RE: [Tap 'n B Free] proxy tapping

[Guest guest]

I have a few thoughts about proxy tapping, its probably been discussed

before in the archives (I hate doing searches at ) but I'll query it

again here. I have a gestalt background and I suppose Im more focused on

personal responsibility.

But....I feel uncomfortable at the idea of proxy tapping for someone else

unless they've asked me to. And, most of the time I think when you're proxy

tapping for a relationship that is close to you, you have an invested

interest in that person changing to suit you. I agree that you should tap

for your own issues that come up about that person not doing what you want

them to.

Would anyone like to share their own thoughts on this.

Kate

At 10:05 PM 3/9/02 +0000, you wrote:

>Hi Listmembers,

>

>Could someone please help me work out the words to use for releasing

>my husband from the " frenzy of inactivity " state that he seems to

>have locked himself into. He is a managing director of a large

>company and has allowed the workload to overwhelm him in such a way

>that he is no longer able to function effectively. His current

>mode of working is to only deal with the issues in crisis, rather

>than keep on top of everything. He's a procrastinator by nature and

>I think this is why he's dug himself into his current position.

>

>I was thinking that I could help by proxy tapping about his

>procrastination, as I feel that if i could just get him to move a

>little, his momentum might start to recover itself. He spends a lot

>of time reading novels and sleeping as he just can't seem to get

>motivated and he needs to stop this NOW because the livelihoods of

>his over-500 employees lie in the balance.

>

>Thanks,

>Lena

[Guest guest]

Kate,

Your question around the issue of 'personal responsibility' goes to one of

the first in recorded history, " am I my brother's keeper? " Maybe what a more

brother loving Cain would have asked was, " to what extent should I look

after my brother? " And, specifically, aren't we simply here considering

whether we should look after our brother whether he knows it or not? "

Re: [Tap 'n B Free] proxy tapping

I have a few thoughts about proxy tapping, its probably been discussed

before in the archives (I hate doing searches at ) but I'll query it

again here. I have a gestalt background and I suppose Im more focused on

personal responsibility.

But....I feel uncomfortable at the idea of proxy tapping for someone else

unless they've asked me to. And, most of the time I think when you're proxy

tapping for a relationship that is close to you, you have an invested

interest in that person changing to suit you. I agree that you should tap

for your own issues that come up about that person not doing what you want

them to.

Would anyone like to share their own thoughts on this.

Kate

At 10:05 PM 3/9/02 +0000, you wrote:

>Hi Listmembers,

>

>Could someone please help me work out the words to use for releasing

>my husband from the " frenzy of inactivity " state that he seems to

>have locked himself into. He is a managing director of a large

>company and has allowed the workload to overwhelm him in such a way

>that he is no longer able to function effectively. His current

>mode of working is to only deal with the issues in crisis, rather

>than keep on top of everything. He's a procrastinator by nature and

>I think this is why he's dug himself into his current position.

>

>I was thinking that I could help by proxy tapping about his

>procrastination, as I feel that if i could just get him to move a

>little, his momentum might start to recover itself. He spends a lot

>of time reading novels and sleeping as he just can't seem to get

>motivated and he needs to stop this NOW because the livelihoods of

>his over-500 employees lie in the balance.

>

>Thanks,

>Lena

[Guest guest]

Lena,

your husband may be feeling pressure because of the responsibility for

others that he has taken on. Even though such " pressure " is just an internal

conversation, that doesn't make it any easier to handle if someone has it

that it's not where they want to be. i.e., Maybe the real reason for his

procrastination is fear of not making the right decisions. When we let that

fear have the 'controls' every time we think about what we have to do, we

usually put off making a decision until we perceive we are at a " crisis " and

" have to " take action. This is so common that there are business management

books written about it as even as there are for most other areas of life.

However, since the 'male' of our species is prone to deny being so afraid of

anything as to be 'controlled' by the fear of it, especially to their woman,

you may have to help him deal with it without bringing it up in such a way

that it demeans his 'masculine' ego.

[Tap 'n B Free] proxy tapping

Hi All,

WOW! What an interesting and diverse range of comments you've all come up

with! Here I was thinking that this issue would be a relatively easy one,

and I find that it has become far from that. I will have to go back and

absorb everything that's been said to decide what, if anything, i actually

want to do with it.

