irrigation

[Guest guest]

> From: " sweatherston " <sweatherston@...>

> Subject: irrigation

>

> Thanks for that - I already use a saline solution as recommended by

> my ENT consultant on a very regular basis but maybe I am not using the

> right stuff - I use salt and baking soda - do you use something else

> cos that could be helpful?

I don't even bother with the baking soda. Just 1 tsp. salt in 2 cups of

warm water.

> Gutted that I didn't qualify for even runner up for newcomer 2005

> although I did actually spend weeks trawling through this site but if

> you hold the key to nasal irriation that would be a good substitute!!!

> I get the impression that most of you live in USA - I live in Scotland

> where we have to do all this on the NHS and trust me, it is seen as

> very low priority.My own GP told me that ENT aren't interested in

> polyps so I figured I need to do my own research.

I'm in Toronto Canada, and my observation is that ENTs are interested in

polyps only because they make money by cutting them out.

Otherwise, the medical community that I have contact with either:

- doesn't know about Samters, or

- just pretends to know about Samters, ie., they fake it, or

- they know a bit but don't go out of their way to give useful advice.

Most of the useful advice about Samters that I have learned, has come from

this group.

--

Ken West

Check the library . . .

samters/links

[Guest guest]

On 12/18/05 3:57 PM, " Ken West " <kenwest@...> wrote:

>> From: " sweatherston " <sweatherston@...>

>> Subject: irrigation

>>

>> Thanks for that - I already use a saline solution as recommended by

>> my ENT consultant on a very regular basis but maybe I am not using the

>> right stuff - I use salt and baking soda - do you use something else

>> cos that could be helpful?

>

> I don't even bother with the baking soda. Just 1 tsp. salt in 2 cups of

> warm water.

>

I moved form NM to MD. In NM I didn't use the baking soda, but here the

water has a lower ph and is softer. It was painful at first until I added

the baking soda.

Pam

[Guest guest]

Pam I think the best irrigation stuff out there is the Breathe Ease XL Nasal

Mositurizing Solution Carol

irrigation

>>>

>>> Thanks for that - I already use a saline solution as recommended by

>>> my ENT consultant on a very regular basis but maybe I am not using the

>>> right stuff - I use salt and baking soda - do you use something else

>>> cos that could be helpful?

>>

>> I don't even bother with the baking soda. Just 1 tsp. salt in 2 cups of

>> warm water.

>>

> I moved form NM to MD. In NM I didn't use the baking soda, but here the

> water has a lower ph and is softer. It was painful at first until I added

> the baking soda.

> Pam

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Ok, I agree boiling water sterilizes it

but boiling it will not help the salt to dissolve unless you are adding the

salt while the water is hot. Salt will dissolve faster in hot water than

in cold water but it will still dissolve. I’m curious as to why sea

salt would be better than earth salt as they are both sodium chloride and

therefore the same chemical. However, I do know that some salts can

contain other metal chlorides and maybe those are what make some salts better

or worse, esp. from a taste/cooking point of view. But if it is sodium

chloride, it really shouldn’t matter where it comes from…

K.

Irrigation

My doc told me

that the water should be boiled to sterilize it and help the salt

dissolve. He also told me to use sea salt rather than earth salt.

Sea salt will provide a solution more similar to our body fluids (approximately

a Ringers solution). He also advised that iodized salts might irritate

nasal tissues.

http://personal.ecu.edu/wuenschk/Nasal-Irrigation.htm

Karl W.

my Samter's

I do have one question about

irrigation solution: I have read you should either use distilled water or

boiled water and not tap water? Why? And does it really

matter? I make my irrigant with 1 teaspoon non-iodized salt and I

teaspoon baking soda in 16 oz warm tap water (we have a well which is filtered

and goes through a water softener).

Thanks!!!

K.

[Guest guest]

,

I should probably let Karl answer, since his site (prev. message) is a great

source. Karl refers

to the Ringer solution

(http://www.whonamedit.com/synd.cfm/2119.html) being superior to a normal NaCl

solution for

protecting the cilia. Table salt is virtually pure NaCl whereas sea salt still

has some of the

other salts including KCl and CaCl. Ringers solution is an attempt to duplicate

the human body's

chemistry.

I tried to find CaCl locally and couldn't, so I just got sea salt. Of course all

salt originally

came from the sea, but table salt has been purified. Concerning distilled water

- I get it because

I feel that it is more likely to be sanitary, as opposed to bottled " drinking "

water. I have a

Reverse Osmosis unit on my kitchen sink (our tap water is really bad here), so I

could probably

use that.

