a dichotomy

[Guest guest]

As I was reading " Esquire " yesterday, I flipped to the section " What

I've Learned. " Clooney was on the cover of the magazine. In the section

he was in, there were pictures, and the one that jumped out at me was one of

him by a pool on his knees with a large robe on, flippers at his feet covered

by the robe and a goofy look on his face - it brought back memories of the Tim

Conway character Dorf. I'm thinking " oh yeah, this is great and really

helpful. "

Then I began reading the text of things he'd learned and one of them was

his defense of being a liberal - and it rang true for me. Here's what he

said: " You know, my dad just ran for Congress. I did stump speeches for him,

and I'd have to get up and apologize to everybody for being a liberal. For

some reason, we've gotten to this place where liberal is a bad word again, which

is truly insane. Look at American history. Start with the Salem witch hunt.

The conservative view was, " Well, they're all witches and they should be

burned at the stake. " But the liberal view was, " Maybe there aren't any such

thing as witches. " Liberals thought that women should be allowed to vote. We

thought it'd be okay for blacks to sit at any lunch counter they wanted and

wherever they liked on a public bus. We thought that'd be all right. We've

always

been on the right side of history eventually. So I don't understand how you

lose the moral argument.

" We don't have to put the word compassionate in front of liberal the way

conservatives do to prove we give a shit about people. I think we should

change what we call ourselves. I think we should be ruthless liberals. We need

to show that we're tough, that we really give a shit about people.

" I remember when I was a kid, going out to eat with my family and other

families. Going out to dinner was a really big thing in Kentucky back then.

We weren't wealthy at all, and shrimp cocktail was something you really

looked forward to. And just as the waiter put the shrimp cocktail in front of

you,

the man from the other family would say something like, " What's the problem

with those people? " And my mom would immediately be telling us, " Eat fast!

Eat fast! " Because we all new that " those people " meant " black people, " and my

father was going to make a scene, and we'd have to leave the restaurant.

" At the time, I was thinking, can't you just shut up and let it go so we

can all eat our shrimp cocktails? But he never did let it go. And I'm

really proud of that. But now, years later, I had to watch him say, " I'm

fiscally

somewhat liberal and morally somewhat liberal, but no, I'm not a liberal. "

" Are you kidding? We shoud be embracing the word! "

And the dichotomy for me is here's a guy making such a passionate

statement about being liberal and yet, has a photo as the one I described above.

How do we get from being at the bottom of the totem poll of what is okay to

ridicule?

A personal note: While shopping yesterday, I spent about ten minutes

with the salesperson before deciding what to purchase. At the end, she asked me

if I were a comedian. I answered, " No, I'm a smart-ass who's a lawyer -

which works really well. "

[Guest guest]

>>> Because we all new that " those people " meant " black people, "

OMG Davey, don't tell me you are black too? I am sure glad I learned to love and

admire you before I knew THAT! <evil grin>

I wish you were MY lawyer than I would go out and find some REAL and serious

trouble to get into, like wearing an anti-bush tee shirt (bought from Danny

Black of course) and picketing the white house for raising my Medicare premium

17% (while the cost of living increase was only 2%!). You would keep me out of

jail wouldn't you? But then on second thought free medicine, room and board

looks better and better to me so maybe I won't need you anyway!

Hugz from your (more pinkish than) WHITE and co-liberal, (more than)average

sized friend!

Karolyn

a dichotomy

As I was reading " Esquire " yesterday, I flipped to the section " What

I've Learned. " Clooney was on the cover of the magazine. In the

section

he was in, there were pictures, and the one that jumped out at me was one of

him by a pool on his knees with a large robe on, flippers at his feet covered

by the robe and a goofy look on his face - it brought back memories of the Tim

Conway character Dorf. I'm thinking " oh yeah, this is great and really

helpful. "

Then I began reading the text of things he'd learned and one of them was

his defense of being a liberal - and it rang true for me. Here's what he

said: " You know, my dad just ran for Congress. I did stump speeches for him,

and I'd have to get up and apologize to everybody for being a liberal. For

some reason, we've gotten to this place where liberal is a bad word again,

which

is truly insane. Look at American history. Start with the Salem witch hunt.

The conservative view was, " Well, they're all witches and they should be

burned at the stake. " But the liberal view was, " Maybe there aren't any such

thing as witches. " Liberals thought that women should be allowed to vote. We

thought it'd be okay for blacks to sit at any lunch counter they wanted and

wherever they liked on a public bus. We thought that'd be all right. We've

always

been on the right side of history eventually. So I don't understand how you

lose the moral argument.

