(No subject)

[Guest guest]

I would be interested in hearing the results as well. Very curious to know

the rate of late onset autism in the unvaccinated versus the vaccinated.

> >I have a question for the list. There's quite a few of us who think the

>vaccinations either totally caused or had a significant hand in our

>children becoming autistic....both of my children included.

Is there anyone out there who did NOT vaccinate their child from the very

beginning, and the child still became autistic? I'm very

> >interested.........>thanks

Marty in Mass.

(mom of 2 autistic kiddies)

>VERY good question. It would be VERY interesting to find out!

>Sheri

______________________________________________________

Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

[Guest guest]

At 11:44 AM 04/02/2000 EDT, you wrote:

>I have a question for the list. There's quite a few of us who think the

>> vaccinations either totally caused or had a significant hand in our

children

>> becoming autistic....both of my children included.

>>

>> Is there anyone out there who did NOT vaccinate their child from the very

>> beginning, and the child still became autistic? I'm very

>interested.........

>>

>> thanks

>>

>> Marty in Mass.

>> (mom of 2 autistic kiddies)

VERY good question. It would be VERY interesting to find out!

Sheri

>

--------------------------------------------------------

Sheri Nakken, R.N., MA wwithin@...

Well Within's Earth Mysteries & Sacred Site Tours

http://www.nccn.net/~wwithin

Bookstore - http://www.nccn.net/~wwithin/bookstor.htm

International Tours, Homestudy Courses, ANTHRAX & OTHER Vaccine Dangers

Education, Homeopathic Education

KVMR Broadcaster/Programmer/Investigative Reporter, Nevada City CA

CEU's for nurses, Books & Multi-Pure Water Filters

[Guest guest]

Thinking more about it -- The problem is the are very FEW unvaccinated at

all. And those that are keep a low profile.

Sheri

At 01:45 PM 04/02/2000 EDT, you wrote:

>I would be interested in hearing the results as well. Very curious to know

>the rate of late onset autism in the unvaccinated versus the vaccinated.

>

>

>

>> >I have a question for the list. There's quite a few of us who think the

>>vaccinations either totally caused or had a significant hand in our

>>children becoming autistic....both of my children included.

>Is there anyone out there who did NOT vaccinate their child from the very

>beginning, and the child still became autistic? I'm very

>> >interested.........>thanks

>Marty in Mass.

>(mom of 2 autistic kiddies)

>

>>VERY good question. It would be VERY interesting to find out!

>>Sheri

>

>______________________________________________________

>Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

>

>

>------------------------------------------------------------------------

>Good friends, school spirit, hair-dos you'd like to forget.

>Classmates.com has them all. And with 4.4 million alumni already

>registered, there's a good chance you'll find your friends here:

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>------------------------------------------------------------------------

>

>

--------------------------------------------------------

Sheri Nakken, R.N., MA wwithin@...

Well Within's Earth Mysteries & Sacred Site Tours

http://www.nccn.net/~wwithin

Bookstore - http://www.nccn.net/~wwithin/bookstor.htm

International Tours, Homestudy Courses, ANTHRAX & OTHER Vaccine Dangers

Education, Homeopathic Education

KVMR Broadcaster/Programmer/Investigative Reporter, Nevada City CA

CEU's for nurses, Books & Multi-Pure Water Filters

[Guest guest]

My nephew was diagnosed as " autistic " at an early age but has had a LOT of

" treatment " in the way of therapy, etc... and was rediagnosed with adhd and

some autistic tendencies ( I think that's right, he has progressed

AMAZINGLY!!!). Anyway, he was never vaccinated (thank goodness) but my

sister was vaccinated with the MMR prior to becoming pregnant. She subscribes

to this list but I think she is behind on her mail.

[Guest guest]

If you don't have an exemption in your state, I would in a heart beat.

CSHHOLT@... wrote:

> i live in sc and i have a little girl that still has a couple vaccinations

> left and i want to get out of them but still be able to send her to school. i

> have the little vaccination card here that they fill out when she gets her

> shot. question is if i cheat on that card can i get away with it or is there

> another way i should go about it?

