Guest guest Posted August 31, 2010 Report Share Posted August 31, 2010 that if you take drugs you have a mental health problem If you smoke you have an addiction and If you're fat you are lazy, idle, greedy and selfish? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 1, 2010 Report Share Posted September 1, 2010 >I happen to think that drug addicts have a choice and choose to destroy themselves and their families, smoking is a choice too but being overweight is not always free choice. Not sure if it's as simplistic as that. I don't really think you can on the one hand say being overweight is not free choice and then say taking drugs and smoking are a choice and get upset when people comment on the overweight.They are actions people take, but why do people take them? You could for instance say to someone who is over weight - go on a very low calorie diet, that would work. So in that respect, that's a choice not to. I am overweight and my body's so messed up right now i can't do anything about it but i could go on a very low calorie diet but that would mess me up even more. As for smoking, why do people smoke? all kinds of reasons of course, from claiming to enjoy it to having no other way to cope (smoking is an adrenal stimulant). I for instance smoke, but don't enjoy it. every day for the last week i've been listening to Mckenna to give up, and you know what, i cannot give up, my body cannot work without it, my adrenal glands are knackered, i am off hydrocortisone, and i cannot cope. i instinctively reached for smoking at age 25 after going bankrupt and having mental health problems, i just could not cope. so what 'choice' do i have here? smoke and cope a bit better, trying to kick my adrenals, or 'choose' not to, and cope even less? what kind of a choice is that? and drugs too. why do people take drugs? again, all kinds of reasons. how about people who have been abused and are so messed up they need to escape and they choose to do that via drugs? have you ever tried getting therapy on the nhs for issues? Are you aware of the waiting lists? do you know what it's like to have no hope in life?it happened to my cousin who ended up on heroin age 18, and then had a daughter (also addicted) to a man 25 years older than her; just a few wrong choices, bad luck (bad parenting, living in a bad area) and she was in a very bad situation, yet she has pulled it back somehow and is off drugs now. i really don't blame people for taking drugs if that's how they can cope. it's not right, and not the best way, and people cause untold issues yes, but it's not as simple as you make out. perhaps you need to consider the wider issues here. Some people's body and brain chemistry is wired so they are more vulnerable to drug and alcohol abuse, or simply don't have the nutritional counselling they need in order to cope. unless you make a concerted effort to find such nutritional counselling (eg, say patrick holford, julia ross's work), then you're not going to get it, and most people probably aren't resourceful enough to find it. Unfortunately, none of these things are as simple as they first appear. I don't feel it's good to kick others just because someone has kicked you. > I happen to think that drug addicts have a choice and choose to destroy themselves and their families, smoking is a choice too but being overweight is not always free choice. > Glynis > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 1, 2010 Report Share Posted September 1, 2010 Hi, I'll throw my bit in here too, I think maybe the first two or three cigarettes are a choice, then you have no choice, you have to keep smoking (in my case for over 20 years) I finally managed to kick it this year, after getting the adrenals and thyroid somewhere near right, I just stopped smoking one day. and it's been over six months now. No patches, no gum, no zyban, I just stopped and then went to http://www.whyquit.com and downloaded a quit counter. It keeps a tally and so far I've not smoked 3,834 cigs and £1,073.52 less in debt than I would have been! xx > As for smoking, why do people smoke? all kinds of reasons of course, from claiming to enjoy it to having no other way to cope (smoking is an adrenal stimulant). I for instance smoke, but don't enjoy it. every day for the last week i've been listening to Mckenna to give up, and you know what, i cannot give up, my body cannot work without it, my adrenal glands are knackered, i am off hydrocortisone, and i cannot cope. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 2, 2010 Report Share Posted September 2, 2010 Oh I know exactly what you mean, having been on the wrong end of exactly that lecture for the better part of 20 years. I've been trying to lose weight for longer than most of these people have had jobs, and yet it's always the same story. I came across a review paper in the Nutrition Journal which concludes that the standard advice (exercise more, eat less) is a terrible failure. http://www.nutritionj.com/content/9/1/30 There are other approaches. Sainsbury-Salis is an Australian researcher and dietician who describes the dilemma - namely that our bodies are geared to retain weight in a famine. When we lose weight, our bodies are tricked into thinking that we are starving, and immediately floods the system with neuropeptide Y, a powerful appertite stimulant. The more we resist eating, the more neuropeptide Y is released, until we