My husband's business, related to computers, is one he co-owns with a

partner, and they have grown it from a 4-person local operation to a

500-plus international business, and I guess he probably is a technical

person at heart, who now has to be a manager. Maybe that's the real reason

for his procrastination.

Thanks for all your input, it's been terrific, and a great help.

Cheers,

Lena

Co-Moderator: Lyn Keller rayofsunn@...

Moderator: Dayu D'Sa dayudsa@... 1(514)937-4246

Homepage: EmotionalFreedomTechniques

Send blank email to:

Subscribe: EmotionalFreedomTechniques-subscribe

Unsubscribe: EmotionalFreedomTechniques-unsubscribe

[Guest guest]

,

What if he doesn't want to be looked after? What if he wants to do it

himself? Where do you draw the line? What about the powerlessness of

always expecting someone else to come to the rescue and solve your problems?

What about always seeing the problem outside of ourselves in someone else?

Asking seems to be the way to go for me.

Kate

At 04:19 PM 3/9/02 -0800, you wrote:

>Kate,

>Your question around the issue of 'personal responsibility' goes to one of

>the first in recorded history, " am I my brother's keeper? " Maybe what a more

>brother loving Cain would have asked was, " to what extent should I look

>after my brother? " And, specifically, aren't we simply here considering

>whether we should look after our brother whether he knows it or not? "

[Guest guest]

Kate,

If I truly " don't want to be looked after " I won't be. If I truly " want to

do it all, by myself, " I will. If I don't want to ask for help (and thus

admit that I need it) I won't. However, I may want help and my ego may keep

me from asking for it or answering in the positive if someone is not tactful

in their questioning of me about it. If we offer suggestions that don't have

any personally demeaning implications to the offeree, if the offerees are

male, they are much more prone to consider them openly with you.

I gave up " drawing lines, " and discourage from doing so, because there is no

way to tell where you " should " draw them and any lines you draw usually line

up " between people. "

I don't understand how your " powerlessness " question applies to Lena's

husband, or her either for that matter, so I'll look it at as being another

topic. My first thought is, " what about what about it? " My take on " always

expecting someone else to come the rescue and solve your problems " is that

it has nothing to do with being powerless. In fact, it is a very powerful

way to be controlling of others while, at the same time, not appearing to be

responsible for your own outcome.

ditto for your last question.

Again, I'm not sure of how the " Asking " question applies to what I wrote,

but, of course, " asking " can be appropriate in some circumstances, OR, it

can be cop-out to avoid our own responsibility.

RE: [Tap 'n B Free] proxy tapping

,

What if he doesn't want to be looked after? What if he wants to do it

himself? Where do you draw the line? What about the powerlessness of

always expecting someone else to come to the rescue and solve your problems?

What about always seeing the problem outside of ourselves in someone else?

Asking seems to be the way to go for me.

Kate

At 04:19 PM 3/9/02 -0800, you wrote:

>Kate,

>Your question around the issue of 'personal responsibility' goes to one of

>the first in recorded history, " am I my brother's keeper? " Maybe what a

more

>brother loving Cain would have asked was, " to what extent should I look

>after my brother? " And, specifically, aren't we simply here considering

>whether we should look after our brother whether he knows it or not? "

Co-Moderator: Lyn Keller rayofsunn@...

Moderator: Dayu D'Sa dayudsa@... 1(514)937-4246

Homepage: EmotionalFreedomTechniques

Send blank email to:

Subscribe: EmotionalFreedomTechniques-subscribe

Unsubscribe: EmotionalFreedomTechniques-unsubscribe

[Guest guest]

Thanks for this feedback , its helped me alot to understand this

issue. I wasn't referring to Lena and her husband, I was referring to your

comments about being your brothers keeper. The *he* was your brother. *g*

When you talk about copping out of responsibility, is that referring to

seeing something that you could help with, and then you dont? My issue

would be I would be tapping for other peoples issues all the time. Im very

good at taking onboard too much responsibility. Im also quite good at

projecting onto other people issues I could well look at in my life.

I suppose I saw it as a similar issue as say doing a tarot reading for

someone who hadn't asked for it.

