Re: Re: High Meat - Enzyme Nutrition

[Guest guest]

On Tue, Jun 25, 2002 at 03:26:26PM -0700, heidis@... wrote:

|

| I think meat has some internal chemistry and/or bacteria that makes it do

| something different -- at least the people who eat " high meat " seem to

| still be with us! Beef can be " hung " for a month or more -- it gets moldy

| on the outside, I've been told -- and it just gets more tender. And some

| hunters hang game outside for a day or two. Kind of like cabbage: put

| cabbage in an anaerobic environment and most of the time you get

| sauerkraut.

|

| Which kind of reinforces my strong feelings about " tradition " -- i.e. it's

| good to find out " how things are done " , not just make guesses. Some foods

| you can ferment, some will poison you if you don't do it right.

Hi Heidi,

I really enjoy this group but I particularly love your posts about celiac,

fermenting, and other subjects. I'm primarily a lurker (time restraints) but

I do some lacto-fermentation, mostly do a lower-carb (since '98) variation

of NT (since y2k) -- I'm doing a lot of reading because when I finally began

to explore nutrition, I began to relize that most of the 'dictocrat' stuff

was philosophical, political and not based on science. ...and your library

must be extensive, I could easily spend months reading your books.

Now the reason I am responding to this post regards enzyme nutrition. I do

plan to find time to do some 'paleo' reading but for now... Muscles and

other organs, fruits and veggies, milk and other 'food' sources have

indigenous natural enzymes which appear to have little real function in the

living being, but which assist in the breakdown of the whole and release of

nutrients on its death. Corpses don't entirely decompose because of

bacterial action, enzymes in muscle and organ breakdown do quite a bit as

well. As a an example: a banana ripens, its own enzymes break it down til

the thing because a blob of mush with the black skin. My chickens love it

but I'm not inclined to.

I'm no expert on this but did want to send a blurb regarding why 'high' meat

and hung carcasses tenderize and flavors meld and 'improve'. Cathepsin, an

enzyme that is in the tissues assists tissue digestion - so when food meat

is hung or buried for later use, internal parts are being " tenderized " . When

a cat munches a mouse, the mouse's enzymes help the cat digest it. Cats that

are feed " COOKED " foods, ala Pottenger, etc, do not thrive. Calves do not

thrive on pasteurized DEAD milk, they need the life of the enzymes in order

to survive.

Apparently most living things are designed to let their food digest itself

before using the resources of enzyme production in the host that has

consumed the food. Lacto-fermentation is definitely well associated with

healthy peoples and among the centenarians who consume just about every type

of diet, from carb to totally animal based.

I'm reading " Enzyme Nutrition: Unlocking the Secrets of Eating Right for

Health, Vitality, and Longevity - The Food Enzyme Concept " by Dr

Howell. (I found mine at addall.com) This is paperback version is oriented

more toward the lay-public to introduce the Food Enzyme concept of longevity

and nutrition. His 700-page tome with all the scientific references is

probably the one I would read if I could afford it but essentially the

little book lays out the elements of the concept quite well (but drives me

nuts since I like to source things<g>) - while some parts of it don't sound

quite right(nothing particularly outstanding that wasn't explained later

comes to mind at the moment)... reading on, it really becomes quite

convincing.

Ch. 3 - He discusses the consumption of 'high' meat and mentions a number of

studies regarding it. Characteristic cheesy flavor of such meat is

mentioned. Also mentioned is that natural cheeses are pre-digested to some

extent utilizing the enzymes of the milk cultured or predictable

innoculatives - I'm wondering if that " cheesy " flavor is characteristic

'good' enzyme metabolism... cheesiness of high meat, (dried raw fish I've

eaten- oriental), etc due to enzyme digestion. And my idea, perhaps at some

level, it provides bacteriostatic effect so that actual 'spoilage' doesn't

happen internally (deep in the meat fiber). -- I think you or someone asked

if lactase was naturally found in milk, and Dr. Howell's book mentions

lactase, when this enzyme was discovered in raw milk (-1938, Weckel). There

are probably a number of dairy science books that list lactase and more.

There are probably many enzymes of which we have no understanding, or

perhaps, means to measure?

I think in light of all the various books we read, we find essential

=unrefuted= elements that keep pointing us to NT -- and at least for me,

this little book is one of them. We appear to need living elements in more

of our food to keep from wearing ourselves out, trying to digest processed

and dead foods, prepared foods and otherwise altered foods is taking it's

toll on all of us.

The Enzyme theory as far as I have read in his book, seems to refer the

limitations of our 'enzyme potential'. The more care we give to this enzyme

resource, the healthier we are likely to stay. To make quick work of the

theory here - young organisms were ground up and their enzymes measured,

then older organisms of same species, eating the same diet were processed

into similar media. The enzymes of the younger batch were far more active

than represented in the older batch. Likewise, the spit of young men and

that of older men was measured for enzyme activity and the older men had

lower enzyme activity than the younger fellas. Same test goes for active

digestive juices and organs such as the pancreas in humans. Older you are,

the more wore out the enzymes, the higher degrees of resistance, the less

efficiency. Aging seems to be enzyme related.

