Re: ok folks, now i'm REALLY confused!!!! Any ideas?????

[Guest guest]

Hi P, Once medicated the TSH isn't really helpful. i would be looking more at the frees. T3 is certainly in range, but there can be an enormous amount of difference from the bottom of the range to the top and there is room for improvement. T4 at 16 is also a long way from the top too. The highish cholesterol is also an indicator that you are still undermedicated. Low iron will certainly make you feel tired- that ferritin level could be much higher= it's near the bottom of the range. remember not to take iron supplements near thyroid meds or they'll cancel each other out! > Subject: ok folks, now i'm REALLY confused!!!! Any ideas?????> > Hi everyone,> > I just received some of my test results today. I'm quite confused. My free T3 levels are the highest they have EVER been 4.8 (in a range of 3.1 - 5.4) and my TSH is 0.3 but I am ABSOLUTELY exhausted most of the time. I thought I'd have a bit more 'pep' with a TSH of 0.3 and an increased amount of free T3, but alas it isn't the case and I'm still falling asleep through the day and needing to rest on a constant basis.> > Here are the results that I got back today.> > TSH 0.3 (in ref range of 0.5 - 4.0) in July 09 my TSH was 5.8> Free T4 16 (in ref range of 10 -25) in July 09 my Free T4 was 16> Free T3 4.8 (in ref range of 3.1 - 5.4) in July 09 my Free T3 was 3.7> Iron studies test results are as follows:> Ferritin 17 (in range of 10 - 150) in July 09 it was 27, but I have been vegetarian for the last 3 months, so maybe that has some bearing on the lower figure.> Any comments on my results and any ideas about why I might be so exhausted all the time, would be appreciated. Low iron?? Could that be a culprit??????> > P xo> > > > ------------------------------------> > TPA is not medically qualified. Consult with a qualified medical practitioner before changing medication.> >

[Guest guest]

Still think you have adrenal insufficiency P - you really need

to take this into account. Can you get the 24 hour salivary adrenal profile

done to see exactly what is happening.

TSH 0.3 (in ref range of 0.5 - 4.0) in July 09 my TSH was 5.8

Free T4 16 (in ref range of 10 -25) in July 09 my Free T4 was 16

Free T3 4.8 (in ref range of 3.1 - 5.4) in July 09 my Free T3 was 3.7

All of those appear excellent

B12 is 227 (in range of 100 - 700) in July 09 it was 290.

That is NOT good. B12 should be right at the top of this

reference range. You may need to start off with a course of B12 injections.

Folate is 21.8 (in range of 6.5 - 45.0) in July 09 it was 20.8

Again, this is too low and needs supplementing.

Ferritin 17 (in range of 10 - 150) in July 09 it was 27, but I have been

vegetarian for the last 3 months, so maybe that has some bearing on the lower

figure.

Again, this is FAR TOO LOW. You need to take at least 200mgs

ferrous sulphate (Fumerate) probably 3 times daily to start with to build up

your stored iron. It is no wonder you are feeling so bad and so fatigued.

Iron 9 (in range of 8 - 27) in July 09 it was 8

Bottom of the reference range P. All of these once treated,

should make a dramatic change to your health.

You now need to concentrate on supplementing all of these,

because they are all too low.

Any comments on my results and any ideas about why I might be so exhausted all

the time, would be appreciated. Low iron?? Could that be a culprit??????

P xo

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18:44:00

[Guest guest]

Hi P,

Was the folate ~ red cell folate or serum folate?

Bob

>

> Hi everyone,

>

> I just received some of my test results today. I'm quite confused. My free

T3 levels are the highest they have EVER been 4.8 (in a range of 3.1 - 5.4) and

my TSH is 0.3 but I am ABSOLUTELY exhausted most of the time.

[Guest guest]

Hi P

what dose medication are you taking?

what sort of symptoms are you experiencing?

[Guest guest]

serum folate i think bob. it just said b12/folate on the test request form.

>

> Hi P,

>

> Was the folate ~ red cell folate or serum folate?

>

> Bob

[Guest guest]

Thanks for your input Sheila, I really appreciate it.

I'll take your comments into account when I work out what I need to do next.

P xo

[Guest guest]

Hi P,

The calculation goes

serum cell folate = total folate minus red cell folate.

they measure both so ought to report both.

