Re: Ketone Report

[Guest guest]

There's no downside to diet induced ketosis.

Ketones are brain preferred food.

Athletes sometimes have a problem at the beginning, until their bodies

acclimate, then they do just fine.

Personally, I ignore the diet at family get togethers, holidays,and go

right back to it the next day.

That's MY rationalization...

Burn,baby,burn...

Chuck

Corduroy pillows: They're making headlines.

On 9/19/2011 6:56:15 AM, lizz7711 (lizz7711@...) wrote:

> " moderate " at 6:50am! Cool...burning fat all night : )

>

> So now my question is what is the healthiest range to be in?

> Don't want to get sick or hurt my body...is it best to eat just low enough

carbs to be in the small or moderate range, or do you wANT it to be " large "

numbers of ketones?

> Liz

>

[Guest guest]

, for cognitive improvement, MCT oil produces a lot more ketones than

coconut oil does. For energy, again the MCT oil, probably for the same reason.

You don't need either one for general health, as milk fat keeps one healthy too,

and cholesterol markers aren't health markers so are a non-issue but the

consensus is that less than 1:4 ratio HDL:LDL is unhealthy, and both MCT and

coconut oil increase HDL more than LDL so are healthy. I have a reservation with

regard to lauric acid because it's known to be able to break cell walls a bit,

so I chose MCT oil and butter as my main fats.

all good,

Duncan

> >

> > I think you're still missing the point here Duncan - at least from my own

experience, and that of many, many others who have been on a ketogenic diet. But

there's no sense continuing to argue just for the sake of argument.

> >

> > The diet and the ketostiks works for most - though perhaps not all. My

point, however, is that it is the diet - not the type of oil that is used - that

is the primary determinant of weight loss or gain; therefore, I would place MCT

oil in the overly hyped area for weight loss along with VCO (not that it doesn't

have it's advantages as has attested to already).

> >

> > Dee

> >

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Thanks Duncan........Good....I've always been a butter guy instead of margarine

and is one MCT oil better than the next? It looks like a change might be in

order after a bit of research. Where might I find MCT oil?

 

Thanks again

From: Duncan Crow <duncancrow@...>

Coconut Oil

Sent: Monday, September 19, 2011 5:09 PM

Subject: Re: Ketone Report

 

, for cognitive improvement, MCT oil produces a lot more ketones than

coconut oil does. For energy, again the MCT oil, probably for the same reason.

You don't need either one for general health, as milk fat keeps one healthy too,

and cholesterol markers aren't health markers so are a non-issue but the

consensus is that less than 1:4 ratio HDL:LDL is unhealthy, and both MCT and

coconut oil increase HDL more than LDL so are healthy. I have a reservation with

regard to lauric acid because it's known to be able to break cell walls a bit,

so I chose MCT oil and butter as my main fats.

all good,

Duncan

> >

> > I think you're still missing the point here Duncan - at least from my own

experience, and that of many, many others who have been on a ketogenic diet. But

there's no sense continuing to argue just for the sake of argument.

> >

> > The diet and the ketostiks works for most - though perhaps not all. My

point, however, is that it is the diet - not the type of oil that is used - that

is the primary determinant of weight loss or gain; therefore, I would place MCT

oil in the overly hyped area for weight loss along with VCO (not that it doesn't

have it's advantages as has attested to already).

> >

> > Dee

> >

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hi ; I'm more of a butter/milk fat guy too, now it's milk fat and MCT oil

all the way. We use a lot of cream so I only hope it's not too radioactive from

Island Farms dairy; it's around the best we have in BC Canada. Here's the MCT

link I use; Now's MCT tastes good, dunno about the rest but they're probably

fine:

http://www.bodybuilding.com/store/now/mctoil.html

>

> Thanks Duncan........Good....I've always been a butter guy instead of

margarine and is one MCT oil better than the next? It looks like a change might

be in order after a bit of research. Where might I find MCT oil?

