Guest guest Posted June 8, 1999 Report Share Posted June 8, 1999 I personally think I'm in between. Are we talking Hi-C here, or are we talking real fruit juice and water? If it is 100% fruit, it is not that bad. Not as good as the genuine stuff, of course, but... Shalia >From: Cmermer@... >Reply-Vaccinationsonelist >Vaccinationsonelist >Subject: Re: Fruit Juice >Date: Tue, 8 Jun 1999 23:08:38 EDT > >From: Cmermer@... > >In a message dated 6/8/99 10:48:37 PM Eastern Daylight Time, >nagel@... >writes: > > > At 11 months of age fruit juice is not going to hurt until you can find >a > > place to stop and breast feed. I nursed my son until he was 14 months >old > > and he weaned himself at that time. He would never take a bottle but >was > > drinking from a sippy cup as soon as he was old enough to hold one >steady. > > (and besides he never liked fruit, so fruit juice fortified with vit c >was > > the only fruit in his diet) He is 4 years old now and still will not >eat > > fruit. I love it personally and offer it regularly, but it is always a >no > > go in his mind. It is recommended also by most nutritionists not to >worry > > about caloric intake until you child is over 2 years old. > > This is of course just my opinion (about the fruit juice that is > > > >I must respectfully disagree. Fruit juice is not the same as fruit. It is >basically junk food, with as much sugar as soda. It is empty calories, >which >will replace nutritious calories. Even cow's milk is far superior, since >it >has more nutrients and is a more complete food, providing fat, protein and >carbs. Most of the nutrition from the fruit is lost when made into juice. >In >addition, the super high concentration of sugar may cause insulin problems. >I would go with the milk or formula instead, although water is best. > >Just my opinion > >Cory > >------------------------------------------------------------------------ >Looking for a new hobby? Want to make a new friend? > >Come join one of over 165,000 e-mail communities at ONElist! _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 8, 1999 Report Share Posted June 8, 1999 In a message dated 6/8/99 10:48:37 PM Eastern Daylight Time, nagel@... writes: > At 11 months of age fruit juice is not going to hurt until you can find a > place to stop and breast feed. I nursed my son until he was 14 months old > and he weaned himself at that time. He would never take a bottle but was > drinking from a sippy cup as soon as he was old enough to hold one steady. > (and besides he never liked fruit, so fruit juice fortified with vit c was > the only fruit in his diet) He is 4 years old now and still will not eat > fruit. I love it personally and offer it regularly, but it is always a no > go in his mind. It is recommended also by most nutritionists not to worry > about caloric intake until you child is over 2 years old. > This is of course just my opinion (about the fruit juice that is > I must respectfully disagree. Fruit juice is not the same as fruit. It is basically junk food, with as much sugar as soda. It is empty calories, which will replace nutritious calories. Even cow's milk is far superior, since it has more nutrients and is a more complete food, providing fat, protein and carbs. Most of the nutrition from the fruit is lost when made into juice. In addition, the super high concentration of sugar may cause insulin problems. I would go with the milk or formula instead, although water is best. Just my opinion Cory Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 8, 1999 Report Share Posted June 8, 1999 Respectfully, I tried formula and other types of milk substitutes and my son would not drink it. He was just to much a breast baby I guess. And fruit juice (diluted) may be empty calories, but most are fortified with vitamin C and is a good hydrant if you child will not drink water. Although my son loves water now. I am just saying it will not harm the child and in a child not prone to diabetes i.e. family history and such a small amount of fruit juice is not going to hurt him. Re: Fruit Juice > From: Cmermer@... > > In a message dated 6/8/99 10:48:37 PM Eastern Daylight Time, nagel@... > writes: > > > At 11 months of age fruit juice is not going to hurt until you can find a > > place to stop and breast feed. I nursed my son until he was 14 months old > > and he weaned himself at that time. He would never take a bottle but was > > drinking from a sippy cup as soon as he was old enough to hold one steady. > > (and besides he never liked fruit, so fruit juice fortified with vit c was > > the only fruit in his diet) He is 4 years old now and still will not eat > > fruit. I love it personally and offer it regularly, but it is always a no > > go in