I guess I got a little paranoid about bacteria when an ENT I went to told me

that she didn't favor

irrigation because of infections.

Jim

--- Keefer <jkeefer@...> wrote:

> Ok, I agree boiling water sterilizes it but boiling it will not help the

> salt to dissolve unless you are adding the salt while the water is hot.

> Salt will dissolve faster in hot water than in cold water but it will

> still dissolve. I'm curious as to why sea salt would be better than

> earth salt as they are both sodium chloride and therefore the same

> chemical. However, I do know that some salts can contain other metal

> chlorides and maybe those are what make some salts better or worse, esp.

> from a taste/cooking point of view. But if it is sodium chloride, it

> really shouldn't matter where it comes from.

>

>

>

> K.

>

>

>

> Irrigation

>

>

>

> My doc told me that the water should be boiled to sterilize it and

> help the salt dissolve. He also told me to use sea salt rather than

> earth salt. Sea salt will provide a solution more similar to our body

> fluids (approximately a Ringers solution). He also advised that iodized

> salts might irritate nasal tissues.

>

>

>

> http://personal.ecu.edu/wuenschk/Nasal-Irrigation.htm

>

>

>

> Karl W.

>

> my Samter's

>

>

>

> I do have one question about irrigation solution: I have read you should

> either use distilled water or boiled water and not tap water? Why? And

> does it really matter? I make my irrigant with 1 teaspoon non-iodized

> salt and I teaspoon baking soda in 16 oz warm tap water (we have a well

> which is filtered and goes through a water softener).

>

>

>

> Thanks!!!

>

> K.

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Most docs/ ent doc recommend the sea salt because it is non iodinized vs table salt Carol

my Samter's

I do have one question about irrigation solution: I have read you should either use distilled water or boiled water and not tap water? Why? And does it really matter? I make my irrigant with 1 teaspoon non-iodized salt and I teaspoon baking soda in 16 oz warm tap water (we have a well which is filtered and goes through a water softener).

Thanks!!!

K.

[Guest guest]

Moved into a new house with an H.R.V.and Hepa filtration connected to

furnace. The humidity seems low but I have not measured with a

hydrometer.Also had a FLU shot near the same time AND 1 WEEK LATER

PNEUMONIA VACCINE.After the shot breathing seemed more difficult and

my sinuses would get plugged with dry sticky mucous(Frontals I

believe)especially while sleeping. The difficulty breathing I think is

caused by sinusitis aggravating the asthma and is gradually

improving.Been irrigating with saline(breathe-ease XL) and hyropulse

which helps.Wondering if it would be better to use waterpik as I can

place tip higher(tip hub to nostril) CLOSER TO FRONTALS due to

previous F.E.S.S..I do get bone calcifications in sinuses as well

which seems uncommon with other members.CURRENTLY ON ANTIFUNGAL

SYSTEMIC TO CLEAR UP FOOT FUNGUS.ANY ADVICE,also ANY ADVICE ON MUCOLYTICS?

[Guest guest]

Wondering if it would be better to use waterpik as I can

> place tip higher(tip hub to nostril)

It may seem that I have an agenda against the waterpik, but no.

I would however council against high pressure and excessive penetration

and agree with Truelori on this.

My ENT originally did not support irrigation as he thought it would

push infected material further up the system. He concedes that there is

necessity, but, with care and no desperate foreign substances.

Regards

[Guest guest]

Vaccinations can most definitely worsen wheezing and create other

immune system reactions because they are stimulating the immune

system. It's not even really a side effect but more of an effect of

the vaccine because it's supposed to be stimulating immunity and thus

people will have transient effects.

I use Mucinex, which is a mucolytic, and I think it works great. I

don't use it all the time, but only when my mucus starts to get thick.

You have to take it with lots of water. Of course water itself is a

great mucolytic, and avoiding dairy will also probably serve as a

mucolytic. I use the brand Mucinex because I think generics of the

long-acting version are not yet available, but if cost is a major issue

the short-acting version is available many places as a generic.

I'm not sure if I would want to irrigate my frontals because I'd be

worried the water wouldn't be able to get back out and it would cause

infection. But I have not had surgery on my frontals so I don't know.

Some of us may have bone calcifications in our sinuses and just not

know about it. My doctor at this point usually just tells me my

sinuses are a " big mess " and much of that mess is probably from

previous surgeries, but I haven't asked about bone calcifications.

