Re: Re: Fw: Prices of VCO in Europe

[Guest guest]

Sharon,

The gallon size is very difficult to open EVERY time! I am just relating MY

experience with WildernessFamilyNaturals. I belong to another group and

several have expressed the exact same experience. We are all entitiled to

that, aren't we? I am not saying your experience is silly and I would

appreciate it if you didn't tell me mine is silly.

Love,

Pamela

Sharon son <skericson@...> wrote:

So find a husband? Ask a brother? Borrow a neighbor? While I agree on it

being difficult to open the first time, that is a silly reason to not buy

their product. Their service is wonderful, product is top quality - it's

made from the milk, not the copra.....etc., etc., etc.

Sharon, NH

On 7/17/06, Pamela <calblonde1@...> wrote:

>

> I wouldn't recommend Wilderness Famil Naturals. Their gallon size is

> almost impossible to open!

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

> Posted by: " Sharon son " skericson@... notmyown_1cor6

> Date: Mon Jul 17, 2006 1:35 pm (PDT)

>

> I just did a recent comparisons of " popular " high-quality VCO's and

> QFI's pricing was ridiculously high.

Remember, Quality First International's price list includes

freight in North America. When I checked, their VCO prices were

lower than average and their other grades were also competitive.

Because they're a wholesaler the prices only go down with

quantity; this will be reflected in their price list -- I don't

think I sent you a wholesale price list; if I did, I forgot;

which one is it? The date is on the top left of the form.

> I found the quality and quantity

> of product information to be severely lacking. Sharon, NH

Quality First International is first and foremost an importer and

wholesaler that does a lot of volume business the old-fashioned

way, by certified check and hardcopy documents, and also bank

transfers and telephone credit card tx. Their wholesale buyers do

not demand the degree of packaging, promotional materials, or

advertising, that retail buyers normally expect. QFI's

distributors mainly sell QFI products under their own label or

use them in bulk; they do the advertising, if there is any.

QFI's wholesaler approach allowed them to grow larger and get

better deals, and (newly) compete on retail coconut oil sales by

offering several grades in smaller packaging, as well as

developing the highest quality coconut oil on the market. Their

own product, Virgin Oil de Coco Creme, is distinguished by being

wet-milled and then chilled to solidfy the oil and the water spun

out, on thei own patented equipment, all with no heat used at

all.

They're adding another centrifuged coconut oil to their lineup

that will fall somewhere in between regular VCO and Virgin Oil de

Coco Creme and will directly compete with regular VCO; this kind

of quality is increasingly what customers want so it's where the

industry is going with the VCO. You can see it youself on this

very discussion group.

Very soon there are also going to be more coconut products too.

I'll know more about all that later and let you know in due

course.

This is in addition to a remarkably varied exotic product list

that already exists from Quality First; I'm particularly

interested in shea butter myself. Remarkable stuff

Anyway, for import/export, this is the company to deal with; they

have the experience to be on time and competitive and of course,

the quality is first.

Duncan Crow

[Guest guest]

Pamela,

I agree it is difficult to open. But in evaluating a number of CO suppliers,

I find WFN's product and service to be worth the battle. Sorry I typed

" silly " . I should have said weak.

They have a Buying Club program which makes it even more worth the struggle

(at least to me). I just can't afford the ridiculous prices being charged

by some VCO suppliers.

Sharon

On 7/17/06, Pamela <calblonde1@...> wrote:

>

> Sharon,

>

> The gallon size is very difficult to open EVERY time! I am just relating

> MY experience with WildernessFamilyNaturals. I belong to another group and

> several have expressed the exact same experience. We are all entitiled to

> that, aren't we? I am not saying your experience is silly and I would

> appreciate it if you didn't tell me mine is silly.

>

> Love,

> Pamela

>

>

>

--

Deut 11:14 He will put grass in the fields for your cattle, and you will

have plenty to eat.

[Guest guest]

Duncan...

Last I checked, two months ago, I got a quote for QFI's 1 gallon size =

$71.00 WITHOUT shipping. I got that pricing by calling QFI directly. No

one mentioned, at the time, there were independent dealers. One would think

there'd be some type of pricing standard, though - are you able to set your

own pricing?