" We don't have to put the word compassionate in front of liberal the way

conservatives do to prove we give a shit about people. I think we should

change what we call ourselves. I think we should be ruthless liberals. We

need

to show that we're tough, that we really give a shit about people.

" I remember when I was a kid, going out to eat with my family and other

families. Going out to dinner was a really big thing in Kentucky back then.

We weren't wealthy at all, and shrimp cocktail was something you really

looked forward to. And just as the waiter put the shrimp cocktail in front of

you,

the man from the other family would say something like, " What's the problem

with those people? " And my mom would immediately be telling us, " Eat fast!

Eat fast! " Because we all new that " those people " meant " black people, " and

my

father was going to make a scene, and we'd have to leave the restaurant.

" At the time, I was thinking, can't you just shut up and let it go so we

can all eat our shrimp cocktails? But he never did let it go. And I'm

really proud of that. But now, years later, I had to watch him say, " I'm

fiscally

somewhat liberal and morally somewhat liberal, but no, I'm not a liberal. "

" Are you kidding? We shoud be embracing the word! "

And the dichotomy for me is here's a guy making such a passionate

statement about being liberal and yet, has a photo as the one I described

above.

How do we get from being at the bottom of the totem poll of what is okay to

ridicule?

A personal note: While shopping yesterday, I spent about ten minutes

with the salesperson before deciding what to purchase. At the end, she asked

me

if I were a comedian. I answered, " No, I'm a smart-ass who's a lawyer -

which works really well. "

[Guest guest]

> I wish you were MY lawyer than I would go out and find some REAL and

> serious trouble to get into, like wearing an anti-bush tee shirt (bought

> from Danny Black of course) and picketing the white house for raising my

> Medicare premium 17% (while the cost of living increase was only 2%!).

OH-kay, I'm going to answer this one. I work for a Medicare-certified home

healthcare provider, and my job is to process Medicare claims.

1. Bush did not initiate the Medicare premium increase. The increase was

written into the guidelines of the Medicare program LONG before he took

office.

2. Even if Bush had initiated the increase (and again, it would have

happened no matter who was in office) ... Medicare now covers prescription

drugs. Show me one insurance company that can add such a potentially

expensive benefit without raising premiums.

3. The prescription drug benefit's only real long-term value is as

political capital. If you have someone who is really in such dire straits

that they are choosing between food and medicine, there are options

available to them - either from the government, from healthcare providers,

or from the drug companies themselves. (Show of hands - how many of you

know that many, if not most, drug companies have programs to help

low-income people who need their drugs but can't afford them? How many of

you know that many healthcare providers have programs for uninsured or

underinsured individuals?)

Here's the reality: the typical senior citizen is not choosing between

food and medicine. They are choosing between medicine and a

home-improvement project. And the reason the AARP endorsed it because

their primary reason for existence is not to serve as an advocacy group

for senior citizens. Their primary reason for existence is to sell

Medicare supplement policies. This new benefit put a LOT of money in

AARP's pocket. (In fact, they actually upset a lot of their members by

endorsing the drug benefit.)

[Guest guest]

Hey ,

Thanks for the " answer " even though there was not a question asked! lol

>>>Here's the reality: the typical senior citizen is not choosing between food

and medicine.

I dare say that you do not know ALL of the " typical " (what is a typical senior

anyway?) Senior Citizens and certainly not my husband, me nor our parents both

in their 80s.

Mother does NOT qualify for MOST of the options low cost drug programs because

she is still very independent and owns her own small but paid for home (where

her home improvement programs <maintenance> are done gratis by her family and

members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints!) If she were to sell

and move into some horrid and demeaning (all would be to her AND to us ...yes

even the new generation of assisted living ones) facility she might qualify. And

her " drug cocktails " are mostly not available from Canada and certainly not her

radiation treatments.

Tell my non-typical 88 year old mother who has been hospitalized FOUR times this

year...(last just 4 weeks ago for breast cancer surgery and whose medical bills

(past Medicare) are off the charts) how she can AFFORD the Bush prescription

program premiums...please do not try to tell anyone they are free! If she did

not have 3 loving daughters se would be eating Purina Cat Chow and she hates

cats! She DOES get help from the Food Bank and Meals on Wheels both " liberal "

conceived and enacted programs, along with most if not all official humanitarian

programs in our country.

As a senior myself my medicines alone to keep me alive and painfree are over

$800 a month and my husbands are $200 +. . I have been on SSD since 1989 and

have had to pay (well husband has to pay) every penny of it past the small

discount that I get through Kaiser mail in pharmacy which gives us a small

break) but the out of pocket cost is not much less than our combined SS income!