My serum folate was in the dumps before I got it back up again and began to

recover a modicum of memory ~ and intellectual function ~ you only realise that,

some time down the road, after getting your short-term memory back....when you

can string two long words together...:-)

might be worth checking what it was, serum or red cell?

Bob

> >

> > Hi P,

> >

> > Was the folate ~ red cell folate or serum folate?

> >

> > Bob

>

[Guest guest]

Sheila, what happens when your vitamin B12 is at the lower end of the range? I

should know all this stuff by now, but I don't. Will supplementing with a B

complex help??? I guess it would help to some degree.

P

>

> B12 is 227 (in range of 100 - 700) in July 09 it was 290.

> That is NOT good. B12 should be right at the top of this reference range.

> You may need to start off with a course of B12 injections.

[Guest guest]

Bob, I just had a look at the pathology lab website. I had a serum folate test

done. I remember the colours of the vials that they put the blood into, and the

'white' vial that they used corresponds with serum folate test.

How did you increase your folate levels? I think I'm asking some pretty dumb

and basic questions tonight, but I've never had to take folate (except for maybe

when I was pregnant????). What do you use? Did it help your short term memory

a lot when you got your folate levels up??? My memory is shot. I relate a lot

to Dory in Finding Nemo. We are very alike and I'm not joking about that!!!!

P xo

>

> Hi P,

>

> The calculation goes

>

> serum cell folate = total folate minus red cell folate.

>

> they measure both so ought to report both.

>

> My serum folate was in the dumps before I got it back up again and began to

recover a modicum of memory ~ and intellectual function ~ you only realise that,

some time down the road, after getting your short-term memory back....when you

can string two long words together...:-)

> might be worth checking what it was, serum or red cell?

[Guest guest]

150mcg of thyroxine.

symptoms are as follows: exhaustion, tightness in chest, occasional shortness

of breath, a lot of weight gain, short term memory loss. they are the main

symptoms at the moment.

>

> Hi P

>

> what dose medication are you taking?

>

> what sort of symptoms are you experiencing?

>

[Guest guest]

Hi P,

I understand that you may need extra folate to get the vit B12 into the system

and to conserve it (in the kidneys) once it's there.

The folate helps to form a protein called CUB (may be intrinsic-factor-related )

Low Vit B12 causes pernicious anemia and affects both the overall function and

the memory.

the level (B12) you are showing is in the range that responds to

supplementation.....according to work done in Durham UK)

....all the B vits need supplementing if some of them are adrift.

Bob

>

> Sheila, what happens when your vitamin B12 is at the lower end of the range?

I should know all this stuff by now, but I don't. Will supplementing with a B

complex help??? I guess it would help to some degree.

> P

[Guest guest]

thanks jenny. T3 is the highest it has EVER been. i was below the lowest end

of the normal ref range at one point so I'm really happy that it is 4.8 now. It

is unheard of!!!! T4 has remained steady at about 16 -17 for years and years.

The higher cholesterol has only occurred since I started using thyroxine. I

think it might be time for some iron supplementation based on your comments and

others i've received on the forum. yes, thanks for the reminder. I won't take

the iron at the same time as the thyroxine. (:

P xo

>

>

> Hi P,

> Once medicated the TSH isn't really helpful. i would be looking more at

the frees. T3 is certainly in range, but there can be an enormous amount of

difference from the bottom of the range to the top and there is room for

improvement. T4 at 16 is also a long way from the top too. The highish

cholesterol is also an indicator that you are still undermedicated. Low iron

will certainly make you feel tired- that ferritin level could be much higher=

it's near the bottom of the range. remember not to take iron supplements near

thyroid meds or they'll cancel each other out!

[Guest guest]

Bob,

Thanks for explaining it to me. You don't happen to have a reference to the

work done in Durham UK do you? Even if you have the name of the researcher so I

can look it up myself. I'm not expecting you to look it up for me, but I'd love

to have a look at the paper.

I haven't explored the B12/folate thing, even though I've always had the tests

done. Showing my ignorance there! I just assumed if they were in range, I was

ok, but based on comments here the amounts might be too low. I will bring it up

with my endo. This is why this forum is so valuable. I've taken lots of

questions to my docs based on what I've found out here and it has resulted in me

finding out about things that the doctors had to attend to. Very grateful for

your help and others help on the forum.

I would like to have my memory back and stop being Dory. I will commence a B

complex thingo again.

P xo

>

> Hi P,

>

> I understand that you may need extra folate to get the vit B12 into the system

and to conserve it (in the kidneys) once it's there.