his mind. It is recommended also by most nutritionists not to worry > > about caloric intake until you child is over 2 years old. > > This is of course just my opinion (about the fruit juice that is > > > > I must respectfully disagree. Fruit juice is not the same as fruit. It is > basically junk food, with as much sugar as soda. It is empty calories, which > will replace nutritious calories. Even cow's milk is far superior, since it > has more nutrients and is a more complete food, providing fat, protein and > carbs. Most of the nutrition from the fruit is lost when made into juice. In > addition, the super high concentration of sugar may cause insulin problems. > I would go with the milk or formula instead, although water is best. > > Just my opinion > > Cory > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Looking for a new hobby? Want to make a new friend? > > Come join one of over 165,000 e-mail communities at ONElist! > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 9, 1999 Report Share Posted June 9, 1999 Go with the diluted fruit juice and stay away from the cow's milk and formula. Since you are only giving bottles in the car on trips anyway, it isn't as if your baby is depending on this to survive. It is mainly just until you can get to a place to nurse him and to keep him happy until you get there! I have done that with all six of my children and the oldest is almost 20 and the youngest is 5. I did only give apple juice mixed with half water though. You can purchase 100% apple juice without added sugar which is better than soda. Whatever works for you and your baby is best. Stick with the breastfeeding for as long as he will nurse. The days will fly by and the nursing days will be over too soon. One more opinion, Alice Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 9, 1999 Report Share Posted June 9, 1999 In a message dated 6/8/99 11:15:10 PM Eastern Daylight Time, Cmermer@... writes: << I must respectfully disagree. Fruit juice is not the same as fruit. It is basically junk food, with as much sugar as soda. It is empty calories, which will replace nutritious calories. >> I agree, Cory. Fruit juice just fills them up. But I also know, once it is introduced rather than water to a child, it is difficult to get them to go to the water. I found a vegetable-fruit juice in our health food store - Vruit - that contained more than just the 100% vitamin C. Still had just as much sugar as a typical fruit juice though (like 27 or 28 grams). Keep in mind not all fruit is the same in terms of nutritional value. There is a book " What are we feeding our children " by F. son, PhD that contains a chart listing fruits in the order of nutritional value (based on all nutrients, like betacarotene, vit. c, folate, thiamin, riboflavin, niacin, potassium, iron, calcium and fiber). The highest score was for papaya (252), then came cantaloupe, strawberries, orange, tangerines, kiwi, mango, apricots.... Interestingly, apple with skin only scored 58 and apple no skin scored 42. Raisins, dates and canned in juice pears came in last. Also important when giving fruits to children, in my opinion, is pesticide use. Generally speaking, the thinner the skin, the higher the concentration of pesticides. I think peaches, grapes and strawberries are at the top of the list. Organic is the way to go, if you can. Cathi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 9, 1999 Report Share Posted June 9, 1999 I was looking through the Mercola website links for info on periodontal disease when I came across this. Since we've been discussing fruit juice and I also questioned unpasteurization, thought I'd forward this. Cathi WARNING LABELS FOR FRESH JUICES The Food and Drug Administration (FDA) says that it will propose new safety processes for juice manufacturers this fall, but in the meantime, the agency is calling on manufacturers of fresh, unpasteurized juices to put labels on their products to indicate a potential risk of foodborne illness. The FDA says the move is in response to several recent outbreaks of Escherichia coli 0157:H7, including one in the fall of 1996 traced to unpasteurized apple juice. During that outbreak in three Western states and in Canada, 66 individuals became ill after drinking the juice from one manufacturer, and one child died, FDA officials said. The FDA is mulling over how that risk could be communicated to consumers. It is considering asking manufacturers to state that unprocessed products may " ...contain pathogens known to cause serious or life-threatening illness, " and that the risk is greatest for children, the elderly, and people with weakened immune systems. The agency says that the new rules will only affect a small number of