Re: Ignorant GP's

[Guest guest]

Hi Sharon

sorry you've had to battle with more idiots. i hate battling with them, too.

you just get labelled as a loon or hypochondriac if you argue with them as i've

found out.

I think milk thistle is supposed to help fatty liver -there's another herb on

here too that's supposed to help:

http://www.herbalprovider.com/fatty-liver.html#buy-liv52

pretty srue there's another herb that's good for fattty liver too but i cannot

remember what it is, i'll have a look and try to get back to you

chris

[Guest guest]

Sharon,

The reason we ask for reference ranges is that not all machines are calibrated the same. It is where you are in the range that is important. From 1st April my local hospital started measuring by mass spectrometry and 'new reference range guidelines apply'. That was on the copy of the blood test results that I had. I do not know whether that is universal, but may go a small way to explaining the differences.

I do not know about vitamin D but there are some things which are different for men and women. H.D.L. and A.C.R are two. The reference range is slightly difference in both of these for men and woman.

I long suspected that the doctors never bother if the blood test results did not indicate any lows or highs. In their eyes, why should they waste time on normal. Secretary probably just files it away. No need even to call or write to patient. And in my experience 99.9% of patients just have the test and wait until they hear from the doctor, and if they don't hear they presume everything is OK. Regardless of the fact they might still not feel well

Lilian

[Guest guest]

Dear Sharon

I am sorry you are having such a hard time with your GP at the

moment. However, I should point out that NHS doctors DO NOT have to prescribe

natural desiccated thyroid extract for their patients. Thyroid extract is not

licensed in the UK and therefore is not recommended as a treatment for

hypothyroidism in the British National Formulary. A doctor is allowed to make

up his/her own mind whether or not to prescribe it, and the Medicines and

Healthcare products Regulatory Agency says that NHS doctors can prescribe it,

BUT they must take responsibility for this themselves as their medical

insurance does not cover them if anybody should try to sue them if anything

goes wrong. So, I would not mention this to your Primary Care Trust because

they will tell you the same. It is up to individual doctors whether or not they

decide to prescribe an unlicensed medication. They cannot be forced to

prescribe it.

Luv - Sheila

Spoke to head of

practice and he's an idiot too! He is the GP I saw when I had my gallbladder

out and told me my fatty liver and gallbladder removal was caused by my

terrible diet and that the only way to get rid of my fatty liver is to go on

a diet, after he gave a long look of disgust! He said he would speak to the

GP in question and I said that wasnt enough.He said he couldnt sack her as

she was a partner in the practice.'Theres a good advert for a great

practice'! I said I would be making a letter of complaint to him as the

practice manager and he said the GP in question would have to reply and maybe

apologise.I said thats still not good enough and that I would take it further

to the Primary Care Trust.He said that's fine,but I needed to write to the

practice first.How can you allow a practice partner give your practice such a

bad reputation to the point of possibly being responsibility for someones

death in the future?! It could have been a much more serious blood test and

it could have had fatal consequences.I am going to put all my spleen venting

in a letter.I couldnt get an appointment to see my GP until December 14th and

will mention that he can prescribe me Armour and if he refuses,I am going to

write to the Head of Practice then the Primary Care Trust regarding this

too.I'VE HAD ENOUGH OF DOCTORS!!!! And I'm sick of feeling sick........

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19:42:00

[Guest guest]

Hi Lillian,

The head of practice and the secretaries are unaware of any ref range changes and both have said it's not right.I do need to ring them again for blood results that are outstanding for myself,hubby and daughter and understand that they never get in touch unless out of range.But I had a letter from the surgery to say a blood test had come back that I needed to make an appointment with the GP for and when i phoned up,it was regarding my D3.What difference it makes to seeing a GP I dont know,as you cant get vitamins on prescription any more.Perhaps the NHS will pay for me to take a long holiday to top up my D3! Ha ha ha!!

