What is LPA for or against?

[Guest guest]

LPA is a unique organization that represents a group of very diverse people that

have nothing in common except dwarfism. We are from every part of society,

every religion, generation, etc. Thus I think it would be a mistake for LPA to

become hard-nosed about what it's for or against.

For example, when you asked what a person with dwarfism should be called, you

get - to say the least - a variety of answers. Why? Because we have different

experiences (good and bad), different preferences, and those of us who are older

(oh, it hurts to say that) look at it differently than the younglings do.

So why insist on one answer? What I love about the debate about naming is

that today we are ALLOWED to name ourselves - we aren't forced to accept what

the allegedly normal population chooses to call us. We can name ourselves and

not be accused of denial, craziness, whatever. And yes, that was the case not

so very long ago.

I think the strength of LPA (and other organizations of people with

disabilities) is that it reminds us all that none of us are alike and that

THAT'S OKAY! Kids are growing up being taught that they are a natural part of

human diversity - not oddities or freaks. How powerful is that?

As much as the ELL thing drives me crazy, I would hate to see LPA take a

strong stand - for or against it. It's an individual decision, and a lot of

individuals choose things that perplex me (I just watched a show about a very

lovely young woman getting a boob job - I don't get it). As for parents

deciding for their kids, again it makes me cringe, but the fact is that parents

make decisions for their kids, sometimes good ones, sometimes not.

As for folks in the entertainment biz - again, it ticks me off when some fool

runs up to me and asks if I'm in the circus, but I sure don't want someone

telling me what I can or cannot do to make a living. The best thing I can do

about public perception is to live my life honorably and work hard at whatever I

do.

So, let Radio City Music Hall and the limb-lengtheners (and whoever else wants

to pay the ticket) go ahead and pitch their line. No one has to listen, and it

doesn't serve the LP community to pretend these things don't exist. We can say

" NO! " as well as any six-footer. Let's continue to respect and value our

differences, not try to put everyone in the same dwarf box.

Okay, done raving.

Alyce :-)

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

Alyce,

Thank you for your comments, I agree with you completely. You managed to

include everything I feel strongly about. Now, I have a few comments to

make. Has everyone forgotten, if it were not for Barty appearing

on the Art Linkletter show years ago (as an entertainer!), there may not be

an LPA? Do you know your LPA history and understand that and Art

looked into the camera and asked all " little people " out there in tv land to

contact them. What resulted was the very first gathering in Reno of 20

little people. They represented all walks of life and came from many

different states. They did not attend to get into show business, they came

for the opportunity to meet others like themselves. Only a few of them

were in show business. Art Noble, Dan , Bob Hinkson, and Bob Brower

were business leaders who later became national officers of LPA. took

the first step in bringing together little people, and that group set the

cornerstone of our organization. Our membership includes actors, clowns,

housewives, clerks, teachers, lawyers, physicians and even surgeons. We

represent all walks of life, all religions, all nationalities, all education

and income levels. We may be alike in our stature, but, we are very

different in our values, life experiences and feelings about other people.

I would not want LPA to become an organization that condemned those among us

who had limb lengthening, gene therapy or were in the entertainment world.

If you have not walked in their shoes then don't judge their decisions.

And please, don't condemn Gene Therapy in general, it's giving children with

various forms of cancer new hope for life. Hopefully, sometime in the

future, it may also give those with life threatening dwarfism a chance to

overcome those first hurdles at birth. Although, I do not agree with ELL

for everyone, it is far better than suicide in certain cases. Don't rule

anything out for anyone else, especially when you don't understand their

circumstances. We have the right to decide for ourselves.

I commend Lois for her ability not to get involved in this form of debate

and discussion on this list. It is beneath her!

Dee , member of LPA since 1965

On 5/17/06, Alyce <afwtexas@...> wrote:

>

> LPA is a unique organization that represents a group of very diverse

> people that have nothing in common except dwarfism. We are from every part

> of society, every religion, generation, etc. Thus I think it would be a

> mistake for LPA to become hard-nosed about what it's for or against.