Lori

[Guest guest]

I would like to thank Lori for all the work she does for our group. Being a moderator(behind the scenes but very effective) and her detailed and articulate postings. I have learned a lot from Lori.

I believe she has mentioned other medical situations she is involved in so her time she spends on Samter's is very much appreciated.

Again, thanks Lori!

Re: irrigation

Vaccinations can most definitely worsen wheezing and create other

immune system reactions because they are stimulating the immune

system. It's not even really a side effect but more of an effect of

the vaccine because it's supposed to be stimulating immunity and thus

people will have transient effects.

I use Mucinex, which is a mucolytic, and I think it works great. I

don't use it all the time, but only when my mucus starts to get thick.

You have to take it with lots of water. Of course water itself is a

great mucolytic, and avoiding dairy will also probably serve as a

mucolytic. I use the brand Mucinex because I think generics of the

long-acting version are not yet available, but if cost is a major issue

the short-acting version is available many places as a generic.

I'm not sure if I would want to irrigate my frontals because I'd be

worried the water wouldn't be able to get back out and it would cause

infection. But I have not had surgery on my frontals so I don't know.

Some of us may have bone calcifications in our sinuses and just not

know about it. My doctor at this point usually just tells me my

sinuses are a "big mess" and much of that mess is probably from

previous surgeries, but I haven't asked about bone calcifications.

Lori

More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail!

[Guest guest]

Your comment about the frontal sinuses is interesting. I have found that the first sign of trouble for me is the reduction of drainage immediately following irrigation. If I ignore it the symptoms rapidly progress and require prolonged antibiotic and prednisone therapy. I'm going to try increasing prednisone at the first sign of decreased drainage to see if a slight increase can abort the closing of the sinuses and eliminate the need for antibiotic.

Carl

Re: irrigation

Vaccinations can most definitely worsen wheezing and create other immune system reactions because they are stimulating the immune system. It's not even really a side effect but more of an effect of the vaccine because it's supposed to be stimulating immunity and thus people will have transient effects.I use Mucinex, which is a mucolytic, and I think it works great. I don't use it all the time, but only when my mucus starts to get thick. You have to take it with lots of water. Of course water itself is a great mucolytic, and avoiding dairy will also probably serve as a mucolytic. I use the brand Mucinex because I think generics of the long-acting version are not yet available, but if cost is a major issue the short-acting version is available many places as a generic.I'm not sure if I would want to irrigate my frontals because I'd be worried the water wouldn't be able to get back out and it would cause infection. But I have not had surgery on my frontals so I don't know.Some of us may have bone calcifications in our sinuses and just not know about it. My doctor at this point usually just tells me my sinuses are a "big mess" and much of that mess is probably from previous surgeries, but I haven't asked about bone calcifications.Lori

[Guest guest]

Funny but I actually found the opposite --

I had a lot of problems with the WaterPik but the NetiPot works

great. I never tried the NetiPot, I just assumed the WaterPik would

work great. But for me the polyps are so bad that maybe the WaterPik

got fluid where it wasn't supposed to go and caused infections.

Now I am pretty well maintained on the NetiPot. I do find the

FREQUENCY matters. When I was in the hospital for an unrelated

surgery recently I didn't irrigate for a few days and the polyps got

MUCH worse. Now sometimes I irrigate 3-4 times a day or even more if

I feel the need. It gets a ton of stuff out that does not come out

otherwise and really clears ms out.

WaterPik or NetiPot don't give me back my sense of smell. Perhaps

having had this illness for 20 years and having had so many surgeries

it's too late to be able to smell fully ever again ... so if

irrigation helps some to smell, that's wonderful!!! I wish I had

known about it at the beginning instead of having all these surgeries.

Lori

>

> There have been lots of posts about irrigation and I wanted to

share a

> recent story with everyone. What I discovered recently was that not

> only does irrigation matter, but HOW I irrigate matters. I went to

> Costa Rica for 2 weeks. We were going to be moving around a lot

and I

> decided I did not want to drag my WaterPik around with me, a Neilmed

> bottle and my syringe bulb would be more convenient. That was the

> biggest mistake I have ever made. I irrigated twice a day like

normal

> with the Neilmed bottle and/or bulb but within 2 days my nose was

> plugged up and I couldn't smell a thing. Some of it was allergies.

> Trees and flowers and grasses bloom there all the time and I have

bad

> pollen allergies. I did what I could and still enjoyed my vacation

> despite the lack of smell.