>

> ------------------------------------------------------------------------

> Get a NextCard Visa, in 30 seconds!

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> ------------------------------------------------------------------------

[Guest guest]

That is how my mother got all four of my brothers and sisters into school!

Juls

________________________________________________________________________

Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com

[Guest guest]

Hi.....I agree with you about lying about it. But, I am the first to admit

that I am not looking forward to registering my child in school this Fall.

We have a religious exemption card, but this is being challenged currently

here in the state of Iowa. I have been through years of strange looks and

people not wanting to have our children around there's for fear of getting a

disease! I'm tired of having to hunt and hunt for doctors that will support

our views or else being told by a doctor we really liked that they won't see

our children because we don't immunize. Does anyone else out there get tired

of this persecution for doing what we believe is right for our children? I'm

really nervous about trying to register my son and what they might say. I've

heard horror stories about the Department of Human Services threatening to

take away children from their parents due to non vaccination. Our old

pediatrician (who supported our views) told about parents that would come

into his office crying because their children were being threated to be taken

away if they didn't vaccinate. So, they came to him for an exemption.

Unfortunately he's since retired!

I don't agree with the lying.........but sometimes I wonder if it'd be easier

than having to go through this all! I guess I'm just growing weary amidst

the battle. Can anyone relate?

Thanks for listening.

Debi

[Guest guest]

This is just my own opinion, but I don't think you should lie about it. We all

need to stand up for what we believe in if anything is ever going to change. I

think you need to go about getting an exemption; I'm not sure about the laws in

SC. Let us know what you decide!

Michele

!

(no subject)

i live in sc and i have a little girl that still has a couple vaccinations

left and i want to get out of them but still be able to send her to school. i

have the little vaccination card here that they fill out when she gets her

shot. question is if i cheat on that card can i get away with it or is there

another way i should go about it?

[Guest guest]

Battle weary? Definately. The only thing that keeps me going is that I

do NOT want my daughter to know the fear that we, as parents, and myself

have experienced for excersing our choice after an incredible amount of

research. I agree with the previous post. I personally don't think

that lying is the best thing. It is one thing if there are NO

exemptions but otherwise I would use a religious exemption. If WE do

not continue to stand up and say 'THIS IS NOT OK' then it will

continue. We will be having the same conversation with our

grandchildren and have to tell them that we were not courageous enough

to stand up when we had the chance.

Whenever I get battle weary, want to scream, quit, not return another

call, etc. I think of the most terrifying time in my life when my

daughter had her Hep B reaction and then I was being told that she would

have to get the next dose. There was no one there for me or my family,

except the NVIC. (I didn't know about this list at the time:) I often

think if Barbara and Kathi had quit WHO would I have turned to? Forcing

myself to answer this question invigorates me to continue. Of course,

balance becomes critical because this is more like a war, the war of

choice, and as such the manufacturers and those making millions will not

be giving up easily.

At the same time, I do not mean to berate anyone. Every person has to

make the decision that is right for them. I am only speaking of the way

I look at the issue. I, personally, refuse to have to look into my

grandchildren's eyes someday and say " Sorry, I was scared/weary/etc (any

word works, I have as many of you have experienced all of them) to stand

up and now you have to deal with the same things and the harassment. "

Another example, would be to meet someone who has the fear in their

voice, the one many of us know first hand from previous experience. The

fear may come from having a child who has been injured or they are

trying to research the issue or etc. I could not live with the fact

that I have the information that could bring them peace or at least

guide them to an answer and that I don't provide it.

Just my thoughts. Someday, we will be acknowledged for fighting the

good fight and for speaking the truth and for especially promoting

individual choice.

> I don't agree with the lying.........but sometimes I wonder if it'd be easier

> than having to go through this all! I guess I'm just growing weary amidst

> the battle. Can anyone relate?

>

> Thanks for listening.

>

> Debi

>

> ---

@...

***************************************************************

Any information obtained here is not to be construed as medical

OR legal advice. The decision to vaccinate and how you

implement that decision is yours and yours alone.

