Re: They had the option

[Guest guest]

Jessie Ahroni <jessie@...> wrote:

How would you like it if you paid full price for the surgery and I gave

the same care to somebody else who paid less? It wouldn't be fair to

our patients.

I agree with you 100% ... you get what you pay for. I'm not suggesting they

get a " free ticket " ... I was suggesting you charge a PREMIUM to those who went

out of the country -- or to another US doctor -- and are now looking for

excellent after care.

I'm glad it's not about the money ... I can already see that just by the

experiences I've had with NWWLS so far. Like I said - I'm thankful I found

NWWLS before I had surgery elsewhere. I don't regret spending the extra money

-- it was worth it!

C.

---------------------------------

DSL Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less

[Guest guest]

Yep, the great American health care system " Screw'em if they don't have the

money "

Jessie Ahroni <jessie@...> wrote: : If it was up to me Inamed would

not be allowed to sell bands to

surgeons who don't provide a comprehensive high quality aftercare

program.

[Guest guest]

I just want to take each and everyone of us back to that place.....that place

where everyday was a serious struggle with weight....where everyday you could go

through all kinds of emotions.........frustration, hopelessness, desperation,

anger,loneliness...where everyday all you wanted was to succeed at losing the

weight that kept you trapped........hidden from your life, your family and

hidden from the man or woman you wanted to be.

All I am saying is whether we had surgery here in the US or in Tim Buck

Two....it was the first time in the life of many of us that we had actually saw

light at the end of the tunnel... a way out of the darkness of obesity. So we

began the research some of had the ability, knowledge and insight to do a more

thorough job then others. Some of us did the best we could and as a result we

came up short in some of the problem areas. Some us jumped in head first so

desperate as to not waste another day for fear that we would wake up and the

dream would be over and we would still be in the darkness.

I just call us to remember how we got here and why! We share a very personal

and intimate journey with complete strangers, making ourselves vulnerable,

hoping to find what the world has neglected to show us which is kindness and

compassionate.

May we all honor one another while giving guidance and support in this truly

AMAZING LIFE CHANGING, WORLD TRANSFORMING JOURNEY THAT WE SHARE ONE WITH

ANOTHER.........FOREVER

God Bless

----Original post removed by moderator -- Please snip posts!----

[Guest guest]

I just read Jessie's message explaining NWWLS's viewpoint and I want you guys to

know I did my homework very thoroughly before deciding to go to NWWLS to have my

surgery done in November. I had a large hiatal hernia and repair also, and Dr.

Watkins DID NOT charge me one extra dime for this additional surgery!!!! He took

his time, and had to do lots of extra stitch-up work on me, and he included this

surgery in the price of the lapband surgery! He told me he has found that many

of his patients have needed this done, and I feel sorry for everyone that has

had to pay extra for this. This perk alone makes me feel fortunate to have had

Dr. Watkins do my surgery!!!! I couldn't believe it! I have been SO IMPRESSED

with NWWLS, and the support I have found there! Jessie's comments were " right

on " , and the support I've received there has been unsurpassed! I totally

understand how others have elected to go out of country for the surgery, and I

thought long and hard about it because I have had to suffer financially like

many of us bandsters! But JESSIE'S RIGHT! The FREE support at NWWLS is worth

its weight in gold, and the doctors and staff can NOT be surpassed in care and

concern for their patients and how they go way beyond the norm for their

patients. Now they have started support groups TWICE A MONTH, which is awesome

for those of us who NEED this! And Jessie's right...it would NOT be fair to

those of us who scrimped and saved and borrowed, etc. to pay the high cost of

the surgery at NWWLS for our doctors to support other doctors' patients when

they have their hands full supporting their own patients. And we only have to

pay $150 for fills, which is an EXTREMELY reasonable price!!!! Yes, I feel NWWLS

is actually CHEAPER in the long run after all the perks they offer to their

patients. I would NEVER even consider another doctor after experiencing the

treatment and care I am getting there. I'm getting ready to have my second

fill, and I am SO EXCITED because I LOVE to see the sincere enthusiasm the NWWLS

staff gives me. I have made true friends there, and I'm SO THANKFUL for each

and every one of them!!!!!!! I know I'm a new bandster, but I have NEVER heard

or read one negative thing about NWWLS and our wonderful, experienced doctors

and staff!

