anything remotely close to your bodyweight unless you really know WTF you're doing. But for purposes of enjoying functional strength throughout your lifespan, and *increasing* lifespan... For the general public I would recommend bodyweight exercises first. They not only increase strength, but flexibility, co-ordination, core strength, but if done with high reps, have CV benefits. So anyway, sorry I got on my high-horse with you, I hope you have a better idea of where I'm coming from as well - and that this little " spirited debate " helped someone to make good choices when considering an exercise program. Now if I could just get my little brothers to try and let me teach them a few throws when I go to the wrestling room. Little b*st*rds seem more interested in trying to tear my head off than learn something. Darn whipper-snappers... Best regards, Dave Narby PS Seriously, if you want a challenge, try some one-arm Hindu push-ups. First time I tried them it was like I gave myself a chiropractic adjustment. Think I gained about 1/4 " height afterwards... Re: Hypertension Dave, don't get me wrong, you can see plenty of results from body weight exercises, but at a point you'll see diminishing returns and you'll need to use extra weight. In effect, lifting free weights (not machines, though), is very similar to bodyweight movements like Matt teaches, but using extra weight for extra resistance beyond what body weight alone can provide. BTW, I'm a STRONG proponent of resistance movements in which the torso moves through space, as research has shown that these trigger the greatest neurological response because your body needs to stabilize itself (a reason machines produce lesser results). In effect, the more fear you have of doing a movement, the better the result, and full body movements are the scariest, such as weighted push-ups (rather than bench presses), chin-ups (various wide, narrow, palm up, palm down grips), dead-lifts, squats, standing calf raises, dips, and so on. These are the movements the best replicate real life evolutionary reasons for having muscles, and produce a body wide, systemic growth effect. (In other words, dead lifts will increase biceps, even though the biceps are not involved in the movement.) I've done one arm push-ups, and can get around 20. I haven't done one legged squats though I imagine they'd work very well as they'd involve core muscles and your body weight would be sufficient to induce growth. They key is to have enough resistance such that you reach fatigue before 15 reps. If your body weight alone cannot do this for a movement, then you need to add weight -- it's as simple as that. FYI, I'm a still practicing martial artists with black belts in two separate styles. I got into martial arts in the early 70's (after seeing Enter the Dragon), and have practiced over 7-8 styles. I, too, much prefer to have a lean, muscular, Bruce Lee-like physique. Bruce Lee's muscle mass versus his body weight was perhaps the best the world has ever seen, and he could to one finger push-ups. But this was mostly because he only weighed 135-ish. Being *that* lean has its advantages, as his bodyfat was probably close to 3%. > > > > > > > >> However, I > > > >> was surprised that my blood pressure was elevated - 145 > over > > 92. > > > >> That's a > > > >> first for me. > > > >> > > > >> I am not wild about starting on any meds. Any thoughts, > > suggestions or > > > >> supplement ideas from anyone? > > > > > > > > Get it tested again, a few times before you accept it. BP > can > > vary > > > > greatly for small reasons. Especially if yours has always > been > > low, to > > > > suddenly get one big jump may just mean you didn't get > enough > > sleep > > > > last night, or that the nurse was unusually cute, or > whatever. > > > > > > > > I assume you are getting regular exercise? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Note: This forum is for discussion of health related > subjects > > but under no > > > > circumstances should any information published here be > > considered a > > > > substitute for personal medical advice from a qualified > > physician. -the > > > > owner > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 11, 2007 Report Share Posted January 11, 2007 Hi, Recently I was diagnosed with High Blood pressure and the Doc put me on meads for it. I am 50 now. Still haven't gotten my revision surgery. I was wondering how many others out their might have high blood pressure as well as flatback syndrome to deal with.? Could their be any correlation between hypertension and flatback syndrome.? Just wondering? Maybe due to the chronic pain and decreased activity. Just wondering? Carol PS, Also I was just put on Lipitor for high cholesterol too. I am so sick of all the pills I have to take. But I know I have to control the blood pressure as my first priority. Whoever thought that my blood pressure meds would take first priority over the pain meds.? As if we don't have enough to deal with.! This road just keeps getting harder.! I never thought I would have to worry about my heart.! It was always my back. I just wonder if their might be a connection somewhere, or might it just simply be because of heredity and age???