Guest guest Posted August 19, 2004 Report Share Posted August 19, 2004 You know, in the hep c chatrooms I moderate, I talk to several people on treatment who take Procrit while on treatment for hep C. It doesn't have to be FDA approved for Hep C/treatment to be given it for hep C/treatment, only FDA approved for something. Neurontin isn't FDA approved for migraines, and it is prescribed for migraines. Zonnegran isn't approved for weight loss, it is prescribed for weight loss. The list goes on. just as a note: The anemia listed on the treatment brochure (Schering) is not iron anemia. I'm cooking or I'd go look up the correct terminology. Anyway, they list the type of anemia that treatment may cause and it's not the type that can be helped by taking iron or iron supplements. Yall may have already discussed this but I'm behind on emails. My roof leaked during getting the roof redone, attic flooded, ceiling crashed in the living room, kitchen, hall and one bedroom. Soaked carpet and ceiling tile and made a BIG mess! So we've been cleaning cleaning cleaning. Alley Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 19, 2004 Report Share Posted August 19, 2004 {{Shshonee <shshonee@...> wrote: just as a note: The anemia listed on the treatment brochure (Schering) is not iron anemia. I'm cooking or I'd go look up the correct terminology.}} The word you are looking for is " hemolytic " , and it means an anemia being caused by the destruction of red blood cells for one reason or another, and no, iron won't help. {{Yall may have already discussed this but I'm behind on emails. My roof leaked during getting the roof redone, attic flooded, ceiling crashed in the living room, kitchen, hall and one bedroom. Soaked carpet and ceiling tile and made a BIG mess! So we've been cleaning cleaning cleaning. Alley}} Boy do you have my deepest sympathy! Sounds like a disaster! C Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 19, 2004 Report Share Posted August 19, 2004 In a message dated 8/19/2004 6:24:38 PM Pacific Daylight Time, shshonee@... writes: You know, in the hep c chatrooms I moderate, I talk to several people on treatment who take Procrit while on treatment for hep C. It doesn't have to be FDA approved for Hep C/treatment to be given it for hep C/treatment, only FDA approved for something. I don't know whether the insurance companies take a difference stance on this than Medicare, but I do know that Medicare bounced the Procrit for the Big Sis because Procrit is approved for cancer and chemo treatments, but not HCV. And this is recent -- like two weeks ago. Makes no sense to me, but that is Medicare's position. (aka the Little Sis) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 19, 2004 Report Share Posted August 19, 2004 In a message dated 8/19/2004 6:24:38 PM Pacific Daylight Time, shshonee@... writes: You know, in the hep c chatrooms I moderate, I talk to several people on treatment who take Procrit while on treatment for hep C. It doesn't have to be FDA approved for Hep C/treatment to be given it for hep C/treatment, only FDA approved for something. I don't know whether the insurance companies take a difference stance on this than Medicare, but I do know that Medicare bounced the Procrit for the Big Sis because Procrit is approved for cancer and chemo treatments, but not HCV. And this is recent -- like two weeks ago. Makes no sense to me, but that is Medicare's position. (aka the Little Sis) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 20, 2004 Report Share Posted August 20, 2004 If someone has created a " supplement " containing iron, it is just that...a supplement. It is not the same as eating a spinach salad or iron fortified cereals, etc. Anyone who knows anything about Hep C KNOWS that we cannot take supplements containing iron. This person is trying to sell you on this supplement but obviously doesn't have any knowledge of HCV...and if others with HCV are taking it, they should be made aware of the effect of iron supplements in folks with HCV. Stay away from " blends " and research each and everything you are thinking of taking...not just the pros and cons of that specific supplemnt, but how it interacts with other supplements, etc. You can do serious harm by taking herbs, supplements, etc. without thorough research. It is always better to error on the safe side than to error when standing at the edge of a cliff. And the key to everything is always moderation. Tatezi Hi Everyone, I am wondering if anyone has ever heard of, or has any experience with something called Reliv. It's a nutritional supplement that I was going to try until I read