>  

> Thanks again

>

>

> From: Duncan Crow <duncancrow@...>

> Coconut Oil

> Sent: Monday, September 19, 2011 5:09 PM

> Subject: Re: Ketone Report

>

>

>  

> , for cognitive improvement, MCT oil produces a lot more ketones than

coconut oil does. For energy, again the MCT oil, probably for the same reason.

You don't need either one for general health, as milk fat keeps one healthy too,

and cholesterol markers aren't health markers so are a non-issue but the

consensus is that less than 1:4 ratio HDL:LDL is unhealthy, and both MCT and

coconut oil increase HDL more than LDL so are healthy. I have a reservation with

regard to lauric acid because it's known to be able to break cell walls a bit,

so I chose MCT oil and butter as my main fats.

>

> all good,

>

> Duncan

[Guest guest]

Duncan.........I found this MCT oil...What do you think.

http://www.life-enhancement.com/product.asp?id=228

From: Duncan Crow <duncancrow@...>

Coconut Oil

Sent: Monday, September 19, 2011 5:48 PM

Subject: Re: Ketone Report

 

Hi ; I'm more of a butter/milk fat guy too, now it's milk fat and MCT oil

all the way. We use a lot of cream so I only hope it's not too radioactive from

Island Farms dairy; it's around the best we have in BC Canada. Here's the MCT

link I use; Now's MCT tastes good, dunno about the rest but they're probably

fine:

http://www.bodybuilding.com/store/now/mctoil.html

>

> Thanks Duncan........Good....I've always been a butter guy instead of

margarine and is one MCT oil better than the next? It looks like a change might

be in order after a bit of research. Where might I find MCT oil?

>  

> Thanks again

>

>

> From: Duncan Crow <duncancrow@...>

> Coconut Oil

> Sent: Monday, September 19, 2011 5:09 PM

> Subject: Re: Ketone Report

>

>

>  

> , for cognitive improvement, MCT oil produces a lot more ketones than

coconut oil does. For energy, again the MCT oil, probably for the same reason.

You don't need either one for general health, as milk fat keeps one healthy too,

and cholesterol markers aren't health markers so are a non-issue but the

consensus is that less than 1:4 ratio HDL:LDL is unhealthy, and both MCT and

coconut oil increase HDL more than LDL so are healthy. I have a reservation with

regard to lauric acid because it's known to be able to break cell walls a bit,

so I chose MCT oil and butter as my main fats.

>

> all good,

>

> Duncan

[Guest guest]

Duncan and I both buy NOW, but I would bet there are very few companies making

MCT oil so you need to trust your brand.

Duncan gets his at bodybuilding.com.. I used to buy a lot of my stuff there,

they are fast to ship...

I use iHerb.com and if I spend 40 bucks I get free shipping... If you use

iHerb, first time buyers can get 5 bucks off using my code...LEC615.

If you do decide to get that brand, I am sure it will be fine.

C.

________________________________

From: <wilson19262003@...>

" Coconut Oil "

<Coconut Oil >

Sent: Mon, September 19, 2011 7:00:41 PM

Subject: Re: Re: Ketone Report

Duncan.........I found this MCT oil...What do you think.

http://www.life-enhancement.com/product.asp?id=228

From: Duncan Crow <duncancrow@...>

Coconut Oil

Sent: Monday, September 19, 2011 5:48 PM

Subject: Re: Ketone Report

Hi ; I'm more of a butter/milk fat guy too, now it's milk fat and MCT oil

all the way. We use a lot of cream so I only hope it's not too radioactive from

Island Farms dairy; it's around the best we have in BC Canada. Here's the MCT

link I use; Now's MCT tastes good, dunno about the rest but they're probably

fine:

http://www.bodybuilding.com/store/now/mctoil.html

>

> Thanks Duncan........Good....I've always been a butter guy instead of

margarine

>and is one MCT oil better than the next? It looks like a change might be in

>order after a bit of research. Where might I find MCT oil?