Best wishes Sharon

From: Lilian <lilian15@...>Subject: Re: ignorant GP'sthyroid treatment Date: Friday, November 20, 2009, 1:06 PM

Sharon,

The reason we ask for reference ranges is that not all machines are calibrated the same. It is where you are in the range that is important. From 1st April my local hospital started measuring by mass spectrometry and 'new reference range guidelines apply'. That was on the copy of the blood test results that I had. I do not know whether that is universal, but may go a small way to explaining the differences.

I do not know about vitamin D but there are some things which are different for men and women. H.D.L. and A.C.R are two. The reference range is slightly difference in both of these for men and woman.

I long suspected that the doctors never bother if the blood test results did not indicate any lows or highs. In their eyes, why should they waste time on normal. Secretary probably just files it away. No need even to call or write to patient. And in my experience 99.9% of patients just have the test and wait until they hear from the doctor, and if they don't hear they presume everything is OK. Regardless of the fact they might still not feel well

Lilian

[Guest guest]

Hi Sharon

Sorry to hear your GP was rude to you. If you do have a Vit D deficiency then

you are certainly entitled to get Vit D on prescription as it's listed in the

British National Formulary as a prescribable drug.

Could you book in to see a different GP? It sounds like that one's not going to

be very pleasant to deal with.

Lou

What difference it makes to seeing a GP I dont know,as you cant get vitamins on

prescription any more.Perhaps the NHS will pay for me to take a long holiday to

top up my D3! Ha ha ha!!

[Guest guest]

Hi Lilian

They had to recover the lost ground by initiating proper testing for vit D3

after it was found that the older methods were useless (the wrong species

quantified).

Mass spec has a chance of doing that and finding the right species.

(Like ~ eg how many bulls in a china shop?)

So, I imagine there has been all h...ll let loose in the Mass Spec industry with

machines flying out the door faster than chips from a chip shop.

best wishes

Bob

wot used to chip pertaters with the chief constable of British Transport Police.

>

> Sharon,

>

> The reason we ask for reference ranges is that not all machines are calibrated

the same. It is where you are in the range that is important. From 1st April

my local hospital started measuring by mass spectrometry and 'new reference

range guidelines apply'. That was on the copy of the blood test results that I

had. I do not know whether that is universal, but may go a small way to

explaining the differences.

>

> I do not know about vitamin D but there are some things which are different

for men and women. H.D.L. and A.C.R are two. The reference range is slightly

difference in both of these for men and woman.

>

> I long suspected that the doctors never bother if the blood test results did

not indicate any lows or highs. In their eyes, why should they waste time on

normal. Secretary probably just files it away. No need even to call or

write to patient. And in my experience 99.9% of patients just have the test

and wait until they hear from the doctor, and if they don't hear they presume

everything is OK. Regardless of the fact they might still not feel well

>

> Lilian

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Lou,

I didnt know you could get any vits on nhs anymore,so thats good news,as I wony have to buy any.The idiot GP's that I spoke to on the phone are doctors I would never make an appointment to see.The first one has already put the phone down on me twice before,as she is so up herself! And the other one is the head of practice and has been very discriminating and rude to me in the past.I will only see 1 GP at this practice and the earliest I can get an appointment is 14th December,so I'll have to wait.

best wishes sharon

From: Lou <enkai111@...>Subject: Re: ignorant GP'sthyroid treatment Date: Friday, November 20, 2009, 3:03 PM

Hi SharonSorry to hear your GP was rude to you. If you do have a Vit D deficiency then you are certainly entitled to get Vit D on prescription as it's listed in the British National Formulary as a prescribable drug. Could you book in to see a different GP? It sounds like that one's not going to be very pleasant to deal with.LouWhat difference it makes to seeing a GP I dont know,as you cant get vitamins on prescription any more.Perhaps the NHS will pay for me to take a long holiday to top up my D3! Ha ha ha!!