end up bingeing, preferably on something the body believes will save us from starving - i.e. usually rich in sugar and fat. That's the mechanism in a healthy body, anyway. Heaven knows how it's all disrupted in people with thyroid issues. Sainsbury-Salis' technique for losing weight involves going through small weight loss periods, combined with rest periods where healthy low GI food is eaten to sate the appetite. For me, for whatever reason, it hasn't worked as yet... but it might be helpful for someone? Might be worth a crack. Meanwhile.... I have an appointment with Dr Ludka Berkowski in Sydney, who appears to be about the only open-minded practitioner close to me. I've got forms for the following tests: FBE; ESR; E/LFTs; TSH; HDL Chol.; BSL, vit B12, iron studies; DHEAs, cortisol, free testosterone, CRP, 25OH vit D, urinary iodine; E2; projesterone; 24 hr urinary cortisol; free T3; RT3; free T$ Thyroid ABs; insulin; leptin. Is there anything that's been left out? Looks pretty comprehensive. > > Its not just small minded people though, its the general impression put out by the health service and backed (hounded) by the media. > > And no, no-one has been unkind to me, they wouldn't dare!! It came out of a rant that me and my cousin had the other day, he's diabetic and has gained a lot of weight but every time he goes to the diabetic clinic they tell him to exercise and eat less, he has appetite supressing injections and the nurses know this but still trot out the mantra of eat less and exercise more. > I happen to think that drug addicts have a choice and choose to destroy themselves and their families, smoking is a choice too but being overweight is not always free choice. > Glynis > > > > > Because its VERY small minded people that would think that! I'm overweight but certainly not lazy, I smoke and yes its an addiction, I take AD's so I must be mental!!! lol Good job we can laugh about it! > > > > > > > > > > > > > >  > > > > > > > > that if you take drugs you have a mental health problem > > If you smoke you have an addiction > > and > > If you're fat you are lazy, idle, greedy and selfish? > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 2, 2010 Report Share Posted September 2, 2010 Trish, I read this and just wanted to say I'm sorry you went through such traumatic times. It is easy for me to say on here and it doesn't really mean anything I guess, but I just wanted to acknowledge what you wrote and shared, it sounds so awful, you are very strong to have survived all that and health issues too. i hope life is much much kinder to you now. Chris == >i took to smoking to cope with an out of control family situation and it did seem to make a difference, didn't know it was an adrenal stimulant! i then had some very traumatic incidences including rape and being threatened with strangulation so later on i added drugs (licit and otherwise) and alcohol to my coping strategy ...i think the drugs that have done me the most harm are antidepressants and antibiotics but i can't say whether that would be the case if i hadn't had underlying undiagnosed hashimotos. i read recently that cannabis helps prolong t3 in the system ...that made sense i thought, it always used to give me energy and make me feel normal and not out of it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 3, 2010 Report Share Posted September 3, 2010 it does mean something chris, thank you trish > > Trish, I read this and just wanted to say I'm sorry you went through such traumatic times. It is easy for me to say on here and it doesn't really mean anything I guess, but I just wanted to acknowledge what you wrote and shared, it sounds so awful, you are very strong to have survived all that and health issues too. i hope life is much much kinder to you now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 10, 2011 Report Share Posted March 10, 2011 How did you go with Ludka? I also went and saw her but made no progress. It became very difficult working with her remotely - as I live in Melbourne. I became unwell and it caused conflicts as Ludka's advice conflicted with the GP and despite trying I couldnt get the two doctors to talk to each other. I gave up in the end and am heavier than ever and more miserable than ever. So I would love to hear your progress. Jacqui > > Oh I know exactly what you mean, having been on the wrong end of exactly that lecture for the better part of 20 years. I've been trying to lose weight for longer than most of these people have had jobs, and yet it's always the same story. > [Ed] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 12, 2011 Report Share Posted March 12, 2011 Jacqui, have a look at the information I have just posted in the New FOLDER in our Files Section about Diet, I think you will find this interesting. You can access the Files section from the Home page of this Forum. Luv - Sheila How did you go with Ludka? I also went and saw her but made no progress. It became very difficult working with her remotely - as I live in Melbourne. I became unwell and it caused conflicts as Ludka's advice conflicted with the GP and despite trying I couldnt get the two doctors to talk to each other. I gave up in the end and am heavier than ever and more miserable than ever. So I would love to hear your progress. Jacqui --- In _ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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