Donna

Dr. Watkins NWWLS

11/16/05

264/239/200/135

[Guest guest]

I agree with your sentiments 100%. I just got rid of

some larger clothes and i remember thinking whenever i

did weight watchers or atkins i held on to my old

larger sizes cuz i guess we know sublimily( (I think

thats right) that were not going to succeed,but on

this wonderfull expierence we know were going to make

it an stay there! And like you said we got a

wonderfull support group of oeople who;ve not only

been there but they got the t/shirt to prove it lol

--- <reneeboorcox@...> wrote:

> I just want to take each and everyone of us back to

> that place.....that place where everyday was a

> serious struggle with weight....where everyday you

> could go through all kinds of

> emotions.........frustration, hopelessness,

> desperation, anger,loneliness...where everyday all

> you wanted was to succeed at losing the weight that

> kept you trapped........hidden from your life, your

> family and hidden from the man or woman you wanted

> to be.

>

> All I am saying is whether we had surgery here in

> the US or in Tim Buck Two....it was the first time

> in the life of many of us that we had actually saw

> light at the end of the tunnel... a way out of the

> darkness of obesity. So we began the research some

> of had the ability, knowledge and insight to do a

> more thorough job then others. Some of us did the

> best we could and as a result we came up short in

> some of the problem areas. Some us jumped in head

> first so desperate as to not waste another day for

> fear that we would wake up and the dream would be

> over and we would still be in the darkness.

>

> I just call us to remember how we got here and

> why! We share a very personal and intimate journey

> with complete strangers, making ourselves

> vulnerable, hoping to find what the world has

> neglected to show us which is kindness and

> compassionate.

>

> May we all honor one another while giving guidance

> and support in this truly AMAZING LIFE CHANGING,

> WORLD TRANSFORMING JOURNEY THAT WE SHARE ONE WITH

> ANOTHER.........FOREVER

>

> God Bless

>

>

> ----Original post removed by moderator -- Please

> snip posts!----

>

>

>

__________________________________________

DSL – Something to write home about.

Just $16.99/mo. or less.

dsl.

[Guest guest]

Sorry Donna, But I feel you totally missed the point of the thread. At no time

had anybody complained about NWWLS policy of not providing any type of care for

patients not banded by them. The nerve that was hit was several comments made

by the original author of the thread that were insensitive. Any body that is

going to go anyplace with the band has done their homework.

I did not look into NWWLS since the aftercare would be almost as limited to

me as the doctor I chose. And the math told me that if I wasn't close enough to

use the tools they charge you for, it is money thrown away. If you live close

enough and find their tools of use for you, all the power to you. But that

wasn't the reason for the replies you had been reading.

Ron Mc

Lakewood, WA

okieladydm@... wrote: I just read Jessie's message explaining NWWLS's

viewpoint and I want you guys to know I did my homework very thoroughly before

deciding to go to NWWLS to have my surgery done in November. I had a large

hiatal hernia and repair also, and Dr. Watkins DID NOT charge me one extra

dime for this additional surgery!!!! He took his time, and had to do lots of

extra stitch-up work on me, and he included this surgery in the price of the

lapband surgery! He told me he has found that many of his patients have needed

this done, and I feel sorry for everyone that has had to pay extra for this.

