Re: Need advice....

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

If I was a surgeon, I would schedule you for surgery too. It sounds like

you have plenty of time to pursue other options. If you did the gallbladder

flush with some type of magnesium in the proper quantities there is no way you

would not have experienced at least diarrhea. There are several components to

these flushes, all of which have some level of importance. I suggest going to

the archives of this group and boning up on the different flushes available,

choose one, and follow it fairly strictly. Since you are not experiencing

intense acute pain you can probably use bile stimulating herbs along with bile

promoting nutrients, smooth muscle relaxants, emulsifying agents and the like

even before performing a flush. A one time attempt at a flush is not a cure

all, nor is it always, the best first step. -Dave

----- Original Message -----

From: <mailto:monalisa3773@...>

gallstones <mailto:gallstones >

Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2006 12:24 PM

Subject: Need advice....

In a nutshell, here's my history --

I had one gallbladder attack during my second pregnancy in 2003. I

didn't know at the time what it was but figured it out 2 years later.

I was able to stop that attack by throwing up and I think it was

triggered by a particularly bad (ie: fatty) meal I ate that night. I

didn't have any more attacks until my third pregnancy. They started

about 6 months into it. At first they were infrequent. Then they

started coming much more often and were harder to get rid of. At 37

weeks along, I was throwing up everything I ate and was in constant

pain so I went to the emergency room. They did bloodwork and a sono

and said I needed to have my gallbladder removed after the baby was

born. She was born a week later and I stopped having attacks. It's

now 15 months later and I have started having pain in the upper

stomach area, right under my ribs. I thought it was just a stomach

bug because this is NOTHING like the pain I had before. I went to my

family doctor Monday and he referred me to a surgeon. I saw the

surgeon today and he scheduled surgery for next Friday. No new

sonogram or bloodwork -- he just couldn't believe that I didn't

already have it out a year ago. I have tried the olive oil flush

before and didn't get anything from it -- no stones, not even diarrhea.

I'm not sure what to do now -- more flushes this week to see if I can

get rid of the pain? Just give in and let them take my gallbladder?

I think my husband would like to see me have the surgery just to end

all of this, especially since neither one of us wants to go through

those debilitating attacks again if we have more children. He has

been supportive of me avoiding surgery, though. Any opinions?

Thanks,

[Guest guest]

The problem is always what if something goes wrong in surgery as

well as what are the side effects?

You need to ask your doctor these questions before you do anything.

http://www.medhelp.org/forums/gastro/archive/1867.html

>

> In a nutshell, here's my history --

> I had one gallbladder attack during my second pregnancy in 2003. I

> didn't know at the time what it was but figured it out 2 years

later.

> I was able to stop that attack by throwing up and I think it was

> triggered by a particularly bad (ie: fatty) meal I ate that

night. I

> didn't have any more attacks until my third pregnancy. They

started

> about 6 months into it. At first they were infrequent. Then they

> started coming much more often and were harder to get rid of. At

37

> weeks along, I was throwing up everything I ate and was in constant

> pain so I went to the emergency room. They did bloodwork and a

sono

> and said I needed to have my gallbladder removed after the baby was

> born. She was born a week later and I stopped having attacks.

It's

> now 15 months later and I have started having pain in the upper

> stomach area, right under my ribs. I thought it was just a stomach

> bug because this is NOTHING like the pain I had before. I went to

my

> family doctor Monday and he referred me to a surgeon. I saw the

> surgeon today and he scheduled surgery for next Friday. No new

> sonogram or bloodwork -- he just couldn't believe that I didn't

> already have it out a year ago. I have tried the olive oil flush

> before and didn't get anything from it -- no stones, not even

diarrhea.

>

> I'm not sure what to do now -- more flushes this week to see if I

can

> get rid of the pain? Just give in and let them take my

gallbladder?

> I think my husband would like to see me have the surgery just to

end

> all of this, especially since neither one of us wants to go through

> those debilitating attacks again if we have more children. He has

> been supportive of me avoiding surgery, though. Any opinions?