> Â

> Thanks again

>

>

> From: Duncan Crow <duncancrow@...>

> Coconut Oil

> Sent: Monday, September 19, 2011 5:09 PM

> Subject: Re: Ketone Report

>

>

> Â

> , for cognitive improvement, MCT oil produces a lot more ketones than

>coconut oil does. For energy, again the MCT oil, probably for the same reason.

>You don't need either one for general health, as milk fat keeps one healthy

too,

>and cholesterol markers aren't health markers so are a non-issue but the

>consensus is that less than 1:4 ratio HDL:LDL is unhealthy, and both MCT and

>coconut oil increase HDL more than LDL so are healthy. I have a reservation

with

>regard to lauric acid because it's known to be able to break cell walls a bit,

>so I chose MCT oil and butter as my main fats.

>

> all good,

>

> Duncan

[Guest guest]

Thank you ........

You're a Peach!!!

From: Cody <lecody2001@...>

Coconut Oil

Sent: Monday, September 19, 2011 6:38 PM

Subject: Re: Re: Ketone Report

 

Duncan and I both buy NOW, but I would bet there are very few companies making

MCT oil so you need to trust your brand.

Duncan gets his at bodybuilding.com.. I used to buy a lot of my stuff there,

they are fast to ship...

I use iHerb.com and if I spend 40 bucks I get free shipping... If you use

iHerb, first time buyers can get 5 bucks off using my code...LEC615.

If you do decide to get that brand, I am sure it will be fine.

C.

________________________________

From: <wilson19262003@...>

" Coconut Oil "

<Coconut Oil >

Sent: Mon, September 19, 2011 7:00:41 PM

Subject: Re: Re: Ketone Report

Duncan.........I found this MCT oil...What do you think.

http://www.life-enhancement.com/product.asp?id=228

From: Duncan Crow <duncancrow@...>

Coconut Oil

Sent: Monday, September 19, 2011 5:48 PM

Subject: Re: Ketone Report

Hi ; I'm more of a butter/milk fat guy too, now it's milk fat and MCT oil

all the way. We use a lot of cream so I only hope it's not too radioactive from

Island Farms dairy; it's around the best we have in BC Canada. Here's the MCT

link I use; Now's MCT tastes good, dunno about the rest but they're probably

fine:

http://www.bodybuilding.com/store/now/mctoil.html

>

> Thanks Duncan........Good....I've always been a butter guy instead of

margarine

>and is one MCT oil better than the next? It looks like a change might be in

>order after a bit of research. Where might I find MCT oil?

> Â

> Thanks again

>

>

> From: Duncan Crow <duncancrow@...>

> Coconut Oil

> Sent: Monday, September 19, 2011 5:09 PM

> Subject: Re: Ketone Report

>

>

> Â

> , for cognitive improvement, MCT oil produces a lot more ketones than

>coconut oil does. For energy, again the MCT oil, probably for the same reason.

>You don't need either one for general health, as milk fat keeps one healthy

too,

>and cholesterol markers aren't health markers so are a non-issue but the

>consensus is that less than 1:4 ratio HDL:LDL is unhealthy, and both MCT and

>coconut oil increase HDL more than LDL so are healthy. I have a reservation

with

>regard to lauric acid because it's known to be able to break cell walls a bit,

>so I chose MCT oil and butter as my main fats.

>

> all good,

>

> Duncan

[Guest guest]

Duncan,

Do you know the source of NOW's MCT oil? From reading their description

it appears as though it's a mix of coconut and red palm kernal oils.

Bob

Re: Ketone Report

>

>

> Â

> , for cognitive improvement, MCT oil produces a lot more ketones

> than coconut oil does. For energy, again the MCT oil, probably for the

> same reason. You don't need either one for general health, as milk fat

> keeps one healthy too, and cholesterol markers aren't health markers so

> are a non-issue but the consensus is that less than 1:4 ratio HDL:LDL is

> unhealthy, and both MCT and coconut oil increase HDL more than LDL so are

> healthy. I have a reservation with regard to lauric acid because it's

> known to be able to break cell walls a bit, so I chose MCT oil and butter

> as my main fats.