manufacturers because 98% of fruit and vegetable juices are already pasteurized. INSIGHT: This is yet another reason to avoid drinking juices. The typical 8 ounce glass of juice has 8 teaspoons of sugar as fructose. This sugar is every bit as dangerous as table sugar and will cause the same metabolic consequences. Weight gain is clearly one of the more common along with hypoglycemia and immune impairment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 9, 1999 Report Share Posted June 9, 1999 the only fruit juice that is good is freshly made. all others have been heated changing the chemical structure and eliminating the enzymes. Re: Fruit Juice >From: Cvroth@... > >In a message dated 6/8/99 11:15:10 PM Eastern Daylight Time, Cmermer@... >writes: > ><< I must respectfully disagree. Fruit juice is not the same as fruit. It >is > basically junk food, with as much sugar as soda. It is empty calories, >which > will replace nutritious calories. >> > >I agree, Cory. Fruit juice just fills them up. But I also know, once it is >introduced rather than water to a child, it is difficult to get them to go to >the water. > >I found a vegetable-fruit juice in our health food store - Vruit - that >contained more than just the 100% vitamin C. Still had just as much sugar as >a typical fruit juice though (like 27 or 28 grams). > >Keep in mind not all fruit is the same in terms of nutritional value. There >is a book " What are we feeding our children " by F. son, PhD that >contains a chart listing fruits in the order of nutritional value (based on >all nutrients, like betacarotene, vit. c, folate, thiamin, riboflavin, >niacin, potassium, iron, calcium and fiber). The highest score was for >papaya (252), then came cantaloupe, strawberries, orange, tangerines, kiwi, >mango, apricots.... Interestingly, apple with skin only scored 58 and apple >no skin scored 42. Raisins, dates and canned in juice pears came in last. > >Also important when giving fruits to children, in my opinion, is pesticide >use. Generally speaking, the thinner the skin, the higher the concentration >of pesticides. I think peaches, grapes and strawberries are at the top of >the list. Organic is the way to go, if you can. > >Cathi > >------------------------------------------------------------------------ >Congratulations to " INDIE-GRRL, " our latest ONElist of the Week. > >Visit our homepage and share with us how ONElist is changing YOUR life! > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 9, 1999 Report Share Posted June 9, 1999 I agree with the comments below. Juice in small quantities, my son's dietician said no more than 4 ounces per day diluted, will not harm a child. Apple juice is pretty worthless, but orange juice has vit c (naturally, not added) folate, and some are calcium fortified. I buy the added pulp for a little more fiber. Both my sons are very healthy. P From: " Steve & " <nagel@...> Reply-Vaccinationsonelist <Vaccinationsonelist> Subject: Re: Fruit Juice Date: Tue, 8 Jun 1999 22:32:11 -0500 From: " Steve & " <nagel@...> Respectfully, I tried formula and other types of milk substitutes and my son would not drink it. He was just to much a breast baby I guess. And fruit juice (diluted) may be empty calories, but most are fortified with vitamin C and is a good hydrant if you child will not drink water. Although my son loves water now. I am just saying it will not harm the child and in a child not prone to diabetes i.e. family history and such a small amount of fruit juice is not going to hurt him. Re: Fruit Juice > From: Cmermer@... > > In a message dated 6/8/99 10:48:37 PM Eastern Daylight Time, nagel@... > writes: > > > At 11 months of age fruit juice is not going to hurt until you can find a > > place to stop and breast feed. I nursed my son until he was 14 months old > > and he weaned himself at that time. He would never take a bottle but was > > drinking from a sippy cup as soon as he was old enough to hold one steady. > > (and besides he never liked fruit, so fruit juice fortified with vit c was > > the only fruit in his diet) He is 4 years old now and still will not eat > > fruit. I love it personally and offer it regularly, but it is always a no > > go in his mind. It is recommended also by most nutritionists not to worry > > about caloric intake until you child is over 2 years old. > > This is of course just my opinion (about the fruit juice that is > > > > I must respectfully disagree. Fruit juice is not the same as fruit. It is > basically junk food, with as much sugar as soda. It is empty calories, which > will replace nutritious calories. Even cow's milk is far superior, since it > has more nutrients and is a more complete food, providing fat, protein and > carbs. Most of