Re: To Fill or Not to Fill

[Guest guest]

Fills are not given routinely or on any set schedule, but only when

needed. you always want to have the smallest fill possible that

allows good weight loss and dims your (real) appetitie, never the

largest fill you can tolerate.

I'd strongly suggest never getting a fill when you are already having

trouble - as you are with your " first bite syndrome " . Only get a fill

when you are having no or very infrequent trouble with the current

level, as any more fill will always make things worse and can get you

in real trouble.

Bread is the #1 problem for bandters and just is not good band food -

so just don't eat it! VERY few people can tolerate breads. Get your

needed fiber from better band sources. Don't waste pouch space on

things that will hurt you or not help your weight loss and health

goals.

Any time you have pain, stop eating for that meal! somethinbg is

wrong and you should listen to your body. The pain seems like your

STOP sign, so you should not be eating more - never more than 1/2-1

cup of solids. More than that, and you can easily stretch your pouch,

which often leads to a slip. Remember, the pouch is only the size of

a golfball and can only stretch to 2-3 times that. More can easily

cause pouch problems.

The pain when you first start eating can be esophageal spasms, and

they only get worse with more fill. You need to get them under

control before you get more fill. Try drinking a cup of hot tea right

before eating. This can relax the stoma and stop the spasms from

occurring. Also be certain to choose only good band foods, be sure

they are very moist (not dry), start with tiny bites (pea-sized) and

chew very well. Also be certain that you are getting enough fluids

in - at least 64-100 oz a day. that keeps your throat and GI tract

lubricated and thr mucous membranes intact. If you have any pain or

problems, never get another fill until the problem is solved.

I'd take at least a few more weeks to get all this in control, then

consider another fill if you're still not losing well. Sandy R

> That is the question....

> Sept. 13 will be six weeks since my last fill. In these past 5

> weeks I have managed to lose app. 8 lbs. However, I've spent the

> last 2 weeks losing and gaining the same 3 or 4. I know we should

> go by how our loss is going and not our feeling of restriction and

> wondering if I should ask the doc not to fill at this next visit.

I

> have slacked off on the gym this last month, but with the kids back

> to school now, I'm starting up again 3 days to start then on to 5

> days. Very scared of filling too soon or too tight. Need advice

on

> whether or not to stay at this level and just count the gaining as

> the result of not exercising.

>

> My second question....I notice a lot of pain with my first few

bites

> of food. It can happen with just plain protien and also when there

> is bread involved. When the pain subsides I'm usually ok to

> continue eating. Is this what " getting stuck " means? Is it only

> because I might not be paying attention to small bites and chewing

> or could there be another reason for it. I actually have to stop

> and wait and try to breathe while the pain passes. This almost

> never happens at night when I seem hungrier and able to eat lots

> more.

[Guest guest]

I have a third fill scheduled for Monday! I now have 2.0 and will receive

another .5 on Monday. My question is...I'm not really getting full very quickly

(my reasoning for getting a fill). If I end up not eating a great deal it's

usually because I get stuck more than full. I've learned the signals so I

stop before I PB, but I actually am still hungry even after stopping, sometimes!

I just don't want to get sick so I stop. Does this mean I should go along

with the fill and learn how to take smaller bites and chew better (I am trying

and have gotten better)? What do you guys think?

~Deb

[Guest guest]

Wednesday, September 7, 2005, 8:56:25 AM, you wrote:

m> However, I've spent the

m> last 2 weeks losing and gaining the same 3 or 4.

You've lost 8 in 5 weeks, that's great.

m> I know we should

m> go by how our loss is going and not our feeling

m> of restriction and

m> wondering if I should ask the doc not to fill at

m> this next visit.

I wouldn't get a fill now.

m> tight. Need advice on

m> whether or not to stay at this level and just

m> count the gaining as

m> the result of not exercising.

You're not gaining. The up and down is normal, particularly if you

weigh daily. Constipation, " time of the month " , salty foods, etc, all

can change you two to four pounds in a day or two, up or down.

m> My second question....I notice a lot of pain with

m> my first few bites

m> of food. It can happen with just plain protien

m> and also when there

m> is bread involved. When the pain subsides I'm

m> usually ok to

m> continue eating. Is this what " getting stuck "

m> means?