>

> all good,

>

> Duncan

------------------------------------

[Guest guest]

Did a search, its manufactured in Malaysia...

http://www.alibaba.com/showroom/mct-oil.html

http://www.alibaba.com/member/my1004607333.html

________________________________

From: Bob Banever <bbanever@...>

Coconut Oil

Sent: Mon, September 19, 2011 8:07:12 PM

Subject: Re: Re: Ketone Report

Duncan,

Do you know the source of NOW's MCT oil? From reading their description

it appears as though it's a mix of coconut and red palm kernal oils.

Bob

Re: Ketone Report

>

>

> Â

> , for cognitive improvement, MCT oil produces a lot more ketones

> than coconut oil does. For energy, again the MCT oil, probably for the

> same reason. You don't need either one for general health, as milk fat

> keeps one healthy too, and cholesterol markers aren't health markers so

> are a non-issue but the consensus is that less than 1:4 ratio HDL:LDL is

> unhealthy, and both MCT and coconut oil increase HDL more than LDL so are

> healthy. I have a reservation with regard to lauric acid because it's

> known to be able to break cell walls a bit, so I chose MCT oil and butter

> as my main fats.

>

> all good,

>

> Duncan

------------------------------------

[Guest guest]

Can't tell what's in that MCT oil without label language but I'd think it's

likely the same as the rest at a 30% higher cost than Now's. All MCT signifies

is it's about 60% caprylic acid and 40% capric acid; it might be a more exact

ratio clinically. I got mine at bodybuilding.com

all good,

Duncan

>

> Duncan.........I found this MCT oil...What do you think.

> http://www.life-enhancement.com/product.asp?id=228

>

[Guest guest]

No, I don't know the source. I think tallow has also been made into MCT oil.

Qualityfirst.on.ca has a fractionated oil that has a similar but not identical

profile. I think by the gallon they'd have a pretty competitive price.

all good,

Duncan

>

> Duncan,

>

> Do you know the source of NOW's MCT oil? From reading their description

> it appears as though it's a mix of coconut and red palm kernal oils.

>

> Bob

[Guest guest]

Thanks Duncan. I appreciate your knowledge and input

From: Duncan Crow <duncancrow@...>

Coconut Oil

Sent: Monday, September 19, 2011 7:39 PM

Subject: Re: Ketone Report

 

Can't tell what's in that MCT oil without label language but I'd think it's

likely the same as the rest at a 30% higher cost than Now's. All MCT signifies

is it's about 60% caprylic acid and 40% capric acid; it might be a more exact

ratio clinically. I got mine at bodybuilding.com

all good,

Duncan

>

> Duncan.........I found this MCT oil...What do you think.

> http://www.life-enhancement.com/product.asp?id=228

>

[Guest guest]

Duncan:

Do you know how the MCT oil is made? The only brand I can find (besides

body-building brands) is NOW, and it says nothing about how it's made: just that

MCT oil comes from coconut and palm kernel oil. How do they separate the MCT

from the lauric acid? It also does not say organic. I'm wondering, if there's so

much fabulous research concerning MCT, why is it so hard to procure from the

natural/organic/whole food circuit? I have not seen a place where I can read the

entire label, so if there's something on the label that might enlighten me,

would you mind quoting it?

Thanks,

--Leah

>

> Hi ; I'm more of a butter/milk fat guy too, now it's milk fat and MCT

oil all the way. We use a lot of cream so I only hope it's not too radioactive

from Island Farms dairy; it's around the best we have in BC Canada. Here's the

MCT link I use; Now's MCT tastes good, dunno about the rest but they're probably

fine:

>

> http://www.bodybuilding.com/store/now/mctoil.html

[Guest guest]

Last report.... re ran the test sunday pm and monday am having eaten both VCO

and MCT.. same readings, mild to moderate in pm, negative in morning.