the label. It has 18 mg. of iron. If I took it 2X a day that would be 36 mg fr iron. They (people who use it) are trying to tell me 1) that it's food so if I eat spinach I can take this and 2) that people with HepC take it. The iron is a ferrous fumerate but they didn't know it's source. Of course I have a call in to my doctor but haven't heard back yet. Also, about Procrit; when I was on treatment my hemoglobin started dropping about the 2nd month. They put me in a study for Procrit at Beth Israel Hosp. in Boston. They study wasn't to see if Procrit helped, they knew it did. It was to collect data so the FDA would approve it for HCV as well as the already approved use for cancer. And they said we needed FDA approval so the insurance companies would pay for it. It was an attempt to close a loophole that gave the insurance companies the opportunity to refuse payment. Don't know where the process is at the moment. Glad to hear that some insurance companies are paying anyway. Amazing! Pam in Maine >Tatezi > > Re: low platelets, appointment with specialist >to start t... > > >Tat, has been invaluable. Anne > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 20, 2004 Report Share Posted August 20, 2004 If someone has created a " supplement " containing iron, it is just that...a supplement. It is not the same as eating a spinach salad or iron fortified cereals, etc. Anyone who knows anything about Hep C KNOWS that we cannot take supplements containing iron. This person is trying to sell you on this supplement but obviously doesn't have any knowledge of HCV...and if others with HCV are taking it, they should be made aware of the effect of iron supplements in folks with HCV. Stay away from " blends " and research each and everything you are thinking of taking...not just the pros and cons of that specific supplemnt, but how it interacts with other supplements, etc. You can do serious harm by taking herbs, supplements, etc. without thorough research. It is always better to error on the safe side than to error when standing at the edge of a cliff. And the key to everything is always moderation. Tatezi Hi Everyone, I am wondering if anyone has ever heard of, or has any experience with something called Reliv. It's a nutritional supplement that I was going to try until I read the label. It has 18 mg. of iron. If I took it 2X a day that would be 36 mg fr iron. They (people who use it) are trying to tell me 1) that it's food so if I eat spinach I can take this and 2) that people with HepC take it. The iron is a ferrous fumerate but they didn't know it's source. Of course I have a call in to my doctor but haven't heard back yet. Also, about Procrit; when I was on treatment my hemoglobin started dropping about the 2nd month. They put me in a study for Procrit at Beth Israel Hosp. in Boston. They study wasn't to see if Procrit helped, they knew it did. It was to collect data so the FDA would approve it for HCV as well as the already approved use for cancer. And they said we needed FDA approval so the insurance companies would pay for it. It was an attempt to close a loophole that gave the insurance companies the opportunity to refuse payment. Don't know where the process is at the moment. Glad to hear that some insurance companies are paying anyway. Amazing! Pam in Maine >Tatezi > > Re: low platelets, appointment with specialist >to start t... > > >Tat, has been invaluable. Anne > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 20, 2004 Report Share Posted August 20, 2004 Thanks, Claudine...you laid it out much better than I did... Unless there is NO (as in ZERO) ADDED/SUPPLEMENTED iron then it is NOT a food source of iron, it is a SUPPLEMENT, no matter how you get it into your body. Eating, drinking, swallowing a tablet - none of that matters. You can eat a bowl of cereal that contains 18 mg of iron, but it is NOT a food source, it is supplemented. The iron in Spinach is a food source. The iron in a steak is a food source. A nutritional supplement is NOT a food source - it is just what it says, a nutritional supplement! C Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 20, 2004 Report Share Posted August 20, 2004 Thanks, Claudine...you laid it out much better than I did... Unless there is NO (as in ZERO) ADDED/SUPPLEMENTED iron then it is NOT a food source of iron, it is a SUPPLEMENT, no matter how you get it into your body. Eating, drinking, swallowing a tablet - none of that matters. You can eat a bowl of cereal that contains 18 mg of iron, but it is NOT a food source, it is supplemented. The iron in Spinach is a food source. The iron in a steak is a food source. A