>

> Thanks,

>

>

[Guest guest]

Does not have to be complicated---how I flush--fyi--

What you are suppose to do is a week before you do a flush just add

more apple/pear juice to your diet--give up meat--more fruit and

veggies. Even do some juicing--but there is no need to fast.

Drink a lot more water--no dairy--think of cleaning out your body by

changing your diet to one of more fruits/veggies/juice.

a good Book-- " Juicing for life " good receipes.

Day of fast you are allowed oatmeal--it's a good thing to eat I have

found--or fruit till noon.

At 5 I start the epsom salts---and you have to do more than one

tablespoon. I add two big ones to cranberry juice or grapefruit (red

is easier)

Hold your nose and drink it down--you will need two of these to

really clean yourself out--take another one in a hour or so (they

say two hours)

Around 9 you should be cleaned out--

get the Extra Virgin olive oil--one half a cup or more if you can do

it---and add one half cup of red grapefruit--)(this is what I do)

and sit up in bed and drink it down--hold your nose again.

you will be hungry and this will help-

They say to lay down on your side--I have to sit up for awhile so I

can hold it all in me.

then I lay down and go to sleep--

when you wake up you have too drink epsom salts all over again---

2 tablespoons in juice and you should be going to the bathroom all

over again.

I hate tt much as anyone--but I tell myself a hundred times it's

better than surgery for me--

I have not had a fever--nor have I had huge attacks--and I have had

cat scans done--so I know my stones--

It's been a year and I still have to watch diet--do flushes.

takes a while but it's worth it--cleaner liver--happier GB!!!!

and vital organ SAVED!!!!

>

> In a nutshell, here's my history --

> I had one gallbladder attack during my second pregnancy in 2003. I

> didn't know at the time what it was but figured it out 2 years

later.

> I was able to stop that attack by throwing up and I think it was

> triggered by a particularly bad (ie: fatty) meal I ate that

night. I

> didn't have any more attacks until my third pregnancy. They

started

> about 6 months into it. At first they were infrequent. Then they

> started coming much more often and were harder to get rid of. At

37

> weeks along, I was throwing up everything I ate and was in constant

> pain so I went to the emergency room. They did bloodwork and a

sono

> and said I needed to have my gallbladder removed after the baby was

> born. She was born a week later and I stopped having attacks.

It's

> now 15 months later and I have started having pain in the upper

> stomach area, right under my ribs. I thought it was just a stomach

> bug because this is NOTHING like the pain I had before. I went to

my

> family doctor Monday and he referred me to a surgeon. I saw the

> surgeon today and he scheduled surgery for next Friday. No new

> sonogram or bloodwork -- he just couldn't believe that I didn't

> already have it out a year ago. I have tried the olive oil flush

> before and didn't get anything from it -- no stones, not even

diarrhea.

>

> I'm not sure what to do now -- more flushes this week to see if I

can

> get rid of the pain? Just give in and let them take my

gallbladder?

> I think my husband would like to see me have the surgery just to

end

> all of this, especially since neither one of us wants to go through

> those debilitating attacks again if we have more children. He has

> been supportive of me avoiding surgery, though. Any opinions?

>

> Thanks,

>

>

[Guest guest]

Question:

How long does a " typical " gall bladder attack last?

> >

> > In a nutshell, here's my history --

> > I had one gallbladder attack during my second pregnancy in 2003.

I

> > didn't know at the time what it was but figured it out 2 years

> later.

> > I was able to stop that attack by throwing up and I think it was

> > triggered by a particularly bad (ie: fatty) meal I ate that

> night. I

> > didn't have any more attacks until my third pregnancy. They

> started

> > about 6 months into it. At first they were infrequent. Then they

> > started coming much more often and were harder to get rid of. At

> 37

> > weeks along, I was throwing up everything I ate and was in

constant

> > pain so I went to the emergency room. They did bloodwork and a

> sono

> > and said I needed to have my gallbladder removed after the baby

was

> > born. She was born a week later and I stopped having attacks.