Now the kicker, yesterday nothing but MCT oil and what ever fats were naturally

in the foods. Last night barely a mild, closer to negative and the same in the

morning.

Not being a scientist or completely understanding the process by which vco and

mct or dealt with in the body I will never the less postulate the following.

MCT is the part of VCO that gets completely burned up and used by the body.

Hence no sign of ketones.

VCO could have something in it that inhibits the complete uptake of MCT oils or

one of the other oils creates ketones that aren't absorbed and used up by the

body.

Either way, positive ketones while on MCT or VCO do not indict that you are in

ketosis unless you have a positive AM reading after fasting for at least 8

hours.

Ok, that's mine.. anyone else wanna give a go?

________________________________

From: Leah <wenandleah@...>

Coconut Oil

Sent: Mon, September 19, 2011 10:13:51 PM

Subject: Re: Ketone Report

Duncan:

Do you know how the MCT oil is made? The only brand I can find (besides

body-building brands) is NOW, and it says nothing about how it's made: just that

MCT oil comes from coconut and palm kernel oil. How do they separate the MCT

from the lauric acid? It also does not say organic. I'm wondering, if there's so

much fabulous research concerning MCT, why is it so hard to procure from the

natural/organic/whole food circuit? I have not seen a place where I can read the

entire label, so if there's something on the label that might enlighten me,

would you mind quoting it?

Thanks,

--Leah

>

> Hi ; I'm more of a butter/milk fat guy too, now it's milk fat and MCT

>oil all the way. We use a lot of cream so I only hope it's not too radioactive

>from Island Farms dairy; it's around the best we have in BC Canada. Here's the

>MCT link I use; Now's MCT tastes good, dunno about the rest but they're

probably

>fine:

>

> http://www.bodybuilding.com/store/now/mctoil.html

[Guest guest]

Hi All,

In the chemistry of fats and oils, MCT or medium chain triglycerides refers to

those fatty acid with 6 - 12 carbon chain; LCT or long chain fatty acids with

13-22 carbon chain; and SCT or short chain fatty acids with only 3 to 5 carbon

chains. In saturated fatty acids,  to each carbon atom is attached to a pair of

 hydrogen   atoms; if one pair of hydrogen atom is missing, this is a

monounsaturated fatty acid and if two or more pairs of hydrogen missing, then it

is termed polyunsaturated fatty acid. The medium chain fatty acids are: Caproic,

C6, Caprylic, C8; Capric, C10 and; Lauric, C12.  The highest  natural source

of MCT comes from coconut oil (63% MCT) and it is 47-53% lauric acid (C12). this

is followed by palm kernel oil (PKO) with 53 % MCT.

Hoping this helps clarify the MCTs and Coconut oil.

Cheers,

Sev Magat

________________________________

From: <wilson19262003@...>

" Coconut Oil "

<Coconut Oil >

Sent: Monday, September 19, 2011 11:25 AM

Subject: Re: Re: Ketone Report

 

Sorry but I'm confused.......Are you saying MCT Oil is better for you than VCO

when it comes to general health, cognition, cholesterol lowering, etc?

From: Duncan Crow <duncancrow@...>

Coconut Oil

Sent: Monday, September 19, 2011 9:56 AM

Subject: Re: Ketone Report

 

If anything Dee, coconut oil has been overhyped based on the MCT research; it's

the other way around. Remember, most of the " coconut oil research " you refer to

was actually done with MCT oil, not coocnut oil, which is 50% lauric acid and

only 12% MCT? These studies are often attributed to coocnut oil to overhype

coconut oil.

MCT oil produces a lot of energy and improves lucidity and cognition in an aging

population, even to the point of improving alzheimer's. It's clearly an

anti-aging tool. We can rely on the actual and researched attributes of MCT oil,

while in contrast, falsely attributing certain MCT properties to coconut oil

(overhyping coconut oil) does everyone a disservice.