>

> When I got home, I immediately went back to using my Waterpik twice

a

> day. Within 1 week, I was cleared up and able to smell again! I

will

> never, never, ever go anywhere without it again. I've been fine

since I

> got back, other than pollen season is starting and with it some

extra

> congestion. But I can still smell.

>

> Anyway, I just wanted to share that. I thought it was interesting

that

> how I irrigated mattered more than the fact that I did irrigate.

>

> K.

>

[Guest guest]

>

> Ah, thanks for clarifying -- I stupidly forgot that you said the

> Neilmed BOTTLE and not the NetiPot. I haven't tried the bottle,

but

> I think the NetiPot probably works better.

Hello Again Truelori

My ENT asked me to trial the Neilmed and I have come up with the

(Pretty Lame,)following ;

oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

NeilMed SinuRinse

· Low-pressure squeeze bottle good for clearing pollutants from

nasal passages.

· Squeeze bottle flow not sustained enough for removing crusts.

· Squeeze bottle easy to use.

· Bottle not easy to fill.

· Sachet mix is not complex.

· Sachet mix is a fairly expensive solution.

· Sachet convenient if only one is needed.

· Sachet is not so easy to fill.

Conclusion;

Basic system which operates well for clearing pollutants, but given

the need for sterile water, scissors, funnels, etc. is unnecessarily

complex in use.

oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

Does anyone agree/disagree, or have anything to add?

Regards

B

[Guest guest]

I have used 1 tsp non-iodized sea salt, 1/4 tsp baking soda and warm

well water from the tap for 10 years. I feel that if the water is

clean enough for my mouth, it is clean enough for my nose.

Chlorinated water may be irritating but I used it without incident at

the last house I lived in. I've never tried the Nelimed bottle. I

went through three water picks and recently bought a Grossan. The two

weeks I went without is when I got the ear infection.

Pam

On Mar 14, 2008, at 6:58 AM, Belbin wrote:

>

>>

>> Ah, thanks for clarifying -- I stupidly forgot that you said the

>> Neilmed BOTTLE and not the NetiPot. I haven't tried the bottle,

> but

>> I think the NetiPot probably works better.

>

>

>

>

> Hello Again Truelori

> My ENT asked me to trial the Neilmed and I have come up with the

> (Pretty Lame,)following ;

> oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

> NeilMed SinuRinse

>

> · Low-pressure squeeze bottle good for clearing pollutants from

> nasal passages.

> · Squeeze bottle flow not sustained enough for removing crusts.

> · Squeeze bottle easy to use.

> · Bottle not easy to fill.

> · Sachet mix is not complex.

> · Sachet mix is a fairly expensive solution.

> · Sachet convenient if only one is needed.

> · Sachet is not so easy to fill.

>

> Conclusion;

> Basic system which operates well for clearing pollutants, but given

> the need for sterile water, scissors, funnels, etc. is unnecessarily

> complex in use.

> oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

>

> Does anyone agree/disagree, or have anything to add?

>

> Regards

> B

>

>

>

> ------------------------------------

>

>

[Guest guest]

I started this week on the NeliMed bottle. Not sure of effectiveness yet. But I did sleep through the night last night!

Re: Re: irrigation

I have used 1 tsp non-iodized sea salt, 1/4 tsp baking soda and warm

well water from the tap for 10 years. I feel that if the water is

clean enough for my mouth, it is clean enough for my nose.

Chlorinated water may be irritating but I used it without incident at

the last house I lived in. I've never tried the Nelimed bottle. I

went through three water picks and recently bought a Grossan. The two

weeks I went without is when I got the ear infection.

Pam

On Mar 14, 2008, at 6:58 AM, Belbin wrote:

>

>>

>> Ah, thanks for clarifying -- I stupidly forgot that you said the

>> Neilmed BOTTLE and not the NetiPot. I haven't tried the bottle,

> but

>> I think the NetiPot probably works better.

>

>

>

>

> Hello Again Truelori

> My ENT asked me to trial the Neilmed and I have come up with the

> (Pretty Lame,)following ;

> oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

> NeilMed SinuRinse

>

> · Low-pressure squeeze bottle good for clearing pollutants from

> nasal passages.

> · Squeeze bottle flow not sustained enough for removing crusts.

> · Squeeze bottle easy to use.

> · Bottle not easy to fill.

> · Sachet mix is not complex.

> · Sachet mix is a fairly expensive solution.

> · Sachet convenient if only one is needed.

> · Sachet is not so easy to fill.

