Re: Re: Reducing High BP (???)

[Guest guest]

I just eat ground sesame seeds. Very tasty.

>From: " Rodney " <perspect1111@...>

>Reply-

>

>Subject: [ ] Re: Reducing High BP (???)

>Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2004 17:43:51 -0000

>

>Hi folks:

>

>Yes. Sesame oil can certainly be found in japanese and chinese

>grocery stores. It is quite distinctively aromatic.

>

>As for whether it is as good as no oil, I couldn't say. But the

>reported decline in BP is substantial. More, I would have guessed,

>than would result from dropping oil altogether. But that is just a

>guess. Also, I do not know what kind of oil the sesame oil replaced

>in this study. Does anyone know what kind of oil is predominantly

>used in India?

>

>As regards oleic and linoleic ............ mine has ~78%

>polyunsaturated (I presume linoleic); ~13% mono (presumably oleic);

>and ~9% saturated. Does this help? If not, I could bug the store

>and try to get more information.

>

>Rodney.

>

>--- In , " jwwright " <jwwright@e...>

>wrote:

> > Sesame oil may drop BP when substituted for other fats, as do other

>veg oils substituted for animal fats, or corn oil, eg. BUT,

>substituting no oil is better than the " best " which was olive oil.

>There are hundreds of these type of fat/oil intake compares. What I

>never saw was the biochem that tells me why one oil is better than

>another. Same for n-3's and PCa.

> > Now they need to compare sesame oil with olive oil, then sesame oil

>with no oil.

> > I reviewed many of these several years ago and noted they left out

>the olive oil/ no oil compare and subsequently they did that and

>found no oil was better.

> > For me, that goes for EPA/DHA as well.

> >

> > The chemical that lowers BP has to open the smooth muscle, or make

>you pee. Or, of course, lose you weight.

> > Sesame oil is found in oriental markets. Looks balanced in

>mono/linoleic, low 18:3.

> >

> > BTW, are you using high oleic safflower oil or high linoleic?

> >

> > Regards.

> >

> > ----- Original Message -----

> > From: Rodney

> >

> > Sent: Friday, August 13, 2004 10:43 AM

> > Subject: [ ] Reducing High BP (???)

> >

> >

> > Hi Folks:

> >

> > For anyone for whom high blood pressure is of interest, the

>following

> > may be worth taking a look at:

> >

> > PMID: 15294632

> >

> > Rodney.

>

[Guest guest]

Tahini is also great!

>From: " Rodney " <perspect1111@...>

>Reply-

>

>Subject: [ ] Re: Reducing High BP (???)

>Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2004 17:43:51 -0000

>

>Hi folks:

>

>Yes. Sesame oil can certainly be found in japanese and chinese

>grocery stores. It is quite distinctively aromatic.

>

>As for whether it is as good as no oil, I couldn't say. But the

>reported decline in BP is substantial. More, I would have guessed,

>than would result from dropping oil altogether. But that is just a

>guess. Also, I do not know what kind of oil the sesame oil replaced

>in this study. Does anyone know what kind of oil is predominantly

>used in India?

>

>As regards oleic and linoleic ............ mine has ~78%

>polyunsaturated (I presume linoleic); ~13% mono (presumably oleic);

>and ~9% saturated. Does this help? If not, I could bug the store

>and try to get more information.

>

>Rodney.

>

>--- In , " jwwright " <jwwright@e...>

>wrote:

> > Sesame oil may drop BP when substituted for other fats, as do other

>veg oils substituted for animal fats, or corn oil, eg. BUT,

>substituting no oil is better than the " best " which was olive oil.

>There are hundreds of these type of fat/oil intake compares. What I

>never saw was the biochem that tells me why one oil is better than

>another. Same for n-3's and PCa.

> > Now they need to compare sesame oil with olive oil, then sesame oil

>with no oil.

> > I reviewed many of these several years ago and noted they left out

>the olive oil/ no oil compare and subsequently they did that and

>found no oil was better.

> > For me, that goes for EPA/DHA as well.

> >

> > The chemical that lowers BP has to open the smooth muscle, or make

>you pee. Or, of course, lose you weight.

> > Sesame oil is found in oriental markets. Looks balanced in

>mono/linoleic, low 18:3.

> >

> > BTW, are you using high oleic safflower oil or high linoleic?

> >

> > Regards.

> >

> > ----- Original Message -----

> > From: Rodney

> >

> > Sent: Friday, August 13, 2004 10:43 AM

> > Subject: [ ] Reducing High BP (???)

> >

> >

> > Hi Folks:

> >

> > For anyone for whom high blood pressure is of interest, the

>following

> > may be worth taking a look at:

> >

> > PMID: 15294632

> >

> > Rodney.

>

[Guest guest]

That safflower oil would be the high linoleic type.