I didn't miss the point you tried to make. You were not " in ketosis " by virtue

of eating coconut or MCT oil; the readings must be taken at rest rather than in

response to eating MCT oils. Your observation of ketosisd based on your " MCT

experience " may not have even been valid because you haven't been shown to be in

ketosis by those keto stick readings.

all good,

Duncan

>

> I think you're still missing the point here Duncan - at least from my own

experience, and that of many, many others who have been on a ketogenic diet. But

there's no sense continuing to argue just for the sake of argument.

>

> The diet and the ketostiks works for most - though perhaps not all. My point,

however, is that it is the diet - not the type of oil that is used - that is the

primary determinant of weight loss or gain; therefore, I would place MCT oil in

the overly hyped area for weight loss along with VCO (not that it doesn't have

it's advantages as has attested to already).

>

> Dee

>

[Guest guest]

Leah & those interested in how MCT oil is manufactured. You can find answers to

your questions here:

http://www.microlipids.com/pages/frequent-questions.htm

In a nutshell here is how it is done:

quote: " " MCT oil is a vegetable oil distilled from coconut oil or palm kernel

oil

with steam. The steam's heat separates the medium-chain fatty acids (MCFAs) from

the whole coconut oil or palm kernel oil. After distillation, the free MCFAs are

esterified (attached) to a glycerol backbone, re-forming them into the

characteristic triglyceride (fat) molecules of vegetable oil. The raw MCT oil is

then purified and deodorized with traditional vegetable oil refining

procedures. "

My personal opinion is that I would not use it as a replacement for virgin

coconut oil, which is cold processed, contains ALL of the fatty acids (each of

which has different beneficial properties - lauric being one). MCT in

combination with VCO, however, can be beneficial for certain conditions. Dr.

Newport mixed the two for her husband's Alzheimer's because she found that the

MCT oil was used up too quickly but the mixture of the two provided a sustained

effect.

Dee

>

>

> Duncan:

>

> Do you know how the MCT oil is made? The only brand I can find (besides

body-building brands) is NOW, and it says nothing about how it's made: just that

MCT oil comes from coconut and palm kernel oil. How do they separate the MCT

from the lauric acid? It also does not say organic. I'm wondering, if there's so

much fabulous research concerning MCT, why is it so hard to procure from the

natural/organic/whole food circuit? I have not seen a place where I can read the

entire label, so if there's something on the label that might enlighten me,

would you mind quoting it?

>

> Thanks,

>

> --Leah

>

>

> >

> > Hi ; I'm more of a butter/milk fat guy too, now it's milk fat and MCT

oil all the way. We use a lot of cream so I only hope it's not too radioactive

from Island Farms dairy; it's around the best we have in BC Canada. Here's the

MCT link I use; Now's MCT tastes good, dunno about the rest but they're probably

fine:

> >

> > http://www.bodybuilding.com/store/now/mctoil.html

>

[Guest guest]

Annette described how MCT oil is made last month; coconut oil is left to

separate in a warm condition, with MCTs rising to the appropriate level in the

container (fractionating), then the fractions are decanted.

MCTs can also be rendered from tallow or other oils by breaking oils into

smaller components, then fractionated and decanted.

The Now Foods MCT label does not say how fractionating is accomplished but it

does say the MCT oil is pharmaceutical grade (USP).

all good,

Duncan

>

>

> Duncan:

>

> Do you know how the MCT oil is made? The only brand I can find (besides

body-building brands) is NOW, and it says nothing about how it's made: just that

MCT oil comes from coconut and palm kernel oil. How do they separate the MCT

from the lauric acid? It also does not say organic. I'm wondering, if there's so

much fabulous research concerning MCT, why is it so hard to procure from the

natural/organic/whole food circuit? I have not seen a place where I can read the

entire label, so if there's something on the label that might enlighten me,

would you mind quoting it?

