Re: Vaccinations and Job Corps - Is exemption possible?

[Guest guest]

christy you and everyone on this list should read-----mary_croft.pdf-AdobeReader . we all lost control of our children when we signed their birth certificates and this is one of the reasons the state can force you and your kids to do anything they want. an attorney will not tell you this because there is a difference between attorney's and lawyers. this is a 96 page read and it will blow your mind. my son has been checking the bill of rights and the constitution on many of the things she says. so far she is dead right. i'm only on page 59 and its unbelievable please read this first. jean

From: Ruth E. Ulvog <putney1963@...>Subject: RE: Vaccinations and Job Corps - Is exemption possible?no-forced-vaccination Date: Friday, February 18, 2011, 5:22 PM

Welcome, Christy!

I’m sure you’ll get a great deal of advice to the question you have posed; however, in this case, I would strongly encourage you to seek the advice of an attorney who specializes in the area of vaccine exemptions. There is a remarkable individual who is a member of this forum who is a vaccine rights attorney; and I would urge you to share your concerns and questions with him. His contact information is below.

Alan J. , J.D.: lawpapa@... or attorney@...

Website: www.vaccinerights.com

Best of Luck!!

~~Ruth

From: no-forced-vaccination [mailto: no-forced-vaccination ] On Behalf Of ChristySent: Friday, February 18, 2011 1:42 PMno-forced-vaccination Subject: Vaccinations and Job Corps - Is exemption possible?

Hi all,My children were never vaccinated.I signed exemptions for them all through their years in public school.Now, my 19 year old son was just accepted to join Job Corps, a government agency - http://www.jobcorps.gov/home.aspx- and he was told that he would have to catch up on all his "immunizations" (their word)......does anyone out there know if there is an exemption possible without discrimination?He'd really love to be in the program, but the idea of him getting all those shots just kills me. He is less frightened of the affects and more scared of the needles.I want to help find a way that he can become exempt without them turning him away...can you help?Christy

[Guest guest]

christy you and everyone on this list should read-----mary_croft.pdf-AdobeReader . we all lost control of our children when we signed their birth certificates and this is one of the reasons the state can force you and your kids to do anything they want. an attorney will not tell you this because there is a difference between attorney's and lawyers. this is a 96 page read and it will blow your mind. my son has been checking the bill of rights and the constitution on many of the things she says. so far she is dead right. i'm only on page 59 and its unbelievable please read this first. jean

From: Ruth E. Ulvog <putney1963@...>Subject: RE: Vaccinations and Job Corps - Is exemption possible?no-forced-vaccination Date: Friday, February 18, 2011, 5:22 PM

Welcome, Christy!

I’m sure you’ll get a great deal of advice to the question you have posed; however, in this case, I would strongly encourage you to seek the advice of an attorney who specializes in the area of vaccine exemptions. There is a remarkable individual who is a member of this forum who is a vaccine rights attorney; and I would urge you to share your concerns and questions with him. His contact information is below.

Alan J. , J.D.: lawpapa@... or attorney@...

Website: www.vaccinerights.com

Best of Luck!!

~~Ruth

From: no-forced-vaccination [mailto: no-forced-vaccination ] On Behalf Of ChristySent: Friday, February 18, 2011 1:42 PMno-forced-vaccination Subject: Vaccinations and Job Corps - Is exemption possible?

Hi all,My children were never vaccinated.I signed exemptions for them all through their years in public school.Now, my 19 year old son was just accepted to join Job Corps, a government agency - http://www.jobcorps.gov/home.aspx- and he was told that he would have to catch up on all his "immunizations" (their word)......does anyone out there know if there is an exemption possible without discrimination?He'd really love to be in the program, but the idea of him getting all those shots just kills me. He is less frightened of the affects and more scared of the needles.I want to help find a way that he can become exempt without them turning him away...can you help?Christy

[Guest guest]