>

> For example, when you asked what a person with dwarfism should be

> called, you get - to say the least - a variety of answers. Why? Because we

> have different experiences (good and bad), different preferences, and those

> of us who are older (oh, it hurts to say that) look at it differently than

> the younglings do.

>

> So why insist on one answer? What I love about the debate about naming

> is that today we are ALLOWED to name ourselves - we aren't forced to accept

> what the allegedly normal population chooses to call us. We can name

> ourselves and not be accused of denial, craziness, whatever. And yes, that

> was the case not so very long ago.

>

> I think the strength of LPA (and other organizations of people with

> disabilities) is that it reminds us all that none of us are alike and that

> THAT'S OKAY! Kids are growing up being taught that they are a natural part

> of human diversity - not oddities or freaks. How powerful is that?

>

> As much as the ELL thing drives me crazy, I would hate to see LPA take a

> strong stand - for or against it. It's an individual decision, and a lot of

> individuals choose things that perplex me (I just watched a show about a

> very lovely young woman getting a boob job - I don't get it). As for

> parents deciding for their kids, again it makes me cringe, but the fact is

> that parents make decisions for their kids, sometimes good ones, sometimes

> not.

>

> As for folks in the entertainment biz - again, it ticks me off when some

> fool runs up to me and asks if I'm in the circus, but I sure don't want

> someone telling me what I can or cannot do to make a living. The best thing

> I can do about public perception is to live my life honorably and work hard

> at whatever I do.

>

> So, let Radio City Music Hall and the limb-lengtheners (and whoever else

> wants to pay the ticket) go ahead and pitch their line. No one has to

> listen, and it doesn't serve the LP community to pretend these things don't

> exist. We can say " NO! " as well as any six-footer. Let's continue to

> respect and value our differences, not try to put everyone in the same dwarf

> box.

>

> Okay, done raving.

>

> Alyce :-)

>

> __________________________________________________

>

[Guest guest]

Dee,

Very well said. (You too Alyce).

A good analogy might be the Americans with Diabetes Association (although I

wish LPA were as large with as many resources). They advocate on ways to

treat and cure diabetes, lifestyle changes for people with diabetes, and

funding for literature and education. The only qualifier for belonging is

that you have diabetes, a family member with diabetes, or are a professional

in the medical community that treats and researches diabetes. They don't

care if you're a clown, actor, lawyer, plumber, ditch digger, nurse,

comedian, black, white, brown, purple, green, Christian, Buddhists, Hindu,

Muslim, Jew, atheist, agnostic, or worship space aliens.

If LPA is going to be an advocacy and education group (I don't think we're

quite there yet -- need more money) then we need to be totally inclusive.

Also, some of the people criticized for their entertainment occupations,

have made large financial contributions to our organization.

I applaud you for rational views.

-Bill

(BTW, Dee and I joined LPA the same year, 1965. I was one-years-old. I

won't be rude and ask Dee how old she was, but the years have been far

kinder to her than me. ;-)

On 5/17/06, Dee <spirit.miller@...> wrote:

>

> Alyce,

> Thank you for your comments, I agree with you completely. You managed to

> include everything I feel strongly about. Now, I have a few comments to

> make. Has everyone forgotten, if it were not for Barty

> appearing

> on the Art Linkletter show years ago (as an entertainer!), there may not

> be

> an LPA? Do you know your LPA history and understand that and Art

> looked into the camera and asked all " little people " out there in tv land

> to

> contact them. What resulted was the very first gathering in Reno of 20

> little people. They represented all walks of life and came from many

> different states. They did not attend to get into show business, they came

> for the opportunity to meet others like themselves. Only a few of them

> were in show business. Art Noble, Dan , Bob Hinkson, and Bob Brower

> were business leaders who later became national officers of LPA.

> took

> the first step in bringing together little people, and that group set the

> cornerstone of our organization. Our membership includes actors, clowns,

> housewives, clerks, teachers, lawyers, physicians and even surgeons. We

> represent all walks of life, all religions, all nationalities, all

> education

> and income levels. We may be alike in our stature, but, we are very

> different in our values, life experiences and feelings about other people.

> I would not want LPA to become an organization that condemned those among

> us

> who had limb lengthening, gene therapy or were in the entertainment world.