>

> Thanks,

>

> --Leah

>

[Guest guest]

I think the sustained effect of VCO is due to the longer chain oils taking

longer to be broken down than the MCT oil. Fats are broken down molecule by

molecule, and as they are, the result is a shorter and shorter chain until all

that's left is the ketone residue. So in this respect ANY fat along with MCT oil

will sustain the effect. I choose butter/milk fat.

all good,

Duncan

Dr. Newport mixed the two for her husband's Alzheimer's because she found that

the MCT oil was used up too quickly but the mixture of the two provided a

sustained effect.

>

> Dee

>

[Guest guest]

Moderate ketones again this morning, have not had any CO or MCT oil. So, my body

is burning fat...but I still do not feel as if i've lost any weight at all...my

clothes feel the same (scale is not super accurate, does not show change)...this

is after 9 days of very low carbs, and maybe 1200 or so calories a day. Maybe

my thyroid is worse than I thought? I could up my Armour dose...

Also, when I walk for only 10 min, the muscles in my legs start to hurt.

Liz

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Well it does indicate that

> > > > > > she's burning fats, right? The question is - is she just burning the

fats she is eating or burning excess body fat as well? Apparently it is only the

former. That would require an adjustment to the diet and (according to the

science and the majority of experience) that would happen by eliminating carbs:

> > > > > > > http://www.atkins.com/Science/ScienceBehindAtkins.aspx and

> > > > > > >

http://www.atkins.com/Science/ScienceArticlesLibrary/NotableResearch.aspx

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Perhaps a morning reading WOULD indicate that the body is

> > > > >

> > > >

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Duncan, can you produce the message in which Annette describes MCT oil being

made that way? I recall Tony saying one could get close to fractionating it

themselves by this method, but I could find no message where Annette described

it done that way with the MCT oil that is being sold. The link I gave was from a

company that produces MCT oil for sale.

This is what Annette said in message 37035:

quote:

" When MCT oil is produced they take coconut oil and fractionate it so the

glycerol backbone is severed from the fatty acids. This process " breaks-up "

the triglyceride. Then they separate out all the different fatty acids and

select only the capric (8 carbon chain) and caprylic (10 carbon chain)

acids. These two fatty acids are then reattached to glycerol molecules. "

Does that sound like something that can be done by simply letting the coconut

oil sit in a warm place?

Dee

>

> Annette described how MCT oil is made last month; coconut oil is left to

separate in a warm condition, with MCTs rising to the appropriate level in the

container (fractionating), then the fractions are decanted.

>

> MCTs can also be rendered from tallow or other oils by breaking oils into

smaller components, then fractionated and decanted.

>

> The Now Foods MCT label does not say how fractionating is accomplished but it

does say the MCT oil is pharmaceutical grade (USP).

>

> all good,

>

> Duncan

>

>

[Guest guest]

Dee I think you're nit-picking as both fractionating methods have been used.

Sorry Annette for attributing part of the conversation to you if you didn't say

it

Quality First International's Vinia Marquez mailed me back with the information

that North America's largest coconut oil wholesaler is launching a few new sites

including an information site for coconut oil processing that will answer some

of our questions. Ms. Marquez is the biochemist inventor of the plant equipment

that makes pharmaceutically pure gourmet VCO in a single pass. Information I

have is that the sites will go live on Oct 5 2011. The company has a new domain

for Virgin Oil de Coco Creme, a commerce domain, a skin care domain, and an

exotic products domain; they should all be of interest.

Meanwhile, today I should be getting a current price list from the company so we

can see the cost of their fractionated oil and their Nutra-oil, which is a blend

of VCO and MCT.

all good,

Duncan

>

> Duncan, can you produce the message in which Annette describes MCT oil being

made that way?