Regarding this situation generally, while there are probably no exemption laws

that apply to federal employment specifically, there are federal laws that

provide a strong legal basis for refusing for vaccines in the workplace for

religious reasons--even more so for federal employees than, say, nurses working

for a private hospital. What qualifies for a religious objection is not a

short-answer question, but for starters, it usually doesn't matter what church

you belong to or whether you belong to one at all, personal religious beliefs

can qualify, but there are pitfalls as well (things that can undermine the

claim), so it's best to consult with someone familiar with the legal landscape

to maximize your chance for success. To maximize chances for success in

employment situations, it may be best to have an attorney make the case citing

applicable law, to put the proverbial ball in their court. Otherwise, it's just

too easy for them to say 'no,' and there's nothing you can do about that. Trying

it on your own first is usually not a good idea either, because you can't very

easily go back later and say, " uh, what I meant to say before about my beliefs

was... "

These are general comments for educational purposes only; to offer legal advice

would require more detailed information about the underlying facts.

Alan , J.D.

www.vaccinerights.com

www.pandemicresponseproject.com

>

> Hi all,

>

> My children were never vaccinated.

> I signed exemptions for them all through their years in public school.

>

> Now, my 19 year old son was just accepted to join Job Corps, a government

agency - http://www.jobcorps.gov/home.aspx

> - and he was told that he would have to catch up on all his " immunizations "

(their word)...

>

> ...does anyone out there know if there is an exemption possible without

discrimination?

>

> He'd really love to be in the program, but the idea of him getting all those

shots just kills me. He is less frightened of the affects and more scared of the

needles.

>

> I want to help find a way that he can become exempt without them turning him

away...can you help?

>

> Christy

>

[Guest guest]

Regarding this situation generally, while there are probably no exemption laws

that apply to federal employment specifically, there are federal laws that

provide a strong legal basis for refusing for vaccines in the workplace for

religious reasons--even more so for federal employees than, say, nurses working

for a private hospital. What qualifies for a religious objection is not a

short-answer question, but for starters, it usually doesn't matter what church

you belong to or whether you belong to one at all, personal religious beliefs

can qualify, but there are pitfalls as well (things that can undermine the

claim), so it's best to consult with someone familiar with the legal landscape

to maximize your chance for success. To maximize chances for success in

employment situations, it may be best to have an attorney make the case citing

applicable law, to put the proverbial ball in their court. Otherwise, it's just

too easy for them to say 'no,' and there's nothing you can do about that. Trying

it on your own first is usually not a good idea either, because you can't very

easily go back later and say, " uh, what I meant to say before about my beliefs

was... "

These are general comments for educational purposes only; to offer legal advice

would require more detailed information about the underlying facts.

Alan , J.D.

www.vaccinerights.com

www.pandemicresponseproject.com

>

> Hi all,

>

> My children were never vaccinated.

> I signed exemptions for them all through their years in public school.

>

> Now, my 19 year old son was just accepted to join Job Corps, a government

agency - http://www.jobcorps.gov/home.aspx

> - and he was told that he would have to catch up on all his " immunizations "

(their word)...

>

> ...does anyone out there know if there is an exemption possible without

discrimination?

>

> He'd really love to be in the program, but the idea of him getting all those

shots just kills me. He is less frightened of the affects and more scared of the

needles.

>

> I want to help find a way that he can become exempt without them turning him

away...can you help?

>

> Christy

>

[Guest guest]

Sorry, but I don't buy it. The state has authority over children who are within

its physical boundaries, birth certificate or not. I've seem people make this

claim, but I've never seen any evidence for it. The Bill of Rights doesn't

discuss birth certificates (it can't--that's a state law issue, and the BOR is

the first 10 Amendments of the federal Constitution), and I've never seen a

state or federal law that says a state has no authority over kids without birth

certificates. Determining who a person is, authoritatively, may require a birth

certificate or other equivalent documentation--e.g., getting government aid for

your kids, school enrollment, getting a SS#, etc. So, if anyone has information

to the contrary--a law that specifically says that kids without a birth

certificate are outside of the reach of the state, show it to me along with the

cite. In the U.S., that would have to be a state law for anyone born in a state

(vs. a federal territory), as birth registration is a purely state law matter

unless one is born outside of a state. Matters pertaining to births in the

states are up to each individual state to handle as each state deems fit, so

laws will vary state to state to one degree or another.