> It's

> > now 15 months later and I have started having pain in the upper

> > stomach area, right under my ribs. I thought it was just a

stomach

> > bug because this is NOTHING like the pain I had before. I went

to

> my

> > family doctor Monday and he referred me to a surgeon. I saw the

> > surgeon today and he scheduled surgery for next Friday. No new

> > sonogram or bloodwork -- he just couldn't believe that I didn't

> > already have it out a year ago. I have tried the olive oil flush

> > before and didn't get anything from it -- no stones, not even

> diarrhea.

> >

> > I'm not sure what to do now -- more flushes this week to see if I

> can

> > get rid of the pain? Just give in and let them take my

> gallbladder?

> > I think my husband would like to see me have the surgery just to

> end

> > all of this, especially since neither one of us wants to go

through

> > those debilitating attacks again if we have more children. He has

> > been supportive of me avoiding surgery, though. Any opinions?

> >

> > Thanks,

> >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

If your Gallbladder is working then its always better to try and keep it.Your

doc should at least do the HIDA test before going for surgery to determine the

functionality of the GB.

Puneet

<monalisa3773@...> wrote:

In a nutshell, here's my history --

I had one gallbladder attack during my second pregnancy in 2003. I

didn't know at the time what it was but figured it out 2 years later.

I was able to stop that attack by throwing up and I think it was

triggered by a particularly bad (ie: fatty) meal I ate that night. I

didn't have any more attacks until my third pregnancy. They started

about 6 months into it. At first they were infrequent. Then they

started coming much more often and were harder to get rid of. At 37

weeks along, I was throwing up everything I ate and was in constant

pain so I went to the emergency room. They did bloodwork and a sono

and said I needed to have my gallbladder removed after the baby was

born. She was born a week later and I stopped having attacks. It's

now 15 months later and I have started having pain in the upper

stomach area, right under my ribs. I thought it was just a stomach

bug because this is NOTHING like the pain I had before. I went to my

family doctor Monday and he referred me to a surgeon. I saw the

surgeon today and he scheduled surgery for next Friday. No new

sonogram or bloodwork -- he just couldn't believe that I didn't

already have it out a year ago. I have tried the olive oil flush

before and didn't get anything from it -- no stones, not even diarrhea.

I'm not sure what to do now -- more flushes this week to see if I can

get rid of the pain? Just give in and let them take my gallbladder?

I think my husband would like to see me have the surgery just to end

all of this, especially since neither one of us wants to go through

those debilitating attacks again if we have more children. He has

been supportive of me avoiding surgery, though. Any opinions?

Thanks,

---------------------------------

Talk is cheap. Use Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls. Great rates

starting at 1¢/min.

[Guest guest]

http://drmarkyjohnson.com/Gallbladder.html

Biliary Pain.

The mildest and most common symptom of gallbladder disease is

intermittent pain called biliary colic, which occurs either in the

mid- or the upper-right portion of the upper abdomen. Large or fatty

meals can precipitate the pain, but it usually occurs several hours

after eating, often at night. Biliary colic produces a steady pain,

which can be quite severe and may be accompanied by nausea. Changes

in position, over-the-counter pain relievers, and passage of gas do

not relieve the symptoms. Biliary colic usually disappears after

several hours. Attacks of pain tend to be intermittent and

infrequent; the chance of pain recurring within a year is less than

50%. In one study, 30% of people who had had one or two attacks

experienced no further biliary pain over the next ten years.

Acute Cholecystitis.

Acute gallbladder inflammation (acute cholecystitis) is a more

serious problem than biliary colic. It begins abruptly and subsides

gradually. Nausea, vomiting, and severe pain and tenderness in the

upper right abdomen are the most common complaints; fever is usual

but may be absent. The discomfort is intense and steady and lasts

until the condition is treated with medicine or surgery. Patients

with acute cholecystitis frequently complain of pain when drawing a

breath. The pain can radiate from the abdomen to the back. Acute

cholecystitis is usually caused by gallstones, but, in some cases,

can occur without stones.