[Guest guest]

, Welcome to the list. Where are you located? We are in Hawaii.

Tell us more about your family.

Elaine Mom to 16 and 14 (DS)

(no subject)

>

> I will like to introduce myself. My name is and I have a daughter

that

> is 6 years old with Down Syndrome. She is very alert, and I have her in

> regular Kindergarten class last year and this Sept she will go to the 1st

> grade in the regular class with supplementary aids. We hope this year

will

> be better than last year. Also she has some sensory issues with her and I

> was told the OT should be working on that with her this year. We will

see.

> If there is anyone that has the same problem please feel free to email me

at

> Jmaria2k@...

>

> Thanks

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 9/8/00 11:34:59 AM Central Daylight Time,

speechgate@... writes:

<<

so, my question is for those of you who have had sleep studies with your

children- how cooperative were your children?

thanks

lori- mom to danielle (11) and alec ( who turned 8 yesterday)

>>

Hi Lori,

cooperated ok. of course it helps to have a couple of them gluing the

stuff on at once to get it all over with quickly. Of course I think i've

only met one person at Mayo who really gets to me. But I do admit it may be

partially me. hehe All staff have always been great with and talk and

explain as they work. I'm amazed at how well it does work. LOL.

As for her results, I hadn't seen her sleep that well in ages, and the sleep

study said all was well. sigh.

Joy

[Guest guest]

's first pediatrician had to fill out some paperwork for services. I

had to tell him to mark off the " needs occupational therapy " . He asked " why,

it will be years before he will work "

[Guest guest]

My favorite saying is " Stupidity is rampant in the world, and it is

getting rampanter and rampanter. " Proven every day. Jessie

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 10/18/00 11:29:23 PM Central Daylight Time,

JB66111@... writes:

<< Do any of you live in Minnesota, by any chance? That is my home

state

altho I haven't lived there for many years. Just wondered about the school

situation there. Jessie

>>

ME. :-)

the school situation depends on where you are. And alot of schools still

like to play the " we're always right, and we do things THIS WAY " game. LOL

I think that alot of placements are mainstreamed. Things slowly improve.

Heck we know of a family who's daughter is 21 now, who back in the early

eighties when she was school age were told by the county (all sped services

went through the county at that time) that because they felt the best

placement for her was in Rochester, rather then the counties program that

they (the parents) would have to pay for the transportation, the county would

pick up the tuition but the parents would have to get her there. This

wouldn't happen now. So things are improving. :-)

Joy

[Guest guest]

my husband gets the magazine.

What do you need?

a.

(no subject)

Found in: JAMA Table of Contents - December 27, 2000 Vol 284, No. 24, pp 3087-3252 http://jama.ama-assn.org/issues/v284n24/toc.html the following article has an interesting topic. Anyone have a subscription to get JAMA articles in full text? Barbara Individual and Community Risks of Measles and Pertussis Associated With Personal Exemptions to Immunization D. R. Feikin, D. C. Lezotte, R. F. Hamman, D. A. Salmon, R. T. Chen, R. E. Hoffman http://jama.ama-assn.org/issues/v284n24/abs/joc01122.html Barbara , NCADRC, Communications Director P.O. Box 8323, Roanoke, Virginia, USA 24014 540/345-1952; Fax 504/345-1899; BH@... MSbP articles at: stop-abuse.org (click Press-files, then "Articles") National Office: NCADRC, P.O. Box 638, Holland, OH 43528 419/865-0513; Fax 419/865-0526; www.falseallegation.org

[Guest guest]

Hi Debbie, Welcome to the list!!! Where are you from? Do you have more

kids? I have two--a seventeen year old pain in the derriere who is very

intelligent and artistic and has a super singing voice, and a fourteen year

old son with DS who loves to swim, play ball, and eat pizza (and watch girls

bounce up and down on exercise videos, but we won't go there). Keep us

updated.

Elaine Mom to 17 and 14 (DS)

(no subject)

> Hi everyone! I am new to this group........so bear with me. I have a son

who

> is 2 1/2 that has downs syndrome. He just started walking last october!

yay!