Sharon

On 7/17/06, Duncan Crow <duncancrow@...> wrote:

>

> > Posted by: " Sharon son "

skericson@...<skericson%40gmail.com>notmyown_1cor6

> > Date: Mon Jul 17, 2006 1:35 pm (PDT)

>

> >

> > I just did a recent comparisons of " popular " high-quality VCO's and

> > QFI's pricing was ridiculously high.

>

> Remember, Quality First International's price list includes

> freight in North America. When I checked, their VCO prices were

> lower than average and their other grades were also competitive.

>

> Because they're a wholesaler the prices only go down with

> quantity; this will be reflected in their price list -- I don't

> think I sent you a wholesale price list; if I did, I forgot;

> which one is it? The date is on the top left of the form.

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Ooops! I dont intend to really seriously butt in but I

think it is unfair not to recommend a product just

because the container is hard to open.

Let's say, Im a newbie and I really want to find out

what product suits me best. I think I would be

interested in finding out how the product tested

rather than the difficulty of opening the container

although I would give the distributor a feedback about

it. I dont think they would mind improving on it.

Coconut oil is hard to contain. It always finds its

way to leak out.

Oh, well, I think I'll go back to ms. ericson's

suggestion: Yes, just go get a husband, a brother, or

a neighbor

--- Pamela <calblonde1@...> wrote:

> Sharon,

>

> The gallon size is very difficult to open EVERY

> time! I am just relating MY experience with

> WildernessFamilyNaturals. I belong to another group

> and several have expressed the exact same

> experience. We are all entitiled to that, aren't

> we? I am not saying your experience is silly and I

> would appreciate it if you didn't tell me mine is

> silly.

>

> Love,

> Pamela

>

> Sharon son <skericson@...> wrote:

> So find a

> husband? Ask a brother? Borrow a neighbor? While I

> agree on it

> being difficult to open the first time, that is a

> silly reason to not buy

> their product. Their service is wonderful,

> product is top quality - it's

> made from the milk, not the copra.....etc., etc.,

> etc.

> Sharon, NH

>

> On 7/17/06, Pamela <calblonde1@...> wrote:

> >

> > I wouldn't recommend Wilderness Famil

> Naturals. Their gallon size is

> > almost impossible to open!

> >

> >

> >

>

> [Non-text portions of this message have been

> removed]

>

>

>

>

>

>

> ---------------------------------

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__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

> Posted by: " Sharon son " skericson@... notmyown_1cor6

> Date: Tue Jul 18, 2006 5:24 am (PDT)

>

> Duncan...

> Last I checked, two months ago, I got a quote for QFI's 1 gallon size

> = $71.00 WITHOUT shipping. I got that pricing by calling QFI

> directly. No one mentioned, at the time, there were independent

> dealers. One would think there'd be some type of pricing standard,

> though - are you able to set your own pricing? Sharon

A wholesaler NEVER competes with their own sales force, Sharon.

That would undermine their relationship so they are likely to

charge retail; however, distributors buy in bulk lots and set

their own prices.

Yes, there is no set price that way. My own retail price is

$71.50 INCLUDING shipping for a single US gallon of Quality

First's VCO.

Again, I'd rather refer you as a new distributor or agent so you

can get it for $50 or less for a few gallon jars or even as low

as about $36 per gallon without even getting to quoting the

price of a single pallet of jars yet, let alone multiple pallets.

That competitive price is why Quality First buys oil for quite a

lot of people. You don't get to be major wholesaler by charging

too much ;0)

Duncan Crow

http://members.shaw.ca/duncancrow/coconut-oil.html

[Guest guest]

ooooooooopss! i think this issue has been resolved. i

would like to stick to the coconut oil issue since i

did not altogether dismiss the fact that i would go to

the distributor and give them the feedback that the

container is hard to open.

i guess, its just that they are just two different

issues, neither is less important. Hopefully, not a

container would undermine the quality of a product.

peace!

--- Pamela <calblonde1@...> wrote:

> If you are familiar with osteoarthritis, you will

> know that opening up hard-to-open containers is a

> VERY important issue. So, I don't think it was

> unfair giving a heads-up to those poor souls who

> struggle with this disease.