the nutrition from the fruit is lost when made into juice. In > addition, the super high concentration of sugar may cause insulin problems. > I would go with the milk or formula instead, although water is best. > > Just my opinion > > Cory > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Looking for a new hobby? Want to make a new friend? > > Come join one of over 165,000 e-mail communities at ONElist! > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Congratulations to " INDIE-GRRL, " our latest ONElist of the Week. Visit our homepage and share with us how ONElist is changing YOUR life! _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 9, 1999 Report Share Posted June 9, 1999 In a message dated 6/9/1999 6:43:29 AM Central Daylight Time, ClintonVA@... writes: << You can purchase 100% apple juice without added sugar which is better than soda. >> This isnt really true when it comes to sugar content. Apple and Grape Juice are the two highest sugar content juices. This is why almost all juice blends have White Grape juice as one of the main ingrediants and Apple juice concentrate is used as a sugar substitute in baking. Take a look at your Juicy Juice labels - its 100% juice - but its still mostly sugar. It has been shown that a glass of orange juice has as much sugar in it as a glass of soda. Apple and Grape have more. The only real benefit it has over white refined sugar is that it is more easily proccessed by the body. Bright Blessings Jana Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 9, 1999 Report Share Posted June 9, 1999 You know, maybe I am out of line here, but this is a vaccine list and not a " juice " list. Why are we debating the benefits versus " risks, " of all things, of fruit juice, when one question was asked about an occasional bottle given to a breastfed baby? Come on everyone, back to the topic. Maybe it is just me being tired after a long, hot day. Alice PS Does anyone want to talk about vaccines any more? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 9, 1999 Report Share Posted June 9, 1999 Where does one get organic foods at? Marcie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 9, 1999 Report Share Posted June 9, 1999 I appreciate hearing about fruit juices. I am on this list to try and do what's best for my child and that entails much more than just vaccinations. (although that is very important) Thank you for sharing your thoughts on juices with us so that I can make a more informed decision. Marcie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 9, 1999 Report Share Posted June 9, 1999 In a message dated 6/9/99 11:15:15 AM Eastern Daylight Time, Cvroth@... writes: > I agree, Cory. Fruit juice just fills them up. But I also know, once it is > > introduced rather than water to a child, it is difficult to get them to go > to > the water. This is an excellent point. Once a child acquires a taste for the juice, it may be more difficult to get them to drink water. Once thay have a " sweet tooth " they may also prefer other sweets like cookies, candy, etc. to the more nutritous stuff. Take care. Cory Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 9, 1999 Report Share Posted June 9, 1999 Wonderfully stated! I agree totally. My sons both prefer milk and an apple over M & Ms and juice. I do endulge them occasionally and give them a treat. It isn't going to kill them!! NicP. <From: " Steve & " <nagel@...> I know this is kinda like beating a dead horse, but I believe the key is in allowing choices. My son has sweets and juice available to him and 9 times out of 10 he prefers water and healthy snacks. Where my neighbors do not have such things available and only use them as treats and their children will always choose the sweet or juice as their preferred choice. I am not a big sweet eater and never have been, so maybe my son just has some of my taste, but I think that denying the child of sweets and such will make them want it more. At least that is what I have witnessed. My son is a healthy, physically fit, very active child. It seems to have worked for him and us.