__,_.Hi,H Recently I was diagnosed with High bloo_,___ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 12, 2007 Report Share Posted January 12, 2007 Hi Carol, Am sorry to hear of your two new diagnoses. I am 47, have flatback, but no revision surgery yet. I don't have high blood pressure, but about a year ago a test showed my cholesterol is a little high. I was surprised about that. I examined my diet and found that I eat more than the recommended amount of fat in a day. If you haven't already done so, it would probably be good to examine your diet and see if it needs adjusting. I, too, wonder if I'll be able to stay generally healthy, given that the exercising I can do is limited because of my back and other orthopedic/neurologic problems. Plus both my parents have high blood pressure. This getting old stuff is not easy!! I don't like having to take a lot of pills, either, but I guess if they keep me from having a heart attack or stroke (my dad recently had a mini stroke, which scared the heck out of me), I'll go along with doing so. loriann > > Hi, > Recently I was diagnosed with High Blood pressure and the Doc put me on > meads for it. I am 50 now. Still haven't gotten my revision surgery. I > was wondering how many others out their might have high blood pressure as > well as flatback syndrome to deal with.? > Could their be any correlation between hypertension and flatback > syndrome.? Just wondering? Maybe due to the chronic pain and decreased > activity. Just wondering? > Carol > > PS, Also I was just put on Lipitor for high cholesterol too. > I am so sick of all the pills I have to take. But I know I have to > control the blood pressure as my first priority. Whoever thought that my > blood pressure meds would take first priority over the pain meds.? As if > we don't have enough to deal with.! This road just keeps getting harder.! > I never thought I would have to worry about my heart.! It was always my > back. I just wonder if their might be a connection somewhere, or might it > just simply be because of heredity and age??? > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 12, 2007 Report Share Posted January 12, 2007 Hi Carol,Am sorry to hear of your two new diagnoses. I am 47, have flatback, but no revision surgery yet. I don't havehigh blood pressure, but about a year ago a test showed my cholesterolis a little high. I was surprised about that. I examined my diet andfound that I eat more than the recommended amount of fat in a day. Ifyou haven't already done so, it would probably be good to examine yourdiet and see if it needs adjusting. I, too, wonder if I'll be able tostay generally healthy, given that the exercising I can do is limitedbecause of my back and other orthopedic/neurologic problems. Plusboth my parents have high blood pressure. This getting old stuff isnot easy!! I don't like having to take a lot of pills, either, but Iguess if they keep me from having a heart attack or stroke (my dadrecently had a mini stroke, which scared the heck out of me), I'll goalong with doing so.loriann >> Hi,> Recently I was diagnosed with High Blood pressure and the Doc put me on> meads for it. I am 50 now. Still haven't gotten my revision surgery. I> was wondering how many others out their might have high bloodpressure as> well as flatback syndrome to deal with.?> Could their be any correlation between hypertension and flatback> syndrome.? Just wondering? Maybe due to the chronic pain and decreased> activity. Just wondering?> Carol> > PS, Also I was just put on Lipitor for high cholesterol too. > I am so sick of all the pills I have to take. But I know I have to> control the blood pressure as my first priority. Whoever thought that my> blood pressure meds would take first priority over the pain meds.? As if> we don't have enough to deal with.! This road just keeps gettingharder.!> I never thought I would have to worry about my heart.! It was always my> back. I just wonder if their might be a connection somewhere, ormight it> just simply be because of heredity and age???> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 12, 2007 Report Share Posted January 12, 2007 Jane, You bring up a good point about muscle pain associated with statins. That is a known side effect of the drug, but, I believe it's fairly rare. I don't know that the other problems mentioned on the spacedoc link you provided have been officially studied or accepted. Unfortunately all drugs have side effects, and the benefits have to be weighed against the risks. Personally I think all drugs should be studied more than they are, so that it would be clearer if there are certain groups of people more at risk for the side effects. loriann > > You might want to check out the Lipitor - it can have pretty nasty side- > effects. My mom and one of my co-workers had to stop because of muscle > problems. You might want to check out this website - > http://www.spacedoc.net/ - for more information. Obviously - talk to > your doctor etc. about it (although they usually say that any problems > you are having aren't d/t the meds). Its really important for you to > know b/c if you get some of these side-effects, you might thinks its > related to your back when it really isn't. > > Jane > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 12, 2007 Report Share Posted January 12, 2007 I would definitely check