>

> Conclusion;

> Basic system which operates well for clearing pollutants, but given

> the need for sterile water, scissors, funnels, etc. is unnecessarily

> complex in use.

> oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

>

> Does anyone agree/disagree, or have anything to add?

>

> Regards

> B

>

>

>

> ------------------------------------

>

>

[Guest guest]

I use the packets - 4 into 1000ml of tap water.

Way more expensive than just mixing it myself, but also way easier.

Never had an issue using tap water. In fact, one doctor - many years ago - had

suggested

cupping my hand under my nose and inhaling water in the shower, to loosen things

up.

I spent several years practicing environmental law and the tap water in most

areas is quite

clean and pathogen clean - it might have a little chlorine residual, but it is

too low to be

harmful to you and it might not be a bad thing, as it would tend to eliminate

any pathogen

that was in your nose.

ie

[Guest guest]

I have used a 20mm syringe for quite a while ie.

My system includes a fruit/jam jar which I sterilize in a microwave

and boiled water. Rock salt, usually without bicabonate of soda is

pre-mixed. Not too complex. Advantage over Neil med mix is that you

can repeat the rinse until all crusts are removed at low cost.

(Necessary for me as ancient ENT procedures included cauterising the

polyp roots and have ruined my linings.)

I find , using the soft plastic Neilmed bottle, more difficult.

Are you using the bottle and, apart from sniffing water in the shower

( which I have also tried,) have you tried any other method?

Regards

B

-- In samters , " saidelscott " <scottiesinboca@...>

wrote:

>

> I use the packets - 4 into 1000ml of tap water.

>

> Way more expensive than just mixing it myself, but also way easier.

>

> Never had an issue using tap water. In fact, one doctor - many

years ago - had suggested

> cupping my hand under my nose and inhaling water in the shower, to

loosen things up.

>

> I spent several years practicing environmental law and the tap

water in most areas is quite

> clean and pathogen clean - it might have a little chlorine

residual, but it is too low to be

> harmful to you and it might not be a bad thing, as it would tend to

eliminate any pathogen

> that was in your nose.

>

> ie

>

[Guest guest]

I don’t

think I have any polyps at present and if I do they are small enough that they

are not a problem and my ENT can’t see them when he looks up in my nose.

I had a bunch surgically removed in 2006 (or was it 2005?) and have had good

luck keeping them away with drugs and irrigation. I have only had 2 surgeries

and there were not many polyps the second time, I more had to have inflammation

removed and my sinuses opened up so they drained better. Since then I’ve

been much better. The WaterPik is insanely loud but it does work well for me!

K.

Re: irrigation

Ah, thanks for clarifying

-- I stupidly forgot that you said the

Neilmed BOTTLE and not the NetiPot. I haven't tried the bottle, but

I think the NetiPot probably works better.

Question: Are your polyps very small? It may make a difference. If

you don't have severe polyps and problems with blockage and scar

tissue up in the sinuses like I do, perhaps the risk of infection

from the WaterPik is smaller. After a very bad experience I decided

the WaterPik was not for someone with my polyp severity, and last

year I switched to the NetiPot, and it works great. It's also a hell

of a lot less messy, actually (for me). And NOT LOUD!!!

I still have my WaterPik if anyone wants to buy one ...

I hope people will ALWAYS keep looking for their own answers.

Medical illnesses are not cookie cutter. Even breast cancer, which I

have had twice, is treated very different ways for different people.

Doctors are discovering that maybe part of the reason there is such a

high death rate from breast cancer may be because there are so many

different forms of breast cancer that they were all treating the same

way. Potentially there are different " forms " of Samter's, and

certainly different levels of severity, which may affect what works

for some.

But there are MANY people here who are living proof that symptoms CAN

Be improved a lot. Yes, they can. It takes some effort, but I think

it is quite worth it!

Lori

> >

> > There have been lots of posts about irrigation and I wanted to

> share a

> > recent story with everyone. What I discovered recently was that

not

> > only does irrigation matter, but HOW I irrigate matters. I went to

> > Costa Rica for 2 weeks. We were going to be moving around a lot

> and I

> > decided I did not want to drag my WaterPik around with me, a

Neilmed

> > bottle and my syringe bulb would be more convenient. That was the

> > biggest mistake I have ever made. I irrigated twice a day like

> normal

> > with the Neilmed bottle and/or bulb but within 2 days my nose was

> > plugged up and I couldn't smell a thing. Some of it was allergies.