[Guest guest]

Hi Sharon, But you'd have to fight off the G......s for the sun-loungers ... Switzerland has been the hot-bed of TB treatment since the 19th C. ....they were also using cod-liver oil too, then!Whilst the knowledge was available to the 'artists' amongst the medical profession.....it took several decades to discover the science (and some Nobel Prizes along the way). and even longer to get the lab tests right ..... (last year, to be precise ~ and still trying). It's taken the Genome Project to be able to distinguish which receptors are affected by which hormone/peptide.... and some of them are still 'orphans' ..... the paradox is, that many of the Australian 'orphans' are currently doing research on the parallel receptors with that same intellectual status ~ with much success. Although not officially an 'orphan' for the last twenty/thirty years ~ DIO2(/DIO1) has recently been shown to have a polymorphism that changes the conversion of T4 to T3/RT3..(Panicker V, et al 2008)..... (under-mining/altering the relevance of the guidance given by the BTA/RCP wrt to lab tests). If previous testing was 'wrong' for vit D3 and treatment was initiated/denied/over-prescribed/symptoms mistaken for something else, then they may be (legally) liable for failure to verify the reliability of the original testing. Because vitamin D3 receptor and thyroid hormone receptor(s) interact (as hetero-dimers) but also as homo-dimers, each with itself, the effect of wrongly quantifying vit D3 is to completely bog up the testing and treatment of thyroid hormone deficiencies. I should put the above paragraph in big red letters. Who (insurers) picks up the bill ~ let them argue between themselves. best wishes Bob Hi Lillian, The head of practice and the secretaries are unaware of any ref range changes and both have said it's not right.I do need to ring them again for blood results that are outstanding for myself,hubby and daughter andunderstand that they never get in touch unless out of range.But I had a letter from the surgery to say a blood test had come back that I needed to make an appointment with the GP for and when i phoned up,it was regarding my D3.What difference it makes to seeing a GP I dont know,as you cant get vitamins on prescription any more.Perhaps the NHS will pay for me to take a long holiday to top up my D3! Ha ha ha!!

[Guest guest]

My endo prescribed cod liver oil for me. When I asked my GP for repeat prescription he said the PCT will not allow him to prescribe cod liver oil because they do not think it is effective.

I buy it from health food shop now. And guess what - it is effective.

Lilian

[Guest guest]

If I remember rightly,the government did a drug trial maybe in the last 2 years.They gave kids in certain areas omega oil capsules every day for so long to see what effects it had.It helped in more ways than they anticipated with thing like calming kids with adhd down,kids concentrated more in class and achieved better results all round! But I've not heard of anything since,so the powers that be probably thought that,even though it worked better than expected,our children,the future of this country,are not worth the cost of a single pill each every day!

Best wishes sharon

From: Lilian <lilian15@...>Subject: Re: Re: ignorant GP'sthyroid treatment Date: Friday, November 20, 2009, 4:33 PM

My endo prescribed cod liver oil for me. When I asked my GP for repeat prescription he said the PCT will not allow him to prescribe cod liver oil because they do not think it is effective.

I buy it from health food shop now. And guess what - it is effective.

Lilian

[Guest guest]

was that the durham fish oil trial, Sharon?

THink that was funded by equazen - don't know much about it, but the trial was

slated by a lot of people i think who also slate patrick holford etc etc.

what's new?

you can't have children taking something natural like fish oil! no, much better

to give them ritalin and the like! that has probably got lots of drug company

funded trials behind it....

chris

[Guest guest]

Hi

I think it was that one,how amazing was it! Just read Mandy's post regarding fish oil tests on prisoners,WOW!! I don't understand the world and am tearful writing this post,cos the more I understand what a F*** up this world is,the more I want to go and live on a desert island and stick 2 fingers up to the world!! All the government harps on about is all areas of crime and how it's increasing and they have solutions and just don't bother implementing them! They should'nt complain about prison overcrowding when this can be solved with 1 natural pill,which I'm sure is cheaper than crap like ritalin! Everybody would lead more productive,healthy,contented,motivated and peaceful lives if they just had a few essential pills like fish oils.GRRR,it makes me so mad!!! Ok I'm gonna calm down now before I bust a blood vessel,lol!