> now he's into everything.....ugg! anyway, I just wanted to introduce

myself

> to all of you.

>

> Debbie

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

My son hates haircuts and we now do them at home.

He only tolerates them in front of his favorite

videos and his dad and I take turns giving them to

him. I to stopped trying to make them fun but I never

stopped giving a reward afterwards. M & Ms are a

favorite. I rarley give food rewards so this is a real

treat. is 8 and at the age of your son it was

very difficult for us so he did wear his hair in a

long shag. Good luck. I also always tried to stay calm

and quiet about my directions sit still ect. His Dad

got him to sit still a couple of times when he was

younger by telling him to " When you feel the scissors,

Freeze " I believe he was about 5 and had already

learne4d to play freeze tag with the kids. But I think

it was key pointing out the feel of the scissors and

what to do. Pam

--- DHMA14@... wrote:

> Hi everyone! I have a problem with my son

> who has ds and is 2 1/2. He

> cannot stand anyone to touch his hair for a haircut!

> He goes nuts and screams

> and hollers when the hairdresser gets near him. My

> husband and I have also

> tried, but he still screams and cries......does

> anyone have any suggestions?

> we have tried giving him crackers, books, musical

> toys, whatever, to distract

> him, but nothing works.........

>

> Debbie

>

>

>

> [Non-text portions of this message have been

> removed]

>

>

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

I checked this out with Norton and here's what they said:

BUDSAVER.EXE

BUDSAVER.EXE is not a virus. It is a hoax. The " virus "

does not

exist. There is currently no virus that has the

characteristics

ascribed to BUDSAVER.EXE. It is a sham, meant only to

panic

new or inexperienced computer users.

The hoax message includes one of the following

" warnings " :

Warning #1

DANGER! VIRUS ALERT!

THIS IS A NEW TWIST. SOME CREEPOID SCAM-ARTIST IS

SENDING OUT A VERY DESIRABLE SCREEN-SAVER {{THE

BUD

FROGS}}. IF YOU DOWNLOAD IT, YOU'LL LOSE

EVERYTHING!!!!

YOUR HARD DRIVE WILL <<>> CRASH!!

DON'T DOWNLOAD THIS UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES!!! IT

JUST

WENT INTOCIRCULATION ON 05/13/97, AS FAR AS I KNOW!!

PLEASE DISTRIBUTE THIS WARNING TO AS MANY PEOPLE

AS

POSSIBLE... BELOW IS WHAT THE SCREENSAVER

PROGGIE WOULD

LQQK LIKE!

File: BUDSAVER.EXE (24643 bytes)

DL Time (28800 bps): < 1 minute

Warning #2

READ THIS MESSAGE IMMEDIATELY

Someone is sending out a screen-saver of the Budweiser

frogs. If you download it, you will lose everything!

Your hard drive will crash and someone from the

Internet will get your screen name and password!

DO NOT DOWNLOAD IT UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES! It

just went into circulation yesterday, as far as we

know. Please distribute this message. This is a new,

very malicious virus and not many people know about it.

This information was announced yesterday morning from

Microsoft. Please share it with everyone that might

access the Internet.

Once again, pass this along to EVERYONE in your address

book so that this may be stopped. AOL has said that

this

is a very dangerous virus and that there is NO remedy

for

it at this time.

Please practice cautionary measures and forward this to

all your

contacts.

Category: Hoax

Please ignore any messages regarding this hoax and do

not pass on messages. Passing on messages about the

hoax only serves to further propagate it.

Virus

>

> READ IMMEDIATELY AND PASS ON

> Someone is sending out a very cute screen saver

> of the Budweiser Frogs.

> If you download it, you will lose everything!

> Your hard drive will crash and someone from the

> Internet will get your screen name and password!

>

> DO NOT DOWNLOAD IT UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES!

>

> It just went into circulation yesterday.

> Please distribute this message.

> This is a new, very malicious virus and not many

> people know about it. This information was announced

> yesterday morning from Microsoft. Please share it

> with everyone that might access the Internet.