> > Trees and flowers and grasses bloom there all the time and I have

> bad

> > pollen allergies. I did what I could and still enjoyed my vacation

> > despite the lack of smell.

> >

> > When I got home, I immediately went back to using my Waterpik

twice

> a

> > day. Within 1 week, I was cleared up and able to smell again! I

> will

> > never, never, ever go anywhere without it again. I've been fine

> since I

> > got back, other than pollen season is starting and with it some

> extra

> > congestion. But I can still smell.

> >

> > Anyway, I just wanted to share that. I thought it was interesting

> that

> > how I irrigated mattered more than the fact that I did irrigate.

> >

> > K.

> >

>

[Guest guest]

I should have said that I use the Waterpik with the special nozzle.

I find that it gives more flow over a more prolonged period of time, and breaks

up

whatever is up there much better.

I also do something, that is probably dumb, but I find that by blocking the

other nostril I

can get the fluid into the upper sinuses and my ears and get a bunch of stuff

out of those

areas too. Occasionally, I do accidentally push something up into on of my

ears and that

can take a while to resolve and be painful.

overall, however, I do find that the irrigation is very helpful.

ie

> >

> > I use the packets - 4 into 1000ml of tap water.

> >

> > Way more expensive than just mixing it myself, but also way easier.

> >

> > Never had an issue using tap water. In fact, one doctor - many

> years ago - had suggested

> > cupping my hand under my nose and inhaling water in the shower, to

> loosen things up.

> >

> > I spent several years practicing environmental law and the tap

> water in most areas is quite

> > clean and pathogen clean - it might have a little chlorine

> residual, but it is too low to be

> > harmful to you and it might not be a bad thing, as it would tend to

> eliminate any pathogen

> > that was in your nose.

> >

> > ie

> >

>

[Guest guest]

That’s

how I feel about the water. I was using tap water while in Costa Rica and did not get an

infection. I think my issues/stuffiness were a combination of allergies and

not having my WaterPik. My dad also irrigates with tap water with no ill

effects, including while in Costa Rica also.

Do you find you prefer the Grossan over

the WaterPik or are they about the same?

K.

Re: Re:

irrigation

I have used 1 tsp

non-iodized sea salt, 1/4 tsp baking soda and warm

well water from the tap for 10 years. I feel that if the water is

clean enough for my mouth, it is clean enough for my nose.

Chlorinated water may be irritating but I used it without incident at

the last house I lived in. I've never tried the Nelimed bottle. I

went through three water picks and recently bought a Grossan. The two

weeks I went without is when I got the ear infection.

Pam

On Mar 14, 2008, at 6:58 AM, Belbin wrote:

>

>>

>> Ah, thanks for clarifying -- I stupidly forgot that you said the

>> Neilmed BOTTLE and not the NetiPot. I haven't tried the bottle,

> but

>> I think the NetiPot probably works better.

>

>

>

>

> Hello Again Truelori

> My ENT asked me to trial the Neilmed and I have come up with the

> (Pretty Lame,)following ;

> oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

> NeilMed SinuRinse

>

> · Low-pressure squeeze bottle good for clearing pollutants from

> nasal passages.

> · Squeeze bottle flow not sustained enough for removing crusts.

> · Squeeze bottle easy to use.

> · Bottle not easy to fill.

> · Sachet mix is not complex.

> · Sachet mix is a fairly expensive solution.

> · Sachet convenient if only one is needed.

> · Sachet is not so easy to fill.

>

> Conclusion;

> Basic system which operates well for clearing pollutants, but given

> the need for sterile water, scissors, funnels, etc. is unnecessarily

> complex in use.

> oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

>

> Does anyone agree/disagree, or have anything to add?

>

> Regards

> B

>

>

>

> ------------------------------------

>

>

[Guest guest]