Anyone who experiences an attack of acute cholecystitis should seek

medical attention; it can progress to gangrene or perforation of the

gallbladder if left untreated.

Chronic Cholecystitis.

Chronic gallbladder disease (chronic cholecystitis) occurs because

of the prolonged presence of gallstones and low-grade inflammation.

Scarring causes the gallbladder to become stiff and thick. Symptoms

of this condition tend to be vague. Complaints of gas, nausea, and

abdominal discomfort after meals are common, just as they often are

in people without gallbladder disease.

Common Bile Duct Stones (Choledocholithiasis).

Stones lodged in the common bile duct (choledocholithiasis) can

block the flow of bile and cause jaundice. Serious infection of the

bile duct (cholangitis) may develop that causes fever, chills,

nausea and vomiting, and severe pain in the upper-right quadrant of

the abdomen.

What Other Diseases Produce Symptoms Similar to Gallstones and

Gallbladder Disease?

> > >

> > > In a nutshell, here's my history --

> > > I had one gallbladder attack during my second pregnancy in

2003.

> I

> > > didn't know at the time what it was but figured it out 2 years

> > later.

> > > I was able to stop that attack by throwing up and I think it

was

> > > triggered by a particularly bad (ie: fatty) meal I ate that

> > night. I

> > > didn't have any more attacks until my third pregnancy. They

> > started

> > > about 6 months into it. At first they were infrequent. Then

they

> > > started coming much more often and were harder to get rid of.

At

> > 37

> > > weeks along, I was throwing up everything I ate and was in

> constant

> > > pain so I went to the emergency room. They did bloodwork and

a

> > sono

> > > and said I needed to have my gallbladder removed after the

baby

> was

> > > born. She was born a week later and I stopped having

attacks.

> > It's

> > > now 15 months later and I have started having pain in the upper

> > > stomach area, right under my ribs. I thought it was just a

> stomach

> > > bug because this is NOTHING like the pain I had before. I

went

> to

> > my

> > > family doctor Monday and he referred me to a surgeon. I saw

the

> > > surgeon today and he scheduled surgery for next Friday. No new

> > > sonogram or bloodwork -- he just couldn't believe that I didn't

> > > already have it out a year ago. I have tried the olive oil

flush

> > > before and didn't get anything from it -- no stones, not even

> > diarrhea.

> > >

> > > I'm not sure what to do now -- more flushes this week to see

if I

> > can

> > > get rid of the pain? Just give in and let them take my

> > gallbladder?

> > > I think my husband would like to see me have the surgery just

to

> > end

> > > all of this, especially since neither one of us wants to go

> through

> > > those debilitating attacks again if we have more children. He

has

> > > been supportive of me avoiding surgery, though. Any opinions?

> > >

> > > Thanks,

> > >

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Carol,

I am sorry you are feeling poorly. It really stinks that you have had such

difficult times post revision. I know you must be feeling very down right now.

I dont know that I can offer much in the way of council on your question of what

to do about the pain. I can think of a few questions that might be best directed

to DrHu or her staff before you go too far down any one road.

For instance, I am imagining that since you put the question the way you did

that this is a new pain...it did not exist once you healed from revision? If

so....and if I recall correctly that you are fused to the sacrum, I am thinking

that its a little weird that anything in the lumbar area is moving enough to

pinch a nerve...but that would be something that might help you figure out what

is causing your pain...and how much you can do now. Can you have a phone

discussion with DrHu?

Very generally speaking, assuming your PCP says to go ahead and try

exercise....or stretching, why not try? If you have been very sedentary recently

or even sitting a lot, it is possible that you will benefit from undertaking

some form of therapy. Can you have an evaluation from a train Physical

Therapist? They may be able to find ways to strengthen or relieve your pain.