I like sesame oil, as well as olive oil for some things. It's very high in phytosterols, not quite as high as corn oil which is high in beta-sitosterol, and also has a high n-6, low n-3.

But I wonder now why we eat any monos or polys if we know they oxidize in the body. Don't monos and polys oxidize more rapidly?

The basic thing I've been wondering is if unsat fat can oxidize more readily than a saturated fat, and n-3's are known to oxidize easily, and oxidation is thought to promote CAD, why does anyone eat ANY oils? Other than the fatty acids in veggies and maybe lean meats.

We are sure that fats oxidize because we've seen those in the coronaries, atherosclerosis and arteriosclerosis. There was a theory that anti-oxidants could prevent that somewhat, but that theory is changing now. Besides, antioxidants interfere with the ROS which the body (and chemotherapy) excites to kill cancer cells.

Until I find the reason why adults need ALA, I'm THINKing I'll avoid it because of prostate cancer association. That means I'll still get small quantities in veggies.

BTW, I've tried sesame oil.

Regards.

----- Original Message -----

From: Rodney

Sent: Friday, August 13, 2004 12:43 PM

Subject: [ ] Re: Reducing High BP (???)

Hi folks:Yes. Sesame oil can certainly be found in japanese and chinese grocery stores. It is quite distinctively aromatic.As for whether it is as good as no oil, I couldn't say. But the reported decline in BP is substantial. More, I would have guessed, than would result from dropping oil altogether. But that is just a guess. Also, I do not know what kind of oil the sesame oil replaced in this study. Does anyone know what kind of oil is predominantly used in India?As regards oleic and linoleic ............ mine has ~78% polyunsaturated (I presume linoleic); ~13% mono (presumably oleic); and ~9% saturated. Does this help? If not, I could bug the store and try to get more information.Rodney.> Sesame oil may drop BP when substituted for other fats, as do other veg oils substituted for animal fats, or corn oil, eg. BUT, substituting no oil is better than the "best" which was olive oil. There are hundreds of these type of fat/oil intake compares. What I never saw was the biochem that tells me why one oil is better than another. Same for n-3's and PCa. > Now they need to compare sesame oil with olive oil, then sesame oil with no oil. > I reviewed many of these several years ago and noted they left out the olive oil/ no oil compare and subsequently they did that and found no oil was better.> For me, that goes for EPA/DHA as well.> > The chemical that lowers BP has to open the smooth muscle, or make you pee. Or, of course, lose you weight. > Sesame oil is found in oriental markets. Looks balanced in mono/linoleic, low 18:3.> > BTW, are you using high oleic safflower oil or high linoleic?> > Regards.>

[Guest guest]

They are and that's why there are standards for measuring it. The height of the device or the arm above or below the heart, the relaxation of the arm are all highly variable.

I once found I could fool the doc ( I actually had a doc measuring it once), by taking deep breaths before the measurement. It would drop 10 mins. Oddly others report the opposite effect.

But the whole scheme is subject to variables depending on the method, hearing, choosing the right korotkoff sounds, letting the patient relax 5 mins, not talking, not moving.

It's an art.

Regards.

----- Original Message -----

From: aequalsz

Sent: Friday, August 13, 2004 1:55 PM

Subject: [ ] Re: Reducing High BP (???)

Hi Croners:Well really hesitate to mention this but if you want to reduce bp trythe following. Make sure you are not wearing any tight clothing orhave a constricting belt on. Sit up straight in the chair whenmeasuring bp and even elevating your arm a little (due to Rho*g*heffect) helps. O.K. NO scientific studies to quote here, but if youhave your own bp measuring equiptment try it. First wear a vey tightbelt and sit hunched over and let your arm dangle down to your sidewhen measuring. Next try totally loose belt, sit up straight, andelevate your arm a little when measuring.Methinks you'll find that bp measurements, just like wc measurementsare prone to natural variations. AequalszPS Disclaimer. This opinion is not that of the board moderator or probably even that of any other group members other than myself. Thistestimony should not be construed as representing the position of the CRONie Group and represents solely the dim thoughts of one solegroup member. That group member (Aequalsz) is not responsible for anyinjuries occurring to those undertaking this experiment. And thisexperiment should only be done under the direct guidance of a fullyqualified medical doctor.

[Guest guest]

I hit 172.5# this morning, so I celebrated with a butter cookie (or was it two?).

Regards.

----- Original Message -----

From: Rodney

Sent: Friday, August 13, 2004 2:58 PM

Subject: [ ] Re: Reducing High BP (???)

Hi JW:"But I wonder now why we eat any monos or polys". The (female) Nurses' Health Study found those who had consumed the most polys had considerably less heart disease. I am guessing the same would probably apply to males.Of course, as usual, there is the dangling question ............. "less relative to what?". Probably, less relative to plenty of hydrogenated fats. My recollection is that monos were also found to be beneficial, but much less so than polys.The above is a major reason why I use safflower oil. But I don't use a lot of it. And I also use some (less) olive oil and butter (much less).Rodney.