nutritional supplement is NOT a food source - it is just what it says, a nutritional supplement! C Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 20, 2004 Report Share Posted August 20, 2004 Excuse me .........that's the third time I've done that to you..Anne Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 20, 2004 Report Share Posted August 20, 2004 Excuse me .........that's the third time I've done that to you..Anne Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 20, 2004 Report Share Posted August 20, 2004 In a message dated 8/19/2004 9:14:51 PM Eastern Daylight Time, shshonee@... writes: Anne, don't stick me in that list! LOL Good luck to you. I'll support your decision either way. I know Alley, but don't forget that some of the helpful info that you and and Tat have given is the reason that I'm nutritionally well enough to even be able to have a choice. By the way, I don't know if I mentioned this when I was talking about biopsy report, but no sign of cirrhosis......some fibrosis......but not bad considering mine was a full strength straight injection that occurred 17 years ago. Thank God. Anne Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 20, 2004 Report Share Posted August 20, 2004 In a message dated 8/19/2004 9:24:34 PM Eastern Daylight Time, shshonee@... writes: Yall may have already discussed this but I'm behind on emails. My roof leaked during getting the roof redone, attic flooded, ceiling crashed in the living room, kitchen, hall and one bedroom. Soaked carpet and ceiling tile and made a BIG mess! So we've been cleaning cleaning cleaning. I've been there in a minor way. Hurricanes are a real B----! which is probably why you needed the new roof. We only lost two ceilings. One was in our bedroom. I vividly remember the drip drip on my feet. Most disquietening. Stay dry. We had more than one bedroom. Fortunately, it wasn't the kitchen. Anne Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 20, 2004 Report Share Posted August 20, 2004 In a message dated 8/20/2004 3:49:40 AM Eastern Daylight Time, msnblk@... writes: And this is recent -- like two weeks ago. Makes no sense to me, but that is Medicare's position. True, but if you look at the list on ribavirin treatable side effects, Procrit is a suggested drug for hemolytic anemia (one of these days, I'll remember how to spell that word. It was misspelled on one of my physician documents and I've been misspelling it every since). Anne Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 20, 2004 Report Share Posted August 20, 2004 I'm a little confused...I've been working long hours this week but I think my brain is still functioning. It medicare refused coverage of procrit because it's only approved for cancer and chemo...then why is ribavarin listed in any detailed information of the poisons used in chemo treatments. Ribavarin is chemo, Don't know, but I might just contest that with medicare. Might not help for now because things like that take time, but would sure set ground work for future folks doing treatment with ribavarin as one of the drugs. Tatezi I don't know whether the insurance companies take a difference stance on this than Medicare, but I do know that Medicare bounced the Procrit for the Big Sis because Procrit is approved for cancer and chemo treatments, but not HCV. And this is recent -- like two weeks ago. Makes no sense to me, but that is Medicare's position. (aka the Little Sis) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 20, 2004 Report Share Posted August 20, 2004 I'm a little confused...I've been working long hours this week but I think my brain is still functioning. It medicare refused coverage of procrit because it's only approved for cancer and chemo...then why is ribavarin listed in any detailed information of the poisons used in chemo treatments. Ribavarin is chemo, Don't know, but I might just contest that with medicare. Might not help for now because things like that take time, but would sure set ground work for future folks doing treatment with ribavarin as one of the drugs. Tatezi I don't know whether the insurance companies take a difference stance on this than Medicare, but I do know that Medicare bounced the Procrit for the Big Sis because Procrit is approved for cancer and chemo treatments, but not HCV. And this is recent -- like two weeks ago. Makes no sense to me, but that is Medicare's position. (aka the Little Sis) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 20, 2004 Report Share Posted August 20, 2004 Thanks Claudine & Tatezi, Just looking for a confirmation of what I already thought. I never heard of anyone passing off supplements as a " food source " before. I would like to talk to these people with HCV who are supposedly taking it too. Mostly just to find out what are they thinking? Pam in Maine >From: " Tatezi " <tatezi@...