[Guest guest]

Duncan, I hardly think it's nit-piking to point out the difference between

something that is made commercially vs. something that can be made at home. Here

is the message where Tony (who is involved in the coconut growing industry)

explains it. And btw, you gave him the usual hard time about this (home) method

so I was surprised to hear you say with such surety that this was how it was

done commercially. Anyway, here is Tony's message:

Message #37160

quote: "

Natural sources of MCT: virgin coconut oil -66%, palm kernel oil - 55%. Â

Note that palm oil (palm kernel oil and palm oil are different, though they come

from the same palm fruit) does not contain significant amount of MCT

Commercial MCT oil is chemically produced from coconut and/or palm kernel oils.

The oils are first chemically hydrolyzed to remove the fatty acids from

glycerol. The separated fatty acids are then fractionated by vaporizing it up to

550 deg F and subsequently condensed. Fatty acids have different condensation

temperatures: the condensed fraction of medium-chain fatty acids are collected

together (thus the use of the term fractionated oil). The collected fraction of

medium-chain fatty acids (MCFA) are re-combined with glycerol in an

esterification chemical reaction, using dehydrating agents like sulfuric acid,

to transform it back to MCT. The intense processing that commercial MCT oils

undergo is the main reason why the oil is relatively thick, even thicker than

another intensely-processed RBD coconut oil. MCT oils have specific gravity of

about 0.95, while VCO is light at 0.91.

A practical way to get MCT without the chemically and heat intense processing is

to extract it from VCO at home. Starting with a VCO in completely liquid

state, put it in an area that has a temperature of about 73 to 77 deg F. At

this temperature, the VCO will slowly solidify. When about half of the oil is

already solidified, decant the remaining liquid part. This liquid is rich in MCT

- up to 85% when cooling is slow enough and decantation is done carefully. The

thicker solidified portion is primarily LCT but still contains some amount of

MCT, and is suitable as cooking oil.

I hope the above helps.

Tony Geniston

> >

> > Duncan, can you produce the message in which Annette describes MCT oil being

made that way?

>

[Guest guest]

I understand your enthusiasm, Dee. OK, if you can get 1/2 of the caprylic and

capric acids out of a pint, 16 oz of VCO in a reasonably concentrated state at

home using the method Tony pointed out, you'd get 1.2 ounces of MCT oil plus

some fraction you don't want, because it's a crude experiment.

That pint of VCO yielded for you about a day's worth of MCT and 14 ounces of

dreck.

I'm not sure it would be suitable for soap making or biodiesel but both are also

top uses of coconut oil. For my purpose of increasing ketones and energy I'd

rather the processing company took away the lauric acid and other components for

their relative pharmaceutical and cosmetic purposes and sold me just MCT oil.

all good,

Duncan

>

> Duncan, I hardly think it's nit-piking to point out the difference between

something that is made commercially vs. something that can be made at home.

[Guest guest]

Yes, that was (basically) your answer last time. So why did you say that this

was the way the MCT oil you recommend is made? Were you afraid that if people

knew the truth they would not as enthusiastic as you are about MCT oil? Or did

you just not know how it is really manufactured?

Dee

> >

> > Duncan, I hardly think it's nit-piking to point out the difference between

something that is made commercially vs. something that can be made at home.

>

[Guest guest]

My muscles and joints are all hurting. I'm startng to think that going this low

carb is not good for the body...maybe that's why ya'll need the MSM, lol Is

it possible my body is burning some fat but also muscle for energy? Most weight

loss plans lead to loss of muscle weight. Or, maybe it's the whey and there is

some casein in it. Frustrated...

Liz

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Well it does indicate that

> > > > > > > she's burning fats, right? The question is - is she just burning

the fats she is eating or burning excess body fat as well? Apparently it is only

the former. That would require an adjustment to the diet and (according to the

science and the majority of experience) that would happen by eliminating carbs:

> > > > > > > > http://www.atkins.com/Science/ScienceBehindAtkins.aspx and

> > > > > > > >

http://www.atkins.com/Science/ScienceArticlesLibrary/NotableResearch.aspx

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Perhaps a morning reading WOULD indicate that the body is

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > >

> > >

> >

>