This perk alone makes me feel fortunate to have had Dr. Watkins do my

surgery!!!! I couldn't believe it! I have been SO IMPRESSED with NWWLS, and the

support I have found there! Jessie's comments were " right on " , and the support

I've received there has been unsurpassed! I totally understand how others have

elected to go out of country for the surgery, and I thought

long and hard about it because I have had to suffer financially like many of

us bandsters! But JESSIE'S RIGHT! The FREE support at NWWLS is worth its weight

in gold, and the doctors and staff can NOT be surpassed in care and concern for

their patients and how they go way beyond the norm for their patients. Now they

have started support groups TWICE A MONTH, which is awesome for those of us who

NEED this! And Jessie's right...it would NOT be fair to those of us who

scrimped and saved and borrowed, etc. to pay the high cost of the surgery at

NWWLS for our doctors to support other doctors' patients when they have their

hands full supporting their own patients. And we only have to pay $150 for

fills, which is an EXTREMELY reasonable price!!!! Yes, I feel NWWLS is actually

CHEAPER in the long run after all the perks they offer to their patients. I

would NEVER even consider another doctor after experiencing the treatment and

care I am getting there. I'm getting ready to have

my second fill, and I am SO EXCITED because I LOVE to see the sincere

enthusiasm the NWWLS staff gives me. I have made true friends there, and I'm SO

THANKFUL for each and every one of them!!!!!!! I know I'm a new bandster, but I

have NEVER heard or read one negative thing about NWWLS and our wonderful,

experienced doctors and staff!

Donna

Dr. Watkins NWWLS

11/16/05

264/239/200/135

[Guest guest]

>>Jessie said:

>>... we talk about an aftercare program frequently but the general

feeling is that this would just encourage people to go out of the

country for cheap surgery...

This is a very clear answer to a very difficult question -- thanks,

Jessie, for being honest. We'd all like to believe those ads that

say a Hyundai is just as good as a BMW. We'd all like to believe

that clothes from Ross are just as good as Nordstrom. We'd all like

to believe that our $10 camera takes pictures just as good as a

Nikon.

The honest truth is that to offer a premium service (Nordstrom, BMW,

Nikon) costs money. You need high-quality people, facilities,

marketing, service, support -- and you succeed by becoming known as

a place that gives the highest possible level of service to people

who want that.

It doesn't mean that there isn't a place for K-Mart in the world.

Or Discount Mattress World. Or for Mcs. It does mean that

it's just not practical to have a " high touch " operation that trys

to serve people who are primarily price-driven. I've run retail and

manufacturaing operations, education centers, and other businesses

for years and the biggest mistakes I ever made were trying to be all

things to all people.

If it was this easy to provide fills and support, there would be

offices on every street corner. They'd line the northern and

southern border like duty-free stores. And you'd be able to go to a

drive-up window and shout into the microphone how many ounces you

wanted.

The only thing I know for sure in life is that choosing the lowest

price guarantees you the bottom of the food chain. Paying top

prices does NOT guarantee quality, but if a company is providing top

quality and charging bargain prices, they go under real quick.

I'd rather drive a 20-year-old Mercedes than a brand-new Kia.

Dick

240/229/155

Dr. Montgomery 12/21/05

[Guest guest]

Well put !

C.

--- <reneeboorcox@...> wrote:

> I just want to take each and everyone of us back to

> that place.....that place where everyday was a

> serious struggle with weight....where everyday you

> could go through all kinds of

> emotions.........frustration, hopelessness,

> desperation, anger,loneliness...where everyday all

> you wanted was to succeed at losing the weight that

> kept you trapped........hidden from your life, your

> family and hidden from the man or woman you wanted

> to be.

__________________________________________

DSL – Something to write home about.

Just $16.99/mo. or less.

dsl.

[Guest guest]

first off I was one of the lucky ones and was able to get my surgery

and aftercare paid for by my insurance.

now...in order to go get my surgery/fills/aftercare done I have to

drive down to federal way from everett which is a 45-60min drive

from my house where nwwls is only 5minutes from my house...yea I

would like to get my aftercare closer to home but since the

insurance is paying and I do like the aftercare I go to him.

Ive tried to be able to go to the support group over at nwwls but

was told that I had to pay $$$ to them since I was not banded by

them (I did look into nwwls first before my surgery and I do have

issues about my experience there but im going to keep my mouth shut)

so I go to other groups around the area.