> _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 9, 1999 Report Share Posted June 9, 1999 I know this is kinda like beating a dead horse, but I believe the key is in allowing choices. My son has sweets and juice available to him and 9 times out of 10 he prefers water and healthy snacks. Where my neighbors do not have such things available and only use them as treats and their children will always choose the sweet or juice as their preferred choice. I am not a big sweet eater and never have been, so maybe my son just has some of my taste, but I think that denying the child of sweets and such will make them want it more. At least that is what I have witnessed. My son is a healthy, physically fit, very active child. It seems to have worked for him and us. Re: Fruit Juice > From: Cmermer@... > > In a message dated 6/9/99 11:15:15 AM Eastern Daylight Time, Cvroth@... > writes: > > > I agree, Cory. Fruit juice just fills them up. But I also know, once it > is > > > > introduced rather than water to a child, it is difficult to get them to go > > to > > the water. > > This is an excellent point. Once a child acquires a taste for the juice, it > may be more difficult to get them to drink water. Once thay have a " sweet > tooth " they may also prefer other sweets like cookies, candy, etc. to the > more nutritous stuff. > > Take care. > > Cory > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Where do some of the Internet's largest email lists reside? > > At ONElist - the most scalable and reliable service on the Internet. > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 9, 1999 Report Share Posted June 9, 1999 Marcie, Where do you live? We are in Alberta Canada. There are many organic producers of grains, fruits and vegetables in Canada and the U.S. We buy them here through a food cooperative that brings in food from BC, Canada and California, USA, usually. Also, some health food stores sell organic fresh produce and canned (eg jams, juices, sauces) products. Krista Re: Fruit Juice >From: Dlfnluvr@... > >Where does one get organic foods at? Marcie > >------------------------------------------------------------------------ >Campaign 2000 is here! > >Discuss your thoughts; get informed at ONElist. See our homepage. > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 9, 1999 Report Share Posted June 9, 1999 Here here! Why don't people interested in the juice topic email each other privately? Re: Fruit Juice >From: ClintonVA@... > >You know, maybe I am out of line here, but this is a vaccine list and not a > " juice " list. Why are we debating the benefits versus " risks, " of all >things, of fruit juice, when one question was asked about an occasional >bottle given to a breastfed baby? Come on everyone, back to the topic. > >Maybe it is just me being tired after a long, hot day. >Alice > >PS Does anyone want to talk about vaccines any more? > >------------------------------------------------------------------------ >Have you entered ONElist's " Grow to Give " program? > >Deadline is June 19. Join now to win $5000 for your charity of choice. > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 9, 1999 Report Share Posted June 9, 1999 In a message dated 6/9/99 11:06:37 PM Eastern Daylight Time, nagel@... writes: << ntroduced rather than water to a child, it is difficult to get them to go > > to > > the water. >> HI This is true, but another option is to dilute the juice a lot and allow it only at certain times! I did this with my oldest son and he now prefers water and when he does want juice, he only wants it diluted..... JMO Kerin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 10, 1999 Report Share Posted June 10, 1999 I think that people should just delete the message if Fruit Juice is the subject heading. I want to hear what people are saying about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 10, 1999 Report Share Posted June 10, 1999 I live in a very small town in NY state and I'm just not sure where to purchase organic foods. In fact, I know nothing about organic foods. I don't know what it looks like, how it comes or anything like that. Marcie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 10, 1999 Report Share Posted June 10, 1999 Marcie, I already posted what I do in Alberta to obtain organic produce and other foods. Organic means produced, marketted and packaged (where packaging is involved) without use of pesticides, herbicides, preservatives or other chemicals. Only certified organic foods qualify. (I think the land has to have been farmed organically a minimum of 3 years before foods are certified). Try the yellow pages to find organic growers in your area (or the yellow pages of a bigger city in your state), or the internet to find sources. Try health food stores (where you buy supplements, homeopathic remedies, etc.), health food and alternative health and nutrition magazines. Krista Re: Fruit Juice >From: Dlfnluvr@... > >I live in a very small town in NY state and I'm just not sure where to >purchase organic foods. In fact, I know nothing about organic foods. I >don't know what it looks like, how it comes or anything like that. Marcie > >------------------------------------------------------------------------ >ONElist: the best source for group communications. > >Join a new list today! > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 10, 1999 Report Share Posted June 10, 1999 ME TOO! This list, at least I thought, would be more broad that JUST exploring vaccine issues... but addressing the overall health of our children - and what factors contribute to promoting that health. I've been very interested in the soy/goat/cow milk discussions. Dlfnluvr@... wrote: > From: Dlfnluvr@... > > I think that people should just delete the message if Fruit Juice is the > subject heading. I want to hear what people are saying about it. > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Looking for a new hobby? Want to make a new friend? > > Come join one of over 165,000 e-mail communities at ONElist! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 10, 1999 Report Share Posted June 10, 1999 Hey ! Thanks for the reminder on frozen peas for teething...my 17 year old LOVED her frozen peas when she was a teething baby...I had forgotten. Now that I have another one coming up...it is good to be reminded! :0) Anjin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 10, 1999 Report Share Posted June 10, 1999 Marcie, What town in NY? I know there is one in Utica...called 's Cornucopia...they have some organic food. Let me know. Also, contact farmers and ask if they belong to the Natural Farmers Association. This group does not use pesticides. Organic generally means that no pesticides, herbicides, chemicals, antibiotics, growth hormones with animals are used. Rather they use natural methods to control bugs. The prices are a little more expensive although at our farmers market in town the organic farmers prices are usually better. For example, at my local store, Big Y, regular bananas cost 69 cents/lb. while organic bananas cost 99 cents/lb. Organic produce will be smaller, but much tastier. Organic eggs also means that the chickens are allowed to roam free rather than being cooped up in a cage. I do my best to buy all organic and even drive 1 hour every couple months to purchase organic meat. Natural meat means that they do not receive antibiotics or growth hormones. Organic meat means that in addition to what natural means they are also fed organic grains (rather than some ground up parts of other animals that may have been contaminated). My understanding though with Organic and Natural is that the animals still get vaccinated. Great huh? meat is a producer of natural meats, Pete and Gerry's (I think that is it) produce organic eggs. Cascadian Farms produces EXCELLENT frozen organic vegetable. My daughter eats them as is, frozen, for a snack (especially when teething). Their peas are to die for! The other option is to start your own co-op. A co-op simply is a group of people who buy in bulk and break it apart and save $. The Northeast ative is 1-800-321-2667 x366. You can ask the requirements to start one or they may be able to hook you up with one in your area. Sometimes coops require you contribute a couple hours a month to be able to buy at great prices. This Northeast Coop distributes homeopathic remedies, herbs, frozen, fresh, juices, etc The catalog is almost 150 pages with small print. This is probably more info then you wanted but it helps. There have been numerous reports about pesticides and how they adversely affect kids because the EPA/FDA approves " safe " amounts for produce, etc for adults. The problem is there is no " safe " amount for kids and obviously kids are smaller. Also, pesticides, antibiotics,etc are all stored in the liver which makes it more difficult to function when you consider eating decades of pesticide ladden foods. in CT Dlfnluvr@... wrote: > > From: Dlfnluvr@... > > I live in a very small town in NY state and I'm just not sure where to > purchase organic foods. In fact, I know nothing about organic foods. I > don't know what it looks like, how it comes or anything like that. Marcie > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > ONElist: the best source for group communications. > > Join a new list today! -- @... *************************************************************** We Must Have The Freedom To Choose & Respect Everyone's Choice *************************************************************** Any information obtained here is not to be construed as medical OR legal advice. The decision to vaccinate and how you implement that decision is yours and yours alone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 11, 1999 Report Share Posted June 11, 1999 When I was directed to this list, I was told I would learn all about vaccines AND health related issues. I am also on a eczema list. What I dont want to read I delete. I hope we continue to cover all areas! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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