out the Lipitor. The doctor will probably say the side effects are rare, but I'm beginning to think that they are very common. My husband was on another statin drug for several years, and it wasn't lowering his cholesterol as much as the doctor wanted , so he put him on Lipitor. Then after awhile (I can't remember how soon0 he started complaining about pain. I told him that it was probably the Lipitor. After awhile, he finally believed me and decided--on his own-- to go off of it. He noticed results within a week...less pain. Now even though his cholesterol is over 300, he refuses to go back on it. I just know that I WILL NEVER EVER go on Statin drugs. We believe that the drugs will kill you faster than the high cholesterol will. Most doctors prescribe it for people with cholesterol below 230 or 220 and that, to me, is just overkill and totally ridiculous. My husband is on Niacin now, and it has lowered it a little, but only down to around 280-290. Yes, he needs to lose weight, and probably if he did that, it would help, but you can't force people to lose weight. I just know that I will not go on those. I will have to figure out my diet or something if my cholesterol goes up. The last time I had it checked it was 220 or so, and the doctor didn't recommend anything, thank God. Carol V (CA) > > You might want to check out the Lipitor - it can have pretty nasty side- > effects. My mom and one of my co-workers had to stop because of muscle > problems. You might want to check out this website - > http://www.spacedoc.net/ - for more information. Obviously - talk to > your doctor etc. about it (although they usually say that any problems > you are having aren't d/t the meds). Its really important for you to > know b/c if you get some of these side-effects, you might thinks its > related to your back when it really isn't. > > Jane > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 12, 2007 Report Share Posted January 12, 2007 Hi Carol, I saw your post about blood pressure and cholesterol meds and wanted to say I can relate! I'm 51 and I've been on both kinds of meds for about three years. Thankfully, they work, and my pressure and 'bad' cholesterol are now within normal limits. I had no problem adjusting to Lipitor, but I had to try 3 or 4 different meds for high blood pressure before finding one I could tolerate with no side effects. There are tons of options so if you don't do well on one, switch to another. I've never been a big meat eater so I don't think my diet caused the high cholesterol. I think I inherited it from my parents, both of whom were on Lipitor. As for high blood pressure, it's possible that chronic, intermittent pain and the stress that it brings on might be a factor, but there is also some evidence that scoliosis can result in heart and lung problems. Here is some info from the new on-line scoliosis journal, Scoliosis: Scoliosis is associated with increased pain in adults of all ages, compared with control populations [6,7]. Furthermore, children and adults with mild to moderate curvatures may have reduced vital capacity and exercise capacity [8-12], and young adults with moderate scoliosis exhibit measurable changes in cardiac function [13]. Recent surveys of the general population have revealed that deficits in respiratory function characteristic of scoliosis patients (<85% predicted for age, height, and gender) are strong predictors of cardiopulmonary disease and increased mortality [14-16]. Reduced respiratory function and increased pain may underlie the observation that scoliosis patients exhibit significantly impaired quality of life [17]. http://www.pubmedcentral.nih.gov/articlerender.fcgi?artid=1459275 I know it's a pain in the neck to have to take all these meds, but I'm extremely grateful that biotech and pharmaceutical companies created them. I also have a thyroid problem and have to take synthetic thyroid hormone - if that hadn't been invented I would be 'six feet under.' So hooray for science! It's not perfect but it helps! Best Wishes, Andy (moving to Boulder on 2/16!!) Hi, Recently I was diagnosed with High Blood pressure and the Doc put me on meds for it. I am 50 now. Still haven't gotten my revision surgery. I was wondering how many others out their might have high blood pressure as well as flatback syndrome to deal with? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 12, 2007 Report Share Posted January 12, 2007 I don't know if there's anyone out there like me, but one year after my Harrington surgery in 1967 I was found to have very high blood pressure (at age 14!) and turns out it was due to hypertrophic renal arteries. I ended up having both of my renal arteries replaced with Dacron prostheses and haven't had any problems since. In researching scoliosis I have discovered that kidney problems are common in scoli patients, although I don't think they know why. Just in the genes, I guess!! Kathy W. > Hi, > Recently I was diagnosed with High Blood pressure and the Doc put me > on meds for it. I am 50 now. Still haven't gotten my revision surgery. > I was wondering how many others out their might have high blood > pressure as well as flatback syndrome to deal with? > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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