> >Reply-Hepatitis C ><Hepatitis C > >Subject: Re: low platelets, appointment with specialist >to start t... >Date: Fri, 20 Aug 2004 01:41:30 -0500 > >If someone has created a " supplement " containing iron, it is just that...a >supplement. It is not the same as eating a spinach salad or iron fortified >cereals, etc. Anyone who knows anything about Hep C KNOWS that we cannot >take supplements containing iron. This person is trying to sell you on this >supplement but obviously doesn't have any knowledge of HCV...and if others >with HCV are taking it, they should be made aware of the effect of iron >supplements in folks with HCV. > >Stay away from " blends " and research each and everything you are thinking >of taking...not just the pros and cons of that specific supplemnt, but how >it interacts with other supplements, etc. You can do serious harm by taking >herbs, supplements, etc. without thorough research. > >It is always better to error on the safe side than to error when standing >at the edge of a cliff. And the key to everything is always moderation. > >Tatezi > >Hi Everyone, > >I am wondering if anyone has ever heard of, or has any experience with >something called Reliv. It's a nutritional supplement that I was going to >try until I read the label. It has 18 mg. of iron. If I took it 2X a day >that would be 36 mg fr iron. They (people who use it) are trying to tell >me >1) that it's food so if I eat spinach I can take this and 2) that people >with HepC take it. > >The iron is a ferrous fumerate but they didn't know it's source. > >Of course I have a call in to my doctor but haven't heard back yet. > > >Also, about Procrit; when I was on treatment my hemoglobin started dropping >about the 2nd month. They put me in a study for Procrit at Beth Israel >Hosp. in Boston. They study wasn't to see if Procrit helped, they knew it >did. It was to collect data so the FDA would approve it for HCV as well as >the already approved use for cancer. And they said we needed FDA approval >so the insurance companies would pay for it. It was an attempt to close a >loophole that gave the insurance companies the opportunity to refuse >payment. Don't know where the process is at the moment. Glad to hear that >some insurance companies are paying anyway. Amazing! > >Pam in Maine > > > >Tatezi > > > > Re: low platelets, appointment with >specialist > >to start t... > > > > > >Tat, has been invaluable. Anne > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 20, 2004 Report Share Posted August 20, 2004 HI.So enjoy your weekend,let HepC be HepX,procrit be prodone and medicare some small institution where they train nurses,ribavarin a tropical fruit from madagaskar.Have a long sleep,healthy breakfast and a nice day,monday is a light year away.Yuppee!!.Willem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 20, 2004 Report Share Posted August 20, 2004 Yeah, insurance/medicare have their own rules but some do some don't. Riba is FDA approved for HCV isn't it? why it's covered? Anne, if you have mild fibrosis (like stage 0 - 1) AND are geno 1, my advice is don't do treatment. Just a personal opinion. I'll support you either way. Yeah, Claudine, hemothingy! Taking iron with HCV is something that needs to be done with a doctor's approval, my opinion. I don't avoid foods with iron, but I don't take any supplements with iron. You have to look at where your liver is and what you normally eat, etc. There are all kinds of scams to make money off people, HCV is no different. Some people will tell you anything just to make a buck. Always check with your doc. Willem you are too funny Yes it IS the weekend! ooooooooooo! Alley Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 20, 2004 Report Share Posted August 20, 2004 " The iron in Spinach is a food source. The iron in a steak is a food source. " What's the iron from my cast iron skillet? A bump on the noggin! Alley Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 20, 2004 Report Share Posted August 20, 2004 > Anne, if you have mild fibrosis (like stage 0 - 1) AND are geno 1, my advice is don't do treatment. Just a personal opinion. I'll support you either way. Can you explain your reason here? I am a 1b and started the treatments 10 weeks ago. It was explained to me to go ahead and try to get rid of this BEFORE there is too much damage. By the way, I was at stage 1. And can you tell me the difference between 1a and 1b? (In layman's terms, please). I don't know if this matters in making the decision to do the treatment or not, but I found out that I had hepC when they first started testing for it. When was that? Somewhere around 1990? I am not trying to put you on the spot, but am really interested in everyones opinions. One of the reasons that I decided to go ahead and try is because we have insurance right now and I have learned that that can change overnight. <><TammieD><> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 21, 2004 Report Share Posted August 21, 2004 Shshonee <shshonee@...