I say that the Grossan is a finer machine. It is quieter. I don't know about durability yet. The reseviour is smaller. I would recommend it but I haven't fully tested it yet.PamOn Mar 14, 2008, at 5:47 PM, Keefer wrote:That’s how I feel about the water. I was using tap water while in Costa Rica and did not get an infection. I think my issues/stuffiness were a combination of allergies and not having my WaterPik. My dad also irrigates with tap water with no ill effects, including while in Costa Rica also. Do you find you prefer the Grossan over the WaterPik or are they about the same? K. Re: Re: irrigation I have used 1 tsp non-iodized sea salt, 1/4 tsp baking soda and warm well water from the tap for 10 years. I feel that if the water is clean enough for my mouth, it is clean enough for my nose. Chlorinated water may be irritating but I used it without incident at the last house I lived in. I've never tried the Nelimed bottle. I went through three water picks and recently bought a Grossan. The two weeks I went without is when I got the ear infection.PamOn Mar 14, 2008, at 6:58 AM, Belbin wrote:> >>>> Ah, thanks for clarifying -- I stupidly forgot that you said the>> Neilmed BOTTLE and not the NetiPot. I haven't tried the bottle,> but>> I think the NetiPot probably works better.>>>>> Hello Again Truelori> My ENT asked me to trial the Neilmed and I have come up with the> (Pretty Lame,)following ;> oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo> NeilMed SinuRinse>> · Low-pressure squeeze bottle good for clearing pollutants from> nasal passages.> · Squeeze bottle flow not sustained enough for removing crusts.> · Squeeze bottle easy to use.> · Bottle not easy to fill.> · Sachet mix is not complex.> · Sachet mix is a fairly expensive solution.> · Sachet convenient if only one is needed.> · Sachet is not so easy to fill.>> Conclusion;> Basic system which operates well for clearing pollutants, but given> the need for sterile water, scissors, funnels, etc. is unnecessarily> complex in use.> oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo>> Does anyone agree/disagree, or have anything to add?>> Regards> B>>>> ------------------------------------>>

[Guest guest]

> > >>

> > >> Ah, thanks for clarifying -- I stupidly forgot that you said

the

> > >> Neilmed BOTTLE and not the NetiPot. I haven't tried the bottle,

> > > but

> > >> I think the NetiPot probably works better.

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Hello Again Truelori

> > > My ENT asked me to trial the Neilmed and I have come up with the

> > > (Pretty Lame,)following ;

> > >

oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

> > > NeilMed SinuRinse

> > >

> > > · Low-pressure squeeze bottle good for clearing pollutants from

> > > nasal passages.

> > > · Squeeze bottle flow not sustained enough for removing crusts.

> > > · Squeeze bottle easy to use.

> > > · Bottle not easy to fill.

> > > · Sachet mix is not complex.

> > > · Sachet mix is a fairly expensive solution.

> > > · Sachet convenient if only one is needed.

> > > · Sachet is not so easy to fill.

> > >

> > > Conclusion;

> > > Basic system which operates well for clearing pollutants, but

given

> > > the need for sterile water, scissors, funnels, etc. is

unnecessarily

> > > complex in use.

> > >

oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

> > >

> > > Does anyone agree/disagree, or have anything to add?

> > >

> > > Regards

> > > B

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > ------------------------------------

> > >

> > >

[Guest guest]

Can someone tell me where you would typically find the nasal attachment for the Water Pik? I've called several pharmacies in my town and no one carries it. Janephymphya <nkrich@...> wrote: > > >>> > >> Ah, thanks for clarifying -- I stupidly forgot that you said the> > >> Neilmed BOTTLE and not the NetiPot. I haven't tried the bottle,> > > but> > >> I

think the NetiPot probably works better.> > >> > >> > >> > >> > > Hello Again Truelori> > > My ENT asked me to trial the Neilmed and I have come up with the> > > (Pretty Lame,)following ;> > > oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo> > > NeilMed SinuRinse> > >> > > · Low-pressure squeeze bottle good for clearing pollutants from> > > nasal passages.> > > · Squeeze bottle flow not sustained enough for removing crusts.> > > · Squeeze bottle easy to use.> > > · Bottle not easy to fill.> > > · Sachet mix is not complex.> > > · Sachet mix is a fairly expensive solution.> > > · Sachet convenient if only one is needed.> > > · Sachet is not so easy to fill.> > >> >

> Conclusion;> > > Basic system which operates well for clearing pollutants, but given> > > the need for sterile water, scissors, funnels, etc. is unnecessarily> > > complex in use.> > > oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo> > >> > > Does anyone agree/disagree, or have anything to add?> > >> > > Regards> > > B> > >> > >> > >> > > ------------------------------------> > >> > >

[Guest guest]

I found a Gossen tip for my waterpik on the internet. I have made an irrigator for traveling when I can't use the waterpik by gluing a cone washer (from the plumbing department of the hardware store) on a 3 oz. ear syringe. This works almost as well as the waterpik. I suspect one could make a Gossen type tip by attaching a rubber cone washer to the waterpik tip which would be a lot less expensive than the $20 something of a Gossen tip. The rubber tip on the Gossen is only to keep the solution from leaking out when irrigating.