>

> Love,

> Pamela

>

>

> Genes Marquez <redpanda17@...> wrote:

> Ooops! I

> dont intend to really seriously butt in but I

> think it is unfair not to recommend a product just

> because the container is hard to open.

>

> Let's say, Im a newbie and I really want to find

> out

> what product suits me best. I think I would be

> interested in finding out how the product tested

> rather than the difficulty of opening the

> container

> although I would give the distributor a feedback

> about

> it. I dont think they would mind improving on it.

> Coconut oil is hard to contain. It always finds

> its

> way to leak out.

>

> Oh, well, I think I'll go back to ms. ericson's

> suggestion: Yes, just go get a husband, a brother,

> or

> a neighbor

>

> --- Pamela <calblonde1@...> wrote:

>

> > Sharon,

> >

> > The gallon size is very difficult to open

> EVERY

> > time! I am just relating MY experience with

> > WildernessFamilyNaturals. I belong to another

> group

> > and several have expressed the exact same

> > experience. We are all entitiled to that,

> aren't

> > we? I am not saying your experience is silly

> and I

> > would appreciate it if you didn't tell me mine

> is

> > silly.

> >

> > Love,

> > Pamela

>

>

>

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[Guest guest]

oooooops! Didn't know you were the convening authority of this Group. Maybe

the rest of us should just email you personally and have you decide what issue

has been resolved and what issue can be discussed.

And for someone that said they didn't want to butt in, you sure are doing it!

Love,

Pamela

Genes Marquez <redpanda17@...> wrote:

ooooooooopss! i think this issue has been resolved. i

would like to stick to the coconut oil issue since i

did not altogether dismiss the fact that i would go to

the distributor and give them the feedback that the

container is hard to open.

i guess, its just that they are just two different

issues, neither is less important. Hopefully, not a

container would undermine the quality of a product.

peace!

--- Pamela <calblonde1@...> wrote:

> If you are familiar with osteoarthritis, you will

> know that opening up hard-to-open containers is a

> VERY important issue. So, I don't think it was

> unfair giving a heads-up to those poor souls who

> struggle with this disease.

>

> Love,

> Pamela

>

>

> Genes Marquez <redpanda17@...> wrote:

> Ooops! I

> dont intend to really seriously butt in but I

> think it is unfair not to recommend a product just

> because the container is hard to open.

>

> Let's say, Im a newbie and I really want to find

> out

> what product suits me best. I think I would be

> interested in finding out how the product tested

> rather than the difficulty of opening the

> container

> although I would give the distributor a feedback

> about

> it. I dont think they would mind improving on it.

> Coconut oil is hard to contain. It always finds

> its

> way to leak out.

>

> Oh, well, I think I'll go back to ms. ericson's

> suggestion: Yes, just go get a husband, a brother,

> or

> a neighbor

>

> --- Pamela <calblonde1@...> wrote:

>

> > Sharon,

> >

> > The gallon size is very difficult to open

> EVERY

> > time! I am just relating MY experience with

> > WildernessFamilyNaturals. I belong to another

> group

> > and several have expressed the exact same

> > experience. We are all entitiled to that,

> aren't

> > we? I am not saying your experience is silly

> and I

> > would appreciate it if you didn't tell me mine

> is

> > silly.

> >

> > Love,

> > Pamela

>

>

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[Guest guest]

LOL... on the contrary! I thought you and Sharon have

resolved the main issue thats why I was begging off

the subject. Both of your emails were very cordial.

and by the way, I have asked Ms. Walkins before that

you can actually talk anything about anything under

the sun for as long as... WE DONT PICK A FIGHT???

HELPPPPPPPPPPPPPPP!!!

(shhhhh membership here is from around the world...

its embarrassing )

and by the way, osteoarthritis is not a rocket science

so... I will CALL MY MACHO NEIGHBOR, or I will put the

bottle in hot running water or... i will use my cs...

I wont undermine love...

--- Pamela <calblonde1@...> wrote:

> oooooops! Didn't know you were the convening

> authority of this Group. Maybe the rest of us

> should just email you personally and have you

> decide what issue has been resolved and what issue

> can be discussed.