> If you have not walked in their shoes then don't judge their decisions.

> And please, don't condemn Gene Therapy in general, it's giving children

> with

> various forms of cancer new hope for life. Hopefully, sometime in the

> future, it may also give those with life threatening dwarfism a chance to

> overcome those first hurdles at birth. Although, I do not agree with ELL

> for everyone, it is far better than suicide in certain cases. Don't rule

> anything out for anyone else, especially when you don't understand their

> circumstances. We have the right to decide for ourselves.

>

> I commend Lois for her ability not to get involved in this form of debate

> and discussion on this list. It is beneath her!

>

> Dee , member of LPA since 1965

>

>

> --

" There are only two mistakes one can make along the road to truth; not going

all the way, and not starting. "

(Buddha)

" You shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free. "

( 8:32)

[Guest guest]

Yes, but ... now we learn in today's New York Times that diabetes activists

are at war with each other (Type 1 versus Type 2). So there you go. There's

fightin' everywhere.

Dan Kennedy

On 5/17/06 9:26 PM, " Bill Bradford " <tslug1@...> wrote:

> Dee,

> Very well said. (You too Alyce).

> A good analogy might be the Americans with Diabetes Association (although I

> wish LPA were as large with as many resources). They advocate on ways to

> treat and cure diabetes, lifestyle changes for people with diabetes, and

> funding for literature and education. The only qualifier for belonging is

> that you have diabetes, a family member with diabetes, or are a professional

> in the medical community that treats and researches diabetes. They don't

> care if you're a clown, actor, lawyer, plumber, ditch digger, nurse,

> comedian, black, white, brown, purple, green, Christian, Buddhists, Hindu,

> Muslim, Jew, atheist, agnostic, or worship space aliens.

>

> If LPA is going to be an advocacy and education group (I don't think we're

> quite there yet -- need more money) then we need to be totally inclusive.

> Also, some of the people criticized for their entertainment occupations,

> have made large financial contributions to our organization.

>

> I applaud you for rational views.

> -Bill

> (BTW, Dee and I joined LPA the same year, 1965. I was one-years-old. I

> won't be rude and ask Dee how old she was, but the years have been far

> kinder to her than me. ;-)

[Guest guest]

Alyce, Dee, Randy, etc.

I have not forgotten who started LPA, I owe a lot to

Barty, however, LPA like any other organization

changes through the years and it's mission changes as

well. This is not 1957 anymore.

Why should we stay a happy little social club?? Heck

if that's all LPA is, I'll quit today because I've got

LP's on Myspace (for free) and this listserve.

I want LPA to speak on dwarfism issues which means

taking a hardline stance. If a tv show asks " what is

your position on... " I want LPA to say " LPA's

position is this " . Because we are getting more

exposure as the years go on, we NEED to take a stand!

I NEVER said people who have ELL or entertainers are

not welcome, hense my Catholic example, nor did I say

ALL entertainers either.

Please explain the statement of either limb

lengthening or suicide. If someone is contemplating

suicide then they need A LOT of help, wayyyy beyond

ELL.

Maybe it's just, pardon what I will say, but all of

your old school thinking. LPA served it's original

purpose, LP's have a wonderful organization to find

others like them and have accesses to medical

professionals, awesome great, but it IS time to

advance in what we do and what we think as an

organization.

I WANT to belong to an organization that takes a

hardline stance, I WANT an organization that will

" speak for me in the best interest of dwarfism " and

the best interest isn't ummm, ya, umm maybe umm..

Maybe there should be another LPA organization

-

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

,

I agree with all of your points. I am simply saying LPA must learn

(or relearn) to exist first. Then, we can conquer the world however

we want to.

Randy_____

>

> Alyce, Dee, Randy, etc.

>

> I have not forgotten who started LPA, I owe a lot to

> Barty, however, LPA like any other organization

> changes through the years and it's mission changes as

> well. This is not 1957 anymore.

>

> Why should we stay a happy little social club?? Heck

> if that's all LPA is, I'll quit today because I've got

> LP's on Myspace (for free) and this listserve.

