mandatory medical procedures (was meningitis)

[Guest guest]

Regarding the meningitis vaccine for college students,

" *JARDEN* " <eljarden@...> wrote:

> Is there a law in your country, that you have too?

I assume the original poster is in the United States as she is an AOL

subscriber. I know

I've been " shouted down " by people who believe otherwise BUT...THERE IS

NO LAW IN THE UNITED

STATES MANDATING VACCINE (ab)USE. (Please understand I don't mean to

shout at you

personally, I'm just frustrated because I don't seem to be able to get

this idea through to

people.) There is a world of difference between LAWS and government

departmental POLICY.

In fact there are no MANDATORY medical procedures in the United States.

* I am not legally required to birth my children in a hospital or

anywhere else with or

without professional birth attendants.

* I am not legally required to obtain birth certificates for my

children. Hospitals are so

if you don't want your children getting birth certificates...don't birth

in a hospital.

* I am not legally required to vaccinate myself or my kids. Now if I

want to submit myself

to further government authority by enrolling my children in public

school or by joining the

military, I need to vaccinate or obtain the appropriate exemptions.

Schools are easy,

military is much tougher. In the original posteris case the only

problem she may have is

in a private college that receives NO federal funds (I'm only aware of

one and it is so

libertarian they would NEVER mandate vaccination for enrollment) or in a

military academy--

both unlikely circumstances.

* I am not legally required to go to a hospital to die.

* My survivors would not be legally required to apply for a death

certificate (unless one

was a doctor in a hospital in which I were to die.) Now if they didn't

get a death

certificate and cashed my social security checks they would get in

trouble for fraud--

another issue entirely.

* My survivors would not be legally required to take my body to a state

licensed funeral

home or to bury me in a state licensed cemetery. (Of course if I die in

a state licensed

hospital or in another facility receiving federal funds it would be a

pain in the keester

for my relatives to convince the staff they are legally obliged to

release my body to my

family rather than to a state licensed funeral home.)

My point is this warning: If the " powers that be " convince us they have

more power than

they are granted in the constitution...then they do.

I'll close with a few quotes.

" If you did not in your own mind distinguish between useful and

erroneous information, then

you were not learning at all, you were merely replacing ignorance with

false belief.

--Orson Card

A long habit of not thinking a thing wrong gives it a superficial

appearance of being right.

-- Paine

" nd most germane of all: " A nation of well informed men who have been

taught to know and

prize the rights which God has given them cannot be enslaved. It is in

the region of

ignorance that tyranny begins. " - lin

Cheryl Overley, who's in a very preachy groove this morning.

[Guest guest]

Hey Cheryl,

You said (amongst other great things):

> * I am not legally required to obtain birth certificates for my

> children. Hospitals are so

> if you don't want your children getting birth certificates...don't birth

> in a hospital.

So I assume you did not get a birth cert for your kids? If I am wrong just

correct me but going on that assumption then.... have there been any

ramifications that you have noticed so far? We would LOVE to not have to

register our child with the authorities when born, (planned home birth) but

my concern is their ability to partake in certain aspects of this society

later on if they want to. I live in Canada so I know our " rules " will be a

bit different, but I heard here (can't remember where) that if we didn't

register our child within " X " number of days, the government would " name " my

child, register him/ her and then send us the birth cert (and bill I am

sure) this makes my skin crawl!!! Expeccially when I see that the " original "

birth certs in our country say on the back that this a reciept... meaning

that they just took your kids life and gave you a reciept for him ICK!

Ok so back to the question, if you did not get them birth certs, how if at

all have you found this to have negatively impacted their lives or think it

might?

Thanks,

Sherri-Lee

[Guest guest]

Sherri-Lee

What do you hope to avoid by not registering your child's birth?

Vaccines are not mandatory in Ontario, are they elsewhere in Canada?

>

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[Guest guest]

I remember reading about the case " Roe v. Wade " and it said something about

the unborn not having a birth certificate and therefore the state could not

claim it (?). I then went on to read about Parens Patriae (state as parent)

which explained the birth certificate in further detail. I was thinking

about not obtaining a birth certificate for my daughter because the mere

thought of someone taking ownership over a child that I brought into the

world gives me the creeps. There was an incident back in the 80's in

Philadelphia with the MOVE organization wherein a police officer crushed the

skull of a member's newborn baby. They pretty much laughed it off and said

they can't prove that a baby even existed because there was no birth

certificate. MOVE didn't believe in registering their births with the

state.

Re: " mandatory " medical procedures (was meningitis)

>From: " Sherri-Lee " <slp@...>

>

>Hey Cheryl,

>

>You said (amongst other great things):

>

>> * I am not legally required to obtain birth certificates for my

>> children. Hospitals are so

>> if you don't want your children getting birth certificates...don't birth

>> in a hospital.

>

>So I assume you did not get a birth cert for your kids? If I am wrong just

>correct me but going on that assumption then.... have there been any

>ramifications that you have noticed so far? We would LOVE to not have to

>register our child with the authorities when born, (planned home birth) but

>my concern is their ability to partake in certain aspects of this society

>later on if they want to. I live in Canada so I know our " rules " will be a

>bit different, but I heard here (can't remember where) that if we didn't

>register our child within " X " number of days, the government would " name "

my

>child, register him/ her and then send us the birth cert (and bill I am

>sure) this makes my skin crawl!!! Expeccially when I see that the

" original "

>birth certs in our country say on the back that this a reciept... meaning

>that they just took your kids life and gave you a reciept for him ICK!

>

>Ok so back to the question, if you did not get them birth certs, how if at

>all have you found this to have negatively impacted their lives or think it

>might?

>

>Thanks,

>

>Sherri-Lee

>

>

>

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[Guest guest]

Hi ,

I have to admit that my husband is more " anti " b/c's than I am... I don't

want to limit my child's options later in life because of choices I am

making now. So I still see that IF he/she wants to hold a job and pay taxes

and join into that system, it will be easier for him if he has a b/c...

however, if he doesn't want to join the system then he will have a harder

time separating himself if he has a b/c. I also would like to have medical

available for him/her in case of emergency, and a passport since we travel a

lot... all which require b/c's. However at the same time I don't really want

the govt injecting it's stinky little nose into my life. So I don't know if

I really answered your question or not I am torn... but am exploring the

options.

Sherri-Lee

Re: " mandatory " medical procedures (was meningitis)

> From: touie@...

>

> Sherri-Lee

>

> What do you hope to avoid by not registering your child's birth?

> Vaccines are not mandatory in Ontario, are they elsewhere in Canada?

>

>

> >

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