Yes. Why not skip the bread all together?

m> Is it only

m> because I might not be paying attention to small

m> bites and chewing

m> or could there be another reason for it.

could be what the food is. But most things will work with enough

chewing and small enough bites. For me I no longer try things that I

love such as bread, calamari, clams, oysters.

m> I

m> actually have to stop

m> and wait and try to breathe while the pain

m> passes. This almost

m> never happens at night when I seem hungrier and

m> able to eat lots

m> more.

Most of us can eat more later in the day. I can't eat solids before

noon, so I don't try. They just get stuck and hurt. Then I have to

be careful at night, so I don't overdo it. That's one of many reasons

we don't keep junk food or sweets in the house.

Forget the fill. Work on your eating and exercising. Consider

joining BandsterWorkout, which is a pretty low traffic group.

dan

Dan Lester, Boise, ID honu@... www.mylapband.tk

Dr. Ortiz, Tijuana, 4/28/03

323/209/199 Age 62 Fair is whatever God decides to do.

[Guest guest]

How can the doc tell ahead of time what wuil be needed?? Fills are not

given on a schedule or at a set amount - they must be individualized

for each person, and evaluated (ideally( with a fluor. Otherwise, they

are purely a guessing game. Fills can be anywehere from 0.1 cc to 7-8

cc.

The ONLY way to tell if a fill is good is by your weight loss. How fast

you get full is really no clue at all - this depernds on what you ar

eting, how fast, what time of day, and many other variables that will

only confuse you.

Also, it's a good idea to never get a fill until you are having NO

trouble with the previous level - no barfing, no pbs, no sliming,

no " stuck " . You must master one level before you go to a higher fill

level.

IMO, it would be much better to work on better band habits and foods

before you get more fill. Until you're eating solid band foods and not

barfing them back, you can't tell much about your fill level. No need

to rush. Trying to go too fast always backfires, and people often need

a big unfill and rest period that sets them back weeks or months. Sandy

R

> I have a third fill scheduled for Monday! I now have 2.0 and will

receive

> another .5 on Monday. My question is...I'm not really getting full

very quickly

> (my reasoning for getting a fill). If I end up not eating a great

deal it's

> usually because I get stuck more than full. I've learned the signals

so I

> stop before I PB, but I actually am still hungry even after stopping,

sometimes!

> I just don't want to get sick so I stop. Does this mean I should go

along

> with the fill and learn how to take smaller bites and chew better (I

am trying

> and have gotten better)? What do you guys think?

> ~Deb

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Sandy and Dan, thank you once again for sharing your wealth of

knowledge. My appt. is scheduled for 9/16, I've had 2 fills so far

and at 5.5 with the VG. I guess I'm just a little scared that the

doc may suggest another fill and I don't think I'm ready right now.

Like you said, I would like to get things under control for a

while. Have never PB'd yet and really don't want to experience it,

so I guess I'm stopping in time. I have been doing the tea lately

or a cup of soup before the protien, it does help. What causes the

esophageal spasms?

You are also right about the bread. Its kind of like that feeling

every time I went on a low carb diet....I hate giving up bread.

Only now, pain and jeopardizing my band are ivolved and that should

make it a " little " easier. I am getting better at not drinking with

meals lately, so maybe I can achieve going " breadless " next. Just

an update on the constipation issue. I finally saw my PCP on Tues.,

he sent me for an Obstruction Series(radiology). He said that the

Gastro would order this test before he would do a colonoscopy

anyway. What info can they obtain with x-ray to the abdomen? I

also have blood work to do. Any advice?

> Fills are not given routinely or on any set schedule, but only

when

> needed. you always want to have the smallest fill possible that

> allows good weight loss and dims your (real) appetitie, never the

> largest fill you can tolerate.

> I'd strongly suggest never getting a fill when you are already

having

> trouble - as you are with your " first bite syndrome " . Only get a

fill

> when you are having no or very infrequent trouble with the current

> level, as any more fill will always make things worse and can get

you

> in real trouble.