>

> The folate helps to form a protein called CUB (may be intrinsic-factor-related

)

>

> Low Vit B12 causes pernicious anemia and affects both the overall function and

the memory.

>

> the level (B12) you are showing is in the range that responds to

supplementation.....according to work done in Durham UK)

>

> ...all the B vits need supplementing if some of them are adrift.

[Guest guest]

I was gunna say labs look great and it appears you dont have a coversion problem

as your t3 is at the higher end of the range

have you spoke to your doc about maybe other medication options if thyroxine is

making you feel this way

have you checked am temps?

have you had a saliva or cortisol test done recently?

how is your sleep?

[Guest guest]

Hi P,

I'm taking 5mg (milligrams) folic acid /day (if I don't forget it), this

last eighteen months. Interesting to see the range quoted is up to 45?

It took about two-three months to make a difference to my short-term

memory....my GP having said the usual guff about 'it's in range'....my

aunt Fanny....it was so low, it was getting it's feet wet. 

It's very low cost so many people need it but don't get it.

Both vit B12 and folate are needed in the methylating cycle ( so that

means all cells).

....have they done a haemotology report on cell size and that range of

tests (full blood)?

Weren't you concerned that your ammonia level was high?

Bob

> >

> > Hi P,

> >

> > The calculation goes

> >

> > serum cell folate = total folate minus red cell folate.

> >

> > they measure both so ought to report both.

> >

> > My serum folate was in the dumps before I got it back up again and

began to recover a modicum of memory ~ and intellectual function ~ you

only realise that, some time down the road, after getting your

short-term memory back....when you can string two long words

together...:-)

>

> > might be worth checking what it was, serum or red cell?

>

[Guest guest]

OK Bob, now I'm going to look like even more of a dummy. Do I need to be

concerned about ammonia levels?? When I called for the test results, I had a

full blood picture done and was told that everything was fine. I will be

picking up a copy of all of my test results on Tuesday, so I'll have a look at

it. what happens if your ammonia levels are high? Mine have been ok in

previous tests.

why is it interesting that the range quoted is up to 45?

thanks for letting me know how much folic acid you take. i will see if it makes

any difference to my short term memory. It has kind of been a bit liberating to

spend the last few months supplement free, but my poor old bod has suffered for

it so I might have to get on the bandwagon again and start using stuff. Rats.

Yes, they did a full blood picture but I don't have the results because I called

on the phone. Hopefully I can pick up the results on Tuesday.

P xo

>

>

> Hi P,

>

> I'm taking 5mg (milligrams) folic acid /day (if I don't forget it), this

> last eighteen months. Interesting to see the range quoted is up to 45?

>

>

> It took about two-three months to make a difference to my short-term

> memory....my GP having said the usual guff about 'it's in range'....my

> aunt Fanny....it was so low, it was getting it's feet wet. 

>

> It's very low cost so many people need it but don't get it.

>

> Both vit B12 and folate are needed in the methylating cycle ( so that

> means all cells).

>

> ...have they done a haemotology report on cell size and that range of

> tests (full blood)?

>

> Weren't you concerned that your ammonia level was high?

[Guest guest]

i'm going to discuss other medication options on tuesday, but expect the endo

will just get me to 'split' my doses and take them at funny times of the day. I

will let them know that it didn't really do anything and are there other

options. my trouble is that i can't seem to tolerate T3 supplementation, so my

options are limited.

yes, am temps are fine. got my nutritional doc to look at them and they were

happy with the temps.

NOO, saliva cortisol test hasn't been done ever.

sleep was completely lousy (not tired until 2 or 3am most days) until i went to

the country for 2 weeks and slept in a room that allowed the sun to stream in,

in the morning. sleep has regulated itself now. it is 10.20pm over here right

now and i'm almost ready for bed. It is a bit of a miracle. I sleep well.

P xo

>

> I was gunna say labs look great and it appears you dont have a coversion

problem as your t3 is at the higher end of the range

> have you spoke to your doc about maybe other medication options if thyroxine

is making you feel this way

> have you checked am temps?

> have you had a saliva or cortisol test done recently?

> how is your sleep?

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Sheila.

This pernicious anaemia...how do you know if you have it? And what do you do for

it/how do you treat it?

I'm wondering if this could be one of my problems?

Happy Birthday!!

Luv

---

[Guest guest]

Hi Sheila.

