Re: Shocked by GP's response to Genova

[Guest guest]

What are you wanting from the GP Lesley? Is it to be prescribed medication for

adrenal fatigue? I think it will be best if you follow up the info on this site

and others which tells you how to self treat. That way you can be sure to make

some progress.

The NHS just dont get adrenal fatigue and so i think it is worthless trying to

convince them of its existence.

>

> I have toyed with writing this this evening because a) I'm quite upset about

it all and I feel like I am telling tales on my GP but it has to be said so

I'm not going to hold back.

>

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[Guest guest]

This doctor MUST be reported Lesney before he ruins other

patient's lives. This is quite appalling and is a prime example of a doctor who

should not be treating patients because of his serious lack of knowledge and

his serious lack of keeping his knowledge up to date. What were the title of

the two books he tried to prove to you that such a condition as adrenal fatigue

doesn't exist. Actually, I do believe that you could be suffering with either

borderline 's or full blown 's and it is ESSENTIAL THAT YOUR

DOCTOR REFERS YOU TO A CONSULTANT IMMEDIATELY FOR AN ACTH TEST.

You need to send him the following links http://www.ehow.com/about_4598654_adrenal-gland-exhaustion.html

and http://www.drlam.com/articles/adrenal_fatigue.asp

What you need to do first and foremost is to send him a letter

and please send a copy to the Head of Practice Also, Copy the attached Genova

Quality Assurance letter and add that too.

Tell him that you are fully aware that the NHS test ONLY for

's disease (too little or NO cortisol) and Cushing's Syndrome (too high

a secretion by the adrenal glands of cortisol). Tell him that you are aware that

the NHS have NO TEST for low adrenal reserve, so if patients want to get their

adrenal function tested, they have to get this done privately. They have no

other choice. Genova is a very highly respected private laboratory as can be

testified through their Quality Assurance.

Tell him that you are not prepared to take on his diagnosis that

you have a mental problem because you know this is a physical problem and your

24 hour salivary adrenal profile proves it.

Write a list of all your symptoms and signs (check against those

in our web site under hypothyroidism www.tpa-uk.org.uk

). Take your basal temperature for 4 or 5 mornings before you get out of bed. Normal

temperature is 98.6. If yours is lower than 97.8, this is an indication you

could be suffering with a low metabolism, usually indicative of hypothyroidism

- it could be MUCH lower. Temperature matters with low adrenal reserve -

see Dr Rind's temperature Chart http://www.drlam.com/articles/adrenal_fatigue.asp

and send a copy of this to your GP and Head of Practice.

I would be inclined to tell him of your great concern that he

has never heard of adrenal fatigue, or low adrenal reserve before as this is

well documented in many of the medical journals and that just because HE has

not heard of it doesn't mean that it doesn't exist. He might have spent years

studying to be a doctor, but how many years ago was that, and I would ask why

he has not kept his medical knowledge up to date through regular research. It

is so easy for doctors to blame the patient and hand out antidepressants, it

takes them off the hook of having to find a real cause for your suffering - out

you go from his office clutching an antidepressant prescription, in comes in another

poor sod who will also likely be given exactly the same. Sorry, I am going off

track.

In your letter, tell him that because of his lack of knowledge

about adrenal fatigue, even though he may know lots about 's and Cushing's,

you now want an IMMEDIATE REFERRAL to a specialist at your local hospital for

an IMMEIDATE ACTH TEST. Point out that such an urgent referral is needed

because every sample taken throughout the 24 hour period showing the amount of

cortisol being secreted by your adrenal glands are way outside the bottom of

the reference range - and this could be DANGEROUS. Sorry Lesney, I don't want

to alarm you unnecessarily, but you have to get the message through to the GP

and to the Practice Manager to show them how neglectful they are being. Bt

ignoring your symptoms at this stage and pretending 'it's all in your head'

could lead to full blown ADDISON'S DISEASE - and believe me, you don't want

that. Tell him that you are NOT prepared to put up with his diagnosis of

'mental' problems and that before he can reach such a conclusion HE HAS TO

ENSURE THAT EVERY OTHER POSSIBLE CAUSE FOR YOUR SYMPTOMS HAS BEEN THOROUGHLY

INVESTIGATED. Giving a diagnosis of Functional Somatoform Disorder is the

diagnosis that should be given when all other possible causes have been

eliminated. This doctor is NOT doing this - so tell him straight. This is your

health. He should be working with his patient - read 'Duties of a Doctor'

expected by the General Medical Council - I would remind him about these http://www.gmc-uk.org/guidance/good_medical_practice/duties_of_a_doctor.asp

Don't let this idiot get you down. Be strong Lesney and let him

know how assertive you can be.