For irrigating I use 4 teaspoons of sodium bicarbonate (baking soda) and 4 tablespoons of salt (kosher salt because it has no additives) per gallon of filtered well water. I add 4 ml of povidone iodine solution to the mix to be sure there are no bacteria present. My well water is quite highly mineralized and filtering will not remove dissolved minerals but this has not been a problem. I have used drinkable tap water in many places to prepare irrigating solution and not had any problems. When I travel I make up packets of 1 tsp of soda and 1 tbs of salt and carry an empty 1 qt water bottle. It is better to have the solution slightly hypertonic because the cilia recover more rapidly than from a hypotonic solution.

I tried using the Pulmicort solution and had no improvement. Went back to just saline irrigations.

Carl

Re: Re: irrigation

Can someone tell me where you would typically find the nasal attachment for the Water Pik? I've called several pharmacies in my town and no one carries it.

Janephymphya <nkrich@...> wrote:

>I had a Caldwell-Luc twenty six years ago before endoscopic surgery was developed and I had an abcess in the sinus during my last pregnancy. When I used the neti-pot on that side it is very irritating. I find that the water pik with a sinus attachment is the best, I use it with 2 tsps of salt in a liter of fluid. It makes it a bit hypertonic, which seems to improve things. I use a neil-med when travelling where there are no outlets in the bathroom. I find it works better than the neti-pot for me, but not as well as the water pik. When we are at the farm, I use the well water. In Madison- our water is very hard, so I use water from my hot water tap and mix it with water from the refrigerator which runs through a filter. >

..

[Guest guest]

The NeilMed

packets are not expensive if you are only using 1-2 a day.  I sometimes use

them if I go on a short trip simply for the convenience.  But I need to use

8/day because I irrigate 2x/day with 1000mL of water each time (in other words,

a full WaterPik reservoir full each time).  If I don’t use that much

solution, I don’t get all the gunk out and I am stuffy.  I also find I prefer

how my homemade solution feels to the packets.  I use ~2 teaspoons Kosher salt

+ a ½ teaspoon baking soda in that 1000mL warm tap water.

I feel like the squeeze bottle pushes

stuff in places I don’t want it to go.  I can’t explain it, but my

ears are clearer after using the WaterPik than the squeeze bottle.  I have to

be extra careful blowing my nose or my ears “squeak” after using

the bottle but I don’t have this problem when I use the WaterPik.  I

asked my ENT about it once and he just gave me a funny look, “You’re

ears ‘squeak?’” and he shook his head and had no

explanation.  He does that a lot though when he sees me. J

K.

Re: irrigation

I'm sorry, but I don't

really understand what you are talking about.

I don't use the NeilMed bottle. I use a NetiPot.

I don't know what you are talking about regarding scissors, funnels

and sterile water. I also don't know what crusts are exactly -- I

mean, I think I do, but I don't really know where you get them that

they would need to be removed and that some other method could get

rid of them.

I don't think the NeilMed is that expensive, actually. But sure, you

can make your own. Some people do. I find the particular mix to

work very well for me. I don't like other brands, I have tried

othres and I like the NeilMed the best. I find another, such as

SinuRinse, I think it's called, too irritating and burning. The

NeilMed is more soothing.

I don't know why you would need more than one packet. I only use one

packet at a time. It's about 10 bucks for 100 packets, so if I use 1-

2 a day, it lasts about two months. Five bucks a month doesn't seem

very expensive to me.

I don't know what you mean by the sachet not being easy to fill,

because quiet honestly I guess I don't know what a sachet is.

Like I said, I use a NetiPot. It's very easy to fill. I use tap

water.

Lori

> Hello Again Truelori

> My ENT asked me to trial the Neilmed and I have come up with the

> (Pretty Lame,)following ;

> oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

> NeilMed SinuRinse

>

> · Low-pressure squeeze bottle good for clearing pollutants from

> nasal passages.

> · Squeeze bottle flow not sustained enough for removing crusts.

> · Squeeze bottle easy to use.

> · Bottle not easy to fill.

> · Sachet mix is not complex.

> · Sachet mix is a fairly expensive solution.

> · Sachet convenient if only one is needed.

> · Sachet is not so easy to fill.

>

> Conclusion;

> Basic system which operates well for clearing pollutants, but given

> the need for sterile water, scissors, funnels, etc. is

unnecessarily

> complex in use.

> oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

>

> Does anyone agree/disagree, or have anything to add?

>

> Regards

> B

>