Best wishes sharon

From: <chrisjtaylor46@...>Subject: Re: ignorant GP'sthyroid treatment Date: Friday, November 20, 2009, 10:36 PM

was that the durham fish oil trial, Sharon?THink that was funded by equazen - don't know much about it, but the trial was slated by a lot of people i think who also slate patrick holford etc etc. what's new? you can't have children taking something natural like fish oil! no, much better to give them ritalin and the like! that has probably got lots of drug company funded trials behind it....chris

[Guest guest]

Hi Sharon

it is depressing but word is i think getting around about natural treatments

being helpful. i think as time goes by and people don't get results with the

pharmaceutical stuff or no longer believe it's " just the way they are " or " it's

all in your mind " " the way you think which is your fault " then i think people

will look outside the medical box for answers.

so it is up to us to spread the word! i have suggested things to people and

most often they don't listen or even consider it, that's up to them though...but

some people are open minded and people learn when they are ready to learn.

chris

[Guest guest]

Hi

I totally agree,but I do get naffed off when you help people and they dont even say thanks! I sometimes wonder why we bother as people are so selfish these days and expect you to help them and not even try to return the gesture! I dont mind helping people or giving advice,but a little thankyou wouldnt go amiss.

Best wishes sharon

[Guest guest]

Hi

Sharon

If

you have helped somebody, it matters not whether they thank you or they don't

thank you. It is enough to know they have been helped, and that they, in turn

will be able to help others - because of how you helped them in the first

place. It spreads…...

Luv

- Sheila

Hi

I totally

agree,but I do get naffed off when you help people and they dont even say

thanks! I sometimes wonder why we bother as people are so selfish these days

and expect you to help them and not even try to return the gesture! I dont

mind helping people or giving advice,but a little thankyou wouldnt go amiss.

Best wishes sharon

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07:38:00

[Guest guest]

Hi Sheila,

That is very true,but just a bit of recognition wouldnt go amiss and I think it says a lot about a person too.I hope they would pass on the gesture to others,but you never know whether they are the kind of people that would,I can only hope.

Best wishes sharon

From: Sheila <sheila@...>Subject: RE: Re: ignorant GP'sthyroid treatment Date: Monday, November 23, 2009, 9:13 AM

Hi Sharon

If you have helped somebody, it matters not whether they thank you or they don't thank you. It is enough to know they have been helped, and that they, in turn will be able to help others - because of how you helped them in the first place. It spreads…...

Luv - Sheila

Hi

I totally agree,but I do get naffed off when you help people and they dont even say thanks! I sometimes wonder why we bother as people are so selfish these days and expect you to help them and not even try to return the gesture! I dont mind helping people or giving advice,but a little thankyou wouldnt go amiss.

Best wishes sharon

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[Guest guest]

Hi Sharon, you're right in a way,but I agree with Sheila. The inbox would get very clogged with folk saying thankyou all the time . But of course it is nice to recieve thanks, but only if there is more to the message than that.

Hi Sheila,

That is very true,but just a bit of recognition wouldnt go amiss and I think it says a lot about a person too.I hope they would pass on the gesture to others,but you never know whether they are the kind of people that would,I can only hope.

Best wishes sharon

From: Sheila <sheila@...>

Hi Sharon

If you have helped somebody, it matters not whether they thank you or they don't thank you. It is enough to know they have been helped, and that they, in turn will be able to help others - because of how you helped them in the first place. It spreads…...

Luv - Sheila

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[Guest guest]

Hi ,

I do see many people saying thankyou on the forum,which is the way I think it should be,as it reflects not only what sort of people they are,but what sort of people there are on the forum helping.The people I have helped don't even bother with the forum even though I point them in the direct route to it.They are people that,even though are hypo,have to be more or less taken by the hand to help themselves! I won't do it again,as I feel my efforts fall on deaf ears and that's energy better spent on myself.