Tell him that you want your letter of requests to be placed into

your medical notes and that you want a written response from him within 7 working

days - otherwise you will take your complaint further. He needs to put in

writing the evidence that no such disease as low adrenal reserve (adrenal

fatigue) exists and in writing that you are suffering with nothing else but a

mental problem - and if he writes back, you must keep copies of everything.

Everything you have written and everything that comes back to you in case you

need to take this further.

I would also put in the letter that you have no faith in your

GP's ability whatsoever and that you therefore do not wish to be seen by him

again and would like another doctor in the practice. If there is no such

doctor, write to your PCT who will find you another doctor in your area.

We have to fight our corner if we want our health back, so

good luck Lesney. We are here to help you.

Luv - Sheila

Cortisol

Sample 1 - 4.0 (12-22)

Sample 2 - 1.2 (5.0-9.0)

Sample 3 - 1.0 (3.0-7.0)

Sample 4 - 0.4 (1.0-3.0)

DHEA

Sample 2 - 0.73

Sample 3 - 0.63 (0.4-1.47)

DHEA : Cortisol ratio 10.30 (2.0-6.0)

Firstly when he saw the report from Genova he immediately became haughty and

kept telling me he didn't understand what I was showing him. I tried to explain

but he said it didn't mean anything. He'd never heard of adrenal fatigue and

flicked through a couple of books to prove it. Then he questioned why I had

persisted in pursuing a diagnosis which was a waste of time and money.

I am usually a confident person but he immediately put me on edge and almost

unable to get a coherent sentence out.

He continued to question me asking why I was so against taking antidepressants.

He said that he would not be prescribing them because he thinks I have a mental

health problem but because they can be utilised in other conditions. Then, and

I can't remember what I said to prompt this, he said he was beginning to think

I might be psychotic because I was wasting time and money on useless tests and

unsubstantiated research. He told me how many years he had spent studying to be

a doctor and he really made me feel small.

He asked why I had refused the treatment offered and I had to point out that I

hadn't yet been offered any. He said he would not be prescribing anything except

antidepressants.

And so I left demoralised, feeling like I have an IQ of 5 and feeling about 2

inches tall.

I also left with a prescription for antidepressants and left behind a doctor

who I really don't think I would like to see again. I'm sure if I ask to change

GP again he will think it is because I disagree with his diagnosis and

treatment. It won't. It will be because I don't think he has given me or the

fact I have been unwell for 7 months any consideration. I admitted to being a

bit obsessive about my health at the moment because it's important to me but I

really didn't need to be treated the way I was today by a 'professional'.

Lesney x

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Genova Quality Assurance.pdf

GTS Table Update 2.doc

[Guest guest]

Yeah, a gp with lots of experience, unfortunately it's the same one day's

experience repeated over and over again. So if he's so smart and well educated,

why couldn't he understand your test results and about adrenal fatigue?

Don't waste your energy on him, or getting upset because he made you feel small.

He's just a miserable bully and he probably has a miserable life.

Find another doctor, or take charge of your own health. Give up with him and

move on.

Your adrenals are in a pretty awful state and no wonder you feel bad. You need

to take nutri adrenal extra, and perhaps HC. Are you on thyroid meds? How

much?

(Galathea)

> I had results back from the adrenal stress saliva test from Genova and took

them to show my GP today.

>

> They were :

>

> Cortisol

> Sample 1 - 4.0 (12-22)

> Sample 2 - 1.2 (5.0-9.0)

> Sample 3 - 1.0 (3.0-7.0)

> Sample 4 - 0.4 (1.0-3.0)

> DHEA

> Sample 2 - 0.73

> Sample 3 - 0.63 (0.4-1.47)

> DHEA : Cortisol ratio 10.30 (2.0-6.0)

>

> His response has left me stunned, very upset and ready to complain to the

practice manager (again).

>

[Guest guest]

Hello Lesney,

I am so sorry for the way you have been treated and angry on your behalf. Reading your account on your GP visit really galled me – you must not doubt yourself in any way, this GP is a disgrace to the medical profession; but they are not all like that, thankfully.

If I were in your shoes, I would do two things – write a letter to your GP and cc it to the practice manager (or the other way round) and look for another GP. Writing letters is so much easier than being put on the spot, particularly for us hypo patients, and for those of us with low adrenal function (like yours) standing up to bullies is a very difficult task. You need sufficient cortisol to deal with stressful situations, and you ain't got much of that ! In this letter point that –

a) you are taking offence to the way your GP has tried to bully (and if it were me, I would use the word `bully') you into submission over his idea of treatment and you no longer have any confidence in his ability to treat you. Ask the question how - in his opinion - antidepressants could possibly help your particular condition. After all, he has first stated that you do not have a mental condition, although later revised that and said you might be psychotic… (what *does* he think your condition is, btw??? Is he at least clear about *that*?)