>

> And for someone that said they didn't want to butt

> in, you sure are doing it!

>

> Love,

> Pamela

>

> Genes Marquez <redpanda17@...> wrote:

>

> ooooooooopss! i think this issue has been resolved.

> i

> would like to stick to the coconut oil issue since

> i

> did not altogether dismiss the fact that i would

> go to

> the distributor and give them the feedback that

> the

> container is hard to open.

>

> i guess, its just that they are just two different

> issues, neither is less important. Hopefully, not

> a

> container would undermine the quality of a

> product.

> peace!

>

> --- Pamela <calblonde1@...> wrote:

>

> > If you are familiar with osteoarthritis, you

> will

> > know that opening up hard-to-open containers is

> a

> > VERY important issue. So, I don't think it was

> > unfair giving a heads-up to those poor souls who

>

> > struggle with this disease.

> >

> > Love,

> > Pamela

> >

> >

> > Genes Marquez <redpanda17@...> wrote:

>

> > Ooops! I

> > dont intend to really seriously butt in but I

> > think it is unfair not to recommend a product

> just

> > because the container is hard to open.

> >

> > Let's say, Im a newbie and I really want to

> find

> > out

> > what product suits me best. I think I would be

> > interested in finding out how the product

> tested

> > rather than the difficulty of opening the

> > container

> > although I would give the distributor a

> feedback

> > about

> > it. I dont think they would mind improving on

> it.

> > Coconut oil is hard to contain. It always

> finds

> > its

> > way to leak out.

> >

> > Oh, well, I think I'll go back to ms.

> ericson's

> > suggestion: Yes, just go get a husband, a

> brother,

> > or

> > a neighbor

> >

> > --- Pamela <calblonde1@...> wrote:

> >

> > > Sharon,

> > >

> > > The gallon size is very difficult to open

> > EVERY

> > > time! I am just relating MY experience with

>

> > > WildernessFamilyNaturals. I belong to

> another

> > group

> > > and several have expressed the exact same

> > > experience. We are all entitiled to that,

> > aren't

> > > we? I am not saying your experience is

> silly

> > and I

> > > would appreciate it if you didn't tell me

> mine

> > is

> > > silly.

> > >

> > > Love,

> > > Pamela

> >

> >

>

>

> our Group |

> Terms of Use | Unsubscribe

>

>

>

> New Message Search

> Find the message you want faster. Visit

> your group to try out the improved message search.

>

>

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> Share feedback on the new changes to

> Groups

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> Recent Activity

>

> 22

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[Guest guest]

Pamela,

I completely severed two tendons in my left hand a few years ago. I have a

reduction in the use of that hand - about 40% less than my " good hand " . I

spent nearly a year in physical therapy to regain any use of the hand. I

have a scar that required 60 stitches.....reaches from my knuckles to my

wrist. I have constant nerve pain in the region that was injured. I have

ulna nerve pain which shoots from my hand to my neck. (And please, I'm not

interested in recommendations for pain reduction - have that covered). I

am familiar with pain. I have also done extensive research, and find the

product in question to be of great value, of great benefit, and of an

affordable, reasonable price. As I mentioned, I would hate for the cover to

be a deterrent to others. There are workarounds. I think we've made

adequate points and would hope this could be valuable information for those

considering pros and cons.

Sharon

On 7/18/06, Pamela <calblonde1@...> wrote:

>

> If you are familiar with osteoarthritis, you will know that opening up

> hard-to-open containers is a VERY important issue. So, I don't think it was

> unfair giving a heads-up to those poor souls who struggle with this disease.

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Duncan...

I never received communication directly from you. No one was " available "

when I phoned looking for information. The person answering the phones was

gracious, emailing several pieces of nutritional information which I

requested, but other than that, the only price given to me was

over-the-phone for quantity of 1.

I would like to receive information, if you have any available. Please send

it to sharon@...

What I was the most interested in the time, other than pricing, was a

nutritional comparison between QFI, WF, MRH, and any number of other CO's.