[Guest guest]

'ja ever hear of Google?

http://lpi.oregonstate.edu/f-w97/reactive.html

>From: " freebird5005 " <freebird5005@...>

>Reply-

>

>Subject: [ ] Re: Reducing High BP (???)

>Date: Sat, 14 Aug 2004 03:17:26 -0000

>

> " antioxidants interfere with the ROS which the body (and chemotherapy)

>excites to kill cancer cells. "

>

>Can you give me more info regarding this? What is ROS?

>

>

>

> > > Sesame oil may drop BP when substituted for other fats, as do other

> > veg oils substituted for animal fats, or corn oil, eg. BUT,

> > substituting no oil is better than the " best " which was olive oil.

> > There are hundreds of these type of fat/oil intake compares. What I

> > never saw was the biochem that tells me why one oil is better than

> > another. Same for n-3's and PCa.

> > > Now they need to compare sesame oil with olive oil, then sesame oil

> > with no oil.

> > > I reviewed many of these several years ago and noted they left out

> > the olive oil/ no oil compare and subsequently they did that and

> > found no oil was better.

> > > For me, that goes for EPA/DHA as well.

> > >

> > > The chemical that lowers BP has to open the smooth muscle, or make

> > you pee. Or, of course, lose you weight.

> > > Sesame oil is found in oriental markets. Looks balanced in

> > mono/linoleic, low 18:3.

> > >

> > > BTW, are you using high oleic safflower oil or high linoleic?

> > >

> > > Regards.

> > >

>

[Guest guest]

4 grams of EPA is a lot of fish oil.

Maybe 8 grams of the new 46% EPA stuff.

Regards.

19: Lipids. 2001;36 Suppl:S127-9. n-3 polyunsaturated fatty acids and cardiovascular diseases.Nordoy A, Marchioli R, Arnesen H, Videbaek J.Department of Medicine, University of Tromso, Norway. medan@...An expert round table discussion on the relationship between intake of n-3polyunsaturated fatty acids (PUFA) mainly of marine sources and coronary heartdisease at the 34th Annual Scientific Meeting of European Society for ClinicalInvestigation came to the following conclusions: 1. Consumption of 1-2 fishmeals/wk is associated with reduced coronary heart disease (CHD) mortality. 2.Patients who have experienced myocardial infarction have decreased risk oftotal, cardiovascular, coronary, and sudden death by drug treatment with 1 g/dof ethylesters of n-3 PUFA, mainly as eicosapentaenoic acid (EPA) anddocosahexaenoic acid (DHA). The effect is present irrespective of high or lowtraditional fish intake or simultaneous intake of other drugs for secondary CHDprevention. n-3 PUFA may also be given as fatty fish or triglycerideconcentrates. 3. Patients who have experienced coronary artery bypass surgerywith venous grafts may reduce graft occlusion rates by administration of 4 g/dof n-3 PUFA.

4. Patients with moderate hypertension may reduce blood pressure byadministration of 4 g/d of n-3 PUFA.

5. After heart transplantation, 4 g/d ofn-3 PUFA may protect against development of hypertension. 6. Patients withdyslipidemia and or postprandial hyperlipemia may reduce their coronary riskprofile by administration of 1-4 g/d of marine n-3 PUFA. The combination withstatins seems to be a potent alternative in these patients. 7. There is growingevidence that daily intake of up to 1 energy% of nutrients from plant n-3 PUFA(alpha-linolenic acid) may decrease the risk for myocardial infarction and deathin patients with CHD. This paper summarizes the conclusions of an expert panelon the relationship between n-3 PUFA and CHD. The objectives for the expertswere to formulate scientifically sound conclusions on the effects of fish in thediet and the administration of marine n-3 PUFA, mainly eicosapentaenoic acid(EPA, 20:5n-3) and docosahexaenoic acid (DHA, 22:6n-3), and eventually of plantn-3 PUFA, alpha-linolenic acid (ALA, 18:3n-3), on primary and secondaryprevention of CHD. Fish in the diet should be considered as part of a healthydiet low in saturated fats for everybody, whereas additional administration ofn-3 PUFA concentrates could be given to specific groups of patients. Thisworkshop was organized on the basis of questions sent to the participantsbeforehand, on brief introductions by the participants, and finally ondiscussion and analysis by a group of approximately 40 international scientistsin the fields of nutrition, cardiology, epidemiology, lipidology, andthrombosis. PMID: 11837986

----- Original Message -----

From: Rodney

Sent: Saturday, August 14, 2004 5:10 PM

Subject: [ ] Re: Reducing High BP (???)