Skeptical in NC, Alan , J.D.

P.S. Black's law dictionary says that the words " attorney " and " lawyer, " are

interchangeable, except in situations where the words may be specifically

defined differently for specific, limited purposes. For any general purpose,

then, they are the same thing.

>

> christy you and everyone on this list should

read-----mary_croft.pdf-AdobeReader . we all lost control of our children when

we signed their birth certificates and this is one of the reasons the state can

force you and your kids to do anything they want. an attorney will not tell you

this because there is a difference between

[Guest guest]

Sorry, but I don't buy it. The state has authority over children who are within

its physical boundaries, birth certificate or not. I've seem people make this

claim, but I've never seen any evidence for it. The Bill of Rights doesn't

discuss birth certificates (it can't--that's a state law issue, and the BOR is

the first 10 Amendments of the federal Constitution), and I've never seen a

state or federal law that says a state has no authority over kids without birth

certificates. Determining who a person is, authoritatively, may require a birth

certificate or other equivalent documentation--e.g., getting government aid for

your kids, school enrollment, getting a SS#, etc. So, if anyone has information

to the contrary--a law that specifically says that kids without a birth

certificate are outside of the reach of the state, show it to me along with the

cite. In the U.S., that would have to be a state law for anyone born in a state

(vs. a federal territory), as birth registration is a purely state law matter

unless one is born outside of a state. Matters pertaining to births in the

states are up to each individual state to handle as each state deems fit, so

laws will vary state to state to one degree or another.

Skeptical in NC, Alan , J.D.

P.S. Black's law dictionary says that the words " attorney " and " lawyer, " are

interchangeable, except in situations where the words may be specifically

defined differently for specific, limited purposes. For any general purpose,

then, they are the same thing.

>

> christy you and everyone on this list should

read-----mary_croft.pdf-AdobeReader . we all lost control of our children when

we signed their birth certificates and this is one of the reasons the state can

force you and your kids to do anything they want. an attorney will not tell you

this because there is a difference between

[Guest guest]

Thank you all for your input!

I appreciate the variety of opinions and facts that were presented.

And, now, I have some thinking to do...

--Christy

> >

> > Hi all,

> >

> > My children were never vaccinated.

> > I signed exemptions for them all through their years in public school.

> >

> > Now, my 19 year old son was just accepted to join Job Corps, a government

agency - http://www.jobcorps.gov/home.aspx

> > - and he was told that he would have to catch up on all his " immunizations "

(their word)...

> >

> > ...does anyone out there know if there is an exemption possible without

discrimination?

> >

> > He'd really love to be in the program, but the idea of him getting all those

shots just kills me. He is less frightened of the affects and more scared of the

needles.

> >

> > I want to help find a way that he can become exempt without them turning him

away...can you help?

> >

> > Christy

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Thank you all for your input!

I appreciate the variety of opinions and facts that were presented.

And, now, I have some thinking to do...

--Christy

> >

> > Hi all,

> >

> > My children were never vaccinated.

> > I signed exemptions for them all through their years in public school.

> >

> > Now, my 19 year old son was just accepted to join Job Corps, a government

agency - http://www.jobcorps.gov/home.aspx

> > - and he was told that he would have to catch up on all his " immunizations "

(their word)...

> >

> > ...does anyone out there know if there is an exemption possible without

discrimination?

> >

> > He'd really love to be in the program, but the idea of him getting all those

shots just kills me. He is less frightened of the affects and more scared of the

needles.

> >

> > I want to help find a way that he can become exempt without them turning him

away...can you help?

> >

> > Christy

> >

>