Kate

At 07:39 PM 3/9/02 -0800, you wrote:

>Kate,

>If I truly " don't want to be looked after " I won't be. If I truly " want to

>do it all, by myself, " I will. If I don't want to ask for help (and thus

>admit that I need it) I won't. However, I may want help and my ego may keep

>me from asking for it or answering in the positive if someone is not tactful

>in their questioning of me about it. If we offer suggestions that don't have

>any personally demeaning implications to the offeree, if the offerees are

>male, they are much more prone to consider them openly with you.

>

>I gave up " drawing lines, " and discourage from doing so, because there is no

>way to tell where you " should " draw them and any lines you draw usually line

>up " between people. "

>

>I don't understand how your " powerlessness " question applies to Lena's

>husband, or her either for that matter, so I'll look it at as being another

>topic. My first thought is, " what about what about it? " My take on " always

>expecting someone else to come the rescue and solve your problems " is that

>it has nothing to do with being powerless. In fact, it is a very powerful

>way to be controlling of others while, at the same time, not appearing to be

>responsible for your own outcome.

>

>ditto for your last question.

>

>Again, I'm not sure of how the " Asking " question applies to what I wrote,

>but, of course, " asking " can be appropriate in some circumstances, OR, it

>can be cop-out to avoid our own responsibility.

[Guest guest]

Lena:

When asked about proxy tapping, specifically about how ethical it is whether

the other person requests it or not, Craig (in Toronto, Nov. 2001)

likened proxy tapping to praying. Often we don't ask another's permission to

pray for them. It's the intent behind it that matters. I would guess that if

our intent is not what is best for them but rather what is best for us (some

codependency going on there) then the proxy tapping may not be effective.

Best bet - tap out your intense emotions about the situation first. One can

also muscle test and see if proxy tapping is in the best interest of the one

being tapped for or not.

> My husband's business, related to computers, is one he co-owns with a

> partner, and they have grown it from a 4-person local operation to a

> 500-plus international business, and I guess he probably is a technical

> person at heart, who now has to be a manager. Maybe that's the real reason

> for his procrastination.

>

>

Wow! Similar situation with my husband's business, which he started out of a

garage with a partner then grew into a multinational success. He then had to

step out of the role of salesman (fun for him) into management/administration

(not so fun). A few years ago, he was not waking up on time to go to work,

complaining, and having physical problems. I finally told him either have fun

with his job or create a new one! So he created a new role for himself that

is more to his liking -- actually hired someone to take on his administrative

" headaches. " He still has to keep adapting, but without the drama and

struggle.

Love & light,

Gwenn

HEAVEN ON EARTH

Create the life you REALLY want!

Phone: 954-370-1552

heavenonearthfl@...

***UPCOMING EVENTS***

BEGINNING FEB. 20, 2002

Evening Energy Psychology Training: A six-week program covering basic and

advanced EFT, BSFF, Muscle Testing and Energetic Healing.

***Now Available***

TAP YOUR TROUBLES AWAY: EFT Tutorial by Gwenn Bonnell

60-minute interactive audio program with easy-to-follow chart

In just a few minutes learn what other programs take hours to teach

CASSETTE TAPE: $20 CD: $26 + Shipping & FL State tax where applicable

***For your FREE subscription to Gwenn's electronic newsletter email

heavenonearthnow-subscribe

[Guest guest]

Gwen,

Thats a great idea about muscle testing. I really think when I want someone

else to be a certain way (Im talking about children and partner here, so a

close relationship) I have an invested interest in things being different.

And the issue is probably my uncomfortableness with the other person not

changing fast enough for me. I usually figure its projection and the other

person is showing a quality I haven't owned in myself.

Kate

At 04:25 PM 3/10/02 -0500, you wrote:

>Lena:

>When asked about proxy tapping, specifically about how ethical it is whether

>the other person requests it or not, Craig (in Toronto, Nov. 2001)

>likened proxy tapping to praying. Often we don't ask another's permission to

>pray for them. It's the intent behind it that matters. I would guess that if

>our intent is not what is best for them but rather what is best for us (some

>codependency going on there) then the proxy tapping may not be effective.

>Best bet - tap out your intense emotions about the situation first. One can

>also muscle test and see if proxy tapping is in the best interest of the one

>being tapped for or not.