> Once again, pass this along to EVERYONE in your address

> book so that this may be stopped. AOL has said that

> this is a very dangerous virus and that there is

> NO remedy for it at this time.

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> Angelina mother of 3 amanda (9) samantha (7) frankie (3 ds)

> frankie's web site

> http://home.earthlink.net/~angelblueyes27d/

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Granny -- thanks for checking on this. As a word to the wise - it's

generally a good idea to check out ANY e-mail that requests you forward it

along to everyone you know. I've found that 99.9999999% of them are urban

legends/hoaxes or whatever you want to call them. A good website that I use

to do this is:

http://urbanlegends.about.com/science/urbanlegends/mbody.htm

And yes, the Budweiser Virus is in their database as being a hoax!!

[Guest guest]

Oh my.....this one really made me cry......Who Mothers the Children with

Disabilities......

Jackie, Mom to 13ds

[Guest guest]

,

Thanks for the URL. I've been using http://www.scopes.com for years in order

to check out things before I pass them on, and they are very good. It is

good to have another source, however.

granny

---

" Beautiful that war and all its deeds of carnage must

in time be utterly lost. " -- Walt Whitman

http://home.earthlink.net/~bspyle

Re: (no subject)

> Granny -- thanks for checking on this. As a word to the wise - it's

> generally a good idea to check out ANY e-mail that requests you forward it

> along to everyone you know. I've found that 99.9999999% of them are urban

> legends/hoaxes or whatever you want to call them. A good website that I

use

> to do this is:

>

> http://urbanlegends.about.com/science/urbanlegends/mbody.htm

>

> And yes, the Budweiser Virus is in their database as being a hoax!!

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

uuuummmmm granny - don't you mean www.sNopes.com?

This sCopes.com is some industrial engineering site.... and here I was so

excited to add another hoax site to my collection... lol - good thing I

looked first.... ;-P....

Take Care,

Shelby :-)

Re: (no subject)

>

>

> > Granny -- thanks for checking on this. As a word to the wise - it's

> > generally a good idea to check out ANY e-mail that requests you forward

it

> > along to everyone you know. I've found that 99.9999999% of them are

urban

> > legends/hoaxes or whatever you want to call them. A good website that I

> use

> > to do this is:

> >

> > http://urbanlegends.about.com/science/urbanlegends/mbody.htm

> >

> > And yes, the Budweiser Virus is in their database as being a hoax!!

> >

> >

> >

> >

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Oops. Sorry about that. It's what I get for trying to type something from

memory. (Shut up, Timbo.) I went to my bookmarks and called up the site.

Here's the correct address:

http://www.snopes2.com/

granny

---

" Beautiful that war and all its deeds of carnage must

in time be utterly lost. " -- Walt Whitman

http://home.earthlink.net/~bspyle

Re: (no subject)

> >

> >

> > > Granny -- thanks for checking on this. As a word to the wise - it's

> > > generally a good idea to check out ANY e-mail that requests you

forward

> it

> > > along to everyone you know. I've found that 99.9999999% of them are

> urban

> > > legends/hoaxes or whatever you want to call them. A good website that

I

> > use

> > > to do this is:

> > >

> > > http://urbanlegends.about.com/science/urbanlegends/mbody.htm

> > >

> > > And yes, the Budweiser Virus is in their database as being a hoax!!

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 1/16/2001 9:16:13 AM Eastern Standard Time,

bspyle@... writes:

<< ,

Thanks for the URL. I've been using http://www.scopes.com for years in order

to check out things before I pass them on, and they are very good. It is

good to have another source, however.

granny

--- >>

I just checked out that site for a FWD email sent to me about a blue envelope

that contains a deadly virus. Included in the email were statements from

police agencies. The person who sent it to me is a cop!! LOL!!! I let her

know it was a hoax.

[Guest guest]

<<It's the epitome of home, sweet home.

But for the owners of 519 N. Nevada, Tim and , this modest

house represents so much more than a cozy space to live. It goes beyond

the

American dream of homeownership.

The es both have Down syndrome. >>

What a great story!

Gail

________________________________________________________________

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