Genova is a very reputable private laboratory, and your test results show clearly that your adrenal function is extremely low. Those test results are almost self explanatory and if your GP in spite of `all his years of study' is unable to understand what they mean, then perhaps he should either refresh his knowledge or at the least offer to refer you to someone who – unlike him - is able to understand those results.

c) If it were me, I would give this surgery two fingers and look for a better GP….You owe them nothing and you deserve better treatment than that !

All the best,

[Guest guest]

Thank you everyone for your comments. I will be writing to the practice as soon

as I can think clearly enough. I'm still upset but beginning to feel angry too -

mainly because I let him get to me.

I held it all in at the time but when I got home I was in floods of tears and

hyperventilating. This is only the second time in my life that someone has upset

me so much that I ended up in that state (the first was my husband a few years

ago). My husband was out when I got home and I tried to keep away from the kids

so they wouldn't see me upset but I wasn't too successful and my 10 year old

daughter soon found me which wasn't good.

This morning my eyes looked like I'd gone 10 round with Mike Tyson!

Isn't it everyday life and stresses that are supposed to tip us over the edge

while the doctor helps to bring us back to reality? Not the other way around...

There was one thing I forgot to tell him. The family planning doc has referred

me for a scan because for the first time in 8 years with the Mirena coil I have

started bleeding heavily and out of cycle. I wonder if he'd have said the

antidepressants would help that too?

I'll keep you updated.

Lesney x

> And so I left demoralised, feeling like I have an IQ of 5 and feeling about 2

inches tall.

>

> I also left with a prescription for antidepressants and left behind a doctor

who I really don't think I would like to see again. I'm sure if I ask to change

GP again he will think it is because I disagree with his diagnosis and

treatment. It won't. It will be because I don't think he has given me or the

fact I have been unwell for 7 months any consideration. I admitted to being a

bit obsessive about my health at the moment because it's important to me but I

really didn't need to be treated the way I was today by a 'professional'.

>

> Lesney x

>

[Guest guest]

Lesney - I'm so sorry to hear how badly you were treated. That GP needs to go for retraining in how not to bully his patients.I think you need to make the point in your letter that he has absolutely NO biochemical evidence that you have a serotonin deficiency (which is what antidepressants are supposed to remedy) but that you DO have biochemical evidence of a cortisol deficiency, so why on earth is he not following that up.I think you should write your letter to make your points. However, you should look for a new GP at the same time, as this one sounds like he's too far gone to be educated (that is over and above the 5 hours of lectures he probably got in endocrinology at medical school!!).

[Guest guest]

Hello Lesney,

I had almost the same from my GP. He looked at the Genova results from my

adrenal function test and 24hr urine thyroid test - he did not know what he was

looking - his face was blank. He gave the copy test results back to me and

changed the subject.

The endo I saw, who I expected to be more knowledgeable, ignored both tests from

Genova saying that they were unorthodox. To date I have not got any reasons

from him as to why he thought they were unorthodox. In the thyroid test result

my T3 was under range - yet he said I did not have hypothyroidism.

I think NHS doctors do not know about up-to-date research - they only know what

they need on a day to day basis. When a patient researches their condition, the

doctors try to intimidate the patient because it shows their own lack of

knowledge.

Think about this scenario - you have been driving for years- you give someone a

lift in your car and they start telling you how to drive - do you smile sweetly

and take notice of them - or do you stop the car and tell them to get out and

walk.

I am not defending doctors - but if you understand their lack of knowledge makes

them nasty then you have power over them. Passive aggression is sometimes

better than hitting them over the head with your bag. (what a lovely thought )

I went to night school for five years studying psychology. Make friends with

your enemy - that way you learn their weaknesses.

B

[Guest guest]

Hi Lesney, I'm sorry you went through that experience, it is really hard

especially with adrenal fatigue to be able to cope with situtions like that and

think coherently enough at the time to be able to stand your ground.When I'm

under stress like that my mind sometimes goes blank and afterwards I can't even

clearly remember the sitauation.A few years ago I saw my gp who refused to

listen and acknowledge I had thyroid problem and was very pratronising (I was

quite new to this too).I left the surgery and burst into tears afterwards and

felt so intimidated.I hope you manage to find a more sympathetic gp or find

treatment for your adrenals elsewhere.Once your adrenals are adequately treated

you will feel stronger,

x

He continued to question me asking why I was so against taking antidepressants.

He said that he would not be prescribing them because he thinks I have a mental

health problem but because they can be utilised in other conditions. Then, and I

can't remember what I said to prompt this, he said he was beginning to think I

might be psychotic because I was wasting time and money on useless tests and

unsubstantiated research. He told me how many years he had spent studying to be

a doctor and he really made me feel small.