>

> I want LPA to speak on dwarfism issues which means

> taking a hardline stance. If a tv show asks " what is

> your position on... " I want LPA to say " LPA's

> position is this " . Because we are getting more

> exposure as the years go on, we NEED to take a stand!

>

> I NEVER said people who have ELL or entertainers are

> not welcome, hense my Catholic example, nor did I say

> ALL entertainers either.

>

> Please explain the statement of either limb

> lengthening or suicide. If someone is contemplating

> suicide then they need A LOT of help, wayyyy beyond

> ELL.

>

> Maybe it's just, pardon what I will say, but all of

> your old school thinking. LPA served it's original

> purpose, LP's have a wonderful organization to find

> others like them and have accesses to medical

> professionals, awesome great, but it IS time to

> advance in what we do and what we think as an

> organization.

>

> I WANT to belong to an organization that takes a

> hardline stance, I WANT an organization that will

> " speak for me in the best interest of dwarfism " and

> the best interest isn't ummm, ya, umm maybe umm..

>

> Maybe there should be another LPA organization

>

> -

>

>

>

>

>

>

> __________________________________________________

>

[Guest guest]

,

I understand your impatience with what seems like wishy-washy-ness, but if LPA

takes a stand, whose stand will it be? Judging by this group, LPs can't agree

on what to have for lunch, much less what stand to take on significant issues.

Why take on an inflexible policy? How would such a policy reflect the diversity

of LPA?

I don't want an organization to think for me, tell me what to do, or tell me

what to believe about controversial issues. I want an organization that

provides information and supports all its members, despite their differing

opinions.

Alyce :-)

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[Guest guest]

But Alyce --

What you've articulated is itself a stand, and one that I would largely

agree with. What do our two candidates for president think? I would like to

hear from *both* of them, in public, either on this list or the official LPA

list -- which was supposedly set up for precisely this sort of thing.

Dan Kennedy

On 5/18/06 8:34 AM, " Alyce " <afwtexas@...> wrote:

> ,

>

> I understand your impatience with what seems like wishy-washy-ness, but if LPA

> takes a stand, whose stand will it be? Judging by this group, LPs can't agree

> on what to have for lunch, much less what stand to take on significant issues.

> Why take on an inflexible policy? How would such a policy reflect the

> diversity of LPA?

>

> I don't want an organization to think for me, tell me what to do, or tell me

> what to believe about controversial issues. I want an organization that

> provides information and supports all its members, despite their differing

> opinions.

>

> Alyce :-)

[Guest guest]

Alyce <afwtexas@...> wrote: " LPA is a unique organization that

represents a group of very diverse people that have nothing in common except

dwarfism. We are from every part of society, every religion, generation, etc.

Thus I think it would be a mistake for LPA to become hard-nosed about what it's

for or against. "

Let me know if im wrong but shouldnt the ultimate goal of the LPA be to make

sure that people who have a form of dwarfism have a voice in this world. A

collection of people like alyce said from all walks of life that normally

probaly would have nothing to do with each other but are joined by one common

thread. Whos views are just as diverse as the forms of the genetic mutation. So

why is it that people want to make hard etched in stone rules or ideals. Would

that exclude people that disagree with those ideas? If you start excluding

people, there thoughts and there passions.. are you accomplishing your goal? If

you wanna say no to limb lengthening or genetic engineering why not also make it

lpa policy to take a stand against abortion, legalizing marijuana, immagration

laws or freakin tax laws. All those things still affects us. Probaly more than

whether or not the person next to you has had his legs elongated. Plus say

someone does go through that process does it make them

less of a person or less of a dwarf for doin it? Thats pretty ridiculous not to

mention just damn petty. In the end it just another person with a different

story to tell. One that maybe a few ppl need to hear. No one should be so

ambitious so as to lose " a few members " just to some policy. Those few members

was a voice from somewhere that needed to be heard and respected. You cant

portray to the public that we as a ppl need to be respected if as a people you

dont respect yaselfs and embrace each others differences. So why not worry about

appeasing the members maybe in doing so everyone might just learn something.

" Not Afraid To Die But Afraid To Live 'Till Death " - Sizzla

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