IMO, QFI and WF were head-to-head having similar processing, almost

identical nutritional scores (which I am assuming may vary somewhat

depending on when harvest occurs, what the weather conditions were like in

particular regions, etc.). I guess I'm curious on your take of this...

Setting aside volume purchases/discounts, and looking at gallon to gallon

pricing, what makes QFI, in your opinion a greater/healthier value

considering it is 30-40% higher priced than others.

I am truly trying to learn because in the last year or so, I believe the

entire CO market is becoming more complex, not necessarily out of better

products, but better marketing spins. (OH, that must sound dreadfully

cynical, but I don't mean it as harsh as it sounds.)

" Spins " of late seem to focus on processing techniques, temperatures of

processing, temperatures during shipping, types of containers, but the

skeptical part of me wonders if the CO industry is like the spice industry -

HUGE containers are shipped to our shores, sold in auction or brokered, then

re-packaged and the only difference in how they're marketed and what " spin "

is put on the product's " story " .

From my probably very unlearned, naive perspective, there are only so many

coconut-growing regions and only so many processing techniques. Right now,

I'd whittle it down to two basics - from dried copra, or fermented milk.

Once that's been narrowed, and one has determined which process is " better " ,

that narrows the playing field even more. In other words, I can't see

anything that differentiates you from WFN - in my view, it is the same

processing technique, from the same material, with essentially the same

nutrition. So...that leaves price.

I do hope I'm not being too black and white or too forward. Or, heaven

forbid, downright stupid. I truly would like to figure this all out.

I've seen bits and pieces of discussions in the archives but it has gelled

yet in my brain.

I've at least eliminated Spectrum CO from consideration as being valid

(several years ago when using it in making waffles, the family through we

needed to evacuate the house because the burning odor from the CO was that

of an electrical fire LOL)....

Best to you!

Sharon The Curious

On 7/17/06, Duncan Crow <duncancrow@...> wrote:

>

> > Posted by: " Sharon son "

skericson@...<skericson%40gmail.com>notmyown_1cor6

> > Date: Mon Jul 17, 2006 1:35 pm (PDT)

>

> >

> > I just did a recent comparisons of " popular " high-quality VCO's and

> > QFI's pricing was ridiculously high.

>

> Remember, Quality First International's price list includes

> freight in North America. When I checked, their VCO prices were

> lower than average and their other grades were also competitive.

>

> Because they're a wholesaler the prices only go down with

> quantity; this will be reflected in their price list -- I don't

> think I sent you a wholesale price list; if I did, I forgot;

> which one is it? The date is on the top left of the form.

>

>

> > I found the quality and quantity

> > of product information to be severely lacking. Sharon, NH

>

> Quality First International is first and foremost an importer and

> wholesaler that does a lot of volume business the old-fashioned

> way, by certified check and hardcopy documents, and also bank

> transfers and telephone credit card tx. Their wholesale buyers do

> not demand the degree of packaging, promotional materials, or

> advertising, that retail buyers normally expect. QFI's

> distributors mainly sell QFI products under their own label or

> use them in bulk; they do the advertising, if there is any.

>

> QFI's wholesaler approach allowed them to grow larger and get

> better deals, and (newly) compete on retail coconut oil sales by

> offering several grades in smaller packaging, as well as

> developing the highest quality coconut oil on the market. Their

> own product, Virgin Oil de Coco Creme, is distinguished by being

> wet-milled and then chilled to solidfy the oil and the water spun

> out, on thei own patented equipment, all with no heat used at

> all.

>

> They're adding another centrifuged coconut oil to their lineup

> that will fall somewhere in between regular VCO and Virgin Oil de

> Coco Creme and will directly compete with regular VCO; this kind

> of quality is increasingly what customers want so it's where the

> industry is going with the VCO. You can see it youself on this

> very discussion group.

>

> Very soon there are also going to be more coconut products too.

> I'll know more about all that later and let you know in due

> course.

>

> This is in addition to a remarkably varied exotic product list

> that already exists from Quality First; I'm particularly

> interested in shea butter myself. Remarkable stuff

>

> Anyway, for import/export, this is the company to deal with; they

> have the experience to be on time and competitive and of course,

> the quality is first.