> wrote: >>What's the iron from my cast iron skillet? Rust??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 21, 2004 Report Share Posted August 21, 2004 In a message dated 8/20/2004 8:05:04 AM Pacific Daylight Time, tatezi@... writes: It medicare refused coverage of procrit because it's only approved for cancer and chemo...then why is ribavarin listed in any detailed information of the poisons used in chemo treatments. Ribavarin is chemo, Don't know, but I might just contest that with medicare. Might not help for now because things like that take time, but would sure set ground work for future folks doing treatment with ribavarin as one of the drugs. I totally agree with you, Tat, but I think you can understand at times you have to just sit tight and choose the timing of the challenge. She continues to get the weekly Procrit, the doctor's office continues to submit it to Medicare, and Medicare continues to send her notices saying it's not FDA approved and they aren't paying it, and she can't be billed for it because the doctor's office told her Medicare would pay for it. Nice tight circle they have there. Mind you, Medicare originally said they would cover it, and because they jumped in there and said that, the Big Sis was exempt from the indigent program available for Procrit. It's a mess, ain't it? In the meantime, she's coming down the home stretch with the treatment. At any time they can stop the Procrit, but we think she'll be okay with that at this point. Obviously, once she's off treatment and the Procrit isn't required, it will be time for us to start hitting Medicare and the FDA with letters regarding approval of Procrit for HCV. For now, though, we are keeping our little mouths shut and staying with the program. Makes sense to us. LOL. (aka the Little Sis) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 21, 2004 Report Share Posted August 21, 2004 In a message dated 8/20/2004 3:00:57 PM Eastern Daylight Time, lands142@... writes: HI.So enjoy your weekend,let HepC be HepX,procrit be prodone and medicare some small institution where they train nurses,ribavarin a tropical fruit from madagaskar.Have a long sleep,healthy breakfast and a nice day,monday is a light year away.Yuppee!!.Willem. Now that is sound advice. I think I'll follow it. Thanks, Anne Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 21, 2004 Report Share Posted August 21, 2004 In a message dated 8/20/2004 5:41:09 PM Eastern Daylight Time, shshonee@... writes: Anne, if you have mild fibrosis (like stage 0 - 1) AND are geno 1, my advice is don't do treatment. Just a personal opinion. I'll support you either way. Thanks. The fibrosis is a little worse than mild, but the geno is 1. I've batted the decision back and forth. Having failed the older two treatments (Interferon was working, just not fast enough to suit protocal-ribavirin addition came as close to killing me as I want to get at the hands of medicine), I've decided to risk a few months at this. If my labs blow up in my face, I'm off. I took myself off last time........two days before the doc ordered me off. You can judge your own bleeding time. I did and decided that I was through. In my heart, I think you're right, but if I don't try, I'll probably never forgive myself. Anne Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 21, 2004 Report Share Posted August 21, 2004 In a message dated 8/21/2004 11:10:45 AM Eastern Daylight Time, msnblk@... writes: At any time they can stop the Procrit, but we think she'll be okay with that at this point. Obviously, once she's off treatment and the Procrit isn't required, it will be time for us to start hitting Medicare and the FDA with letters regarding approval of Procrit for HCV. For now, though, we are keeping our little mouths shut and staying with the program. Makes sense to us. LOL. Makes sense to me, too. Time for me to go on a letter writing campaign. Help with wording is appreciated. Anne Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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