> Bread is the #1 problem for bandters and just is not good band

food -

> so just don't eat it! VERY few people can tolerate breads. Get

your

> needed fiber from better band sources. Don't waste pouch space on

> things that will hurt you or not help your weight loss and health

> goals.

> Any time you have pain, stop eating for that meal! somethinbg is

> wrong and you should listen to your body. The pain seems like your

> STOP sign, so you should not be eating more - never more than 1/2-

1

> cup of solids. More than that, and you can easily stretch your

pouch,

> which often leads to a slip. Remember, the pouch is only the size

of

> a golfball and can only stretch to 2-3 times that. More can easily

> cause pouch problems.

> The pain when you first start eating can be esophageal spasms, and

> they only get worse with more fill. You need to get them under

> control before you get more fill. Try drinking a cup of hot tea

right

> before eating. This can relax the stoma and stop the spasms from

> occurring. Also be certain to choose only good band foods, be sure

> they are very moist (not dry), start with tiny bites (pea-sized)

and

> chew very well. Also be certain that you are getting enough fluids

> in - at least 64-100 oz a day. that keeps your throat and GI tract

> lubricated and thr mucous membranes intact. If you have any pain

or

> problems, never get another fill until the problem is solved.

> I'd take at least a few more weeks to get all this in control,

then

> consider another fill if you're still not losing well. Sandy R

>

>

[Guest guest]

Thanks..some say we're knowledgable, while others say of both of us

that we're full of.....something else! :-)

I'm sure Dan would agree that we only offer suggestions and what

worked for us or others we know; we surely don't have all the

answers. As always, take what is useful from anything anyone

suggests, and leave the rest..

Remember, this is YOUR band journey. If the doc suggests another

small fill, you have EVERY right to say, " No, not quite yet, please.

I still have some things to work on " But also try to keep at least a

small helpful fill, becuase that helps you forget abpout food so you

**CAN** work on other things.

some people's stomachs and GI tracts are just more sentivie than

others, and some take longer to get used to the band. Most esophageal

spasms go away with time, and with care to follow good band

guidelines. Some docs have also had good success with a medication

called nefedipine, placed under the tongue. But meds are rarely

needed.

An xray of the abdomen can give a clue as to an obstruction, mass,

injury, or unusual position of the bowel. It's just one of many tests

docs use to play detective.

Good luck with all this - please let us know how you do.

> > Fills are not given routinely or on any set schedule, but only

> when

> > needed. you always want to have the smallest fill possible that

> > allows good weight loss and dims your (real) appetitie, never the

> > largest fill you can tolerate.

> > I'd strongly suggest never getting a fill when you are already

> having

> > trouble - as you are with your " first bite syndrome " . Only get a

> fill

> > when you are having no or very infrequent trouble with the

current

> > level, as any more fill will always make things worse and can get

> you

> > in real trouble.

> > Bread is the #1 problem for bandters and just is not good band

> food -

> > so just don't eat it! VERY few people can tolerate breads. Get

> your

> > needed fiber from better band sources. Don't waste pouch space on

> > things that will hurt you or not help your weight loss and health

> > goals.

> > Any time you have pain, stop eating for that meal! somethinbg is

> > wrong and you should listen to your body. The pain seems like

your

> > STOP sign, so you should not be eating more - never more than 1/2-

> 1

> > cup of solids. More than that, and you can easily stretch your

> pouch,

> > which often leads to a slip. Remember, the pouch is only the size

> of

> > a golfball and can only stretch to 2-3 times that. More can

easily

> > cause pouch problems.

> > The pain when you first start eating can be esophageal spasms,

and

> > they only get worse with more fill. You need to get them under

> > control before you get more fill. Try drinking a cup of hot tea

> right

> > before eating. This can relax the stoma and stop the spasms from

> > occurring. Also be certain to choose only good band foods, be

sure

> > they are very moist (not dry), start with tiny bites (pea-sized)

> and

> > chew very well. Also be certain that you are getting enough

fluids

> > in - at least 64-100 oz a day. that keeps your throat and GI

tract

> > lubricated and thr mucous membranes intact. If you have any pain

> or

> > problems, never get another fill until the problem is solved.