>

> Duncan Crow

>

>

>

--

Deut 11:14 He will put grass in the fields for your cattle, and you will

have plenty to eat.

[Guest guest]

Hi Sharon;

My take on the virgin oils is that they are a natural product so

they naturally vary. Other than price and coconut selection, I

think comparing processing more exactly will reveal much.

The highest natural quality will preserve the most aromatic

volatiles so it will be extracted with as little heat as

possible; at the present time that means wet-milling, chilling

and centrifuging, with no heat at all, and Quality First holds a

patent on equipment that does that, and sells oil from that

process in bulk to retailers.

I assume other companies will eventually make this exact product

but I don't know who they are and I can't vouch for anyone else's

factory; I just know they can't copy Quality First's equipment

without being sued for patent infringement.

I think that the fermentation method and the quick drying and

expeller-pressing methods apply about the same amount of heat,

but I'm sticking my neck out here and I'd rather hear the

detailed comparison of their methods fom the manufacturers so we

can compare the relative amounts of heat used to dry the oil. In

my opinion and that of many others in the industry the field is

moving to the higher qualities that use no heat but there's lots

of room for all the grades even if we use most of the RBD fom the

copra industry for biodiesel, pig food and cosmetics.

We should also decide if some companies are perhaps not getting

their coconut oil dry enough; that may be reflected by the short

shelf life of some virgin coconut oils on the market compared to

the wet-milling, chilling and centrifuging method which yields

oil that exhibits no deterioration after three years at room

temperature. Not that it's going to last that long before it get

eaten in a normal situation, but if I had a bomb shelter that's

the kind I'd store. I like the taste of it too

> Setting aside volume purchases/discounts, and looking at gallon to

> gallon pricing, what makes QFI, in your opinion a greater/healthier

> value considering it is 30-40% higher priced than others.

ly, I'm not sure that even RBD coconut oil has enough less

health value than virgin that you'd avoid RBD if it's cheap.

There's enough variance that oils have to compete on their own

merits in the marketplace, just like ice cream.

But to answer your question from the price standpoint, QFI

wholesales quality products for a reasonable price, and if you

can indeed get a US gallon of virgin coconut oil shipped to your

house in the US or Canada for the $42.90 to $50.05 US, I think

we'd all like to hear about your source and its quality.

> I am truly trying to learn because in the last year or so, I believe

> the entire CO market is becoming more complex, not necessarily out of

> better products, but better marketing spins. (OH, that must sound

> dreadfully cynical, but I don't mean it as harsh as it sounds.)

It's not cynical; I think it's an accurate observation. In fact I

was contacted three days ago by a forum member from India who had

the nuts to use Quality First's copywrited advertising of their

trademarked Virgin Oil De Coco Creme to try and sell me the new

product from India. Low ethics and also high-risk, considering

Indian courts subscribe to international copyright and patent

law.

> " Spins " of late seem to focus on processing techniques, temperatures

> of processing, temperatures during shipping, types of containers, but

> the skeptical part of me wonders if the CO industry is like the spice

> industry - HUGE containers are shipped to our shores, sold in auction

> or brokered, then re-packaged and the only difference in how they're

> marketed and what " spin " is put on the product's " story " .

I don't agree; there is considerable real variation between

products due to the processing techniques alone.

> From my probably very unlearned, naive perspective, there are only so

> many coconut-growing regions and only so many processing techniques.

> Right now, I'd whittle it down to two basics - from dried copra, or

> fermented milk.

Copra's best for RBD oil, and you missed the best extraction

technique; wet-milling, chilling and centrifuging the oil with no

heat applied, a technique that retains the most virtue from the

plant.

> Once that's been narrowed, and one has determined

> which process is " better " , that narrows the playing field even more.

> In other words, I can't see anything that differentiates you from WFN

> - in my view, it is the same processing technique, from the same

> material, with essentially the same nutrition. So...that leaves

> price.

I think Quality First quoted you on a single gallon at retail

because you're not a distributor and distributors get the best

price. Calling for a quote on a drum and using my name as a

reference might help convince them otherwise

> Best to you!

> Sharon The Curious

....And to you, Sharon.

Duncan Crow

http://members.shaw.ca/duncancrow