Best wishes sharon

From: Sheila <sheilatpauk (DOT) com>

Hi Sharon

If you have helped somebody, it matters not whether they thank you or they don't thank you. It is enough to know they have been helped, and that they, in turn will be able to help others - because of how you helped them in the first place. It spreads…...

Luv - Sheila

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[Guest guest]

I think its also important to remember that many people are quite ill on here,

especially when they are new and unmedicated, totally focused on their own

health and family problems and probably have every intention on thanking people

but they forget things.... get interupted and then the moment has gone.

Last year when I was very ill I couldn't tell what day of the week it was, who

I'd had a conversation with, what I'd said to whom.... I would be trying to hold

things together and I'd only got a little energy for surviving.. I'd often

repeat things many times to one person and not tell everyone I meant to.....

Also many people are quite depressed (hypo symptom) and again that does mean

they are not functioning as they would normally.

So I wouldn't take it personally. I just assume they are too deeply involved in

their health issues to reply. When they feel better you do see a difference.

Kim x

[Guest guest]



In a lot of busy forums one of the rules is that no one liners, such as thank you, are permitted and that if people wish to thank someone they can do that through the private route.

Therefore a lot of people who belong to other forums who might have that rule might well apply that rule to all the forums they go to. Just because you do not see a thank you by someone it does not mean they have not sent one personally. It would be most unfair to judge members or the forum on something like that.

Same as things like condolences etc. It does not mean the forum is full of uncaring people if they wish to not put these messages on the forum and to send them personally.

Since being a moderator here, for many years now, I have found our members to be fantastic and always try and help where they can. They are caring and grateful. But some are very busy and some extremely stressed and most struggling to keep their heads above water healthwise.

I think one of the symptoms of hypo is the fact that they are very complacent. I remember Dr. Skinner telling me that once. I was with a friend who was seeing him and afterwards he said to me "you are hypothyroid and need treatment". I said yes I was and was already taking thyroxine. He replied "well you are not taking enough then, increase it". I said I couldn't take any more because the doctor wouldn't prescribe any more. In typical Dr. Skinner manner he sort of put his hands in the air and said something about "typical hypothyroid" and then something about being complacent etc.

Lilian

as it reflects not only what sort of people they are,but what sort of people there are on the forum

[Guest guest]

I don't think Sharon was talking about people on here (or other forums) but it

was rather a general observation?

chris

>

>

>

> I think its also important to remember that many people are quite ill on here,

especially when they are new and unmedicated, totally focused on their own

health and family problems and probably have every intention on thanking people

but they forget things.... get interupted and then the moment has gone.

[Guest guest]

That's so true Kim - I just want members to get better - that is

the best thank you that anybody can get. Also, I do remember times when I have

asked members NOT to send an email just saying " Dear **** - Thank

you " as we have too many messages to cope with some days. If the NHS is

not going to help them, and lets face it, they come to forums like this because

they have had no help there, then it is up to us to do what we can to help

them.

Luv - Sheila

I think its also important to remember that many people are quite ill on here,

especially when they are new and unmedicated, totally focused on their own

health and family problems and probably have every intention on thanking people

but they forget things.... get interupted and then the moment has gone.

Last year when I was very ill I couldn't tell what day of the week it was, who

I'd had a conversation with, what I'd said to whom.... I would be trying to

hold things together and I'd only got a little energy for surviving.. I'd often

repeat things many times to one person and not tell everyone I meant to.....

Also many people are quite depressed (hypo symptom) and again that does mean

they are not functioning as they would normally.

So I wouldn't take it personally. I just assume they are too deeply involved in

their health issues to reply. When they feel better you do see a difference.

Kim x

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found in this incoming message.

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19:40:00

[Guest guest]

I am sure you are right Chris.

Lilian

I don't think Sharon was talking about people on here (or other forums) but it was rather a general observation?