This is why lactofermented foods or 'high' meat are less stressful to the

host organism, because the host would need to use less of its own enzymes to

mobilize nutrient. Most animals use less digestive juices, continue to eat

raw foods which contain their own 'food enzymes' - which are digested in

fore-stomachs or at least an early part of the digestive system. Even the

HUMAN has a food enzyme component of their stomachs where nothing really

happens except to permit digestion of the food by its own enzymes (or any

added by saliva - apparently peculiar to humans only). This is where the

food's natural indigenous enzymes are given opportunity to do pre-digestion.

I had never really given this any thought til now, but apparently this is a

known fact of human stomachs. In Gray's Anatomy this is called the 'cardiac'

portion (food enzyme stomach) and the pyloric portion where our own enzymes

kick in. Typical western medicine and nutrition gives little type-space

to the importance of food enzymes despite the bounty of evidence of its

importance.

I'm unprepared to make a treatise of this I'm still only about half-way

through this book, but I think many elements of it help explain many such

odd things - like raw liver juice among other things, given to cancer

patients enables them by removing some of the intense enzyme stress to their

bodies, which helps address one factor on the road to possible recovery.

Janice

[Guest guest]

At 04:20 PM 6/28/2002 -0700, you wrote:

>Hi Heidi,

>

>I really enjoy this group but I particularly love your posts about celiac,

>fermenting, and other subjects.

Thanks! Writing helps me think things through, and living with a new diet,

there is a LOT to think through.

>I'm primarily a lurker (time restraints) but

>I do some lacto-fermentation, mostly do a lower-carb (since '98) variation

>of NT (since y2k) -- I'm doing a lot of reading because when I finally began

>to explore nutrition, I began to relize that most of the 'dictocrat' stuff

>was philosophical, political and not based on science. ...and your library

>must be extensive, I could easily spend months reading your books.

My " library " is mostly on the Net! Peruse away! Search engines are

wonderful ...

I agree about the " dictocrat " stuff though it's hard to know nowadays who

is 'crating. I think we are in the middle of a paradigm shift -- when the old

paradigm is not working, a whole slew of new ideas pop up, and eventually

one wins as the new paradigm. Kind of like car models: eventually they start

looking alike and one style takes over. I'm guessing the new paradigm will

look a lot like NT: food more natural, closer to home, less processing, more

vegies, more meat, more good fat, probably fewer carbs than currently, more

fermenting. There is a groundswell going that way -- I tried to give away my

last tub of stored margerine and NO ONE would take it. They are all back

to real butter!

>Now the reason I am responding to this post regards enzyme nutrition. I do

>plan to find time to do some 'paleo' reading but for now... Muscles and

>other organs, fruits and veggies, milk and other 'food' sources have

>indigenous natural enzymes which appear to have little real function in the

>living being, but which assist in the breakdown of the whole and release of

>nutrients on its death. Corpses don't entirely decompose because of

>bacterial action, enzymes in muscle and organ breakdown do quite a bit as

>well. As a an example: a banana ripens, its own enzymes break it down til

>the thing because a blob of mush with the black skin. My chickens love it

>but I'm not inclined to.

I really don't know much about enzymes scientifically -- I'm inclined to be

an empiricist -- but I think there is SOMETHING in raw (or fermented)

foods that just isn't in cooked foods. Some if it is bacterial -- raw cabbage

has bacteria living in it, why I have no idea, maybe to protect the cabbage --

and some of it is likely enzymes, and some if it is other chemicals.

The chemistry of organisms is just so complex and interactive. There is

evidence that parasites actually have a kind of symbiosis with their host

and sometimes with that hosts PREDATORS (they make the host easy

prey for the predator, which helps the parasite jump to the new host). A

banana breaking down to become sweeter would make it nicer for something

to eat and so spread banana seeds (I think that holds for most fruits, whose

purpose after all is to get eaten!). Milk has lactase to help the small mammal

digest it. Raw meat, though, I can't think of a reason for it to break down

" correctly " to be edible ( " bad " bacteria could decompose it just as well).

It's interesting to hear about it all the theories though!

Heidi

[Guest guest]

At 09:15 PM 6/28/2002 -0700, you wrote:

> >Now the reason I am responding to this post regards enzyme nutrition. I do

> >plan to find time to do some 'paleo' reading but for now... Muscles and

> >other organs, fruits and veggies, milk and other 'food' sources have

> >indigenous natural enzymes which appear to have little real function in the

> >living being, but which assist in the breakdown of the whole and release of

> >nutrients on its death.

The indigenous natural enzymes in a living being are a fundamental basis

for life. They are tools, if you will, at the cellular level. Cells must

have these enzymes to build new cells, do work and produce energy, use

nutrients eaten by the being, clean away waste, etc., etc. Without these

enzymes the cells could not do their jobs and the being would not be able

to live. Cellular enzymes have a key role in what we call " life " . And, as

you say, they assist in the breakdown of the tissues after death. It is

very important for us to eat living enzymes (uncooked, natural foods) to

achieve good health and longevity. Otherwise the enzymes necessary for

digesting the denatured foods we might eat are permanently taken from our

cells to do the job. This causes no end of problems including premature

aging and disease.

Regards,

-=mark=-