Now if I didnt have the 20,000, 16,000, the 12,800 and have tried

many resources (loans, etc) yes I would go and get my surgery done

in another country.

but from what I notice from other bansters is that getting fills

from other docs that are willing to do it is pricey and usually you

need about 2-4 fills that can add up and from prices from 150-350 it

can add up. I didnt understand this at first but when I got my gall

blader taken out and went to another surgeon I discovered why.

every surgeon does their banding different from where they place

their ports to where the tubing follows. doing follow up for some

surgeons is like taking care of someone elses mess. That is a

factor that you do have to add into when you are studying your

options when you start looking into the surgery.

Its just called you gotta do what you gotta do from getting

insurance to pay for part/all to refinancing/selling things to going

down to mexico. you gotta do what you gotta do for the surgery

because none of us wanted to be obese but we are. the associated

problems that we have. But to have this surgery not to be obese, to

have the associated problems go away (or lessen). I would do

whatever I would have to do to get the surgery.

you just gotta do what you gotta do!

jen

4/12/05 Dr. Oh

260/197/150ish

[Guest guest]

Hiya all....I just read through Jessie's post twice and no where did I

see that she was criticizing those who had there surgery out of the

country. In actual fact, Jessie had her band placed by a Mexican

surgeon. I truly believe that Jessie meant no harm by her post. Her

job is to see that people are successful with their band. I know for

some of you that it hit a nerve. But ask yourself why? We need to

stop being so sensative and just learn to support each other. Yes we

have the band but folks it is only a tool. It all up to you and only

you to be successful.

Ok that is my two cents all. Hope you all had great holidays.

Toni in Seattle

[Guest guest]

I had my lapband done by DR Kuri on 10/10/02. I went to him becauser the cost

was less and he had a good reputation plus there were fewer US Dr's doing the

band then. It's well worth the money I spent for it and with what I know now i'd

have done it in USA for more. Ironic since first real WLS person I know, Sasssy

from SeattleBBW, spent $31K for the duodenal switch in early 2001 and I was

considering that, also my niece Dana had the band done for $31K in NYNY in

August 2001 by same DR that did Al Roker's WLS and her insurance paid $31K too.

It's irksone that Group Health didn't support the band then (nor do they now)

but it was still worth it to me to be a selfpay. The band was the best large

investment I have made in my life for my health.

(Accupuncture to quit smoking cost me $60 in 1986 or 1987--that's a smaller

investment.)

I know of at least two bandsters women that took second mortgages on their

homes, neither expressed any regret for soing so.

Larry Murray

[Guest guest]

I would have liked to have just let this thread die, but I have to say this,

at least:

Comparing bands and surgeons to cars disturbs me for some reason. There are

Kia's and Lexuses in other countries too, so the analogy just doesn't make

sense. (Although, the band does cost about as much as a new compact car, so

that makes sense at least.)

And one other thing. :-)

As someone who not only went out of the country and also chose a

French-manufactured band, but who later URGED my own mother to stay local

for a Lap-Band, I see both sides of the argument...

The fact is, when I had my surgery it would have been exceedingly difficult

for me to have coughed up the 20K it would have cost me to be banded by the

only PNW surgeon doing bands at that time, and he had a terrible rep for

after-care (this, from how own patients who can't stand him and his

pro-bypass stance!). NWWLS wasn't yet up and running when I made my choice,

and, although they did open up the same month I went to France, I simply

wasn't willing to be in ANYBODY's first 100 band surgeries (even if they

were very experienced laparoscopic surgeons). So I would have had to wait

another couple of years (or so) to be banded locally by anyone other than

Dr. Icky-Follow-Up.

Today, I wouldn't change a thing.

Although the weight loss part is not a race, I wouldn't give up the last

three years for *anything*!

Now, that said, I managed to line up after-care in advance - but it is

getting harder. And when there are so many experienced, local surgeons

nowadays, I think anyone who is looking into this today would be crazy not

to seriously - VERY seriously - consider keeping close to home.