My husband is just 3 years shy of 70 years old, still forced to work at his

owned small business (Thank God for his health) and due to the economy has lost

ALL of our retirement in the last 4 years. We are being forced to sell our home

(if we CAN sell it in this terrible real estate market of the last 4 years) so

we can survive and perhaps qualify for some assistance, if Bush has not canceled

it all by March! . Good part (and my mother always called me a Pollyanna because

I could always find something good about everything...) is that we are moving

next door to our WONDERFUL daughter, son-in-law and 4 grandchildren, ( 7

our LP being the youngest)

That my friend is reality in our world

Oh ONLY one political statement: (Because Dan and Bill will k-line me for doing

other wise) Everything done under the watch of a president IS his

responsibility. Who did Washington have to blame??? Bush Sr was

responsible for his 4 years, Clinton for his 8 years and Bush jr for his 8 (if

we have a country left by then). The president has the power to remove, disarm

or tweak the policies of the previous administration ESPECIALLY when there is no

balance of power between the White House and the Congress. Bush has overturned

and negated MANY of Clinton's policies and appointments. This is all addressed

best by Harry S Truman whose sign on his desk said " The Buck Stops Here. " and

there is no " except for... " list on the back. I NEVER heard Clinton blame

anything that went wrong on his watch on Sr. But he DID give Sr credit when it

was due. Whining and pointing the finger back in time at a predecessor is self

serving, evidence of immaturity and ignorance. Medicare is not broken, past the

greed of some doctors pharmacacial companies and care or assisted living

facilities.

Pretty heavy extrapolation when I was only joking with Davey Lamb in the first

place! <wink>

Cheers,

Karolyn

Re: a dichotomy

> I wish you were MY lawyer than I would go out and find some REAL and

> serious trouble to get into, like wearing an anti-bush tee shirt (bought

> from Danny Black of course) and picketing the white house for raising my

> Medicare premium 17% (while the cost of living increase was only 2%!).

OH-kay, I'm going to answer this one. I work for a Medicare-certified home

healthcare provider, and my job is to process Medicare claims

[Guest guest]

Karolyn said: " I would go out and find some REAL and serious trouble to

get into, like wearing an anti-bush tee shirt (bought from Danny Black

of course) and picketing the white house for raising my Medicare premium

17% "

Alas, that may not be possible or effective. Anyone with placards etc.

of dissenting opinion is kept 2 miles away from Mr. Bush at any

scheduled speaking event by the secret service. I assume this includes

the White House. Should you get covered by the newspaper or media it

would be of little help as well since Mr. Bush has publicly stated that

he does not read any newspapers or watch the news on TV. He claims to

get all his information from the carefully worded synopses of his staff.

But it is pleasant to imagine that we still had the ability to exercise

our right to free speech. Of course there are forums where you can still

have the administration answer legitimate questions of concern. Just

write your question down and give it to a soldier going any meeting

where an administration official is looking for a photo op.

Marty

Karolyn wrote:

>

>

> I wish you were MY lawyer than I would go out and find some REAL and

> serious trouble to get into, like wearing an anti-bush tee shirt

> (bought from Danny Black of course) and picketing the white house for

> raising my Medicare premium 17% (while the cost of living increase was

> only 2%!). You would keep me out of jail wouldn't you? But then on

> second thought free medicine, room and board looks better and better

> to me so maybe I won't need you anyway!

[Guest guest]

At 01:39 PM 12/12/2004 -0800, Marty wrote:

>Alas, that may not be possible or effective. Anyone with placards etc.

>of dissenting opinion is kept 2 miles away from Mr. Bush at any

>scheduled speaking event by the secret service. I assume this includes

>the White House. Should you get covered by the newspaper or media it

>would be of little help as well since Mr. Bush has publicly stated that

>he does not read any newspapers or watch the news on TV. He claims to

>get all his information from the carefully worded synopses of his staff.

>

>But it is pleasant to imagine that we still had the ability to exercise

>our right to free speech. Of course there are forums where you can still

>have the administration answer legitimate questions of concern. Just

>write your question down and give it to a soldier going any meeting

>where an administration official is looking for a photo op.

>

>Marty

funny, parts of Marty's scenario also sound like they were from a

non-profit organization we were once a part of... :-) there seems like

there are several places " where size meets reality "

....and in light of the recent squabbles, organization NO newsletter

publication and resignation; doesn't it seem like as much as things change,

they always stay the same? with some of the same players.

huh. :-)

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