Lastly, as crazy as this may sound, sit (or lay) quietly and rethink the time

leading up to the pain becoming apparent. Was anything new or different about

the days leading up to it? Were you traveling more, walking more, sitting more,

eating differently, sleeping on a new surface....anything? For us of the very

fused spines I often find that the littlest thing can change how I feel. It just

throws me off..and if I focus on stopping doing whatever I suspect the culprit

is, I usually return to the status quo fairly quickly. So in answer to your

question, I would only be more active if I was sure what the source of the pain

was.

The good news is that your PCP doesnt see any of the " biggies " as the pain

source...so at least you can rule them out. You didnt mention any tests for

things like ulcers....which is the only other thing that came to mind....knowing

that you have probably been on a slug of medications that have probably played

havoc with your stomach and whole GI.

Please let us know how you do if the coming days. I hope you feel better.

Take Care, Cam

[Guest guest]

Yes, this is a new pain. I'm embarrassed to admit it--I was straining from a

bowel movement. So, yes, I'm embarrassed.

I am fused T-5 to sacrum. I was thinking that I had my hardware removed (only

lower part of my back) that probably (maybe) contributed to it. But, I was in

pain after I had my revision, I needed to get relief from my pain. So, I had my

hardware removed 1 yr. post-surgery. Maybe that contributed it, but it's too

late to do anything about that now.

Llewen had an idea to try yoga. I will see if I can find some examples on the

internet. I do ride my exercize bicycle about once a week.

I have been on a lot of medications as well. I take Norco for back pain,

Skelaxin for muscle relaxant, and Keppra for seizures. That has probably

contributed some to my pain. I may not " bounce back " so soon as usual.(??)

On a related (but totally separate)issue I was told by my plastic surgeon last

Mon. that I have to wait 5-6 months to get my head back together. That has

probably contributed to my depression. I have to wait 5-6 months!! I guess I'll

wait, don't really have a choice! My body is taking a long time to heal my head.

I guess I will get a lesson on patience!!

Carol V.

>

> Hi Carol,

>

> I am sorry you are feeling poorly. It really stinks that you have had such

difficult times post revision. I know you must be feeling very down right now.

>

> I dont know that I can offer much in the way of council on your question of

what to do about the pain. I can think of a few questions that might be best

directed to DrHu or her staff before you go too far down any one road.

>

> For instance, I am imagining that since you put the question the way you did

that this is a new pain...it did not exist once you healed from revision? If

so....and if I recall correctly that you are fused to the sacrum, I am thinking

that its a little weird that anything in the lumbar area is moving enough to

pinch a nerve...but that would be something that might help you figure out what

is causing your pain...and how much you can do now. Can you have a phone

discussion with DrHu?

>

> Very generally speaking, assuming your PCP says to go ahead and try

exercise....or stretching, why not try? If you have been very sedentary recently

or even sitting a lot, it is possible that you will benefit from undertaking

some form of therapy. Can you have an evaluation from a train Physical

Therapist? They may be able to find ways to strengthen or relieve your pain.

>

> Lastly, as crazy as this may sound, sit (or lay) quietly and rethink the time

leading up to the pain becoming apparent. Was anything new or different about

the days leading up to it? Were you traveling more, walking more, sitting more,

eating differently, sleeping on a new surface....anything? For us of the very

fused spines I often find that the littlest thing can change how I feel. It just

throws me off..and if I focus on stopping doing whatever I suspect the culprit

is, I usually return to the status quo fairly quickly. So in answer to your

question, I would only be more active if I was sure what the source of the pain

was.

>

> The good news is that your PCP doesnt see any of the " biggies " as the pain

source...so at least you can rule them out. You didnt mention any tests for

things like ulcers....which is the only other thing that came to mind....knowing

that you have probably been on a slug of medications that have probably played

havoc with your stomach and whole GI.

>

> Please let us know how you do if the coming days. I hope you feel better.

>

> Take Care, Cam

>