This pernicious anaemia...how do you know if you have it? And what do you do for

it/how do you treat it?

I'm wondering if this could be one of my problems?

Happy Birthday!!

Luv

---

[Guest guest]

..

>

> This pernicious anaemia...how do you know if you have it? And what do you do

for it/how do you treat it?

>

> Hi ,

My sister has pernicious anaemia. her symptoms were fatique, severe bruising

after just slight knocks, and (huge) blood clots at menstruation.

As i understand it she has antibodies so cannot absorb b12. she had injections

en mass, and now has them every few months, but feels run down when she is due

for an injection. She needs this treatment for life.

Jan x

>

> ---

>

[Guest guest]

..

>

> This pernicious anaemia...how do you know if you have it? And what do you do

for it/how do you treat it?

>

> Hi ,

My sister has pernicious anaemia. her symptoms were fatique, severe bruising

after just slight knocks, and (huge) blood clots at menstruation.

As i understand it she has antibodies so cannot absorb b12. she had injections

en mass, and now has them every few months, but feels run down when she is due

for an injection. She needs this treatment for life.

Jan x

>

> ---

>

[Guest guest]

Hi P - you keep saying that you cannot tolerate 3. T3 is the

active hormone your body needs to make it function. If you cannot tolerate it,

you need to find out exactly the reason why not. There are many conditions that

stop thyroid hormone from working. It points to your adrenals. It is my guess

that once you get the 24 hour salivary adrenal profile done and start

treatment, all your other problems will suddenly plop into place. Do you have a

birthday or celebration coming up where you could ask friends, relatives to

donate money instead of presents or can you beg, borrow or steal the money to

get it done?

Luv - Sheila

i'm going to discuss other medication options

on tuesday, but expect the endo will just get me to 'split' my doses and take

them at funny times of the day. I will let them know that it didn't really do

anything and are there other options. my trouble is that i can't seem to

tolerate T3 supplementation, so my options are limited.

yes, am temps are fine. got my nutritional doc to look at them and they were

happy with the temps.

NOO, saliva cortisol test hasn't been done ever.

sleep was completely lousy (not tired until 2 or 3am most days) until i went to

the country for 2 weeks and slept in a room that allowed the sun to stream in,

in the morning. sleep has regulated itself now. it is 10.20pm over here right

now and i'm almost ready for bed. It is a bit of a miracle. I sleep well.

P xo

>

> I was gunna say labs look great and it appears you dont have a coversion

problem as your t3 is at the higher end of the range

> have you spoke to your doc about maybe other medication options if

thyroxine is making you feel this way

> have you checked am temps?

> have you had a saliva or cortisol test done recently?

> how is your sleep?

>

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found in this incoming message.

Checked by AVG - www.avg.com

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18:44:00

[Guest guest]

Thanks Jan. Is there a test you can do for pernicious anaemia? I'm wanting my

Endo to run several tests and am wondering if this is something he can do too.

Cheers

>

>

>

> .

> >

> > This pernicious anaemia...how do you know if you have it? And what do you do

for it/how do you treat it?

> >

>

> > Hi ,

> My sister has pernicious anaemia. her symptoms were fatique, severe bruising

after just slight knocks, and (huge) blood clots at menstruation.

> As i understand it she has antibodies so cannot absorb b12. she had injections

en mass, and now has them every few months, but feels run down when she is due

for an injection. She needs this treatment for life.

>

> Jan x

> >

> > ---

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Hi All. In May 2009 my result for B12 was 210 out of a range of 140-914. Sheila

mentioned to someone else who had a similar result as me, needing injections to

help the situation. Where would I get these injections? My GP? My Endo?

According to the results, I'm WITHIN range so how could I convince them this is

something I am needing?

Luv

[Guest guest]

Hi - read here http://hcd2.bupa.co.uk/fact_sheets/html/pernicious_anaemia.html

My birthday was 28th September, but thanks anyway. Strangely

enough, it is 's birthday today - so perhaps there is a bit of spookiness

here.

Luv - Sheila

This pernicious anaemia...how do you know if you have it? And what do you do

for it/how do you treat it?

I'm wondering if this could be one of my problems?

Happy Birthday!!

Luv

---

No virus

found in this incoming message.

Checked by AVG - www.avg.com

Version: 8.5.423 / Virus Database: 270.14.25/2450 - Release Date: 10/22/09

18:44:00