> > I'd take at least a few more weeks to get all this in control,

> then

> > consider another fill if you're still not losing well. Sandy R

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Well, you're in charge. If your doc says you should get a fill and

you don't think so, just say no thank you. Period. He can't stick

you if you don't want him to.

As to constipation, there are lots of ways to get your fiber. Unless

there is some other problem going along with it, just get more fiber

by any of the means. We can offer suggestions if needed. I sure

can't imagine getting a colonoscopy or anything like that just becuase

I was constipated.

dan

Thursday, September 8, 2005, 12:38:42 PM, you wrote:

m> Sandy and Dan, thank you once again for sharing

m> your wealth of

m> knowledge. My appt. is scheduled for 9/16, I've

m> had 2 fills so far

m> and at 5.5 with the VG. I guess I'm just a

m> little scared that the

m> doc may suggest another fill and I don't think

m> I'm ready right now.

Dan Lester, Boise, ID honu@... www.mylapband.tk

Dr. Ortiz, Tijuana, 4/28/03

323/209/199 Age 62 Fair is whatever God decides to do.

[Guest guest]

Dan,

I'm having other problems that should probably be checked.

Bloating, hems, bleeding, etc., so I think it would probably be wise

to check further. Also I just turned 45 and I guess it wouldn't

hurt to be sure. I know they usually suggest the colonoscopy at 50.

The doc hasn't said that I need one yet, but waiting for the results

of this " obstruction series. " I have been very careful with cheese,

beef, and other things that seem to start the whole " cycle of

pain. " Been using the prunes with my cereal and take the colace as

soon as any signs of a bout starts up. Have had a much better

month. Thanks for your help.

>

> m> Sandy and Dan, thank you once again for sharing

> m> your wealth of

> m> knowledge. My appt. is scheduled for 9/16, I've

> m> had 2 fills so far

> m> and at 5.5 with the VG. I guess I'm just a

> m> little scared that the

> m> doc may suggest another fill and I don't think

> m> I'm ready right now.

>

>

> Dan Lester, Boise, ID honu@g... www.mylapband.tk

> Dr. Ortiz, Tijuana, 4/28/03

> 323/209/199 Age 62 Fair is whatever God decides to do.

[Guest guest]

Had my appt today and opted to not have another fill. When I told

the doc that I haven't been to the gym for a whole month and had

a " lot " of birthday cake (I finally came to the realization that I'd

eaten app. 4 " lg " pieces over a 2 day period...way too much

celebrating), he agreed that its not so much how tight I am, but

that we take into consideration the things that have slowed me

down. Oddly enough I haven't had any " first bite " syndrome when

eating CAKE! It winded up being a 7 lb loss in 6 weeks, still ok

for the mistakes I made. Just starting to wake up a little more to

the fact that the band works....as long as I make the right

choices. I imagine that if I had chosen the bypass I'd be on the

floor in pain with dumping quite a bit, since nothing seems to stop

me when I need my sugar fix. Thanks for all for your wisdom.

> > That is the question....

> > Sept. 13 will be six weeks since my last fill. In these past 5

> > weeks I have managed to lose app. 8 lbs. However, I've spent

the

> > last 2 weeks losing and gaining the same 3 or 4. I know we

should

> > go by how our loss is going and not our feeling of restriction

and

> > wondering if I should ask the doc not to fill at this next

visit.

> I

> > have slacked off on the gym this last month, but with the kids

back

> > to school now, I'm starting up again 3 days to start then on to

5

> > days. Very scared of filling too soon or too tight. Need

advice

> on

> > whether or not to stay at this level and just count the gaining

as

> > the result of not exercising.

> >

> > My second question....I notice a lot of pain with my first few

> bites

> > of food. It can happen with just plain protien and also when

there

> > is bread involved. When the pain subsides I'm usually ok to

> > continue eating. Is this what " getting stuck " means? Is it

only

> > because I might not be paying attention to small bites and

chewing

> > or could there be another reason for it. I actually have to

stop

> > and wait and try to breathe while the pain passes. This almost

> > never happens at night when I seem hungrier and able to eat lots

> > more.