That's why, when my mother decided to get banded, I strenuously urged her to

go to NWWLS - there are too many reasons to stay local, not to.

Three years ago, I would have had a very hard time swinging the 20K; my

MIDband in France cost me about 10K, and was installed by one of the most

experienced band surgeons in the world. Today, the balance of benefit vs.

risk is different, and I would try very much harder to beg, borrow or steal

that extra 10K (well, not really steal, but you know what I mean!).

But I am glad I made the choices I did, at the time I did. 2005 has been the

best year of my life so far, and I expect 2006 to be even better. This is

due in very large part to getting my MIDband in 2002. It quite simply,

changed my life. I am finally living the life I always wanted... and if the

only way another person can get a band is to go out of the country - TRULY

the only way - then Jessie ir right: it's better than staying moribidly

obese.

But I'm glad my mom's docs are here. :-)

Sarina " On the other hand... " Mc

MIDbanded 11/06/02

by Dr. Frering in Lyon, France

Starting weight; 215

Goal weight: 115

Current weight, including Christmas fudge weight gain: 115, woo-hoo!

[Guest guest]

>

>

Hey Guys, I sent this yesterday but it never came through. I

thought I

would try again. I hope you are all well!

> Hey and Phyllis,

> I am so glad to hear from both of you. I say Ditto! I too had a

GREAT

> experience with my Surgeon in Mexico. I got the best of care and

I STILL

> get the best of aftercare. I would not have been able to have the

surgery

> locally and I thank God every day that I found Dr Aceves. I have

had many

> surgeries in the states and my care by Dr Aceves was the best I

have ever

> had. The hospital was clean and the staff all trained by Inamed.

> I have been back to Dr Aceves and Dr Kuri for my fills. Both

times I was

> treated with the utmost care and compassion.

> For those looking for local fill, I hear there is a new place

opening in

> Arlington. I don't have all the details, but as soon as I do I

will

surely

> let you know. I plan on going back to Dr Aceves for my fills, but

having

a

> local compassionate person who understands the Mexico patients

will be

nice.

> I won't say more until I check it out more thoroughly. Lets all

keep our

> fingers crossed it is as good as I have heard :0)

>

> Sharon,

> I too am so sorry for your loss. I pray that you are doing OK and

that

you

> will lean on all of us for moral support. God Bless!

> Take Care,

>

> Banded 7/20/05 Dr Alberto Aceves

> 210/172/140

> >

I added this later. I understand why Dr.'s in the states are weary

about working on us Mexico patients. It is a liablilty if they did

not do the surgery. That is something I am sure we all took into

account before we went to Mexico. I think we all need to support

each other and encourage each other no matter where we were banded.

We all have a lot to offer and we all are members of an awesome

Bandster family. For those banded in Mexico, We will need to search

out the places that will work on us and cultivate a good

relationship. Lets all pray the new Arlington clinic turns out to

be a friend to all of us :0) I can't wait to get more details.

again ;0)

>

[> > >

>

[Guest guest]

Just my little opinion to the Mercedes vs Kia comment. I have a

Mercedes (Inamed) and assume most here have the same. It would not

have mattered if I bought my Inamed in Mexico or US, the travel to

aftercare is just as far away either way. (NO " dealer " in my area)

You can buy a " Mercedes " in Beverly Hills and pay twice as much as if

you bought it in Detroit, but it is still a Mercedes! I don't think a

person who got their Inamed in Mexico came home with a Kia!

Get yourself an Inamed, and make sure it is put in by a Master

mechanic! Wherever you get it, take care of it and get it serviced!

I certainly don't see it as an issue of " substandard " or a " get what

you pay for " attitude.

Sandi G

[Guest guest]

Ron...thanks for clarifying. I am new to the group and probably jumped the gun

with my comments. This seems to be a great group, and I'm looking forward to

being a part of it....Donna

---complete quoted post snipped by moderator---Please trim your posts!--